tv [untitled] June 21, 2012 7:30pm-8:00pm EDT
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now seems to be reaching the opposition in syria, this alone will not be decisive. it will not be sufficient to end the conflict faster. it may even just prolong it. nearly every syrian i speak with tells me the same thing. the longer this conflict drags on, the more radicalized it becomes and the more it turns into a sectarian civil war with an escalating spiral of violence that syrians alone cannot stop. finally, the syrian opposition needs to know that the united states stands with them. and that we're willing to take risks to support them when they need it most. our current inaction only denies us the opportunity to have influence with the forces in syria who will one day inherit the country. and we are ceding that influence to foreign states that may not always share our interest and
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our values, or worse to extremist groups that may not always share that are hostile to us. our lack of involvement in syria is not preventing the militarization of the conflict or lessening the risk of sectarian violence or countering the appeal of extremist groups. all of these events are just happening without us. and without our ability to influence them. in short, the main reason the united states needs to get more involved in syria is to help the opposition end the conflict sooner while they can still secure an outcome that is consistent with their goals and ours. we should do so not simple police for humanitarian reasons, but because it is in our national security interests. in the words of general james maddies, the commander of u.s. central command, the fall of assad would be the biggest blow to iran in 25 years. yes, there are risks to greater
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involvement in syria. the opposition is still struggling to get organized. al qaeda and other extremists are working to highjack the revolution. and there are reports of reprisal killings. these risks are real and serious, but risks of continuing to do nothing are worse. if we fail to act, it will threaten our allies. with or without assad the country will develop into a full-scale civil war with areas of ungoverned space that al qaeda and its allies will occupy. violence and radicalism will spill even more into lebanon and iraq, fuelling sectarian conflicts that are still burning in both countries, syria will turn into a battlefield between sunni and shia extremists, each backed by foreign powers which
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will ignite sectarian tensions from north africa, to the gulf, and risk a wider regional conflict. this is the course we're on in syria. we must act now to avoid it. the u.s. action i envision would not be unilateral. it would be multi-lateral. we would work closely with arab and european allies, especially turkey, and our partners in gulf. as in libya there would be no boots on the ground, and we would only intervene at the request of legitimate representatives of the syrian people. our goal would be to help the opposition change the military balance of power on the ground thereby creating conditions for an end to the violence, the departure of assad and his cronies, and a negotiated transition as soon as possible. to achieve this goal, we first need to help the syrian opposition to establish safe havens inside the country. this is essential for a number
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of reasons. it is constantly said that the syrian opposition is disorganized. that may be true at the national and international level, but it's much less true at the local level. to the contrary, the revolutionary councils and military councils and local coordinating committees have that emerged in cities across syria are increasingly sfist kated and effective. i have met some of their members and representatives, and they are among the most impressive figures i have encountered in the syrian opposition. nonetheless, if the syrian opposition is to succeed, it needs an effective and unifying structure of some kind. it is unlikely that such a structure could be formed in syria until the opposition has a safe haven. a place where they can emerge from hiding, gather together in safety, select national and political and military leaders
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and organize themselves better as an alternative governing structure, not just for the purpose of pushing assad from power today, but to prepare for the huge challenge of administering and securing the country once assad is gone. this is what the national transitional council was able to do in benghazi, and it is why despite the major challenges the transition in libya is largely succeeding. it is less difficult to imagine today as opposed to several months ago how safe havens could be established in syria. indeed, some analysts suggest the opposition may already be creating some areas of de facto control in the country. for example, in parts of the turkish border and in eastern syria it is quite possible that the opposition could soon declare parts of syria to be liberated as libyan rebels did in benghazi and then ask for
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external support in defending that territory. this is exactly what we should be helping the opposition to do. rather than insisting that we cannot act militarily without a u.n. security council resolution as the secretary of defense recently asserted, we should follow president clinton's example from kosovo. we should refuse to give russia and china veto power over our actions and instead work outside of the security council to shape a coalition of willing states with a legitimate mandate to intervene militarily in syria. many of our allies are willing to do much more. but only if the united states is with them. as one regional official told "the wall street journal" last weekend, the turks in particular are looking for quote, the ironclad backing of the u.s. and others. we should provide it for them. we should make u.s. air power
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available. along with that of our allies as part of an international effort to defend safe areas in syria and to prevent assad's forces from harassing them as they will inevitably try to do. once defended, these safe havens could become platforms for increased deliveries of food and medicine, communications equipment, doctors to treat the wounded and other non-lethal assistance. they could also serve as staging areas for armed opposition groups to receive battlefield intelligence, body armor and weapons from small arms and ammunition to anti-tank rockets and to train and organize themselves more effectively, perhaps about foreign assistance. the goal would be to expand the reach of these safe havens across more of the country. as a final part of this strategy we just think about the situation in syria in a broader strategic context. the events unfolding from lebanon, to syria, to iraq are
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all part of one connected story. we must be thinking about how we could capitalize on the fall of the assad regime in syria to weaken and marginalize hezbollah, to strernten lebanon's sovereignty and independence, to support the reconciliation of sectarian conflicts through politics, not violence. to increase the pressure on the malaki government in iraq, to roll back the authoritarian tendencies and share power more democratically and counter the hegemonic ambition in the region. in all of these efforts the united states and turkey share common interests and values and we need to be working more but most of all what is needed most is american leadership.
