african-americans in education and the importance at 4:00 p.m. eastern on real america and light of the recent attacks on the u.s. capitol, watch several films on the united states government and american democracy that offers >> lessons on how the government works. at 6:30 p.m. eastern author nathaniel talks about his book in the heart of the sea, the tragedy of the whale ship about the 1820 sinking of the ship following a sperm whale attack and the fate of the ships group at 8:00 p.m. eastern on the presidency we look back at farewell and inaugurations of previous presidents. bill clinton, george w. bush, dwight eisenhower, john kennedy, and ronald reagan. exploring the american story watch american history tv this weekend on c-span three. >> michael kirk is joining us, he is the filmic of the documentary filmmaker of this pbs frontline film president

biden, again that airs tonight at 10:00 p.m. eastern time on your local pbs station. mr. kirk, why make w this documentary? what was the goal? >> while we make an annual film or every four years to make a film called the choice about the two presidential candidates. we weave it together is two hours and always airs right before the election andnd october. and essentially the idea is to get in side the method of the two different men. we do not interview the candidates we interview their friends, their family the people of known them allnt their lives as close as we can get. we try to really answer the question is the boy the father of the man? when you get down the begin to learn everything you can about this case trump and biden. and weave them altogether was a very interesting picture. we've taken the best parts of the biden story that i think

will help people understand and the eep of an election who joe biden is. what are the aspects of his likeness that could contribute to how is going to be as president. >> what are those aspects? >> he is made a lot of mistakes. he has learned something important cross life which is to apologize, very different than what donald trump is like. he freely admits the mistakes, he apologizes and may be the most important emotional and useful method that he has is that he perseveres in the face of tremendous failure to run for president two times. a plagiarism scandal and other things. joe biden kept going. if you look very closely at his role so many controversial policies and events, he is

finally apparently on the right side of history. and you see that come to fruition across his life. >> how is it that someone who has run twice before and failed could win the presidency on the third time? iou think this is the father, the man the other adage we work against the time make the man urges the man make the time? i think donald trump tried to make the times and he think he may have, i think joe biden, the times of may joe biden president of the united states. he never comment all of the times he ran he never really had a policy, an ideology at the heart of his politics. he was a liberal, his really close friends was segregation of senators and the senate. he was always casting about peggy says the film, for a policy, ford ideology for an idea for a definition of who joe biden is.

the american people were never buying it whenever he ran a national campaign. he was not great out there in america he just was no' unique or different. it may be that what happened to him this time in the face of the coronavirus reckoning, a president who has set a lot of stuff on fire, maybe a lot of people were uneasy and really felt they needed a grief counselor and chief if you will. i think that is who joe biden had become, we tell a lot of the stories in the film tonight. maybe that was enough, people finally recognize even what joe biden may not of recognize about himself is that he is prepare' to be the grief counselor inn chief. >> do you explore the dynamic that people voted not

necessarily for joe biden but against president trump? >> there is no doubt about that. biden benefited from that. i think aside from political or policy differences that many americans had coming there many personality issues, decency, one of the things that change in joe biden over his life is you can watch it happen. he gets a kind of restraint and the fact that he did not engage with trump but he kept trying, persevering, striving forward. i think a lot of people who were running from trump because he was not trump, found the restraint in biden about trump and trump's actions in that first debate and what is happened with the coronavirus and other things.

