>> s to your daughter still want to be president? >> no. >> that could change. when i think she was like 10 or 12. no, no, shoe is a musician, an artist, i think. >> that was really conflicted for you because of a gender, of race, of a lot of things, a lot of feelings. >> he hope things are better by the time she is old enough to be president. we have few years to do. a lot of work to do before then. well, this has been such an honor, such a pleasure, and i just am so grateful to have the opportunity to talk with you today. >> thank you so much for having me, kate. canthank you all for listen, an. >> and everybody gets a free copy of the book. that's amazing. that's wonderful.

>> well, thank you so much for such a wonderful conversation. thank you for the book, kate. thank you for your awesome questions. good afternoon, everybody. i'm connor and i'm the director of the wisconsin book festival and i'm delighted to be here this afternoon to feature paola ramos on latinx. two days out so very exciting. we're joined -- she is in phoenix, reporting on latino vote in arizona, and we are also joined by angela bautista from to the best of my knowledge wisconsin public radio. thank you for being here as well. before we get started, and we do have paola needs to catch a plane we have 40 minutes so grill another oft by what to thang madison public library and

sponsors who have been steadfast in making sure we're able to bring free cultural events to people in wisconsin and now as we do digital events across the country, and throughout the world. so, thank you to all of them. i will stop now and hand it over to angela and paola. thank you for being here. >> thank you so much, connor. thank you paola for being here with me. >> thank you for having me. >> and the airport lounge. >> literally, yes. >> so, your become, finding lex los angeles, redefining latino identity. approached the book, with what i thought -- i thought i in other words what latinx meant and i think people will approach this book with some familiarity of the term. we're seeing is it more and nor, now even in the news. what was it like for you to first hear the term latinx?

>> so, i first heard it and i didn't know what it meant but i know it felt better. and iso i think that was my intro tux with the word. the -- introduction with the word it and felt more like me and i didn't understand what it meant. so that was my first introduction, that's the beauty of this world that a lot of people i, i think particularly since 2016 when the word was popping up, more around the internet, more around activist circle, random circles and then people were just using it and i remember having so many conversation and we were like what does that mean? but that was the beginning of this word that starts to embrace, make people feel more included without knowing why. and then with can get into what the word means for different people but i think that's, like, the beginning of the story. the word feels better for a lot of people and that for many

years have not felt includes. >> right. and you write about coming out as latinx. what do you mean by that, coming out. >> i feel like i grew up in -- in different cities, and i feel like i grew up wearing different hats. i was born in miami, to a mexican father and a cube yap mother and then when i was younger, two years old i move to spain mitch parents separated and so when i was in spain i remember feeling latina in spain and then when would go to u.s. i felt seems more mexican and other times more cuban and i had a childhood in spain, and then going up in my father -- both parents wore in hispanic media so i grew up watching these very traditional images of what latino's looked like, whether and i would look at that and i

didn't really see myself. and then i would go to mexico and be with my entire family and i felt 50% of that but also still didn't see myself and didn't see myself in cuban circles and i feel like in a lot of these spaces i had to wear different hands and had to pretend to be more lat lat lat already latina in this circle and i had to be -- i was queer and i didn't feel like i could be all parts at once. so it was a moment after 2016 where i realize for so long in my different careers, in politics or story-tell, with my family in europe or the u.s. issue had to choose a little bit of something, and so i think that's why the term latinx felt right because i felt like when i'm talking to you and identifying myself you've get the whole of me in that one word. >> so, the way i understood latinx coming into this book it was a sort of identifying label

for yourself but when you write about it you write a lot about seeing things through a latinx lens and not just the way off identifying about the way of seeing yourself and other people, communities, issues. what does it mean to look through a latinx lens? >> so the first is understanding that the way i see that x is it's an invitation for anyone and everyone that has ever felt left out of traditional latino community. youback latino and has only learn to speak english but was once told they were not latina enough and account speak spanish. that word is for you. you can be like my grandmother who was toward she deserved right us but the was yearning for mow. that it is latinx. so to look at a latinx lens is to look at all of us to understand i myself have similar

stories to the three million latinas here and there's 250,000 lat tinas that identify as muslim and immigrants are not just -- there's four million black immigrants in the country and stop looking at one dimensional migration lens and look at the different issues that take is, which it's criminal justice, climate change, and this breaking stereotyped many have created pull out us and to start understanding all the different -- the way he we have evolved in past 30-40 years. think part of the interesting thing of this word is that for so long mainstream media told our stories, pollsterses told our stories. people saws as numbers and be lost track how he wad changed in the past 34 years, so all that latinx does

