and alex marlow of breitbart news with a critical look at mainstream media. find full schedule information online@booktv.org online at booktv.org or consult your program guide. >> welcome everybody to the institute of politics andro glol affairs at cornell university's book and author series sponsored by bernard schwartz. tonight, "madam speaker: nancy pelosi and the lessons of power" written by susan page. will have a nice conversation with susan page. she will be interviewed by chris rybak and myself and then we'll throw it open to your own questionss about 7:35. want. want to welcome our friends at c-span who are with us this evening as we tape and for those you are unfit with the institute of politics at cornell we have one very simplee mission, that s to deepen discourse and raise understanding on complex issues in a bipartisan way. the forward begin a little bit of housekeeping if i may. on may 12 at 7, we're featuring

a program on education and politics setting the stage for the 2021 elections and 2022 electionsti featuring congresswoman rosa delauro, and anna greenberg. at 7 p.m., navigating international hostage situations, a collaboration with the richardson center for governor bill richardson will join us. we hope you gote to www.i/o pga cornell or just google cornell politics and you can register. during this evening a few distance guess. former carson john barrow from georgia, martin frost from texas, former chairman of the state republican committee, tompkins county legislator martha robertson, cornell is located in the county.nt the president of the afl-cio richard trumka, great keiser, chair of the executive committee of the cornell board of trustees

and a member of the board of trustees becky robertson. and now to our guests this evening. my co-moderated ass always is chris reback, the host of chris reback conversation and publishers chris reback newsletter which i made up my former colleagues in congress the as absolute essential in getting through the clutter and denniston what's really going on in the world. you can sign up for the newsletter. chris is also the cofounder of good guys media ventures and host a podcast on politics. science, education, arts, his political wire conversations has been ranked number three in itunes news. and a very special guest this evening, susan page, award-winning washington bureau chief, "usa today" where she writes about politics and th white house, covered seven white house administrations, 11 presidential elections, indicate

that the past ten ten presi. she supported from six continents, i don't know what would you k want on the seventh. i don't know what happened to the seventh continent, dozens of foreign countries and and i0 she moderated the vice president debate between mike pence and, hairs. before we get to the first question put to take a point of personal privilege about this book. i as many people know i chaired the democratic congressional campaign committee and whether it's me or any other chair of dccc that position is regarded as nancy pelosi's chief political lieutenant, and with that position comes the responsibility of really getting to know her. on a typical day i had one meeting with nancy pelosi on a more typical day three meetings with nancy pelosi four, five meetings come many very often the last voice i heard at the end of the long day was not my wife's butt nancy pelosi's on the phone. i thought i knew more about her

than anybody else. i'll be honest with you, when i was telling susan this in the green room, when i first picked up the book i was skeptical. i said what could i possibly learn from this book? what i don't know how to spend as much time as they did with her. i learned more about nancy pelosi from this book than i knew about her from my interactions serving with her as chair of dccc. i could not recommend this book. if you want to understand the dimensions of nancy flows h tragic, or impulses come her strategic to come for to come her personal commitments, relationship shared with familyl you must g this book. we will post the link to get it several times during the next hour or so. susan page thank you so much for joining us this evening. >> it is such a pleasure to be withsu you. i should know personal that my husband is a proud graduate of cornell, so very excited i'm

speaking at your institute. i knew institute is doing great and now the work for our democracy. i very much appreciate your words about my book. i do want to out my sources but i did have an excellent source whose initials were steve israel. redit goes to you you interviewed 150 people and spoke with nancy pelosi ten times including some of the most complex and challenging days she had in the leadership that you actually found a house record in 1963 disclosed they paid $106 a

week and spending $49 a week arguably you know more about nancy pelosi than anybody else, maybe even more than nancy pelosi knows about her so with all of that information, what opinion did you have of nancy pelosi prior to the book that changed after the process? >> i'm not sure that my view ever changed so much, but it deepened. i will tell you one of the big surprise is in researching this book it wasn't the influence of her father who was, and many people don't realize this her father was the legendary larger-than-life mayor of baltimore born into political royalty, the daughter who was a woman way ahead of her time and

