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host: so what are your goals and priorities going to be for the coming year? guest: it's important for the government to continue supporting the kind of research we've had in the united states. what we've done has helped tremendously in this country by having a partnership between the government and its universities. that has proved practical for applied research and basic research and has laid the foundation for later discoveries. so one of the things that i want to do is work very closely and carefully with president barbara snyder to support that funding and congress. we will also help to make the case for what those institutions are doing for our students and the country. host: make that case. how would you describe the current state of higher education in america? yes: i think the current state of higher education is terrific in the united states. people all around the world seek to come to these universities as students and faculty members.

the return on the investment for a four-year college degree, which is what we offer is tremendous. for many families, that investment in higher education be the best investment that they make in their lifetimes, judged just by financial return and other benefits to getting a four-year college degree. the research that are universities produced as a difference maker in terms of our health and information technology, innovation and knobs. host: you talked about return on investment. a college degree has become extremely expensive and it continues to get more and more expensive. outpacing inflation, and it has been put out of reach for a lot of american students. why is that, why is a college degree so expensive these days? guest: i'm glad the rate that point because i think there are a couple of things and one of the very common narratives and i would love to be able to correct

them. the actual cost that people pay for higher education hasn't been going up even at the rate of inflation, it has been going down. that is something you can find in college or data. host: tuition itself has been going up. guest: the sticker price has been going up but what people actually pay is the sticker price minus financial aid. institutions including mine have been raising dollars from alumni and from endowments, so our educations are more affordable than ever. let us use some of our own data around that. 71% of the students at princeton are on financial aid. 71%. that involves scholarships that are larger than their tuition price. the average student on financial aid at our university is getting a part subsidy in addition to

full coverage of the tuition price. we were looking at education, they have to keep two things in mind. one is what matters is the net price and all of the aau institutions are offering significant financial aid to their students, so people have to look carefully at what they are actually going to pay. in the second is the critical question about education is that return on investment, figure out exactly what the net price is and pay attention to what you're getting from that. education isn't a consumer good to be simply used up in the way that something that we purchase our. it is much more like the kind of investments that you make for a long time and it is one of the best investments that you will ever make. host: nonetheless, there are people taking out a lot of student loans in order to pay for college. do you take a position on student loan forgiveness? guest: the aau doesn't have an official position on student loan forgiveness. we have a commitment to

affordability. we believe that the government should increase the pell grants that enable students from low income families to attend college and flourish when they go there. we and other associations have supported the idea of doubling the pell. one of the things i think people need to know if these narratives get out there through stories that i think often are outliers, that these financial aid arrangements, often students are able to graduate without any debt from college. princeton makes a commitment to its students that all of them will get financial aid that will allow them to graduate with zero debt. more than 83% of our students graduate every year debt free. the others are taking out relatively small loans on a discretionary basis. so the reality when parents are taking a close look at what colleges and other universities are offering is different. host: well you've got to get

into princeton first. that's not easy. guest: that is not easy, and we have extraordinary students who are applying. so it's just say that is true in different ways across this extraordinary group and that many colleges and universities that are outside of that, it is not is very selective universities were this is true. host: there has been a decline in enrollment across the board in american universities. is that a concern among university leadership and what is being done to address that? guest: we're seeing a generational shift. we have known that we will see declines in the numbers of college going students as demographic patterns change. the leading research universities in the applicant

pools remain robust and students want to come to our colleges and universities from within the united states and outside the united states remains very strong. i think we are going to see effects in the sector more broadly as these democratic -- demographic shifts take hold. host: if you got a question or comment about higher education in america, you can give us a call. i guessed is president of princeton university. the lines are by party and republicans are on (202) 748-8001. democrats are on (202) 748-8000. an independents, (202) 748-8002. we also have a line for college students. so if you are currently enrolled in college right now, please give us a call, we would love to hear your perspective on this as well. (202) 748-8003. there have been fewer protests

on the gaza war than we have seen in the past. how are schools addressing this issue this school year? guest: what schools have to do around this issue is to respect basically the principles that are part of our united states constitution. that for most of us are part of our university rules as well which is we respect free speech and at the same time, we insist that students and others comply with what are known as time, place and manner restrictions when they are protesting. in the city of washington, d.c. where our government is located to have more freedom to criticize our government than you do in just about any other country in the world. i think that is a good thing and you have to have that kind of vigorous free speech on college campuses where people can speak about controversial topics like the israel gaza war. on the other hand, we do have rules in the united states and on college campuses.

