was a petty officer getting red for a flogging. it's a phrase we still use today. don't let the cat out of the bag. you don't want to see the cat coming out of the bag for a flogging. >> that's at 7:00 p.m. eastern and pacific. also this weekend, more from the contenders. our serious of key political figures who ran and lost. former new york governor al smith. this july 4th on c-span tv it's 24 hours of american history tv usually seen on weekends providing eyewitness account, historic tours and lectures and discussions with historians and teachers. see our website to see the weekend schedule and more about the programs. next, author and political commentator michael barone, examines the writings of alexis

detocqueville, focusing on liberty, equality and community. tocqueville is best known for his two-volume work "democracy in america" based on his travels in the 1830s. mr. barone is a guest lecturer in charleston, south carolina, and of course, called the conservative intellectual tradition in america taught by professor mallory factor. >> thank you very much. it's an honor to be here and a special honor to be asked to speak to speak on alexis de tocqueville. in reading tocqueville in preparation for this lecture. i began to think that he was something like mozart, that i was in the presence that was so bar above the level of almost anyone else in history, that there was almost no comparison

with anybody else. you can listen to the music of mozart and it sounds pleasant and melodic and so forth, but if you really think about it, if you really analyzed it, you realize he's doing something, that it's so far above the level of ordinary and oppressive achievement that you're in the presence of something and you see the same thing in tocqueville. it's easy to read tocqueville fairly fast. you're in front of the television set and there is a conversation in the next room. you're starting to think about what you have to do, and what you have to pick up at the store and you lose track of the fact that tocqueville really requires close attention and when you pay him that close attention you realize that you're in the presence of something extraordinary is both of these men did their great work as young men and it's a little

daunting, perhaps, even to a college audience that mozart died at age 35, so all that we have from him is written from the time he started composing music at age 6 until his death at age 35. tocqueville composed two volumes in america by the time he was 35. he did other great work later, but if he had died at age 35, and the publication of the second volume of democracy in america that that same age that mozart died i think we still know he was a great man and that he was way above the ordinary level of human achievement that he has much to teach us today. so let me begin by recalling that on the 11th day of may 1831, two young french aristocrats alexis de tocqueville and his friend beaumont arrived in new port, rhode island, after arriving

from france. they were lawyers from the commission of french government to study american prisons, which they did, but they did much more. for during the course of his 288 days of travels in the young republic, tocqueville, who was only 25 years old when he landed, not much older than today's undergraduates made the observations and accumulated the material which he fashioned with two volumes of democracy in america which the political scientist de tocqueville translated harvey mansfield, the best book ever writ own democracy and the best book ever written on america. he was with andrew jackson and sat next to president john quincy adams at dinner in boston and he was escorted in washington, with the charleston-born botanist and future secretary of war and by everett, the boston-born lawyer and future secretary of state. he met 95-year-old charles carroll, the last surviving

signer of the declaration of independence and the only catholic to sign that document and sam houston, the future president of the first president of the republic of texas. he attended town meetings in new england and observed slave markets in the south. he visited indian villages in the michigan territory waged on steam boats and shortly after he disembarked and he was a tacitous form of transportation and he traveled by stage coach. he went to columbia, south carolina, and he unfortunately, did not make it to charleston. tocqueville was an aristocrat who suffered during the revolution. you can trace him back to the invasion of william, and some of his ancestors were part of that arm pep his great-grandfather, now a distinguished philosopher and lawyer who was defense council in king louis xvi, after

the three days before he was scheduled to be guillotined as well and when he left the prison at age 22 his hair turned completely white. this was a family that was traumatized by this great event in history, the french revolution. as a child, tocqueville was born in 1805, met the restored king louis xviii after the downfall of napoleon and while his family thrived under the new king fi philip philippe, the inspector of bloodshed and the threat of another revolution was always in their thoughts and he came from a background which considered the french revolution a great disaster. in the first lecture in this course, alfred recounted how they had roots in four cities, jerusalem, athens, rome and london. conspicuously absent from this list is paris. still ruled by a monarch in the