ick tag a look and understand, myself, what did do in the past 25 years? what are the different issues that affect he, that different that those that facial my parents? >> so you went in search of the voices that would represent latinx and took you all across the country, even a map in the book of the places you we went all over the united states and found all these different voices. what i found connecting off these defendant experiences and different people indigenous people, latinos, and so on, you maimed a bunch of examples, a lot -- i think the connective thread when them is stories of trauma and also resilience. trauma from the immigration system, systems that have neglected latinos for abused

people, the history of the colonialism and racism, all these things. how much does trauma inform latinx identity and at what point does it stop defining it? >> i think lot. i think one of the things i'm noticing is that younger -- the younger last tina generation isn't allowing -- isn't allowing someone to define. thes and i believe they deserve more than what has been given to them. every single story and every single community i was with, whether it was central valley, california, whether it was in the trans latino community here in arizona, or indigos in the south and wisconsin, everything single person had an initial story of trauma. mostly through their parents but the lesson i truly learn the

lesson in -- through young latinas, particularly i think of in people like -- a student, he was in parkland, and he was obviously part of the day on which he lost one of his best friends in high schoolen due to the shooting and he saw those images. those are track images -- tragic immigrations gun violence and created an organization for young last tinas to speak out but gun violence. another example in texas, these are folks that had been part of and witnessed a massive massacre, and instead of keeping your head down, instead of accepting what other people told them, that it they didn't belong there and they were trying to get out the vote in the 2018 mid-terms and they recorded -- they created an historic amount of youth mobilization and people went out to vote because they

didn't allow the status quo to define them. and more than anything, i learned that i had a lot of conversations with outcome latinas who suffer from depression and from anxiety, and young latinas that had seen their parents be criminalized. someone documented, others living in families and when they're parents were told to not talk about mental health, not talk about sadness, they didn't take that. they're starting to talk about it openly. so, yes, there is trauma in a lot of these stories busts it's incredible to see what young people are doing about that. they're speaking in -- and they can be broken but they're choosing to go beyond that. >> i see in all the stories you talk about that you talk -- the people you talk with that there is this sort of moment of self-realization for each of the people in their own way sort of

coming out, not that they would ever use the term latinx and -- and the people you talk to, most of them actually don't use the term for. thes but there is a sort of coming out moment in in which ty kind of come into their own identity, whether it's being black or muslim or no longer wanting to be defined by trauma. there's something -- hmm. what am if trying to say. >> that has been sort of the -- the takeaway really is that people are now -- it's happening now. particularly in a moment where you can agree with trump or not, be republican or democrat but this atime where many people some form of oppression, people feel divided and it is now that

people are sort of like stepping into their identities. it is people are understanding what it means to be them and then right enough that's why the term is so complex because year learning about that. you also use this analogy of like imagine -- 60 million latinas. now imagine we all step out into the sun and you put a light on us, hearings what we look like. that's the metaphor of the book. i'm going to put -- raise the -- here's what we look like and we're in that process of coming out ourselves and the hard part is for other latinas to look around us and be like, oh, wow, why did this person, that emoperate from me like ms. decide to choose muslim and hundreds of thousands other people why das a latina that forever was toll she wasn't last teen -- latina enough, what is

that? why did it spent so many years not seeing this person. the conversations we're having right now. >> you traveling across the country, you talk a lot about geography and a place of home, sense of home, defining who we are as people; can we talk about that? for you talk but growing um in the miami bubble and what it meant to leave. and what that taught you. what did that teach you? >> part of for me the exercise of the book was in meeting different people but sort of like tackling geography in a different way, going spaces that re believed aren't ours don't feel like home and looking at them from different perfect

perspective. in miami and florida the exercise was the reverse, rediscovering a place i thought i knew and that was one of the most interesting conversation is had. the first thing i did when i tackled miami and i wanted to find different voices, the first thing i did was i hit up in my -- for reference, miami is a bubble, because more than 60 parse, 70% of people in miami identify as latino so you grow up not identifying as latino because everybody around is and has been -- miami is a place that allows you to flint where you come from and everyone elves is like you. got in touch with high school friends and the question i had for. the was what happened to you when you left miami? what happened to you whenie went to american college or went to south or win to california, and

everyone has the same experience. we're all of a sudden they were like the first time i experienced some form of racism think first time i understand my parents are immigrants. but it took me leaving miami for people to open their eyes and now the interesting thing for me was, okay, once you had that experience and come back to miami, what does that mean? how are you changing the city you thought you knew? and he think it's creating a little more empathy. what you've see now in miami and nsa politics when you hear therefore stories of a lot of the cuban exchange, cuban support for someone like president trump and a lot of that is because the old generations of cubans have been able to forget where they come from and now you see this younger generation that left miami and came back and are injecting another sense of empathy that miami has lost.

