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who need it most. charter communications c-span as a public service along with these other television providers. giving you a front row seat to democracy. >> our first guest of the morning is toni preckwinkle. she is the cochair of community known as counties for guaranteed income. is also present the cook county board of commissioners in illinois. tonito preckwinkle thank you for joining us on the program today. >> thank you so much for invitingit me. >> on both of those friends are advocating for something called a guaranteed basic income. can you talk aboutca that push from both of those titles you hold currently? >> first of i think is important for us to remember this is not a new idea. martin luther king in the c 1960s talked about the importance of providing an economic floor for rp guaranteed basic and can.

answered your document guaranteed employment or income for residents of the united states. this is an old idea that is that concurrency recently. with that municipal level and we are organizing at the county level those who are engaged in this work. and ofi course doing it here in cook county, they're doing it in los angeles at the event earlier this week we heard from people in minnesota who were engaged in his work. so all overa the country counts and municipalities are highlighting, modeling guaranteed income programs. >> cook county talk a little bit about the experience of getting that thing started and what has been the reaction to it? >> first about let me think might chief of staff. when the american rescue plan act dollars came to us, we spent a year trying to figure out where the best investments we can make of that money but we

did not start spending it immediately we said let's be this.tful about s oneee of the ideas that bubbledp was guaranteed income. i again went to the former mayor from stockton, california had the first guaranteed income pilot program in the country that i am aware of anyway. it was a a year-long pilot investingve by lottery stockton. they did some academic evaluation of participants and found that people invested in their own education and support for their children took some time to try to reflect on where they wanted to grow. and at the end the participants in the program as opposed to the control group were more likely to be employed, more likely to pursue their education. more likely to have pursued theirion and support for children. all the positive outcomes you would hope and expect from program likera this.

so, our programs authorize our board of commissioners our legislature in the fall. we got the first checks out in january 3250 participants. $500 a month for two years. now we are going tont continue e program with her own resources on the americredit resource plan dollars are exhausted. we have made a long-term commitment to this. at the 42 million largest government-sponsored program in the country. >> if i read this in cook county they are 200 30,000 plus people applied to vent cook county's program. what were the requirements going into it and once they get the money have requirements as which they do at that? >> two and 50% of poverty was the threshold.

233,233,000 individuals and families unfortunate were only able to support 3250. there is a great need for support. those of the local level whether cities or counties are trying to make the case the states and the federal government to step up to do this work. in w the meantime may gauge own pallets and models. >> once they get the money are they required to join thing with it or spend it on certain things? government gives social security payments to senior citizens with gray hair like me no one tells us how to spend the money. we have confidence of the people or countries are going to spend it wisely. >> judicially some sort of testing for these types of funds? >> in our program give to have 250% is a family income or less.

that was a means.ea my view it's easier politically to support programs for which everyone is eligible. any senior citizen get social security payments. in my view it should be more broad that we've been able to do with our modest resources. but that's up to the federal government for the future but for the moment our thrush it was shown% of poverty, two and half times the poverty level or less. >> our guest with us until 8:45 p.m. if you want to ask about not only cut counties experienced in illinois on the larger idea of a guaranteed income if you want to ask her questions (202)748-8001 for republicanss (202)748-8000 for democrats. (202)748-8002 for independent

space with the text as you can do that (202)748-8003. tell us about counties are guaranteed in comfort how many counties are involved in the support of challenges? versus other localities and municipalities when approaching these types of programs. >> we had more than a dozen folks who were with us when we announce the program on monday i'm very grateful for the fact they came from all over the country. two cochairs from los angeles and chicago. leaders from all of the country or representatives i'm growing very grateful for that. it has been percolating for a while. we are grateful we are at the point we have the resource to explore some of hisso investmen. >> host: , ask about that this time is money's company plan what authorizes you to use the money and that way

within the requirements? >> one of the blessings as there weren't restrictions but you cannot use it to pay debt. other than that you can disrespect any project or initiative he felt was critical. that is where the beauties of the program. individuals cities, counties, states could make decisions how they want to invest the money. different choices were made in different places based on local needs. if you are the t of a column in the "new york post" about the she said this specifically strings to giveaways empowering people to take care of their families come pursueducation find better employment. these are the same golking people has people who are not make ends meet need help or

not people sit on the couch or choose to live in many do in los angeles but that'sct the referee that's a quote how you react to that? >> i've never heard of this person. let me just say this is not a general view of our people in this country. with never said you're not working. and exactly what the lady said two or three jobs. this gives them a little bit of a financial cushion. to people who are working some of whom are looking for employment some of whom are disabled for this is a real lifeline. i don't know about you, what i was growing up we did not have veryry much. it would have been very helpful to my family to have this kind of support. both of my parents were working.

