>> welcome. tonight we are focusing on the complicated centuries old relationship between america and iran with experts with america in iran before introducing me briefly introduce myself with their brooklyn historical society and with those in history in the world and activities are

first free public programs to their programming arms and the next few weeks with naomi klein. and many others i hope you go to the website to explore what's coming up. first we will plan the chat locally at the candy bookstore here in brookland and then to share your questions throughout the program john

born in iran and raised in los angeles with a doctorate in history appearing in newsweek and the new york times the iranian-american and writer and the author of three books in iran and the ayatollah bags to differ with the new yorker to "vanity fair" and many other publications and a contributor to nbc news and and new york city want to welcome you both and thank you so much and they turn it over

to you. >> thank you for that lovely introduction. >> good to see you. >> thank you for having me. >> you are wearing a jacket and i am wearing a tie so before us we can be a professional. >> and we are both wearing pants. [laughter] i know i am. so with this terrific new book it's very timely given the idea the fireman to be in the forefront with the united states and before we get into the book it felt like a story to me and that academic tone

felt like you are telling a story that we know from your book and anyone paying attention did not start and 79. and with that person ambassador i did not know it back that is a fascination what made you write this book. >> and just to say thank you. thank you to everyone.

and to call it face to face a really enjoy the ayatollah bonus for starting out and it is a real privilege and looking forward to the conversation. >> my pleasure. >> by the way he felt like it read like a story that is important to me but it's something i would always try i'm a big believer that we have a responsibility to tell a story. we are uniquely positioned to do that because that is what we do if we can bring those human stories to life and that

would be valuable and those other people did not know about before but and an enjoyable story as well. >> and to be one year old. two oh go outside london and in high school me move to los angeles think i had a single iranian friend and in some weird way to be on the east coast in rhode island on the uk to be like.

not as much as you have obviously that in the early british history for british travelers that is when the interest began and was september 112,001 i want to say being iranian didn't mean anything to me but it wasn't what i was interested in pursuing intellectually. and about african politics and

i am a historian so what about the history of the country? and those as as well. so that's how this came about. my background is similar to yours. >> my father was a diplomat and we moved around going to american schools and a boarding school in england in the back in the states. and when i was growing up iran, am i a classmate you know what iran was. they didn't care it was not the news practically ever less you are following foreign

relations it was not on anyone's radar. somebody heard the persian empire but we study greeks and romans not the persian empire it wasn't commonly known. after the revolution suddenly everyone knew. then there was a long history to be allies and friends and a fascination getting into this in the book telling me about the very beginning. how did it start that was a thousand miles away how did this fascination begin? >> a part of the history that

is absolutely fascinating. they all began around 1940 because before pearl harbor the us was an isolationist power. there was no strategic us interest so the feeling was why study the relationship? that is a problematic way to look at history with the history of relations only begins when the us is interested and so just how much we miss when we do that and for 90 years heading back

to 1850 iran was interested to get more involved. the us wasn't really interested but just because washington wasn't interested but the mere fact that successive iranian governments want to have a relationship with united states to send a message to the british and russian empire to interfering with the fed and that consternation among with that third alliance in the united states is a country they kept turning to. why? because they believe that the us as a country that had a revolution against the british empire against imperialism wanted understand the us seem

to be a country that didn't care about empire is that they admire the fact the form policy but also in and politically in many ways. but not to have the embassy in tehran. and then to build schools and clinics in the government wasn't interested in and the more i learned about america and the very first disagreement us and iran hands with each other is in the 18 fifties. this went on for several years and then to negotiate and in 1851 they tried to begin negotiated to come to an

agreement in 1856 budget them longer to negotiate than the jcpoa. what were they arguing about? get this. but one of the real sticking points and they said no we don't want to tell you what to do it actually requested american warships in the persian gulf and not with those entangling alliances. and this is where the relations begin with that

diplomatic relations it makes us unique like printer russia or many other european powers and with that diplomatic with that missionary. >> and there is a fascination with persia. which was prettier than ran. magically after the revolution