>> this is a part of your book that really profoundly affected me because of i guess kind of where i come from, and my family's relationship to it. you talked to someone who you call basically your opposite. the black cuban, supporter of trump, a member of the proud boys who identifies as a western show nist. on people you would read him as someone that would? identify on paper as not sitting the ideology but when you look at him through a latinx lens you come away with more sympathy for where he is coming from and how he tries to defiance -- tee fine himself. >> part of this conversation is understanding that just because you're latina, does not mean you are democrat. it does not mean year liberal and that's important for people

to -- including myself. a good reminder that is also part of the conversation and that's part of breaking stereotypes. the other part is not letting our own biases get in the way. when someone like anthony, when i first read there was an cuban heading the proud buys, way the chairman, misinitial reaction was like, why? and then you understand that someone like anthony who is black and latino, is a person that has been neglected by both systems, and by the system and by both parties. he is someone that at some pint, neither democrat order republicans can do at theirs and he is someone that was left out of the system and miami is a perfect example. everyone is always trying to reach the lat teen latina vote and my question is who was look out for him? the answer i took is no one.

so, the interesting thing in enriquez is that in trump, he sees a proximity to white power and at the end of the day my take was that is driven we this deep desire to assimilate to be part of something else. again, you can agree or disagree but it is -- that is to me was this core of why this person was aching so much to be part of something else, and so that was one takeaway. the other takeaway is when something like enrique and you see it threw latinx lens we were able to have the conversations and understand our differences buts one thing i'm most proud of i was able to get him to understand no matter how much you try you still can't erase the factor an immigrant so when you calm call people illegal aliens understand when you're saying that. when i talk to him he al say

undocumented immigrants so much it's a small, very small thing but going back to words, words matter it and is injecting a level of empathy and sympathy that wasn't there before. >> you mentioned a assimilation and one of many examples i think of ways in which i had not thought about ways to assimilate. so you went to georgia to witness this -- the local mining community and their memorial for 9/11. the 9/11 memorial celebration and they used 9/11 as a way to assert themselves as american and i jug thous that is a beautiful portrait of not necessarily assimilating by rejecting ones self-but enblames one's self and your multiple identities. >> when i first got the call

they were like -- irremember one of the leader was like i want you to see something people don't see. come here on september 11th september 11th and my initial reaction was, is not the first thing i would think of. there's these significant indigenous mayan community in that generations now has been living in the south and one of them is in georgia and so for them they wanted wanted to take september 11 as a way for other americans to understand and redefine what racism meant and for. the it was both like honoring the united states and honoring what america has brought them but also a way for them to say, what this country has allowed me is to hold on tight to my mayan roots to my indigenous languages to my extra traditions and my culture and that's the beauty of america and i found that and i found that symbolism in the most

unexpected places in georgia. so, i met a lot of young mayan kids who saw their parents far back in silent. the parents would try to either speak in spanish or english but choose actively to not speak in the mayan language, kids that saw their parents in -- just the silence to me was like very -- i learn a lot, where silence meant a lot the mayan community, way to assimilate and put your head down and not look at people in the eyes and not bring your whole receive toes and the mayans kids are rejecting that. and so that is what i experience in hamp con, kids in this small georgian town in the midst of this red sea, took over the town

and they had this little town church and they did a whole traditional, like mayans and celebrations on 9/11 and there were some white folks in there and i could see a reaction to them. people were like didn't really know how to react but the people that were there, like, found -- saw a different form of presidentism -- patriotism they had never seen. >> what kind of assimilation can look like. you win to greenville, south carolina, and went to mayan catholic congregation n which they blend and preserve mayan traditional practices practicesd catholicism. what would indigenous filipino catholicism look like? i thought that was fascinating. >> yeah. that's one of the things where i feel like as more people

