doing is illegal and get them to turn in their substances and to stop selling these things. they've been holding a lot of press conferences and, in fact, doing enforcement sweeps to bust people who are selling these things. general shirtliff, utah has been on the forefront of this as well. can you share some of your experiences with us? >> what we've done is we created what's called a criminal alcrim strike force in is great because every state your citizens are saying do something more about illegal immigration. and some states have taken more aggressive approaches with regard to enforcement type bills but everything we could do and say is, my state has been for state laws.

there are criminally aliens, illegal aliens who create crimes and violate state laws. we found in 2 1/2 years that not om are they manufacturing false ids but are very involved in synthetic drugs, human trafficking across the board. we've had so many successful raids and the last two have made a substantial amount of spice and other drugs. including oneed a quartered in southern part of salt lake county had connections to nevada, as well as california, and they were getting the ingredients from china. so the multi-agency, multi-disciplinary strike force, offer office, local law enforcement, and federal government, we've been successful in going after the spice operations. they are multi-state and even international with the china connection. so i would just suggest that you maybe look into -- into a criminal alien type strike force. initially people say you're just

going after people of color. no, we -- 90% -- 95% of all of our confidential enforcements are undocumented aliens. 90% of our 200 convictions so far are criminal reentrants so they go straight into the federal system but very involved in gangs. the gang unit here, spice and other illegal narcotics. and so you can actually get two or three bangs for the buck by doing something like that. >> have you introduced legislation in utah? >> yes. >> has it been successfully up led? >> yes. as i say, we just recently in february, we just had a major spice bust. we're charging under our new statue. it hasn't been challenged yet on that one. but that's the first time we charge under the new statute. i think we're going to be fine. >> great. one thing i note is that sometimes we don't hear about these things but the latest is that the american poison control center came out with a survey that they published last year. one out of every nine, one in

nine high school students reported that they have used spice or k-2 and tried it. and there is a huge danger to the children. general bondy, i understand that florida has been on the forefront of this, too. could you tell us about your experiences, as well? >> yes. thank you. and -- loud. before i get started, too, on this, it's killing our kids. and another very important issue, i know it's off synthetics, but is the oxycodone problem. i would like everyone to know that general conway and i jointly testified in front of congress last week to stress the importance of our war on the real drugs, the prescription drugs throughout our country. but as to the synthetics, general louie, yes, last session we banned the use of bath salts. it's mdpv.

we found that it's all over the panhandle of our state. this stuff is being manufactured in asia, this junk is being sold in our country, to our kid legally. they can walk in convenience stores and buy this stuff. it's in very small pacts. it looks like sugar packets. legal. $15, $25 a packet. these kids are sprinkling it in their potato chips at school, they are snorting it, drinking it. everything you can imagine. and we were having overdoses left and right. so i was in office not even two months and i found out this was going on. well, before we could reach session, we had spring break. one of the side effects is that it's a hall luis generalic. we have kids on balconies. so that was our biggest fear. so in florida, i have the authority to sign an executive order and make a drug illegal for a limited amount of time until we could get it passed at that session. it unanimously passed. and so we banned the bath salts and the k-2 spice.

i can tell you the same horror stories of -- we have videos, law enforcement videos of what this stuff is doing. if somebody trying to say it's simple marijuana, it's not even close. it is a hall luisijenic, close to pcp and acid and kids were dying. calls to poison control plummeted after we outlawed this junk. now this session we're back again because we have creative chemist, a multimillion dollar business, and what they are doing is they are all over the world just changing the compounds around to make it legal. so it's back on the shelves, under different names. they've even gone so far as to stamp on the back of it, this is legal. being sold in convenience stores. so now we have an additional list of compounds that that's passed i think the house and senate already. we're in session this week. so hopefully that will be signed into law soon. but you've got to keep up with

these guys because they're changing the compounds on us revery year and our children are overdosing. just within the last three weeks we had two overdoses in florida because of this stuff that is now legally just by the legal -- legal just by mixing up the compounds. on an education front, we've been all over the state talking about it. you know, when i talked -- i personally go talk to kids everywhere. our gubernatorial fellows, i asked them, have you heard of this stuff in they raised their hands. are your friends taking it? they raise their hands. last week i heard of a story of a 14-year-old girl, the students i spoke to witness this happen. some of the stuff that's still legal she took it and sprinkled it, advance placement student, sprinkled it in her pate po tate to chips at lunch and overdosed in front of the entire class. that what we're seeing. we just have to keep up with these chemists and keep fighting the fight. and if any of you -- we didn't invent the wheel.