told me that if her mother was born today, she would be president of the united states. she was smart and ambitious and restless. she was a big risk taker. she had a regular spot and there were times when her husband the mayor would go to the restaurant to pay off the bookies. she was the keeper of the file, which was exactly what it sounds like which was her husband's political operation that he gave to constituents which was repaid on election day. she was so partisan that this is it sounds like a long story but i will make it short, 1984, reagan is going to come to italy to build a statute.

you would think they would say yes. after all the things ronald reagan said, don't let him come near us. the white house is so concerned they call her son who was himself a former mayor to ask if his mother posed an actual physical threat to ronald reagan. that tells you something about the partisan route of nancy pelosi. >> you talk about how when nancy and her husband paul moved to san francisco with their children, they cannot find an apartment. tremendous pressure trying to find where they live and they finally find the perfect apartment until they find out that the landlord is going to washington. talk about that.

>> so, they had four little children. they tried to find the perfect house. it's got a swing set, it's in the right place. they are about to sign the lease when they say why is this house available to rent and she says my husband got an appointment by richard nixon and that's why we are moving to washington and nancy pelosi said i can't rent a house that became available because richard nixon was elected and she wouldn't rent the house. it needed some work and that is how strong her politics are. when she was a little girl her father took him to the polling places fc often did and a worker tried to get this little girl a stuffed elephant as a toy and she wouldn't take it because even then she knew what

elephants stood for. >> i noted that you mentioned how some will look at the back to see if and one of the names of the former representatives that are listening is a gentleman that is named in susan's book i like to start these conversations at the beginning and you've mentioned a remarkable once upon a time there was an incredible young girl named nancy and it's a great tail but you've also written about power and everyone i talked to who wants to know about nancy pelosi remarks on her power, her use of power and

what we want to know is where does it come from, what is the essence of her power and also may be could you talk about the different facets of it and that struck me in the way that you describe the way that she engaged with three different presidents, george bush, obama and then trump and the way she employee the different types of power with each of them so talk to me please about nancy pelosi and power. >> i kept changing the title of the book. it had the different titles and finally ended up with the lessons of power. every title i had had the word power because one of the distinguishing things about nancy pelosi is how comfortable she is with power. she has no qualms about power. it is just a trait that is rare

among the politicians and even more among women who get into politics so at ease with amassing power and a long time friend of ours, congressional correspondent about a decade ago he wrote a profile and described her as an iron fist and i think that is just about the perfect description of nancy pelosi's use of power because she does have a -- she can be very persuasive [inaudible] she has an iron fist and i thought this actually myself in the ninth interview i did with her i did ten in all and in the ninth interview i was asking her

about something she didn't want me to put in the book. she said you shouldn't do this in the book and i said actually it should be for this reason and she started to display the iron fist. she didn't raise her voice and she didn't threaten me but she did somehow get bigger like she started out five for five and by the end of the conversation about 6-foot two and she asked such questions that forced me to articulate the position and we got to the end of the interview and i hadn't relented either and i told her i thought it should be in the book and it is. it was about 3:00 in the afternoon i drove home, poured a

glass of wine, crawled into bed and watched reruns for a couple hours until i felt a little better. i can only imagine being a member of congress and having an exchange of much greater importance than this one with nancy pelosi's iron fist. >> steve how many glasses of wine did you have two drink as a result of nancy pelosi's power? >> she will wear you down. that is one of her talents she will stay in the rain for you for as long as she needs to. there's a wonderful photograph of her father with eleanor roosevelt and you talk about the relationship with her father and her father just as an extraordinary powerbroker, streetfighter, mayor of baltimore, former congressman, but then there is a quote in the book i would like to share to

