legislative plaza? >> okay. okay. >> great. thank you all for coming. >> thank you. [applause] >> you can watch this and all other book tv programs from the past 20 years at book tv.org. type the author's name and the word book in the search bar at the top of the page. >> our coverage of the recent southern festival of books continues now with a discussion on andrew jackson.

>> hello, everybody. thank you for coming today. we are always happy to have you at the southern festival of looks. my name is andy bennett. i am hosting this session. i will not be talking very much. the festival is, as you know, free. it depends on community support. if you would like to donate to the southern festival of books, you can do so by going by the festival headquarters. you can do it on the website or on facebook. a way to give the festival money you can also buy our authors book at the book sales area on the war memorial plaza. and after this presentation, you can take your book and get it signed at the authors signing area which is also on the

memorial building plaza. today, we have to authors. hearing from one at a time. we will take some questions. the first author we will hear from is mark. he is a professor of history at cumberland university. one of the things he is doing now is he is the project erect your for the papers of martin van buren. becoming a democracy. presidential campaigning in the age of jackson. also has another book that came out this year. called andrew jackson and the rise of the democratic party. he also has another bookie wrote he knows a lot about andrew jackson. without further a do, i will turn this over to professor mark.

>> thank you, andy. let me start my timer. i i appreciate being here with andy. also with all of you. appreciate the southern festival of books. they witnessed the awakening of american democracy through the lessening of restrictions on adult wide male suffrage. this suffrage likely would have led on its own to a more vigorous type of campaigning and to a more democratic government. coveting this change was vigorous political campaigning during election years. this was led by martin van buren who was from new york. serving as vice president and president and really the

architect of the democratic party and the two-party system. it stood with us today. individuals such as francis p blair moving to washington. serving in various capacities under the jackson administration and for the democratic party. these activists used the expanded voter base and fresh and new ways. they used it in ways that had not been seen on a large scale before. seen at the local and state level but not the national level. what resulted was traditional politics such as voting and holding office with something called cultural politics. my book, becoming democracy addresses the intersection of these two things. traditional politics as we think of it. a new type of cultural politics.

you may not be familiar with cultural politics. i will spend most of my time today defining what that meant a give you some examples of what cultural politics looks like. i will talk about nine things. they will not take me that long. i promise you. you kind of settled in for a while. i will be done pretty quickly. the first example of cultural politics was auxiliary organizations. these were organizations or clubs of voters who would meet and they would discuss politics. they usually drink as well. they ate food. these organizations were crucial in building up and energizing the voter base. you had old hickory clubs. you had okay clubs. and then you had other clubs. the nickname for william henry

harrison. a second example with material culture. really just objects that were used to support candidates. there is a campaign button or campaign for van buren. it could be things other assorted things. liking to plant or put into the ground hickory polls. these things are so a big u.s. the first real scholarly biographer said this the hickory polls. every village as well as upon the corners and many city streets was the hickory pole. many were standing as late as

1845. a third example of cultural politics was print culture. print culture could mean a number of things. newspapers grew tremendously through the. many of them don't last very long. some of them last for decades, some of them last four months. those newspapers were partisan. they were openly partisan. that is something to wrap our minds around today. we are used too fair and balanced. unbalanced news. newspapers at this time were not that way at all. openly paid for by parties, candidates. they advocated a very strong partisan position. you also have campaign biographies.

