there were many nurses there. they were used to the fact there were women in this world and they can have a part in the war, too. so -- still something i want to tell you and i can't. oh, you were asking me about harvard. well, one of the hospitals, biggest one at that time in france was the harvard hospital. and i think it was inez robbin. he were about to get in paris and we started on this detailed trip into paris and stopped at this hospital. by that time, see, my hair was not naturally the color it was supposed -- that i was wearing it, you esee. it had grown out and i thought they needed to do something about it. i said, i'm not a golden haired person anymore, am i? they said, no, you've got a

streak around there. it's a little darker. so i went into this hospital and i said, any chance of getting a pail of water? i had a bottle of the stuff. something anybody know anything about putting stuff on heads? yes, they did. so, they gave me a dose of putting the mreebleach on my he and all that sort of thing and washed it. and when i came up, somebody said, oh, my god, it's not the right color. so here i was starting out with two layers of darker hair than my real hair, i think. i think she put something on there. i don't know. that's -- that part of that story. so, i got into london in, i think -- not into london. into paris. one of the first things i did was to find a beauty parlor and get myself all in one tone up there. it was just fun. well, i was with one small hospital that particular time

and they were going into paris, being transferred from out in the -- where the action was into paris, and i wanted to know if i could get a ride with them. and i did. i got a ride on the train into paris with this particular unit. so, i rode in the cab of the engine, climbed up in the cab of the engine to see what it was like up there. there wasn't much i didn't look into. >> this would have been when paris was liberated in august of '44 that you were -- >> no, no, it was earlier. oh, no, it was -- we was -- we was still fighting in paris. fighting for life. as it were. and then every now and then i'd get with the wac unit. i don't -- rejoined the wac unit

and we went into paris in a car. automobile, one of the wac had enough rank to get a car and got in. we got stationed -- got quarters in one hotel and went up and pushed the window up and thought we would wave the american flag out and pretty soon somebody began firing at us so we closed the window down and stopped it. decided it was a little too early. >> you said in an interview that you were -- when you were assigned to do stories that you were assigned to do stories with a women's angle on it. >> yes, uh-huh. >> what did that mean when they were -- >> well, they don't know what -- the men in those early days didn't really know what to do with a woman reporter. now, could she come in and go to cover a murder trial? isn't that a rather messy for her to cover? and shouldn't she be protected from that type of thing? well, that was the early days.

of course, i was right out there where i wanted to find out what was going on. now, what was the question you asked, then? >> the women's angle of stories. in europe, was that -- would you -- >> well, i always had to worry with the women's angle on something, but that was not the real story. i was after the real story. >> tell me -- explain to me the difference. what would a woman's angle story be and the real story? >> a woman's angle would be covering nurses, covering a hospitalization, covering whatever civilian things would carry over into the military, covering the food. but not covering fighting, battles. not going into -- when they were planning what kind of move they would make. when the military was planning what kind of a move they would make, like i can remember that

one of eisenhower's groups, the men came in and they were talking about what moves they would make in a particular maneuver they were making. i was in the -- right in the back, standing right there. i never made -- never intruded in anything. i never wanted to get thrown out, if i could help. it. so that's -- i didn't see much of a woman's angle. i thought it was just -- it was a war, period. and i don't know that i -- i've been around when they were firing cannons and that sort of thing, but i didn't push my way in. >> and you preferred what kind of story? >> more or less human interest stories.

what the whole thing was all about. i wasn't an authority on this thing, you know. what i mentioned, various -- i would go into a hospital in which they had casualties recovering and i would talk to them. and get their stories. and write them and get -- push some of them back and file them. of course, a lot of those things didn't get printed. they didn't leave the country because they couldn't. gave too much away. that was their job, not mine. >> the editors that you passed -- >> right. sure. i knew pretty well that i could write the story or not. but if so and so person was wounded in such a battle that happened at such a place, perhaps, that wasn't

knowledgeable to the enemy. so i -- you don't do it. >> how would you physically get these stories? did you type them? did you write them longhand and send them to an editor? how did they get to where they were supposed to get? >> i used a phone a lot. those are pretty hard, those phones over there to handle. plus, they have french operators and i spoke to french. but i managed to get through. and then i used to write stories and if there were men correspondents that were going back or something like that, i'd give them something to turn into the ap. usually i could find ap, enough of us were over there that i could make connections with an ap chap and give him some copy to take back. or i would give it to some friend of mine. when i came back, i did some initial writing. but i was awfully tired. and then they said i would be

assigned to the london bureau. that was all right with me. but i didn't go back. >> why didn't you go back? >> got my old job back in washington. i liked it better. and i had left my apartment in washington, and so i just -- several wacs had it. ann corak, do you know her? >> huh-uh. >> she was public relations for the wacs. very close friend of mine. we worked very good together. and so when she came back a little ahead of me, she got my -- she took my apartment. and a couple of the other wacs were still -- the war was still on. >> you came back in summer of '45? >> something of that sort. i'd have to look up the dates. >> and when did you start back to work back at the washington ap bureau? >> about two months or

