like this where americans can see democracy at work, where citizens are truly informed our republic thrives. get informed straight from the sources on c-span. unfiltered, unbiased, word for word. from the nation's capitol to wherever you are, you get the opinion that matters the to mosa matters the most is your own, this is what democracy looks like. c-span,ab powered by cable. >> a year ago this weekend roe v. wade was overturned. for a conversation on what's happened in the states over the past 12 months when it comes to abortion excess, we're joined by kelly biden, vice president of policy at the goodmaker institute. remind folks what the institute is. >> guest: sure. it's a research and policy organization working to advance sexual and reproductive health and rights worldwide. that looks like everything from estimating global incidence of abortion to researching barriers to contraception here in the u.s. a and using that as an

instrument to inform advocacy with policymakers. >> host: goodmaker.org is where viewers can find out it if you want to check it out, a link to this report, abortion policies, the landscape one year post-roe v. wade. this is the lead prr, one year after the united states supreme court'sth decision in dobbs very jackson to overturn roe v. wade, the status of abortion rights in many states is dismal, and complex legal questions continue to create chaos and confusion. there's also bright with spots that can chart a pathway to more state and federal protections for abortion. start first on the dismal aspects. what would you describe as dismal? >> guest: absolutely. well, it's the current reality which is that 19 million of reproductive age right now live in a state that has banned abortion or severely restricted it with an early abortion ban such as georgia. i think importantly opponents of abortion have spent the last 50 years since roe roe v. wade was

the decided trying to overturn it and in the meantime, greatly restricting abortion inea whater way they could at the state level, thousands of bills and lawses. so several of those were what we call trigger bans which were bans intended to go into effect as soon as the supreme court allowed them to do so. and so a year ago right after the dobbs decision, nine states had abortion bans go into effect immediately or soon after. and since then it's just gotten worse. we have 13 states that have fully banned abox 1 where abortion is unavailable due to, again, legal come for examplety and i chaos which i think is the keyword, and a series of abortion restrictions tied up in the courts or being considered or passed by states this year. >> an interactive map on goodmaker.org where you can hook at the state of abortion access in the country. the darkest red there, the states that have the most restrictive access, and those are mostly the states with those trigger laws. explain what's happening in the darkest red states. >> guest: right. is so those are states that have

completely banned abortion with very limited exceptions. for example, they might have an exception for a pregnancy that resulted from sexual assault or that threatens a woman's health or life are. but we know that those kinds of exceptions are very difficult to access in practice. they really exist mostly in name only. and so you can see looking at that map and thinking about, you know, what we know about state legislatures and their political climates that there's really an entire region of the country where there is no legal abortion access. ctthat whole southeast region. which meanss that that for the past year someone in louisiana, for example, whoat wants or nees an abortion has had to figure out how to navigate across multiple state lines to get a legal abortion in a state where it is still allowed in a clinic. and so it's a really difficult, challenging situation that requires you to have money, childcare, time off work and an ability to navigate all of those barriers to get legal care. >> host: coming back to the ma ma map -- to that map, three states very restrictive, sort of

the next most restrict isive, the orange states, georgia, nebraska, arizona. >> guest: those are the states that haven't fully banned abortion but have enacted bans early in pregnancy, so that creates additional challenges not only again for people in that state, but for all of those people from the neighboring states who don't have legal are trying to get care this in those states. georgia, as i mentioned, has a very early ban on abortion at about six weeks which means that many people might not even know they're pregnant by then, and by the time they're able to get the appointment, get the money, get the time off work, they might not be able to access abortion in that state. similarly, nebraska made a lot of news this year by trying to enact a similar 6-week abortion ban. it failed, but they did end up getting a ban on abortion at 12 weeks attached to a gender-a affirming bill as well. really looking at how, i think, that story tells us how bans on abortion and on gender-affirming

care are really two sides of the same coin. and i think nebraska nebraska illustrates that really well. >> host: which brings up what you talked about in that report, the complex legal questions that are creating chaos and confusion, as you describe it. what's an example of that? >> guest: i think wisconsin is a good example. that is that 14th state where we say abortion is not legally banned per se is, but it's -- the legal questions are complicated enough that folks are chosen not to provide abortion care this. and so abortion is unavailable. so, you know, for all intents and purposes, it's very similar to operating under a climate of an a actual abortion ban. >> host: what's a preemption law? >> guest: a preemption law is when a state tells cities or localities in that state what they can or can't do. it kind of says that the state has precedence over attempts by a city or county county to do something. and i think where we're seeing that relate to abortion this yearar is with the series of county commissions or city councils who have tried to take

