bridge is in my mind all the time. i was born by the brooklyn bridge. it's in my head. i said the landscape of texas is in all my work. so somehow this landscape is inherent in this great man. >> so frank, you have described this project as an emotional portrait of dwight eisenhower, using the power of architecture, landscape and visual art to tell this life story and to represent his strength and values. and at the same time, paying attention with the balance between respectful and boring. so talk about the boring piece. [ laughter ] >> well, it's hard to comment on that. but i think expressing the man is not boring, and if we do it right, it will resonate and be strong.

>> resonate is a good word. the history books have recorded him in a certain way, but this is something i think that we can reflect on in multiple ways. >> i think that there are people that think this is too big a space for eisenhower. he wasn't as important as that space. it's why does he have a space that's bigger than somebody else? he doesn't. he's just going to have a little plank with a little boy. this is just an image to contexturalize and modify the location so that it can accept that little modest piece and not get lost in the hubbub of the city.

i think it's going to be very modest. >> you know, let's see if i have this. >> what are you looking for? >> i said, in one of our meetings, if you take a space that's this big and you put it in a space -- >> that's what they thought i was going to do. [ laughter ] but if you put this in that space, this is bigger, because there's more space around it. >> yeah. >> and that's sort of the idea. >> that's the idea. >> so the intent is to use content from carl's library to enhance the experience.

>> carl is a living library. if i go have coffee with him and say, i would like to have a coffee, can you get me this kind of coffee, he said, well, eisenhower used to --s, the people involved. just fantastic. >> so this is still very much a work in progress. >> we're getting close. we have budget and technical stuff, and we have the landscape, which joe brown was here. where's joe? there he is. [ applause ] that's eda, landscape. >> and attention to materials for the fabrication? >> well, right now we're talking about the columns being stone.

that seems to be the right thing to do in this location. we're pretty close to our budget, so we're doing well. there's not going to be any -- the maintenance part of this is very carefully thought out. we're doing tests on the tapestry to ensure that it will last at least 200 years, but you can see it's pretty simple. you can just spray it and clean it. i don't think things are going to grow in it. so it's just spraying that and maintaining a garden. there's no complicated

waterfalls, or there may be a little fountain or something but -- to get the trickle, trickle of water, the sound of water, but i'm not sure. the lighting will be interesting, how you light this at night. and it looks different from behind and from forward. and it changes during the day. so it will be very interesting. it will have a different persona. >> i think it's going to be very -- >> i don't know if there's a night picture. there was -- >> beautiful at night. >> yeah, there it is. and you can see to the left, this shows the landscape down at

the bottom, a building and the openness. these are just tests of the various pieces. and we actually made -- tomas made a face of eisenhower's eyes in that material, and it's recognizable. so if we wanted to put figures -- we don't, but if we were, you know -- if we wanted to, if it became an issue, we're able to do it. so we're vetting this thing. >> so the side panels will be trees also? >> yes. the landscape just continues around. you know, you can put eisenhower the general on one side and eisenhower the president. we tried it. i've got pictures of all this. when you do these things, the

first thing you do is figure out the ten most obvious things to do, and then you do them and look at them and then reject them. but it's -- that's the normal process for guys like us. >> does that include -- you talked earlier about other memorials. is there a particular memorial that you think is good? >> lincoln. >> absolutely. lincoln, washington. >> and maya lin. >> oh, beautiful. that's great. >> she was my student, so i'm proud. >> that's right. [ laughter ] >> that's right. >> she was a >> is that the end of the slides? >> i don't know. that's the dure. so you can see where tomas got it. he was very clever to do that. there's the more intense part at the bottom, which is still transparent. you can still see through it. and this is the conundrum representative, the man as president ran -- >> here's the homecoming speech.

>> yeah. >> so it's here. >> can you all read it? >> because no man is really a man who has left out of himself all of the boy. i wanted to speak first of the dreams of a barefoot boy, always in his dreams is the day when he finally comes home to a welcome from his hometown. because today, that dream of 45 years ago has been realized beyond the wildest stretches of my own imagination. i came here to thank you and to say that the proudest thing i can do in that is that -- that i can claim is that i'm from abilene. >> yeah. >> wow. >> there's the little -- there's the boy. it's hard to get this done, and we're getting help by an artist friend, charlie ray.

>> there is a small museum on the aircraft carrier "uss eisenhower," and that photograph is this evening on its way to that museum, because they've asked for some new photographs. >> really? >> that's one of them. >> we're trying to find other photographs just so we have -- i with -- this one is pretty special. >> it's great. >> this is the photograph from the military that we all like. >> oh, good. >> and this is the photograph we like on the right of him, or this one. this is when he was giving the military industrial complex speech, he looked like that. >> that's right.

