children deserve whether you agree with our politics or not. >> good evening. thank you for tuning in behalf of all of us at the locally-based intently on bookstore books & books in miami florida in partnership with the miami book fair but it's my pleasure to welcome you to virtually evening to discuss

"wallet activisim" how to use every dollar you spend, earn, and save as a force for change published by our friends. tanja hester is the author of "wallet activisim" and work optional. after spending most of her career as a consultant to democratic politics and progressive issue campaigns and before that as a public radio journalist tanja retired at the age of 30 pages than outspoken voice in the media committee to consider systemic carriers an opportunity gaps ratherr than simply pushing advantages to accumulate more wealth. mbpart of what "the new york times" called her -- to moderate tonight's conversation we joined by jeanette ruiz who is a miami native. in her current role as program irdirector for them miami climae alliance she works withnv the community and member stations for solutions for the climate crisis.

formerlyly the cohost of the podcast planted in miami she and her husband alex sought out pushing the city to their actions. passion about animal welfare and affirmative's work is a developmental director for the number one vegan food festival in the country. and now without further ado i'd like to welcome our guest to the virtual stage. >> thank you so much for thatoo warm welcome. hi tanja. >> hi m. so excited to be having this conversation with you. >> so i might.

it's a very appropriate time to be with you because it made me think about every single urges that i made. so let's start off with the obvious question what is "wallet activisim" and what made you become a wallet activist? >> wallet activism is using your financial power to create change in the world and addressing power in all its forms. one of the thing in the book that people can relate to as a lot of the messaging is about how to operate in the world in an ethical responsible way and to shop and shop differently. and someone he cares about the climatee may be buy this instead

of by this and i want to stress this is about so much more than shopping and as you mentioned it oftentimes about i not shoppingt i think that raises the point to that is often much cheaper to shop this way then use conscious consumerism where they say it's better to buy a tesla but it's really expensive than to buy a ford or a patagonia is better to buy than a secondhand jacket paid those are things you can push back against and that push back is part of wallet activism trying to see through those marketet activism taken make choices. >> i feel like i really wanted to know that i wasn't buying that things with the money i was spending and i was hopefully doing some good.

it was unclear what the right things to do work. it's so obvious sometimes it things are brainwashing. making products look like it's more environmentally sustainable than it is worth maybe this message sounds good. i know this person is trying to sell me something. how do i figure this out and i did some research as a consumer and realize they don't know what the right thing is that i work at a public policy for a lot of years and felt like it had a pretty good level of savvy about how things worked. i still felt lost. so it's really wanting to share it with others because i think a lot of people feel and there's not much individuals can do. i is an individual and 1% and our leaders aren't doing enough. it's really easy to have that

feeling that we will never make progress on social issues or equality and i just don't believe that's true and i wanted to make sure people feel hopeful and clear-eyednd about the hard realities of things but also empowered to do things that actually make a difference. >> one of the things that i really enjoyed reading this book is a book that you can come back to time and time again. there'll be certain circumstances where you can practice wallet activism and for example our drier at our house broke recently we and we had to go out and purchase a new one. i was reading your book atnl the time and i was trying to do my religions. is it energy efficient and where was it manufactured and what is the carbon -- carbon footprint etc.. the reality is there was one

that we had to go with. so you talk about her affection in the book and how we can't be perfect. i wanted to talk about that a little because it does get overwhelming when we try to be more conscious with their purposes so right off the bat how do you do with that and how do you address it in your book? >> i think that we all areso surrounded by imperfect choices. in capitalism there are no perfect decisions that we can make. everything we do will do some harm in some way whether it's just using resources that could remain in the ground or go to someone else. last winter a little over a year ago ourr furnace died when it ws 0 degrees out in a perfect world we would have loved to have painstakingly researched and

tried to find exactly the best furnace and we would have loved to go with thed. heat pump but it's such an expensive thing and it was 0 degrees outside and we needed heat so we ended up buying the best furnace we could get and i'm really unhappy about that. we are all just doing our best. we said okay if we know we just want a natural gas furnace we preferred that it could be powered by wind or solar. we are going to resolve to use as little heat as possible so as a fossil fuel appliance we will try not to use it too much and with the driver -- drier maybe it's worth looking into to hang up a laundry if you can. it could be very challenging. >> figuring out if airways working impact this choice.

