being careless, and we always have discussions about taking care of your equipment and making sure that everything functions and that you don't -- you don't lose sight of where you are. because the early part of there it was more passification. so we just kind of went around and handed out medical stuff. and this was a rude awakening for us because up until that time i think we had -- i had -- up until that time i had one casualty in the company. and this guy was killed -- he went out of the perimeter and

either didn't remember the password or didn't say the password quick enough, and on the way back into the perimeter he was shot. this is -- and i don't know if you'd talked to freddie owens yet or not. but this is one of freddie's buddies that died in freddie's arms because, again -- and i won't say it was carelessness, but it was a lapse. a mental lapse. so we talked an awful lot about that. now, again, the rest of the guys went back, 2nd of the 7th, 1st of the 7th went back to thanksgiving dinner and whatever. and we got back and my battalion commander said, we have another operation. and it's in -- we weren't back very long before we were out in bong song. but i think a better unit

because i didn't have to tell them. make sure you've got your water. make sure you've got your ammunition. your weapon is ready to fire. you don't need to be smoking on a trail so these guys can pick you out. you need to make sure security is out. once burned, you become a better unit. and i think they became a better unit as a result of that battle. >> what was your morale like? >> low. really low. because again, i had lost people. and i think all of it -- the only time after the war, the only time i was seeing hal moore break down is when he talks about this feeling he had as a commander that he survived and his guys didn't survive. and that's kind of the same

feeling that -- he just expressed it a little bit. with a lot more passion than a number of us. but my morale is really low. because first of all i'm going, what the hell am i doing here? why am i doing this? what is this really all about? and again, i'm 25, 26. what do i know about -- what ordained me to be this leader? because i went to infantry school or whatever at fort bening or some guy in rotc told me that -- i mean, it just makes it -- you start to question your ability to be able to manage this. and then you have to start sitting down and writing these absolutely horrible letters. you know. "i reyet to inform you that your son died in -- and there was no -- there's a form letter that you can do.

but my mother would have been absolutely livid if she'd received a form letter from somebody that said, you know, the president regrets that your son was killed and whatever. so i used to do those myself. and that's a hard, hard task. >> looking back at albany now, what are your thoughts? what do you see in your mind's eye actually when you think about that now? >> waste. what a waste. what a waste of young people's liv lives. i don't know if those 17 guys, what they might have been, could have been. and again, i know this sounds melodramatic. but who knows that robert

hearst, my radio operator, who had often talked about what i want to do in the future, do i want to go to medical school, do i want to -- i mean, suppose this was the guy who would go to medical school, become the next great ben carson, brain surgeon, whatever? i mean, those are all things that you think about in hindsight. >> this is what you thought about over the years? >> this is what i've thought about over the years. and for a number of years, until joe wrote this book, until joe and hal wrote this book, i would not first of all be able to do this interview. nor would i have been able to sit down and talk to anybody about it. because when he first called me i said you obviously have the wrong guy because i do not want to talk about what happened to me in vietnam. and in a lot of ways i'm still reluctant to do it. for a lot of the guys that you will interview here. and this is not a criticism. for a lot of the guys that you

will interview here, this is their life. they are locked here. i can do this once a year. or maybe twice. by after that is really hard for me to sit down and have discussion. and everybody keeps telling me, you need to think about what if you hadn't done -- what about all the guys -- i mean, like last night. i'm in this room with a bunch of guys and their wives and their children and their grandchildren and whatever. and not that i have any responsibility for them being there. there's a deity somewhere. he or she had control over whatever. but if i had done something

different or just lay there on the ground and not done anything and the whole company -- i mean, these guys wouldn't be -- i mean, they wouldn't be here. and i don't want to make that sound like i had this great power over making it happen. but it is a reality. >> two questions. what's that do for you personally? and when you see this room full of men last night, it's still -- >> it's still there. i mean, it is -- it is a part of you that you can put away. for a little while. but when they're staring you right in the face. when they're looking at you. and i haven't been able to successfully communicate this. sometimes i don't think they understand that i'm not the captain anymore.