understood indigenous -- the my yap communities through -- when the thing of patriotism, people think about religion and love of god and traditional views and there is nothing more than american that what i saw through the mayan community, where they not only have a relationship, very unique relationship with their environment and god and that was the biggest take away from my experience. they valued the land they walk on. value the sun and they value conversations in a way that many of us take for granted, and then you start thinking and it goes back to like, of course, they are the first people. they were in the americas before anyone was so they have a relationship which of the lands and with geography that we may think is random but for. the it's like -- and i always think about this -- i remember being like -- what does it feel

like to be here and they sayit feels just like home and when of the leaders was just like just look around you, the trees and that is part of the history. so what to us is random to them is familiar to them is home, is their land. >> you travel to so many places where you find communities that are -- would not expect to be there. and when you ask the question how did you end up here it's kind of -- kind of obvious because they made it their home. >> yes, guess back to -- you go where your loved ones are, and that's the core of thieves migration patterns if your loved one is in these cities or places you go. and that -- you can be in georgia in the midwest in the border, and that is kind of this unstoppable force, and putting politics aside no wall and no

policy will end that. bogey your loved ones there are and people make thieves maces feel like home. >> we've been talk budget the south. let's bring it to the midwest. so you came to wilkes and to madison. what did you find here? >> i hadn't been to wisconsin so i went there for the first time through this book and i have been here multiple time but my idea for their midwestern chapter was to make a make lie the midwest feel like home and truly understand that over the pass tech candidate latinos are greg in the midwest and the south and higher levels than in florida. so-so i trade too guide myself through culture, and so it was through food, knowing i wanted to see what people were doing with food, and music, and so

what i found in wisconsin there's this -- i didn't know that wisconsin had the largest latino music festival in the entire country which was news to me. that was interesting. so from through started figuring out, what was that foundation? and i found out there's just like these incredible young last tina musicians that are completely impacting culture and making a place like wisconsin theirs and so i spent some time in milwaukee, with a mariachi band on the south side of milwaukee and i spent time with two hip-hop artists, that also grew occupy then south side and instead of holding on to traditional latino musician, merging with hip-hop and electric -- electronic musician and so it was amazing, and i think the biggest thing learned

is particularly with browns crew this is hip-hop crew in milwaukee, and they kept saying they're -- in order to know where you're going you have to know where you come from. and that was the message throughout all of these different musical scenes i found. music was a way to get people rioted in where they're from and allow that to give. the the creative freedom to be who they want to be and i think music allows you to do that, not only in that music, but with notes, you can do whatever you want and feel however you want and it was amazing to watch. >> there was so surprising. i feel bad i had missed the -- when bad bunny and -- >> yeah. >> and it just makes me so proud to think about the sort of vibrancy you can fine in the midwest. >> yeah and i didn't know that. that was on me and i feel like that -- that's a lot of

people's -- wait, what? you found all these amazing artists in yeah. that was the theme of the midst. and illinois i wanted to drive through food. in wisconsin, threw musician, and in iowa, through religion and language and understanding for generations latinas have made homes and felt people -- and a lot of people feel like home through their own culture. >> so, i want to bring it now back -- or i want to bring it to politics again. it's not lost as us we're in the middle of an election and you're just now coming back from a reporting trip. what are you seeing in the latino community in regards to this election and the latino vote? >> you just based on what i'm seeing here so i'm in arizona. and just arizona is a place

where president trump won by less than 4% in 2016. it's also a place that has not seen a democrat, presidential democratic nominee has not won the state of arizona since 1996 and enough you see that joe biden is lead neglect polls. ... >> in the way that the latinos are. to give you an example is there is a pull the found a 40 percent of young latino men in arizona are intrigued by trump. they might vote for donald trump. so goes back to what we were talking about assimilation. unlike what is trump over to

them. so that is the gender gap that is happening. but the foundation is immigration. so i talked to so any dreamers that watch their parents be criminalized by different groups. no matter where you live, for paola ramos biden, the legacy is lingering. yet these young people the group watching this in this insight immigrant history. is there coming into vote for you to think that is driving the vote people tuesday forget about that . and some people can. those are the two driving forces. i think every state has some form of that in place. but to me, but not perfect. the perfect example would be what to expect across the country. it is way more nuance than we think. the undercurrent, always goes