campaign biographies that were pro candidate, pro- jackson, pro- van buren, pro- clay or campaign biography that were anti-candidates. anti-van buren, anti-clay, anti-harrison type of biographies. they could also be children books, by the way. four example, 1840, there is a children campaign talks about him on a very elementary level to try to cultivate supporters of the party for the future. fortunately the party does not last that long. maybe some of those young people, young men grew up to vote big. a fourth example of cultural politics was visual culture. visual culture primarily meaning political cartoons. political cartoons became a very prolific during this period because of the development of

lithography. a way of imprinting illustrations illustrations in a cheap efficient way and very detailed way that allowed them to be on cheap newsprint or good newspaper. these political cartoons were very complex. you have the opportunity to look at political cartoons from this era. you would be astonished at the assumption of political literacy that was contained in those cartoons. a pro- wig cartoon. the farmer and his visitors. showing martin van buren. the democratic candidate. going to visit. harrison's home. harrison is depicted as a farmer out plowing his fields. you have these democratic

dandies. these elite democratic statesmen who come to visit him. they come in on how he is telling the ground. how he is tilling his field. here we are, democrats that live in washington, d.c. in high style. we ride around in our carriages. we wish we could be more like william henry harrison. that is propaganda. political propaganda. cultivate this image of a very wealthy family as a commoner. to depict van buren in particular who came from a very modest backgrounds. an elite aristocrat. an example of cultural politics was political music. something that spread tremendously during this time. lyrics will be printed in newspapers. you have songbooks that premier.

you have hymnals for lack of a better term. for the wig party in particular. very evangelical. the songbooks or the songs have a very partisan message. often times, the lyrics in newspapers, they would have the lyrics. they would also have songs to the tune of a very commonly known song. for example, there was was one song that was sung to the tune of rock-a-bye baby. it goes like this. russia by baby daddies a wig before he comes home hard cider hill swig should he get tipsy ♪ ♪ together we will fall ♪ down will come daddy tip cradle and all ♪ ♪ you don't even have to pay for that song. the point is, you know, the lyrics are not very deep. it was a song.

it was a tune that people would know. the point is, they were supporters of hard cider and log cabins in 1840. the democrats said this is not a good thing. hard cider is drink of the commoners. the hard-working class. democrats are saying it is alcohol and these guys are getting drunk. they are auxiliary organizations. it has its effects on families. just like with political cartoons. very complex. assumed an amount of literacy on the part of this new voting population. an example of cultural politics included public correspondence between candidates and voters. you have voters who would write letters or write appeals or

write resolutions that they would send to a presidential candidate and these would be publishing newspapers of course. they expected candidates to respond. there are times where they would respond very superficially. thank you for your letter. usual political brushoff. then there are times when candidates felt like they had to respond in more detail. four example, 1836, running for election for the first time, voters in the south wrote him asking about his views on slavery. van buren was a northerner. southern voters, he was a slave owner, he was someone they could identify with. withholding these same principles. responding in detail. the southern voter base was similar to the coalition he put

together. including public events such as campaign rallies and parades. the newspaper descriptions of these rallies and parades are in some cases very detailed. you get a really good flavor of what politics was like at this time. you can also find this in the correspondence. there is the campbell collection one of the letters in the campbell collection is by virginia campbell. where the university is located and where i teach. this is her description of the wig campaign in 1840. our eyes were charmed i the liberty pole. the grandest of all, made at muskegon, ohio and has traveled to alter more to nashville for this parade.

you have these campaign balls that appear in 1840 that are rolled down streets. usually they have names of some sort of campaign slogan on them. this was one of the highlights in particular in 1840. virginia was up on a hill watching this take place. it is really fascinating to think about parades and rallies and a way i don't think we can see above during this period an example of cultural politics include political speeches by candidates. william henry harrison was the first presidential candidate who adversely campaigned by giving speeches in 1836. by 1840, he gave a little over two dozen major speeches and another minor speeches during that particular campaign. these speeches were very long, very detailed.

