knowledge and leadership, can meet any crises just as well as they met it over and over again in the past. i can remember the cries of horror when my sunday said we had to have 50,000 airplanes in a given period, but we had them. and the difference was that the people were told, what the reason was and why, and i have complete faith in the american people's ability if they know and if they have leadership and no one can move without some leadership. >> and for the time being, you feel that we are bereft of leadership? >> yes. >> take a closer look at the spouses of our nation's presidents, their private lives, public roles and legacies. watch all of our first lady's programs on-line at first

ladies.c-span.org. >> we're talking to you at the white house historical association's presidential summit in washington d.c. you're here because you work with the organization and the descendents. >> i'm related on my maternal side to glover cleveland 22nd and 24th united states president and on my father's side, fraternal side to william mckinley and the great-great-nephew of william mckinley and great-great-grandson of grover cleveland. how did those two families get together? >> it's happen chance because my parents married and the two became one. >> excuse me for interrupting were your parents aware of their lineage when they married? >> had no clue. my father was a long time history professor at uga, during the course of time he, you know, at the breakfast

table, we talked about presidential politics and presidential descendents and i learned so many stories about those families from those conversations that i had with him. >> the two are very different, aren't they? >> they are, they are, absolutely. >> so, let's start with the ones whose family name you bare, mckinley. what do you want people to know about him since you've studied some of his legacy and his life. what do you think is the most important thing to know about william mckinley? >> everybody remembers he was assassinated in buffalo and the most important thing, i think that robert's book brought that to light, how powerful of an impact his presidency, you know, gave the country because we had industrial revolution, we had, you know, expansion around the world. we had just tremendous growth and i think, a lot of times, sadly enough, both grover cleveland and william mckinley are often forgotten, but through, you know, books that are written about both,

especially about mckinley and of course, you remember charl rove's book will william mckinley, i think in times past he's often bb forgotten and my hope is that through the course of time and through the great efforts of the white house historical association that jacqueline kennedy founded in 1961, through those efforts with education, preservation, and legacy, you know, learning about those presidents that they'll certainly be remembered. and i'm trying very hard to do that. >> we have visited the mckinley memorial in canton, ohio, wow, what a structure. tell our audience, the story of how that came to be. >> so the william mckinley memorial, way back in the day, people revered him and of course, you know the significance about the roses that they wore back in the day when he was assassinated, but the citizens of ohio,

especially since they were assassinated thought it was befitting to actually come together and actually create a memorial to his legacy and his memory. of course, these probably, in my opinion, ohio's most revered president not only a house member, but also, susan, the last u.s. civil war president. so i think the legacy that that produced and in addition to the fact that he was assassinated, probably contributed to him having this wonderful memorial and it really truly is. >> it's impressive. the amount of space that it takes and the size of the memorial itself. i understood that the first lady was very much involved in the building of it. >> that's correct, that's correct. >> and the first lady's memorial museum is also on the same campus. would you talk a little about mrs. mckinley and her legacy and role in the white house?

>> absolutely. wonderful mate, wonderful supportive wife of william, of course, you know the story about her having epilepsy and the fact that, you know, mckinley was such a wonderful husband that when she had the epileptic seizures at dinner functions, he would place a napkin over her face and then they'd go on with dinner. because they lost both children that's the reason they have no direct descendents because both daughters died in infancy. and they want today memorialize mckinley and, too, the white house first ladies home is actually, was actually her home. did you know that? >> no, i didn't. >> it absolutely is. the first lady's museum is

actually out of mckinley's home and it's beautiful, beautiful structure. i think that hillary clinton inaugurated that home back in the day. >> so if one were to look at that period of time, it was a time of great disruption and technological change and industrial change. there are a lot of parallels to today. so, going through the digital revolution and challenges with immigration as there were back at that time. with the purpose of studying history is to help understand our time today. what would you take away from the mckinley era that people can help to understand the time we're going through? >> i think, like you said, the technological advances and, you know, and we just were epanning at rapid speed and money was poured into the country for, you know, industrial expansion. i think we can learn from that and that today, we can take the strides and make sure that we have the infrastructure to be able to proceed and cities can