i think at a a time of great fear of where trump might take the country or had taken certainly the health of the country, people back to they perceive, i think as a decent if not wonderfully charismatic leader. >> what did he learn from president obama? >> he learned i think a certain column, picked up a call aspects. they had from what we can tell a very big partnership. j the most important thing joe biden got from barack obama is with the people in washington called the obama halo which is this halo effect. if you are that close to obama and obama embraced you at a time with a lot of black people in the country were very worried about biden and who he was, white guy, news segregation is in the senate

was on the wrong side of the anita hill, clarence thomas moments in history in the supreme court, the crime bill. a lot of things that biden brought with him that once obama had picked him and he spent a lot of time and it was clearle that they did have a working relationship and he wasat handling things obama could not handle. especially in the racial world. he earned that obama halo. i think in lots of places that's why he has who he has in his government now. that cow will his service as vice president help or hurt his administration? >> he knows the people that he has put in place inside his government. but remembers i said at the beginning, i am not sure joe biden, i think he believes what he says he believes and hears and sometimes hard choices between the pressures

of the ideological left and many people called the progressives and the standard middle-of-the-road democrats and the people who were the obama administration as well. i think he i knows how to navigate that. a lot of people who are young, bright, soldiers and higher in the obama administration are now in the biden administration in very high places. jake sullivan, john feiner, a lot of people at that level. and they have graduated themselves into something. is it obama 2.0? i'm not sure it's that exactly because a lot of things have changed by the mere fact of who donald trump is and was in what he did. but i think in terms of what hene learned, i think he learned who other people are. think he holds a sensibility of think he'd notched it back a little bit in those meetings with the kids who in the beginning of the obama administration were kind of making fun of him behind his

back, uncle joe is people tell us, sleepy joe a lot of those words came from the obama young people in the white house and the other agencies in the very beginning are now senior people in the biden administration. he obviously does not carry grudges either. >> were chocolate the incoming president, joe biden freed the new documentary by pbs frontline is called presidenty biden, filmmaker michael kirk here with us to take your questions and comments about mr. biden's career, andy in lewiston california it independent you are a firster go-ahead. >> caller: good morning to both of you. just a comment. first of all i hope the republicans and everyone for thati matter, practice what they preach in the sense that they give mr. biden a chance.

a slight comment on your last, last segment, we deal for the bible and stand for the flag. but i'm going to jump in so we can stay on topic here. were talking about joe biden story. michael kirk you heard that college that he hopes republicans give him a chance. how will his years in the senatehe working help them? >> i think abydos we discovered is an institutionalist that's not a surprising or controversial comments. he does know and revere the ways the senate works, we senators like mitch mcconnell and others have been around a long time, understand the protocols, the give-and-take, the way things were, the way power is. use, abuse, and spread pretty think biden understands that

pretty think the times are also very, very different. this is not your united states senate, joe biden rose up and became a powerful member of. things are very, very different just ask mitch mcconnell how different they are inside the republican caucus sitting inside the democratic caucus. biden yes he has friends that he has an affinity for the institution, i think he's going to know how to call mcconnell. they have surely spoken many times in the last few weeks, months now. everything is slightly different and very skewed. not to mention what is trump going to duties out of office? and how much of his bases he going to be able to hold onto? i base that by now is obviously a big part of the house of representatives. may be even in 2022. and has moved into the

senates. there is holly, cruise, others that joe biden is going to have to feel how to deal with. if he's going to have to deal with joe biden at the senates going to get anything done. >> were rebecca and ohio, republican bert okay boss or go to cala new york, democratic collar hi cal. >> caller: good morning, good morning, mr. kirk i'm a great admirer of yours but i've been watching your films that have uncovered a presidencies and politics for decades now. stilll seems to be with you as a narrator. speak with such authority in terms of providing that first draft that they call it. i guess that makes me want to comment that it seems as if the greater national issue with biden's election is the country that makes these

incredible mistakes refuses to take blame and comes up with solutions that do as much harm as good if not more. i think that is the greater national narrative that people like biden and trump into. this nation creates monsters like trump make him president and is stuck with all the problems that leaves. the solutions we come up with our politicians like biden who frankly get elected because we have tried everyone else. they have tried so many times bound to hit the jackpot sooner or later. i say this to particularly because even what seems to be in the opening clip statement of where he will be placed in presidential history.