get your perspective. after she became the most powerful woman in the history of the country, she said her children have been more influential in shaping the leader that she became that her parents, quote, i was forced by my children having five children in six years and understanding the difference in personalities from one to the next is a real lesson. >> i know parents that have school age kids now during covid understand the skills obtained by running a household. she says it requires the same skills as being speaker of the house in washington in that you try to impose order in chaos. you are dealing with grievances both real and imagined and try to convince sometimes unreasonable people to stop doing what they are doing and do

whatever it is you want to do. you have these shifting alliances and with five kids you could imagine sometimes it is for-to and sometimes even. very much like in congress. this is an argument that as you know from when you were recruiting candidates to run for congress when you were head of the d triple c she would consider running and they would say didn't have the right experience, their experience was mostly in the home, and i believe, tell me if this is right, she would tell them the same story that the skills you gain by being a mother or not dissimilar from what you need to bring to washington. did you hear her make that argument? >> many times, and it usually worked. before i send it over there was

a famous quote that speaker pelosi used in a white house meeting with president trump when he began yelling at her one of them please don't characterize the strength of the meeting but another was more directed at the experiences. >> where she said i recognize a temper tantrum when i see one. she came back with a meeting and shrugged off the fact that he had -- i recognize a temper tantrum when i see one. i can tell you i don't know what he said when he heard her say that but i am sure it was because she did have an ability to get under his skin. there is another famous exchange the two of them had a conversation in october, 2019 meeting in the cabinet room that was about syria but became a about impeachment and it's where she is standing up and jabbing

her finger at him in a table something i never heard of before he says you are a third rate politician and steny hoyer tells me if he heard trump say that apparently the remark was chasing to the politician. i am a fifth rate politician and you are not a politician at all. >> what i also liked about the planned that steve just made about nancy pelosi having learned from her children is the

circle from the parents and relationship and the fact her parents had i would have to expect a possible subtitle of the book to the apples don't fall far. can you take us back to 1950s baltimore because you paint a picture you bring this period the baltimore orioles and i think that is where she learned the benefits of being operational. i would love to hear about baltimore 1950s and as well the way that they used politics to operate to get things done, to create benefits for

constituents. take us back to that part. >> definitely a larger than life figure. when he was 13-years-old never went back and after he was a member of congress invited them back to the courtyard as an honorary diploma graduating from elementary school. he was so enamored that he named his first son thomas after himself and second son franklin and eleanor roosevelt so these were new deal politicians, people who believed in an extensive government and in some

ways a corrupt government as we might look at it today a city government that was known for patronage for one political boss who wanted to play and aid in a city job and the mayor said what can he do and the political boss said you can't really do much of anything and he said basically we have a blank slate but nancy pelosi continues to believe in a big and expensive government that especially in a time that like we have today in the wake of this terrible pandemic should be filling a big role in terms of providing a safety net for

people. >> you get in on your own terms, not anybody else's. she decides she's going to run for leader. no woman has ever been in a leadership position and decides she's going to kick the door open. can you talk about what that was like and her approach to that race in terms of timing and how she worked the caucus?

>> there was somebody waiting in line and that the democratic establishment for the job of the democratic with whenever it became open and that was steny hoyer who had been known since the days they were both working for senator brewster. she disputed the need to defer to the people who were waiting. this campaign announced before there was an opening and this involved millions of dollars in money raised. it was a brutal fight that left some scars that remained for a long time afterwards but the

fact that it's a secret ballot made it more complicated because somebody could tell you they were going to vote and then not do so. nancy pelosi demonstrated in that way her ability to count votes that has been one of her skills ever since when the vote was when the job finally came over and it was finally housed just after 9/11 in fact she is the one who won. >> there has been so much made of the supposed rivalry between pelosi and how detrimental it i have always viewed it as saying a problem when you have -- those are two heavy hitters. i thought it an advantage of democrats. chris? >> susan just mentioned, and steve you brought us to that. matt, you just mentioned 9/11, susan. and you write a lot about nancy pelosi's reaction at 9/11, and then even more about the iraq war and about pelosi's

