next a hearing on domestic extremist groups and efforts to counter their activity on social media. the house homeland subcommittee on intelligence and counterterrorism heard from former law enforcement officials and experts on american extremist movements including the cofounder of the global project against hate and extremism. >> joining today for the hearing entitled acceleration is and militia extremists. we will look at a range of actors and organizations from the militia separationists

including the seeking to accelerate the society. this is something happening on the left, the right, anywhere on the political spectrum with violence, pending society, threatening institutions and we've got to look at it and that is what we are doing today. so, it is incredibly irrelevant to think which groups we look at so long looking at the principles of fresh in people's lives. some of these movements stem from ideology that are decades old and others are relatively new. some range from decentralized to more structured militia groups. it's one of the common threads we often see a overlap with

bringing these into common cause of with others who are extremist in nature. they have a collective opportunity to discuss the current threat landscape so we can develop an understanding of how they flourish in the communities and mind space. we have seen horrific acts of violence. a man in texas was arrested after straining a facebook live searching for a law enforcement officer to ambush and children and men in california shot and killed the department of homeland security federal protective service officer and wounded one more. and then went on to kill a santa cruz deputy sheriff officer before being arrested. she wrote the word do in blood. three were arrested anticlockwise matter protest in

las vegas. two men in oklahoma were arrested found in possession of illegally modifieds machine gu, all connected to the movement. the list goes on and on and on. so, it is important today that we recite the way that it's interested other populist extremist groups. there are two groups we've looked at particularly during our discussion. we will be asking some really critical questions today. principally it's what the hell do we do about this. what we do, what is the federal government do, what can and should social media to do, what dodo we do in a collaborative wy mandatory way. we have a shared responsibility across the public and private

sectors. the lives of law enforcement officials are on the line in so many of these instances. the lives of innocent citizens who are congregating in protests are on the line. and i do believe in so many ways the future of the country into the constitution is on the line. with that, the chair recognizes the ranking member of the subcommittee the gentleman from north carolina, mr. walker. >> you are on mute, my friend. >> thank you, mr. chairman terry there's no doubt that across the globe is a there is an uptick in extremist ideology particularly linked to the supremacy and the committee created after 9/11 we must stay focused on the jihadi threat. and these movements they see the adoption of acceleration is rhetoric that calls to target government institutions and law enforcement to commit acts of violence as a means of creating further unrest. we see this concept in my

discipline is the movement from antigovernment groups and some environmental organizations. avthis convergence of the violet ideology results in the sharing of tactics and propaganda in the spreading of misinformation and conspiracies as the hostess of celebration of violence. i should start by expressing my condolences to the families of david underwood of the dhs protected security officers and a santa cruz deputy chairman just mentioned. they were murdered in the line of duty. i also want to express support and hope for the speedy recovery of those injured in the attacks. the suspect believed to be responsible has been arrested and in the fbi they are conducting a full investigation including into the possible support for the movement which is an acceleration is turned. we also must review others as the chairman just mentioned, iai appreciate dean's attacks are on all americans.

i know that seems to be these days kind of a conservative talking point, but it's not. the damage that they were doing. a reporter was in my office and you can still see the injuries. has been a consistent effort to implement protests. in portland they cited that it's cost the city tens of millions of dollars. these are the kind of things we must stand together regardless of the politics. we need to move forward. the reality is that it's not an organization. we understand that that is an ideology into the people involved if the continued violence around the city they are part of these movements. we can agree that all of these movements and any other

extremist movement must be condemned and i think that is why the hearing is crucial today. on all sides they are attempting to hijack the protests and interrupt debate on the institutional reforms. some are targeting protesters, some are attacking police officers and many are vandalizing buildings in seeking to create the so-called autonomous zones. we need an effort to condemn the violence and restore order. i want to thank the witnesses were appearing in a record to to the testimony and yield back my time with. >> i think the ranking member. members are reminded they will operate in accordance with the guidelines of. the chair recognizes the chairman of the full committee for an opening statement.

