wonderful benefit to be able to wear that honor. but it also has a lot of responsibility that goes it. and it's something that you need to always remember. this medal doesn't represent you. it represents all those that served and gave their lives in serving this country. so it's quite is a responsibility to carry, believe me. but it's quite -- it's an honor and you're -- as much as it sometimes becomes a burden, it's

also a responsibility and you only hope that you can carry it with honor and with dignity. [ applause ] >> i'm going to be last. >> you're not 35 anymore? >> for me, i was going to get out of the military or before i even went on my last deployment to afghanistan. me and my wife decided that we'd done enough, it was time to grow up and figure out what i was really going to do with my life. the decision was already made before even going overseas and immediately, after that day, the thoughts were never, you know, i did something to receive something. my big thing was to make sure that the guys with me got acknowledged, and more

importantly, i was proud of that moment walking into the barracks and having five guys volunteer to go on a counterattack, while i was so impressed with the true grit and just the willing bs to continue on. because we had nine more months left in country after that day. it wasn't you get done and get a free ride back to the states. you have to pick up the pieces. and to watch my platoon reconstitute after so much loss and recorporate after the replacement guys and bring them into the fold just like kicker and mace and heart, and take them and have them step right into their shoes and finish the mission and when i got out in early 2011, i had no idea. it wasn't until almost a year

later that i had gotten a call from a colonel out of the pentagon, asking if i'd come back to d.c., i don't have enough vacation days, i'm not going anywhere. and what did i do wrong? to finally being brought out to understand what my actions were, were getting recognized with but like tommy said, it is a responsibility to wear this little blue ribbon of silk around your neck. just the caretaker of it. this represents every man and, every marine, airman, sailer, coast guard, air force, every aspect of our military. past, present, and future. this is their reward. we're just selected to wear it.

and every time i put it on, i think about the eight guys we lost that day. what would they think of me with this decision i'm about to make? would they appreciate it? or would they turn in disgust? and that's how i continue on and continue forward. [ applause ] >> well, the medal of honor certainly changed my life. when i got home, they started giving me $10 a month for it, i thought, boy, i'm rich. i was a country boy that was very shy and bashful. you don't believe that, do you? but i was. but probably the best thing that happened to me was receiving the

medal of honor. i'm talking about psychologically. we didn't have ptsd in world war ii. we had psychoneurosis. so if you were diagnosed with psychoneurosis, you were a psycho, and nobody wanted that connotation associated with them. i had a brother that cracked up, we called it, in the marine core and that was the diagnosis and when he came home, he would not permit to file a claim with the va for psychoneurosis, because that would mean that he was a psycho.

when i received the medal of honor, i had no choice. from the second day on, i became a public figure. i didn't want to be that. i wanted to go back to the farm and dig a hole and get in it. because i had a lot of whatever they term now ptsd, but in those days, as i said, it was psychoneurosis and we had no treatment facilities. we had no psychiatrists, we had no psychologists. we had no va facility that we could even go to. and being forced by the public to talk about what happened to

me was the best therapy i could have received. i couldn't pin it up, i couldn't hold it in, i had to let it go. and that helped me tremendously to adjust back to civil life. you guys, all of you in the military know that when you grow up and your folks are teaching you things you ought to know, one of those things they teach you very firmly is, you do not kill, period. there is no exception. and then you go into a combat situation, where you have to reverse that completely. if you're going to survive, now you must do that which you have

never been permitted to do and taught not to do. and our case in world war ii, i was in the for the duration. and when the war was over, they handed me a discharge and said, we're done with you. you've done well, but just go home in 24 hours and revert to where you were three years ago. almost an impossibility. because the brain doesn't stop working. it keeps going. we have similar problems here today, with individuals who have the ptsd. fortunately, our facilities, our treatment methods, our knowledge and information about it is so

much greater and more accessible than it's ever been in the history of this country. and we all can be very proud of that. i am. i was a veterans counselor for 33 years and in the early part, we had no answers. we had nobody to go to. nobody to talk to, except each other. i'm grateful that somebody had the wisdom and the foresight to establish the situation that we have today, because it is so much more beneficial to those coming home than we've ever had. i'm grateful to my nation. thank you. [ applause ]