relationship with george w. bush as we got into that war and then as thingse progressed. we lived out in a pretty toxic time of politics, but that was not a great relationship. and my reading of what you had to say is that it's maybe not all george bush is false. you may befall nancy pelosi somewhat responsible as well. was i reading that correctly? >> so nancy pelosi enormously skilled in negotiating this polarized time in our t politic, but i think critics would say that she didn't do very much to make the change to politics, to make it t less toxic. it's not that she created the situation in which we find ourselves with our government often being dysfunctional. it's that she worked in the world in which she was given, she didn't try to transform it.

she and george w. bush at the very difficult relationship. nancy pelosi was the highest ranking member of congress to oppose the iraq war from the start. i was actually thinking about that with the news today on liz cheney. liz cheney is taking a position now that is politically perilous with her own party. the smart money -- that was also true with the democratic y at the beginning of the t iraq r are democrats who wanted to run for president had presidential a person, almost to supported the war in its early days. that turned out to be something that was damagingin to them. in any case, , nancy pelosi, the highest ranking member of cards to oppose the war from the start, and when she was first elected to speak in large part because of the war, because of the 2006 election, republicans

had setbacks because of voter unhappiness over the war, she was convinced she was going to be able to persuade george w. bush to change course in iraq. she was unable to do that despite two years of d all the effort she could think of. and by the time of the 2008 financial meltdown, it had been months since they had talked, since the president and the speaker had hadal a conversatio. they started talking again only because the financial crisis really forced bipartisan action to try tot address it. >> steve, can ask, we've had the opportunity, steve, you and i, to talk about your vote in the run-up against the iraq war. as i was reading citizens telling about, and i have fear what you got nearly two-thirds of the democratic caucus voting no, right? 126-81. one of those 126 were steve

israel. steve, did nancy pelosi's argument hold any influence and -- let me ask you differently. how much influence the nancy pelosi's argument in your own decision to vote against the war? what did youin think of citizens telling about that part of the story? >> i thought it was as if susan was with us on the floor of the house we nancy posey expressed herself. i would say this and i'll be brief because this is about susan and will open up to questions. what are the reale skills and talents of nancy pelosi was not only knowing her caucus but knowing your district. and she knew that i represented a 9/11 district that my district had lost 200, over 200 of my constituents. she also knew that i was one of the most endangered incumbents elected to a republican seat in 2000, considered to be a one

term or. nobody thought including myself i would get reelected. i do remember speaking with her and her going through many of the arguments, and are saying look, we need to keep you here. nancy pelosi's brilliant because she knows how to count votes. she also knows how to keep democrats in congress, and so she threads a needle and i believe she did that with that vote, and others. we are going to open it up to questions and answers in just about five minutes. susan, i would ask you this. throughout the book to talk about this fixation with nancy pelosi's wardrobe. and these unfair headlines. one comes to mind, nancy pelosi not just another party girl, things like that. this obsession with what she's wearing and how she dresses, which i've never heard directed at any male politician i ever

remember in my 16 jews in congress, somebody commenting on my shoes -- 16 years in congress. congress. can you talk about those perceptions? >> i think she didn't worry about themm much. she was the subject of clearly sexist attacks and only way she ever lost it was when she ran for democratic chair after 1984 debacle with walter mondale who we lost so recently, may he rest in peace. .. .

