good evening and welcome. i'm joined this evening by rick tyler the author data joined my friend and author john clark. good evening, gentlemen. welcome. >> think yothank you for having. it's an honor to be at one of america's greatest independent bookstores.

>> thank you for saying that, first of all. i will mention as one of america's great independent bookstores, this book is available for gibson. we have books over the country, all over the world or if you are local, we do offer in-store browsing and curbside pickup right now. so, tell me a little bit about this book. >> so, i knew i wanted to write a book and i have a lot of ideas for books. if you don't like this but they won't be writing any others. i wrote different proposals and got rejected by lots of publishers like a lot of authors do but i have one publisher that worked for thomas's famous stephen coward and if it wasn't for him i don't think this book would have to again because it was unheard of in the published industry he edited my proposal

and send it back to me. he said if you write this book i will publish you and i said i don't have the stature to write that book. the john is someone we normally meet in a coffee shop and they always discuss ideas john has

been a partner in this book. there isn't really a chapter that i wanted to write this for two reasons. one conservatism is often bashed in the media it's actually the track of the government philosophy and i would try an olive branch to my friends on the left and say it can be presented as a very attractive philosophy. it's not my philosophy but i

don't know that it serves anyone the philosophy to agree on. you have to compromise with people that have different views from you and if you want somebody that you agree with 100% of the time, you should run. so, that's one half of the audience. the other half are people that self identify as conservatives, but seemed to be more and more grazing policies that are antithetical to conservatism and i want to lay that down as well so people that of course are unfamiliar with conservatism because they are young or the attention to that philosophy, i think that this book lays it out pretty well. i would define conservatism the way john does and he says the

border of liberty. in the sense that if you take away the order you just get liberty and that is the libertarian philosophy. they don't automatically reject that just because they are new. we've had those ideas against established ideas and if they are better, we can migrate them if not, we wouldn't throw out somethinwould throw outsomething very well for something that might not work very well or isn't working very well. so, i make that case on immigration, trade, health care, the second amendment and many of the other issues in the book. so that was my motivation for writing "still right."

the reason it is still write iss i'm an analyst and get accused often of going to the enemy. although i daresay there are more conservatives that appear regularly on msnbc then do on any of the other cable news networks. and one of the reasons i like to be on msnbc. and i had to learn how to present a case to illiberal left-wing audience. and i think over time it's been pretty successful. while i haven't convinced everybody that watches the network that they can embrace conservatism, i get a lot of comments that i didn't really know what conservatism was it at least now i understand it as a rationale. so being accused of being a lefty nimh romp credit and they say you've gone over to the left and i say no i am still write. so if i thought the title fits but of course the immigrant loving composting american which

is all true. i think we should be a pro immigration country, i drive a hybrid of technologies that do protect the environment. i have a whole chapter on the environment, and we compost here at the tiger household and so i never thought of that as a liberal idea. i thought it was a conservation idea. >> i will say our local town offered a funny pay as you throw garbage removal where you pay per garbage bag and composting has reduced by a third. we will take this moment to say you've given your credentials. tell us a little bit about yourself and your conservatism. >> so, just briefly, rick and i actually met working on a campaign. i worked as a speechwriter for a

few candidates at the local level to the national level, so i think we met, we were working on a campaign together if my background i have a degree in political science and economics at rand and investment firm for about 18 years, so i sold my company about ten years ago. i wanted to get into the writing side because that's what conservatism wasn't getting a very fair hearing. and i thought i could maybe help a little bit with that. i can bring my findings with other bona fide to the economic side of the argument. and i don't think it presented well. i'm hoping this book can that tn accomplish is that we start a conversation because we used to try to win the hearts and minds. we wanted to know what it is that we believe and i think one of the funny things to me is that it is stress testing my own ideas after they work. but i'm hoping what this does is

start a conversation because i think right now the political environment is such that it really doesn't help anybody, and i don't claim to have all the answers by far. and you know, i think that over time my ideas have changed and that is a healthy thing. that is a positive sign. and like i say, i am hoping that that does start a conversation. what i am saying in the reviews for the buck is people that are saying i'm a lifelong democrat, but i don't really see much i disagree with in the book, i think it's good and it's starting a conversation. >> being willing to have a conversation is a very good thing, whereas the shutting yourself off and having making your choices the emotional on a project. so you know, did conservatism

needed to be predefined command for persons that may be joining us to learn, can you briefly define conservatism for people who may have had a different idea about it? >> tuesday in a nutshell, i think you can go back to the writings of william burke and there is a lot of great conservative writers which i mentioned before is a little intimidating to write this book. i didn't feel the stature to be in the zone bu that zone but i d to lay down i don't want to define conservatism per se. conservatism as we took that earlier is ordered liberty, the idea that freedom, individual freedom matters. ...

