following the first successful desegregation e the second worl. things shifted to other matters. the whole nation is at war. most of the activity of the civil rights organizations had to do with fair treatment of soldiers and employment in the war. so it's after the war that the domestic civil rights movement really gets going again and again, it's paul hendersonnd apthe afap the and the afro that are documenting this. for example, on the cover of your program is a photograph taken in 1948. this shows the famous actor and singer paul robison and an officer in the naacp on a picket

line in front of ford's theater. ford's theater had a policy of the blacks could only reach in the second balcony. and they could not come into the front of the theater, but had to go around the corner and it wasn't even on a corner. so come to the front, buy a ticket, walk around the corner and go up a very steep glorified fire escape to the second balance condition a balcony. until they decided to change that policy, there were demonstrations for every performance in front of ford's theater. paul henderson photographed many people. it actually became kind of likes thing to do if you were coming to baltimore, you would spend time on the picket line. thing to do if you were coming to baltimore, you would spend time on the picket line.

so there are lots of famous people on the picket line in front of ford's theater untilpi 1952. henderson photographed lots of activities leading up to the brown versus board of education decision. our two baltimore cases that were pending at the time of brown had to do with the vocational school. and with weston high school. poly had desegregated. but the two baltimore cases that were pending, and the argument was they couldn't be separate but equal because had one of the state-of-the-art one of the best in the country printing facilities and there was nothing comparable to that in the black community and the weston

lawsuit, weston high school, dealt with the fact that there were no single sex schools for blacks in the city. paul henderson took photographs and i'm sure in this collection are photographs 245 deal with that matter. we then get into the '50s where helena and other who are begg ms in fact started the sit-in movement. it did not begin in 1960, but morgan students at reed's drug store downtown, at reed's drug store on the corner of coal spring lane. and they had actually a fair amount of success. by 1959, they had desegregated all of reed's drug stores and in 1959, they deseg dwbreak gated e run dell's stores.

that was another chain. so there was a lot of success all which have is being photographed by the afro and its photographers. a transition takes place in 1960 because henderson leaves but then another afro reporter comes there, henry phillips. and the movement continues to be photographed by the afro. the sit-in movement ultimately spreads to the entire nation will in 1960, all of which is covered, all of which is photographed in in the afro and of course leading up to the sort of two granddaddy of sit-in activities at northwestern -- at north wood center where about 400 students were arrested. paul photographed many of them a part of the images of this

exhibit. so i think it's certainly valuable, important that this society that has those images and we all need to do what we can to make sure they get the resources necessary to make these 6,000 very important parts of american history available to everyone. [ applause ] >> and so the reason why people like dr. hicks and others have been able to reclaim the legacy of protest sit-ins that have taken place in this area that lit the fire in other areas is because of documentation.

history is nothing without documents. you can't just make this up. oh, i was there. well, really, were you? i don't recall seeing you. so the documentation is critical, critical, to our understanding of the events and issues that we've been discussing tonight. and so you heard professor gibson touch seeing part about the evening, going on about the henderson collection and significance from the 23r56 photographic perspective. so i'll ask if he would sort of touch on the oral history project which will is also part of the collection here and touch on the significance of that project as a document of the civil rights movement.

and how the ro correproject was received. p. >> good evening. i'm not a civil rights activist. i'm a historian. and quite frankly, this is a spiritual experience for me because i celebrate 40 years of oral history interviewing and the first interview that i did was in 1972 here with the maryland historical society. but i would not have been part of the project if it hadn't been for betty key. mrs. francis scott key started the oral history program here at the historical society. and what was interesting was that i did a variety of projects including how immigrants established credit in baltimore.

and betty said you're the kind of person we're looking for, you want to give a voice to the people that have not been recorded, would you like to work on the project and i said absolutely. she really preceded many of the standards and ethics that are now institutionalized in the oral history association. she really did many of the things that preceded the wiwingd guidelines which now direct the irb kinds of things that we have to do in oral histories. so she set the standards and the model for good oral history. and made thewa many people consider the project to be a grass roots project. i don't necessarily agree with that because of the 92 interviews, most were the movers and shakers of the civil rights movement in baltimore. and i think that's very

important. because you needed those kinds of interviews to paint the picture here at baltimore. so i contend that was a good decision. later on other projects really get into the rank and file people that did a lot of grass roots kinds of things. it was an interesting project because i did seven interviews. three stand out in my mind. clarence blount was an amazing man. you could look into his eyes and you could see the rez wlut kinds of things that he wanted to do, the motivation and just the kind of person that he was. you knew he was going to do everything in his power to support the civil rights movement. james rouse was a tremendous supporter. i've never interviewed instead that was more confident.