and airhead as she is not about she lost that race anyway and she complained about it to the reporters and about i think she decided it was not useful to respond. so there was a strength that she developed in the wake of that loss that she would use to this day. that is, don'tagonize, organize . though people would come and say i can't believe they're saying these things about you . of the millions of dollars of attacks that have beenwaged on her by republicans in the years since then . she says don't agonize, organize. >> let's have natalie give instructions for folks who want to ask questions. i want to remind everybody we are with madam speaker nancy

pelosi with don't agonize, don't organize but also no one ever gives you power, you must. another one of her mexicans. sponsored by the cornell university institute of politics and global affairs. when we give people instructions on how to pose questions ? >> if you have questions you can write them at the q and a long. we will take questions if you prefer, ask her question like but you can also use the raise hand function at the bottom of the screen. >> while skewing up, chris, went to pose a question. >> i want to follow on susan, you were talking about tax attacks on nancy posey to ask you about this other politician whose name escapes me he spent four years attacking nancy policy recently. it's such a striking linefrom your book . at this point obviously with

donald trump in office policy has been the highest ranking american woman in politics twice. she's got the affordable care act. she did the bailout and so many things that had been accomplished and yet you write it was her ability to stand up to the president donald trump that finally made nancy pelosi would be underestimated no more. was donald trump good for nancy pelosi? >> donald trump had a big impact on nancy pelosi and on the arc of her life because not many people i think were aware of this she had been planning to retire after the 2016 election. she assumed like so many of us that someone was going to be elected and she could count on hillary clinton to protectthe affordable care act which she was most proud of . she was 76 years old and that would be retirement agebut on election night , she, when

she realized a little earlier than the rest of us that was going to win the election he described it as feeling like she was being kicked by a mule. she said that was not a b metaphor. she felt physically like she was being kicked by a mule and she decided not to stayin power . he felt so close friends to the things she cares about like the affordable care and also a threat to democracy itself.that was a concern grew greater and greater and greater over time and really reached its apex with the january 6 attack on the capital. and it trumps ascension kind of made democrats and everyone else aware of some of the skills she had been displaying through her career in the legislature that not everyone and recognized. one of the ways she sees

power is the way she gives credit. he's very careful to give credit to others and she gave credit to barack obama for the affordable care disaster. we went down affordable without morocco, we wouldn't have had horrible care act without nancy policy is that her privacy, her skills, her ability to hold democrats together and focus more long-term strategic politics against this disruptive president, i think that has been thecapstone of her career . >> natalie, let's take take questions. >> so we have a phone number for anyone that has a question. chris, if you could unmute please and go ahead and ask the question. >> former democratic congressman from pennsylvania ns mark chris. >> it's good to be here.

susan, thank you so much for writing this book but my question is more i guess historical in flavor. it's that i happen to be in the woodlands when nancy pelosi gave her presentation yoand said in fayette county i southwestern pennsylvania you reference that in your book . i'm just curious to hear more about unfortunately my time there was so quick . i was quite, i was so busy i never really got a chance to sit down with the speaker and talk about her relationship with jack martha and i'd be curious to hear from you what she shared . you. >> thanks so much thanks for joining us tonight. she's not a particularly openly emotional person. she's pretty disciplined and kind of garden. but one way i tried to

convince her to be more candid with me was i would bring her stuff i discovered in doing research for her biography and one of the things i've done the archive at the university of pittsburgh where jack murtha's papers including some handwritten notes he had made about his thoughts on nancy pelosi. these were notes he made when he was going to write a memoir which he never did. >> from those who don't know who jack murtha is maybe you can get a little bit of explanation . >> of course you're right. although we've got such a smart elite audience i'm sure they won't object. nancy pelosi is a san francisco liberal, jack murtha is the guy from coal country and a member of the old guard in congress not exactly a natural ally of nancy policy but the two of

them came friends and allies and one of the big assets he had when she sought a leadership position was that murtha agreed to run his campaign. this was a huge blow to steny hoyer by the way so i'm looking for these papers as to why he was willing to do this is that a lot of old guys were reluctant to have as leader. he would probably as an old she was perspective leader as she he had ever met. i made a copy of these, these things, this was a tablet, this was not some fancy thing , this was written in red on the cheek tablet. copy and your policy the next