the chair now recognizes the ranking member of the full committee mr. rogers for an opening statement. >> there's chairman thompson. if you like they will now recognize you for a statement. >> thank you very much, chairman. thank you for convening this timely hearing today and for your leadership. this committee is known for following the threats wherever they may lead. today that brings us here. this is an opportunity to examine the emerging threat from violent antigovernment extremists. today's hearing is the first congressional hearing that

focuses specifically on the emerging threat and i applaud the chairman for examining this issue. it is important that members and the american public hear from these experts today and understand those emerging threats. recent attacks showcase the individuals affiliated in the movement. this collection of extremists present in immediat and immediao law enforcement and the american people. as our experts will share in their written testimony, this movement is complex and requires a nuanced understanding. it appears to be antigovernment, constantly changing. the common thread is designed to accelerate society towards a second more and that means many

of them are driven to commit violence. it is imperative that the department of homeland security and other federal agencies immediately devote resources towards understanding these threats. understand that this is aul difficult issue, but it's not acceptable for dhs to remain in the dark. law enforcement officials remain a top target of these individuals and extremists, whichh means that it's even more urgent for dhs to produce and disseminate information to state and local law enforcement so they can stay ahead of the threat. federal resources must be appropriately allocated. we need to follow the thread. we shouldn't be persuaded by the political winds. it goes without saying property damage in any and all violence linked should be condemned by bt public reporting and arrest records, the governments own reporting all indicate the

right-wing extremists pose a moreic urgent threat to america. we are hearing today from those experts about the threats facing americans. i look forward to the discussion on how the violence that has utilized for many platforms to their advantage. this has been a major concern of mine over the last congress and one of the reasons i introduced the national commission on online platforms and homeland security act the commission would seek to understand the factors including extremists that support online platforms and the furthering of violence. the bipartisan separation was of the committee in october 2019 and awaits action from colleagues in the commerce committee. the committee will continue to shed light on how social media

platforms are exploited and also hold accountable when they fail to enforce the policies they set forth to combat extremists. i'm pleased the witnesses have joined us today and again i thank the chairman for convening this hearing and i will yield back. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i now welcomed the panel of extraordinary witnesses. the first witness is jj mcnabb at the george washington university. he's one of the foremost experts on antigovernment extremism and militia groups in the whole country. the second with his his cofounder and executive vice president oexecutive vicepresidt against hate and extremism. more than two decades of experience studying and fighting extremism including ridding the southern poverty law center intelligence product. the third and final with mrs. jack donahue a fellow at the miller center for protection and resiliency of the universi

university. the former chief of strategic initiatives at the new york city police department with experience with his time at the nypd. thank you for your extraordinary service to new york city with the men in blue, the greatest place to protect not only in the history of the country but i believe in the p history of the world thank you for your extraordinary service to the country. >> thank you. >> without objectionable statements will be inserted into the record and i now ask each to summarize his or her statement for five minutes beginning with mr. mcnabb. >> thank you. chairman, ranking member and distinguished members of the subcommittee, thank you for giving me the opportunity to testify today. i'm a research fellow at george onhington university program extremism with remarks and opinions i'm going to fix this on my own. i'm here to talk about the militant substantive antigovernment t extremist movement. people who want to change or topple the country by force.

like any large movement,an the group goes through cycles and in the months following the 2016 election, the supremacy groups experienced a meteoric rise and militant extremists joined and were relatively quiet. in general, they are antigovernment for a time. however, the renewed conversations about the control and stress from the pandemic, the mainstream of the state and anti-vaccine conspiracy theories, high unemployment rates, civil unrest in major u.s. cities and the extreme divisiveness plaguing the upcoming election have triggered a recent rebirth in the militant groups.ve the movement for example the membership includes police officers from activevepe duty military and not a veterans shifted from armed standoff with federal agents to providing arms

support to small businesses violating stay-at-home pandemic organizing armedov guards to protect from leftist violence.ar the 3% organization is a hybrid between a private paramilitary militia network and club. the group believes the use 3% to band together to overthrow the current government in each subgroup is independent on the other. there is no central leadership structure so despite the large numbers, it's kept them from becomingth significant force. the pair on the terri militia were a much smaller segment of thee movement. the groups engage in training and have you with organized structure in each chapter and even though many states prohibit their activities, they offer it with impunity. the segment as people mentioned is the boogaloo movement. the revolution where armed patriot rise up and overthrow

its radical government as in the extremists for decades. the look went viral. the tribal aesthetics that separated those from those who were not. most boogaloo members are anarchists even the major players with a major red flag for example this includes red

floodwalls or any legislation viewed as a foot in the door. another potential issue is the pandemic that is placing significant stress on the groups groups. the states return to lockdown status and determined individuals and small groups will lash out violently against the government, law enforcement, medical professionals, essential workers, contact tracers and medical infrastructure. ..

