welcome to the bookstore and maplewood new jersey. thank you for helping join us for the tenth anniversary celebration.

we opened ten years ago not coincidentally on president obama's first inauguration date. thanks to all of your support and glad my wife is here to join us in the bookstore was her brainchild and we are experiencing double-digit growth since we've opened to the people of maplewood. first is to provide vocational and employment opportunities for young people with autism and we've had over 100 people with autism working in the stores we opened. [applause] we have two children here today. it's been a great success and

the second mission is to be hoped for the community, and we have a little over 100 authors appear every year so we are excited let's give a warm welcome. [applause] joe has over 30 years of experience in journalism. he's worked on papers all over the country and covered many events at the bookstores. i'm going to be turning the event over two teen kelly has appeared here several times. a pulitzer prize-winning journalist at "the new york times" had been a book called almost home tina is going to be interviewing joe today.

after they speak we will have a question and answer period, and i hope that we are fortunate enough to be covered statewide tv on c-span so if you can't wait until i pass the microphone around for questions, that would be great. going to turn the program over now. thank you very much. joe and i have been trying and competitors in the local news seem. we both ran a local blog and they wanted to find out from you what other aspects of your

career went into your decision to write this book? >> thank you everyone for coming they are few and far between but flawed view many of you know my background ipod earth -- it ran from 2009 to 2018 i'm sorry, 2017. they've been supported to a great website and their editor fred smith is here so i thank him and he might be right for him for about a year and we broke several stories in the school district which we won't get into.

my background quickly i grew up and went to brooklyn college the city university of new york and brooklyn college fan by first job was at the daily journal and actually i write in the book that is where i did my first donald trump story i might mention later that i was there for several years and then went to california and wrote several newspapers out there, none of "the new york times" size but that's where i also met my wife in the back. [applause] -started to freelance for a magazine that covers the newspaper business and trade magazine, and i covered many issues and i was hired in 1999 and worked for 11. they went under, i hope not due to be for the media watchdog

organization that covers conservative media that they've been branching out and it gave me a lot of the background for journalism and my whole approach was during the time i worked for those outlets and earlier stint i was finding i was always writing about job cuts for several years it was cut backs, fewer jobs a lot of things get covered that are covered easily. a lot of things are ignored. there's less legal protection for journalists, editors, news outlets.

they limited the funds over something that they had written about him. there's a lot of cases about that as we know. donald trump is on the cover. it's how they are destroying news and he's a big part of it. as i was writing the book, trump was doing more things that were attacking. i'm not writing politically about trump. my view is what he does in his

into this issues and approaches are but it's how he's attacking the press and started in a campaign saying we are the enemies of people pushing the audiences as you know to b be onscreen with them like something we've never seen before we had a saying that media matters you are entitled to your own opinion. that is what goes in. but it talks about other things i thought were important things like the cutbacks and legal defense and fear mongering and

there's always the health scare of the day. people got peas vaccinations and then you fast-forward to vaccine that were the culprit. if then people wouldn't know what to believe and what you get to ththe conservative press whie not all bad, i had no problem with the conservative or liberal views or moderate. i had have a problem with information that isn't factual. a lot of conservative news media outlets spreading lies or half-truths or information that is rumored so there's a lot of

elements to this. you can disagree with the policies, that's fine, but you can't really agree with alternative facts. if something is in the news it should be presented as such. this is one of the things we are fighting as journalists and consumers don't have to worry about. >> what in the reporting surprised you the most when you were doing the nuts and bolts sitting down with the internet and doing your reporting surprised you? >> what surprised me is how much i liked it. i'm always telling people i'm a reporter because i'm nosy, not the other way around and when i talk to students as many of you do first thing i would ask is do you like gossip and we don't gossip we find out the facts but if you like to find out what's

going on and tell other people, you are doing really well and if you can find a curiosity and anything i had one of my professors at brooklyn college, one of the classes which he would do if he would require you to interview and the thinking was if you can interview short order code and be interested in his or her life and present it in an interesting way you might have a future so they found a cook at a diner in brooklyn and interviewed him if i was interested. he was from nigeria and had come to the u.s. penniless. he felt in this job and worked to other jobs. my curiosity about things, i went to the book i was a little frightened and i just sort of started. i think the surprise is how much of the data and facts supported what i thought about job cuts and about it being real, the

belief in credibility people don't really trust the press and i am a news guy from way back. i value honesty and active press. i was surprised how many people don't like the press and how many people will believe things like what donald trump says or some other spokespeople say that tears down the industry, fake news come in any of the people, other things i mentioned before. that surprised me is how bad it was coming and baseless. there's a lot of reporting that goes on but there's a lot of good reporting and as i say in the book greed and laziness of corporate ownership by going to in the book and taking the t. stories. when you turn on the news, a lot of times you will be on the same story all day whether it is trump, a hurricane, some