action. there, you know, for example, a blue city in a a red state and have tried to move to somehow protect abortion rights or access within their community, and the states have moved to kind of block that using this concept of preemption. >> host: why is oregon the one state you lives as the most protective of abortion access? >> oregon checks a lot of boxes in terms of good proactive policies. it was an early adopter of a bill called the reproductive health equity act which really recognized that not only is legal legality of abortion important, but your ability to pay for it, especially via insurance coverage, especially if you qualify for are public insurance cover aage. it's a big part of that equation. they've been able to enact a lot of laws not just focused on legality, but expand access. there are many other states that have done really wonderful things that we could talk about and, i think, really set up a series of recommendations for other states to consider. >> and we can talk about them throughout this half hour of the

"washington journal." kelly baden is our guest. phone lines, republicans, 20 2-748-8001. democrats, 20 the 20 2-748-8000, independents, 202-748-8002. she's with us until the bottom of the hour, i 9:30 a.m. eastern, and plenty of calls already. this is john in johnstown, pennsylvania. democrat. good morning. >> caller: good morning. my question pertains to the american medical association and how some of these states are treating doctors or threatening doctors with jail time or or prison time if they're performing an abortion, especially one that's totally necessary in the case of emergencies. you know,no i -- a lot of doctos are changing from o ob/gyn to just g nyn because of the fact that they're afraid of doing a certain procedure that a may be considered illegal. i think the american medical association oughts to givega up their rear end and protect those

doctors and file lawsuits against these states that are threateningar doctors jail timer prison time. if they're -- because a lot of these doctors are afraid to perform certain surgical procedures -- >> host: john, got your point. kelly, let me let you jump in. >> guest: yeah, i'm glad you raised the point because with i think what it tells us too is that abortion bans are not just impacting the people who need abortion care. they have a ripple effect on anybody who has a want pregnancy that they're hoping to continue safely. and i think to the your point, we've seen a lot of examples of doctors being unable to feel like they can provide the care a patient needs when they're facing an emergency because of this fear of criminalization urn an abortion ban in their -- under an abortion ban in their state. we have a lot of stories out of women whonews have, again, wanted pregnancies and they face a health emergency and they can't get care in their

local hospital, they're turned away, they're forced to the travel to another state. and so really i think while abortion iss a human right issue and i think everybody should care about at it just for that, i think also this climate now has the real impact on anybody to who can become pregnant or is pregnant or if you're somebody who loves somebody who is pregnant. it really touches us all. >> host: rockaway park, new york, this is nicki, independent. you're on with kelly baden. >> caller: good morning. ill like to ask -- i would like to the ask a, maybe two questions. how far -- how would you compare the way afghanistan treats women as opposed the to how republicans treat women in the united states? as far as women's rights. the second thing, since i'm a man, i don't believe i should have the right to tell a woman

what she can do with her own body because i'll be damned if some woman is going to tell me what i can do with my body. so i think thats it is your inherent right possibly listed under the tenth amendment, the unenumerate rights of individuals in this nation, that women have the right to control their own bodies. >> host: that's to nicky. >> guest: yeah. i think what's interesting now and what the dobbs decision a year ago has led to the is that the u.s. is now something of a global outlier on abortion rights. the trends in the last few years have been towards liberalization of abortion laws. we saw that in ireland, we've seen that throughout latin america, argentina, mexico and beyond with what's called the green wave, this amazing momentum of activists working to liberalize those really restrictive abortion laws

throughout latin america. and so with in this dobbs decision, the u.s. is really going backwards. and i think that is not a place that serves us well, and it certainly doesn't serve my of the people in this country well who -- any of the people in this country well who need access to care. >> host: sioux center, iowa, this is bonnie. republican. good morning. >> caller: goodni morning. what is the difference between a mother murdering a baby who's not born and is a bib bibby -- baby who is born? obviously, we outlaw the one. a a second thought is human beingsgs have distinct dna. anan unborn baby from the moment of conception is not only undeniably human -- not animal, not mineral, not vegetable -- it also has dna distinct from the mother. imi cannot do what i want with y body when it harms someone else. i can't put my right foot down on the accelerator and drive over a pedestrian and kill him.

mye body, my choice. i can't use my right hand to take a gun and murder somebody. that would alsoi be my body, my choice. >> host: kelly m baden.ch >> guest: so i i think, fortunately, most americans recognize that the situation's much more nuanced than the situation you've just described. i think it is important to know abortion has existed since the beginning of time. people have always tried to understand fertility and understand how to end a pregnancy when they needed to. i also hi that this question of when life begins is, it is a religious philosophy question. people for generation, centuries have tried to answer that for themselves, and i think that's what people should do, answer it for themselves in a way that matches their own values and not have that question be answered by elected officials at any level. >> host: going back to yourlu m, iowa, where the caller was just from, a state you have listed as a restrikive state.