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if there ever were a case that should remind us that our interests are indivisible from our values, it is syria. a few days after the massacre in houla, the "washington post" interviewed a young bosnian man who survived the genocide in srebrenica in 1995. this is how he looked at the ongoing slaughter in syria. quote, it's bizarre how never again has come to mean again and again, he said. it's obvious that we live in a world where srebrenicas are still possible. what's happening in syria today is almost identical to what happened in bosnia two decades ago. he couldn't be more correct. syria today is indistinguishable from bosnia in the 1990s with one exception. in bosnia, president clinton finally summoned the courage to lead the world to intervene and stop the killing. it is worth recalling his words
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upon ordering military action in bosnia in 1995, and i quote. he said there are times and places, president clinton said, where our leadership can mean the difference between peace and war and where we can defend our fundamental values as a people and serve our most basic strategic interests. there are still times when america and america alone can and should make the difference for peace. those were the words of a democratic president who led america to do the right thing in stopping mass atrocities in bosnia. i remember working with my republican colleague bob dole to support president clinton in that endeavor. the question for another democratic president today and for all of us in positions of responsibility is whether we will again answer the desperate pleas for rescue that are made uniquely to us as the united
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states of america. and whether we will use our great power as we have done before at our best, not simply to advance our own interest, but to serve a just cause that is greater than our interest alone. thank you. [ applause ] >> thank you very much. senator mccape has graciously agreed to also entertain some questions. please wait for the microphone, introduce yourself and please, make your question brief. >> hello, john mccain. i am the spokesperson for the green youth party in the south of sweden.
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kofi annan is a very wise person, and he has spoken a lot about and worked really hard towards finding a diplomatic solution to this situation in syria. what he means is that you should always primarily look for a non-violent solution to conflicts. i was wondering why the united states finds working harder for and implementing more diplomatic pressure against the assad regime. thank you. >> if you have any ideas as to how we can put more pressure on diplomatically or support kofi annan, would i like to hear about it. certainly this administration has, but the facts are that it is now being acknowledged even by kofi annan that his plan has failed. u.n. observers have just gone back to areas where they would not be subject to attack.
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it is widely acknowledged that the plan as some of us predicted would fail and has failed. so if you have any ideas how we can be more active diplomatically, i would be more than encouraged to hear from them. the fact is that this is a brutal dictator who is willing to massacre his own people and his people have risen up to try to overthrow mr. assad, and i believe that the only way that mr. assad will leave is if mr. assad believes that he can't stay. thank you. >> i'm an under grad eight student at the london school of economics. i was just interested because you mentioned iran and obviously with the bravado between iran and israel that that's always a wore egdevelopment.
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how do you feel a syrian regime change would link to that. you mentioned it would be the greatest threat to iran in 20 years or so. surely it can worryingly provoke iran into, you know, some form of aggression or action. >> well, i think the first thing that happens is that the connection between iran and hezbollah and their for instance in lebanon is dramatically reduced. i think that the iranians have syria as really their only arab client state remaining. i don't think there's any doubt that with the loss of syria they lose their connections to hezbollah. they lose their influence over lebanon. perhaps mr. maliki might think a little more often about how close the relations are that he should have with iran, and with that loss i think it may put additional pressures on iran to
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cease their continued development of nuclear weapons which, as you know, is a forthcoming crisis unless the iranians abandon their efforts to build nuclear weapons which so far there has been no indication that they have. this is a key and central part of the entire mideast. and what happens here will have dramatic effect on the entire mideast as well. thank you. yes. >> senator mccain, i'm the daughter of one of the speakers, i'm syrian. i am a political refugee. came here with my family in 2006. my question for you is we keep hearing from policymakers and the current administration that the united states can in the afford intervening in syria. as syrians how can we change that?
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i mean, the people are dying. you see economically that the united states is the main -- that's the main excuse they gave and they give every day, actually. and we keep lobbying and we can't see any change, and we can't convince them. we feel very hopeless. i totally agree with what you said. what can you give us? what can we go to convince them that the military intervention that the people are asking on the ground is what we really need to end this dictatorship and stop the killing. thank you very much. >> i have to tell you that political realities here in the united states, americans are very war weary because of our long and protracted engagement in iraq and in afghanistan. a couple thousand young americans have given their lives. americans see our economy in a
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very bad situation and that has tended, of course, to lead to a more inward view and a lack of desire for involvement. i believe that the same arguments that you hear being made about syria today are the same ones that were made about libya. that we would get into a protracted conflict, that it would be overtaken by al qaeda. we don't know who they are. my friends on both right and left see the same arguments. well, there's a more basic principle here. one is that we are not -- no one that i know of is advocating american boots on the ground nor american unilateral action. i do know for a fact that our allies in the region are crying out for american leadership, and no one that i know of wants american boots on the ground nor wants unilateral united states action.