look like a fascinating place with the headscarf covered women but there was a fascination in the 17 hundreds where you start your book. and then the educated ones what was the impetus? to seek that out? >> this blew my mind i never expected this. but looking at the first newspapers published in north america before the us even existed. twenty or 30 percent of the weekly newspapers one

newspaper said we regret we have no news this week. that was the headline in philadelphia. the leading the story you don't expect to find that. the reasons for that are complex but iran was a big international story there was a big rebellion against the persian empire. and they were trying to force the afghans. but americans assumed that they must have been colluding to support the evil empire. and because they were rivals

then the enemy must be my friend. and the fact they were shia interviewed by the majority made them even more appealing. and then to describe that rivalry is a conflict between muslims and persians which is such an interesting way to describe it. and then to be in control of the religious side. and puritans especially in new england with the true and a literal word of god. when you open of the bible

then you have cyrus the breeding the jews in captivity and the three magi's that is plural for the priest probably iranian. so iran looks good in the bible. and the ottomans are seen to have inherited that. the very first american missionary 100 years later this was like the garden of eden. it was somewhere around northern iraq and they began

slightly east of eden so there was no threat to christian europe. so many ways it seems this slightly exotic kingdom that they hate it. but that mentality is still with us in the 1970s that the way americans talk about the shaw and the pro- american and exotic kingdom with this troublesome arab world. and the iranians have their own version but i will stop. >> that is fascinating with the idea the newspaper would have to apologize. today we have to apologize for having too much news. but do you think there was a.

with the general population may be from world war ii the general image of a man for americans that all the way into the seventies. because we were not in america back then. but there was a point at which iranian started to view americans in my curiosity in your research that they started to see america is not quite the benevolent force it was in 1944 or 53? but in world war ii how the us

along with russia and those great powers were outlined because of the war the shot in time of his favor of the sun to be pro- german. and sympathetic. >> that is three or four questions. >> was there ever a golden age? >> i set up the book in the beginning by 1979 and the hostage crisis and iranians have its own version i don't

want to focus too much on that. and to be critical of us policy. you mentioned in 1953 as a time when everything changed and those among the middle class but then the very people that should have been most from america and were. but what is interesting everything changed after 1953. it is this implicit and tell

me in what way and most people can't do that. the idea that they look better at some point? i thank you could talk about that. the closest thing we ever came to the golden age. in very familiar and your family as well. and with that diplomacy and so forth. he was ambassador to the us in the early twenties and loved going around with all these talented in middle america. so i was reminded of that.

and most iranians with the wild west cops and robbers john wayne the prosperous place that seem benign in a lot of ways and with those ideals of the 19 twenties that were pro- american on the streets of iran in 1819 and that is extraordinary just to think it's a few hundred years ago. >> that was way too long of a question i apologize for that but the area that more people are aware of but between 44 and 53 with the young shaw was

completely inexperienced he was only 20 years old. so in that short. i know for a fact america was still considered a great place by the educated class of the upper-middle-class. people per to buy chevrolet if they could were washing machines. or whatever they did or refrigerators. and the bowling alley was the hot place to go.

so there was that section for america itself. and there was is always dissent by the clerics and religious classes they seem that went back into the forties as well sorry to make it long. >> so in the 18 forties it's a fascinating. most americans don't know this with the us occupied iran in the first large-scale interaction 30000 us gis were stationed as part of the persian gulf command with those british positions using

the railway. those stationed in iran and then they get drunk and all they were very dignified. and to say with a 19 sixties and happens gradually. the middle class to be, fully illusion and that the united

states finds itself in a very awkward position. with those three main opposition to the shaw. and then the liberal democrats with those religious radicals but all three of these were very angry with the shop by the seventies. that is the special reason. but then the hard left will hate the united states. and then for obvious reasons.

and it is the actual embodiment so those religious figures many had been pro- soviet anti- american but in the new generation of leftist to be much more radical.