arede there times when he you could leave the car home werbach -- bike or walk or carpool with someone else? there are ways ways to scale back the resources that we are burning through. >> i love that and another thing in the process was you have it chapter on developing anan activist mindset and you list different values and trying not to be perfect. like herrig issues i want to support.y the new make purchases you keep these things in mind. you may have a situation where you don't have a choice but there other situations where you do. can you talk about that? >> i'm glad that spoke to you. the analogy that is a stretch. really illustrates is perfectly very quickly is if you are a vegetarian and some insist you want a burger? you don't have to use any willpower and you'd don't waste

any of your energy and naturally saying no, i don'tol eat burgers or the idea of trying to come up with a financial value statement is trying to figure out what are the things that are most important to you and will order the views you care most about because sometimes those are in conflict. for example if you are solely focused on climate andf a climae change you're probably going to be focusing on reducing what you buy as muchn she can all the tie versuset someone who's really focused on the first thing the racial wealth gap. they may be focus on spending a fair amount of money on -- businesses owned by people of color and that's going to be a very different set of financial figures. i figuring out here is what i don't spend money on are the sfinancial choice that don't me

it lived up heard and offered you from always having to feel exhausted by choiceson and it helps you automate a lot ofo that. it's a very helpful thing and it's early in the book a so it's one of those things that are easy to skip over. come back and spend a little bit of time thinking about because it's for your own sanity as is to go to the store that you don't feel like you have to do a ton of research on every littlev thing. >> it's a it helps you realize that you are doing a lot of that already. when i did the exercise i realized i have already been making these purchases self-consciously. i have been supporting the things thatme i find important. that's why it's important to do this and to put intention behind what it is you want to support

before making resolutions and it's a great exercise to do. deciding how you'd like to move forward. you also talk about the good guys and how to tell the difference. this was very enlightening because he mentioned greenwashing before andou how these companies -- reside in 2020. the protests in a lot of these companies came out in solidarity it's something that is authentic so can we talk a little bit about that and how we navigate those waters? >> i think it's a coming trickier because every of brand would have you believe that they are perfect on every issue all the time. and with black lives matter and with george floyd people came up

on their social saying we stand with black lives matter which that's fine. that's a good first step and it's good to normalize having that conversation especially with groups that have been talked about his friends before but it's very easy to look at whond are their leaders and whos on the order of direct heirs and to see a claim to racial equity. that's a lot of men on their ward and it's often a lot of folks employed and you can take a look at that and see if what they are promising too you has a potential customer matches what they are actually doing.. you might use that as a moment to let them know that your future business is contingent on them backing up their words with

action because that's how things change comments when businesses hear from customers. one of the things is sometimes the best way to create change is two different companies or two different businesses which are runs counter to a lot of people with the environment. if you boycott something that you never shopped with them to begin with a are unlike you to listen to you. or being able to get a big motivator for companies. that's not to say we should all be consumers 24/7 and it's essential to address climate change but there are ways you can nc do it that are intentional that can over time lead to change. h >> i agree in along those lines he talked about the true cost of purchases and externalities if

i'm pronouncing that correctly. you give an example of the spiral notebook. just checking this one spiral notebook andli what it goes through to get to us and once we possess an allison of a thing. once you possess something whether it's a pet or a book it's like how it got to the process and what you plan to do with it. can you talk about the true cost of the purchase and what that means? >> the things that we buy where we live and what we do and so much of our experience is part of the reality of it and when to use something similar that simple like a spiral notebook to say look this is made out of two things its paper and metalal

spiral. it's something so simple. involves mining and it involves trees coming down and involves pollution. papers must water-intensive industry in the world so producing that cheaper means taking lot of lucian out and it goes through a lot of human hands as well to get to you. almost none of thatit is priced into the dollar you might pay for a notebook. you may pay for an expensive notebook and for the companies pay no profits it's not going to the people who manufactured it or the communities impacted by the mining or the factory pollution or any number of externalities. externalities are things that are required to make something that are not actually priced in.