centralized bureaucracy with limited powers from a legislature whose powers were from a small electorate. tocqueville ruled before he arrived that america was different. it was something he wanted to see, that it was a democracy, the word he used in his title and it was a democracy, that was something that the people in whose circles he lived and his family in which he'd grown up regarded with dread. the young republican involved and important ways in the days of the founders and revolutionary america was still a somewhat deferential society and not an aristocratic society and most involved those with a certain amount of property to vote and that's yet framers of the constitution decided that the representatives were chosen by the same electorate that chose the numerous house in the state legislature that would be as wide a franchise and not a

complete franchise of all adult, male, citizens. he was considered dangerous in the british tradition to allow those without property and without a stake in society to be in a position to determine the course of government and this is indeed a tradition that comes to us as well from athens and rome where they also felt that the property, people with the stake in society should have a monopoly on political power and on the vote, but in the first decades of the republic is historian gordon wood has written, american society became less differential and more democratic in character. tocqueville was treated as just another guest at dinner and he was surprised he wasn't treated like a monarch. people didn't bow down before him and simply said hello. by the 1830s, almost all of the states, south carolina was an

exception had extended the vote to all, white adult males. some resisted as john randolph at virginia's constitutional convention decrying, quote, the all-prevailing principle that numbers and numbers alone are to regulate all things in political society and the prospect that government was to divorce property from power and they believed they should be connected and not divorced, but by the time tocqueville arrived this was a minority rule and to r universal suffrage, limited to adult white males, we obviously do not limit it to whites and males anymore and we still limit it to adults and the universal suffrage did not see a nation in which the large majority of people were farmers who owned land and were property holders and tocqueville's time were still the vibrant thread of the

revolution, democrat see seemed very dangerous indeed and tocqueville, disagreed, seeing dangers in democracy ask also seeing opportunities and reasons for hope and he also saw democracy as irresistible as the way of the future as something that was sure to come in some form, good or bad to europe that it would be in conflict with the aristocratic heritage as it was common to america which did not have much in the waive an aristocratic heritage to conflict with it. >> one danger that tocqueville perceived in democracy was what he called individualism, the tendency of citizens to isolate themselves and withdraw from society when they are not bound together by the relations of aristocrats and inferiors. the model he had in mind was where his family had resided and had centuries where they had obligations to people that lived

on their land, that people in the vicinity and institutions there and where the people, in turn, had obligations to people like the tocquevilles. they were connected, he thought, they were not equal, but those connections, at least existed and he was afraid that in a democratic society and in a society where all were considered equal, that those relationships would not appear and that they would be replaced by the isolation of the individual and not having the connections, the social connections with others. democracy, he wrote, threatens to confine the citizens so wholly in the solitude of his own heart, but the america he observed avoided this danger, he came to believe, because of two important factors. the american, he wrote, had combatted the individualism, with freedom and they had defeated it. he saw this as a very hopeful

development and you can read much of tocqueville as an instruction about the system that they were very suspicious of was working pretty well that the dangers they thought it contained had been avoided and one of those dangers that had been avoided was individualism. one of the things that helped them avoid that danger was the importance of government and of local governments. at the time of his visit, americans seldom came into contact with the federal government with the single exception of the post office, and even that was not always federally ruled in the decades after tocqueville came to the united states, post masters in south carolina would not transmit abolitionist letters of literature. they simply burned it or destroyed it and would not deliver it to the recipients, but the post office was the main source of federal power, but

americans were -- of necessity in constant contact of local governments with the towns of new england and the townships that were spread across the old northwest territory and the counties of the south and being affected by the decisions took advantage of the opportunity to participate in it. democracy meant that those decisions by local governments were not made simply by those above them, but were made by them and people that they chose. thus, by charging citizens with the administration of small a fashgs much more than by leaving the government of great ones to them, writes tocqueville, one interests them in the public good and makes them see the need they constantly have for one another in order to produce it. local freedoms bring men closer to one another. local freedoms and democracies bring people into contact that established ties and bonds between them on the basis of equality that were equivalent to or better than the ties that

were created between them in the unequal system of aristocracy. and what we see here is an appreciation of the conservative principle which catholic philosophers refer to as subsidiary. instead of a central government, superintendent of local affairs, as was the case in france and beginning and that began as tocqueville wrote in his later volume on the a see an regime accident french revolution with the louis xivth getting rid of local autonomy as louis xiv said -- it's me. imthe government. that france was centralized before the revolution and becomes further centralized by the revolution which abolishes the age of profits and the superintendents are appointed by