we went to louisiana because they had already outlawed it originally to get the compounds from them. but if any of you are interested in this, check with us and we can go through the compounds with you that we feel are the most deadly and need to be outlawed. >> thank you. >> general louie, just to give you -- these packets she's talking about, this operation we took down just last week, this is utah. 2.5 million population. we seized 150,000 of those one gram sugar packets. 150,000. they're selling for 13 bucks a pa packet, which is nearly $900,000 worth of drugs. 150 pounds of herbs. . the manufacturing machines where they were manufacturing them right there in the city. so that is just one operation. so consider how much is out there in all of your states. >> general sothers, any comments on this as a prosecutor? you seeing this in colorado? >> absolutely. remember, last meeting i told you how much colorado loves its

kananoids. you will be pleased to know they don't like synthetic a novemb canavanoids. it's really not been that controversial. we got off to a good start because of the very high profile situation in september of 2011 when a 15-year-old high school student in thornton, colorado, during her noon hour, purchased k-2 from a corner store near her high school. smoked the product over lunch break. passed out in class. woke up, was hallucinating. taken to the hospital. had a long recovery period. and it just dramatized for the public how serious this problem was. so we had absolutely no problem in the next session outlawing it. we are now dealing in this

legislative session with cathonoids. but the only issues have been it's unanimous everybody wants to outlaw it. the issues are what people have said here, do we just individually list these things and then have to come back every year or can we come up with compound descriptions that we don't have to amend the stad chu statutes every year? but in a state that's on the verge of legalizing marijuana next november, we've had no trouble turning the public against these particular products. >> okay. thank you. and let me just note for all of the ags, we sent out an e-mail to you with a handout and a memorandum documents some of these things. and also providing some of the press releases that general manacan has issued and also some of the press releases that general shurtliff has issued so

you can take a look at that and decide if you want to do something similar. we've also provided you with draft legislation that you might want to consider if you haven't done that in terms of identifying the families of these drugs. general biden? >> i just want to add to what general bondy said. not only are our kids dying, we all know that, and at too rapid a rate because of this stuff, but law enforcement is dying, too. we had a police officer go into a routine bringing and entering who ran up against one of these folks and found himself at the other end of a knife and is now no longer with us. he was killed. and so this rapidly moved through our state and legislature banning it. but if you talk, as we all do, to law enforcement, they're very, very concerned about this for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is an officer safety issue. >> thank you. anybody else have any experiences or court challenges

that have been brought up or successes in doing any of this? >> general, jeff from new jersey. excuse me. >> yes, thank you. >> last week, last thursday i, through my department of consumer affairs, which is part of the attorney general's office, issued an emergency order banning classes and, including in that, known and unknown variants of things used to make synthetic marijuana so that we can try to get around what we were talking about earlier, which is the backyard chemists there tweak these chemicals a little bit and technically it's legal. and it goes back on the shelves. so it's a very broad-based ban. i don't know if we're going to get it challenged but i know the retailers who sell this stuff and put it out there for kids making it seem like it's okay to use are not going to have it on our shelves anymore. that's what we did in new jersey. >> a question for those who are seeing it, what is the age group that it is targeted at and using it? and secondly, do you see that

the spread of this is through social media in any way? is it because of kids ability to spread the word on facebook or anything that you've seen? i guess my last question is, urban, rural, or across the board in your states, for those of you who have seen it? >> yes. primarily urban right now for the spice. that's for the manufacturing and where it's most popular and where it's spreading. they are using social media, directly targets kids. you have -- what age group though, middle schoolers, high school? >> middle through college. and it's -- they have names like -- for these legal sachet jars, brain sick, three wise men, barry jay. some are fruit flavors so they are -- we cheerily believe they're being marketed to the youth. we did ban 17 -- our law bans, 17 specific synthetic drugs so far. >> right.

well, i think this is an area where we can all collaborate and learn from each other. and if there are court challenges, i think we can ban together to try and work on identifying these generic families and getting them banned so that we can address this problem. and i would just note that, you know, there is no quality control on this. these guys get these chemical substances and they spray them on to herbal packages. then it's like spray painting or anything like that. you can lace something with 100 times what a dose would be or 10 tooi times and there's just no guarantee how hall luis genic this stuff may be. >> okay. general mcgraw. >> we're looking at this issue through the -- the approach in consumer protection of unfair and deceptive practices.

