continues. host: we are back with a chair the biotechnology innovation organization and ceo here to talk about vaccine manufacturing. let's remind our viewers what

your organization is. >> good morning greta. biotechnology innovation taken an organization about 1000 companies. how do we drive access and secondarily and that is underpinning biotechnology. and those that have people and then to discuss on congress the president and others one of the most important points about it this industry delivers 70 percent in the world so it is a really

important part of the industrial infrastructure. >> your reaction quick. in support those intellectual protections with the trade representative it is a global health crisis and those extraordinarily circumstances calling for extraordinary measures. with the strong protection but in service of this pandemic to support the waiver of those for covid-19 vaccines. what is the impact on the biotech industry? >> what is the impact? >> weaving patents does not stop the pandemic. what you have to do is get shots into arm as fast as

possible.nl that is just a tiny step along a very long journey we could estimate roughly to take 18 months before any kind of waiver to have any impact around the rest of the world. if we ever have a hope the stopping this pandemic we need to ramp up immediate production of those facilities of high quality and then to export these vaccines at a price that isho affordable that is what will make a difference weaving the patents will not do that you have to train the

people and then set in place a very complicated supply chain and then thehe vaccine we're using most prominently in the united states it is very effective to do the job and the bottom line is they also require is called chain which means you have to keep the vaccines at lower temperature with the right kind of refrigerator. i cannot imagine in the middle east and africa or asia with that quality and capability to distribute these kinds of vaccines even to manufacture them in time and they cannot. bottom line it is a patent

waiver itself to have a disappointingte step that will confuse people and it will give them hope it is a false hope better way to go is to ramp up manufacturing to get the shots into the arm immediately. >> how much money did these companies spend on research and how much could they potentially lose i lifting the intellectual patents? >>es these vaccines it wasn't any one individual company billions of dollars have been invested in industries between 20 or 30 years which has led to the capability last year so

that intensive investment gone over many years was brought to fruition those particular companies like pfizer and those in germany could build on that information and then they invested billions of dollars not just with the research but also in manufacturing the us government helps them i contracting to buy the product but the bottom line is the research that's done is cumulative in many billions of dollars to begin with and then subsequently the investments by private investors this leads to the mrna vaccine.

j&j itself launched a vaccine approach based on years of investment that j and j itself were invested so it could come to the table with a similar vaccine. with regard of what it might mean in the top line of these companies because the top line of last year modernity said it would be willingng to waive patents and license and provide vaccines to others it is not at all clear what the word use in the long-term. in the short term the industry suffers because what happens people lose confidence the investments cancer companies diabetes companies and others

making novel breakthroughs of the same kind we see here that have occurred in the pandemic that investors take a double look and say wait what i invested in a company if the government will step in to take in the patents to allow me toin have that certainty we are investing in something that could give us a good return long-term? it's incalculable at the end of the day it could cause companies to slow down say ich or others to don't want toth invest in this area and that would be very disappointing so actually what is important ispl we understand what we are trying to accomplish which is shots in the arm.

host: a robust pharmaceutical industry if they have waivers they can probably start manufacturing rapidly. >> many countries don't have this. countries like china, japan, russia and the european union. of course they have the ability to start to manufacture no doubt about that. but the real question is that would they be able to do it to get the shots in the arm and they have a bride capacity in this country and we could get it to them? pandemics to wait on - - don't wait for anybody but in addition what about the other countries? china for a long time is trying to get his hands on this technology why are we

trying to provide to a nation that has u been trying to get this technology from us on a plate? it is core to the strategic effort of biotechnology. and then to send out all all sorts of messages. a better way to get it out to the other countries. and then sanded a broad. >> . >> and the fda approved the use for use in what is the

take away? >> very good news. >> and then to mutate. but with any part of the population they start to change naturally with those disasters. meant to rise from that mutation. and then to be sure that type of opportunity to change does not arise. so this is great news. and then to ensure that kids they can go to parties and meet others and you can

prevent clearly. and that the virus is not given a safe haven and then to address a segment of the population. but every illness is a tragedy. but at the same time you can start to remove the virus. and that is a very big deal. >> . >> and the vaccines currently? >> that what we do know in

south africa, india, great britain. every time. every time if you give a chance to this virus, it takes it. there are several kinds of mutation. there are other that we have seen in india and it is spreading superfast. - - v superfast. spreading very quickly throughout the united states. and then to become more infectious and other that we don't want to see. because it can hurt more

people. so the more we can crush back the hotspot. not even remotely the right thing but you need to crush it now. and then to turn a corner into aan bad place. host: but these variants and those that were vaccinated? >> . >> and with that small percentage and what it is very important to have a significant amount and that