for revolution. these groups know they need a catalyst, a big event. they need a ruby ridge or waco so they can be the next mcveigh. most are waiting for the big event but there are some that

will do what they have to to force this occurrence. thank you for your time. chairman rose: thank you for your testimony. >>

. >> and how on social media to have those revolutionary ideas often disguised as inside jokes or codewords the codeword for the second revolution in protest that played the semi automatic rifles and then to encourage violence in the video gaming committee they by no means are alonen and that shows online the social media spaces with a

have seen exponential growth of the most. in america these messages have broken into the mainstream media advocating the murder of law enforcement and with those peaceful protesters as a subterfuge that are now being widely circulated on i social media. regardless of ideology with law enforcement was civil unrest there has always been the inherent tension between law enforcement and policing protest they are the most visible representatives and

then to protest against us that is a constitutionale righ. we are sworn regardless of the content of the speech and whatever controversy or how seem thesial it may constitutional right is to bear arms some permit open care we lawfully while others outlawed the practice both have scrutiny with some exceptions. in real life with tens of thousands with the point of constitutional law doesn't work that's why they are at a disadvantage specifically challenge when they become the target of the protest as more recently observed on the right hand on thehe left on enforcement needs information that smart government and

preventing overreach what law enforcement needs want an exception with cryptic communication into those channels that's where the tactics and opportunities are shared and for occupation carrying semi automatic weapons that grows exponentially. and with any social media companies they must remain vigilant but the timeframe may

be remarkably short. as a last line of defense because they become the ultimate target with the online movements are notwl predictable. and then to preserve civil society y. thank you for having us here. >>no thank you for your testimony and we now recognize you for your statement. >> ranking member of the subcommittee thank you very much for inviting me to testify today. it's a great honor i'm the cofounder of the new establish global project have been researching more than 20 years this is of the utmost importance with the global and increasingly violent movement

with neo-nazi movement they are all interested to bring about the collapse of democracy to terrorist violence. the accelerators or extremist recruiting and growing in a way that was never before possible primarily at the feet of the tech companies that adequately the content on their platforms the fbi considers risk of violence from white supremacist as those of former terrorist like isys. dhs the state department government agencies and independent experts all agree that is a metastasizing problem will be dealing with in the long-term the tragedies in pittsburgh and christchurch are testaments inspired by the movements a broad right now

taking advantage of the pandemic to spread hate for those they wrongly blame over covid-19 with protesters and police officers and then to intensify the approach of the election. descriptions laid out in detail in my written testimony so like the opportunity to offerre recommendations if we don't accept them. online platforms are driving extremism but with the new technology and extremist today do the same. starting in 2015 the perpetrators almost entirely online rather than the real world that is all forms of extremism right and left and

islamic an online platforms where plans are hatched drying in recruits event planning and inside jokes but that is how they treat content and as the accepted strategy push by our government and practice by the ppet companies and with the social media platforms allow the propaganda to be monetized but that's what happens with white supremacy not until 2017 after the charlottesville riots they took a seriously to ramp up enforcement. there hasn't been enough. now with the anti- muslim sentiment my newvi organization dozens of youtube videos posted by the white international network was

monetized with ad revenue from businesses and political campaign ads. even after notifying youtube it stayed up if we stopped those online platforms must decide policies and we must enforce them. those to help establish baseline of the extremist content to push platforms to be better those like proposed by the civil rights coalition that i cofounded we also need to address extremism in the military is way too many veterans in the movement we cannot unleash them on the public when it comes to law enforcement priorities to help

us understand how officials would prioritize these movements in the extremism directs dhs to disseminate those threat assessments. i would suggest we be very carefull before understanding what the impact might be too often they were not used as promised but then to violate civil rights sensible gun control measures could be useful here. win closing thank you for taking these issues seriously and having mera here today. thank you. >> thank you to all the witnesses for their extraordinary testimony i now