we've got to look out for each other and not look for opportunities to disparage or diminish folks who may not have had the same opportunities are good fortune that we have. >> asked about how you verified the income of those getting the money? >> we have access to social security numbers. therefore we get information about their employment. they tell us what their income is time w we move ahead in that way. let me just say we have an academic partner the university of chicago which is looking at a control group and how they fare in our participants and how they fare. analyzing results telling stories of the people who are involvedan. not just received at that initiative like this it's

important for us to look at the data, what's happening to people who participate in the program. we have that academic partner. he won toni preckwinkle she is the president of the cook county board of commissioners per our first call for you comes from jim. jim iss in pennsylvania republican like you are on our guest go through question or comment please. >> caller: good morning pedro. so we are going to get into social engineering and control them. i would like to ask this woman what gives government the right to take the fruits of one man's labor and give it to somebody else? where does that basic concept come from? we too would listen government all the time. let me just say and some of the states which are so opposed to

government control or relation or intervention or whatever they call they get several dollars back from the federal government for every time they continue. what comes to mind to the governor of arkansas talks about rawere going to these federal bureaucrats off your back. it doesn't help it arkansas contributes against two or $3 back in the federal government given the federal government off your back there are lots of ways in which government supports people. we provide farmers with subsidies. in supports rural communities we would live in the city i've never lived in a farmer we work to see their opportunities in rural america for our children but what's happening is is being

depopulated people moving to the city's economic it's very hard for rural areas. the thirdth be investing in supporting rural t areas. social security programs or medicare programs. the federal government to invest in military and young people in our military. they invest in people very few of those programs have lots of barriers to participation for this is a program that provides people with support and assistance. we do check every month you figure out to c make sense with you and your family the subject social security payments. check onn the senior's mitchell using money responsibly, come on. >> another viewer off of twitter said social security money is

money returning tooew the taxpa. big difference, it is their money. >> yes but the federal government when they initiated social security program are considerably less than they are now. considerablyly less. many people were able to utilize her social s security benefits r five or maybe 10 years. we are in a place now with life expectancies many of us get a lot more out of the purity system that we put in for a count of younger workers to continue to support the system and make possible the federal government commitment to make that possible. i gave the example about farm subsidies part farmer so put any money in the government to support subsidies the federal government decides is important to our economy andra to our country to support agricultural workers and agricultural owners. there are some programs people put in and get money back. but there are many programs in

which we decide this is important we are going to support it. text georgia democrats lied richard you're next for our guest, good morning. >> caller: good morning. i firmly believe a living wage for americans should beat $25 an hour. and i will tell youd why. i was able to pay for my car, my mortgage, my 401(k), health iinsurance. and also i worked overtime as much as i could in order to build my social security account so i can benefit the fruits of my labor is i am now retired as a chemical operator from a foreign government that paid as well. a foreign company that paid as well. and i firmly believe. here in the south the cost of living is cheaper than it is up north. i go back and forth to pennsylvania where i am from.

i'm also on veteran but i am not retired military. a living wage, $25 an hour so you can pay for all the things i mentioned. 401(k), health insurance, car loan, mortgage, that is as a single man. could you imagine what it would be for young couples with two children or three children? a living wage $25 an hour. what i write richard you made the point under guest respond to that. >> this is not a special about living wage is probably the gentleman is correct. what is at minimum wage $7.12 absence an hour? there's no place in the country can support yourself on $7.25 an hour in multiple jobs or multiple wage earners the family to make it. is absolutely corrected. we need to raise the minimum wage considerably. removing productive development of an hour that makes a lot more

sense but i agree with him when he said inn more than 15 pair bt at thear moment what we are talking doesn't guarantee basic income. see what for the 3250 people on the program in cook county how does that break down as farce families versus single people?op doesn't break down as far as who is receiving it? >> thank you from getting a little help here. [laughter] this is why you have staff, right? gender demographics 71% are women, 20% are men. 51% are african-american 29% are white, 5% are asian 2% are native. total% are multiracial. 24% are latino. 85% are in suburban cookin couny 15% in the city. we skewed our program toward the suburbs the city of chicago had its own guaranteed income program and there is no other supports for people in the suburbs.

