>> in "red card," ken bensinger bensinger -- this took place in los angeles. it is just over an hour. >> this book, which i read half of cannot be put down. one of the things that has been interesting to me is people calling saying you know i'm not really interested in soccer. should i read the book?

soccer is of passing significance in this book. this is a true crime kind of story. a story about corruption, power and you'll see names that you are familiar with if you are reading newspapers today about what is going on in american politics. it is a remarkable, amazing book. i encourage you to buy it. the other thing i encourage you to do is to sign up to be on our mailing list because we have events like this a couple or three times a week and you'll find a few start to come, that it will add something to your life. thank you for being here. without further ado, alan rothenberg, ken bensinger, thank you both for being here. [applause] >> i don't know where we start. most of what he said about politics was alive.

that was a lot more than i could ever teach. it is a pleasure to be here. before i start talking again, who here is unfamiliar with the whole structure of international soccer? just a quick primer. every country in the world to play soccer, there's 211 of them, has the national association that runs their soccer program. then, they all belong to fifa, the international umbrella over all of soccer. and fifa for organizational purposes devised the world into regions. so the catch out with all the scandals going on is the fifa scandal. in one sense it is because it's under the umbrella, but most of

the horrendous corruption occurred mostly in south america and north america. obviously, they get their organizational bona fides by being part of fifa. basically all these local entities in all these regional entities have their own competition, marketing and sponsorship rights is where the money comes from. i want to make sure you all have that background. as bert said, this is really, soccer is the gathering story if you will. what fascinated me in reading it if they knew a lot of the players. i was in, but thankfully not in. a lot of the episodes that went

on. how you pieced it all together is just amazing to me. multinational, many years what was the process of piecing it all together, doing the investigation and running a really compelling book. >> thank you. i want to say that alan knows what he's talking about. he feels the awareness and things come of it was the chief executive of the 1994 world cup in the united states. he was in charge of running the most successful workup in history, certainly the best attended world cup in history in terms of number of people who went through it and one that turned a very tidy profit compared to some of the others. alan also was president of the united states soccer federation, one of those associations he

mentioned the country's operations and reports directly to fifa. allen also is a cofounder of major league soccer which is the professional league that has two teams here in los angeles and played all over the country. he's been on numerous fifa committees and has been involved in the sport i really the highest level for decades. >> you might mention that one of the fifa committees i was on was the fifa ethics committee. i said nobody laugh. >> military intelligence. another fun fact is that alan makes a cameo inside of the book because unbeknownst to him he went to dinner with one of the secret cooperators at the doj had enlisted him that i was wearing a wire.

[laughter] was an fbi agent, ira station in the same restaurant waiting for alan to put his foot in his mouth. they never did and they never did anything with them but they sure tried. >> the first thing i did was look at the index. i was hoping my name wasn't even in it. and when it was in it, i was delighted there is only one page. couldn't have been too much. that's when i found out this dinner that i had not only was the person i was having dinner with who is the real whistleblower if you will on everything had a wire. the wire was a chip inside of a key ring. that was bad enough, but only later when i read your book that i found out the fbi, irs with the next thing. >> the story i heard was it was very keen in a beverly hills steakhouse and very trendy at the time because a whole gaggle of hollywood stars and walked into the restaurant.

fbi agents and irs agents aren't necessarily used to that sort of thing, so i think they had trouble paying attention to conversations. [laughter] so in answer to your question, how did i put it all together. the first draft was about 60% or 70% longer than the final draft. even before that come a moment where i was in the basement of the national library in argentina going through newspapers from 1978 trying to learn as much as i could about a world cup the list in the of being very problematic. i thought to myself, how the heck am i ever going to tell the story? there's so many characters in so many moving parts. ultimately, the answer was a lot of cutting and a lot of just removing material that seemed extraneous.

i had an editor who is of the old school. so old-school that he edits with pencil and ups views the manuscript printed out and makes he tell you what pencil to use when you make your changes and mail it back to him. that happened multiple times. i spent a lot of money just on postage to make this book. his comments meant to be things like why you have so many care yours. there's too many. cut them, cut them, cut them. what it came down to was tearing it down, looking for what was the central most important story that kept it going forward. unfortunately, some blood had to be shed. character is incredibly important to the investigation, but we alternately made gains in the smaller role the story because they didn't get indicted or arrested. >> i guess there was only one page. yeah, exactly. >> a guy named roberto teixeira come easily one of the most corrupt soccer officials in

history and he is in the book. there is a version in which he was chapter after chapter of the argument with the editor was he did get indicted, but it's in brazil which doesn't extradite to defend in the maverick anemones never going to leave and why don't we focus on a happy ending where they could get these guys. i'm glad to hear it held together coherently. >> i think it was great. byrd alluded to some of the things that are going on in washington. reading the book, that struck me a lot, including that the original source was an irs agent and it was less about the glamorous stuff that she read about in trials or in mystery books.

