>> for a congresswoman joins us with policing and race after leaving congress to the police institute initiative on police reform. explained the mission of this project you are working on now and how you got involved. >> good morning john and to your listeners or your viewers. it's good to be back with you

working through the national policing institute has gone on for two years and initially we thought maybe it would be three months but then we realize that there was so much we needed to look at and it was research-based not only law enforcement but the faith community other communities social service representatives. i believe we were able to do some good work. we know that we have some problems. spending 27 years in law enforcement is a profession that i love. working with the greatest the most courageous and compassionate men and women but we have had some problems. as you know over the last two years now almost three cents the death of george floyd we have been on police reform so the institute mission has always been look at policing and race.

so the group and the council came together looking at everything from policies and procedures, specialized units, community based programs that could help reduce crime and the overall mission to look at public safety in a more holistic way it is not just the responsibility of the police but it takes a community to be involved to keep us all safe and to file stronger community i know that's what we all want. host: joining us onon the same day that on the op-ed pages you can see her common pleas leaders must reform themselves she will talk about it this morning with us for about the next 35 minutes or so.

congresswoman we have all seen a tyree nichols videos edited several different videos of what has been released so far. what is your reaction? >> after a 27 year law enforcement officer and chief of police and someone who social worker before becoming a policesa officer, i saw the video and it was shocking and appalling. i think that every good person every decent person, every good and decent police officer and executive should see the video as shocking and appalling and what i have looked at as a place executive i have had the opportunity to review and look at what

happens and what occurred and the person who was stopped what did they do to dictate the actions of the police do they dictate the response of the police? i have lookedre in a know the investigation is ongoing that the video is pretty clear. we should not ask anyone to not believe their own eyes or ears. the video is pretty clear it is a night that went off the rails. and i have not been able. the chief is still reviewing and still trying to find the justification for the stop in the first place. i have not beenat able to see any justification. let me say this. it is a tough subject but we have to get this right. what happened to tyree nichols and his family and community

and friends every decent person going through we have got to come together to processes and programs in place and legislation toro prevent things like this from happening again. host: the headlines a seventh officer has been relieved of duty and of course as you talked about already the specialized unit with them being with those specialized policing units sure they have these types of units? >> we had specialized units when i was appointed chief crime was at the all-time high in orlando the murder rate they wanted the police to do something about it so we have specialized units as well.

as i said orlando was the target was thehe worst of the worst the gang members and drug dealers those that were committing gungu violence. we had a list and we knew who they were so to target that behavior citizens appreciate it because they wanted crime reduced i remember getting calls and those who live in neighborhoods to say they tried to go to church they have to go through the drug dealers to get to church and tired of seeing their grandchildren walk to the bus stop and begin cost of by the drug dealers everyone regardless deserves to live in safe and secure i had a year i

had to disband because the department had a certain mission and policies and procedures that within some specialized units one of safety and service one specialized unit can develop their own toxic culture. they are created for the right reasons but to have the most highly trained and seasoned officers within the units and be sure you are giving proper supervision. one thing that is important not to leave the officers there we have to rotate the men and women within the specialized units. host: and this could so-called

scorpion unit operation to restore peace in our neighborhoods created late 2021 shut down on saturday one day after the police chief there had defended it. on calls of reform calling the george floyd act passed the house for not the senate last congress. what did that do and if it had been passed is there anything that would have prevented what happened here? >> i was disappointed that the joy aid —- george floyd justice policing act failed in the senate. is not perfect legislation. we all know that. i certainly didn't think it was perfect there were some areas that id didn't necessarily agree with. but we needed to do something.

it seldom protects anyone and developing national standards that will help give police department tools that they need. we have over 18000 law enforcement agencies in our country god bless the men and women who do the job right every day it is a tough job doneav have 36000 some sql is ten or less. so i believe development of national standard in terms of hiring and training and proper use of equipment especially coming from the federal government to let me go back to hiring. we know we have to have the people with the temperament for the job giving place at departments funding whatever

it takes to expand their scope to hire people but also diversity it always has been and is still important the training we know that for the police departments they all have different training budgets. the george floyd act would have allowed for minimum training standards that could give men and women in the tools to better be able to protect members of the community modifying policies like a chokehold and the no knock warrant. we had a policy that said you cannot strike a person above the shoulder unless you were justified to use deadly force. why? because a strike above the shoulders could cause death or great bodily harm.

