is there to help bring affordable internet to families in need to boys and girls club and support. supports it.whenever and wherevs the most, we will be there. >> cox support c-span as a public service monkeys and other television providers. giving a front receipt to democracy. >> army officials discussed modernization efforts including bridging the gap between industrializing processes digital agent problems lockheed martin's vice president for strategy and business discuss artificial intelligence and autonomous aircraft missions. the association of the united states army held that this annual meeting in washington d.c. it is an hour and 10 minutes. [background noises]

[inaudible conversations] >> good morning. good morning i am sebastian springer, thank you for joining usg this morning. for the session on army modernization. i can tell it's a packed room it's very much a topic of interest.om now, this session is sponsored by lockheed martin it will be recorded and archived. figure themain discussion will a microphone available for audit to ask questions. if you are watching online, click asked the question button to submit a question. mike yesterday is dan tenney

vice president for lockheed martin welcome. this part of your title you may have heard thank you for joining me. >> pleasure to be here great to be with you to kick off this great event. appreciate the full room here this morning and looking foris o the discussion. >> we are on the topic of modernization want to pick your brain what is that your company is working for what comes of modernization of the moment? >> so it modernization extremely important, as all of you in the room no. and those of you who are online. weon are working a lot of passes together with the military and if i can take just a second and say how great these events are. having spent 27 years of my life in government and now the industry i think it's the ability for us to come together as a team and talk about how we stay ahead of the threats around the world is extremely important. i want to thank all of you for taking time of your busy schedule to join us here.

as a great form it's a great time to interact. modernization 60 of the important to us. as we serve the army in particular is a couple things i really important what i want to talk about is ai and autonomy and the other is the importance of open system architecture purchasing of the next couple oi days this is a fantastic machine wewi have algorithms and technology completely autonomously. we're going to demo, it's pretty cool were going to have a tablet, you pushed a button and go to all the preflight check. it will start, it will take off and perform that mission were not tongue but remote control we are actually talking about putting a mission into the aircraft and allowing it to perform it. that is extremely important you talk about supplementing a pilot pretty about pilot flying their other mission objectives and need to be working on, they can autonomously fly the aircraft

acknowledged on autopilot but the mission it will just because of weather. it will just because about geography. libby detected two sensors and spaces. capabilities. you can send other signals to perform a different mission. we think it's extremely important we are invested in open system architecture and i say thatt because open system architecture oils companies all around the world medium, small, newld to integrate new applications and new technologies. we are committed to that extreme important it's a great machine are going to demo here i think weo have six and demos to show the ability of economy. we all know we think about modernization crude, unaccrued will be a big part of that. just autonomous aircraft that work together and are interlinked across the platforms enables us to finance the fight.

>> use the open systems that's the holy grail of dod and industry for as long as i can member. what's the statusst of making it happen and make it efficient? >> we have something our system that's enabling open system integrate third party apps with new software updates. we can have new providers that come with new technology don't integrate in the aircraft is not a problem it's not proprietary but truly is an open system architecture we develop in such a way we think that is externally important. i' think it's a way of bringing innovation. if you have the best capability and product would bring it to yourur customer. to me i else has that we will bring that to enable the open system if you will. >> when the sticking>> points hs

been data rates. >> in this case is not proprietary because c the way we are deciding it now but the army wants to do. enabling an open system allows us of other providers come in. you don't have to come back to integrate new systems and technology into the aircraft at the extreme important. >> you mentioned ai and autonomy in the balance of that full ai on the other. where is he technology currently that you see? >> it is in place. through a series of sensors, algorithms and>> technologies tt we have today only fly the blackhawk the blackhawk will be located in stratford, connecticut. were going to fly from, here. when you space capabilities which is showing the t blackhawk in the network.

the atomic comes in actually saying this is a mission we want to perform. the aircraft goes through algorithms this is the best way to perform that mission. interlinked across platforms and domains is a very intelligent aircraft if you will ai comes in is not remote control there's not behind the door controlling it something we call matrix. software application enabling it. it isn't all sorts of aircraft, all sorts of other domain. we are enabling autonomy on vehicles if you will and that type of thing. truly is the machine going through thousands of algorithms. give me an example of what the mission might look like? that sits at the hub of controlling? workload so you're in theater your troops on the ground that you did an emergency medevac or an event like that.