i am not the guy that pulls it all together, that leads them, whatever. i'm just me. >> they still see you that way. >> oh, abso- -- i mean, it is -- >> do you -- >> no. >> why? >> because it's an awesome responsibility. it really is. i mean, i know -- and i know hal moore would never tell you this. but i know he gets tired. i know he gets tired of leading. and we're 40 years out. and he's still leading this organization. >> 84 years old. >> yeah, 84 years old. i would not be surprised if hal moore says tonight, i have enough, i'm going to do hal moore stuff. and i know he enjoys doing this. but at some point you have to step back. and i guess a lot of it, a lot of it is what you -- the other piece of your life. and i guess in my case the other

piece of my life, what i do now, is so rooted in you've got to make decisions. sometimes i go home at night and don't ask me to make a decision about what we're going to do for dinner or where we're going to do to eat. i've done that all day. all i want to do is put my feet up, turn on the western channel, and watch gene autry. that might sound -- but it is -- so when i come to these and when we have these discussions about -- and i always want to be socially correct, and i always want to remember who they are. and i always want to remember what they did. but sometimes i'll look in the faces of these guys, and i don't

have a clue. and it's not that -- it was so long ago that i remember, there are some faces that i remember. and i don't know how to communicate this, but there were 123 guys in this unit. >> yes. >> and if they did what they are normally supposed to do as soldie soldiers, them coming into my conscience -- conscious is remo remote. it's like -- and i guess i can relate a lot of my after -- life experiences after the military to the military. when i was principal of a high school, one of the commitments i made was i want to learn the

names of all the kids in the school. now, this is a school of 900. so i know i'm not. but what drives me to do that is because when i see these guys, i mean, i saw a guy yesterday, i mean, i remember his name because in the book -- i don't remember him because he was a good soldier. and being a good soldier, the company commander doesn't pay attenti attention. it's like in school. we don't pay attention to the average good kid. we look at the a.p. kids, and we give them lots of attention, and we look at the kids on the other end of the spectrum. in the middle, there is a great book written by a guy who talks about education, and it's called "the neglected majority." and it is about -- it is so reflective of the world we live in. those folks who are in the

middle and who pay their taxes and vote and whatever, nobody pays any attention to them. it is the high flyers and the lower achievers and the health and strength of this nation is in that middle group. in my college years i cannot remember the name of the number one graduate from my college. i mean, he's probablify beta kappa, straight a, whatever. no clue. but in that middle group, there are a whole lot of guys in that middle group that i do remember. and maybe it's because i was in the middle group. and maybe on the low end of the middle group in terms of achieveme

achievement, accomplishment. so i'm just kind of circling back to why do you want to be the leader? i didn't want to be the leader in school i think. in my relationship with my parents and my brothers and sisters, because i was the second child and there was not a lot of expectation for the second child. at least in my mind. my father tells me now that that's a misnomer on my part. but i have an older brother who has my father's name. he's a junior. he was a high flyer. he was an overachiever. and he got lots of attention. my reaction to that was be a low flyer and you'll get lots of attention, too. so here i am 67 years old now, and i walk into a room of men that i have not seen in a year and i'm not sure what their

expectations are. >> this is an interesting commentary on leadership. and that book and your reputation precedes you. the leadership qualities you exhibited. if i'm hearing you correctly, now you just want to be one of the guys. and the burden of leadership, i mean, not necessarily a horrible burden but i'm hearing a burden of leadership, from albany, from this company, and going forward with this company after albany. and it's still with you. >> mm-hmm. and i guess at some point maybe i'll get comfortable with it. but i am not comfortable with walking in a room and guys coming up and saying sign my book.

and so what do you -- what do you say, no, i don't want to sign your book? no, you sign the book and whatever. when you do that, i guess you continue to learn as you grow. when we -- and what really kind of made this -- or pulled this to some different level for me. when we went out to california for the screening of the movie, i had the pleasure of having some meaningful conversation with sam elliott. and in that conversation i made a mistake. i had a program in my hand, and i asked him to sign the program. his persona changed, and he basically said to me, i'm here for you guys, not here to be a celebrity. those weren't his exact words.

but that was kind of his -- and that's kind of where -- i mean, the guys, the valuable guys at this reunion are freddie and per, fred klug, al montgomery, alan brown. it's not -- you know, they're not here -- >> why did you come back then? that may be a way of escape. and i can probably guess your answer. >> because maybe i need them as much as they need me. >> but do they know that, that you need them like they need you? >> no. because i don't think i've gotten -- i don't think i've gotten in touch with my sensitivity to be able to communicate back -- and many other pieces, we never have time for meaningful conversation.