tell everybody about how that went down. i am just curious, was he somebody that did you spend a lot of time at them or is this just piecing it up afterwards? >> i will start by saying i'm a journalist and there certain kinds of sourcing i can't talk about. i can name the source. in this book, there are characters that it probably looks like a talk to them. i in fact did. i'm going to have to be like a magician inserted not tell you all the secrets unfortunately. nonetheless, this is a guy named steve berryman and he was a fun character because he was very likely for this story. this is an investigation done out of a federal district in brooklyn, new york and at the time he comes along it was

stymied because they are having a lot of trouble making the case move forward. steve berryman, an irs agent in orange county, in southern orange county by the internal revenue service would seem to have nothing to do at this. turns out he's a diehard soccer fan. he's an air force brat and his father was stationed in england, said he grew up in england and was a liverpool fan. he's also a great athlete. he had a division i scholarship as a placekicker to kick field goals for think i want to say either southern or northern illinois university. when he wasn't quick enough to to be an nfl kicker, he chose the next obvious path, which would be irs agent and went down there and in cut his teeth in originally riverside county and then in orange county doing narco cases, being drugrunners

and that sort of thing. the thing he said when the fbi would do them, they are always chasing the tracks. what i do drugs, but the guy with the drugs you decide you can't complete the investigation until you figure over the money is. they don't sell the drugs were not being enough money is dirty, too. that's part of the transaction until you find that come you don't fully close the loop. that was the way he took cases that have one cases that have one or two counts and turn them into cases of 22 counts and put these people away forever. so that was what he brought to the case was an interest in soccer and also what he talked about. he convinced the prosecutors in this case, the money-laundering case and that was the way to prove that and by doing the really hard, grueling work of looking at excel spreadsheets all day long, you can make this case. there was finally a trial in the case last november, december and

he spent three days on the stand which was a lot. they one more person could spend more time than him and there was this great endeavor project team excel spreadsheets. he was like the to line 13,452. you will see on bro x x b., there is the you are looking for. when he wasn't testifying during the trial, he was looking at other excel spreadsheet with because he is continuing to do what he does best. >> currently in washington d.c., it is my eerie that underlying everything that went on with trump and the russians-based transactions that i think are more questionable for many years. and if you see what little we can see from the outside of that

mueller is doing, sure looks that way. manafort? and gates who has fled the russian. again, this has really struck me. i want to that i read the book. but it's on page two, so you know. the agent they are talking about is a man by the name steve berryman. work in those cases was drugs, guns and violence were only half the story could only be told once all the money had been traced. while dea agents trained troves of drugs, they spend his time chasing the dealers money around the world, adding additional charges that often defended to the indictments. people were validly realize. they played games, for carfax,

succumb to temptations, exaggerated and contradicted themselves. documents never lied. what i can tell from the outside, all this hard work that mueller is doing is going to be similar to that. what's your view? >> i think that's right. you're giving me a very tempting segue. but i think that's right. in fact, there are old on mothers teen who had a small hand in this investigation. one of the top prize guys said the team is a guy named greg andres. the supervisor of the lead prosecutor in train 10 and a woman who worked below the lead prosecutor in this case supervised other cases while he was running this case. he's a really interesting prosecutor. he was profiled in "the new yorker" a couple years ago. a pakistani-american doing anti-terrorism cases.

she's on the case as well and all of these people were trained in the same position of that kind of police work that sort of checking the boxes of the paperwork for following the numbers and showing it because there's just so much more compelling than almost anything else. but also when it comes to sitting down in the room and saying you can do it our way or the hard way. those kind of prosecutors are used to getting most people when confronted with this evidence to just rollover because it so completely overwhelming. i find it astounding they are going to try out considering suicide. [inaudible] said giuliani representing him. only a fool has giuliani for a

client. but the segue was about the connection between this and mother in general. the first was he was ahead of the the fbi witness case opened and after september 11th he created a new vision for the fbi, which had to do was sort of forgetting about traditional crime and focusing on what he considered to be terrorism related crime, counterterrorism and the money movement that would support it. a lot of money out of the traditional fbi squad in the new york squad was principally focused with breast-feeding ukrainian and other moms. you can sort of imagine a surgeon importer for something. there is no longer an appetite for what they're doing. they are being bled that agents. they try and find out a different way to bite the apple.