recognize myself. moving away from all the noise with the threat from jihadist fundamentalism what is the worst-case scenario? >> clearly from my testimony i raise the comparisons the recruitment and that techniques of people of violence. what we have seen the motivation violence in any moment. and a concern that we have and to trigger the events that happened across the united states even before

christchurch show the power of what is happening and they are so virulent that they make sense to certain people and that is c where we need to have the ability to have visibility in those networks. >> my biggest concern is twofold which is the incendiary situation of the protest to be heavily armed and easily triggered we've already seeing shots against protesters that we saw in las vegas. but what we saw in el paso and pittsburgh and as an international problem is what i'm most concerned about and

then to bring down the systems and government multicultural democracies to stop the white genocide that has stopped most of the attacks and that motivation will go away because demographics are shifting. if we don't intercept how the propaganda is spread i'm just afraid the next christchurch can be anywhere here or abroad. >> we are facing an uphill battle with social media platforms with the propaganda recruiting members of from that point on they move into private groups and then they

cherry pick trying to police this i think would be impossible with the bigger propaganda.to there is a large group to come together and with the earlier testimony. and possibly infrastructure. in las vegas the plot was to take down the grid. the power grid during a protest and then mass casualty is an issue. is not large-scale.

and then to learn from las vegas shooter a pie shooting down into the crowd. >> in my experience you are uniquely qualified to talk about law enforcement as violent extremist groups can you say why this is the case and the impact on law enforcement and how it impacts law enforcement and their families? >> thank you very much ranking member. in addition to what i w said in my prepared remarks and

testimony the impact on law is great and to indicate the true intention to attack the most visible arm of government and that impact on law enforcement over the last month and a half has been dramatic and there is always a concern both from how can they continue to respond or repeating the attacks on law enforcement whether just the physical with police officers and sheriffs around the country.

and then to the negative media attention is played on that. to be the most visible representatives of government we always look to be an arm of whoever is being protested against. a looking at violence and destruction with the militia extremists. >> and i want to tip my hand before the research isrc complete there has been the exponential growth and the far

leftin and anarchist social media participation. >> and from gun legislation and then not to reelect president trump you were concerned different levels of civil unres unrest? is that something you see from your research? >> that's gun control and the reelection of president trump it has been a hot issue for it is one of the factors that push them to movee forward it

is a hot button one of the things that will bring them all together so at the beginning of the other gun rally to protest with those rallies of 22000 and those that are not violent or extremist. and never in the antigovernment extremist world this will happen so trump is the second issue a lot of them are pleased with trump and they support him.

to talk about civil war now for years. >> how can we show support for law enforcement with the additional training tools and authorities? >> first of all she wouldn't want - - we should understand the movements of the militias after years of targeting law enforcement. that has to be understood. and that's the first level of attack. cops are in a precarious position.

and with the racial justice protest. and with the law enforcement and threats and those that call for domestic terrorism statute. and then to allow law enforcement other tools and they do right now to combat the threat. and that's why in the written testimony i talk about the need for study.

>> and thank you for your extra ordinary leadership. so one of the challenges we have been working with to enhance that responsibility and with the civil rights and civil liberties. and with the extremist to care for the message and to talk to

each witness and to what extent do we hold those companies responsible for the content on those platforms? >> thank you very much for the question the enhance responsibility for social media companies obviously my prepared testimony speak of the value the power of the social media platform as an opportunity to share ideas. and the speech that is shared on a number social media platforms goes to provoke the assaults we see with law

enforcement and jeopardize others not involved in the protest. the extenti to which social media companies monitor that speech and to ask their social media community itself to disarm the platform has gone somewhat in the rightt direction however it is whack a mole. for that extremist speech and the videos you are shown altering the content of what other people are saying and amplifying negative messages that is a complication. part of that is empowering the communities on the platforms themselves in coordination with the companies to police them internally on - -

eternally is not a question of police can do that. that's not possible. as the people that are using it it has to fall on them as well as the company. >> i should've mentioned in my oral testimony for a commission to look into this. i apologize the process is gone on for too's long civil rights organization screamingsc and yelling criticizing in public with the incremental moves when it comes to white supremacy. i believe it will take a lot thmore than that. and facebook can submit itself to a civil-rights audit and still finds it has major problems, then this strategy