shooting which is a big story that deserves attention to the exclusion of so much else. >> what surprised me was a figure i wasn't even aware was about to happen as a figure of the news outlets and i was talking to my husband about this like where's the antitrust laws and anti-monopoly. it was like 90% of news organizations. >> they are owned by six companies. it used to be 50 companies just 35 years ago. >> how did that hav happen? >> it's what is true in a lot of business. one of the unique things very few chain stores here and what of independent bookstores like this, this and and coffee places, other kinds of shops, restaurants. we don't have change down here

if at all and it's in all the businesses and media. there's also talk of the new company first media in talks to take over two of the largest newspaper companies and if they emerge it would be even larger. you are right the government allows it. there used to be a limiting the numbelimit on thenumber of newsd own in a certain market. you could own tv stations in the same architect. now i know news corporations on channel five in new york, channel nine, others have several stations owned by one company. they take over and i out and then you have six companies owning 90% of the news outlets and they are starting to side with goes on in them more and more. >> is there any legal remedy for that?

>> good question. antitrust injunctions and loss certificate files. the scary thing about it though is that there really is no stoppage and it's starting to trickle down to the local station. you probably remember last year at sinclair broadcasting which owns very conservative companies they own the most tv stations in the country. they put out a directive to his operation last year to read this very attacked statement basically warning their viewers not to trust other media. that is only one example that you can see more and orbit of this even the idea they might try to slant the news that is only one part of the story that they start tbutthey start to cos news operations and coverage where you have three, four, five reporters now you might have one

or two and there's a whole part of the book on state coverage. if you're used to be a whole lot more people from different outlets that it's just here in new jersey. they used to compete with the broken record which was independently owned. ..

. >> world the daily, info wars, a lot of the news outlets per you are right it is tough. it is a necessary evil. use the internet with a great tool it helped newspapers in many ways because we could compete with the immediacy of the television and the internet.

if you put it online it is right there so now it's back because anybody can do it. if you want to make a website it is news inaccurate a lot of people will believe you. you have to do some research. as a consumer you really have to be educated consumer do research on what you believe or what you follow. if it was just tv or radio or print it would not last that long because it wouldn't survive because now you don't even have to make money but you have to do research and i believe a politician and

classes in journalism where do you get your news a lot of them would say twitter. [laughter] are you following cnn or new source a or b or c or following your friends or another friend who read it on a site that is not credible? >> your solutions part of the believe that the way forward is through nonprofit news organizations is through nonprofit news organizations

talk about that way you don't pull love - - but a bullet to your head on chapter eight you go to chapter eight. [laughter] . >> not profit news has been in journalism for years. who knows the biggest news organization in the world? the associated press technically it is not nonprofit it is a cooperative. heat he used to run mcclatchy and talks about it as a news cooperative that it is not profit everything it makes goes back into the organization they rely on subscribers and services and everything they make goes back into it. gray photo history great news

history one of my favorite books they have been doing that for years and still do it very well. but we are talking about new organizations the last ten or 15 years the institute for nonprofit news website. they get money from foundations and donations private and public. pro public is one of the rock stars and this is the former managing editor of the "wall street journal" they get donations but they also share

with other news outlets. the "wall street journal" with the marshall project in california the investigative reporting of the lands in new orleans and this is the real answer. so one of the things we talk about the news outlets in the past were owned by families so

one of the things that happened so they merged and brought out each other and leveraged that is a bigger profit demand than eight or 10 percent. my view would be every news outlet should be nonprofit. and still have a good product. >> so this disdain people have towards journalist and then it

is petrifying. where does that come from? . >> so bring the bad news? is easy to blame the reporters doing a bit of history and as their disdain grew. nixon lost kennedy with the famous departure coming back

in 1968 and then the came up with these phony town halls the democrats and to make them look presidential with staged events then nixon went down there were a lot of supporters on the right among them was paul harvey a very influential respected news radio person. so when he was knocked out and

was knocked out by the reagan revolution they built up this conservative attack on the press and false claims against reporters. that they are all liberal. left-wing. although in their personal views they want to get the story out. if you want to slant the political action anyway and then two.2 reporters to push

people against them this is fake news the story is wrong that a lot of people would believe them like sean hannity would perpetuate and there are people who want to believe that is even stronger and stronger against the press. they are looking for someone to blame. . >> my first go was at the daily journal affectionately

known to say the donald trump fund. with this several bankruptcy with very bad financial statement. it was partly a joke but also part the four real. and then interview them to say i'm a fan. because it was mobbed with

reporters radio stations are calling nbc nightly news it was tom brokaw. . >> i did check in with them later which elizabeth is a working-class town. and so they try to give it to his office but they wouldn't take it.