most of our participants are suburban to 56% are working. 56% are working. 31% delayed medical turn last year due to the cost for a 15% have a disability. so let me just say the overwhelming majority are work you have a disability. we went to michael and north carolina independent line, hi. >> yes hi. a couple of times a lady brought up they checked income from people receiving social security. i heard another guy bring this up too. then she said more people are outliving their term of social security. i will also want to bring it to her attention onto people are waiting to sign up for social security a later age two. like my wife didig not sign up until she was 72 and they used

to sign up at 62. the other issue i have is there too many handouts. we have people in this country that are getting disability we have another 70 million people that are getting welfare help. if people just had jobs, which we have plenty of jobs. if they were told to go do those jobs and stop taking the handouts one thing i thinki should be done is if people are working and not receiving enough money, said the government giving the money to not work they should give them an extra bonus for working that's for them it's all going to say. >> look i believe the importance of work. it's part of a sense of ourselves. there are people who are in a difficult place either because of their health in a particular

area is not readily available there is a real challenge there. one of the have done get more educationtt they can better participate in the workforce are more opportunities. it's just a little bit of extra money often helps people to make that choice and pursue that education that enables them toha work. we also 15% of the people in the program are disabled. i'm sure the judge would not suggest we in the country who are able-bodied should not help those who are disabled. i don't think he wants to say that. providing people who are struggling with opportunity benefits us all for they will be more productive citizens at the end. in contributing to social security for older people like me. more young people able to

support their families. we are at a point in this many young people they postpone the decision to have children because they know cap they cannot afford it. we don't want that we want people to feel comfortable in doing that. have parental leave have inexpensive childcare. we have lots in terms of family support democratic party has always supported things like publicly supported child care. parental leave, things that really support families. we want to continue to do that. frankly, allbe of us in this country should be supporting our younger workers and younger families for the future of our f nation. >> i understand t is part of tht you had aro living wage that pas the city council at the time. what was it like these programs

back then what you're seeing now? the environment is much more friendly and announce these kind of initiatives. at least here in illinois. for most of the rest the country the minimum wage is 7025 cents an hour. no onene can support themselves alone their family. even inac places with the cost f living is low on a minimum wage job. that's wise one of our collars we have so many people doing three jobs enable them to supportse themselves. one of the gentleman suggested if we could raise the minimum wage. if we could supply support for families inexpensive childcare reasonable parental leave. those would be really helpful in terms of family support.

>> hearing kansas roger, democrats line go-ahead. >> yes i was calling about i don't feel like we need to give more free benefits outt there. especially one like this. i don't believe it would be the best of our money being spent i think it would increase people not doing as much. we give many a way to the farm bill that's when i happen to be as a farmer. our farm bill is coming up almost 80% giveaway to welfare into programs and children's school programs that is the majority of our farm bill. i thought i would clarify that fearlessness. >> i cannot speak to the specifics. to the extent of the support school lunches for our kids food

security for families it's money well spent. i am not an expert on the farmville. i cannot say how the money is spent but i'm not sure and take the gentleman's word for it. to the extent we are supporting school lunches for kids and food security for families it's money well spent. >> in florida margaret republican line you are next, out. click suit y mention that means testing two and 50% of poverty level. he had more people then you have money for. why didn't you just to the poverty level? why didve you offer the people above are the more of the poor people? >> who wanted to be a little more expansive and who is eligible for the program.

we had tos break it somewhere that is where we chose. a quarter of the population of the county would've been eligible for our program but i wish we had a lot more we have demand from american rescue plan resources that we have. we devoted 42 million which is the largest amount in the country for these models. >> made a commitment to continue the program of the federal resources as ice said. excellent ask you you this then, how are these programs you can specifically talk about yours or others. how do they remain sustainable? >> for us we have created an equity fund for the printer cannabis revenues and trying to identify the revenue streams we can use to support this program on an ongoingsu basis. >> as far as the other programs that you have along the other counties that are involvedth in this the sustainability?