the death rates go down to have a far lower incident of a core outcome on - - a poor outcome of any kind. but they do appear to be fighting against and that is important to understand with pfizer and motor now with the mrna. to pivot on iodine to tackle the new variant if they could come along and then to try to manage new variants. >> so kurt wants to know what are the profit margins for

pfizer and t4? >> i don't know we shed have a talk to the companies. i don't follow that specifically. but i do know something. that without the investment those companies made they would be shut down. and did they make money have it oner - - out of it. i hope they do. but if they were not here what they be doing? people that were old would be dying. what is the price of that? listen very carefully to the statement of the ceos of modern a - - moderna

astrazeneca and pfizer they are not out to make a profit. some of these companies have said they are willing to send the product a broad summer of out of contract. and from my perspective for profits are not profits. for all other listeners of what would have happened? who would have done it? >> nobody. >>caller: good morning doctor. my question is you mentioned

to the key to controlling the pandemic is create more vaccine to ship it to other countries but also not having the refrigerator to keep it and the temperature so do you think we should push for the release of johnson & johnson? you also mentioned the one that discover the process of the messenger rna. >> great comments. and right on target. a better investment of time is how do we set up distribution

and all of these nations so we are sure in the very impoverished parts of africa all across the middle east they can get the right kind of vaccinegh of high quality not a fake vaccine they happen to be knockoffs or fake so be very clear we need a high quality that we put into our arms. the investment of time and effort with that safe kind of distribution those machines that could be manufactured quickly you can make the

refrigerators superfast with a high quality vaccine. we should all take our hats off of the very solid and interesting results. you are right can we encourage the's companies to do what they do the ceo of j&j since 1947 with a said they would treat everybody what matters is the patienter as far as i am concerned the practical steps he putut your finger exactly on it how do we get them out there a and in a way that we ensure and the lady that actually discovered this

vaccine at the mrna facts on —-dash vaccination i sure hope she does get compensation if you read her story will find out for a long time what she wasne considered to be doing was never feasible. how do you create the artificial mrna that does not cause the body to react against mrna? but she figured i it out. it is great. >> good morning and welcome to the conversation. >> good morning. the drug companies are willing to give this to their patent but how much the politicians think they will gain everything they do they see a

dollar in their pockets they will not do anything to help the people. i just want to know how many do it for the good of america in the world? thank you. >> i apologize i did not hear your name. but good morning to you. one of the most remarkable things of thehe biotech industry is people go into work every day and they fail what keeps them going every day? literally. i've been there for 30 years what is so amazing to have the experiment and it doesn'tan work.o what motivates the next day and every single one was to

find so the most remarkable thing of this industry is not like making a sandwich you don't know what will come out of your every day and biotech you think about how you run nine experiment. let me test this out, will that work i cannot tell you because the vast majority of their experiments fail. so what makes you get up in the morning to go to work? exactly are point. host: if you recovered from covid 18 withh the antibodies

do you only need the booster shot? >> that don't know yet but the recommendation is to take both. 114 americans are vaccinated that's a huge number and we believe that this is another 132 million have the infection the numbers you are seeking i don't have that. and with those who have been vaccinatedo they will that the that is not clear so every

year i think we all should expect and know it is coming but should you only have one vaccine booster you had covid before it's not clear but it will be. >> if you have antibodies are you more sick with the vaccine? >> i don't think that's necessarily the case. it's's the timing. there is a period of time before you actually have the vaccine some people are taking into account the best way to prevent is then have the

vaccine. a lot has gone into that. >> will that alter your dna? >> that is a myth it cannot possibly do that. i don't know where this came from to be perfectly honest but the reality is it is a complete impossibility. the reason why because it is scientific and very straightforward. what the mrna vaccine do, they actually contain a fragment of is what is in the virus your body hijacks the machinery to

make that piece of the virus. only that piece and what your body is hijacked for a period of time is a small fragment that is manufactured that little spike that we have seen in your body reacts against it but there iss no possible way these vaccines can change your dna because it doesn't have the machinery to do it. host: cares - - - can it impact your fertility quick. >> a strange and very odd myth that i don't know where it came from. anybodyma saying that is trying to make a point is a myth. it is false. the data shows categorically with a wonderful set of collections that basically describeses all of the papers over the last year it is rich

set of data and there is evidence that even comes close to indicating may be a has an effect on fertility. not even remotely real. host: the reason you are next. >>caller. >> i had covid i'm fully vaccinated. but then withmu herd immunity what is the problem? and then social media telling them not to take the shot they will do what they want to do. but i want to go to the gym. i can't go back to the gym