this is pre- president trump before the tablet drum. i just want people to know fake news would to be unfair and liberal and to go get a paper it is not fake news in this much more serious. the problems of the news media are much more serious. we have cutbacks. with investigative news going on.

which i'm glad they are exposing drum. to put constant stories of trump hour after hour without the real problems that we have is a detriment. there is not a legal defense for reporters but obama was one of the more secretive when it came to the press now he didn't have to deal with fake news but they had their own attacks news outlets were

afraid to write stories because they could get sued. so self-criticism and a check on your work like the statehouse news and local news and then to value to keep us on the toes. and i won't talk about the school board. to say that it's not fake news

and to focus on what is true which dumbs down the coverage so this is a game within the industry and they still promote the best journalism. and for the real fake news and which is the credible new source so to say i was in

journalism school. so these young people that are in that position so then what? . >> so to teach media and journalism classes at rutgers last year and i just signed on to teach a private new york college in queens with the city university graduate and that's going to be a social justice class.

and then to drain the blood out of you. just this news junkie curious person you really have to find things out work hard and dig up the stories learn how to spell and as a critic of texting so you can create your own website.

other people coming out of journalism school that they have learned but that is hard to do now because they are so quick to attack so i am working on a book in my grandmother's family from south dakota but to be way anti- press. and we could not even defend.

do teachers really want to be teachers or a doctor just keep punching it. . >> so nonprofits where does the funding come from? most of the foundations so if you are getting money from the far left you will be tainted.

and you have to be learned who gives the money and if you go to the institute for nonprofit site pro public has one a couple and also a finalist. . >> and to survive that caliber of nonprofits is that funding secure?

and then just shut down was that funding secure? the funding is not forever. trooper go that's why we have to support them and to promote them. so what is the ultimate purpose of a democratic society now?

and those that our responsible for truth so now what word you say of the ultimate purpose? and to change the world so what we do can do that. or even ben bradley said journalism is the best obtainable version of the truth. news today is different than tomorrow.

but if you report that it is news. is that true? then you lied. you all saw that recent kerfuffle over the video of the students at the lincoln memorial the native american and gentlemen and that dispute then another video found there was another group involved and that change the story. buzz feed had a story about trumps attorney saying he was ordered to live by trump then the prosecutor's office disputed that. then we will find out the truth eventually so then with the boston bombing and the

original coverage of that allied of misstatements and inaccuracies. so it's supposed to get the news. i had one of the first editors at the daily journal to speak truth to power to put the news in the damn paper. [laughter] that he said what's new? so one of the guidelines to be important unusual or interesting. can one be interesting? if your neighbor is mowing the lawn is that interesting?

know but it is news. and then that is odd. that is the ever-changing question. with the different versions of the news you get that take. >> the way that i could access i am interested with the google news so what do you

think about that? and then to go to one source. but with google news they tell you but i believe i would trust in general to tell you the source that is the product with online versus print and you can see so many things that you would not see otherwise but online even if you go to "the new york times" home page and then that's it.

you could do a magazine and then you would see something you did not know you wanted to read. but the news is more open. but do you have any thoughts on how things have gotten worse or better and the problems described? . >> it is for a few news outlets it is a rush to get the story out. i interviewed ted koppel that

i asked what he thought the biggest problem was? and he said the rush to beat each other most don't care but why are we beating each other up to be first? that now everything is breaking news. . . . .

and then later turned out the video had been edited and fox news received the video in either happened checked it over chose to go with what was edited and the statement was quite the opposite and she was later i don't know if she was the hired but i know that it became an example of you had a right-wing outlets that was very discredited. this is before steve became breitbart and the video became something to report about fox news and ended up out of a job.

there's still people who still believe people hear something and they stick with what they believe. they don't want to hear something else. i think it woul but if it is gog away but these are some of the big ones. i'm wondering if you can go back to how your life changed when we went to 24/7 because there used to be a reset and you could

think again but now there is a standardization of language. my first few jobs you could do a story or two and have until 6:00 or 7:00. i never worked at an afternoon paper when there were they were timely and then about the effect on me if they didn't come until i was an editor and publisher of the weekly magazine that he slowly went online and slowly had to have online news and then they cut off our print edition to monthly so they went around

from 2004 they wanted us to die and we didn't we gained a lot from the web and like i said earlier having this reporting where if something breaks, you get it out to make the story. my favorite story that i broke was about a big newspaper change in detroit free press and the detroit news had been owned by a ninth grader in the gannett no one in the industry knew it and i have somewhat of help from having a little bit of a lack of

deadline because i was the only one on the story they had different sources telling me that the deal is going around and it was our industry that recovered and we gowecovered ant we had a source in denver which was owned by media news and still owns as first digital. he was telling me because he knew me from another story that the deal was taking place and it was like a double switch so both were being sold to new owners. one of the things i did, the new editor was going to be the editor of "the des moines register" which was then owned by mcclatchy. i knew paul and i called his home and he wasn't fair. i called his wife and asked where he was and she said he is

in detroit so then i called other sources in detroit the funny thing is the day before that i was at a conference in manhattan and one of them was dean singleton who owned media news and still does. i knew him over the years and one of my questions to anyone i covered and nancy adams knows this, what's the news. >> congratulations are in order. but this was before i knew.