the cigarettes it's an easy way to think about externalities. when you find a pack my understanding is they are quite expensive everywhere now. still that's not considering the health care costs and could not covering the health care costs of allhi the people that are affected by secondhand smoke or theha farmworkers of the tobacco exposed to pesticides and all of those volatile chemicals. thinking about that and thinking about what is the true cost of something, is thiskn something that's inherently polluting and something that is made of fossil views which means carpet is coming out of the ground and going into thehe atmosphere ands this something that will biodegrade or end up in ais landfill? when i you have an understanding ofe' it. it may feel overwhelming at first but the goal is to -- so the next time you buy buy something you realize okay it's

not just the pen. it's are fairly complex mechanim it that has metal in it and plastic and what is that a good made of and it helps you i thank hit the pause button before a buy something without takingun about it. it becomes easy to say these are things i'm just not going to buy anymore any more or engage with anymore. these are things that i may still buy. i want to be more informed than that is the goal. anythingeo you buy the cost you pay is not reflective of its true impact on the environment. >> you are frozen on my end. i'm not sure if other people are seeing that. >> i just took my video off to

see if that would help. i'm not sure now how to bring it back. do you know how to bring my camera back? >> to rings me to your value questions which are also helpful. one of our members is an advocate for farmworkers and they are always on line for me when i shop for food talking about the conditions that they have to work in out in the heat and with the pesticides and the living conditionss. it's just conditions so there is a cost that's not included with

your avocado and so to see something that is some that's one of your questions come is a too?tu can everyone do this and is it too and what am i -- said any talk about those? >> the question as to take a lot of this -- you have the sense that some of this stuff can feel big andke overwhelming and they really wanted to make sure thats readers felt trusted. i believe you can handle it and we'll find a way through and guiding questions are there to help you find your way through that competition and to say i'm getting this marketing message and hearing from us this anbar mentalist on instagram. that's the idea of the questions is the first one is meant to

help evaluate if someone is proposing a particular solution. to say okay this actually serve justice with which i mean giving more power and financial resources who historically have been marginalized or kept out of power for this reason. oftentimes you'll see people who mean well. haven't thought about this. theyey say okay we are going too a whole bunch of culture farming.by that sounds really good permaculture is about regenerating the land. this doesn't include farmworkerg and this does include indigenous people or food justice or food sovereignty. it's really just for sort of hobby gardeners. some projects i've seen is an example. that would be something where you say okay i've heard this and i'm thinking about who it's been a fading.

how can i think about a different solution or give my time or money toan something ele that will help and what would happen if everyone tried to do this if everyone tried to eat all their food out of the dumpster then we wouldn't have any food. it's not just saying that folks being gung ho isn't a great solution. is it too as really big one and everyone is looking for a deal and trying to save as much money as possible and often leads to people prioritizing prices above everything else and that's often a quick way to shop unethically and shop in a way that harms other people much more than it should. you know that probably was picked by someone who was paid

literal pennies and in the country it's very rate is erprobably flown in and you know unscrupulous acts when intuit. >> i used the chick-fil-a example. they are known forha being anti-anti-transgender rights and so a lot of folks might say i don't want to give chick-fil-a in the distance and that's a totally valid thingon to say bad on amazon walmart whatever company you disagree their practices on. you can also think about in terms of political contribution. think of a politician you don'tc like.ds if iai was going to give that amount of money to politician how would it feel about that and that can be of really good way

to figure out in my okay doing this? it'sve different to spend five r $10 on a restaurant once or twice a year than to spend thousands of dollars at a bigab retailer. i encourage to look at the biggest institute for his party talks a lot about shopping but also how you earn money and where you where you stated and how you use money and all those different things in there. making the biggest decisions first will avoid driving yourself and make a bigger impact.urn. >> yeah. i think you are frozen again. i can hear you fine. >> she's not frozen on my end. >> she was good? >> okay great. we will press ahead and just hope for the best.

>> tanja in miami we are experiencing an affordable housing crisis on top of a lot of other crises. the residents received eviction notices over the holiday break and they have refused to leave so they just raise their rates from $1000 to $1650. here the average person >> over 50% of their income on rent. all the communities mine included that were low income and don't have a choice on what to buy. you want to get affordable food

to go to walmart or you go to otherhe establishments where you can get cheaper food. if you want to get clothing you have to go where you can afford and that was just running in the background the entire time. i feel like there are people who are in a t situation that are privileged enough to read this book and make these choices and then there are others who are justou like -- what i thought ws interesting in the book was how you broke it down on the food and i feel like there should take cards that you can tear out. there are little things that you can do even if you're on a really tight budget. what would you say to someone who would say that to you, i have to get what i can. >> yeah i would say that's completelyha valid. we live in a deeply unjust society economically speaking at a lot of levels as well so

absolutely. the thing i want to do in the book is to make the action steps is actionable as possible and for many of us we can't consume less. we t can shift some of the foode buy from one thing to another thingli instead. for those whore can't those fols are not the problem. people who can't afford to make a lot of different choices aren't f the ones driving climae change and they are not the ones running companies that are exploiting workers and contributing to massiveth inequality. they look at this and they say about these principals. there's not much i can do here. i think we should all fight for better economic realities for many folks. anyone reading it the good news is that you are not the problem. it's the wealthier folks who are over consuming who are