the central government in paris usually from a list of people as time went on who are educated in the central universities in paris and in fact, the government in france resembles that model in very many ways. that kind of centralization did not, in tocqueville's view was something for which he had a considerable dread, and he notes that instead of america, instead of having that kind of central government, democracy in america tended to let local governments, chosen by people who would remain close to their representatives and be affected by their decisions have control of all matters that could be handled at that level. the constitution limited the powers of the federal government and tocqueville studies intensely the figures of the constitution and reserves other matters to the state governments and the people and the state governments delegated the local matters which could be addressed locally. now, not every issue could be so

delegated. one of the major, vents during this visit was the nullification crisis in which the south carolina legislature encouraged by vice president john c. calhoun, south carolinian, declared it had the right to nullify a bill passed by congress. the president acted furiously and he moved troops in place to enforce the law outside south carolina while at the same time moving congress to a compromised position which would address some of south carolina's grievances. tocqueville described some of the process in democracy in america. tocqueville also coincided with another national policy that had a significant, regional effect and that was andrew jackson's indian removal policy, something he considered important. the five civilized tribes over what has become the trail of tears from the southeastern states to what is now oklahoma

and tocqueville on his western travels witnessed some of the indians moving west in this movement and he wrote a chapter at the end of the first volume of "democracy in america" on the position of indians and blacks in america and what the problems that posed for the country. these issues foreshadow crises that came later and tocqueville addressed it in the last chapter of "democracy in america" on the fact that blacks and indians were not considered citizens in this republic. it is one of his many uncanny predictions. he looks ahead, this young man writing in his 20s and 30s, looks ahead and sees much of the future history that has happened. he sees the possibility of the rupture of civil war and the tragic fate of many native americans, even as he saluted the way democracy had citizens through local government and

perhaps he may even be seen as having pointed to the successes of the civil rights movement when he writes to combat the evils that equality can produce there is only one efficacious remedy. it is political freedom. the habits of the heart fostered in local government also did something else and here we encountered the second reason americans avoided the isolationism of the individual of what tocqueville calls individualism, and incidentally, i gather that it was his use of it and it is the first time that enters the french and english languages and he coins words as well as ideas that occurred to no one before. to the contrary, americans are busy starting thousands of voluntary associations of creating civil society and mediates institutions between governments and they could change society without involving

government at all. and tocqueville paints this one passage, he paints this picture of a busy people, constantly involved in political activity and voluntary associations. scarcely have you sdendzed on the soil of america when you find yourself in a turmoil, a confused clamor is raised on all sides and a thousand voices come to your ears at the same time, each of it expressing social needs and i think some of the french aristocratic readers are here kind of saying, it doesn't sound good here. this is a problem and all of these people agitating. around you everything moves and a lot of people gather, if the church ought to be built. farther on, the deputies of the district are going to town to decide about local improvements. in another place, the farmers abandon to discuss the road or school.

citizens assemble declaring they disapprove and the men in place are the fathers of their country. here are others, still, who regarding drunkenness as the principle source of the evils of the state come solemnly to pledge themselves to give an example of temperance. there's a note of astonishment where it contemplates the prohibition of alcohol, and tocqueville -- tocqueville arrived in america at a time when voluntary associations were champions and causes that ultimately transformed the nation. and often changing people's habits of the heart. they were particularly common these associations in new england in upstate new york where tocqueville spent a large part of his visit and nearly half of his visit to the

northern tier of states. as bronson noted, it tends to be, restless in body and mind, always scheming, always in motion and never satisfied with what he has and always seeking to make the world like himself or as uneasy as himself. the graft historian and author of the british folkways made his way to the different american colonies made note that the englanders who were isolated and then spread across the northern part of the country, they were moralistic and intol errant. they believed in following their moral principles and in making other people do it, too. persuading them, if possible, but using powers of government. tocqueville clearly admired the reformist yankee impulses and an example of the democratic americans working together with