you can't occupy a building, you can't display paint your message on the washington monument and the have to have the same kind of rule on college campuses. that is will be done at princeton and with other universities have done. people have to make sure they speak up in a way that allows everybody to go about business on the campus and doesn't disrupt the activities of the campus. we have to be elevating the conversation. a lot of it is covered a lot of the news media. what gets the pictures are the students with the signs, but we've got to take those conversations and elevate them. the second i would say is we do want students to be engaged

around the issue. there are people who go about their business and don't pay attention to the issues happening in the world. we want our students to grow up to be engaged leaders. it is a right to disrupt, not a light -- a right to -- host: not just the protests, but the freedom of speech aspects. guest: i think we can a good job at princeton. when we asked him about the student experience, and we do this every year, last year students continued to report a high sense of satisfaction with student experience, in fact a little higher than the previous year. you mentioned that because we important have these tumultuous events, and people get hurt during them. but we are able to give students the kind of educational experience that they want. there are a lot of people who are upset with me about various

things that happened on campus. we had students chanting slogans . i am jewish, i have relatives in israel, i found those slogans very offensive but i also felt had an obligation under the constitution and under our free-speech at pnceton to protect the rights of people to say things. we also had to enforce our rules when people were violating time, place and manner rules. we were very clear about what those rules were. but what i am proudest of is a number of different event that allowed people to explore these issues in more detailed ways. i'm just going to mention one very quickly. our dean is probably the most prominent palestinian-american and political scientist in the united states. she did a couple of sessions with her counterpart at columbia's school who is an

israeli who was previously in the israeli military. the two of them became friends when they were assistant professors before they became deans of these schools, and in the fall of last year not to long after october 7 they were doing public events at both princeton and columbia in order to model for students what it meant for people with very different backgrounds to disagree with one another and to civilly. those kinds of events don't get the kind of attention that the protest do, but that is the heart of what is going on on college campuses and they don't think it is happening in many other places. host: there is an article, why colleges are turning to institutional neutrality. can you first explain what that means and is that a good approach? >> institutional neutrality is a kind of slogan that describes a view about when universities should take positions and when presidents should make statements on issues.

this has been something that has been discussed among university presidents and other people in higher education for a time and kind of exploded into view after some of those unsuccessful statements that were issued last year. institutional neutrality at universities at a broad level, they ought to be restrained which is a word i like better than neutrality. the idea behind it is that universities ought not themselves to be the critics, they ought not to be taking positions as princeton university it should be the sponsor of critics, they should be enabling faculty and students to raise their voices. i personally don't like the phrase institutional neutrality. i don't think i've got a neutral institution. i have an institution that stands for the value of research

and free speech and people of all backgrounds who should be able to lower it. i think neutrality doesn't express this idea well but i do agree that universities have to be careful not to be taking positions as institutions except in a very limited of circumstances. host: that's talk to callers. syracuse, new york, republican. caller: i am a little bit surprised that we have this gentleman out here saying that he is saying you have to go to college to be successful. princeton is worth the money. mark zuckerberg, other people who have done. successful. mike rowe who has a show about dirty jobs, other jobs that you don't have to be successful. but i think one person who would agree with you that it was a good idea to get a college degree would be ted kaczynski, the unabomber who went to berkeley.

i'm sure he put his degree to good. host: what do you think? guest: thank you for the question. and thank you for the opportunity to clarify what i think about this. i agree entirely that you can be successful in a number of different careers without going to college and i don't think that everybody should go to college. and i think it is very important for us to recognize that as a country and for academic institutions as well as the government to support people who make other choices. on the other hand, what i do believe and what i did say is that the people who want to go to college and the people who make that choice, it is going to be a spectacularly good investment to go to college. if you just take a look at the data about my institution, or for your college degrees more generally, the return on investment is very strong. it provides you with a lot of