exploiting others are benefiting from the exploitation of others. if you don't feel w like you are doing it directly we are all benefiting from the exploitation of others including those who cannot afford that food and that's made possible by the people of limited options allowed to do that paperwork. i wish that i could have written this look from within a just society in which everyone had choices.e if we lived in that world we also wouldn't need the book. i know people in virtually all cities are facing the album. people who earn minimum wage can't afford a apartment in a single city. in miami you are dealing witht a ton of climate change that other places are dealing with and that

impacts housing. we certainly saw the collapse of the building. all of these issues are interconnected so what i would say people listen to this and seeing lots of folks who don't have choices and you are able to make choices says those who can make decisions are responsible because so many are able to. >> i was thinking about the impact of covid and how we are seeing the ripple effect with our supply chain and people getting sick. my niece goes to school and she sent pictures of grocery shopping and there was nothing. nothing on the shelves and i was so worried for her.

i've been experiencing it but it's a slow trickle thing in when you go to the grocery things there are some things -- so will be harder and harder to support those brands that you do want to f support. have you thought about that as well? >> for sure in a lot of different ways and one of the things i think that's important to talk about is when we say supply chain supply chain shortages will we really mean is people. we don't have less fossilo fuel on the ground replace that weekend -- it's not like all the machines around the world make and transport things that are brokenag down. people are sick all over. millions of people have died of covid and a lot of those folks who are out not to be in the workforce a lot of them were at summer working in the essential farming functions. supply chain g shortages means

we've been deeply mistreating her fellow humans and thus affecting us. here in california the mountains we havere had heavy snow. trucks couldn't get through to restockk the stores. a lot of people are feeling that compounded and feeling like you just have to do your best. in the early time of the pandemic we didn't feel was safe to go to the store before we were vaccinated so we were having to shop with people who i n,don't normally shop with. we couldn't get groceries otherwise and that's with me having it is a number of choices. i think it really just underscores that think the firs you raise tonightht about not looking for perfection and doing the best youo can with the choices you have at the moment

and during. covid we have even more imperfect choices than usual. i think where we can consider do i need to buy it and sometimes the answer might be yes. other times it might be no and in that case do your best and i don't want to make everyone feel super stressed out aboutat it. don't loose with about it adjust over time try to continually improve the goal is not to say okay i morally pure because i never shop at that store. >> do your best and don't lose sleep about it. that's good. if you guys have any questions just drop it into the question box and we will answer them for you. until then i wanted to -- one is becoming a wallet activism part two is practicing wallet

activism in every aspect of your life. one that stands out to me is you talk about thanks and you talk about justice and i want to focus on it something we have encountered with jpmorgan chase and investment in fossil fuels. it's very much so soot and bar mitzvah conferences and trying to be that good guy. i have learned a lot in terms of re-complacent and you've given me a lot of food for thought. that's something that most of us could probably do is to change our bank. can you elaborate on that? >> honestly if that's the one outcome of this book is that more people change where they bank or they will consider that a complete success. if you look in personal-finance

conversations there is so much conversation aroundol responsibe investing which first of all most people can afford to invest anything so it's not a very inclusive action. straight line a between if you buy a share of exxon oval one of the biggest oil companies in the i world and the huge polluter and climate terms and an exploiter of humans around the world is that dollar that you have invested in doesn't go to someone that exxon and it doesn't help their bottom line. so much murkier line in a lot of thosees shares at fossil fuel companies are being snatched up by equity investors. we are going s to get a bargain and they are holding onto that stock so it's not necessary whooshing the companies to do anything any differently which is really the goal of divesting. with banking however people don't realize they think the

money that's going into her savings or checking account is funding small business loans in youre community or mortgages for first-time homebuyers in your committee and is sure that some of that is happening but a lot of the money of your banking with the big bang, we are talking bank of america jpmorgan chase. >> that level those are the largest fossil fuel projects funded. like the dakota access pipeline or offshore drilling or fracking bernie the practices we know are really destructive and a disaster from a climate perspective. if you switch instead to a union or communityng bank or black-owd bankly and there are so many different options all of the country. depends where you live. then you ensure your money is not funding those projects that

moreover if others join you and leave that rankin tells the bank why you are leaving as you don't fuelto fund fossil projects that completely cuts off the funding for the fossil fuel industry and at the time when our leaders are doinghi enough to address climate change or the actions of fossil fuel industry it's an incredibly powerful thing. people will tell them why you are leaving because one of the most powerful things you can do and it's kind of a pain. it's like you did that one time and you switch torg something better and you don't have to worry about it anymore. honestly that should be the biggest on the i part of the bok is change your bank. >> there were a lot of examples like wells fargo and jc morgan chase. you gave me great reasons to stop.