suggests that congress call the tech companies to account for their terms of service and how they enforce them. because at this point they claim not to monetize hate acontent and yet we keep finding it that they would be dozens of neo-nazi bands on recently. i would suggest congress uses investigative powers to hold them to account asked about their procedures and raisehe the bar modeled on what the european union has looking at hate content and the european commission to push the tech companies to do better. one last note of caution should be the civil rights organizations that are small

and underfunded to play this role. it's asking too much. >> i second that. one problem is thehe organizations chase the news and then facebook comes in and does a purge but to know what's going on in private groups d and even the public pages i spent time developing hard contacts to get into the private groups but the cause they don't reimported facebook letsey it fester i use them as an example there are other groups but the first place i

would go is to see who claims credit for laughing about it. or we could be better. i will go to facebook first and foremost. really it isn't a movement it's a way of talking its jargon the people who belong to it come from other extremist views may be militia. so you pick it up somewhere and yet you are treated as a separate movement. will have 551,000 followers. i've had death threats on facebook that were explicit i report them and nothing happens.

must there is a lot of attention i paid, they don't have incentive to do anything at all. it's not really up to civil rightsts groups or the news so there has to be some x terminal group. w>> and chandler has taken the leadership and it's a real concern on my part. because as long as i'm making many it's hard to pull back. if you remember we asked a simple question where they are devoted to managing content. it's believed like i can't believe you asked d the questio.

if you are serious about it and then you speak with your resources. with the young in private business. and then to monetize hate and with free speech thank you very much gracing us with your time. i yield back. >> you are now recognized from michigan. >> thank you for having this hearing. i am from flint michigan and

incidents with hate groups have been on the rise and very recently from the coronavirus lockdown we have had significant repeated protest in lansingng michigan protesting the lockdown but also in e response to the killing of george floyd. and a fourfold increase in the state of michigan right when the lockdown started there are

27 so i am wondering if chief donahue you can speak to the group and putting on signs on top of their cars and then there is asc discussion whether they are hate groups but can you talk about what you know about them? >> i do not know them specifically i have to defer but maybe my panelist do we added that to the organization and with that anti- muslim thinking. but in some ways it was a forerunner that is that they

are showing up places the canadian military but i will say that the problem right now and i think there have been seven and then it can. >> that very specifically a mart protest it was in response to the george floyd and those who

showed up at the protest we didn't have any evidence but and then what we think our folks on the ground. >> sure. and they are siding with the protesters with the george floyd protest in a bizarre world you can have to shooting at each other so just to see hawaii you cannot be judge and what they want to but then

with the rise of incidents of hate in michigan generally and in my district that we see these groups talk online then there is graffiti and nonviolent incidents and then they climbed up the ladder. >> certainly in my testimony how people areit recruited online and the viral nature of means that people online are creating and sharing. but then when people modify and shift their dialogue from what may s have been an inside joke or funny and then show things that are more violent and then talk specific instances more recently where police are involved but then

that turned into something that shows even more violence. the term itself means all cops are pastors so you can see how the technology and visuals go to amplify a message of violence. >> to do a second round of questioning. >> thank you so much mr. chairman.

suffering from being at the epicenter thank you so very much. the opposition to the vietnam war. i'm interested in asking that witnesses. the ultimate results of not dealing with the's fringe groups who can characterize important protest. from their belief in this country and democracy. what is a fight of the nation and when i say directly and

those that has been known to do this in the history of the united states. >> and we all believe in the constitutional the ability to protest but this petitions the government and then to say what we see is violence dad is coming out the peaceful protests to be usurped where

people petition the government for the right types of change and for those purposes you can't have a find discussion to have that compatibility reserve at protest that is lacking when they show up with guns and intent on occupation to have change in government where appropriate as opposed to violent revolution that's where police become in the headlines. we need to learn from our past. and move beyond that.

>> if we don't do something to address the spread of this material online and the rise of the movements what we are facing more terrorist attacks like we saw at the walmart for probably in other countries because it is flourishing abide - - a broad in and see a rise in hate crimes like in the pandemic and then the numberer of attacks we will see more terrorist taking

advantage whether that is directly targeting protesters like the neo-nazis who claim they will use people infected with covid to infect others. it's scary there is a huge amount of people unfortunately who do not accept multicultural democracies don't like that changing demographics. >> mr. donohue? >> m.