as a national crisis that no one is discussing that does not allow much promise for it biden presidency. a president who is elected who i am sure your documentary will show, has his fingerprints on so many of the problems he has been elected to salford i would be have.sted in it, you >> guest: thank you for your continued viewership of our films. this is our 20th film we have made in the obama and trump era. we have a kind of understanding of the division that is deep in society. deeperer now than ever after january 6 i would suspect. i don't think joe biden is naïve about what is ahead of him. he knows the gears in the machine of democracy work. it is a democracy. it is held at least so far in the democracy there will be a struggle for sure to kind of

fix, and god knows from what i can tell, he feels he has to go in and deal with, it's like you are in a triage unit in a battle zone. he has to stop the bleeding before you get the patients up and get them back on their feet. that is a formidable task at this time. you've had an entire government going the other way. you've got at i least 70 million people in america who voted to go the other way. then bentley who cannot comprehend that you one. on the progressive democrats and bernie sanders who do not believe your anything but old white guy. what you do about that? how do you step up? you read the papers and listen to some of the commentators on cableme this is a chance for biden to do the new fdr not only does he have a formidable

task of what's actually out there is real and will require efforts he, harrison the forces they put together go out and do that on behalf of what they want, it's also amazing on the other side. in finding a way to do that and deal with the sadness and depression that i think runs deeply to the american society. he knows. i am certain of this, given his own moments of deep grief and how he has responded to situations which you can see the film tonight where it required him to be a grief counselor. not give a big policy statement give something on a one-to-one basis for think that instinct and him it's got to be running pretty deep right now.

if people pick up on it, he is right does not overreach and does not fall back into the traditional american, political camps. all the things that await any president or any official who face what america faces including the deepest division ever and formidable media and internet enemies who come at you and twist what you say. and to real combat, conspiracies and lies are out there everywhere. they were not there during the obama administration, they were rising up then largely fed by donald trump for four years. certainly for the last couple of months. it is a real, real problem that america is in, that democracy iss in. and because joe biden said please elect me president i can help with this, really

hits him most directly and all eyes are going to be on this man including ours of measuring them against who he is and who he was. you can watch the documentary of the eve of president-elect biden's inauguration and on your localal pbs station, 10:00 p.m. eastern tonight presidentt biden is the title. let's go to james in st. louis missouri, democratic collar. >> yes, i've always been a democrat. i just hope joe biden stays in a center with the democratic party. i think he can get more republicans maybe to provide more immunity government that we need.

he was not my first pick. i reallyas did not believe he was going to win. if it was not for the coronavirus i don't believe he would have. but in a lot of his policies and i know a lot of things need to be done for the minorities, but i hope he presents a sense of view for the whole nation. >> are right james, michael kirk. >> there's a doubt about that, that's where he has always been. not a flaming liberal his politics take six or seven months to make one of these but i first started to make it i looked back and jaisol he had a ride the wave politics. because he did not really have

any internal that was driving it. it's a bernie standard is over elizabeth warren it did. in fact he may be the least of all the democrats who ran. what that says to me as he is a ride the wave guy. when things were, that is what puts him on the crime bill start of the ledger. that's what puts him trying to nurture clarence thomas through these hearings and not listen to anita hill and others. that put him where he was. when i think deep down inside, he is the centrist. i am sure that is what they are counting. and he created a centrist government. i'm sure that is what theyen counting on bringing back republicansck who deserted the democratic party for a variety of reasons, the least of which is economic trouble.