if i can new transnational russian organized crime, then bob mueller is going to like it. and so he starts traveling around talking about what he can find. involving an illegal poker room in an online sports book. a piece of that case was recently in the movie theaters in a movie called molly's game. molly bloom was a piece of that. there was some russian cameos in that movie. the head of the whole thing was a russian boar, which is like the mafia don. the fbi agent goes to london because he tried to build a case and look for other cases under different connection he's introduced to a guy who becomes really famous. years later it back i is called

christopher steele. raise your hand if you've heard of christopher steele. he needs the fbi agent until somebody can about this russian mafia boss. if you find anything else interesting in your case is coming you've got my phone number. here's your car. christopher steele had a client at the time in the world of soccer. it didn't come out. but the client was england. to win the 2018 world cup for here in the 2018 world cup, england doesn't have the world cup in 2010. he had been hired with england's finding not small amount of money. it's a huge deal for them. they held a 66 cup at the birth is a soccer. and when they cover all the bases they hired a bunch of different intelligence types and gather information about their

competitors, and because they know he knows about russia. he's gathering information and gets really ominous things from his sources about russia rose up to. they don't seem to be playing fair in their attempt to win the world cup. he hears about potential brides and the people getting involved that are oligarch betty said putin. the fact that putin is famously not a soccer fan, a hockey fan is not interested, suddenly is obsessed with soccer. all of this is really troubling to him until he called an fbi agent that began inside you should come back to london. i want to tell you about something else. they sit down in july 2010th and have a conversation about what rush is doing, how the voting works, about why russia might be trying to play funny games and there might be transnational crime involved. the fbi agent never heard of fifa. he goes back to new york and he

finds this prosecutor and convinces him to open a case. not because it has a star name, but that is essential between the fbi and christopher steel that ends up playing a much more important role down the road in all of our lives because christopher steel as we know develops this dossier about trump and russia. christopher still wants to get to the fbi. he gives tips all the time that he ignores. because he had this track record with income he had this relationship with him, he had proven a person had with him. he called the same fbi agent who at that point is no longer in new york, but in rome working in the embassy in rome and says he should come to london again to the dossier. a safe bet they would have taken it seriously. the success in the fifa case to make it a viable, credible

thing. that's one of the other parallels. jim comey with the fbi director by the time this case is open in 2015 given a press conference he was towering over it loretta lynch is quite small and he's six-foot eight and a lot of the cast of characters that we think of better trumps pacific also are fifa. before i let him get a word in edgewise. >> you're the author. i'm just a provocateur. >> one of the things i've been thinking about the last few days is the timing of this. this russia -- i should back up and say infamous super qualified and russia was like utterly unqualified to get it. england was the best place for a walkout besides the u.s. today. that's a whole another ball of?

but russia did not say, didn't have the money, airports, freeway. they didn't have a really great soccer tradition. there was not a lot of good reasons that they win in 2010. when obama was president and we're in the russian reset and i like russia and the u.s. were buddies. obama was hugging putin in making deals and at the same time christopher steele is signing up on the subterfuge is happening to them and they agree to sanctions against iran and take russia off its own sanctions list and it's this wonderful, warm fuzzy time. it is easy to forget that now because we think of russia in pretty stark terms right now. but this is a warm and cuddly rush as far as they knew in 2010. what we see now if this was in a sense the first time of what russia were dealing with now.