the deal is going on right behind my back and the next day i enjoyed your history but it seemed there was another side to this because you talk about how people believe the various stories so the question is why. they thought this was the authority there used to be more limited outlets it is coming

from so many more angles and people used to be credulous to more limited sources and now they are credulous equally but then chosen sources, said the issue of credulous eddie, where does that come from and how can we engage with the backpacks spinnaker there are people who didn't believe cronkite and the early abc anchors, they all face said they were lying. was it the spirit of baghdad --

i agree there's a lot of things that get covered and a specialized news it covers just the environment or crying or health that's a good thing they don't think it changed as much as we always had our opponents and critics, but you're right i don'you are right idon't know wo believe when trump or rush limbaugh or somebody that believes that the media is doing. i was surprised i covered a lot of him when he was running for president. one of the things i noted the book in the introduction about when i went to the values voter conference that is a far right-wing hate group i call them the law center probably caused him to hate group, family research council he and i went

to the events to get them to comment and he was not a fight with fox then and i think it was after the meghan kelly debate comments that he made where he got into a dispute with her in the a lot of people were criticizing his comments. we were asking will fox have you back up and he actually made some news for us but this was always surprising to me because we would write and others would write whether you like his policies or not if you are conservative or liberal, i want a politician or candidate to be accurate if you look at one of

the fact checking sites i would urge you to go to the site but check rumors on the internet. he would cite facts that are not true then he looked into the history as a businessman and we all know about trump university as the tip of the iceberg. he is very open histories he wrote a great biography that were very open and verified i'm still amazed how much people will listen to his lies and accept them but they are so supportive as a celebrity candidate or some people just don't want to admit they are

wrong. i have a family member i won't say who e-mailed me the other day about trump euphoria had ended. trump was also very effective turning people against the press what is your take on his ownership? >> it put a lot of money into it i haven't covered the post day today but the words used to be

giving them what they need and not telling them what to do and i've known him since he was editor of the miami herald we used to give an editor of the year award every year but the first one and then he went from there to the "boston globe" where he led the spotlight team in their great uncovering of the church that became the spotlig spotlight. i'm still very proud of the work they did. when he became editor of the year of course i was forced to go to miami into a story it was a tough job but somebody had to do it they have the same revenue

issues as everyone else. he may need more money for that but i would give great credit for what they are doing. while we've been sitting here the president says fake news and bad journalism cause a big downturn and sadly many others will follow. do you think it's appropriate to be cheering on job losses like that? >> i don't think it's appropriate to cheer against the press especially with what is probably false information. others would ask them why are you choosing job loss but it's a loss of jobs he probably doesn't -- >> do you think part of what's also going on when you say you don't know why people are so

credulous is that we blurred the distinction between entertainment and news, but people don't actually know what news is that cnn doesn't do itself any favors by making any stage talking heads but if someone from here and there they are creating entertainment and so the distinction is worded in people's minds. if we can follow when we see it necessarily. >> there's a lot of thought and there's a lot of opinion. i was an intern in 1980 -- [laughter] go 1988 my senior year in college and you will probably remember cnn was the constant news report, not the most exciting thing on the air but it was news and larry king live which i miss terribly because he was a great interview he word fr the kind of stories he focused

on. now it's not only more entertaining sort of opinion in the evening hours msnbc, fox. they are creeping into more opinion. some journalists, not all he's such a terrible precedent that they have a right to go beyond what is acceptable to give their opinion too much and then there is of course the news outlets that just put the panels up and let them argue.

that's where people can say things in an argument that turns out not to be true or slightly inaccurate but yes that is a form of entertainment and don't get me started on reality tv. a lot of magazines have gone that way. priam and tabloid in the scandal. they brought monaco since h mona recently and we don't need to see these people. [laughter] speech [inaudible] [applause]

[applause]

what you really need to go and here we go, write them down. foundation, public opinion, participation, political parties, interest groups, campaigns congress president." the entire test covers those ten topics our students struggle with this. it's a concept with the idea if you are trying to get a big bill passed, a lot of times it helps a quid pro quo for this or not

sometimes earmarks and if you add that you'll get more supportive votes.