it is a huge economic problems in the post recession 2008 crash. and s trump assange i've got a deal for you, i can make the economy better. i can doy deals. he is going to have to get in there and do that. that is whatk he is counting on. the people who deserted the democratic party will come back to him, he thanks that's what happened during the election i am sure. and he's got to keep feeding that. >> trump had a very narrow intense base of anywhere from 25 -- 35% of the republican party. he changed it in his image and likeness, he made it donald trump's party. so that leaves a lot of room for people who did not feel comfortable in what they saw on the sixth of january and other things coming from trump in this last year including the policies, the

coronavirus. that is where joe biden can find the sweet spot. but he's got to cut a lot of breaks. a lot of people have to stop dying, and a lot of people have to get vaccinated. a lot of people want to feel better about getting outdoors and getting back to work. and then maybe he can get things moving. itul is certainly what appears to be the calculation. >> fran and michigan, democratic collar. >> caller: hi, thank you for taking my call. my problem is, how in the world president biden is going to fix all of these things that donald trump, president trump is leaving him. every day he's leaving more men. people are getting paroled, he ispe just like leaving more and more mess for him to claim. it seems like everybody forgot about obama and what biden did.

thisis country was in the toilet. and they cleaned it out. so when they plant pass it off to donald trump it was good. the day after trump got where he got, he professed that he fixed a manufacturing company. and hen' didn't. all of these things were already done. so when he got his job, everything wasev smooth. and he just ran it down into the ground. : : michael: and as i have said, there are a lot of things the biden and the democrats would like to turn around. it would be interesting to see how he picks and chooses what to do as you all know, he addressed

immigration issue yesterday. any put out a bill that he wants to see it done. i was at the forefront of what donald trump came in doing. and it was the opposite direction. in the early 100 days of the biden administration is a test of his current skill the house of representatives and we can get done in the senate. it will be a big test of how biden presidency will go. that iscy one of the issues that the democrats invited feel they need to clean up from what donald trump and others brought to washington, back in the early days of the american presidency. >> is president elect biden view vice president elect kamala harris in the roles to play in the ministration. michael: whether things will spend time addressing his biden

and his relationship to the issue of race and specifically, black people who are known including barack obama who he has known. and that mistakes were made and then apologized for and then it was hard to reprint himself with black community. his choice of kamala harris which i'm sure he and everyone thought of as a truly historic thing, also a critical signal he was sending. i just to the black community and the women of the united states of america and of the world. but also a very specific kind of thing the shows what he is demonstrating which is that he looked the other way may be

agreed before dramatic attack on him in the way and very first way because she is beloved son, she really took them down. for his issues but it shows how long he has been around he would have a fundamental role in the busing issue. and she really ate him up. and i think it hurt his feelings. and then five or six months later however long it was maybe longer than that, as he announced the democratic nomination. what you do. this is the woman who took him down. his fierceness and strong articulation the position made him look bad.

and the government puts them in the second seat right next to him. and gather they were closely together. so that says something about him in a personal way. set that aside for a moment.ne for, there was something personal about that as well. how easy is positioned. and he apologizes and perseveres. and now they are persevering together. for rallying issues and not just race. >> discussing brooklyn sends us this text . good morning and you think the level of civic and government literacy is one of the issues present biden will have to contend with. michael: at this moment, it's what people know and understand. the fact that so any people come

i will take long for you factsi that so any people who stormed the capital on january 6, really believed in meaning the president of believed that they could name a new president at that moment. if he only had the courage and respect for donald trump. i think he was demanding and they had quite an argument. the fact that so any people could've lost it. and they g were talking about gt hence, hang fence . maybe others as well. the vice president billy cannon a moment an election moment that he can elect her named the president. such a fundamental difference couldn't and this is an example

of how people really understand how government works and who is in congress and what they do what their expectations are. with the cultural used to be and what is becoming. and who the president the checks and balances work. it is designed to be a bipartisan environment. it's all in a days work. and now it's beyond a food fight. and i think that is partially because the texture which is that people don't understand how government works. it's supposed to work and some of that, we can blame on what we have seen happen right before your eyes and television and around the web. to the american politics. it's just a divide really to settle in and get on out on.