very interesting and giving insight into what candidates william henry harrison is what they thought were important. it is something that again i do not think we connect with this. because we think all of this comes later. it comes much later on a larger scale. you have candidates giving speeches. lastly, the last example of cultural politics is women's activity. women, of course, could not could not vote in presidential elections. women had a very limited role. the party in particular found ways to involve women. doing the normal things you would expect out of gender roles during this time. lucy kenney was a virginia woman who wrote political pam plates that were published. these political pamphlets are actually very astute

observations about the political landscape of the united states about point. she even serrated martin van buren. what is interesting is part of her evisceration seems to come with the fact that she went to him first in asked for support to publish pro- democratic pamphlets. she went to the other side and decided to write for the whigs. very political in that way. those were examples of cultural politics. what do they tell us about this? it tells us a lot. i will mention two things. it helps explain why voter participation rates between 1840 and 1900 exceed in the% threshold. in some cases the 80% threshold. think about this. in today's world we get close to 60% voter participation rate. talking about how energized and how interested voters are,

consistently between between 1840 and 1900, 70% of american voters who were eligible were voting. in some cases, 80%. voters in the 19th century were interested in politics. part of the reason is because of the way parties reached out to them and involve them in ways that we sort of assume are the norm today. they were in many ways, new at that time. cultural politics in the jacksonian. in many ways are still used today. just in different forms. in terms of the imagery and candidates as just common people very wealthy. lived in a mansion. you never would have known it. sitting back and drinking alcohol in your log cabin. kind of hang out with the guys.

that is not who he was at all. ink about modern day presidential candidates. i will reference 2016. hillary clinton was worth 27 and a half million dollars. she and her husband bill collectively around 45 million. the republican candidate donald trump, hard to get a grasp on how much he is actually worth. ::: ::: this is something that voters in 1840 were pitched by candidates and they are something we still face today. the use of images and visual culture those funny cartoons

so for example there was one in 2016 that depicted hillary clinton as the wicked west -- wicked witch of the west. someone that can't be can be trusted. and then on the other side of the image of donald trump as pepper the frog. there is one very famous image. they are dressed in nazi uniforms and depicted in a meme that is intended to point out the fact that they had affiliated themselves with the white supremacist wing of american politics. those are just two examples of

their many more that i could talk about. following the victory in the 18 presidential election. they commented on the non- transitional things that they have head. they will have a lasting memory to prosperity. that for the coming of democracy. i think we are still seen the coming of democracy today. thank you. he has written this book hard into hickory. the misting chapter of indra jackson's life. and in the other life. he was a practicing lawyer in

franklin tennessee. he has have a long-term interest in the parkway he has represented the trace parkway association on the war of 1812 by centennial commission. he has written a play about the mysterious death of mary, whether lewis. the trail heritage foundation journal. in the journal of mississippi history. so, let's hear from tony about his new book. >> thank you. i want to think humanities tennessee for inviting us here today. and judge bennett for the introduction. my book turned out to be a story about the rivalry between two of the most intriguing characters of american history. they called one of the characters the most despicable character in our history.

and for people today who is not talking about andrew jackson. the other character was general james wilkinson. he was a general in charge of the u.s. army southern command. he was also a spy on the payroll of the european enemy. they called him agent 13. a great name for a book if you're writing about history. they sold the loyalty early on to the spanish and his goal was to pull away the western states and somehow empower himself in the west here west here in the tennessee area. jackson suspected that wilkinson was a spy and he worked for years to prove it. and so, what i had found in the story was the great rivalry that went on between jackson and wilkins it was a little over ten years. before i get into the story

itself. let me tell you about how this came about. in writing the book. when i was in high school i have a great high school history teacher. and one day for extra credit. it's one of the early great wagon roads. let me tell you a story. from that moment i had been hooked. one of the stories he told was about indra jackson merging the soldiers down the path to new orleans to win this great victory over the british. i was interested to know where to jackson steps. where there any battles along the way. i was disappointed when i read the biographies to find there is very little in the biographies about this time of his history. this is when he became old hickory. i could not understand why there was more written about this type in jackson's history. fast forward to about 2011 and in the national park where a lot of these events took place. and we were getting ready to plan the war of 1812 by centennial with living history

events. we will be pretrade in these these events and i began to do research again as to what actually took place during this time. one day a friend of mine handed me a journal a copy of an old journal and he said you might find this with some help. i realized it was one of jackson's officers order books from the battle of new orleans. and that started the seven year journey of a club exploration. they may be able to answer the questions that they asked. that led me to bill cook who is that for most collectors of 1812. asking about it. he said i had collected these documents my whole life. i began to discover documents that talked about this time and that led me to other archives along there.