it is -- i mean, for example, tonight when we go to the dinner, we will be overcome by lots of stuff. so to sit down and have a meaningful conversation with these guys about what you feel, how you feel, where you are, whatever, i've never done that. the only guy that i've spent after vietnam some quality time with is don adams. and that's just been recent. because we go to football games together. he's a big georgia tech guy. and we go down and spend time with him. and i stay at his house. but we've never had a real dialogue about the war and what we did in the war. i don't think we've reached that comfort level yet. and don is a funny guy. so a lot of our experiences are about funny stuff that happened when we were in --

>> safe stuff. >> safe stuff. that doesn't make you vulnerable or sensitive or whatever. and maybe my discussion of the sensitivity, maybe it's probably therapy for me. i don't know. >> are you going to have those conversations? >> at some point. at some point. yeah. i mean, it's a work in progress. as i am a work in progress. >> i guess as we all are to some extent. >> as we all are. weekends not c-span 3, starting at 8:00 a.m. saturday, it's american history tv. every weekend american history tv travels to historic sites, museums and ark yieflz, to learn what artifacts reveal about american history. watch "american artifacts," sundays at 8:00 a.m. eastern and again at 7:00 and 10:00 here on

c-span 3. american history tv also examines the presidents, their policies and legacies, through their historic speeches and discussions with leading historians. that's every sunday morning at 8:30 a.m. eastern. and again at 7:30 and 10:30 p.m. find more information about our programs and our other series including schedules and online video archives at cspan.org/history. this sunday on c-span's q & a, the u.s. snalt youth program. >> i think one of the greatest experiences of this week was when i got the opportunity to meet both my senators. bob casey and pat toomey. and just being able to meet them and talk to them. >> some of the leaders like leon panetta, he talked about how important it is to be financially sound because if we're not financially sound, devoting money to national defense isn't going to be worth us because we're not going to have any money to devote to it. >> reporter: high school students from all 50 states who participated in a week-long

government and leadership program in the nation's capital shared their observations and experiences as they interacted with congress, the supreme court and the president. >> all of my congressmen and senators said there's a lot of partisanship going on in congress and i'm the one reaching across the aisle. and everybody here we've met from congress has said that. and it kind of makes me wonder if everybody's saying that but it's not actually happening. is there a discrepancy between what they're saying and what they're actually doing? and i had never really thought about that before i came here. >> the u.s. senate youth program. sunday night at 8:00 eastern on c-span's "q & a." this saturday at noon eastern on c-span 2's book tv, join our live call-in program with distinguished navy s.e.a.l. and author chris kyle as he talks about his life, from professional rodeo rider to becoming the most lethal sniper in u.s. military history. at 10:00 p.m. on "afterwords" -- >> if you think of yourself as a family and if you think of

yourself as a team -- and she said, you know, when i get a raise at work he's so proud of me and it's like we got a raise, our family got a raise. but i really felt as though she had redefined providing to include what her husband does and that she had a lot of respect for what her husband was doing. >> "the richer sex" author liza mundy on the changing role of women as the bread winners of the family and how this impacts thfr lives. also this weekend, "america the beautiful." director of pediatric neurosurgery at johns hopkins ben carson compares the declines of many pyres past with america and shares his thoughts on what should be done to avoid a similar fate. sunday at 3:30. book tv. every weekend on c-span 2. now more oral histories from the vietnam archive at texas tech university in lubbock. these stories focus on the november 1965 battle of the idrang valley. bill beck was an assistant machine gunner whose actions at

a clearing called landing zone x-ray earned him a silver star. in this hour-long interview he recalls a routine mission on a sunday afternoon that turned into a life and daeth struggle. >> i'm doing an oral history video interview with mr. bill beck. we are in washington, d.c., crystal city hilton. it's november 12th, 2005, about 1:15 p.m., and we are here commemorating the reup, the 40th anniversary reunion of the battles in the idrang valley, x rarks alb ray,albany, and falcon. columbus. tell me about those days in novemb november. before you all get in, tell me about tony nadal and the guys around you, your buddies, before you all arrive on sunday. >> all right.