and sit down cable television broadcast news. especially the right wing. it is not about civics anymore. were decency even. let's a bloodsport. and now it is what it is. and changing that, is a formidable task which is waypr below the president of the united states. an assistant in the house and the governors and americans institutions fall in line. and that seems a big reach for four years. host: orlando florida independent. >> good morning and i want to say first, that i appreciate the film makers collective review of

biden's history, i am a 60 -year-old man that i quite vividly recall when president-elect biden consorted with known segregationists. and when he stood up for the crime bill that incarcerated numerous black men. and what he did. and for me, he is a person that gets it. in thehe sense of and understand this and he's made mistakes but is not too big to say that i was wrong. some encouraged with that. and you mentioned on president or vice president elect kamala harris challenged, on the podium during the debate. i was glad to see that. i'm aua graduate of howard

university. and is happy to see that she challenged him, did not back down and then he stood there and he took it. so my point is this. i commend you on your documentary. i'm going to watch it tonight but i am also have enough faith the president-elect biden gets it. he gets it from the people that stormed the capital. he may not agree with what they did but i believe he understands their angst. i also believe he understands the workings of the parts of the government that our current president didn't have a clue about. irr also believe that is schoold president obama on how to navigate those channels as well. host: on michael kirk to respond to that last part that you are saying. michael, is institutional

knowledge. e.michael: yes, the best book tt everybody that hung biden, is that the senate will hold his experience that's not an actual person. and mitt romney used to be in the united states senate. and that is to still and involved with the institutions around the country. he was able to walk with that kind of a walk. without being man's a pansy because going to be necessary to be bold these moments. certainly when it comes to us what to do with police in america and the killing of innocent black people. and of the people of color.

we've got to make it work. he's gonna let people know where he is coming from. assume that happened with biden under this last campaign in a way that it didn't see a lot of it before. maybe there is somebody is listening to other voices because he is an experienced and been around for a long time. things have been changing in the country. the new you look now about all kinds of things sorted be necessary. with areas are not cummings of us find out. the respect that he has for not just the congressman government but also knowledge-based institutions . it is something that has not been at the forefront the trump administration. the idea that the universities now are important to the people to go to the university teaching universities.er

that matters institutions like the cdc. in the world health organization . and also inside of the institutions beliefs there's knowledge there. no president can live without that and certainly no country can live without. all of the sort of fact-based institutions including i certainly hope the press in the united states not fake news are enemies of people. just people who are part of the democracy. they do the best i d can. and i hope they have aspirations for the democracy as well. if anybody out there has the chance to maybe move the needle a little more the other direction, it's probably what people would say.

maybe his life experiences. just like any human being is there with biden. maybe in the institutions that he's been involved in. and certainly when he was or more of thee king of the hill n the united states senate. you can watch that make your own judgments about it. watch him now. and watch kamala now. and the people like the attorney general who is aal fascinating back story. it's going to be an amazing test of the posted trump reinvigoration the kind of an american that appeal to the angry based people with the

policies and things that nurture and help them so that they will come back into an america is not quite so divided.ir host: in the documentary tonight in your local pbs station on tpm eastern time. also there talking about the confirmation hearings for the biden administration beginning on capitol hill the defense secretary nominee along the home secretary and secretary of state and national intelligence. those nominees all on capitol hill today coming up and cspan. they will bring you janet yellen's testimony. and she will urge lawmakers to act big to avert protected downturn. and michael kirk before we get to those hearings up on capitol hill though, tell us more about this documentary, we have a few

minutes left here. what do you think the president-elect biden or what will his communication strategy look like. it will be communicate differentlyymm rated. michael: coming to say into your good questionn there. this is perfect for cspan. i mean, to tell you but this is exactly the time when you take a peek at a new kind of government coming in. so the continuation, this is great that we get to witness it happened and listen to the arguments . try to watch how these people are going to come backto in and turn the ship in a completely different direction. that's going to be fascinating. and cspan, the use of the time, it's a view into that democracy. it's a more valuable resource, maybe pbs.