understand how, you know, important that is, you know, because i think they were doing it by happen chance and hoping for the best and sometimes that did not work out. but i think we can learn from the past, we can learn from those, you know, those police takes that were made during those times in the mckinley's times. especially during that particular time because we radically changed in the early 1900's. >> grover cleveland, you're actually more closely relate ed to grover cleveland. what should they know? >> they should know that he had a beautiful wife and a great story passed down for my family for many, many years. francis and grover were so saddened they were defeated after the first election, she told the white house staff who she dearly loved, take care of the china because we'll be back

in four years. they were back in four years. but i think, you know, the romance that they had, you know, prior to them getting married in the white house was just, you know, a love story that, you know, will endure the test of time. she was married in the white house. the beautiful gown, susan, founded by george cleveland. he's the grandson of grover. and his sister ann and, and they found the wedding dress that actually exists in the white house collection, the first ladies collection at the smithsonian. so, that's just, i mean, that's just a powerful display of how wonderful and how elegant she was. and i think people will certainly, you know, learn from history from that. >> but there was an enormous age difference between the two. >> absolutely. >> how does the family process that piece of information?

>> now, i think it was a love story that was kindled by francis' father. he was a dear, dear friend of grover and i think upon his death, i think grover felt the need to make sure that francis was taken care of for the rest of her life. and they loved each other. i mean, i think definitely, you know, he was definitely a lot older by a stretch of 25 to 30 years, but i think, you know, at that time she trusted him and i think that she was the guardian for many, many years and even prior to mr. fulsome's death, i definitely think that she had complete trust and they loved each other and they have a wonderful family, so-- >> they really did not like life inside the white house. >> that's correct. >> they really want today protect their family. how did they do that? >> so a lot of times, you know, susan -- frances would actually take the children by carriage to some of the, you know, the sites off campus of the white

house and unbeknownst to the press and unbeknownst to anybody that was around and they would actually secretly do that. mid day or at sometimes, probably in the evenings when no one would be suspect, that they would be around and i think that she's just-- she's very much -- you know, she controlled how her children would be seen. >> they also built a house, i understand it, what's called the cleveland park session of washington. >> that's right. >> and the family more or less lived there and then didn't grover cleveland use that at the white house. >> yes, there's a ton of correspondence that exists from that time because he was a voracious reader and writer, and at the time we didn't have the archives like we do today. when he left office, all of those letters and documents were taken by him and i was talking to george just yesterday about, you know, how much volume of papers still

exist and they're trying to give those to the museum and to, you know, institutions like princeton, you know, to preserve and to keep those. but it's a lot of information. >> where is the bulk of the papers? >> they're at princeton. >> what is the connection? >> princeton is the place that grover and francis retired to. and i know we'll forget the story, it's a great story, susan, but i've been told this many, many times. grover did not like woodrow wilson and at the time woodrow wilson was the president at that time and he did not allow his children or woodrow wilson's children to play together because there was a little bit of a rift, so they did not play together. so that's the connection. he actually retired to princeton. >> we're talking about the cleveland's children and they also had a daughter that became

very famous who unfortunately also passed away in her youth, baby ruth. we have a candy bar named after baby ruth. >> that's right. >> tell us what you know about the family stories about baby ruth. >> so, the actual candy company contacted the cleveland family to actually put the images of the baby and also, frances on that and we have actual -- i have tons of political memorabilia and souvenirs na have been given away and they actually contacted the family to actually allow both images on the candy bar, but sadly, like you said, ruth passed away and sadly, susan, she was pregnant with a child at the time and both happened almost at the same time. so she did not get a chance to say goodbye to ruth before she passed away. >> i think she was in her early

childhood. that's correct. they were afraid that the disease, i think it was diphteria, that the disease would, you know, would certainly affect the child. >> but she lives on through the name that never goes away. >> that's right, susan, everybody thinks that candy bar was named after babe ruth, but that was long past that time. and anyway you hear it from the candy company, they say it's named for baby ruth and you see likeness and on lot of the candy wrappers. both were beautiful. she was a beautiful child. you know, frances was a beautiful woman, why not put that on the display for sure. >> so let's talk a little about you, and your interest in politics. you mentioned that the family used to talk about the family history around the kitchen table. when did you take a really serious interest in american history? >> i would say, susan, probably