well, we all trained at fort bening, georgia. advanced infantry division is what i was doing down there. we went overseas. we were best buddies back in the states. we were close knit in on-kay. we were in country about two months before the ballot of the idrang valley. so we worked together, we played together, we shared things together. we were close. and we were good friends. our sergeants were good friends, good buddies. our officers we respected. our lieutenants, our captains, right up to colonel moore himself. we all knew each other. so we were pretty much a close-knit family. >> was that unusual, do you think, for a battalion to be that close? >> i didn't know it pet, but in hindsight, when you look back on things, i think we were a lot closer than other veterans i talked to. >> tell me about tony nadal. >> tony nadal, he was my company

commander. he was a fair and honest man. he treated his men like they wanted to be treated. he treated us fairly. we liked him very much. we respected him. we knew he had a prior tour in vietnam. so us being green, we had a good tendency to listen to what he had to say. we knew he had been there before. and we looked up to him. >> what about the lieutenants in the company? >> our lieutenants were all good guys. we had a young -- i had a -- my platoon leader was lieutenant taft. he was a young lieutenant, young first lieutenant. he was a very good officer. he was real nice to us. he treated us great. we respected him very much. he was killed right in front of me about eight, ten yards in front of me on lz x-ray when the firing first started.

it was a real shame because he was a bright young lieutenant. probably out of west point. i didn't know then. >> well, i do want to get your impressions of two individuals who a lot of people know. hal moore and sergeant major pl plumley. tell me about hal moore. >> back then i only knew him as an officer and that he was our battalion commander. and as you went up in the scale, lieutenants, captains, majors, and colonels, the more fear you had for them. the more brat they had on the more you feared them. and the more you respected them. >> was it a fear and a respect? >> well, yeah, you didn't want to do anything wrong because you had to go before him and you knew you were going to get reamed out if you did something wrong. so you wanted to keep that down on a sergeant level where he might just give you a kick in the ass 37 but if you went up

anything higher, for minor things, they might give you an article 15 or put you on kp duty for 15 days or something like that. they were very strict, very formal. and down on our level, the grunts down there, we could clown with each other, get away with a lot of stuff. but colonel moore, we had a lot of respect for him. and we didn't see him real often. he wasn't out in the field with us that often on a small level. a little search and destroy missions we would go on every day. you he was there on lz x-ray for the entire battle. >> howwhat did that mean to you all for him to be there and refuse evacuation and stay? >> had he not been there on site, i think it would have been a different story. because i was lost. i'd lost my -- my lieutenant was killed in front of me. mf my sergeants were shot and

wounded and killed. so russell adams, the other guy on the machine gun and i, we ended up by ourselves, and we needed direction. we needed somebody to tell us what to do, where to go. we were without that for an hour or two. >> right. what about sergeant major? >> sergeant major, we really feared sergeant major because he had the most stripes on his arm. we were all young back then, but of course he being tolder than us, we knew he was a world war ii veteran, combat veteran, korea combat veteran, and now we're in vietnam. so we really feared him. he was the greatest guy in the world when he was nice to you, but there again, you didn't want to do anything wrong and face him because you were going to really get chewed out big-time. so we had a lot of respect for all our officers and ncos. >> okay. well, on sunday morning november

14th you all air assault down into x-ray. did you have any idea on your level kind of what you were getting into or what your -- i know you knew what your assignments were going to be once you hit the ground. but what did you know intelligencewise on your level as a machine gunner, system machine gunner? >> we knew absolutely nothing of what we were stepping into. we were just out on another mission, another search and destroy mission that buy. got off in the jungle, dropped off in another part of the jungle. we were doing that every day, looking for an enmai emynemy. and that day was no different from the rest. but it turned out we stepped into a hornet's nest. >> so when you all -- tell me what happened when you went to your positions and how soon things started off now. >> well, we had landed. we got off on the huey

helicopters. three-man machine gun crew. russell adams was the gunner that day. i was the assistant gunner. and then we had an ammo bearer to carry extra ammunition. we rotated guns. you were carrying around 100 pounds with your backpacks and handgrenades and ammo. it was his day to have the gun. we landed, got off the helicopters, and we actually, where we were standing he we faced along from chupong mountain and had no idea there was a dry creek bed in the jungle. we were standing there, kind of looking around. it was a beautiful sunday afternoon. we figured we'd find nothing and do this again and