they could send a message of the blackhawk the blackhawk would reroute that have to have the right parameters to do that but they would send it. the blackhawk would accept that mission, turned around, find the best place to land and perform it. wece have actually shown this appear we did one medevac blood to show the capability to do that. so that would be an example has a mission is performing. a new mission has been sent to the aircraft they analyze it, determine the best parameters how to perform it and change course. >> i just learned this the other day that launched with the army as part of that? watch it launch a fax or part of what we are modernized but we know talking to the army the priority it's extremely hard will be think about blackhawk modernization. want effects will be integrated into that if we modernize. it's a different system. the ai economy is inflation right now.

we have it available for void before the next couple of days. click to think of a modernization what others are you thinking? >> working across the main platform is a future, it is going to be the future how we think about the future fight for we do a lot of work in that area. the software is really becoming if you will, the currency of the day to allow speed a lot of times we could sayan the hardwae would state the same think about radars which means we can push software updates at the radar themselves to make them more intelligent. to make the fencing about it to work out false alarms that are occurring. that's occurring thing in theater but were able to show in the system on ships of pushing software we did that in theater andd so with that does as we now

reduce the cycle time to update a system for months and weeks and literally hours. software and putting us time and effort into two modernized the hardware is there it's going to be enabled. software makes it smarter, more intelligent it's what they connect across the supply chains. >> is it hard where we sit there, as is or does it need to be made receptive? >> both. many times and think about aircraft, the air cargo self can remain thing aboutlf blackhawk travel linkages that come out of the aircraft that itself can put in the ability to control the software part, we are fly by we without the mechanical linkages we haven't could have crude and unaccrued we can have a toddler in the system. you do not to change the entire structure we think about radar more accurate just by pushing

software as we learn what's happeningas in theater, false alarms and those sort ofpe thin. >> a final question we talk aboutyo software. anything you gave the european theater is pressing? >> our military has been extremely helpful of enabling a new partnership with allied nations.pa we have learned a lot from ukraine you will know it's happening there. we are seeing a great awakening across europe. a partnership wanting to advance and modernize her capabilities, we think that's extremely important of allied nations to threaten the modern theater. we've seen the government, especially u.s. government move quicker and faster to want to enable this kind of capabilities. thank our partners near enough. it's important to our military to have strong hours across europe.

we are seeing europe invest. missing opportunities across europe to create a more robust light chain. that's part of it. it's not just having weapons insistence in theater its investment of industrial base within the countries and that's her whole lot of the advances are coming up to progress okay that's all the time we have. let's thank you very much. [applause] [inaudible conversations]

[background noises] all right, good morning. reported for defense news. thank you for joining us our first session on army modernization it. i hope everyone is all set with their coffee. be feel free to get over there and get it if you don't have it. i know it's early for the recorded and archived on defense news.com part we have a microphone available for audience questions. if you're watching online click the ask a question but did move will get to as many as possible. my guess a army chief

information officer garcia lieutenantnt jon morrison deputy chief of staff cyber lieutenant journal barrett commanding general u.s. army cyber command welcome thank you for sitting down with me on day one. this a paddler in our re- modernization is very telling based on who is up here network and operating in cyber domain is essential to a modernize force. the army will not be doing anything effectively in tomorrow's battlefield without a robust hard and efficient usable network. i probably left out some important descriptors there. you get the idea. there's a few short years before you hit 2027 which is the time linene goal of the unified network. the army is making headway a little bit about this about a month ago.

what this has entailed and what you are working toward. make kick it off. >> where do i even start? i think we spent a lot of time, great stuff that industry. i think a lot of focus over the last year not just this idea of converging the networks and release of a fight the network echelon. hyper focused on rethinking the way we do business. we often talk about were just going to change policy i think it's a little more than that but how do we reengineer how we deliverr capabilities? three areas we met hyper focused in the spate and lay down but what i would consider as a policy foundation that let's us get the 2027 space. one is rethinking cybersecurity how to think about operationally cybersecurity in today's world? especially when we are looking

at it industrially how do we upgrade that will quickly get the shaping guidance for cybersecurity a much better way. the next big piece is the idea of how to h lay the foundation d data we spent time thinking who owns having them focus on their problem set look at some of the work were doing rightht now security, data protection what is that look like customer a lot of work there. idea big pushthis of the last rent software modernization how to be a policy around that that allows programs to move a lot faster.