other opportunities as well. that doesn't mean it is a smart choice for everybody, it just means that for people who are asking themselves the question i'd like to go to college, the kinds of careers you get by going to college may sound attractive to me. will that investment payoff? the economic news is very good about that, but it is not the right investment for everybody just as other investments are not right for everybody. host: michael in denver, independent line, you're next. caller: thank you so much for taking my call and for being here this morning. i just have a quick comment and question. what i want to bring up is the issue of mental health at colleges. statistics have shown as high as 40% of students on college campuses are experiencing some form of mental illness. and many times i think the problem is a lack of action that students have in many cases to

forms of treatment or services. so the question i was going to ask you about this, what have you implemented or what should be implemented in terms of making sure that students have access to mental health care, and furthermore, identify mental health issues before it is too late? guest: thank you for this question which is so important for our colleges and for our country. what i would say first of all this we are facing a mental health crisis in the united states right now. it is especially acute among young people and that includes both high school aged and what we typically think of as college aged students. i put it that way because it is not as though this is worse for students were actually in college. the numbers i've seen suggested is actually a bit better for students in college than it is for their peers of the same age

and you're absolutely correct. this is an issue that we need to worry about on college campuses and in the country. i will just respond to your specific question a little bit from my own institution at princeton because it is the one that i know best. we work very hard to increase the availability of psychiatric services at princeton. we work hard to educate our students as well as our faculty to recognize signs of distress in themselves or in their peers. we've taken a comprehensive approach to mental health recognizing that mental well-being isn't just a matter of psychological services, it is a matter of making sure that people feel supported and have ways of talking through problems throughout their life in this academic environment. you are right to bring up the question and i think in terms of

access to resources but in terms of understanding what are the sources of this issue? people point to things like loneliness, they point to the impact of social media. we are providing on many of our college campuses better access to the services than people enjoy in their lives after leaving these institutions. we need to find ways to make sure we are producing citizens who are resilient and are able to live flourishing lives, and that goes beyond the care we are able to offer on campus. host: can in a texas says there's a great deal of waste whicsiificantly adds to the cost. the seven attribute it mostly to administrations and paying for tenured faculty who do little teaching. yet these costs continue to rise. what do you think? guest: first of all, one of the things i do at the president and i did it before as provost, is

always to look for ways to cut waste and find more efficient ways for the university to do things. when i with the chief budget officer of the university i was maximizing the impact of mission-based dollars. but let me say a couple of things about why it is that any university is going to have to invest collectively and people both on the faculty side and on the staff side. i will just mention on the staff side the conversation i just had with previous caller about counseling and psychological services. all of those people are staff. they're doing critical work to support our students and other members of our community in order to enable them to flourish, and i think that is true of a vast majority of people who sometimes get grouped under the word staff for administration. faculty are the core of the enterprise at any great college or university, and they are

doing teaching and research. both of those things are important especially at america's leading research universities. i think the thing that drives expense, whether you're at the university level or dealing with high schools or elementary schools is that what matters is to get great teachers with great minds in classrooms with students that enable them to push those students. that means investing in talent and that is what we do and i think we do it well. host: thomas in michigan, democrat. caller: good morning. my name is thomas, i'm actually a princeton alum so it is great to speak with you and thank you for being on the show. i think princeton has done a pretty good job handling the complex issues and controversies that arise, however my question for you is how can students get

the attention of the administration when they have important issues that they want to address like divesting from weapons manufacturing, divesting from institutions that might support ideals that are not what princeton supports? thank you. guest: thomas, thank you for calling in and for other viewers, and service of all nations, the princeton motto now is in the nation's service and in the service of humanity. thomas, i appreciate the question. i think there are multiple ways that students and others can bring their concerns to the attention of myself for the administration. you may well know as an alum that it princeton, we have meetings with the council for the princeton university community. basically once a month during the academic year. it ends up being about six meetings per year.