time i was interviewing her, was about as emotional as i saw her get thinking about jack murtha and his thoughts about her. >> next question. >> we have a question written from tracy medrano . she writes looking so closely at the speakers light experience as a in politics, be you think that it will any easier for women to operate in congress or does every generation reach these obstacles? >> that's such a great question and again i'm honored to have someone who had run for congress listening to this conversation. i'd be curious about your view but in my view he made a difference. she's now been a woman who has served enin this position

of great authority more effectively than any other figure in modern times. i think you have to go back to sam raburn speaker who had been as effective as nancy pelosi has been in that office and have to send a message to women who want to see positions of leadership, two young women who are thinking about a career in politics. two little girls are thinking about running and they look up and see ruth bader ginsburg has been a supreme court justice nancy policy as is the house so yes, i. >> so overwhelmingly our questions are coming in. if you have any insight on the speakers future, if she's looking to the senate or a presidential run if you give us any insight ? >> in 2018 when democrats ran for the house was a contested

leadership. there was interest from house democrats to do a new generation of leadership and at that point nancy pelosi made an offer she would serve serve two more terms which this would be her last virus as a member of the leadership . interestingly when i went back and i this was never put into the democratic world. it's not a law. you can't make her do it she has made sure next statement about what her plans are earlier this year he did acknowledge that members made this offer and she indicated that she plans to live up to that. that would make this our last term. it's dangerous anything to clearly in politics but my expectation is that this, these are her last two years as a leader last two years number of congress.

and what she plans next. i have a personal theory and isbased not so much on reporting . for what it's worth but i could see president by appointing her as ambassador to the vatican or as ambassador to italy where her grandparents immigrated from closing elements of her career. and one reason i think it's because romance or or one of her mentors was lindy barnes, the congresswoman from louisiana is after she left was appointed by president clinton after i. cindy wants daughter whatever regardless the roberts was somewhat interviewed for the before she passed away. and cokie said her mother would like that if nancy pelosi followed in her footsteps anyway.

>> we have question from ron asking if you please be on her fundraising abilities, methods recently. >> she is unparalleled at as a fundraiser. for all his will that she has raised 1 billion dollars since she was elected to the leadership. many for various democratic campaigns. nolan also come close to. >> fundraising has long been one of her strengths. one of the things he brings to the table. it's one that she's use to reward people. she's used it to a support. he used it. yetdemocrats . astounding. >> i'm going to call on somebodythat had their hand raised . i will correctly you go ahead and unmute your questions as me.

>> we will give howard a try, if you can on you and go ahead and ask your question . >> are you with us? all right, let's. >> what i did not put forth a question so i'llyield my time . next person. >> thank you howard. i'll go back to a question we had a bit earlier. our audience is asking if you might be able to prediction about who is likely to succeed nancy pelosi now that congress is in the house. >> you can still be a respected speaker but she's thinking about thepeople who are most often mentioned .

and as potential successors area i think one would be team jeffries, n congressman from new york. he would also be a groundbreaker, the first person of color to be either house, either party in either house of congress. there's some others, karen bass the congresswoman from california she's a former leader of the house. adam schiff has been interested in the leadership as well . so there are several people who i think would like this. there are 200 people who would like this job when policy leaves, there will be about. it will be a progressive one so then the leadership candidate, so that will be about to watch. nancy pelosi will have a role in that i'm sure. i don't know if you make an

endorsement she will have a voice in the matter is evil as he tunderstands just as when she got into the leadership, the leadershipdid not determine her victory er. that she will not be in a position to determine the victory because it will be up to the democratic members of the house and it's a secret ballot. >> can i chime in on this? you talk about the usuccession talks and how that played out with a number of my colleagues. in those conversations, when they come up, she always said that she knew the future and her successor as someone with three qualities. number one, somebody who reflects core democratic e values . number two, somebody who can keep the caucus together which is no small feat and number three, many who can negotiate with a president and a senateleadership of either party . to the extent that when and if she became speaking about