>> yesmgentleman, i want to ext thanks once again. this is a rare, in fact completely unique opportunity to hear the prospective across generations like this. and i can't say how privileged i feel and i know we all feel for this opportunity. so with that said, captain, would you like to bring us home? >> so it is with great regret that i have to bring this panel to a close. ladies and gentlemen, please join me in thanking our distinguished panelists for their extraordinary service at the moment of crisis and for their extraordinary humanity ever since. thank you, gentleman. [ applause ]

>> it's also my privilege to present each of our panelists with a book, entitled "the accidental admiral." on the next washington journal, sunlight foundation editorial director bill allison discusses the effect campaign spending ad on the 2014 midterm election. and a look at how voters reacted to marijuana ballot measures this election cycle with john hudak of the brookings

institution. that's followed by a discussion on the role of physicians assistant with john mcginty, who heads the american academy of physicians assistants. we'll also take your phone calls and look at your comments on facebook and twitter, beginning live at 7:00 a.m. eastern on c-span. >> each week, american history tv's real america brings you archival films that take you on a journey through the 20th century. produced by frank khapra, "the negro soldier" is a 1944 documentary intended to encourage african-americans to enlist in the u.s. army during world war ii. the film traces the history of african-american contributions to society, during war and peace. beginning with the revolutionary war, then showing their work as teachers, judges, scientists, artists, musicians, athletes, and soldiers. in 2011, this 40-minute film was chosen to be preserved in the

national film registry of the library of congress and was recently restored by the national archives. >> a paratrooper in the nazi army, men turned into machines, challenging the world. joe lewis, training for the fight of his life. this time, it's a fight not between man and man, but between nation and nation, it's a fight for the real championship of the world, to determine which way of life shall survive. their way or our way. this way, we must see to it that there is no return engagement. for the stakes this time are the greatest men have ever fought for. and what are the stakes? the american stakes. the german stakes. the nazis. the gospel according to hitler.

i'm not going to read all of this. but there are one or two things in this book that will interest you. i quote, what is denied to us, the german fist must take. if our forefathers had made their decisions by the same pacifist nonsense as the present day does, we would possess about a third of our existing territory. further, he says, from time to time, the illustrative papers show how a negro has become a lawyer, a teacher, perhaps even a minister. it never dawns on the degenerate middle class america that this is truly a sin against all reason. that it is criminal madness to train a born half ape to one believes one has made a lawyer of him. this book was written 20 years ago. the plan which it foreshadowed

has become a raet. and the nazis now instruct their disciples in terms such as these. we must straive by any means to conquer the world. any methods are permissible. lie, betray, kill. kill and kill again. kill the slobs, the russians, the poles, the czechs. don't stop, whether you have an old man, a woman, a girl, or boy. kill. we want to create our great german empire. we must exterminate everybody who stands against us. the liberty of the whole earth depends on the outcome of this contest. americans have always guarded liberty. the seed took root in boston. in that city is the granary

burial ground, 1660. within this grounds are buried the victims of the boston massacre, march 5th, 1770. the first to die in the boston massacre was christmas adams. the longest freedoms calls the wise contend, dear to all the country, shall your fame extend, while to the world, the letters stone shall tell, whered a docks, gray, and maddock fell. >> on newsmakers, independent vermont senator bernie sanders, the chair of the veterans affairs committee. he talks about efforts to revamp the va by veteran secretary, robert mcdonnell, the lame duck congress, and what he expects in the next congress with republican leadership and campaign campaign 2016.

newsmakers, sunday at 10:00 a.m. and 6:00 p.m. eastern on c-span. >> c-span veterans day coverage begins tuesday morning at 8:30 eastern during washington journal with an interview with american legion executive, verna jones. then at 10:00, the annual uvo gala, featuring joint chiefs of staff chairman general martin dempsey, and we're live at 11:00 from arlington national cemetery for the traditional wreath laying smoep at the tomb of the unknowns. later, a selection from this year's white house medal of honor ceremonies. for more than 50 years, tom brokaw has reported on world events for nbc news. he recently discussed his career with nbc news congressional correspondent luke russert, sharing some of the more memorable stories he covered in the last five decades, as well