something. i went down to texas and stayed there. that's my home state, as it were, and stayed there about a few weeks and then came back, rested a little bit more and then i wanted to go back to work. >> now, you were involved at that point, very involved with the women's national press club. >> oh, yes. i think i joined the national press club before i'd ever been overseas. and then along early in that deal i got elected president. >> tell me about your year as president. what do you remember most about it? wel >> well, i had some very good speakers. of course, i had mrs. r. and then when they were working out plans for the peace and all that sort of thing -- i had everybody that had a title, i think, in

one of these departments, the head guy, i tried to get in to talk to the press club. i had some very good programs, because i got good people. >> this was the time -- during the time in which women weren't allowed at the national press club. >> oh, lord no. you could go in with somebody -- you know, there's one little room off to the side there. as you come in the main door, there's a room off there. i think it's a cloakroom now. and that was a dining room. if you had some man member or some man that had connections with the press club, they could invite to you go in there to lunch or dinner. and then they got so that they would let two or three women come in. if one of them was married to a man that was a member of the press club. but you couldn't go beyond a certain place over there. you could hardly get a check cashed. that was funny.

>> what happened when you had secretary of state marshall come to the national press -- to the women's national press club? >> oh, that was the time that i had asked marshall if he would come and speak. he did. he said he would. we got mixed up getting upstairs. but that didn't have any real serious thing to it. but marshall made the first statement, first public statement to the women's national press club. well, now, a woman in the national press club could invite a man to come if she wanted as her guest, just as they would let the men invite us to certain limited number of performances -- types of performances they had. and the men just couldn't get in and here was marshall making his speech, you see, his first -- and they were all out in the hallway. oh, it was adorable. >> turnabout is fair play?

>> absolutely. marshall, great person. >> were there any efforts when you were with the women's national press club to integrate the two clubs and merge them during that time? >> no. not that i ever knew anything about. i thought we were doing very well on our own. we were getting places sometimes the men couldn't get. >> for example? what kind of stories do you think you were able to do that they couldn't? >> well, some of them -- mrs. roosevelt, of course. the men didn't want women in their -- the president's -- oh, what do you call it, conferences. and once in a while they would get in, but you always were having to stand at the back and that sort of thing. so mrs. r. didn't like the way the women were pushed around, so she had press conferences and she wouldn't let the men in. funny days, those. >> well, you had started

covering mrs. roosevelt when you worked for -- in chicago? >> oh, i was in chicago when i covered her. yes, she and i -- her -- one of her -- her secretary, we went down in a mine and got stuck there. had to get us up by inches almost. >> was that -- that is when she went to, what, the orient -- >> you you, the orient. have you got that? >> i knew you were on that trip. >> yeah. >> but i didn't know you had gotten stuck. >> no, we got -- it was slow getting up. it wasn't really a stick. we weren't barricaded down there or left down there. but it was very slow coming up. i think they were afraid to send us off. let's just skip that. and that was the time that i backed up against something and -- it was summer. i had a light wool dress, a knit wool dress or something like that on. and i had -- was covering

mrs. r.'s -- several functions in washington -- in chicago at that particular time. that's when i was stationed out there. and i had to keep going from one thing to another. and at the night show -- on the night performance of this group of -- like these -- some big women's club, they -- everybody was all duped up. of course, i showed up and here i had all this stuff that i had gotten on me from this -- backing up against this thing in the elevator, in the mine. walked out, trying to find a place to hear mrs. r. talk and they just wouldn't let me on. and mrs. roosevelt saw it and she laughed and laughed and laughed. she said, ruth, come on over here and sit down here. and then i realized what was the business. so i said, no, but i was awful dang mad.

i imagine i covered their meeting without any spite, but i would have like to have wrung their necks. >> what other stories do you remember covering of mrs. roosevelt that stick out in your mind? >> that what? >> that stick out in your mind. >> well, when mrs. -- first time i saw mrs. roosevelt is the time she came out after the election and she had a lot of mail in her hands and she asked if anybody from the ap was there. and i acknowledged that i was. and i moved up front and she says, well, here i brought these letters. i said, you're carrying our letters for us? she handed me a bag of mail. so, i -- they were personal things, you see. they weren't really letters that went through the mail. so, i took them into the office and says, mrs. r. brought these things to us. some people had left her and she wanted people in the ap to see them or something. i don't know what was in the

things. >> she had a very good relationship with the women reporters, didn't she? >> oh, yes. she was very -- she liked them. she didn't like them being pushed around like they were. if you went to something to cover, some -- and you had maybe a little difficulty getting a chair or something like that, sheltd be sitting up on the platform and move down and point to a chair or something of that -- she was very helpful. one of the most helpful people you could possibly imagine. and she was helping the women. and any time that she could say a good word for a woman, she did. so, the men, of course, didn't like that either because good stories would break through mrs. r.'s press conference. i imagine she and the president plotted some of that stuff. anyway, they got to the place where they would try to sneak in to us. one time she got up and she just ordered them out of the hallway.