operationalized you say it, was they were going to operationalize but we have not built that framework to get that done. big focus has been laying that foundation to then be able to turn around as amended 2027. >> i would add a couple thoughts. we started this notion of that unified network four years ago, it's hard to believe it's been that long. just get the army moving in a common direction. i would say we are blowing a pass that in a very, very good clip it is now becoming a realized operational capability and we can talk more about how crushing the artificial barriers between theaters that allow us to rapidly deploy folks in organizations around the world seamlessly. how we are crushing the false divide between enterprising tactical.

almost working and eight united fashion, excuse the pun. the most important thing we are going to be arguing a change ine in the institution. i leave you with the thought institutional changes lasting change. we have changed the way we govern and prioritize requirements we have changed the way we align resources to those requirements: cio in my office. we have established one po to deliver the network. for the network. as responsible for delivering it. and then under the unified governance we have new requirements we have unified delivery of those capabilities based offered most importantly

we have a single operational commander who is responsible for operating, maintaining, securing i would submit to you maneuvering the network on behalf of our army. a completely different approach we were assigned load the reality of it is we could not achievean in the network modernization based off zero trustpl principles by 2027 were trying to doing again in 69 different networks. you do it against one you've got a fighting chance. you do it against 69 no chance at all but howard and with network modernization? i'm going to turn over to the operational commander. >> perfect. there is so much going on i'm going to say from an offense of cyber standpoint show me a network in transition i will

show you one at risk. everything we are doing in the network modernization is a deliberate transition. when the f transforming contact elements are going out to jp mrc next month, this month. we'll have read teams on the ground looking to see, trying to penetrate them what were laying in every step of the way we execute this modernization and we employ zero trust principles for every aspect of that we are layingy in, it's being read teamed with think about our businesshi processes some of the services are not regionally provided they're not provided by

units they are centrally provided. we have transitioned into a global cyber center to operationalize as issues come up this is the synchronizing body behind it. it almost goes to mr. garcia's point is not just about the session organizational change there is a process to change and to allow all echelon that are required to get after this. can you highlight a few ways you're changing with the organization to be able to accommodate this unified network? to ensure it's a functional on the battlefield.

>> talk about raising complexity up on the battlefield. the idea of a central delivery of services the global cyber center to orchestrate all of the sea across the global span from a performance standpoint and from a security standpoint. some of the other things as the ordinancee convergence. we see ourselves so much more clearly it's not just efficient how we required services but collapsing of the networks centrally provided services some of things by employing us are smarter to army unified services plug and play you longer to reimage a computer when you go somewhere else or pcs or deploy.

more globally provided services underpinned furthermore it has to extend throughout the enterprise although it down and sleep tactical space. operate this way really doesn't make sense to want to elaborate on that? >> the notion of central delivery service and raising complexityty up in our formatios are nonexclusive. they are mutually supporting i would submit to you. we talk about central delivery of service think of army 365. one location from a cloud environment a vast majority of the vast majority of our business operational support

day-to-day collaboration. we are filtering capabilities a set we were doing it for all the right reasons. supporting a very rigorous deployment schedule. we were not deployed as divisions we were as brigades they had to be self-contained organizations. whenfo we did that we pushed all the t complexity to include the organizational structure. that caused a lot we started transitioning back to the combat operations. i made the comment and i grew up in the divisions i cannot imagine maneuvering one of our division formations today but the network we have because it was so silent. to be given at the appropriate

echelon has a time to build the problem. think about this. highest and. the ct maneuver, they had no time to conduct the critical past pattern of your playset capability the organizational structure or even inside some of the regional cyber centers for dahlbergrd reinforcing now you'e able to check the complexity out and still provide critical capability making it a simple as you possibly can and putting the right people at the right location guilty more complex task is essential part of her journey. >> the next couple of years or might be interesting to watch it. be watching and or real-time organizational transformation. we are moving in contact on the those some of those have matured

to a place where it just makes sense toto put the lego block ad the right lego set we had clout as the headquarters probably the worst possible idea on the planet let's go run operations out of the headquarters. women cloud operations to cyber and just make sense it was auteur enough, it is time. other things like thinking through the process we've removed complexity and with things up. now we've done two things which are really interesting to democratize the ability to with platforms out there. data platforms if they are available to you and then we empowered folks at echelon on the data side. you own your data each operationalize that those twod things are forming on micro organizations within command and theza echelon which are not driving bigger change.