as his own ideas of how the news media has changed in the 21st century. this is just over an hour. >> thank you, peter. and most importantly, thank you for all of you to come out and supporting this wonderful institution. it's my favorite museum in washington. my father helped found it. when you walk in here, you see the first amendment plastered to the wall, that can be seen from the capital. and it's so very important that we come here to celebrate the role of the press and the fourth estate and i think the fourth estate is less popular than hmos right now and oil companies in some polls, but i promise a new generation is trying to do better on that. but let's talk to a living legend, as i like to say, tom brokaw, who if you ever mention tom brokaw, you'll meet some people who say, i woke up with tom brokaw every morning with

breakfast on the "today" show, or ate dinner with tom brokaw on "nightly news." it's tom brokaw at the dinner table every single night along with my mom and dad and it was so great to get all kinds of stories and an instant history lesson at any time. we're approaching the 25th anniversary of the fall of the berlin wall. i did some research today. you were the only network news anchor there, the only broadcast, the west germans did not have time to get set up live. amazing backstory about how all that happened. but you took it upon yourself to go over there while there were mid-term elections going on, because you believed that this could be the bigger story. and you won't to a press conference where the propaganda minister from east germany said these things, you had an interview with him, i want to play that right now, can we do that? and we'll go into the question. >> do i understand correctly, citizens of the gdr can leave

through any checkpoint that they choose for personal reasons? they no longer have to go through a third country? >> they are not further forced to leave gdr by a transit, through another country. >> it is possible for them to go through the wall at some point. >> it is possible for them to go through the border. >> freedom to travel? >> yes, of course. >> good evening, live from the berlin wall on the most historic night in this wall's history. what you see behind sme a celebration of this new policy announced today by the east german government that now for the first time since the wall was erected in 1961, people will be able to move through freely. this crowd has gathered here tonight spontaneously from the east german side. they have a water cannon, as you can see, on some of the solvents, but it doesn't seem to make much difference. we'll show you a videotape of what happened earlier tonight

when there were more people on top of the wall. the west german police have moved in here. suggests that they move back, saying that the situation is already complicated enough. but it doesn't seem to make any difference. the people are here to celebrate freedom. freedom to travel anywhere in the world. >> that was an amazing moment. two things. the first time i've ever been interviewed by someone who i first saw on a sonogram. [ laughter ] >> there we go. >> tim came to me and said, i'm going to have a son! and here is the proof of that. and it was a thrilling moment for everybody and i'm so proud of how luke has continued the legacy of his dad, with his mother, marie, and he has become a cherished, not only surrogate nephew, but also a great, great journalist. so i'm thrilled to be on this stage with him and i know that

tim is lacking down and says to us, go get 'em. >> yes, indeed. thank you. thank you. >> a couple of things about that. he didn't know what he was talking about. he had been given this note at the end of a news conference and politburo had a lot of restriction on how people could go back and forth through the wall. he read it not quite knowing what he was saying. so people did go to all the exit barriers and start pushing back and there was a lot of confusion. and as we went on the air, we had not yet got an video of people who were going through one or another of the exits. so we needed to show that immediately. the water cannon didn't work very well. the guards on the other side didn't quite know what to do. at one point, they did drive everybody off, except for one man, who stood with his back to

the water cannon and i said to my producer, go get him and bring him back. he's the face of the new liberated east germany. my producer came back about ten seconds later, doubled back and laughed and said, not what we think. and i said, what do you mean? and he said, he's a drunk. he's been living over here in the forest and hasn't had a shower in two weeks. he's very grateful for what's going on. but that was the beginning of the fall of the wall and it was the symbolic end of communism, obviously, as the controlling factor in the satellite states and the soviet union was coming unraveled at the same time. i'm a child of the cold war. i grew up studying it and thinking about it, about what kind of a world we're going to have. and when that happened, i have two really reactions to it. one is, it is a liberation the likes of which we've never seen before and a lot of people didn't expect it to happen until the 21st century. and i don't think that the west then reacted in a way that they might have. i had just gotten back from