who replaces her and to the extent she weighs in on that issue i think those three criteria are going to be quite operative. >> i'm sure that's right and i see how difficult it isto do those things . to keep the democratic caucus together it's crucial because the margin is narrow but it's no easy task. her ability to keep centrists from holding when they have to go back to districts like your district, and members of the squad from defecting, that is really a considerable story and negotiating with presidents, it's hard to negotiate with presidents. people melt when they walk into the oval office but she has dealt with a series of them in part, in a way it goes back to the picture of her in the book when she's 16 years oldand talking to jfk . so this is a person who's had a lot of presence and is not

phased by them. >> we have about 10 minutes left. we have a hard stop at 8:00 so two minutes left. let's see how many questions we can get in and chris, i'd love for you to chime in as well . >> i was going to have a question for susan i wanted to pick up on and asked a question from the chat. you just mentioned this the squad and the question is how has madame speakers relationship evolved with aoc and to lean into that you wrote page 281, nancy pelosi saw something of herself in aoc, even when aoc was causing trouble. maybe especially that. could you talk about her relationship with aoc? >> nancy pelosi isn't against disruption, she's been a disruptor and she's not against

passion for your political views because she has passion for her political views. when she was thinking about aoc, she said i use to march in protest and rail against the politicians who would settle for half a loaf but her perspective now is a little different because she's disruptive and passionate but she's also cooperation old, her highest praise and these operational means you can have a strong view, you should have a strong view but are you willing to do the things required to make it happen, you actually get something done. and one of the interviews i had with her game on a few hours after she had had a big blowup with the squad and the democratic caucus. it's the four members of the squad had defected on an immigration vote that nancy pelosi had wanted democrats to hold together on. and it set off this cascading effect of rather public criticism to the squad and between the person who was

then her chief of staff and other democrats in congress. and she said that some people didn't understand the difference between making a fine pctc and making sausage. and that while it's nice to make a fine pctc most of the time you're makingsausage . in washington and she also quoted a goalie who was a former chair of the appropriations committee of wisconsin . and he had this saying that some people come to washington to pose for holy pictures to show how perfect they are. and other people come to washington to actually legislate. nancy pelosi would definitely put herself in the corner with those who actually wanted to legislate in her complaint with the squad is they do not seem to always understand the process that's involved in doing that.

>> before we go to the next question i want to remind people to purchasethis book , go to 12 books.com. follow the links on nancy pelosi and the lessons of power. let's go to the next question. >> we had a question from former congressman martin strong. you can unmute and ask the question. >> this is an anecdote that i think you would beinterested in, can you hear me okay ? when the democrats were trying to, when they were trying to runthe house in 2006 in the middle of a heated battle , my wife and nancy called to express sympathy and asked when the funeral would be and i told her this was in september 2006 and the issue was still in doubt. she came to the funeral,

wednesday at the graveside had attended the reception area after that i was friends with nancy. >> that occur throughout your book, that personal bonus, sending orchids to people. that just ironclad grasp of everybody who was important to her and he was that important to our.>> if i could follow up, we lost the house in 2010 and the times wrote an editorial about it saying she should not continue as democratic leader . she asked me to respond to the times which i did. i wrote my response as to why she should remain as leader. that was, i was happy to do that and it was an unusual relationship. >> it's so great to hear from you and to hear that story. and the kind of bond that

forges to have had an experience like that. i did hear several stories from people who had similar experiences. it's very meaningful to people to have an experience like that. when i interviewed bob dole for this book and bob dole is no friend of nancy pelosi's politically. he was excited that the book was coming out and nancy pelosi always sendhim imported on his birthday. that's what he talked about in this interview . i actually checked back with her office as i was putting that anecdote in the book to make sure that she in fact sent him an orchid and they had . >> let's take the next question, i think we havetime for two, possibly three . >> we have four questions in the chat asking if you could the terry of the of the state