i'm finally going to do it. so we have some questions. what advice would you give someone in their early 20s on wallet activism? >> i think honestly the more you can get into some of the habits the better. the american way the capitalist way is referring to as you grow in your career and earn more you are supposed to spend more and buy a nicer things. people call smaller homes smarter homes. if you can set your expectations looking for and this is a concept i don't talk about in this book that i do talk about my first book work optional and finding your comfortable spending level. when she got to the point where you say i can pay all my bills and not do everything in the world i wanted to. i can do enough things that i

feel good about the work i'm doing is worth it to me and whether or not it's going to restaurants are going on vacation board certain hobbies it's up to you to see what that looks like. once you make that point any new money you earn on top of that one you can state it so you can give yourself maybe an early retirement or secure retirement at least which is becoming increasingly more difficult to achieve. you can also keep yourself from getting into a habit of lower consumption. it's harder to find yourself in your mid-30s, 40s and 50's o and say okay i need to consist cut my consumption back by half or more than it is to have never gotten there in the first place. .. ay okay climate is most important thing to me on that you make your choices in they most important thing to me

is that you make your choices in line with that versus the example earlier if that racial wealth gap. you might make different choices in mind with that. give yourself permission not to do everything pretty.have to hedress every issue with every choice you make. really focus your efforts on the things that are most important. >> we have another question. what was the writing process like for this book? [laughter] this was a tough one. her folks have seen the book, the last because i really wanted this to be extremely intensively researched this about 500 different citations loose early research have you did not want to be my opinion or the opinion of others out there. i really wanted to say what are some of these standard lines of

reasoning that are out there? and is that sound? can we back that up as if everybody did exit truly would bee better. or is it the way people are talking about things really the right way? and how can we think about that? it was very much putting some things together i thought were right during the research, discovering and plenty of cases i was wrong and do something else like one of the big surprises what i did not expect to find buying only organic food for example is not the best choice for your while it's not the best choice for the planet it's not the best choice for fellow human organic is better some of the time but not all the time. it was pretty surprising toi a . i was going to be by as much organic as you can possibly afford. so i think any big book project tends to be really consuming. it took me about a year total to write it and it was in my brain kicking around for at least

another year end a half before that and we spent about six months and a round of editing. and final little things a book like this has so much current information you are afraid before it comes out something will become outdated before it's even released. [laughter]nsew i was thinking what happens if tuition for the book comes out fossil fuels i knew that was not going to happen because the really committed to making money off of oil, gas, coal. but you sort of think about that stuff. so fortunately none of that happened although maybe unfortunately it would have loved to see more progress but still hopeful. folks that's very especially with the covid stuff. okay it last there are some local businesses that make delicious bean salad have to support them as much as i can. however, there products come packaged number five plastic tubs and i'm aware of how much

plastic we are adding to the recycling bin. do you have any ideas how to get my head around this? or do we resign ourselves to only food we make at home it's perfectly fine. >> i think we all feel that. and unfortunately a lot of place number five plastic is not even recycled at all. a lot of towns and cities recycling systems only recycle number one and two plastics. even then there's no a guarantee it's going to make itt into a final product. it might go through sorting and up in the landfill anyway which is a huge bummer. i think there's different things you can do. first if there is a business that you really like you to buy their product talk to them and ask them what are some other options here? could i bring in my own container and have you put the food in it? some places in some cities they're working camp pilot programs to make that happen so that we can reduce waste.