he knew what he wanted to do and he wasn't going to take no for an answer. and then betty key said i want you to interview governor taws. and you have to remember, i'm 23 years old. and i said betty, you want somebody with experience, you don't want me to to the interview. and she said yes, i do. you put a 23-year-old kid in front of the governor, he will be disarmed a little bit, won't look too promoting. so i was able to ask the hard hitting questions and got away with it made maybe an older experienced interviewer would not have been able to do at the time. but it was a tremendous project

that really captured one of the la largest collections in baltimore at the time. now, remember, that was audio interviews. that was analoged, cassette. we did everything on typewriter. there was no e-mail. yeah. student of my can't understand that. what do you mean no e-mail? so it was done in a tremendously different way than today. and when we got to products, products were not on twitter and so forth. they were very much traditional. there was a presentation, but in many respects it was not the type of products that we would develop today. betty key said really we don't want to do our own product, we want to let other researchers do it from apobjectivity standpoint. that was the thinking of the day. it's changed considerably.

immediate reaction, we had a presentation here and it was well received. but i don't remember a tremendous amount of fanfare at that time. because i think what was happening is the dust had not yet settled enough with the civil rights movement and the history that was collected. i think it has now taken maybe 40 additional years or 35 additional years for this project to have people realize what a tremendous gem we have in this project. so it was my pleasure to have worked on this project. it got me started in oral history. i've now completed over 900 oral history interviews. and again, betty key would not have been -- i would not have been involved with it had it not been for betty key. what is damon? damon is standing in the back. he's worked on the project. you talk about about full

circle. betty key was my mentor. she was kind of the second generation of oral historian. i was third generation. and damon took my graduate course in oral history and is now directing many of the oral history projects here as the fourth generation. and that's what oftentimes happens in the sif rights movement. it was passing from generation to generation in support the same way with oral history. we hope through these generations we have been able to create a project that was enduring and is still a diamond in the rough. it still has not been explored like it should be. and i think we have such an opportunity in the future to really explore the material out of those 92 interviews. [ applause ] so one of the principal figures of that oral history

project is of course lilly mae jackson, really the bedrock 6 the baltimore branch of the naacp, who served for 50 years -- 35. excuse me. that's why i'm here with the experts. so i'll throw it back to dr. scott and ask her to sort of discuss how not just lilly jackson, but the involvement of women in civil rights protests in particular. >> okay. the question actually takes me back to my first studies in undergraduate at stanford when i was working with people making the documentary the eyes on the prize. the first course i took was women in the modern freedom

struggle. and i was overwhelmed by the fact how little i knew. when i think about civil rights, i think about martin luther king, i may think of a. phillip randolph, definitely thurgood marsha marshall, but hadn't heard about rosa parks beyond that one incident on the bus. and definitely when you think about traditional history book, you don't learn about lilly carroll jackson, gloria richardson or victoriaed a dams. and one of the things when you're positioning, and i would love to hear dr. hicks' point on this, when you're thinking why are women not so focused on the overall civil rights movement except in the last 15 years or so, it goes back to the same questions of why the movement exists in the first place because of racism and sex civil. t sexism. it's why we're only recently hearing about the strong

powerful leadership of women in the movement. baltimore was a hot bed. it wasn't as if when you think about the large on washington, you think of traditionally the big six leaders, you think of a. phillip randolph, martin luther king, the urban league, naacp, but on that day, the only women present were dr. dorothy hite and mahalia jackson. and that day would not have occurred beginning in its planning all the way to 1963 without women involved in the planning. but they weren't allowed to speak on the day. baltimore didn't have that same issue. baltimore and maryland are an exception. women were not only -- even that first letter that we heard when they were talking about how they were going to plan the membership drive and asking specifically for a female

secretary. well, that's generally where often these major national organizations wantedo remain as a secretary, as a person pouring the coffee, person doing the leg work to organize the members. but not the personf thfo movement. and baltimore, maryland was different. they didn't have to be asked to be at the forefront. they were in the movement. and i'm taking this from the men who were involved who mentioned in a black men could not come into the movement at the same point that black women did. black women were willing to risk some of the early fights that were generally seen to be rights that were part of quote/unquote the women's role, fighting for a shop where you can work. who is doing the shop something women are doing the shopping. fighting for educational rights and desegregation in the classroom.

whose job is to think about who is educating the next generation some women's rights. but between public and private, it wasn't a luxury afforded to african-american or immigrant women. african-american women worked at the home before they worked in someone else's home. there was no public and private. so they were able to forge leadership roles in a way that they kind of took upon themselves the rights that women were involved in in terms of the movement were on which what t sought on a daily basis. whether they were denied to teach a class, whether they were called to put on full uniform in the middle of the night to serve someone a glass of water, or whether they were sa

sustain horrendous accounts of sexual harassment. so in a way, they had to fight a the double binary of being african-and icjoke with my studm african-american during february and i'm a woman during march. so i'd like to hear dr. hicks' pi opinions on how women forged their way particularly at baltimore. >> well, i've always said one of the things that women do well is they talk to each other. they talk and talk and talk to each other. and they talk about things that are usually important to all, it's not just one person taking over. and then they share a common bond once they decide as a group