>> i have explained the choice we have made great cannot speak to the choices other counties have made i'm not that familiar with them. we have an equity fund we create in the midst of the pandemic to hear how we can better target resources. putting her cannabis revenues and were trying to figure out what other we can dedicate to it we have the resources to continue programs like this one. >> gary in connecticut hi there. >> good morning. i wanted to bring up an idea that was proposed in the 60s. by the society. it's a very moderate republican group from michigan. what they proposed was resolve a minimum annual cash income be

provided to all americanri citizens. the way the programrk worked thn was that families living under the poverty line which was $4000 you brought up the $5000 but it doesn't end there. all americans during the first 4000 would not be tax amount on that amount of money. now for those who are living on the poverty line what would happen is if they went to work instead of losing that benefit but they would get was 50% of the difference between whatey ty earned in a top number that was set than a 10,000 dollars. in other words if an impoverished family got the first $5000 and went out and earned $3000, they would get another $1500 from the

government without taxes. >> only because were short on time motion like a guest to elaborate on that? >> if she is familiar with the society plan? >> i am not familiar with the plan. i do know however richard nixonc republican of the united states was contemplated a guaranteed income program at one point before he got in so much trouble with watergate. this is not an idea thus to the democratic party in the past not just the society's adjustment had suggested at present the united states, richard nixon supported and was considering some implementation of a guaranteed income program. >> is this a bipartisan issue or largely partisan issue you think? >> at the moment i think it's a partisan issue was more bipartisan in the past and we hope it will be more bipartisan

in the future. that's part of the recent release pilot and models to build - the case this is a good way to invest. >> thank you touched on it when you're developing your program in cook county. whether is the country to look to as far as examples or models to base this on? >> well as i said i credited major tubs from stockton, california who put a plan in place a number of years ago. with the benefits of the research that was associated with that program. that is the most recent national model. there've been other philanthropic efforts in the provided people with resource but in terms of government i investment in recent times its major tubs in stockton that we turn too. let me just make a broader point. i am a teacher. take the teacher out of thee classroom.

[laughter] when i was teaching geography i would ask my students what is the most important resource that in the country has? the kids would say it's like oil or gold sometimes they would say water, the more thoughtful ones. we would talk for a while and they've get to the point where hopefully somebody said the most importantor resource in any country has is its people. so if we invest in her own residence or make them best investments we possibly can. that is what guaranteed basic income is. so went democrats out hear from harold in houston, texas good morning. >> yes good morning. i just wanted to say i support the program that tony is talking about pretty think it's a wonderful thing. you're saying there are a lot of

people in the low pay range making less than 30,000 dollars. it's all races of people. it helps those who are single and ones who might have kids and below the poverty line it would help them. as far as what gives us a right, we as a christian nation it's the christian thing to do. so that is a goodth thing. i just wanted to let the lady know i've been talking to my family about something like that. people making $15000 year on social security that's another things and less than 30, they need at least $50 a more a week, $100 or more or something like that. and might cut down on a lot of crime. a lot of these people committing

crimes knowing they're getting a little something in every week or month or something like that. some people might think that's a bad thing throwing money at crime but it can be a good thing. >> think you color. >> yes i think if you provide people with a modest resource there are some people who might commit crimes of desperation with a little bit of resource they won't feel so desperate. so think that's a good thing is welcome the gentleman is correct because a couple people texting twin this is toni inn florida saying has consideration be given to the inflationary effects of attic more money into the economy with no commencement production? what source of illicit opportunity for people to invest in themselves but invest in their own education. invest in their kids. and those kind of investments,

most of us to have resources make all the time. we invest in college education for our kids. we invest in ourselves continuing education the higher education for ourselves. not that they're great investments of a suggesting that money on education or whatever inflation to spend the money on keeping a roof over your head or making sure kids are fed. nobody talks about that being inflationaryat. i'm not worried about the inflationary impacts. i'm worried about our academic partners making the best bridgeview analysis of the program they can ensuring the stories of how people individualize have been transformed and their families have been transformed by thesese investments were quick to talk about that academic partnership we haver a viewer who talks abt or makes the statement another program that could be used or abused with no oversights. this academic partner in your case provide oversight or is

there another means of specific oversight and how these funds are used? >> is not oversight it is analysis and review. i think we have to trust our citizens to make good investments. how can i say this,. [laughter] there a lot of programs ingr ths country that have focused on helping people with veryes modet means is if there's something matter with them. a lot of our employment programs we have not talked about enough in my mind impacts of racism through no fault of their own to

succeed in life. invest in them send me more successful which is good for all this. not just that individual family. will be more productive over their lifetime. that's good for our country. investing in our own people is a great thing for us to do as a country. stuart new york michelle republican line the cochair counties for guaranteed income but also present the cook county board of commissioners in illinois, michelle go ahead. >> good morning folks. i'm sitting here and watching it's all about communities, it's all about programs for them. but we are watching in palestine, ohio right now.