i found journals from some of the soldiers that were with jackson that told different parts of the story. in some original documents. the documents have not been properly catalogued. it was like putting together a motion picture retell the story from different angles. all of these journals and letters. we started giving talks along the magistrate. and at the end of a similar talk. they would come up to me sometime and say my ancestors fought with them in the battle of new orleans. everybody's ancestors follow jackson after he won. just like they followed the valley forge.

and i have his letters. yes i would like to see this. they begin to fill in more with a piece of this puzzle. this rivalry with wilkinson. they both really one wanted the same thing. he served with the revolutionary war. he is in his cousin's house. they ransacked the house. and he sees jackson. rather than runaway.

they stood up and demanded the rights. in the soldier research out and hit jackson on the head. he bore a scar on his have from the encounter. as a say in the book. it told the story of a young boy. even as a 13-year-old. i think some date someday wanting to become the next general who would drive the british soldiers. the first, he have to deal with general wilkinson. it led to a greater victory.

you get an idea if the animosity that's going on with these men. it was very crafty. he have intelligence everywhere. he was very deceptive. and ehrenberg showed up at jackson's house and ask if he could board the horses. that led to jackson being pulled into a scheme. jackson was a traitor to his country. he have a plot. they didn't realize it until a businessman was having lunch with him. what was that up to. what was really going on. he wants to rob the bank of new orleans. and hide the mercenary army. and that he wants to attack washington.

it wasn't really burr and wilkinson. they have pulled them into this steam. even the secretary of war suggested that perhaps jackson was a traitor to the cause. they medially begin immediately begin fighting back and when thomas jefferson had him arrested for treason and have them taken to richmond for a very public time. they appeared as a witness. rather than talk about the trial politely. and he arranged jefferson for prosecuting this innocent man. when the real culprit was general wilkinson. the grand jury came within two votes of convicting aaron burr. of james wilkinson for

treason. in jackson when we heard that wilkinson was good appear they would make the ground shake within 20 miles around wilkinson if he shut up. after he was safely back at his cam. and that he insulted him. they swooped off. in a mosque the just continue to grow over the years. inter- jackson saw his chance. this is as opportunity to make himself the general who liberated the south. when the order came down to lead them. that order came in june of

1812 if not quite what they expected. he was ordered to that point general. they have hijacked these plans. jackson was very politically connected here. and they had ordered the governor to muster to regiments of soldiers. they violated the order. it was going to be a calvary regiment. kind of like the tank force of its day. and rather than just march down as a unit on the

mississippi river. as he was ordered to do. jackson treated him like the enemy and he divided the soldiers. almost a surprise attack. on his rival there. jackson had a plan, he was going to go to new orleans where he was camped and then he was going to ignore wilkinson. and take it from the spanish in the british. and jackson was going to become the general who liberated the gulf coast the evidence is there in a book. and then jackson set off in january 1813 with the soldiers. and when he left nashville. there is a grand public ceremony. the flags were fine. in jackson assured everyone

that they would return as concrete heroes. indra jackson wasn't charged of these trips. wilkinson started working his plan. you need to stop short of new orleans. they used both the cure and the stick. he would be better positioned to march towards mobile. and as a stick he used the one enemy that i think indra jackson feared it was fever or disease. it can wipe out an army. in short order. if he went on to new orleans there was disease that would wipe out his army. what he disobey the governor's order and follow that advice.