berlin and in germany, i was there with dr. kissinger and jim baker at the american academy. and we talked about this. it was not the kind of effort that should have been made to say, how else can we use nato. nato was our western alliance and remains that, but it has kind of come unraveled around the edges. it's not as unified as it once was. it was an incredibly important and potent force and facing the east and dealing with issues together, and not always perfectly, but it was the alliance. now it has a lot of parts to it, and they're often not greater than the sum of their parts, which they need to be. the other part of what we're watching here tonight is that it was so thrilling and hard to explain about how the dramatic people who had such a terrible 20th century, mostly self-induced wounds, then were divided. and you'd have people in the west who had cousins in the east. the people in the west had

democracy, consumer goods, and hope. and when the wall came down, their cousins and the other fellow germans came through in acid washed jeans, two-cycle lottos and automobiles as if they had come from the moon to venus. they just couldn't believe what they were seeing. and so, it was one of the most dramatic events, i think, of the 20th century, in kind of a 24-hour period. and then it went on from there. there was a big debate about whether german should be reunited politically. much later, i was presiding at a conference in atlanta, organized by a corporate lawyer. we had gorbachev, president bush 41, and helmet cole. and helmet got up, big bear of got quite emotional, got tears in his eyes and he turned to gorbachev and said you did not send the tanks and that gave us a chance to be a whole country again. he turned to president bush, and he said you stood for

unification when others, including margaret thatcher said we have to keep them divided. it was one of those moments in history when you saw three men with courage and vision come together and they were so personal in their interaction, and it kind of gave me hope. we don't see a lot of that anymore. >> one amazing thing in that newscast, aside from you being the only broadcast anchor there, a huge win for nbc news, if ever there was one, probably our biggest one in history, is i was reading sort of a breakdown by the e.p. at the time, bill wheatley, and he goes, you asked for about 15 to 20 seconds at the end of the newscast to give a little essay, put it in the context of history. why was that important for you to do at that time, and how did you come up with that in the commercial break, is how it was described? >> two things happened. first, it was such chaos, i couldn't hear myself, and i was

very well dressed because i went over with in one of my raggedy outdoor jackets. this is going to be on tape for a long time. one of my colleagues bought a smashing topcoat in london, lent me the topcoat, so i'm there in the topcoat, i said to the control room in new york, i'm going to have to add to this, i have to get through this the best i can. you'll know when i'm going to call for video. when we were doing the special later, i thought, we have to put this in context. i thought 1968 would be the defining year of my career. 1968, lyndon johnson stepped aside, we lost 68,000 people in vietnam. bobby and mccarthy were running against each other, dr. king was assassinated, we had the chicago riots, miami convention, george wallace was running, and we had that heated election that fall. people also forget at the end of that year, a man stepped on the

moon. so that was a very, very rich year. and then i phrased some of that and what we had been witnessed in 1989, which was the rearrangement of the world, if you will, which included china. i was also in teiananmen square and russia and poland. i interviewed gorbachev in '87 and persuaded him for a couple years he was the only american journalist he should talk to, and then he caught up to that. i said we have to put this in a context so people can understand the warp speed at which the world is changing. >> in our present day, the main adversary the use faces is islamic radicalism and fundamentalists and it's changed the way we cover the story because a lot of journalists can't get into syria, into parts of iraq because it's so dangerous. the story has changed and it's

not as clear-cut as it used to be. it's not the united states versus the soviet union. you have these sort of tribal wars playing out in the middle east. what's important for media consumers to digest from, a, how we're trying to do our best over there in terms of getting the story out, and what does it mean for future generations if the prolonged conflict in that part of the world and a guerilla style, not only through newer technologies and also radical ideologies seems to be defining global struggle? >> you have touched on a critical issue of where we go from here and our national security consideration. we're so locked in. even those of us as journalists who should know better, to the idea of nation state confrontations. that it will be between the east and west, between russia and the united states. as i said, i was in berlin with kissinger and baker, and kissinger said we could have anticipated what would happen in

the satellite states. we could have anticipated even the rise of someone like putin. we didn't see what was going to hap in in the middle east, and what we have in the middle east, now, of course, is not just asymmetrical warfare where we have these highly trained, extraordinarily motivated ra radical islamic forces that are moving easily, too easily in my jum judgment, across that part of the world. they all came out of ort financial states, states designed after world war i. the tribal culture is what defines them. it's faith based in most instances and goes very deep and it's been there for a long time. when you're there with them, and it's not just with the militia but with the people in the streets, of the various cities, that's the first thing they refer to. and the one place that they close up on, you can be talking to a shia or a sunni, and they'll have extraordinarily stark differences, but then you