that's was the of the next couple of years as a whole all echelons the transformation that's happening a little bitn more heavy data figuring that out. mart heavy on the cybersecurity said but maybe not so much of the network more about software. it's also created this opportunity to build smaller teams that may or may not be episodic. if like we did this cloud thing as an episodic threat to headquarters and move operations.so during the same thing on software. the triage team get the software piece right probably looks a little different in five years a little bit more streamlined and maybe we don't need that anymore. and kind of shape into how we operate on a day-to-day basis. >> i don't think when it comes to organizationa' design and the training our leaders and our people i don't think it's ever done deal. i think they're going to continue to evolve over the

course of time. a lot of folks get hung up on the capabilities being fielded. transforming the way we fight and are organized to fight. not waiting for a modernization cycle because we are just too busy as an army. >> is going to be continuous and is not just about as leo said the bright shiny kit it's being able to sync our way through adaptive organizations. in the skill sets were going to need a overtime. what you talk a little bit about how policy needs to change. big ones that remain. i'm sure there's plenty of yet to discover. what policy needs to be amended generally in order to enable the goal to establish network? >> there is a lot.

i've been sitting in the seat for about a year i have looked up stuff that'snd written in the army was using before i was born which is terrifying by the way. here's what we have been doing better take a little bit of a different approach it's like one policy to rule them all. a couple of areas real critical we continue to auteur that space it's a space that historically is all or nothing kind of thing. it's like hey, you cannot release the data. kind of really refocused. almost everything were doing in the army whether to name your buzzword, ml, ai, cyber, it doesn't matter, big data, whatever you want to call it. did not have any policy on that. we focused a lot on empowering

functional stew on their data shaped not just the proms are trying to solve with their data but have accountability for making that available to other folks. we talk about big challenges it's how we get it so it is in the system and the system owners is no, i cannot share my data. but the making that decision. look at the some other stuff we are getting. that's an area. shaking the gap is a lot more work to do. the next pieces been around kind of balancing the space between acquisition and non- acquisition. what i mean by that there's capabilities out there soldiers, civilians and some of our vendors are operating those platforms. inside an acquisition? i don't know.

really quick dynamic perishable software does that count as an acquisition? spending a lot of time right now putting on boundaries and definitions around that so we could keep forward momentum not to secondly bureaucracy of old. when i think about big challenges that try when the biggest ones we have is stopping folks from delivering because reliving back here presenting for requirements. an acquisition executive. were going to expand that now moving forward. we did it for these platforms i don't do it for all of our overs and really democratize that. a lot more work to do. the last space is probably the place we need most. we are kind of putting out micro guidance to get folks moving

into the right direction. we are pretty old cybersecurity policy when today's army from a policyit perspective it's all about compliance one 100%. general morrison i've been i been talkingfor months about operationalizing cybersecurity moving folks and compliant based environment that's a big muscle movement we are going to see if the next 24 months is a reimagining of that entire process and the policies around that part is going to take some time is going to take culturalist to get there but to me those of the three areas where we've got holes in our swing oregon industrial age processed for digital agent problems. how do we bridge that gap is submitted to department digitally enabled policy. you and i weighed in on that? no retirement policy i was the image of the software policy a few times. that's a big push for the army

right now skip the software policy right, to help enable modernization across the enterprise. much is dependent on software upgrades to add capability whether that's combat vehicle, missile defenseif radar, or the network print from your vantage point what is a software policy enable your work? why is it important? what is it doing what is it not do? looks a big thing it does is pry the most important part a loving buzzword compliant ivories got on that little pamphlet sis of a program is doing. but when you go down and look nobody's doing that. we are playing at it still. it sets the foundation to be able to do those things. build software at speed and scale in a secure fashion. we can talk about doing it all day long but on the policy to support that enables that it's

hard to get it done. the first real true moment is going to be here shortly. here is how theom army will approve of the pipeline. this is what it takes years the tools. does matter how you get them who you leverage from as long as it's within the framework. the last piece which is a critical piece is here's what that means for you if you want to be in a continuous ato in a secure fashion. really big. the other piece is this idea of where do we help, or do folks need help? what i mean by that is to build smaller teams that can go out helplp command or programs that are challenging software space come up to speed really quick. that the piece into their program and get the tools they need to deliver software. the most important piece this is thes gap of gaps make sure youe cybersecurity people are sitting in the room and readjusting that