we saw in the video what we all saw tragically with our own eyes were officers to kick tyree nichols onn the head. they punched him in the face they beat him with a baton and theyey tased him having a national database that requires one police officer and even in another state. that not with just cause and then to go apply and get hired at another agency. and then increasing accountability. increased accountability. when those officers know they will be held accountable and pay the consequences for bad behavior of course our hope

with that performance with citizen interaction so know the georgeyd floyd act was a step in the right direction and that's why legislation passed in the house there's not even much of an appetite to protect members of congress. for my brothers and sisters to take matters into their own hands after george floyd i called the executives andlo said if you are the federal government telling you what to do that look internally and take action to modify your own policiesma. many of them did that and many did not and look where we are today. we have to do something. host: congresswoman demings is

our guest through the national policing institute council on policing reform.org. starting on the democratic line good morning. >>caller: good morning have a quick question do they ever test the officers? i am blind but i heard what was going on but it sounded like a pack of wild jackals. i thought the rage from steroids maybe that's a problem. what do you think. >> thank you for your question whenever has person has authority and use of think way and certainly resulting in the

death of any individual i would call any of them a wild jack also i will start with that. i also believe going back to the hiring to take greater steps to make sure we are hiring the right people i remember the chief of police get 40000 applications within one year only hiring 20 individuals. but it is important and also believe the recruitment process should involve psychological evaluation. but we cannot just stop there. one of the first bills i supported in congress was the law enforcement wellness activity sure it is a tough job let's make sure we are

doing regular checkups to make sure we are taking care of mental issues and physical issues and spiritual issues and then increasing our odds to do so. andur then everything that they need to survive. host: to your home state of florida republican line good morning. >>caller: good morning. this word salad we are listening to will doso nothing to solve any of this and it never has done anything to solve any of this. the police reform ist. only half of it. we need people reform. stop with the disrespect. people would be so much better

off. i do this in my personal life. i get pulled over by police. on my hazard lights, i put down every single window for the approach the car so they can see inside and put my hands on the steering wheel and say yes sir and no sir and answer every question. respect has to start in the home which thou demings does not want to talk about or in the schools. people need to be taught in driver education classes instead of talking about transgender bathrooms that people like val demings want to talk about. host: good morning. let me just say this. i grew up in florida and jacksonville with two parents in thehe home and they taught me to be respectful parents teachpe

their children to be respectful. i heard your earlier segment talking about just a general lack of respect. and then to get back to respecting each other so let me say this. that may be something to different people that nobody deserves to be beaten to death by a police officer. i did the job and dog on it. i love the men and women who do the job.

that we send a message that everybody counts and everybody is accountable i'm sure he reviewed the same video that i did and lord knows i cannot find anything tyree nichols said or did that shows a level of disrespect to the officers. officers are trained and going back for de-escalation is very important that we wanted to be a national standard. as a matter of fact the only person on the scene to listen and watch trying to de-escalate was tyree nichols. >>caller: good morning.

i have an uncle was a police officer with the new york state trooper. and about ten or 15 years ago i felt that police did not deserve my respect. i was in a snowstorm headed to work at 10:30 p.m. i slipped through the red light but the police officer in amherst stopped and yell at me i should be off the road. without even giving me the respect why i was on the road. then another time i was in a car accident.

work in the emergency department and the work that mostmo of them do even there the city officer would blow up so here he has the unstablebl patient screaming at me but what i would like to say i never had the experience with the state trooper. my point is we need to note the state troopers are doing what they used to recruit people and how they train people because they are always respectful it's a different level and it shouldn't be. >> we had a whole policy on regulation and of being respectful not just to each other but certainly to

the citizens that we serve to have that entire regulation. just all of the good men and women u from any reform who do the job. let me say this. so when you talk about policing and public safety and one of the things that the counselor looked at but don't just include the police everybody counts but everybody is accountable which allto means we have a responsibility to police our communities. there is a whole other aspect of violent crime prevention section it basically says commissioner david brown was

the police chief in dallas when he made the statement not enough mental health funding give it to the place not enough drug addiction let the police handle it. and orange county florida the orange county gel is the biggest drug treatment region. in the the commissioner went on to say give it to the police they will w handle it and then chief brown ended with we are asking our cops too do too much. so while we'rere making sure our officers with the best training and equipment to utilize that equipment and holding them accountable , there are consequences for that action we also have to deal with the social ills in

community in the first place and in 1968 it is president johnson course it was 58 or 68 and to have the council that looked at this issue and giving the best training but then they said we have to deal with unemployment and low wagess and substandard education in substandard housing and' homelessness if we will build a strong communities that we need we have to do the same things. so public safety police other front-line. takes the community and it does take the village to go where we needd to be. we have to address some of the

social ills. host: we have ten minutes left with congresswoman demings currently the cochair of the policing reform and race and you can find at counsel at policing reforms.org and their recommendations for these issues. taking your calls vancouver washington. >>caller: good morning i have seen what you have done in my community our shares department has changed for the better because they reach out to our community in a good way because officers are pulling people over by not giving them tickets they are just letting

them go because this could be a guy going home from work and made a simple error but it could of factnk is food or rent they are not jumping the gun they are actually trying to be friends with people in the community and it is working and dry lives it is working. so my comment is keep it up has that is what will change. i watched my brother get be in the late seventies almost to death. there was nothing i could do because they were for police officers who are big and strong. we were teenagers. they begin within an inch of his life i have changed a lot