talk to them about the west coming in, and they close up. and they say, this is our world. you can't tell us how to live here. and that's what we have. we have not yet in my judgment dealt with the culture. we don't get it yet because we have such an different impression in the western culture about how life should be lived. you cannot overstate the faith-based motivation that they have. and it's ancient, and it's narrow, and we have a hard time understanding it, but it is a hugely motivational force, and it leads to the kind of radical, unspeakable behavior that we have been witnessing of beheading journalists, and they think they're doing it in the name of their faith. there's nowhere in the koran that says you have to behead somebody who doesn't necessarily agree with you, especially innocent people. i think the hard problem for us is we don't have that part of the world, we don't understand it as well as we need to, and we're losing what allies we had.

you know, one of the things i said recently is how do we deal with isil or isis, however you care to characterize it? i said i like to take a lot of those idol rich young men when i go to saudi arabia wandering through shopping centers and put them in uniform and make them special forces. the king is saying it's up to the west now. it's up to everybody. this is a deeply dangerous situation. and moving into the political syria, it's going to define president obama's presidency in many ways. >> part of the success of the new forms of radical islam is based on their skillful use of new media. completely bypassing any of the traditional forms, and even to some degree, their success in the united states has been in terms of recruiting people has been in that manner. what has surprised you the most about the new media age we live in? we all talk about how the barriers are now being blown away that exist. it's more free in some ways, but

that freedom also brings with it a lot of liabilities. >> i think that's good news and bad news. i think during arab spring, twitter was powerful for people to stay connected, who were in the streets and not sort of revolt, but have an end of the revolt. my issue with the social media is it allows almost no reflective time. you don't have a chance to stop and think and have a real dialogue. it's, you know, 140 characters or whatever it happens to be, bang, bang, bang. and we don't know the sourcing of it. i mean, it could be some guy in his underwear who couldn't get a date, sitting there, and he's giving the impression he has hundreds of thousands of followers and saying anything that is outrageous that comes to his or her mind. and i'm telling you that in the middle east and the jihadist camps and other places, they're ahead of a lot of where we are in terms of how they communicate and stay in touch with each

other. if something happens here, bang, it's all out over there. i said something on "meet the press" right after the boston marathon bombing where i said we have to re-examine, re-examine was my phrase, we have to re-examine our drone policies because if you hit one innocent in a village, then that rockets around the middle east. on all the social media sites. and bill o'reilly among others came after me hard saying, oh, he just wants to fold up and he's the guy who wrote about the greatest generation and sometimes there has to be collateral indemnity. i wasn't saying we have to stop. i knew at the intelligence agencies and the military, they were concerned about the drone attacks and knocking on doors. everything you do over there has consequences of some kind and we're fighting a war the likes of which we have never fought before. it's very hard and we're now on our third war. >> another area we can turn to that seems to be constant war is

american politics these days. you're so good at having a historical context for all of us in terms of what you have seen and heard. i want you to go back to about 14 years ago, election night 2000. closest election in history. florida had gone to al gore, and then had been taken out of his column and gone to george w. bush, and then taken out of his column. the 25 very precious electoral votes, run to tape about how it looks 14 years ago. i remember it like it was yesterday because it was a defining moment in my household, but let's take a look. >> the networks giveth, the networks taketh away. nbc news is now taking florida out of vice president gore's column. it's just far too confusing. we're about to make an official call, and it's just too confusing. all night long, it has not been a sterling evening for both

projections in that state. oer originally, nbc and the other news networks projected al gore was the winner, then at 2:18, we projected -- all right, we're officially saying florida is too close to call because of a reca recall. let me show you one more time. florida. >> it's morning. >> it is, indeed. >> it was that kind of night. and then it went all the way to the supreme court case that happened in december that ultimately decided. >> we were working class kids. we love politics, we had grown up with it. at one point when i met big russ, your grandfather, he got out of a car where i was waiting for him at a baseball game and tim got a car to drive him out, and he got out and said my limo