this is the first incursion of russia into international affairs in a way that's kind of machiavellian, which as we look at what we want no matter what. russia wants the world cup because it's the most important sporting event in the world and the biggest audience in the world want all their eyeballs on them. i think who it was prime minister at the time. he was prime minister again and plenty to be and when the world cup has internally he could speak to russian voters and say look how great i have got us the most prestigious in the world and he did. in march he got 75% plus of the vote. but the second thing was to get the world cup now so he could project the power out. he had proven domestically he was the big strong man and now he wanted to show the world. that was his motivation and what we see in 2010 and hindsight is a russia that was interventionist, a russia that would do secretive things to get what they wanted and no one was

really noticing that i guess except for maybe these fbi agents. >> a central figure in this whole thing, one they were able to identify when they saw the initial tax issue is a gentleman by the name of chuck blazer. some of us who know him, i wish you would give a terrific description of him physically, psychologically, every which way. >> i've talked to check a couple times. chuck is no longer with us. he died by summer. alan knew him far better than me. he is certainly larger than life both figuratively and literally. chuck in the later part of his life is about 450 pounds. fairly tall. pretty big guy, had type-2 diabetes and other health problems and couldn't walk very

well, so he would ride around central park in a personal mobility scooter with a pair of perched on his shoulder. he had a big, giant beard and sort of a mop of tangled hair on his head and looked like santa claus basically. ..

>> he was briefed at u.s. soccer federation to create the national team, a supporter his a supporter his daughter played soccer help to understand how important that was. people talk he was the life of

the party with a classic nightspot in the kind of guy that was with the really big personality but towards the end of his life putting things in his pocket that did not belong to him which is common one of the guys was convicted at trial last december brazilian handing out metal and putting them on their neck but then one kid he's jim and he put the metal in his pocket. he is in the metropolitan

detention center right now waiting for his sentence five out of six counts. he's 80 years old will probably die in prison. so his thing he did not invent that that might eat a bike in the early 70s it is that situation who knows where it came from but had a button company they produced the button and he made a fortune. and he saw the opportunity one of the famous he does with his regional confederation which you would like that?

me in a room and did i will just set up the company with the association and get 10% of all revenue. all the money coming in the door will go to my company. but by the end there was $16 million in revenue. he did pretty well on top of that with the corporate credit card to pay for almost everything he did in life he didn't put anything in his personal card like vehicle or a, i get condominium in the bombing it is a long list. he built a 3 million-dollar film studio at trump tower.

trump tower. and things to donald trump in the lobby of the trump tower. he built that film studio using a grant from fifa but that didn't stop him creating $300,000 for his own i don't know how you consider that revenue but anyway. no bookkeeper ever caught it because he never filed taxes he didn't file for so long the irs revoked his 5o1c3 status. they are still fighting to get that back even his own personal taxes and going back 17 years and then i found court filing

that there were issues in the 80 when he wasn't filing taxes either. but that was his downfall he didn't ever pay taxes to understand why he didn't buy the condo so there was a story i heard he would go to las vegas and they trade you get the players card and you make a lot of money then you get a free room he would refuse those because he thought that somebody asked the irs knew that he had income he would not participate in what was the behavior of a guilty man. and steve had the power to look at tax return you would think

they are all-powerful but they can't they just cannot do that they need the irs do it lawyers have explained this to be five times that i don't i don't understand it if they get a judges order without irs makes them impossible to charge so they don't do it. he pulls it and said bingo he's never paid taxes. it's one thing not to pay by the same to never file. but they did that because of complications a guy in the caribbean baby, baby, not at odds with each other and in that bond with the investigative journalist the irs agencies and

looks at it that in looking at the computer screen with a magnifying glass and that was photocopied the cancellation mark was merrill lynch. and then mailing the checks to the caribbean or he was headed to the broker at merrill lynch because he could be painted with those records to build a case. and because it was merrill lynch and not the first caribbean national bank in the cayman islands he could do that without making a lot of noise asking in other countries and then they

confront him on the trump tower and they down with him. there has been stories he was handcuffed and pushed against the wall. none of that they called him on the phone is down. and introduced through another fbi agent said i i want you to know i love football i care about it that you haven't paid taxes in 17 years. here is a subpoena you can ask your lawyer but you have to give us every account number of bank account in the world and it

would be helpful if you consider helping us with our investigation. this is trying to get somebody to flip some you have to work them really hard to have to handcuff them or dragon downtown he took me. [applause] second and flipped and then within weeks he sat down with prosecutors telling selling them his life story and explaining to them and that was one pack of law. it all. you mention of os and lower i don't like to think of them like that because if you feel that

moral him bridge it is an outrage. this is moral outrage. and it feels like game theory. he decided to wear a wire. and makeup consensual reporting only coming from one side of that phone call by the way. and recorded other people with chuck and that didn't work out that there was an important brazilian. because unlike laser was about payer. and countless millions and was

for north and south and much less helpful cooperator but when they got him and to deliver a full new continent and still bleeding on a tray. >> most of those payoffs were related to the marketing right is so for example if somebody wanted to have those tv rights which are hugely valuable, they would go and pay off and then to acquire the right that u.s.