>> my biggest fear is there will be acts of terrorism. it makes people afraid to go to the streets to protest and it's terrible for our system democracy. i'm afraid were coming up on the street war. too many held with people by b different views with a lot of paranoia as a defensive mechanism. you never know who is who until the shooting starts i'm terrified they will be a shoot and that will play a damper on future protest. that is a dreadful situation it's very difficult to stop them from speaking but there is no counter voice.

we should be ready to see if the memo was leaked before we know that governments you want to groups. i would like to see public papers put out and as they come out looking for information should be public information. >> mr. chairman and one quick question this is important information. what i guy is domestic intelligence to protect our citizens. we have seen homeowners stand in front of their homes.

>> obviously, these people's views who i find repugnant have first amendment rights. but i do think that congress has oversight responsibility to find out what the heck is going on in the social media world on this front. companies are allowed to write their own terms of service it seems to me our government has a right to find out if they are enforced or how they are enacted because you don't live in the same worldhe if somebody it so that's where it will

start and. [inaudible] >> thank you very much mr. chairman ranking member and members of the full committee i yield back. thank you for this very important hearing. so now we recognize mr. walker for second round of questions and then to have some quick responses each of you can highlight the extremist content on social media. so to call for the creation can you further explain the

haauthorities and they should have to have certain social media post. and no pun intended. to monitor and review. it would be abused unfortunately where we should be look at this as a violent trend. police have a little bit of the blind spot and they need to be looking at t right wing. >> can you unpack that for me a little bit more?

>> from portland or seattle. with left-wing and right-wing protesters. and they are facing left-wing that that is what will harm them. and with those were 3 percent tattoo. these are extremist groups police need to be aware unfortunately that's not really coming through. there needs to be a counter voice coming out of homeland security or fbi that explains

that police have the ability to discern the right ween protesters from right we extremist. >>. >> i spend the better part of 20 years with a republican administration and the democratic administration trying to convince federal law enforcement that the threats tfrom right we extremist should not be abandoned after 9/11 people were horrifically concerned about al qaeda that is still important but working at right weighing extremism was dropped those that created intel it was shut down in the early years of the obaman administration. i think it would be very helpful to find out exactly what the federal government is doing and what authorities

they have. >> i said tracking extremist comment. do you have anything to speak of that? >> and in the 19 sixties and the focus has to be there. it could change tomorrow but right now that's a problem that needs to be done in the online space. >> nobody has a monopoly on violence there are authorities that exist within the federal government with the guidelines

the fbi intelligence operations guide and we're under federal court monitor ship for the intelligence gathering we engaged in the past i've been the intelligence officer and understand the importance to prevent injury and death. but as we have seen in a more recent protest molotov cocktails thrown at police officers and to be beaten over the head sustained serious injuries. in fact if you look at the events in california to

federal agents and sheriff's deputies is incredibly painful for law enforcement to see. with the training and then third on - - authorities. the trusted broker ship. >> specifically. >> and hiring new people and may be mr. chairman we can do an update on some of that work my time is expired and i

yelled back. >> something about me. absolutely it is clear extremism and with the law enforcement officials across the country. and then the constitutional and extremism is amplified and on steroids with social media. and then to do nothing to crackdown on what is happening across the spectrum with the rise of law enforcement officials putting them unnecessarily at risk.

>> the answer is yes whether long-term remains to be seen the groups can build without a a dampening effect and then engage in random acts of violence and then they burnn out but the long-term is unknown short-term we are looking at mass casualties who knows it could be protesters or cops or medical workers or anybody if there is chaos they will thrive they will do what they have to do to bring chaos to the situation. >> i agree if you do nothing then we will have exactly what

he described. >> it is very clear the tactics and rhetoric is being turned up. we are watching and need to acknowledge to preserve civil society. >> politicians often on - - often get lost with bipartisan support do not act as congress and then on social media if you have the courage to act the law abiding americans will die. so i sincerely hope to put

politics aside. something that signs into law democrats and republicans. so with that we will have another round of questions. >> to continue the line of questioning that we have, as a hat on - - high ranking police officer this level of escalatio escalation, you talked about on the internet and how itit goes from an inside joke. so can you talk about that as it hops off the internet to become harassment and violence?y and some examples there is a