i think his ambition got away from him. and he decided to stop. he fell for the trick. and as a human in. he have a grand public ceremony it was said they arrived as a concrete hero. almost a roman emperor coming into town. he planned his own grand ceremony is a concrete hero with the troops. he went up to the fort. they kind of baited the trap. and when jackson marched his troops up to the fort he realized he had been taken. this is not fort that was

designed. but jackson said it was dilapidated. it was falling down. he found the collection that would cause the man to die within a few weeks. jackson realized he had been taken. and rather than the concrete hero jackson found himself in a very vulnerable position. he controlled food, ammunition, medicine, and a general about any of those. they began the back and forth. tried to convince the other that they were trying to do that. he needs jackson's soldiers. wilkinson puts jackson in this position where the men start to get sick. the men start to die. and finally, jackson has to beg wilkinson for even medicine.

and he gets a letter from general wilkinson. this is finally his orders to march to pensacola. and when he opens it. they have bragged that it would come as a thunderclap out of a clear blue sky and strike jackson and it did. what was inside it was this order supposedly from the secretary of war telling jackson that he was dismissed. his services were no longer mediate -- needed. in turn over every piece of equipment to his rival. even the tents covering the men. even the imposition -- ammunition. everything was to go and jackson was there with 450 miles from home jackson

had promised these boys he would be a father to them. he would take care of them. one of his biographers wrote. many look and saw these voice. with tears in their eyes and reminded them that he promised to be a father than him -- with him. so indra jackson had to make a decision. did he disobey this order from the president and face the consequences were the abandoned the 2000 soldiers there in the field. when he described some of the discussion that went on. if they disobey the order it would be considered high-handed mutiny. one option was a firing squad. the other option was that a lot of these port tennessee boys would die if you banded them. and that was a choice indra jackson had to make. i think it showed -- shook him to the core. i think it changed him. it appeared the indra jackson had been thoroughly defeated.

there is a great story in mark's book. when jackson was a young boy one of the boys he wrestled him. said i can throw him three times at a four but he wouldn't stay throat he never would give up. he started to devise a plan to march his soldiers back to tennessee. he was going to violate this order from the secretary of war. and jackson agreed to do that. the soldiers try to talk him out of it. it's very easy for you to head money to get back to say that you can take care of yourselves by following this order a look at the poor boys. a lot of them shut up but nothing other with nothing other than the clothes on their back. a lot of them will die and i'm not can leave even one soldier here to be controlled by wilkinson. a couple weeks later. he began marching the soldiers back up.

he assumed the governor of tennessee would come to his rescue because they were tennessee soldiers. halfway up the trace. with 450 miles up. he have no authority to supply jackson with any funds or equipment. and jackson was at that astounded. they heard about their plate. they began to come south with food and wagons to rescue their sons but think about what that meant for indra jackson. here was the concrete hero who is having to rely upon charity. not just the merchants. they had witnessed the grand parade. agreed to give those soldiers there. when he came back to nashville they have a dismissal -- dismissal ceremony. it was a pleasant little

ceremonial and you can imagine indra jackson standing there it was said that before he left nashville the country was not enough for wilkinson in jackson. they reported the story that wilkinson had just taken mobile. that was the mission that he wanted. it seemed to be a humiliating defeat. the book talks about the american industry -- indian history as well. jackson on the way back. in one of those leaders told the story that he was not born as a moral man. it split apart. in the full-grown warrior popped out. i think on march 14, 1813 when andrew jackson got this

letter. it was just like that thunderclap. from james wilkinson. and it split apart the old indra jackson. the one who pretty much lived for himself. and a new indra jackson was born. and out popped old hickory full-grown warrior. for the first time in his life he made a decision i think to live and not just for himself and his friends but for people who have nothing. people who have been abused by the government. in this idea of democracy began to flourish. i think that's when indra jackson became old hickory and ironically when he made his decision to march back as march 15, 1813 he was -- it was his 45th birthday. it is one of the ironies of history as part of the story that andrew jackson became old hickory with the help of the indians.