for these capabilities but at the big piece on the soffit modernization refocused on by a lotot of to do the centr of excellence is going to big help to get folks the help they need when they need it. a lot of work they are doing great looking at requirements especially it has been really big. the other piece to this is a re- think, test, evaluation. this idea of we can build software fast if i got folks to realize there is a security component to it. now the next pieces could we build software fast with the security component and actually tested in a way that makes sense? that's the next piece we see a hyper push what is testing look like how to be reimagining and the are moving forward? i would ask for more industry partners much like we were talking before about our organization technology capability auteur, the network

is going to continue. think about that in a software space. that's really going to start taking off on us. but at least now we have a where we are going to hit a homerun where in major league baseball season. but we are on base i think we will continue to move people around the spaces. >> will played. >> thank w you. i do want to ask on the evaluation side a little bit how are you working through -- test and evaluation set up right now to allow for cybersecurity testing other cyber testing?

artist test and evaluation should be revamped in some ways that will enablere you that will evaluate the capability? >> i think we work very closely, our two organizations work closely on the policy of this. in order to develop a process that makes sense, like it end up with product at the end. [laughter] but in a secure manner. i think this type of partnership gets us to that end of making smart changes in the way that we do business in order to achieve security. we are embedded in each one of the project conversions experiments, doing overwatch of the experimentation, looking at also i think providing the test

and evaluation and to the acquisition community, here is what we are seeing from a threat standpoint. here's how the threat is changing. herent is that what they are takingng advantage of to share this insights beyond the borders of cyber is super important so that they can be integrated into the work being done. especially on the software side of the house. everything is going to be driven by software. and, as a takend a look at somef the trends in the threat environment the number of zero days is not essentially increased. the particular areas they are focused on security appliances and software, that has absolutely increased. and that keeps me awake at, night. being able to receive products that not only our secure, but

have the wherewithal to respond rapidly to a particular threat and issue a patch. that is critical. when we look at who we want to do business with from the standpoint of defending the networks, this is what we are asking. how effective? what is youre process or moving quickly to change something in your operating system should you find out there's a critical flaw? i think that has to be part of the conversation. the other piece is we moved to more, as a service type model. which look, there's a benefit to taking advantage of industry, deliver it capability blix but x starling, claire meadow, and a cloud type service that is out there. having this conversation you now are in operational partner.

and so something happens within your environment whether it's nation state actor or natural causes we have to have this operational linkage where you are calling me or i am calling you in saying how do we move more forward on o this? i think that is a big change we will see it evolve over the next couple of years. >> that's really interesting but three years ago we did the first program of a record that was really in the cloud. i happen to be a part of that effort and sought wow, we had no idea what we were doing. but we talked cyber survivability we kind of think it's this. that is everybody that's purple team, the testers. i think where we are today is so different rightt. now. the last couple of events i have seen and we are talking big programs the idea that our ciphers in the conversation.

that that red t team and the purple team everyone is talking together and we are re- thinking the skill set we need in that space to make sure we are testing against the right things. like where wee are at today is like a 180 degrees out from where we were three years ago. it is a moving target. i think it will continue to auteur. as we move up the stack which is what i keep saying a lot of the capability is moving up the stack it's changing what we look at and that's going to be the big piece how do we maintain the support that? >> it is a two-part question that you ask lucy institutional componentut of how do we rebuild po are in is that foundation set the way we want it? just sat there and said it's trending in the right direction. we still have more work to do. quite frankly as the light changes our testing is going to have to change. take you back to the actions we have been doing. our cyber red teams attacking the architecture we have

deployed with the 101st, now out in the pacific with the 25th doing the same thing. it's not just doing an assessment of the network from a cyber perspective it's wrapping how we do electromagnetic spectrum as well. on today's battlefield it's probably a greater threat than what we are facing on the cyber side. we are seeing that play out in conflicts around the world. and so having the operational red team actively trying to do something to the network is making sure we are fielding a capability that we can operate, maintain, secure, defend, maneuver in support of combat operations. >> could you elaborate more on what the army's learning from what you're doing the experiments and exercises through e real world examples on approaching the hardening the networkor capability? you see two systems again very