i want to -- restrictive state. i want to talk about why you've listed it that way. it's a state where abortion is banded after 22 weeks, correct? >> guest: correct. so so we considered any ban on abortion at any point this pregnancy to be a restrictive measure of some kind. obviously, it kind of -- the variation or the gradation of that ranges. but when there are additional restrictions on i abortion in that state. so, again, it's already complicated, difficult to navigate throughte that obstacle of laws and policies to be able to get an abortion in that state. >> suzanne, el paso, texas. good morning, line for democrats. >> caller: good morning. oh, it's such a pleasure to talk to you today to the. i'm a support of goodmaker. i just wanted to mention back when i had my abortions, it was in thent late '80, early '90s, it was before there was a law that said the protesters had to stay across the street or, you

know, a certain number of yards away from the clinic. and what would happen is that they would just swarm you in the parking lot. so we had to have what they're called clinic escorts. and after my first abortion, i became a clinic escort. and what you do is you take the patient, you cover her head with, like, a heavy coat or a blanket or something, and you hold tight on to her, and if you just have to muscle your way through the from protesters -- through the protesters. they would get an inch away from yourrs face. they would scream at you, they would spit on you. they weren'the allowed to actuay physically assault you or block you, but they would, they would try to trip you, step on your shoe laces if you had shoe

laces. and it was a nightmare just to get from your -- the car to the front door. ask and i -- >> host: do you mind, what year was this, when you were acting as a volunteer? >> caller: this is -- oh, as a volunteer it was in the early '90s. is so i feel like they're doing exactly the same thing now only through judicial means and legislation, legislative measures. it's exactly, it feels exactly the same thing. and if i can just add, i encourage everybodydy to read gabrielle bayer's book "i jack late responsibly." -- ejaculate responsibly. it's justsi a great read. it's on booktv also, if you want to go see it on c-span.org. [laughter] justst a great -- it's a whole w way to think about abortion as

the subtitle. i encourage everybody to read this book. it's a great read. and that's what i have to say. thank you so much for what you do. >> host: thanks for mentioning booktv is and ourto coverage of that book. >> guest: yeah. of thanks for your support and also for sharing your abortion story thes. i think that's just such an important part of how we move busting through stigma and by sharing our own stories, so thank you,. and i think you raised such a good point about how the policy and legal climate also has other impacts when accessing abortion care,ic right? and this idea that people can stand outside a clinic and try to physically block somebody from accessing any reproductive health care and getting to their appointment is really outrageous and, you know, in the early '90s it was particularly green juice, and then we had something signed by then-president bill clinton with called the freedom of access to the clinic entrances. and since then there's been a series of policy and legal

attempts to, again, try to figure outtr those precise four corners of the law when it comes the what escorts or, excuse me, what protester thes outside clinics can or cannot do. >> host: georgia, independent, goodod morning. >> caller: good morning, y'all. how you doing, miss kelly? yes, ma'am. and i've watched the legislation since last year, and it's been, like, 500 pieces of legislation against women brought by mensch and -- by men. and in this case they have put the cart in front of the horse for over 50 years. if and with that the conversation has been the court. we need to be talking about the -- the cart. we need to be talking about the horse that brought all this mess up. it is men whose cause abortion. can ask yourself, who caused it? it takes men to cause an abortion. and there has only been one

sliver of anything against men in all of those 500 pieces of legislation. ma'am, i'm with y'all. i stand for it every day. when i ask a conservative who causes abortions, it ain't but one word. they look at me like they just got in the headlights of an oncoming truckment. >> host: kelly baden. >> guest: i think if we recognize abortion as an issue of fundamental bodily autonomy and dignity, that that really broadens the lens and lets us see it as a bigger picture issue that is relevant to anybody, men, women, nonbinary folks, trans folks, and it really is an issue we should all be fighting for. again, because it is so core to our fundamental humantism i also, i hear you about lawmakers, and we are still in a situation where the majority of lawmakers are men. at the state level, i think