some places they start where you combine the reusable take-out container for $5. and then when you go in you bring your dirty one and they give your food and a clean one. sort of like a package exchange process. and so that is happening in more places but you can also engage your local government a lot of cities and towns are looking at alternative packaging to try to plastics.gle use i talk in the book about the nuance that's really necessary and that and how really harmful for communities. also to a lot of lower income folks who cannot afford to have that they carry around all the i time. and so it's really important to think about the changes in ways that are just and inclusive. but it might be something where town or state and act measures to try to reduce the waste that is used they also provide grants so those stores can upgrade to

different packaging or could install a so they can use regularr dishes instead of plastic, that kind of stuff. got a lot of different options it doesn't we start the business tell them how much you love them number five plastic tubs are really a problem for you. and you never know what is possible. >> i totally agree with that. as i said earlier, this book is. deafly one you'll come back to time andut time again for the ge you somebody great tips. talk about the food chapter about garlic and how it 90% of it is grownld in china which i d not know why would he think about garlic? something so simple we can grow ourselves and my husband was rhetoric okay we have to grow our own garlic were going to try own garlic because we use a lot of it. little nuggets like that thatat you drop in the book that make it approachable even if the big things you cannot necessarily

make the decision to practice activism on a small scale you can definitely do something i definitely appreciate that. if we don't have any more questions? there's anything i left out like to mention? >> as you can tell i can talk at length about any of this stuff. i care a lot about it i'm sure everyone watching those as well. i think a lot of us are really concerned about the climate, where it is headed and the lack of action on a policy level both in the u.s. and globally. i want to assure everybody there actually is a lot we can do it as consumers sure your individual action all by themselves do not necessarily solve all of our problems. were not going to lie to you and tell you that they did were doing all these things think and they're going to help you been recycling for decades and we have not save the earth yet.

[laughter] what a stoppages good monotonous of the impact we need. but with capitalism and corporate profit structures think about how you change a law or how you change policy and a way that is for the better. you0% have to win an election oe means giving at least 50% of the vote. then there has to be public support through polling of at least 50% for even then we don't often do it now we've got more than 70% of voters are concerned about climate change it we don't see meaningful legislation going through. but when you're talking about corporate return with the banking example tonight, if morgan chase quarterly profits go down by three -- four, 5% shareholders are going to notice the board of directors is going to notice they are going to want to know why it what they can do to reverse that. sophie talk about this in a capitalist frame we actually underway have more power only elected voters the type of threshold is so much higher but with capitalism it could be 3%.

that is why encouraged to focus on is to the extent that you can tell other people around about some of the stuff. get your friends and family to switch banks also. really speak up in a way that folks notice. there is really tremendous capacity for change that we could drive as consumers. last thought i'd y like to leave folks with this really so much power that you have pretty wanta you to feel that even if you don't feel you have a tone of choices you have much more power than you think. >> i love that. we do not have a question it is just a statement and i think it's perfect way for us to and. no question but tommy is awesome, thanks for writing the book. 'thank you so much for writing this book. if you've not not picked it up yet please do. and thanks so much for talking with me. >> you are amazing thank you so much for your great questions. and slides in the book till he made my night prayer. [laughter] have a good night everyone. >> thank you both for this

wonderful conversation great thanks everyone again for joining us tonight. don't forget you can buy a copy of the book from books website or in store. don't forget to shop during these timesho are thank you both again, thanks everyone print hope everyone has a great night. >> thanks. >> weekends on cspan2 are an intellectual feast. every saturday in american history tv documents america's story and on sunday book tv brings you the latest in nonfiction books and authors. funding for cspan2 comes from these television companies and more including charter communications. >> broadband is a force for empowerment. that is why charter has invested billions building infrastructure, upgrading technology, empowering opportunity and communities it big and small. charter is connecting us. >> charter communications along with these television companies support cspan2 as a public

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american story. at 2:00 p.m. eastern on the presidency, part seven of our eight part series first lady in their own words. we'll look at the role of the first lady, their time in the white house and the issues important to them for this week we will feature michelle obama. >> with every action we take it. with every word we utter, we think about the millions of children who are watching us. who hang onto our every word, looking to us to show us who they can and should be. and that is why every day, we tried to be the kind of people, the kind of leaders that your children deserve it. whether you agree with our politics or not. >> at 2:45 p.m. eastern the white house historical association state conference on the american president focusing on topics such as history and >> engagement, digital history, first lady impact and influence and interpreting slavery and race at historic sites.

exploring the american story. what american history tv saturday on c-span2 and find a full schedule on your program guide or watch online anytime at c-span.org/history. >> my name is katherine boyle emmett recent recent partum please to be here to welcome off their jimmy soni to discuss his new book the founders by the story of paypal me entrepreneurs who shaped silicon valley prayer is especially wonderful to be a because i knew jimmy and my early 20s. this book really takes place in talking a group of people who support each other at work really to get him and lifelong friends meeting after college meet in the early 20s is very special for me as a former fellow journalist and writer to be interviewing him because we shared that time together as well. from a fairly non- startup and