capable. >> i will share three really big thoughts that we are starting to see. first off, we can raise complexity. we do not need to push it all the way down we can make things very simple for our operators who really just need to figure how they are maneuvering and fighting. the quote we got when we went down to the trending center from the observer control room was were not fighting the work that unit is fighting the enemy. that is a completely different shifts than any conversation we would've had about the army tactical network anytime in the past. that's one, we are able to do it. two, we do not have thee h echn of who is responsible for doing what from eight cyber defective naileded down yet. were getting straight insider tactical formations. but the big idea is we will be

hooked back to the broader cyber exercise i will call it we have the layered defense. so the regional cyber center global cyber center all the back to the cyber headquarters itself a common view across the entire continuum. because again wes do not want that tactical level folks trying to counter blocks on cyber actors. we one that done someplace else will folks have time to see what's happening and take the appropriate measures. we have a little bit more work to do on that component of it. i will also tell you this and the notion of putting simple and intuitive kit in the hands of our soldiers is also working. we should take upwards of a day or even longer to install and get to an operational capability, we have units now doing it in less than 30 minutes. forty-five minutes, at night,

with night mission goggles on. a sea change in how we have been operating it is because the network is simple and able to be delivered to formations as opposed to them trying to establisho their own network by themselves. >> i will just amplify the contested nature of the battlefield. i think commanders at echelon are more cognizant of the fact that it will be operating in a contested electromagneticec spectrum. so what does that mean? it's the mobility piece. the appreciation for the fact they can move their seed to with little or no disruption. thedi idea they have to keep moving. the idea they have to be aware of what their signature looks like and also be able to see the adversaries of the op force signature as well as in the electromagnetic spectrum. giving them the tools to do that and then makere decisions about how they arrayed themselves to

reduce theired signature. that was also some of the feedback jrotc was that was probably the best signature reduction of a command post that they had seen in a while. and so that also -- were seeing it reflected in on the ground how they are thinking about how to employ the forces. i think that's a really good news story. but it's also because they are watching what's happening in southwest asia or what is happening in the ukraine, the transparency of the battlefield cannot be overstated. that's one of the other big things i would underscore. >> going smaller for a huge command post sounds great to have us back in the tank to coordinate missions but also sounds great.

what are some of the trade-offs to consider when reducing that footprint? they are great benefits of course but waters of the downsides you are discovering as you go through some of the experimentation, evaluation in the past year or so? quick he'll take a stab and then turn it over too general morrison. but whatever it is we are deploying whatever application or service it is it's got to work at the edge first w and thn bring it back to the enterprise. if you are doing with trying to reengineer of capability are normal approach to that, it doesn't work but if we get that at the edge of the other thing is having this really robust conversation with commanders about how he went to operate? how do which maneuver? how do you make decisions? that informs it where it is the data need to be? where does the processing, compute and processing need to

be at echelon on the battlefield? does it really need to be all the way down to the platoon and what classification are we operating at? i think that conversation is really helpful in coming up with the datain layer that's going to be vital not just operating the network and enabling but actually all of those mission command systems that commanders are employing. quick said no we talk about this att length. but not really. i think that it's been our big thing we lost the almost hyper dependency but what does that really mean? i think this idea of edge it's us redefining what that means. depending on the capability, and the date at thea definitions my be different. a lot of the work wef have seen

the drawbacks of week got enough to understand where we have some challenges were going to have to adjust? i think that's going to be a big piece the next couple of exercises are going to demonstrate that to a much greater effect. hopefully that will start shaping summer acquisition around that space. this idea were you need to store and compute as we experiment we are defining that. fundamentally we are changing the way we arefu fighting. in real time. so there's going to back and forth on what that looks like. >> i think that it really hit ih but i will add a couple of thoughts. it is a seat to fix the next is not about a capability only. it is about changing the way our army operates. redefining with this echelons are going to be doing and getting the complexity, getting

it to division and core ordi evn higher. brigades can go back to doing what they're supposed to be good maneuver gets an adversary and destroying it. and right now it's overly burdened with its own task to be doing that breakup take it back to the notion of fighting the network instead of the networks notifying the adversary. and that's what we reallys need to get too. this notion of distributed data is going to be absolutely critical. we know we do not have that right yetha we have very positie times coming out of what we are doing but we also need to realize of an adversary out thered and we will be operating in degraded environments at times.s. i will tell you you use the word what's the downside? one of the downsides we are seeing us back to the notion too much information. i had one commander it's a great problem to have, i have so much

information i found that shut down some of my systems so i can concentrate on fighting. i would talk to people what i needed to talk with them. the information in the data that was available to me would just overwhelm me and i had to go back to theve basics of natural maneuver. and said too much information unfiltered is one of things will have to work our way around. because for lack of a better term we have open pandora's box with the network is not the problem accessing that data now in what's the right data and the echelon were going to have it in. >> i do want to ask about so many options. how are you working on connectivity solutions for the network? how are you building relationships withsh industry tt have these commercial capabilities? was it changing the game and what challenges remain when it comes to that?