>> and we could use the medal or the eisenhower jacket. >> mm-hmm. >> so if you made it out of stone, like the elgin marbles, and these are pictures we looked at. okay. >> terrific. so why don't we open it up for questions. there are microphones on either side. and you really need to use a microphone because c-span is recording tonight. >> can you hear me okay? i'll talk loud. can you hear me? >> are the microphones on? go ahead, sir, you need to turn them on. >> so you may not remember this, but about three or four years ago in "the washington post,"

there was this incredible photo of robert todd lincoln at the lincoln memorial when it first opened. and i would give serious money to find out what he was thinking. so my question is, what kind of role did the descendants play in your analysis. >> the what? >> the descendants, the grandchildren and great grandchildren. >> well, we've met with them. >> we've met with them and -- [ laughter ] >> they've been cordial. they have their opinions. they're strong. we've listened to them. i think that when we say we're finished, they'll realize that we've listened to them. right now there may be a little question about we haven't shown how we're dealing with the president and the military man.

so everybody involved is questioning how you're going to do that, and i'm questioning it myself. but we're getting there. >> mr. gehry, previously you've been quite forthright publicly about your design philosophy. if i may quote something you've previously said. you said life is chaotic, dangerous and surprising. buildings should reflect that. likewise, thinking of this center, you said i think of this in terms of controlled chaos. i always relate it to democracy. democracy is pluralism, the collision of ideas. our cities are built on a collision of thought. look out there. there's a bridge, a huge hunk in the distance. if it wasn't for democracy, it would all look like one thing. given your stated predilection for chaos and danger in architecture s this project a

continuation of that or a departure, and moreover, did you explain your design philosophy while applying to the commission? [ laughter ] >> you know, it's like you pick -- i've got a nose hair here if you want to -- you guys, i don't remember the context of that talk. i probably was talking to a bunch of students who were not -- who were afraid, and i usually try to say that the chaos of the world around us is a fact, and recently it's gotten to be more of a fact. and how do you build within that, that if i'm building a city in the 19th century or in

the 18th century, i have a format. the cities of europe have six and seven-story buildings lining the streets. they are all similar. they're -- they create a quite beautiful city. in the democratic world, which i don't want to give up, believe me, is everybody has their right to build what they want as long as they live within the zoning codes and law enforcement. >> anything you want, no matter if it's a big hunk? >> what? >> does it matter that there's stylistic harmony within washington, d.c.? >> yeah, i know. i'm not talking about washington. >> this is where the memorial is going to be built. >> do you think this is chaotic? >> well, i happen to think that the giant screen represents winter, permanent winter, trees

without leaves and it represents death and annihilism in the way i see your black t-shirt, much beloved by downtown hipsters and annihilists everywhere and and it's a total rejection and the past and tradition and honestly everything else that eisenhower, himself, stood for. [ laughter and applause ] >> hi. mr. gehry, thanks for coming to speak with us today. [ laughter ] i just want -- a certain analogy popped in my head as we were watching this and watching your explanation. i don't know if you're familiar with the story "the emperor has no clothes," but they're weaving together a suit of invisible clothes until a little barefoot boy says the emperor has no

clothes, and i just think -- you said it's not necessarily post-modern what you're doing, but it just streams to strike me as very post-modern. i don't know if you're familiar with c.s. lewis and the space trilogy, but in that age, they have metal trees. they no longer have real trees, metal birds, and a place where there is a huge amount of space, and can you use real trees and you do use real trees, why do you think of making metal trees and doing something that seems so ridiculous? it seems to me like the emperor has no clothes, and how is this a memorial reflecting his great deeds and great works? i think as you said, the lincoln memorial, the washington monument, things that are so striking and that honor these great men and this just seems to me as -- >> well, can i answer? >> sure. >> do you have more? >> that's it. >> lincoln memorial is in a greek temple.

what's that got to do with lincoln? >> it's -- i think my mike -- okay, it's on. but it's the deeper symbolism as i said in the hearts of our nation. these principles which are classical last forever. >> okay, okay. so in our nation, in our history, in world history, the tapestries have been used to tell stories throughout the world. raphael made them. >> i find you saying that this is a tapestry a little bit ridiculous. i mean, it's just metal. i don't call that a tapestry. but i guess it just depends on definitions. >> okay. >> all right. thank you. >> phew. >> my question is a little different. i'm looking at the columns here, which appear to be rectangular in the photo. i know out in central kansas, in

the abilene area, farther west, there are a lot of limestone fence posts cut rectangular. were these intended to be reminiscent of those limestone fence posts? >> no. i didn't think of it that way. i was looking at the grain elevator. >> good evening. well, i'm from the midwest, and i'm the chairman of the board of an organization called american forests. so i couldn't be more delighted with the design and i thank you. [ applause ] i'm just curious. i read in the newspaper about a possible e-memorial, and i know that there's been talk about needing some fund-raising from the general public. is that e-memorial a way to thank the donors, or what's that all about? could you elaborate. >> we are working on an

e-memorial, yes. >> what will that be like? >> don't know yet. >> we'll stay tuned. >> yes, i was wondering to what extent do you expect or actually intend for the viewer at the memorial to come away with a good sense of the historical context within which eisenhower was an actor? will there -- i don't know whether it will be like writing and some inscriptions about the historical aspect of these times, and/or do you expect there to be like the usual brochures available there where people will be able to get a better sense of him in history? >> well, i think in some aspects, yes, we'll do that, but, you know, we have that in history books. we have that in a chip. and i think as artists, frank is an artist, you know, we're not