of the union speech. and if she sees a path forward on bipartisanship. >> i've been in washington a long time and i've neverseen anything like that . i asked her about it when i was interviewing her about how the terry of the text but she says that president from arrived and it's customary for the president to give the speaker a text of the address and that she's leaving through it reading it quickly because she wants to see what is going to say that she sees something that she thinks is inaccurate, is untrue and she wants to make a little mark with a pen so she can find. and so she can't find a pen. i guess even if you're speaker of the house you don't carry your purse up to the dais there's a desk and she opens up the drawer, there's nothing in the drawer .

there's no pen. so she doesn't have to pen, she makes a tiny tear in the margin of the speech text so she can find this and that she thinks is untrue and then she sees something else and she thinks is untrue and makes another tiny tear another thing she thinks is untrue by the time it's at the end of the speech there are little tears all the way up and down the speech text. after she tore up the speech some photographers went back to look at the pictures and saw her taking the little tears there were some speculation she had been planning to tear up the speech all along. she told me thatwasn't true , that she haddecided what to do . then the president awards a metal to rush limbaugh that strikes or as an inappropriate thing to do during his state of the union address especially to rush limbaugh is such a toxic figure for the democrats. so speech ends, she stands up and she says i decided if he

was going to shred the truth, i was going to shred his speech. the speech was too thick for her to tear it in half so she divided it into four sets of pages , for each of them in half, cost them on the desk and meanwhile my favorite part of this picture is my mike pence who is standing next to her pretending he cannot see what she is doing . >> let's take one final question. >> a question from ellen asking if you could please either compare or contrast speaker pelosi and newt gingrich and local polarity and if you believe your pelosi's great strength as a unifier for her own party in fact rises the republicans even more. >> she definitely is living in a polarized world as was newt gingrich. newt gingrich of course

followed strategies that made our politics more polarized. nancy pelosi is very critical of newt gingrich area newt gingrich is very critical of nancy pelosi but i have to tell you when iinterviewed newt gingrich for the book , he was criticizing her on policy as a hard liberal but then he started to talk about how much respect he had for her as a politician, as someone who knew how to get and use power for the purposes she had. he said when he looked at nancy pelosi, he saw a fellow pirate and if you're newt gingrich i think the words fellow pirates are intended as high praise indeed. >> over the next several weeks and months congress is going to be dealing with an infrastructure bill with continued response to

covid-19, with many significant challenges. if you want to understand how nancy pelosi developed a strategy hto impact and operationalize, you should read madamespeaker , nancy pelosi and the use of power and that will give you the best inside view of her very critical time. what a delight to have you. ladies and gentlemen, may 12 at seven, education and politics with congresswoman rosa delauro, chairman of the house appropriations committee. governor bill richardson talking about how to navigate international toxic situations. you can receive more r information by googling cornell institute of politics and i do recommend you go to 12 books.com and follow the links for madame speaker, nancy pelosi and the lessons of power. thank you all verymuch again .

>>. [music] >> tonight tv helen riley argues china has gone too far in its quest to become the world's number one superpower . former xerox ceo ursula burns, the first black female ceo of a fortune 500 company shares inside american business historian gordon reed talks about the residents, slippery and emancipation. get more information at book tv.org.

>> good morning and for those viewers in the united kingdom good afternoon. i'm rob gore, president of the american enterprise institute and i'm please to be able to introduce conversation with professor robert tombs. i'm happy to announce that today's event we are beginning a new series of events at aei area that edward and helen before him. these forums will provide a platform to host prominent authors for discussions of their important new books on issues of national significance. i want to take this moment to thank ellen helen and edward for their support and deep commitment to our mission. since this storm will bring together leading speakers, professor tombs new book "this sovereign isle: britain in and out of europe"