>> i will general morrison deal with that. but i will say this, i think the environment we have touched on it a couple of times. but this really big move, we look at our provider capabilities out there right now but kind of fundamentallyab different delivery models. what he thanks he been focused on is making sure we tighten our partnerships not from cyber security but also from a business perspective. how are we going to operationalize some the capabilities is changing the model for how capabilities get delivered. a lot of work between our team and it really focuses how we start shaping that's what makes sense and there's a viable delivery model out there. i think in that space it has been interesting to watch the last couple of years. one of the interesting thing is not just driving cybersecurity chains but really driving

acquisition chains. a lot of what we seen even from some of that work that's done in experimentation is having us rethink the guidance we've given some of her acquisition folks on the contract side and the contracting officers. hope of the starting to see the benefits of that piece is the army doing a big push in that space bar i think it's going to be like everything else the models changing really fast and change the whole entire institution at the same time. the big thing is going to be pried going to get 80% right most of the time, sometimes are going to get reallyst wrong. it is going to be some work on making sure he can flex across this as a service capabilities that are out there there really changing not just by about leverage. i always tell folks might number one question in all of these is when something goes bad and i pick up the phone who was on the other end of that phone? that's my number one question,

who do i call? because that's what we all do as humans when something breaks. that's going to be the big one is continuing to flush out who do i call problem. >> you know, 20 years ago, when i came into the army a long, long time before that the army would deploy its own network boot pickup,, go to the field d that was it. those days are gone we will never deploy a solely military network again. it will always be infused with commercial capabilities and i do not use specific vendors names i think is going to be a really, really big task is to start working our way through this. but, whyth wouldn't we do that? military network only, no joke a few years ago we are putting on fielding network capabilities out until the 2040s.

what business would think of the network or it in that fashion? your army should not think of it that way either. if we really want to get into the spin of how things are going to base architecture wheatland onba that we can rapidly plug things too. very, very software defined so that as a new capability comes on from one of our industry partners who can rapidly spin it in. if we have a change of the threat environment we can rapidly spin it out. but the biggest change and it is going to take all of us is a conversation to be completely different. there can be no more, this is my secret salsa, that's yours we put it together it looks great. when you have a capability landing in a foreign country that's a house and buy one of our industry partners we need to understand that security is. more important you need to understand the security we are going to be layering in so that we cans work together. and quiteen frankly should be

demanding threat intel from us so that wee can tell you what's happening in an operational environment because when that fails your army can be put at risk when armies put at risk, bad things are happening. it is going to force a different dynamic and a different conversation amongst all of us. we do head into that brave new world with eyes wide open and full of energy. >> once upon a time commanders loves, got pointed me. [laughter] quick snow because you are going to identify with this, right? >> and dinosaurs roamed the earth. [laughter] works commanders love to hug their servers. we have change that paradigm. the reason they hugged it was because they wanted to be assured it was protected and perform i did not need to depend on anyone else.

now that we are going to we will always be using industry services. that risk profile i have to be able to articulate that risk to a joint force commander, to the chief, to the secretary and away we all understand it clearly. i would use that to amplify general morrison's point there. that ability to articulate risk at any given time or to have that risk conversation. >> if not i can keep going and give you chance to stand up if you have one. okay,. [laughter] why did want to ask about you know seem to the big effort this

year and since it started actually pilot program at the beginning of the year read that you see it for irwin in march. event further iterations on this including some work done so you talk about the evolution of this analysis we growing which are taking from it and how your growing potentially to build this program off of this efforts possibly. >> i will offer a couple things. going would crushing his thinking se to fix and nexgen activities and you have two separate and distinct focuses. exactly what it sounds like and you know the network we have insider divisions today predict