there to do what history books do. it's not a lessonb in history. but it's, i see it as something more poetic. and so content is con ten related to the history of the man. yes, there will be references to it, but that is mot the main objective. that information is the readily available here in your computer. and that -- >> hi. do you planb to have a specific

type of landscape behind the trees that you will plant or any type of tree? >> well n , when we were in abilene, we saw the sycamore with the bark and they are common around his house, and they are also common in washington. so, that's where we are, what we are showing now. we are not, and i don't know if all of the trees will that. >> thank you. >> the garden is going to be a park, a garden. a pretty nice garden. a nice place where there's shade, and the tapestry will be very transparent, and so it'll be like a film that organizes the space. >> i just want to encourage you

guys to talk some morek because i'm very impressed with the design reflecting the hometown and it is quite a personal reflection when you think about the marble and some of the others, the formalityf of the others, and to me, you are trying to go back to the beating heart and their sense of the community, and to me, i have been to abilene and seen the documentaries on the history channel and i'm very struck by what you are intending to do and i think that you will accomplish, but i wondered some more about is it a goal to humanize him kind of? >> well, he was. >> do you follow me when you think of how grand lincoln is sitting there. >> the speech that you read where he comes back and he doesn't beat his chest and talks about it. so he survived all of that, all of those great accomplishments, and he still didn't say, hey, look at me.

that's the guy. that's rare. and i think that it's so rare hometown is very striking, thank you. >> this question is for both of you. specifically, mr. gehry, you have always been willing to reach out to disparate professions to kind of advance the profession of architecture. at reaching out to other practices and in keeping the boundaries between practices open do you -- how important do both of you think that is to advancing both of your own professions. >> to reach out to? >> well, going back to jim glimf and bringing in the architecture and the design? >> well, it is still going on

and we are sharing it with as many people as we can. we have trained many. i think that's a real important thing. >> mr. gehry, my husband and i have a personal connection with this piece of land. we have gardened there for 30 years. >> oh. >> it has been a community garden known as independence garden. we have batted around, you know, what would eisenhower want. and i think that the first thing that we came up with is a putt putt golf course. he, of course, loved golfing and anybody as old as we are can remember that he was an avid golfer, and this is of course unlikely, but we would like to

please, please put as much green and openness, because as i say as gardeners for 30 years, we have people from all over the world come and say, oh, what a wonderful spot this is. i have this and i can show you later, what a wonderful spot this is, this garden, this oasis in the middle of washington. i think that eisenhower would love that. so i hope that you will provide some green. we know that we're history. we realize that. >> well, we have the green guys here. joe, why don't you get up to talk about it. >> the green guys. oh, okay. we know that we are history and we know that it is a done deal and this is going to be the eisenhower memorial, and we go gracefully, but we hope that you will put as much green in it as possible, a place where people can come and relax and not be covered, you know, not just

stone covered and not wild tapestries or whatever, but a place where people can commune and i think that is what eisenhower would want, too. >> that is what we are trying to do and why we don't want to bombard it with five different memorial stations. >> maybe i will show you this later so you can see what the 30 years have been to us and the spot of land. >> we hope it continues to be. >> sorry? >> we hope it will continue to be. >> your spot. >> thank you. we would appreciate that. >> joe? >> yeah, joe brown who is our partner in this and the landscape architect. >> i appreciate those remarks. it is certainly going to be very green and sustainable. the sycamore is one tree that is native to this area as well as

kansas. there is a area of the view corridor to set the view to the capital so that is going to be green, so there is a gradation of native landscapes from the green sword through the modulated landscape with hills and valleys and tree covers and informal seating areas, and very informal areas near this walls and the statues and the stone, and so you will see a very rich landscape. >> good evening. we tonight have a lot of the photos of the memorial and how it reacts to the daytime and how this tapestry will react to the lighting, and i'm curious how the space itself will react with greenery space will react the same way, and it will be lit up and engaging with the public and

be welcoming to the nice space for the people to participate and hang out and sit in the evening or we haven't seen anything, and so i'm a little curious about it. >> we haven't gone that far with it, and we know that there's a terrace, and we know that it will be used for programs. we are hoping that the space will let their terrace be used as a place to sip and watch. i think it will vary with the time of year and weather and stuff. and we see it mostly as a garden, and the story is simple, and, you know, people can orchestrate it with lighting, and we are going to build in lighting so that they can do things. so they can put on events and --

>> since this was a collaboration, i'm curious as to whether or not if there was anything that the two of you strongly disagreed over and if that was resolved. >> we went step by step, and it evolved quite naturally. >> it was a real collaboration, but no i think that -- >> it was strong. there was strong opinions. there were not -- and but, it was welcomed opinions, let us say. they were not conflicting in the sense that created stress or anything. >> there is plenty of time left.