voluntary associations to improve their society and one of these efforts, as he notes was the movement which ultimately persuaded the nation to embark on a dozen years of the noble experiment of permitting alcohol and the movement did vastly confirm alcohol consumption by something of two-thirds of average alcohol consumption in this country and one historian speaking of the period before which tocqueville arrived entitled the book the alcoholic republic and the consumption of whiskey was very high and there was not a total lack of correlation with the average consumption of whisky and the number of duels that people were partes pa ee ee ees pating in. this was a lusty society and they would have had a big effect on the behavior of americans. another movement that was soon to begin was the women's rights

movement. tocqueville, the frenchman, whose wife, by the way, was english, but was -- tocqueville was astonished to note that, quote, women themselves often go to political assemblies and by listening to political discourses take arrest from household tedium. we are at a period in history, for example, hillary clinton is doing anything else from taking a rest from household tedium and two women served as secretary of state, but tocqueville sees this movement, i'm not sure that he entirely approves, but he sees it and this is not something that in aristocratic france, women can have a behind the scenes influence in the budde

woir, but america was something different. abolitionism, the move to abolish slavery and the increasing defense of slavery by white southerners. just a few years before tocqueville's journey in the state constitution in virginia, i referenced john randolph and roanoke's remarks at that convention had narrowly rejected a provision to abolish slavery as all of the states geographically to the north had done and it's how history would have unfolded with that decision had gone the other way. in the north, most americans considered abolitionists fanatics who disrupted the union in the 1830s. they were considered extremists, but the abolitionists' cause had great, moral power in the nation that the independence had begun that we hold it to be self-evident, that they were born with certain rights and among them were the right of

life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. the moral equality and christianity professed by almost all americans. christianity is a religion unlike the pagan religions that it replaced which says that each individual has an immoral soul and is made in the image of god. this would have been an absolutely astonishing proposition to aristotle and the roman philosopher, but it was part of the christian heritage of america and it was always with some intention of slavery and one of the interesting things about britain and america is that the impulse to end first the slave trade and then slavery itself was the impulse that was most strongly advocated by even the christians of the day and quakers. it came out of religious belief. those who see religious conservatives or religious

people of any ideological disposition and they reflect on the fact that the movement to abolish slavery was indeed much of the civil rights movement began as a movement spurred by people of strong, christian impulses that were at peace with the tenets that are at the heart of christianity. and religion clearly impressed tocqueville and he was from a country, france, in which everybody was technically catholic and had gone through a revolution that w revoluti revolution. it had become an ally of the royal family, and it was in the pre-revolutionary period in which the church, the catholic church nationally or internationally in the form of the papacy was explicitly hostile to democracy and said that it was not a good system,

and religion in tocqueville, from the perspective of the people among which he'd grown up, religion was the enemy of the democracy. it was the religious aspect of the country that first struck my eye. in contrast to the countries with established churches and with monopolies of religious belief established by law and enforced by the state, tocqueville notes the spirit -- in those situations, the spirit of religion and the spirit of freedom must always move in contrary directions, but american his a different heritage, britain's north american colony started off with different religious traditions and some of them were havens of people who were subject to religious persecution including the egonauts who settled in south carolina after king louis

xiv that it would not be tolerated in his country. so the founders who understood this religious heritage provided him the constitution and there would be no religious test for office in the federal government and the bill of rights they provided that congress shall make no law regarding an establishment of religion and this didn't mean an entire separation of church and state, although tocqueville uses that phrase during his visit tomas mas still had an established church that was supported by the tax revenues of the commonwealth of massachusetts that was abolished a couple of years later, but the but tocqueville noted the paradox that he thought was something that would astonish the french aristocratic readers and it came to increase

the real power if people were not forced to attend the church and they voluntarily supported and its teachings would mean more of them, tocqueville believed that it was more prevalent and stronger in america and that they believed it necessary to the reference of republican institutions so his view. religion was not hostile to the democracy and it was the friend and the support of the democracy and the republic. religion, he writes, which among religions should never mix in the government, was the first of the political institutions where if it does not give them the taste for freedom, it facilitates their use of it. religious belief, he could observe, was the impulse behind the movement for temperance and women's rights and abolition of slavery and it gave the limits of powers