is all under the bridge but the community will respond whenli police officers get friendlier and not so stern. that's my comment thank you for all you do. >> thank you for your kind comments. part of the work on the council focuses on the community police aspect of safety and service and the work that we did was research and evidence-based to invite everyone to take a look at the report but a major part is involvee the community in situations with regular town halls give yourself every

opportunitye. and involve them. it is okay in your decision-making. kept body cameras over a decade ago trying to be ahead and innovative and proactive. we were told our budget could not afford them but think god the municipalities found the money that they need it is just part of the work that needs to be done to develop a policy and how they would be storedor in be used and training it can be used to do a better job but it can also be used to help involve the citizens in thatci process number one it

increases understanding and number two it increases the buy-in and number three helps to improve trust between the police and the community and that is the direction regardless of the party, where you live, state, relationship that you have with the police , that is the direction we all need to be moving to come up with ways to help further develop trust between the police and the community and also have an attitude of safety and service. host: remind viewers of what qualified immunity is. >> when we think of the george floyd justice and policing act it is part of the legislation

in the u.s. senate. it does not just extend to law enforcement there is a belief that they are covered by qualified immunity and no one else is. really it isal extended more to people with certain official positions like mayors or governors or police officers. think of it this way, they have a duty to act. that is something we always have to keep in mind because we hear people say that police are treated differently. if i had done i would be behind bars. they have a duty to act. they cannot just look at a street fight on the corner and say i'm not going over there because i am white and they are black andnd then i will be called a racist and then i

might end up in prison before it is over. they have a duty to act and they are up one —- obligated. because of that duty to act comes with certain protections. and provisions they are not looked at just like any other citizens or a t person of any other profession who does not have that duty to act any effort or discussion about qualified immunity would prevent good officers from doingff their job. but the provisions are not about that officers doing their jobs, it's about holding that officers accountable and every police executive says i don't want to

do that. host: just a fewew more phone calls chatting on policing reform and the recommendations from her group from lakeland florida thank you for waiting. >>caller: good morning. i must start off by saying i absolutely love you. used to call you my political girlfriend. i will say this i and in lakeland down the road from orlando. it is bad when you have w people in tampa say they will go to orlando because they have to go through lakeland. right now a friend of mine's son you probably seen it it was on viral he was handcuffed on the ground being kicked by police. this kind of thing has been going on forever. my question is i don't know if this gets better or worse it's about the same from my

viewpoint because when we were younger a friend of made mine got hot grease kicked on him by the police a lot of people settle out of court there is no real conviction so they just get moved to different areas so with great power comes great responsibility and i am wondering it seems like all we're doing now is catching the stuff on videotape. okay we have the video of what went onve in memphis and the video of george floyd but will these people ever be charged? >> part of your conversation and comments cut out but the bottom line is you asked a question is it getting

better? let me say this. place officers patrol every community in our nation and they do it 24 hours a day, seven days a week including holidays. so that alone, think of the number of hours and citizen encounters at the men and women in blue have every day, all day long so that lets us know what has gotten better. talk about your relatives kicked on the ground and it is on video no one especially with your situation especially in memphis with george floyd it was brutal and senseless and murder. the person involved with

george floyd have been held accountable. the officers were quickly fired, relieved of duty five of the seven the other investigations are ongoing. they are being held accountable. and that is what we want to see. yes we have a long way to go it is not the responsibility of our counsel or one person'snt police department the community issueco the community is the police and the police is the community. but we should be encouraged by the swift action we have seen with the george floyd case to add and tyree nichols.

let's keep moving forward and i know in doing that it is an emotional issue the police have a tough job. i get it. i have done it but we also have provisions in place to not only protect the citizens that we serveve but also police officers that is what police executives taking responsibility for their own changes that's what they can do to help protect innocent people those police officers going after prison, no one wants to see that but seeing a young man or woman lose their life unnecessarily and tragically, no one should want that either.

host: one more call in from panama city republican line. >>caller: do you believe in the no cash bail? and why are so many policeman retiring or quitting because of the pressure? i will hang up and wait for your answer. >> thank you for your question. i was there are not too long ago. i remember when i was the police chief and that was over a decade ago. for a lot of police officers are hired with academy classes 60 or 70 or 80 or more. and i can remember saying we will have 100 police officers

retire next year and hoping and praying the mayor will allow us to higher before they leave so they can be trained and ready to hit the streets i know there has been an effort for those police officers running for the doors because of the pressure of the community. that's not true. the job has always been tough. going to workyo every day knowing you can be shot at are not see your family again or god forbid whatever that is a tough job in the men and women who are willing to do it but it has always been a challenge r for policing. and the job is getting tougher. it probably is. do you know why?

because of gun violence, drug dealing and gang activity. it is a tough job they don't have the tools in the training that they need to do the job. let's make sure that they do. there is no simple answer to this. we need to give our mens and women the tools they need. today we should want to give them the tools they needed to do the job 50 years ago. let's keep moving in the right direction. we can do this. host: for congress from demingsston now is counsel for policing reform.org. with the work she has been doing since leaving congress. thank you for chatting with us. >> thank you. take care.