attorneys use and that was the value of the entire package not just the parts that they got. most of that involved around that most of that talks about the fifa handle that on -- handle handle but i was representing the government of morocco when they were trying to acquire the rights in 2010. and what happens when i went to bed the night before the boat and we lost.

it was jack warner and one of his cohorts i assume it was a payoff i have no idea. but apparently when he volunteered that if we thought we had to do this in advance so that is how we lost it. fortunately i have no idea what they paid him but that was a big bust. >> it was a big disappointment. >> but does south africa admitted him and jack warner negotiated to those plus that member of the confederation and

he admitted to it. but that was the high level when we think about that with corruption. and that was a lot more where that comes from. so with that highest level of fifa not representative of the majority of what they found. because nobody thinks about it. with sponsorship but about how popular it is not at the very highest level but all the tv in

sponsorship and coca-cola and all these other brands it turns out they had some questions. nike has not gotten in trouble to this date but the story goes 9293 went to meet with nike and get him to sponsor a national team he was not interested. but then the world cup happens in brazil win the world cup with 100,000 people and thought maybe soccer is something important and agreed to sponsor u.s. nationals at that point but also about brazil. that was very nike thing to do.

and then number one team in the world. and then including those back but now he laughs them to say i didn't i didn't know about the kickback but the fact is with $2 million per year but that is representative of a lot of the that would include bigger and bigger and bigger that was here in u.s. a couple of years ago as an originally with 15 million then negotiated down at 10 million. so to say that could have gone to the federation so think about

the economics so why would they have the right to something? i want alan that promise not to talk to anyone else about it. and you don't have to take much more to know what that means we have competition. and then never plate to market. but it is also taken. >> because of the prosecution team. with those core defendant and

they would it would never be brought to justice. in this break that open set to go down in history one of the most significant days in history two days before the fifa election but it is incredibly luxurious. and with these lobbies. and surprisingly small. so they have the talent to make nothing look really nice. empty.

and makes it was fabulous. and then to knock on the doors at 6:00 o'clock in the morning but it was a crazy thing to ever happen but they bested him as they travel with their wives and completely terrified. and then marco had just taken over from the other one and said marco polo you have to help me my husband is in trouble. so he said that's terrible and that's awful i will help you out we will figure this out.

and then to pack a suitcase and goes to the lobby of the hotel and goes to the airport and flies to brazil. he has not left brazil. that this step was not indicting on the first round. not until the following december. but then was about two days later was a delegate. and then with trial all the evidence should be put out again the other guy. and almost as if you were convicted because all of that evidence is like one thing after the other to make those press --

press statement that he stopped making comments. >> with the investigation and indictment after the u.s. had lost his bid in the 2022 world cup there was a lot of discussion it was a revenge what was the take on that? i? i have heard that. number of times. not exactly like he had been portrayed. with that scheming international man.

and then another place with nothing in it. and he said it is sour grapes and obama went home and when that was anno announced phil cln was the chairman and then to order the investigation eric holder called loretta lynch and then boom that's what it's all about. and then it was already open five months earlier as the investigation. but then they operate out of the

office for a reason. that is a gray and story district because these guys were not even thinking about it. there is the moment when the case agent reports. and in 2010. and then the new york times or action. thinking about the world cup back then. and like on page five of sports section to say look. but that is my answer.

but with my travels not in any justifying. but there is a lot of outrage around the world. how could united states invite people from other countries? they would have the rico law ricoh law in most parts of the world. and in many cases they barely step foot in the united states fed the wire transferred money through defense system in all likelihood that's enough to get jurisdiction with the rest of the world that is bewildering to us that bribery is commonplace

so when this was taking plmonple in the world. so when this was taking place that did not make commercial bribery a crime. so to take that costs as a a deduction on your tax return. i'm not adopting that but then they call us hypocrites? if? if we want to come to the united states with a lawful you have to hire this lawyer this is the lobbyist you should hire support this elected official that we are just more straightforward about it. that justified it but some of the anger and perplexity is we

do not understand. >> it took a lot of explaining to make him them understand what they had done. and with that inquisition to two the way the prosecutors worked it out with what they figured out that what they got was often used on politician but if you are an officer of some kind of institution to have that standard and on a fiduciary level. and with that ethics code you are defrauding the institution

you work for. and the giveaway is that is true. but you can tell because they were sneaky about it. to go to incredible late -- length but they would take it in cash one was convicted and then the personal driver 15 hours each way to pick up a cash prize put in the back of the truck and then spend the night load the truck and drive right back with a couple a couple hundred thousand dollars cash in his truck it doesn't smell like a legitimate way to take commission. absolutely.