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and, frankly, the most immortal words in my view ever written are those that all of us are endowned by our creator with certain inalien able rights, that among them the right to life and pursuit of happiness. the united states of america has shed its blood and spread its treasure in all four corners of the world in defense of other people's freedom. many times it was in our interest as well. we need again to answer the call. and for a little encouragement, i think the administration is moving a little bit in the right direction and certainly our allies in the region are picking up the slack. yes, sir. >> thank you, senator. my question to you, sir, is about the repercussion of arming the opposition and creating a
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safe haven for them. as we report today, they are actually recruiting jihadists, islamic jihadists in jordan, kuwait and in other places. and could we have an afghan-like situation afterwards? thank you. >> first of all, the afghan situation we went to afghanistan because that's where the attacks of 9/11 began. and we should never forget that. but the second thing is i've seen the movie before. yes, jihadists are going to come into libya. they're going to have an election, my friends, of 80% of the libyan people have registered to vote. they're going to have an election on july 7th. i hope to be there to observe it. the one thing i can assure you of, the longer this conflict is protracted, the more likely it is that that happens, that foreign fighters come in and jihadists and al qaeda and others because the frustration and anger that -- and casualties
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our staff is on its way. it is a work release program. >> thank you, senator mccain. now while we have our differences with the russians. is there anyway to convince them that it is in our interest to abandon support? >> thank you for that question. i have been puzzled too. the russians have been intelligent. he is a smart guy. but they are being, they are doing enormous damage to their image in the world. they are harming themselves dramatically. i don't pretrend to get into president putins mind. but there is a nostalgia.
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this is our port on the mediterranean. this is in many way to them. a test as to whether this disease called the arab spring will spend to other parts of the world including places like chechnya which was put down with exceptional brutality. i can't faphom the reasons for their behavior. i hope the president is meeting with president putin today will bring about change in their behavior. but it is part of a pattern of putin's behavior since the elections. jailing of people and intimidation of the media et cetera, et cetera. that does not mean that i believe that the cold war is going to be re-ignited, it is
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not. i think we are going to have to take a more realistic view with russia and our ability to do built with them. yes, sir? thank you, mr. senator. i'm from norway with the progress party. you said that a solution might happen outside of the un system. is that a road that leads to less human involvement in the world and is that a road that the obama administration is fearing and could that be leading to less involvement? >> russia and china now have veto power over action that the united states might take. that is not acceptable to the american people. our actions cannot be governed
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by whether it will or will not veto the solution. we went without a un security council resolution. and that was a coalition of the willing as we say. so i respect and admire the united nations security council and the thing that is they do. but the fact is united states national security should not be governed by whether russia should veto the security coup sill. you have been over looked four times please go ahead. >> my name is tyler o'neal and my question is about turkey. with the act party successful in
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2011. they seemed to have a shift toward islamism. do you think their interested being coincidental with the united states would change in that situation? >> i believe that turkey is one of our strongest allies in the world much less the region. but i voiced concerns at a breakfast at a u.s. turkey society that i continue to be worried about the jailing of journalists. turkey now has more journalists in prison than any country in the world. i have been worried about intimidation of opposition parties and consolidation of w power in the hands of the prime mip ster and a man that i admire
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and respect a great deal. i worry about tendencies in turkey that transcend religious reason ares and that is a matter of great concern and we should concern and continue to voice those. this is something that is not appropriate for a functions democracy either and there are other reasons. >> thank you. >> could i do a coming more? >> yes. thank you, sir. >> i'm from sweden. i agree with everything you told about syria. but what do you think about the fact that so many people died and peace keepers were there. i think it was a horrible event that most of us thought could never take place on europe soil.
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saudis, published reports that the saudis are assisting in some ways. the arab league lebanon or io obviously is under the influence of -- who have veto power that makes it more difficult that it d did. i know there are members who are more actively involved. but whether the arab league itself because of the vetos of a couple of three countries. they -- it may be difficult to get a solid position out of the arab league as opposed to the
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situation. since he had tried to kill a few of the leaders of those countries. i think we have to stop. we have a panel of leaders here. i would like to say there are a lot of young people in this audience. and you come from all over the world and you are here i think to learn and to listen. and i hope you will go back and view with a thought that we live still in a dangerous world and one that is fraught with challenges but it is a next generation of leaders throughout the world that can change from a bleak picture in some cases to one that is more optimistic. i believe that your involvement in a
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