something like only 30% of state legislators are women even now. and so there's a lot of progress to be made more generally on who gets elected, and that can allow us to maybe reach a point where our representatives are a little more representative of the will of the people. >> host: in 2023 any statses from goodmaker.org, part of your report that you put out on the state of abortion access in this country, nearly 700 abortion bills have been introduced so far this year, about half of which would expand access and about half that would restrict access. 30 measures enacted in the tates including 16 shield laws. what's a shield law? >> guest: yes. so a shield law, i'm glad you asked, it's a measure that a state takes to attempt to protect the abortion providers or patients in that state from the possible negative effects of laws of abortion bans in other

states. so we know that already even before the dobbs decision people often crossed tate lines to get their abortion care. a state like mississippi, for example, only had one abortion clinic for years even before roe was overturned. andi so interstate travel to access care is not anything new, but now it's the much expanded because there are 14 states where you can't get an abortion. and so y looking at a place like colorado, for example, where we have seen an influx in patients from texas, i think colorado looks around and says, okay, we've made -- we've enshrined abortion legality into our state and there's more we can do. so a shield law says we will make sure that the abortion providers in our state, patients who live here, patients who have traveled in from here will not be open to prosecution, investigation, anything like that there other states that have banned abortion. so 20 the states plus d.c. now having something like than --

that on the books. i think they're a really strong signaling effect that that those states really want to welcome patients who need care. and they're a strong model for states, again, to consider that protecting the right to abortion in their own state borders is not enough. >> host: to kentucky, this is lisa in louisville, line for democrats. good morning. >> caller: good morning. thank you so much for c-span. i'm a reasonable democrat. i don't believe in 9-month if abortions unless it's the life are of the mother or other problems. but here in kentucky in 2022 we put it on the ballot. ask we actually won -- and we actually won. we had the majority, and it was supposed to be a constitutional right to have an abortion. and and our attorney general, which is daniel cameron who is now running for governor, put a lawsuit up, and it's going to theil kentucky state supreme court. well, in kentucky, as you well know, it's very conservative in most parts of the state, so i

pretty much know how they're going to rule. so if that's the case, if we kick itw up to the supreme cou, i'm pretty much going to say that they're going to say, well, that's the right of the state. do we have any other recourse of any kind since the will of the people has been spoken and we want to keep it as a legal protection here? what else can we do? thank you. >> guest: thank you. and and, yes, i think that the kentucky ballot measure, the kansas ballot measure, some other states have had similar, really does show that when abortion rights are on the ballot directly, the people generally support them. and we've seen poll after poll especially in the last year show thater the people don't support the overturning of roe v. wade. i think, you know, in kentucky what happens next -- i couldn't can even speculate. you'd have to ask a lawyer. i do think it's important to continue organizing in your community, in communities. don't think about abortion rights as just being an issue

during an election season. abortion's on the ballot all the time at every level of government. we have talked about things that city councils and commissions can do, members of congress are important andrs people to advoce for abortion rights with regardless of whether or not you know theyy currently agree with you. that drum beat of having your voice heard is incredibly important to the movement that we're trying to build to not just regain what roe v. wade held for us, but to move beyond that and make sure abortion access and right is available to everybody. >> host: about five minutes left public policy institute aboutresident, talking the land scape of abortion in this country since the dobbs decision. this is sally ann in alabama, florence, alabama. independent. good morning. >> caller: good morning. i add had to call when i heard the lady in the '80s who had multiple abortions? i, too, was also sexually active in the '80s.

i'm amazed at the amount of uneducated women who no longer in the 21st century know how to not get pregnant, have not learned their own bodies. i raised four children. two of my daughters, sexually active, neither one of them wanted pregnancies because i taught them how to be responsible for their own actions. and this is my issue. i'm not talking about law, whatever. i'm talking about self-responsibility. in the age a, in the 21st century now, we have -- and you can see that -- [laughter] a child inside a womb is, in fact, a child. it's not a blob, it's not something to not think about. i also became pregnant with my fourth child and found out i had leukemia. everybody wanted me tond have an abortion, i would not because my question was a to myself, is my life more important than this

child? and the answer i could come up with was, no, it's not. i had a responsibility. i kept my baby to full term. -- [inaudible] i still have the baby. now 23 years old. she's sexually active. she knows how to not get pregnant. >> host: sally ann in alabama. >> guest: sally ann, thanks for sharing your story. what i took away from that or one of the things is that you had the ability to make the decision that was best for you, and i i think a that is where my of us come down, that that is a process and a right that we should all have regardless of what our state legislators or members of congress feel at any given time. and i think, you know, talking about how we prevent pregnancies is incredibly important. i will note that the same people who seek to ban abortion is and have banned abortion also seek to limit or restrict access to

contraception. and so we are working to advance, a again, not just abortion with rights, but access to contraception, comprehensive sexuality education so folks knowow how to, how to handle thr bodies. .. dorothy in mansfield ohio, the lineer for democrats, good morning. >> a good morning. i'm listening to all these people and their opinions which is wonderful. i am 82 years old in this little town of mine back in the 50s

there were men and women that were sentenced to prison because of what they called back alley abortions. i personally would never have had an abortion but the problem is why would the supreme court change that when i know of more than one girl that had an abortion. >> got your question birthday. >> thank you. a notable point that you referenced is abortion often happens regardless of the legality and in countries where we are told the abortion pill still exists. the question is how can we make sure women have access to safe abortion and the landscape is vastly different than it was.