absolutely cspan. so thank you for what you do right at the metropolitans do. it's essential that with this democracy. ask me again. what was it just me greta. it's. host: the relationship with they press. and will be used twitter by president trump did. michael:li what we watched, alliances this way. i don't think he ever did twitter. i don't think it's going to be institutional journalism. and people like cspan. he is going to or it does not seem likely as a strategy to use twitter. and for my individual perspective, top of the hill of

beans but thankfully that's not going to happen way. but i'm not sure. it's the right checks and balances. he's not aot great speaker is nt going to come out and be a kennedy or an obama. with his charisma. personal story, when you went and shot an interview with joe biden, he was limited to 15 or 20 minutes. usually do a downhill four to our trailer interviews with people. as with very limited. fifteen minutes off him. but as a cobra goes off, he might tell our top for 40 minutes . tell you stories and talk about his neighbors and ask you what you think. so that is his style. and even as i speak about it.

it is one of the things he mileti of doing as well. you see what the planets, point them out at critical moments and try to talk the stratus he can and i think people get used to the fact that there's no drama obama during the obama years during the biden years. the better thing to come up with. a phrase like no no drama obama. but i think heat biden is fiscally responsible. and he'll be prepared. and keep the process moving. i think, at least his transition has not been fed fight on a variety of formats platforms. and i think that's a sign that the way that it's going to

happen, just going to happen people right here about it and official meetings. it will be up to people like me and others to get under the hood and find out what is really going on if it is working or not. host: to watch the documentary are in tune into your little pbs station tonight at 10:00 p.m. eastern time, president biden, michael carr, thank you for the conversation . michael: my pleasure greta. thank you. tomorrow, the capital, joe biden will be sworn in as a 46 the president of the united states. sitting on the same platform or just two weeks ago, a group of trump supporters rioted and forced their way into the capital. president-elect joe biden will take the oath of office and deliver its inaugural address in their usual circumstances. the smaller crowds due to covid-19 restrictions . and security just concerns . what her life, on the coverage on historic inauguration for joe

biden and kamala harris . starting at 7:00 a.m. eastern including live coverage of president trump's departure from washington as a boards force one for the last time as president rated antimilitary review is tradition which honors the peaceful transfer of power to a new commander-in-chief. followed by former president bush. in the clinton and obama. joining president biden at arlington cemetery for an presidential escort to the white house . live coverage of inauguration day . on c-span and cspan.org or listen live on the c-span radio app. booktv on "c-span2" top nonfiction books and authors every weekend. saturday at 4:00 p.m. eastern, in his book the fbi way, former fbi assistant director for counterintelligence . on the organization standards and how it operates read and then if i

15, epidemiologist talks about her god, viral yes. medical lifts and why we offer them. i'll and sunday, and on p.m. eastern on afterwards, and they discuss the book, three wise men navy seal, a green beret and how the brain brother became a survivor. there interviewed by author and journalist la kennedy. watching tv, this weekend on "c-span2". american history tv on c-span three. exploring the people and events that have the american story every weekend . coming up this weekend, saturday at 2:00 p.m. eastern. history maker the conversation between founder and president, giuliani richardson and "fox news" political analyst. sunday, at 2:00 p.m. eastern, history maker series continues. with college presidents and

review president. history of african-american education and the importance of the university. and on real america, in light of the recent attack on the u.s. capital, watch on the united states government, and american democracy which offers civic lessons on how the government works. at 6:30 p.m. eastern, author nathaniel talks about his book in the heart of the siege of the tragedy of the welsh of evans about the 1820 sinking of the ship following a firm well attack in the crew. in a p.m. eastern on the presidency, will expect farewells and inaugurations of previous presidents. bill clinton, george w. bush, dwight eisenhower, john kennedy, and ronald reagan. exporting the american story. watch american history tv. this weekend, on c-span three. >> earlier today senate majority leader mitch mcconnell talked about the anywhere attac o