and we believe that we are on a road to a intermediate solution. >> that's a have you brought prosecutions against -- >> no, not yet. not yet. >> not yet, okay. okay. that's certainly an avenue. >> okay. let me now jump to our next topic. we're going to take one topic out of order. is that right, general coakley? >> yes, we're going to switch around. gang units will be last. it's switching places in our brochure with handling scanne i. >> we're now going to talk about scandal reporting. that's the second topic we want to cover. let me tee it up for discussion. the issue many times comes up as to when there are sexual abuse allegations in schools or in state agencies or things like that. and the issue comes up as to when you're supposed to do something, what you're supposed to do, whether you report it,

whether you call a police, what do you do? in hawaii we've actual little had two recent cases. the first case involved allegations that surfaced about a high school track coach who allegedly had touched inappropriately a 13-year-old girl. and what had happened in hawaii was that the coach -- that complaint was made and it was made to the principal and the prirns p prans pal decided she would make an investigation, as an administrative investigation. she interviewed a number of people, decided that the girl was not credible and that the coach was credible. and let it go. six months later, it erupted as a scandal because a lawsuit was brought and then criminal charges were brought. they t. charges have now escalated into a much higher degree of alleged touching. and there's -- so there is a lawsuit about that. and question is, what was the

principal supposed to do, what are the policies and procedures of the schools, when do you -- when do you report this stuff and who do you report it to? another recent problem that we've had in hawaii was we had allegations surface at deaf and blind school where there were allegations that the students themselves were coercing sexual activity on behalf of other students. and that it had been reported up to the principal, and the principal had done nothing. i now have a lawsuit there involving about 30 plaintiffs. some of whom are victims, some of whom are perpetrated, and some of whom were both. they were victims and then they thought, well, everybody else is doing this, i can be a perpetrator, too. now we have that. the issue many times is what are you supposed to do, what are the different perspectives? obviously law enforcement's perspective is always report and always report to the authorities and the police as soon as

possible. from the school's point of view, they have to decide whether or not they have any expertise in this at all, whether or not they know what they're doing in terms of making an investigation into what are very serious allegations. and whether or not they should be conducting an administrative investigation or sitting back and letting a criminal investigation go forward. many times the school, as well as the state agency, has to balance the rights of the accused, as well as the rights of the accuser to privacy. many times these are miners w are making these allegations and they're sensitive and their parents are sensitive about any kind of publicity about this thing. and then you have the problem of, well, is it just a disgruntled student who wants to make trouble because we have seen some of those things in the past. so we have had these problems, not just in hawaii, obviously in california, they recently had a

situation where they shut down an entire school. the miramonte elementary school in florence, california, where they had two allegations of inappropriate sexual contact by teachers and they shut the entire school down and replaced the entire faculty. and it is still going on right now. that was over the objections of the students and the parents there who were very concerned that everybody was being tarred with the same brush. and we also know that in pennsylvania there have been some allegations that have been raised about a certain coach there, mr. sandusky. and so let me invite a general kelly to tell us some of the perhaps -- if you can, and we all realize that there is litigation, so none of this is in any way intended to go into litigation details or to force you or anybody else to take a

position that could be used in litigation. but perhaps you could talk to us a little bit about some of the issues that you are seeing in your state that have been tee'd up by the situation with mr. sandusky. >> sure. i wanted to comment just briefly on the policies and procedures, and really the lack thereof, policies, procedures, and law in some of these instances involving the reporting of child sexual abuse cases. and as david said, we've had this issue come up in a very big way in pennsylvania as a result of the jerry sandusky case, as well as the parallel case where the attorney general's office has charged two high-ranking administrators at penn state university with failing to report child abuse -- child sexual abuse that occurred in the football locker room at penn

state and lash hall. i don't want to talk, as david said, too much about the facts of the case but, quite frankly, i have never been involved in a case quite like this that has -- where there is so never been in case like this where there's so much in the public domain and so much in the public record. i think it will be all right to talk about make of the points that really illustrate the different ways that different people responded to their obligation to report in the sandusky case and the case where the penn state administrators were charged. i think that it's probably fair to say the office of attorney general in pennsylvania became involved in the jerry sandusky investigation primarily because someone actually chose to report sexual abuse. that occurred back in 2008 when a mother of a young boy who attended a high school in clinton county, pennsylvania,