>> and those that pull yourself up by your bootstraps and all of those things are true but there are people who will never be independent.

and the decentralized government out to you a story about fdr. the gradient on - - the greatest politician of the 20th century. woodrow wilson was a democrat and modeled his political career after teddy roosevelt. he could run as a republican because that was then and economic collapse. and that stems from eugenics which is the science we could

decide who gets to procreate and who doesn't want - - who didn't. but also brought us popular elections of us senators. with the responsibility that the legislature she's to have and then in the old days they say that's not the case anymore right in the middle of prosperous times if you could imagine.

and wilson was a progressive and they ran against each other with competing progressive agendas from different parties. even though he was a party candidate but fdr did something very necessary that put out the agenda. but the word liberal and liberalism had been associated as a conservative test we would identify ourselves as classic liberals in the pre- roosevelt sense but if you just call it liberal then it

stuck in those are the monikers of the political philosophies in our country ever since. and i would argue what's happening now trump call themselves conservative he's not but those call themselves conservative and they are not for the first time since 1856 in which the original republican party platforms it was the pro- civil rights party. they have lost that in this year is to say they don't know what they believe to say we a with the big guy and whatever he says we are behind that. that's a sad thing because parties cannot sustain themselves on personality in the same way parties come and go with their leaders

netanyahu coming from the lawn - - from the stage his party would collapse because there's nothing under it but the republican party is now the trump party and when he moves on it will collapse because it is based on one person it's based on ideas because when we went in i spent my career helping republicans when so what do we win what do we actually get? if entire deficits are trade tariffs mismanagement with the national public health crisis and millions of lost jobs to the tried and true philosophy of governing and conservatives are at the kids table and then

they could sit at the adult table and drove the agenda and then the imposter sits at the dinner table and call themselves conservative but were not allowed to come to dinner. so that's where we are in a nutshell that even if you read my book and don't become a conservative that's okay but at least understand why and understand his thinking on how it works that is one thing but at least you will know it is a rational theory. >>host: you mentioned earlier forced you to examine your own belief in death and to teach is to learn.

and for yourself as well, did teaching people reinforce your own beliefs or change them? >> it's funny because i have nine children. i have homeschooled all of them but one of the greatest preparations for writing speeches is teaching my children. there is that but there is that principle that it is impossible to separate teaching from learning. so the thing for me from a conservative perspective the private sector with the solutions i think rick did an amazing job in the environmental chapter because

that's the way he lives his life and the reality of it is conservatives are painted with the brush we don't care about the environment that's clearly not the case. we are making the argument that the private sector might simply be the best way to address this as to leaving it in government hands. many of the areas addressed in the book make the claim it's not that we don't care about these things. of course we do were just trying to figure out the best way to get there. >> and yourself? >> i was so enthralled with

his answer i forgot the question. [laughter] >> re-examining your own beliefs and to convey them does that help reinforce your own beliefs? >> absolutely if you have to explain to other people i will give you two examples. first on msnbc i started going on the chris matthews show. we been watching chris matthews literally as long as there has been cable television. he was a legend he worked on the hill for three separate congressman is actually a capitol hill police officer before he was involved in politics he does not pontificate because of that but because he actually worked for the speaker of the house. that experience you cannot trade. so chris matthews on hardball

would be invited back. to be the person the people love to hate. they are enjoyable and entertaining but that was me. that i would argue and i love to argue but i was not very likable. and from the several presidential campaigns that would ever be effective at have to learn how to convince people it was reasonable. and to find common ground.

and talk about people who have read the book they are very surprised and had conversations with those who've read the book so much i did not understand and i did not know and that's very gratifying and it's about starting a conversation i also taught people how to run for elected office all over the world from rome to greece to canada and the united states and you have to think it through. and to rewrite my failed proposal that with that manuscript i cannot remember but 7000 words or questions that is cooper union length and it was hard because i had

to think very deeply about healthcare people with pre-existing conditions and with those second amendment rights and gutenberg and so i write about him but every chapter i try to think i was already accused of that wasn't my attention on - - and tension i wanted to answer questions of how he answered and i want to answer but

here's the theory. if i can start a chapter when they nod their head yes for the first three pages as opposed to throwing my look across the room than i might have a chance and might finish the chapter. if i could just do some storytelling and connect with them at the beginning of the chapter that strategy may have paid off the book is available from the bookstore we are providing signed bookplates. he was very kind to send to us. tell us about your biggest frustrations and political conservativism and for the