[roll call] medication of abortion folks can self manage and in their safe place to do that and we shouldn't operate in a climate of fear. we should have abortion access for all. >> lydia from waterford, new york, republican line. you were on with kelly baden. >> hi some the things that i was thinking of have sort have been brought up but i don't understand there isn't more of a push on prevention of unwanted pregnancies and the education about using contraception. i had an unplanned pregnancy right after abortion became legal mainly because i was pressured by somebody to get birth control but i chose to have my child which i'm glad about but i would have back then

used a morning after pill if one was available and this is almost 50 years ago and i never had another unplanned pregnancy so i don't understand the repeat abortions. there so many kinds of birth control and it almost seems like it's no big deal kind of a thing, they treated that way and yet now we know so much more about fetal development. you can see there has been all kinds of photos taken and it's so much more is known now and science does state by the way life begins at conception so i understand if someone does something early on and i may not agree with it or understand it but it seems like there should be a reasonable limit just based on being humane. at a certain point in time it seems really barbaric to me.

i'm not sure exactly what point of time that is. it seems barbaric that somebody, aborting a baby that could live in the other thing i don't understand is if the baby happens to be born alive why it's not kept alive, like why is no help given to it. >> let me take up those questions that you asked. say that there a lot of questions there and let me start on the question of pregnancy prevention. many of us agree access to contraception and -- it's important for right of reasons and that's why something like the affordablele care act with such a game-changer because it didn't include no co-pay contraceptive coverage opening up d this idea that contraceptin is more affordable with co-pays for insurance and those are the policy changes we should be

working for. beyond that to some of your other questions this is a situation where some of the escalated rhetoric has really shown up. i would encourage you to learn a little bit more from solid news sources about what abortion care actually looks like and why people need abortion and the majority of abortions are done earlier in pregnancies and yet they are abortion opponents who are making it harder and harder for people to access that abortion care so i think there's a lot of unpacked with that and i do think it comes down to abortion bans being bad for women's health and in the future and abortion rights being an issue of bodily autonomy and integrity. >> the last call from liz in jonesboro, georgia on the lines for democrats. good morning.. >> at morning and thank you ms. kelly baden for your

advocacy. two things, i want to know what men have actually said. one caller from georgia talked about responsibility of men and the fact to me this comes to gender discrimination even though i know you want to explain this in the larger context that men think that they understand the issue i think that's something we i should promote. the other thing there was a female caller who wanted to equate the use of her arm or her r hand with a handgun and usinga handgun to murder someone with what the woman does with her body. as far as i know if you wield a handgun and kill someone it doesn'teb matter if you are male or female but but this applies y to one in one body part.

i was part of an underground network literally in the 70s in north carolina where women hadon to then find someone who could run a pregnancy test and try too raise money to help womn get to new york. that was the closest place that you could get an abortion at that time before roe v. wade and they'll tell you i cried on the day that this happened. thank you. saying thank you lives and thank you for talking about those networks who volunteered to have always helped people tryry to gt the care they need. we have those today the national network of abortion funds as an example where there are volunteers in almost every state that do help connect the people in that state to the resources they need to get abortion care. it's to help them get to a state where abortion is legal but it's an incredibly important network

and is one example on top of the many we talked about earlier of how people can become part of this movement to restore and rebuild our right to abortion beyond what roe v. wade giveth and beyond the ballot box which is important in itself. >> the vice president public policy kelly baden at gup mocker institute.com. appreciate your time this morning. >> thank you. we will break away for live coverage of the u.s. senate.

the senate working in a pair of issues first lawmakers failed to repeal an atf deal of 49-50 vote. later they approved the u.s. treaty the first bilateral income tax treaty between the two countries. with the senate still in recess for two days joint meeting the prime minister will show you some of the speeches from the rule repealed today. >> thank you mr. president. mr. president america is crying out for this congress to do something about the epidemic of mass shootings. the average more than a mass shooting a day right now and kids are living in fear when i walk into school.