to do something, they do it as a group. nobody breaks away to be the leader or to charge ahead and get another group started so they can be given the credit. they do what they say they're going to do. and so women's groups were everywhere. in the church, in the neighborhood, on the white marble steps, in the evening when they were watching the kids play. they were in lots of places. they were in the backyard, hanging clothes out on the line, and they talked. and in those conversations, they discovered that there were things they could do quietly to make a difference because they were thinking about their children and the next generation. and they did them. and they did them without any

fear because one thing i was taught is that you have to drop your fear. you can't have fear and work it in a movement, definitely not the civil rights movement. so whatever you do, first thing you have to realize, you're not going to be afraid. you can't carry fear into that activity. women with yoere pretty good at. they had to stand up to the bill collectors and say, no, that bill is not correct. or to the grocery store merchant, you're overcharging me just because i'm black, negro, colored. very different names depending on where you lived and what generation you came out of. they had to do all of that. and i said women are better at standing their ground over the long haul or they were at that

time. i think are good at it, too. more has helped men learn to stand hair ground. women go through a war. we went through it teaches you you have something precious, you want to protect something precious like liberty and freedom, you learn on to stand your ground forever and ever. and that's what women do. [ applause ] >> as i've been sitting here, i've been thinking about photography, continuing to think about photography. and i wonder if the reason why women are underrepresented

generally in people e's perceptn of history is because men wrote the books. the two of you mentioned four matters that we have the fortune of there being photography correcting the history. in 1933 following that george armwood lynching, the first proactive activity you mentioned was the buy where you can work campaign on pennsylvania avenue. it was an economic boycott to get jobs. this was pennsylvania avenue was the principal business strip through the black community. there are several photographs about pennsylvania avenue in the henderson collection. and so they started a set of demonstrations. it was thurgood marshall's first climb was a man who organized this. well, the most well-known and enduring photograph of the pickets on pennsylvania avenue, all of the picketers are women.

another photo that i just thought about you'll see upstairs is of a 1942 meeting getting together of voter registration campaign. i hadn't thought about it until i'm sitting here listening, but most of the people getting ready to go into the streets there to organize people and to register them are women. that 1935 membership drive, the most well-known photograph of that is a street corner rally where they had like a flat bed truck and they went around urging people to join the naacp. the person at the mike is a very young juanita jackson.

i did an exhibit that i hope you will get out and see it. and aboin 1943, fortunately some was able to get into the city jail because the women's prison was absolutely packed. and i have photographs on that exhibit of women. i suspect that this involvement and this leadership and role on the part of women has happened many other places, but they didn't have paul henderson there taking the photographs. but we did and now this society has those images. so i'm back where i was before making another commercial for the henderson exhibit. [ applause ] >> i'm hearing a lot of wonderful things from our panelists this evening.

and again i'm going to go back to the records. if we don't have photograph, if we don't have oral histories, if we don't have the documents, then the history gets lost. so i want to open it up to the group and sort of throw out the question as we've seen recently with the struggle for revitalize reed's drug store and the issues of preserving even in the historical society, we've had issues with documentation, can you touch on the importance of preservation and the importance of the continuing mining of these primary resources so that we all have a better understanding of this dialogue, this story?

>> again, i think the project was incredible and the re presentation was a good presentation, but there was not a lot of fanfare. you have to recognize the r inripple effei inripple effect. there was a program on the penn north project, that involved students and grass roots people and all of a sudden they took a cue from the jackson project and they realized we need to widen that and that project was really quite a very interesting piece involving the community members. in 1980s, we had the baltimore voices play. i'm curious, how many people know what the baltimore voices -- very good.

where linda shope worked on the baltimore voices project. she worked with betty key and is a driving force in oral history herself. and this really was a play which looked at baltimore neighborhoods and again widened their circle of documentation. and then we have another -- i'm sorry? and the tapes are here, right, exactly. ed did a tremendous project and the list goes on and on. and as you see this kind of work just builds on itself and creates a tremendous body of work that's looked nat in different ways including education. i think students through these kinds of pieces look at education differently. it didn't happen overnight and it didn't happen just in birmingham and the rock. it happened in baltimore and right in their neighborhoods.

and they could get so much in-depth information when they hear the words of people that actually involve themselves and put their lives on the line and stood up and wanted to be counted. and when you get students interacting with history in that way, it makes a radical difference overall. i will say betty key was very pleased about the project, but unfortunately in 1980 to 81 ['], the oral history collection and her work here was ended as a short sighted view quite frankly at that time. oral history was not considered as important as other endeavors. think about what would have happened had we continued an oral history project through the 1980s and '90s and so forth. we would have had a tremendous quleks of oral histories here at the maryland historical society. that's really a lesso