back to history. how have these young people been going up to see among them. angelo: is so easy to forget about the history and stories. about the building blocks in the cultures. as these data points. paola: and that's a tendency right. when the story is like latinos coming into vote. they would overwhelmingly voted democratic. but there are so any nuances. what is it mean to be like a traditional latino man. i was of change right. there's so much data out there. but there's not enough research. there's never been enough research in the money does been invested in. angelo: yes . you reported about

it a much different time than were living in right now. otherwise, we would be talking face-to-face on the stage somewhere. what are you saying, and how are you seeing latinos being affected by the coronavirus. paola: i think, that is the number one issue right now. i think a lot of latinos are sing this virus, this election is no longer about politics. is on a trump and biden. for any of them, is a matter of survival. life or death. there's over 36000 latinos that have died. and the employment rate is about 18 percent for latinos. it's a lot of the young people that perhaps at some point in their lives could detach themselves from politics.

like politics is the right start now. so there a lot of young latinos that a sing the parents be affected. nineteen the parents passed away. they have sing them treated differently is essential workers . that is a driving force. and again the lens is simply understanding the nationalities of all of these issues. and i honestly think that is one of the main reasons why the latinos, i believe it will be one of the highest ones we've seen. it is truly like a black and white choice. going back to the trauma, you cannot forget it. perhaps there was a moment that you can see at home . but most can't. angelo:it's interesting.

obviously, the president won by less than 1 percent. look at like 2012, and in 2016, the latino voter turnout decreased. in goes back to do people feel more seen now. negative place and like wisconsin. have the talk about issues that go beyond immigration. i can't spend enough time looking at these plans, the winning lens. you do need those lenses to turnout targeted like they did in 2016. angelo: d think you're underestimating and power. paola: i think it in a way that her job. i do. i think there's so much more to be done and semi lessons we learned. i think you have to not being making mistakes. you've got to ask questions . think a lot of this debate comes

down to the most stable questions. of the campaigns and politicians asking the latinos. like what is the agenda that you want to see. the other day i was hearing someone say has ever entered anyone ask you what changes you want to see. they said no. thing goes back to the basics. angelo: so we are preaching the end here. i do want to ask you, it's hard to . will happen in the next three weeks and what will happen in the next year or more. but the big picture, what do you hope for the future of lesson x. and latinx. my biggest thing really is for people to read this book and start to understand the value. the only way that people do run

for office, is if you believe that you are valuable. do you see yourself, and that lens for in this way go back and ask people why they use that word, latinx . the way that you talk about yourself is where you see yourself in the world. and a lot of people have limited us. so i hope this allows people to see beyond what is been given to us. and i think were ouralready starting to see change. you have more latino voters now than ever before. young people speaking out more than ever before. i think it is a wave and i have that wave goes faster. angelo: you wrote such a beautiful portrait of this community. i'm really looking forward to seeing the reaction and hopefully other people sees themselves elected and even

people who are not latino. like myself. i busy myself and parts of the story. it is wonderful to be able to do that . paola: thank you so interesting that it means a lot. this was one of my 31 podcast. and i really honestly want to go back because i think there is so much there. angelo: we would love to have you back. paola: okay. on that note i'm about to go catch my plane. thank you so much. i really do appreciate it . angelo: thank you for being here. >> this is an open of invitation to come back. perhaps maybe for another book or perhaps with this footprint . thank you so much we hope that you will go and purchase the book from our book selling,

travel home safely and we wish you all the best. thanks so much . paola: thank you. book tv, on "c-span2" has top nonfiction books and authors. every weekend, coming up this weekend, tonight at 8:15 p.m. eastern, coverage of the 7031 annual national book award, sunday life at noon eastern on "in depth", conversation with author and chair of african-american studies at princeton university. the author of several books including begin again, james baldwin's america and lessons for all, exodus and democracy in black and an uncommon state. >> after electing the 31 black president in 2008, the country responded by voter suppression laws and voter id laws. the tea party, and then reelected donald trump. so we had a crossroads. who are we going to be.

at the heart of the dog, it's always been this moral question. who do we take ourselves to be. >> during the conversation with your calls, tweets, text and facebook messages. in the 9:00 p.m. eastern afterwards, correspondent kevin williamson in his book megabytes ghetto. politics everyday lives of white working-class what americans . is interviewed by washington examiner columnist and cnn contributor. if i spoke to be, on "c-span2". this weekend. >> the next on book tv, law professor douglas ginsburg examines the constitution to the eyes of legal scholars and historians. and then it's an offer discussion on the american dream from the recent virtual brooklyn book festival follow the bike guardian life insurance company of