some of who wanted take the comments was about fixing the network architecture. during her term focus, normally doing new programs that we are making sure that were infusing the appropriate commercial capabilities into it. it makes us more enabled and we are bringing in higher capacity satellite capabilities leveraging 5g and reducing the computingd requirements that require inside of four brigade headquarters and appropriately so the division can maneuver and engage in insights and so that is what it's about estate. focus and fixing the network components of it really getting the c2 us between the division and the break to include the

enabling brigade which is also a significant departure from how we were building the capabilities in the pastab with brigade combat team said everything but combat aviation brigade the division artillery brigade, didor not have the capabilities himself even in the division, we were not to the point that wee needed to and i feel that that network components benefits are definitely heading the right direction but red team still guests and we are watching the gates and from that watching the gates to be able to get back to what is supposed to be doing and maneuvering as opposed to mere that is all trending in the right direction in the nexgen c2, it is now taking that b-2 apparatus to think about were fighting functions system.

so intel, maneuver, sustaining and integrating that at the data layer and laying that c2 apparatus over the network that will emerge emergence instead of the stove pipe command systems we've had out there today, simply do not integrate the way any two, and are overly complex very still fighting now integrated at the data layer application will run a tub without. all cloud enabled file base that is they were saying it would have to be distributed because we operating we know will be contested and congested environment especially comes to electro magnetic spectrum soapy 263 divisions, in 25, we going

to the 101st fully getting them out to the 25th division out in the 82nd airborne for liberty getting them kitted out andd then who identified a fourh fourth division moore's most likely an armored information at a point and meanwhile, great foundation for the nexgen c2 leveraging many if not all of the network coming n at us, movg towards conversion five, capstone five march timeframe that will make some important decision as we come out of the experiment freighted to go to you so yvonne x is the only place that i bend my left and go past up i don't even know how many policies that walk out of there and i was like will, what a huge listen here is something different not told the army how to do and so i think one of the things were finding us and removing complexity gives more

flexibility instead of showing interesting feedback in that space i think we have a lot more work to do there. >> all right i just want to ask one last question because i know you like one minute. and little bit involved i'm sorry but harry thinking about incorporating a.i. in a networking function buzzwords about incorporating it into everything. when you see potential for that. making the most sense organ these capabilities be useful for you and what are you looking at. >> yes, overpass network like us to be applied, that is really tough. you need to start in a very focused matter. and get that going. so we do have an effort that we are doing and in his prototype

we did in conjunction with cyber command that looks at how to reduce the complexity some of our analysts have to do in terms of identifying for the network. in sum, will move that into a pilot this year hopefully. but i think the other piece of this is that i will go back to the industry a lot of the capabilities found the services that are industry is providing has nai or ml component to it. in this type of tools missing the service that they are providing were taking advantage of really operationalizing those so there willin be two ways of implementing a.i. or ml annual things that we generate for very specific mission purposes and then there will be some more general capabilities that we need to take a a look at the mae sure that we are

operationalizing. and especially take this as part of a journey as well and again, most of what we are doing, we can leverage those things very effectively and achieve greater outcomes and again reduce the organizations are northpoint to grow. so we do need to unburden some apart offenders from trumping what really apply them to taking a look at some of the more sophisticatedd things. sue met will give you the perspective on this so couple things, i think the biggest part last couple of months is been some guidance up to the army and lm and nai, we have great feedback on it but it was like well youto just told the commanders to go doing that's exactly what we did right we open the emissary got sinners

run scissors spell is run started opening the environment especially in the commanders and really good use escapes coming. and with the purpose is numbing cool a.i. supports figure out the business model here thank you so the biggest piece that we are fighting we don't have the business mino quite figured out. so how do we get an environment open with good commander use where we have a small company becomes an and hold your hand and we have a large integrator is working on an enterprise this doing something considerably more complex and we have needed cloud services work and then we have phd's working on it so really sorry to experimenting against those use case to figure out a couple of thanks. i don't want to be with the data we foundw out quickly that thi. cannot have ten i people full

every piece of doctrine and build their own, not a good idea. result likes a lot of working things in shaping the guidance around because we can't afford not to. in the other piece is kind go back to industry and say there's a cost model while it really doesn't work and we have folks charging tokens and folks charging us a service like the army cannot buy that way. somehow we work disseminated more standardized approach really right now. the foundational level especially the services they can be democratized out of the workforce is really about building the digital foundation that we can t secure around digital foundation that we can get these pockets updated by functional's in a good place that has pieces viable sustainable business model we have a lot of work to do and that very much in the infancy

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