okay, i see you over there, get going. i was very fond of mrs. r. first time i came back from oversea, i went up to hyde park there for a little bit. she was -- she liked reporters and understood them. she liked men reporters, too. but they weren't going to keep the women from getting a break, too. this is early, you know. >> back in '33 when she first -- >> yes, right. and this is when civilization was a little different. >> when you came back from the war and rejoined the ap in washington, was that still -- were you the only woman that was there? >> in the ap? >> uh-huh. >> no, they had a couple in the feature section. and then there was a gal taking

a -- my job while i was gone. she then went back home to get married. so i just went and got my same old desk and shoved the stuff in. >> and you had a general news beat? >> huh? >> the you had the same beat you'd had before, general, covering the white house? >> no. i was more or less -- well, i had some of that. if there were special stories -- yes, i covered the white house and that first, and then i was assigned to the department of defense. they thought i knew a cannon from a shotgun. and i got along over there all right, because i knew so many of those people. >> and how much longer were you then at the ap? you worked there until the mid-50s? >> did what in. >> you worked at the ap until -- >> about '55. early '50s in there.

i don't know. >> early '56. >> somewhere in there. >> lost the -- >> yeah, i got fired. >> we're going to talk about that. >> no, that's a joke. >> you stayed single all this time. >> yes. >> was that a choice you'd made or how did that come about? >> well, once in a while i did get an offer to change it. >> and? >> i didn't do it, of course. >> of course, the coverage also -- >> huh? >> press gallery. you were in the -- you covered the press gallery on the defense committees. >> oh, yes, i did the -- right after the war, i then see they had -- they learned a little during the war that women could do some of these jokbs so i was assigned to the press gallery and house armed services committee in the house. naturally, i would go into the

press gallery to see what was happening to the bills i was concerned with in the committee meetings. >> i am interested, though, i've asked other women that i've interviewed, and in the choice that you did make, did you think about marriage and did you think about having children and what that what that meant for your career? >> oh, i did, of course, going along the ways. i've had a few love affairs, but that was not -- everybody has those. in high school you fall in love with somebody. what? i was anxious to be a success in the writing business and that sort of thing. and i had a lot of fun in those days. did you think getting married would change that? sure. >> the ap didn't want a married

woman. best firm and that was one of the reasons. did you know -- that was one of the reasons for starting over there. she got married. terrible crime. hope you notice that as a joke. >> beth stewart followed her. >> then beth stewart married. i followed beth stewart in, you see. yeah. then beth stewart moved to some other place, and i was single. >> what about some of your other women journalist friends, do you think they had difficulty making that decision? >> no, i don't think so. i think we were all more or less the same opinion, and just worked out that way for me. any time that i got -- i don't know, i was rather ambitious to get something done. and i don't know. i just went from one place to

another. >> so what made you finally decide to get married? >> well, you had to be -- if you were not of a certain age in the ap, they put you on a more or less kind of a retirement basis, which was not much good. and i had met brad about that time. >> that's true. they had an after 55 retirement rule at the ap. >> they did what? >> cig sigrid arm was forced to retire at 55. >> yeah. and who else was up there? i think beth sherman was, wasn't she? >> not sure if she left because she was married or hit by retirement. >> hit by what? >> had to be retired. >> i don't know either. i've forgotten. >> were there any reporters you worked with who were married and had families?

>> that's different. the ap finally got some sense. yeah, so, others in there -- but they were always -- there were so many of those restrictions. it was very difficult for a woman in the teaching profession to ever become a principal. whoever heard of that? ages have changed a little bit and it's very amusing to see how much it's changed in the recent last few years. >> when you look at journalism today, think about your career as a journalist, what do you see that's different in the field in what you read today in the papers? >> you mean the material, the content of the story?

well, they're different type stories. if a person is covering a committee hearing, there would be very little, if any at all, difference in the way it would be written by a man or by a woman. a woman can take a viewpoint of that kind, it is a little more difficult for men to just see the woman's hairdo, that sort of thing, and her clothes. and i don't remember meeting and covering the white house social events. i don't remember seeing too many men there, if any at all. >> do you see any other changes in the journalism field that you noticed since you retired from journalism?

>> well, i think that they're accepted and men also accepted women. you see, men didn't want women in, sometimes they would get some of the prized stories. and now that i think men are accepting women and women are accepting men. okay. >> when you look back on your life as a journalist, what are you most proud of? >> what do i what? >> what are you most proud of in the work you did? >> i think some of the stories i did overseas. they seem to stay longer with me. and i was always proud when i

got -- well, because it was after i came back from overseas, i was assigned to the military over at the pentagon. i liked some of those stories. but a story to me was a story. >> how do you mean? >> it was a good story, told something, and it met some need, maybe there was some -- i think of a medical campaign going on. we would go to medical services, go to medical headquarters, get what they were doing and that would be -- that had no sex.

lots of stories don't have sex and are worth covering. that's a joke. >> well, thanks. i think we'll wrap up for the day. >> all right. i hope it has been worthwhile for you. >> it has for me. >> pippa is dead. i think that that's pretty clear that the effort that was undertaken there ran into a lot of controversy, a lot of miscommunications and so i i those bills are not coming back again this year or any year for matter. >> virginia republican bob goodlatte on prospects of anti-piracy legislation in the next congress and other telecommunications issues monday night at 8:00 eastern on

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