one of those is a town hall where just as i'm doing now, i take questions from whoever shows up, but i am present at almost all of those, as are my colleagues and we hear the concerns in the community. people concerned about things like divestment have the opportunity to present issues to student, faculty and staff committee that considers issues about divestment or the use of university resources. there are a lot of different ways to do that. and by the way, it is permissible to protest. protest is fine, disruption is not. there is a difference between bringing up issues and getting attention on them and getting the particular outcome that a group wants. when you've got an issue and question about the israel-gaza war or about divestment, there are going to be multiple opinions on a college campus, multiple opinions and strong

disagreement within the student body on those issues. and it may be the case that people bring up issues that are then discussed through a fair process where lots of different viewpoints come in and the university doesn't end up taking a particular position. that brings us back to institutional restraint. some of these issues, the right thing is for the university to say i understand you are really excited about this particular issue that it is not one where the university should take a position. we encourage you to continue taking positions as students or faculty members. thanks for the question, i hope i see you every unions. host: let me just show this newly introduced bill cald protect economic freedom act. it essential cs off federal student aid to colles at participate in a commercial boycott against israel. it prohibits colleges and universities from recein federal student aid if they engage in commercial boycotts dedicated by those -- dictated by those in the

boycott-sanctioned divest movement and that comes out of the house education workforce committee. not expected to go anywhere, but your response to that. guest: i strongly oppose the idea of boycotts in general. i put out a statement opposing boycotts in the first year of my presidency which was marked 12 years ago. i think that as universities, we depend on -- rather than creating walls. it is important for us to be interactive with other institutions around the world and with regard to what i would call institutional restraint, i just don't think is appropriate for the university is to be engaging in this kind actions. on the other hand i think there is a huge danger of congress starts looking at particular issues and saying with regard to these universities that make such a difference in the world that we are going to pick on this political issue or that political issue and use it as a

reason to start cutting off aid. that ultimately make these institutions more affordable and enables them to do the research on which our country depends. host: austin, texas, independent line. >> i'm going to speak fast because i know you were almost out of time. i do believe in higher education. and 61 years old. i wish i could go out to all these high school kids and tell everyone if you end up being an organic housekeeper like myself, and they also got to training at a job that does not pay well. that is my passion, i love it. i am for protesting as long as it is civil, but in austin, texas governor abbott brought in the state troopers and it got real violent because of the state troopers.

i want everybody to know i quit buying into this propaganda years ago. i learned a lot. to me, doctors without borders, all these major newspapers say these children have bullets in their heads, and yes, the students are passionate and we want that. i think the university should protest. with the republican house and now senate, anyway, thank you, c-span, forgiving the people to voice. host: any comments? guest: thank you for calling in. one thing i would say is we want our students to have engaged in passionate opinions that you have engaged in passionate opinions. and over this past year, they are sometimes protesting on the lawn with different slogans, and we think that is important, but

we don't think it should be the university doing the protesting or the speaking in those circumstances and moreover, as important as protest is, it is really important for what we do to have these conversations like the one we are having here this morning that take these topics and try to elevate them and get people to appreciate one another's side to the extend that that is possible and look for solutions that are going to make a difference for the future. host: we've got a text from doug in toronto, ohio wants to know your opinion regarding free college for all and i will just show this npr article, university of texas, m.i.t. and others announce free tuition for some undergraduates. guest: i think free tuition for some undergraduates is a great idea. as i said earlier, i think that the aau schools are all doing this in one way or another. we all do it on the basis of financial need. that is for students were qualified to attend our

institutions and aren't able to afford to go to our institutions, we provide aid that makes it possible for them to do so. and for some students that makes it free. i don't believe in free tuition for all. there are some people who are able to afford to make this extraordinary investment in college education. it is a good thing for people to do. host: m.i.t., as an example, it says that undergraduates with family income below $200,000 can attend tuition free starting next year. that is up from the current threshold of $140,000. as you know, big endowments at some of these ivy league colleges including yours at princeton. should those be maintained at that level, or should that be used to increase the amount of aid given to students?

guest: it's a great question, i really appreciate the opportunity to speak to these. the endowments are meant to be used in the are using those endowments if you look at and its why it is able to do what it is doing, i talked earlier about how princeton has 71% of its students on financial aid with its scholarships that are in excess of the tuition price and students as a result graduating debt free. that is because we are spending our endowments on financial aid, spending our endowments on research endowments. people sometimes think their savings accounts that set off to the side. they are not that. they are like annuities. we are currently spending 5.3% of our endowment every year to maintain the operating budget of the university across all that we do. -- the reason why i was able to answer your first question about the affordability of american universities getting better is that because for those of us

with endowments we are deploying them aggressively to do things like what's happening at princeton, m.i.t., and the other schools you mentioned to create opportunities that didn't exist before. that's what we ought to be doing. host: christopher eisgruber is the chair of the association of american