how much did russia pay in bride >> there was a lot of question about the world cup and fifa under pressure hired a former u.s. attorney not a the new york state appeals that is the equivalent of the supreme court in united states that he worked at kirkland and to investigate russia so what is amazing he could not conduct the investigation and to be banned from setting foot in russia but

he could not go there. but not as much as american but and the russian at the funny thing that you asked about that we have the computers to keep track but but when it was over he then back to the person that won't them to us. >> so there is no computers left. no records at all of what happened. but then fifa said no harm no foul. [applause].

[laughter] but then they were banned. but you might put on the tv set today to see putin assess his personal guess. >> and one of the great troll news of the year. and then it sets out that entire criminal investigation. and then it has the world cup. and that was in that physician there was no way he had the job without it but one week later and there with the former guy who said you're not allowed back. this is my country.

so to me that is a power move. >> i was going to ask your opinion. >> they did get caught. watching mitt romney's career the reason they got that job because they were arriving everyone right and that was in the late 1990 the prosecutors

built the case asking about one of most of noxious prosecutions in modern history the case fell apart there was no conviction. but they were paying college fellowships for them to vote in a bid to a bid to answer the question in london so because it is based in switzerland it is so beloved and popular throughout the world no one could catch it. but the olympics is can we host the fix? there is big dollars there but beneath that the community and

marketing rights to the local gymnastics team or mobile archery team have no value. relatively less value obviously that software is the passion to every country in the world. that all of these levels below the fifa level. but there is all that money those tv rights are worth a fortune. so it is so different. the methods of annual championships.

we met we are so olympic fixated. trying to get interested in the world cup in the early 90209 members fifa and the united nations and given a choice to a choice to belong to only one. and with united states at 5:00 o'clock in the morning.

>> payment and that makes it susceptible to bribery but now they have changed that with the location of the world cup. will that the tide bribery from their votes? it is a small pool of people. but then they change the voting policy? and then instead of a secret ballot than brazil because they are so irritated and from canada and u.s. and mexico. some would say it is just more people to bribe. but lower cost.

you want to bribe the guy from sierra leone it probably doesn't cost that much that we have to see over time fifa is making it much harder. but in mexico is 4018 that is more complicated more stadium and infrastructure down to those countries to be put off that could be one way. that is not the mystic way to look at that as money grab but we will see is a little early to tell. >> it was all power from their standpoint so one of the things

fifa does is all of the federation literally with electronic voting as they walk up to the ballot box they were handed in envelope with money in it. allegedly for their federation. >> but there is a cultural problem there. that is for the conversation but it is the deep needed problem but they cut three generations deep one president then the next successor. but is not having enough of the

metaphor i'm using lately like cancer you have to cut out that tissue or the tumor that's not the end of the treatment but fifa needs a lot more treatment before it gets a clean bill of health. >> that is in the directors cut. [laughter] because it was too long. not many people want to read 700 page book on fifa but it is a crazy story that pelé was haley was most famous soccer player of all time had a big test at all.

because of that power he got a haley pushed out the sport for a while because of this. then they inc. the name he did not do the draw. and then to bypass that to make a dramatic injury. and then writing several books in portuguese i speak spanish not portuguese to take it took me a long time to read the book and then they lived in florida for a while and then after dying in highway in miami that may

have led to the following out the fact that he had a lover not his father-in-law's daughter. >> that is a great book a great book whether you like soccer or not. and how it takes place and detected. it is phenomenal. i thank you for saying that. [applause]

>> you have learned. he would serve roosevelt and taft i will not play popularity if they want to reject me that their prerogative he has the madisonian view love james madison and hamilton and john marshall considered the greatest american ever and they believe the majority should rule but only slowly and thoughtfully over time the reason over passion could prevail in the entire system is to so low that direct expression so people can be covered in the public interest rather than through affection. in self-interest other than the public good.

[applause] good evening. welcome to the national press club and our audience i am the national press club president and editor at politico is a place for a place for news happens in today's headline feature the fascinating p