happy to sign copies and take further questions. thank you so much for joining us here today. [applause] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2014] [captioning performed by national captioning institute]

>> you're watching american history tv, all weekend, every weekend, on c-span3. to join the conversation, like us on facebook it c-span history. >> 40 years ago on october 17, 1974, president gerald ford made a visit to the house judiciary committee to speak on his pardon of nixon. we will show his testimony and theremarks upon receiving 2001 profiles in courage award from the kennedy presidential library. recognizing his political courage in granting the pardon. we are speaking with richard norton smith.

>> thank you for speaking with us. in a few moments, we will see president gerald ford on his speech to the house judiciary committee. how many other president have testified before congress? >> that is a little bit vague. there is a tradition that abraham lincoln appeared in formally for a congressional committee early in 1862 following the apparent theft of a presidential message, which many had associated with mrs. lincoln. the story in the "herald tribune" said that woodrow wilson went to the house judiciary committee for an informal discussion of the

treaty of her side. but that is it. -- treaty of versailles. but that is it. >> did the house judiciary committee ask him to testify? >> he exit proposed to do so. -- he actually propose to do so. all sorts of questions were raised. not just from the usual political adversaries regarding possible motives behind this, and in the ensuing uproar, he decided that it would make perfect sense for him to break with tradition and in fact become the first president since lincoln to testify before a judiciary committee. the reaction was much more negative than he had anticipated. all sorts of questions were raised, and not just from the usual set of political adversaries regarding possible motives behind this. uproar, heensuing decided that it would make

perfect sense for him to break with tradition and in fact become the first president since lincoln to testify before a congressional committee. this is when 25 years on capitol hill paid dividends. he was, going into that lion's den and i think the record will committee treated him less harshly than them i have someone who had -- who they had not known and worked with for 25 years. >> as you said, 25 years on the hill. >> there were lots of strong nixon critics, and that was the committee that even i was preparing to rake nelson rockefeller over the coals, they had asked some tough questions during the gerald ford

confirmation hearing. so it was no pushover. >> the president saw the reaction to the pardon and opposed it to the committee, what is he seeing in the mood of the country? >> this man had already made history in so many ways. certainly in unwelcome ways. his gallup polls fell faster than any other president in history overnight. >> gerald ford? >> yes, it fell from before until after the pardon. you have to remember that we have to re-create the mood of the country. the country had been through two years of hell. it'd been almost a year during which he had to watch every word he said, lest he inadvertently

give the impression that he not follow the oaths of the oval office. >> did this testimony before the committee deflate the desire to go after neck the -- after nixon? >> there had been this long. of time where one after another after another where suddenly there was this breath of fresh air, and for a month or so, things seemed to be directly different. more open, more open, more trustworthy. and then to the surprise and shock of some people, there have

been no preparation for this. on a sunday morning, americans wake up as either president on tv, pardoning his predecessor. it would have been a surprise if that had not been his reaction. the committee wanted credible assurances that there was in fact no deal. that overwhelmingly was what they wanted to hear. it was interesting. they wanted to hear who he had discussed the pardon with, whether had there been discussions when he had taken the office, they wanted to know whether he had had any contact with mr. nixon during that month. they were specifically interested in dr. henry kissinger, mr. rockefeller, and more portly, alexander haig, who was nixon's chief of staff.

he had been the precipitating agent back on august 1, when in two conversations that day with gerald ford, he had first hinted at and then made explicit the likelihood -- the imminent likelihood -- that ford would in fact become president and then tacked on almost as a footnote, a series of options, including a pardon, affecting his predecessor. >> our viewers will see all of that as the president mentioned that. do you think the president was successful in front of the committee? >> i think he was successful. you will see this in the short term, but it must also be said that his colleagues who knew him best were perhaps most

predisposed to believe him when he said that there was no deal. and that sends the action of going before congress, which is really the muster mattock thing about all of this -- had a reinforcing quality to it. now, since the years, the debate has moved on as to what the specifics were, what the motives were, who intended what, what signals percent, and to the larger issue of whether this was good for the country. and i know from personal conversations with him, that president ford wit to his grave, first of all that there was no deal, and secondly, enormously he was sort of proud and reassured by the action of the john f. kennedy library in 2001, i believe it was, when they gave

him the courage award, specifically for this act. that was huge symbolism within that gesture. >> do you think that testimony in itself put him on the road and the country on the road to healing? >> i think it did. but again, feelings were raw and do not heal overnight. there are some people who objected to a pardon on any number of grounds, and also who do not believe a came about as innocently as ford said. >> there were people on the judiciary itself -- >> you will see that. elizabeth holtzman was particularly doggedly strong in her questioning. one of the things you watch this testimony is that the committee operates under the clock, and everybody gets five mi