not until junior high. my dad talked about it because i had two other brothers, he always talked about politics, he always talked about presidents, the presidency and presidential descendents, but i think that junior high piqued my interest and cause me to take a closer look at it in fact i had the legacy to both families and i certainly wanted to research as much as possible. i think my junior high years were the time frame that i had interest in it and dad showed a greater interest and we actually went to a lot of the historical sites the mckinley museum and the library and of course, grover cleveland's grave site in new jersey. but i think, i would say say i really was not as familiar with it in early years, but i think junior high, high school, college and the interests that i had in that probably caused me to become even greater --

have a greater interest in that. >> is it a coincidence that your profession is political communications? >> yeah, right. that's exactly right. no, susan, i have been privileged to write for some of the greater people, newt gingrich, of course, john boehner and then, also, the current speaker paul ryan. very specific speeches, i don't do day-to-day stuff, but it's been a thrill to be able to write for them on some policy things and i thoroughly enjoy it, but most of my work is corporate communications. >> what is it like being part of a community of presidential descendents. is there a lot of interaction among you? >> you know, i hate to say it, susan. years ago we attended the new york mayor's presidential descendents luncheons that they used to have. this is probably 20, 25 years ago, probably in the last, i would say, probably the last

five years, people have become more interested and i approached stuart mcloren, the head of the presidential association. six months ago, wanting to do, create an event for the presidential descendents because i think it's something that just kind of that's not been done, but hopefully going forward we will actually have more reunions. i'm in hopes that we have an annual dinner that we actually will have in different locations around the country, and i hope that we will, because i think it's so important because you learn so much. you share, you know, experiences, you share stories about the presidential families and i just love to be around people that are a lot like me. >> if you had to say your perception of being a president or life in the white house is different than folks who don't have this history because of what you know, your family, how

would you tell it? do you have a different appreciation for the job? >> i think i really do. i think, susan, probably the greatest word would be respect. two men gave of themselves, william mckinley, grover cleveland to aspire to greater office and i will tell you what a sacrifice. especially during periods of time that were, like you said, that were quite strenuous with this country and i do think i have a greater respect for the office. i have a greater respect for, you know, the people that occupy that office and the sacrifices that they've definitely made each and everyday. you miss family times a lot of times and i know for a fact that william mckinley because the way they had to travel back then, lost a lot of that time with his young daughters because he traveled by rail and was there. and it was apart from his wife for a good time, too, and that was kind of very traumatic because of her illness.

>> well, thank you for visiting with us during this white house summit. >> absolutely. >> nice to meet you. >> same, pleasure. >> weekends on c-span2 are an intellectual feast. every saturday, tv documents america's story and brings you the latest nonfiction books and authors. funding for c-span2 comes from these television companies and more, including contacts. >> do you think this is just a community center? no, it's way more than that. comcast partnering with community centers, so students from low income families can get the tools they need to be ready for anything. >> comcast, along with these television companies support c-span2 as a public service. >> our weekly series, the presidency, highlights the politics, policies, and legacies of u.s. presidents and first ladies, and during a recent program, christopher

leahy talked about john tyler, the first vice-president to succeed a president who died in office, and who was ejected from his own political party. >> the power resides from the senate in february of 1836, rather than vote to expunge the censure of andrew jackson. the whig party led by henry clay passed resolution of censure that took president jackson to task for removing bank deposits which inaugurated the bank wars in his second term and then congress passed the expunging resolution and what they aimed to do was to expunge the censure from the journal, in other words, get it out of the record of the journal. tyler was to vote for the resolution by the virginia legislature. he refused, he resigned in

february of 1836 out of principle. but he returned to politics yet again a year and a half later. he was elected to the virginia legislature for the third time. again, we see this pattern of looking at a way to try to continue his political career by using the legislature as the springboard. he got himself nominated as vice-president by the whigs at their convention in december of 1839, their national convention nominated william henry harrison and of course, tippy canoe and tyler too defeated. and harrison died 32 days into his term. tyler became president, the image on the right is romanticized image of tyler receiving news of harrison's passage and elevation to the presidency. >> watch this program and

thousands more on-line at c-span.org/history. >> our weekly series the presidency highlights the politics, policies, and legacies of u.s. presidents and first ladies. next, historians david reynolds and h.w. brands talks about abraham lincoln as part of a symposium on his life and times. >> and our first is david reynolds, he's the author or editor of 16 books including his current biography, abe. abraham lincoln in his time. this book received numerous accolades, including this year's abraham lincoln book institute award and the prize of the gelder lahrman society and wall street journal's top 10 books of the year. his brief books, walt whitman's book and