republican party? >> there is a lot of issues there. and then healthcare and immigration. and conservative thought and the way the republican party's decided to go instead. and that's esoteric but here's the heart of trade. the human being is designed to create. it's our most precious gift to be creative great artwork, great music, great books but also great products and services to try to get

people to part with their dollars and that is in the aggregate truly different transactions of those competing with dollars in the free market. it says your government decides we don't want you to buy these kinds of products for whatever reason and that's a moral objective and those trade deficits precisely for the reason with your local supermarket you keep buying stuff from them voluntarily it

is not compulsory. and they don't buy anything back from you because hong kong trades agricultural products but they wouldn't buy anything from the british it was a one-way street. it was a crisis because they were literally running out of silver because they send it all to hong kong. installs sell something to the chinese they could not resist and that was opium we are so

sorry but we only take silver so then was the outflow back to england and meanwhile millions of chinese became addicted to opium that led to two separate wars years later ended in the british treaty to acquire 236 square miles of the hong kong territories. so what i am advocating is is freedom and it's pushback they know the goose is laying the golden egg. and hong kong has become one of the wealthiest places of the world with contract law and independent judiciary,

with freedom of press and freedom of religion. people say they want to take something out. that i have natural gas. they have some fish and agriculture but they became wealthy because they shared creativity but there is nothing significantly better than what the previous agreement had despite the presidents proclamations to the contrary. americans are not allowed to buy south korea pickup trucks until 2032. i thought what if i want to? what if that is the truck that i need and i want? why does my government want to keep me from buying a south korea pickup truck? when the government interferes

in that way they pick winners and losers. and that is leading to the biggest program we have seen it's worse than the gm bailout that's a deal obama struck they said it's good and it saved the plant and the company and the jobs. i don't begrudge that at all and that's true. so the government decides to take your money and give it to a company and you don't get a service or product in return. i got nothing. not even a doorhandle that gm got the money. but now it's closed not

because of unfair trade practices of labor laws it's closed in ohio because americans did not want to buy the chevy cruz and they made it. if they didn't they couldn't sell it, they had to close the plant. that was painful. here is the bigger problem. all the money that went to gm arbitrarily because politicians decided didn't go to their competitors or the upstart companies and those that are designing cars that i might want to buy. so the government literally took your money and put money

into a company that was failing. i know that sounds harsh but over time and take give it to products and services you don't actually consume. so on healthcare the republicans in short, the democrats have always had an advantage to propose policy solutions. they point to a large or massive government program saying this is our answer to healthcare. they have been at a disadvantage pointing to the private sector which allows the democrats to say they don't have a plan because it's not a government plan. but they didn't actually have a plan. there is still no plan. four weeks ago trump announced

on chris wallace to unveil a huge healthcare plan. it's incredibly complicated. and obama care is just 70 percent of the market private insurance and tricare and medicare and medicaid it is extraordinarily complicated. and there was no free market in healthcare. but with the immigration reform bill and the republican party what we say about immigrants is the fear that

trump generates that the wall did not pay for and trump did not build. and what the wall encapsulated that people who are fearful with the overwhelming culture. and then the jews came to worship in the temple now the muslims and hispanics are getting so i don't suspect those who were worshiping are praying for mecca in spanish no immigration has ever

overwhelmed the culture is never happened in history and quite the opposite. it's made our economy better and stronger and more innovative and traditionally diverse but people do bring a lot into our country. their ideas, food, traditions. why wouldn't we want to keep going in that direction? by the way looking at the low-wage workers who are latino working in construction and lawn care and restaurants and god for that congressman. that is just the way immigration is always worked.

>> what is nancy pelosi or rudy jenny not on - - rudy giuliani have in common? >> there parents are immigrants? but that doesn't come immediately to mind even though the last names give them away because the italians have so assimilated we think of them as americans. i will say rodriguez and hernandez and say i give up. we are getting closer to that every single day but don't worry about economics or the american culture. the next time a caravan comes we should get a bus and bring them them here quickly as possible somebody has to do all the work for medicare if we can get to 6 percent gdp we don't have enough americans now to do the work. we will need a lot of

immigrant immigrants. >>host: that was trade in healthcare and immigration you want to talk about the environment? >> all that john. >> i have to admit my environmental chapter is a little snarky on - - snarky. and my editor had a real problem and first a give a background i tell the story of the grand canyon and why it's my favorite place on earth and it's amazing. and so here at the tyler household we compost all grass

clippings and count the newer everything gets recycled personally because i don't trust the trash man is taking them there but there is a terrible suspicion with all of the other trash and all the other efforts so i do recycle myself it is foolishness for the republicans to see that and i make two recommendations one on the republican side it can be a great issue because it is job creation and innovation issue. it is such an exciting field and at the same time if we could help the planet i'm a