the entire city be nuked by chemicals. where's the federal government there? there's not even fema on the ground. i verified that. it seems to me we are picking who are the winners and who are the losers. no one is doing anything about ohio. then we have a train wreck in south carolina texas, arizona had a chemical spill yesterday. that's all about equity. nobody cares about those people right now in ohio who are struggling to just get by with burns on their face, animals dying constantly constantly equity. >> okay, thanks michelle. >> i don't think those two things are mutually exclusive. i agree we have had these train accidents and fires at oil refineries. and whatever.

those are man-made disasters, right? we are quick as a lady points outl to respond sometime to natural disasters to hurricanes, wildfires whatever sometimes were not quick enough to respond to man-made disasters. but that's not what we're talking network talking but guaranteed basic income. i am not prepared to defend the federal response to the train accident in ohio. i think that is that nightmare it's a man-made disaster. i can't respond because i do not know the ways the federal government has stepped up or failed to step up. the federal government response on all of our behalf to disasters.s. and frankly here in chicago don't a lot of her organs i do not begrudge the federal government spending money to help american residents respond to a hurricane when there's been a hurricane in florida. i think they ought to come in and help people. if there is a tornado in

minnesota where a group there's lots of trance the federal government spends money helping people who are victims of tornado sets a good investment by the federal government. our people in the west struggling with wildfires the federal government ought to help those people we don't have wildfires illinois with the governmentlp should help those people. >> ohio, eyewitnesses kim independent line. >> good morning. you're doing a good job in illinois about the commission preserving the constitution about corporations, 75 corporations. [inaudible] 80% ever federal tax and 20 for the citizens. it seems like it has been twisted. it seems like we are paying 80 and they are paying 20 or less. that is white each state has to come with a commission like you guys to sit here and distribute the money to the poor.

even though the majority and they are telling the oil subsidies that's a waste of clean big oil for sabotage in what's happening with the trains and all the chemical spills. so when we go to the state of each state i noticed were paying 80% of the taxes and 20% the federalist paying. it should be the opposite we would not have poverty. will not have the commission you are having if everyone do it the right way. crime is down at the small but the big ones are getting billions in showings of dollars in subsidy. stu went thank you. >> guest: let me say words of this pilot program andar other suturing models as well. on the hope will prove up this is a goode idea the federal government ought to take up as you point out the federal

government has the lion's share of the resources were discussed with the federal government to support our people all across the country. i am not sure about the tax policy issues but i will say that in the long run the foregoing have effective guarantee income program. >> will take over call this week from janice in brooklyn, new york democrat line. >> hi good morning. i just love the program. i have to send my sister $200 and georgia press enter money every month. she works six days a week sometimes 10 hours a day and barely makes enough. i'm sorry. at the beginning of the program you stated that you were able to use this money because there are no rules. desantis is in the same line to integrate across the country.

talk about social security. social security gets an increase why can't we do that also with the minimum wage? this is needed there a lot of them as other struggling right now for six hours for eggs, corporations. i commend you for what you're doing because you are helping ag lot of families that should be spread across thehe country. >> that's a viewer i forgot the state but go ahead. >> and very grateful to have the opportunity to be with you this morning and have talked about guaranteed basico me income. as i said the most important the best investments we can make in our own people. this is the way we can invest in our own. i hope other cities, towns, villages, counties will consider this kind ofsi initiative we cat make the case and it would persuade the federal government this is something we ought to

do. >> of the end of the pilot what would you like to see happen? what results would you like to see?o >> i want to be able to share with not just the people of cook licounty the state of illinois t across the country the results of the program when we can figure how we can invest in more of our residents. again this is 3250 folks that have 233,000 applicants. how we can address more of our residents and make these programs larger brick works are guests cochair counties for guaranteed income she is also the president of the cook county board of commissioners in illinois. toni preckwinkle joining us for this conversation. thank you for your time. >> thank you. ♪ c-span's washington journal every day we take your calls live on the air of the news of the day i would discuss policy issues that impact you. coming up thursday morning

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