road people travel before they perpetrate real violence. >> it probably defies a logical order. and to produce a report with the potential risk factors and onin the context the experiences of the us and uk and canada for people who are seeking to support violent extremism a broad. i don't want to say i'm a social scientist but these are examples that other experts

have weighed in on. but certainly among them in for people who desire action or adventure, those who have serious grievances and feel under threat that is part of that talk 622 contribute to radicalization and violence. people and parents andco community members and potentiallypo people to help support and motivation to

extremism and violence. and what happened to the tree of life synagogue in pittsburgh that rampage went to moments before entering going in to conduct those murders. screw the optics of going in. so left of action to right of action is very short.

public, not lack, not white, but all americans understand black lives matter. o as we go into the election, social media, lack of understanding, and lack of presence in the government,

accelerators, e can interfere with the election, for people rous going to vote, in order to catastrophic.ing what is your response to the mportance of the government, using resources, understanding, able to know where these accelerants are, as we this very difficult time and very important time in democracy. think that's a very important point you're making. he break from justice movements, black lives matter movement, is a particular target of these organizations. obviously, you know, if you're a don't caremacist you for rarely justice and these are people who you want to stop from xpressing their views and reforming american democracy in a positive direction. the government needs to be this. attention to the fusion centers, law enforcement investigative

gencies, and so on, need to be watching these movements very, very carefully. monitoring when they are getting into violence in the online space, working with academics movements to e keep on top of these trends and i feel strongly the government oversight tog some the online space to pressure the companies to be better on this front. this laim to be taking kind of material down yet it keeps popping up. those are all very important things and you're going to have on it in the months leading up to the election to 2018.ber, in four terrorist attacks in a month, including the tree of in just aogue attack, few weeks. and we could be facing something as we is coming up approach november. you.hank rightnabb, dr. beirich is in terms of actions of 2018, which allows certain candidates really take advantage of the divide that's going on, or

be going on in this country. the second amendment has been an instigator to divide people. the secondchallenged amendment, to my knowledge, in the united states congress since meaning, to amend the constitution. does guns what role have, and the provoking of the along with thet, potential hate speech, impacting the election going forward? my question again to you, how important it is for the resources and understanding to be played into a real response to gun safety laws that have promoted? ms. mcnabb? lost my logies but i connection for about the last five minutes. in. just logging back >> what role do guns play in the

elections, the provoking of the second meaning using the second amendment as an excuse against people who really want gun safety. of these issues provoking eaceful -- what we would want to be peaceful elections in 2020 ut accelerants would use these components to disrupt elections? hat i said before, there were terrorist acts during the 2018 election. bviously, skewing people to believe you needed a gun toting law and order, to win, as opposed to someone who wants nation together. what does that do in adding to accelerant's approach to peaceful demonstrations? >> bring power. power that an ordinary person have, and therwise some people are abusing that

power. hey are using guns to intimidate and in the worst case scenario they will use their guns to kill. it's not just guns. arrested los vegas brought an accelerant. they were planning on bombing people. car er recent arrest was a bomb. another one was a man who wanted to blow up a hospital with a car bomb. it's not just guns. it's just guns are visible and they are very intimidating. it's anything that's going to cause protestors to be afraid to go out. the presence of a large armed group. chairman, thank you very much for that. clearairman, i think it's that this hearing is vital to our actions that should be taken and, in particular, dealing with the actions by the government. idly by, they can't be leaning and giving one group over the ther, and particularly in

boogaloo, we want to of dealing unting with, particularly the jewish community, and i know that we're i look forward to moving on some of these issues particularly before the november election. make a very strong stand against these actions and against these accelerants. so with that, mr. chairman, i back. >> thank you. t's clear that there is a massive intersection here between protecting our law nforcement officials, protecting the rights of millions of people, to be her, justice all for racial in this country, and protecting constitution our to be upheld. action on our re part. >> respecting all americans, thank you, i yield back. i thank the witness for their valuable testimony. nd the members for their

questions. the members of the subcommittee, they have additional questions for the witnesses. to respond expeditiously, without objection, committee records for 10 days. open