which is very near penn state, where penn state is located notified the authorities of the high school where her son attended that he had been sexually assaulted by jerry sandusky, who was a volunteer coach at that school. the school, clinton county school then, in turn, notified children and youth services, which is what we call that agency in pennsylvania, and then the police became involved. eventually shortly after that the attorney general's office began its investigation which resulted in charges again jerry sandusky, 50 counts related to sexual assault of over 10 victims. from there the investigation worked backward from the report made by the mother in clinton

county. we then learned after initial reporting of that sexual abuse in clinton county, back in 2002, an assistant coach by the name of mike mcqueary had gone to the penn state football facilities in 2002 and saw what he believed to be a young boy in the shower being assaulted by jerry sandusky. i'm sure you read the accounts of what happened after that. mike mcqueary immediately called his father who advised him to contact the head football coach joe paterno, which he did the next morning. early the next morning he went to joe paterno's house and reported what he had seen. coach paterno the following morning contacted the athletic director at penn state tim curley and vice president in

charge of finance and campus affairs gary schultz, who was also head of the campus police department and reported to them mcqueary's visit to his home the previous night. after that, no one else was ever notified. children and youth services were not notified and no law enforcement agencies were notified of what occurred at lash hall in march 2002. gary schultz, who was also the director, as i said, of security at penn state was also aware of a 1998 incident where a report had been made. that report of the 1998 incident, again, was made by the mother of a young boy who learned that her son had been showering in the lash hall facilities with jerry sentenced.

this was conducted by the police department and children and youth services were brought into the 1998 incident as well. in that case, those were three incidents of reporting or lack of reporting that occurred in the sandusky case. it ill straits how different people react in different places. the mother notified the school who notified the police. in the 2002 incident the private citizen who observed it reported it to his superiors at penn state to administrators and no further report was made to law enforcement or any child or youth services. in the '98 incident, again, a mother reported it to children and youth services and to penn state university. as a result of all that, the ags ended up charging two administrators at penn state with failure to report an

incident of child abuse that occurred on the penn state campus. we did that as a result of a statute in effect in pennsylvania. the statute was not artfully drafted, overbroad, nonspecific, and really was only a summary offense and had very little teeth as far as punishment. at the time penn state administrators allegedly failed to report the activity, it was a summary. since then it has become a misdemeanor and carries the penalty of one year. so you can see the penalties associated with these reporting statutes are not really -- they don't really have much strength in them. if you look at the statute that existed in pennsylvania at the time, it looks like it was

drafted to really cover people and professionals who had contact with children as a result of the profession they were engaged in. nurses, school administrators, doctors, people like that that might coin contame in contact w children bruised or had physical trauma. it really wasn't designed to a private citizen that observes child sexual abuse or physical abuse. we know with private citizens there's all sorts of issues attendant to them as well. off times you might run into a situation where someone might come into contact with their seven-year-old neighbor who lives across the street, who may not be credible, has a tendency to exaggerate. if that child tells them uncle

john has been doing things to them, the question arises what is the obligation of that neighbor to report, to do anything, to probe any further as far as that child is concerned. so i don't want to go on and on here, but the jerry sandusky case really has raised a lot of consciousness as far as the need to report child sexual abuse. it obviously has raised the consciousness of the public, because when the facts came to light, it was obvious in both the media and the public, oh, my goodness, why weren't these things reported. then when you took a look at why they weren't reported, there were various reasons. it also raised the consciousness of us in law enforcement because it made us realize we really have a need for better laws and better statutes that are well drafted and that are directed toward the need that our society has today to protect our kids

and to cause people, whether they be private citizens or people that come into contact with kids by their profession to report this. then you have the issue whether it should be reported to a child and youth service agency or whether it should be reported to the police. it really is not quite as simple as it appears at first blush. there's a lot of nuances and issues that arise as far as the moral obligation to report and the legal obligation to report. >> thank you, general kelly. general biden. >> i just want to chime in quickly, general kelly, i commend you for all your efforts in pennsylvania on this. it's been -- you've been working on. i've been thinking of you as you do it. our state approximately two years ago, my office indicted a pediatrician who we indicted him

for raping nearly 100 of his patients, average age 3 years old. pediatrician raping his patients, average age 3 years old. we've dealt with all the same issues you're dealing with. i just want to leave you with one fact. most of you know these facts. one out of four girls is sexually assaulted before they are 18 years old. one out of six boys is sexually assaulted before they are 18 years old. only one out of ten of these kids ever report is, because nine out of the ten of the perpetrators know or say they love the children they are raping. one out of four girls, one out of six boys, only one out of ten report, nine out of ten say they love the kid they are raping. that's high this issue is so critical, in fact, i raised with the admiral, maybe another ev