they don't enforce the mask or to be vaccinated. host: what is the number we need to get to a herd immunity to get back to normal and go to the gym without a mask? >> good morning i'm glad to be talking to you. you are one of the folks who know what covid can do. congratulations you have had your vaccine. you are not only helping yourself that everyone else as well it's a pleasure to talk to you. with regard to herd immunity, this is a very important consideration. for those who has studied pandemics and epidemics, we know for example with measles

you need somewhere north of 95 percent of the population vaccinated and or immune. fortunately everyone has behaved well. that occasional that a flareup happens but we have that under control and then we don't have polio. we have herd immunity so where are we today with the possibility of herd immunity? folks like gerald are helping in other words we had roughly 114 million people have been vaccinated we know at least 132 million have their first

dose. probably close to the estimates of a very respected researcher 110 millionr other people have hadad covid. so if we take that and totality roughly 50 percent or little more at 60 percent, we don't know exactly if it is 90 percent or 80 percent. doctor fauci estimates you need between 70 and 85 percent of people having been infected are vaccination. the good news is we are getting there.

so we can take an example that israel nearly 60 percent of everybody have been vaccinated and it's pretty evident they don't see any death there people are not wearing masks they still wear masks face to face because they are being sensible but they are going to the s gym and behaving in a way that is very sensible. if you take the lesson from israel, the first time there was a death to be a part of 60 or 70 percent of people who are vaccinated or have had covid you are getting close to it to doctor fauci said i believe we are very close. very close. host: new jersey go ahead.

>>caller: interesting conversation. i appreciate it. doctor you have a very smooth presentation. something i was great to hear mentioning polio thinking of doctor jonas salk who upon completion of his work simply put it out for the world to benefit from. the profit motives not for the planet but we must remember the american people also kicked in $1 billion towards the development of these vaccines. we must be conscious of what

is stimulating best saidd what should be put out there for the benefit of humanity. i remember one scientist for the completion of their work put it out there. motive took over, everybody was kicked to the side profit motive is paramount. i am a defender of israel -- host: we are running out of time but dr. levin, according to the government accountability office, johnson & johnson received a one billion manufacturing award and maternal was 1.2 billion astrazeneca, 1.2

billion, novavax 1.6 and pfizer nearly 2 billion. guest: absolutely. >> absolutely. take a look at what it takes to scale up and the kinds of infrastructure that you need much of that money was used not just to invest in manufacturing and distribution so be careful about the terminology that one is using. with regard to development, they did not receive money to develop that what the government did which was fantastic to speed up and ensure the fda could review the materials very quickly. but the comment is very important.

i would like to return to that you are 100 percent right. if we have a world in which you and i i and the government pay for the people to research and then our motivation was nothing to do with profit, then indeed it is fantastic and would be an ideal world but unfortunately what we have created in america as an engine that stimulates innovation part of that o engine is the requirement we invested in companies to get them to do things. i understand that quite frankly that is what drives every single industry unless you will completely change the totality of how we work as a

society then looking at people to do things part of that is like you and me we believe in doing good we want people to benefit we will donate time and effort. but when it comes to investing in new technology, who will take the risk coming out on the other side? he only way to do that is to have investors who want to return because they have to raise money to prove to their investors they are worthwhile for investing is notot like the government these are individuals folks who are taking money out ofhe their pocket to make something happen that nobody believesdy could happen. today we have incredible

development called them you know inc. one - - immuno oncology the way we harness the white cells of the body to attack and kill cancer. that is a revolution. it is half of all the investment of the pharmaceutical industry goes into this in 2009 nobody believed in it and they thought it was a wacky idea. there was no evidence that it worked. one company continued to think about how they would tackle this incredible idea to stop cancer from hiding from your white cells let them do the job to attack the cancer

that's why it's called immuno oncology. meaning white cells and cancer. this company was bought by bristol-myers squibb. the reason why they spend that amount of money was to say how can we answer the question to tackle this incredibly importantor question we will spend two.$3 billion and by this company to see if we cannot conquer cancer. no governmentep stepped in. no public goods stepped in. but the intent was conquer cancerth. they bought that 2009. nobody believed indy it. but because of that acquisition, today we have a very real possibility we have

cures for cancer. and with that, i really agree perhaps that is uim and say i wish in thel ideal world we all took out of our pockets and we took these chances that you and i both know that will not happen nobody will take a chance except the rare person who is willing to in for them they deserve a return. they deserve the return and industry lives by that every day investing and crazy ideas that may not work but if they do they need a return otherwise how do you stimulate this in the future? are we willing to u give up new cancer discoveries? that conquer diabetes or

alzheimer's? and by the way who will invest for the next pandemic? it will come. who will find the next discovery there. host: to find out more about the industry follow the organization on twitter chair and ceo doctor levin thank you for the conversation. >> thank you very much