[applause]. >> we had two with two great books here to very knowledgeable authors in a few minutes for questions. so, does anyone want to ask something perhaps mark can grace us with another song or would everyone ask about. zero, a shy group. can you please use the microphone there. thank you. you pointed out that the indians were very helpful for jackson why did he turn against the indians so much later on. that is one of the things in the great mysteries those who

defend jackson's decision say that he realized that the u.s. government did not have the power to protect the indians from the squatters. it would take a chinese wall to protect the indians from the settlers. i did not appreciate the effect of settlers coming in and squatting on land and take it until i studied meriwether lewis and the problems that he face in st. louis. the u.s. army was a very small unit. white spotters and settlers would in settlers would go into indian land. and for a time the american army would come in and burn their houses. they weren't supposed to be there. there on the tennessee river there was a fort hampton. and that was built not to protect the white men from the indians but the indians from

the white men. so it is said that jackson decided that he have to move the indians in order to protect them. i don't necessarily understand why he was not a greater friend to the indians. it seems to me like i said injured jackson never gave up. he was a fighter. if anybody could've stood up for the indians it was indra jackson. but it is interesting to know and we have a different perspective in our time now that there were american indians and those who named their sons injure jackson i've been told that was the case after removal. why would american indian leaders named their son indra jackson. if they perceive them as someone who hated them. i don't know the answer to that question. see. >> are there other questions. this is for mark. and i'm not can i can ask you

to sing. we talk about today about campaigns being rather brutal lies, misstatements, whatever. can you talk a little bit. >> that's not a new invention today. it certainly was true in 1824 to 28. thirty-two, could you talk a little bit about that? >> the presidential election which pitted injure jackson against john quincy in the was one of the dirtiest campaigns we have ever had. the men talked a lot about jackson's violent temper. a lot about his marriage to rachel in the questionable circumstances surrounding that. there was one, editor in cincinnati who spread the rumor that jackson's mother have been a prostitute who had

interrelational relationships with jackson. and jackson was the product of one of those relationships. there were other newspapers that talked about jackson trying to put together a southern army sort of echoing the rhetoric they were to take an army up to washington. it's a pretty scurrilous campaign. what was really interesting in 28 they tried to do the same thing to adams but adams was so boring that they can really come up with anything. the legitimate argument that can be made. they criticize adams for using taxpayers money to buy they

were gambling devices. the most scandalous thing that they could come up with is that adams when he had been in a ministerial position. have been a pimp for the russian czar. he is a guy that gets up first thing in the morning and reads the bible for a while. he is just kind of a boring guy. they don't really get a lot of traction. but they humor home the way that they are democratic. that seems to carry the day in 1828 as far as the campaign rhetoric.

we talk about the differences between harrison and van buren. van buren is just a dragged through the mud. he's presented as someone that has literally gotten fact off of the back of americans. he grows in size. he is president. that is just a sign of him thinking he is above everybody else. all of these attacks foisted on him by the whigs. these attack ads and campaigns there on a different level because of social media and things. it's how do we depict the opposition candidate and that most negative terms possible and if we have to lie to do that. then so be it. that just gets us more votes.

>> i have a question for tony. they play a central role in their book. i assume it wasn't a two lane and four-lane highway. can you explain this. it was a wagon highway. at that time our nation did have a bunch of votes. the federal government decided to build this road. it is really how i got started writing a book. i wanted to tell a story of this road. that thomas jefferson devote developed.

they built it wide enough for two carriages to pass. and when they approached a stream. even then when it rained it was a muddy mess. a lot of people just chose not to travel at all on it. during the time that jackson was on the road with the soldiers. wagon wheels are constant getting stuck in the mud. in the newspaper in nashville said if they could've only waited another couple of months the roads would have firmed up. and travel would've been much easier. we are still driving on much of that today. one of the oldest roads in north america. thank you.

is there any other questions? if not i think we will end the session. thank you very much. their books are on sale. of the war memorial plaza. very soon. thank you for coming. i hope you enjoyed today's session. [applause]. you're watching book tv on c-span two. for complete television schedule visit book tv.org. you can also follow along behind the scenes on social