little critical of the democrats i think that foolishness is not an important issue. but on the democratic side i'm a little harsh i've had many conversations to say are you a scientist? know i'm not. and then to say can't talk about it but then if i say something about the environment in the most critical way that it is occurring but i am not entirely sure to the degree

anthropomorphic climate change that is man-made admissions, i don't know to what degree that is true. when i look at the science they say rocket science is hard and by comparison it's easy that i have to put fuel in it it's the fuel ways so much working against the force of gravity and in that certain trajectory i'm not smart enough to do that now that those are all known factors because we are very smart people who understand how to do that now. there are hundreds of variables to impact those that

are known and that we don't know what they are we have to make destinations for some of those conclusions are catastrophic so it is a very difficult thing to protect. so when people talk about the environment they always refer to the weather for instance hurricane laura went from category one at category three overnight and nobody predicted that but you can't talk about climate change but you just did. [laughter] and then to say i'm not sure

we may be warming the planet and i'm concerned and we should do something about it they say i am a denier. you have heard that word. that means i don't believe in climate change. i just told you i did that's like arguing about the virgin birth because that's what i believe is a christian you can't discuss it because you won't convince me otherwise things that i can't talk about it's a belief that is internal based on the doctrine the democrats could when but that means we'll all die in 20

years and that people should begin to lose credibility i don't know if it will be terrible let's find out i hope it's not. but it just seems to me that scaring people is not a long-term political strategy because people tend not to believe it. and in the end that's far better from environmentalism. >> i don't have the book but here is an interesting background they didn't have a lot of money growing up so when he would ask his father

he had an interesting response it was go make it. go make one. and then to develop the led technology. and those government lightbulbs that he invented the led bulb pretty much any color of the rainbow it's made from light versus heat it's cheaper and they last forever i don't remember replacing an led bulb so from that perspective it's clearly not the case they don't appreciate the environment and looking at as a christian and then looking at that as god's

command that the answer is supply-side and with the creativity the answer lies in the creativity of man. and then the reality is that what idea would that be? i look at the numbers in the book in the amount of energy saved every year with the led bulbs is incredible. what will the next thing be? here is my guess. somebody is coming up with it now. may be having a conversation with their dad or mom and said go make one. and maybe that's the best way

and less supply-side operate things don't happen to efficiently the greatest inventions by government committee. >> and a good place to enter the counter thought that john and i also agree there is a role for government in areas where and the led bulb was a government contract going to the private sector to solve a problem they needed an indicator that did not produce

heat this is how it was invented. but the government does do something. the government did get us to the moon. that is an incredible effort there's no market to go explore the moon there is basic science. talking about the chapter on healthcare leading to the development of drugs and that needs to be rebalanced or licensing and it's unfair the taxpayers pay the enormous amount the national institute of science and they do reap the benefit but not the

profits. it's not. but they do amazing work with the private sector in the internet is a perfect example starting off as darpa net the way the pentagon kept the nuclear codes to send them around the world so they were not physically stuck in one place nobody could even imagine what the internet would have been like at that time. so yes, the last example is the pandemic because i am asked this a lot in healthcare we had a national healthcare system and obviously we could deal better with the pandemic. that may be true i think the

pandemic had to be dealt with on a national level because it required a national response a national health crisis it could not be dealt with town by town level. and that was in place at the beginning of the trump administration and then which is planted to the states and that's why the numbers are so dramatically bad the death rate is 20 times worse than all asian countries combined and twice that of europe. >> we have time for one more question.

>> you mentioned a very large family how do we recognize large personal differences - - political differences and personal relationships like marriage or friends or siblings? how do you reconcile with those persons? >> that's a great question. i actually like to hear the other side. sometimes we get together and i like to hear the other side of things. one of the things that has happened lately and that they defined themselves politically

friendships are more important and rick talked about this that i don't think we agree on everything and that's okay. but the reality is that i like to keep the friendship in place he's a patriots fan we need to listen better and it all starts there because he won't get anywhere and tell me do. winning hearts and minds because we try to adapt things to make more sense we have to

focus on the friendship and things we disagree about and that's okay. >> i say in the book relationships are more important than politics you want to preserve them at all cost. if we can't talk politics in a way that doesn't preserve your friendship i have friends were trump supporters and then to say i cannot stand it anymore and i've often responded many times to say turn off the news

and take a few days off and stay away from social media for two days and clear your head and connect with nature. and if you find yourself going crazy because it's too much and people need to take a break. >> thank you very much this evening. we do have signed bookplates and available for pickup thank

you very much have a great night

>> before we launch into a discussion and the secret history of the imperfect union i would like to share a little bit of history.