driver was late. it was a great line, and i thought, that's exactly what my dad would have said. where's my limo driver? i have these kids with limos. we were joined at the hip, the two of us. i still, especially at this time of year, i want to punch his number in and say, hey, what do you think about what's going on in arkansas? we were there together that night and it was one of the great confusing nights of our lives. we were both off camera saying how do we get out of this? and at one point, tim remembered me trying to make a quick break, and i came back with a mouthful of saltine crackers. and that's probably the only time i made sense all night long, by the way. i had never been through anything like that. thank got the country has not gone through it again. it was kind of the beginning of the unraveling, i thought, of the american political system as we had grown up with it. it was drifting off in many parts. we're all looking at tuesday of next week, for example.

and president obama has a world of troubles. i was just looking at a harvard poll today. he's now losing the millennials, the young people. the white millennials. still a racist divide, but he's dropped down to under 50% in the millennials who don't think he's taking care of them with education cost, with job training. they don't like obamacare. this is going to be a tough election for him. on the other hand, the republicans are coming into office with no grand plan about what we do. so for the next two years, we'll have a protracted run for the white house. and not much done in congress. you know, wednesday morning, rubio, cruz, santorum, jeb bush is now looking more like a candidate than he has in recent months. they'll be out there getting ready to run again. on the democratic side, you've got hillary, obviously, but jim webb taking a look at it, some of the other governors taking a look at it because the landscape now is moving in a lot of different directions.

and who knows? my favorite theory of politics is the ufo policy. something could happen between now and the next election. a lot of democrats are already saying, you know, we're going to lose the senate, and they'll go nuts to the white and then we'll get the white house back. republicans are saying we have to learn some lessons from the past, and we've got to get our act together. i a very prominent republican strategist who is no longer as active as he was, but i'm telling you he was in the thick of it all, i asked what is your best outcome? he said, mitch mcconnell gets beat, we still win the senate. they think some of the leadership in the republican party has to be set aside. the next two years are not going to be great for the country necessarily, but it's going to be rock 'n' roll in the political arena. >> you don't foresee any chances of obama trying to savage some legacy domestically? it's pretty tough. >> it's tough.

you have two years left. they know that. you really don't have the full two years. you have 16 months maybe. >> you run out the clock. >> they're already, reading the papers today, kerry and hagel are not happy with how they can't fit in there. he's getting, seems to me, when he talks about the ebola quarantine, he seems angrier than he has been in some time. this is not unusual for a president in his second term. you may remember that george bush 43 in his second term hank paulson was trying to hold the economy together, and the president went to him at one point and said i would like to help you, but i would do you more harm than good if i stepped in at this point, because it's a tough, tough business. and they take the measure of you very quickly. you can be the chief executive and commander in chief and live in the white house, but if you don't have the underpinning of power and support, you don't have a lot to play with. >> the president came in in 2008 with a resounding victory, came

in with a huge majority in the house, a big majority in the senate. filibuster proofs for some time, and then in 2010, the gop wins 63 seats and we seem to have been in this perpetual trench warfare where the big idea is the country is so changed, one could say, some change did occur, too much change too quickly. ult mele from six years in as we go into the last two years which seem to be a lame duck, where do you fall in the sense of do you think this was a republican opposition from the beginning? did the president have poor relations with congress? is this a defining thing that has stuck to obama during his term so far? >> i don't think it's one thing. i do think there are lessons in all of this. one is the lesson of president obama, brilliant man, obviously a charismatic campaigner with extraordinarily well organized campaign running against in the first instance john mccain, who

was not the stronger candidate. he has all kinds of other qualities, but as a presidential candidate in the depths of the recession, he didn't have a lot to say about it and how he would handle it, but this president had no managerial experience, he had not run anything before. a state senator and community organizer and somebody who had been extraordinarily successful in getting elected to senate, but he hadn't been there for long, and he's made clear over the last six years he's not crazy about the political process. if you read those accounts of when he lost the debate to mitt romney the first time in denver, you go back and look at the preps, he said at one point to his team that was preparing, you know, guys, this is not who i am. that's what presidents have to be. i thought it was symbolic when he won that election, he wanted to reach out to congress. he took the people he wanted to talk to, the jefferson hotel for dinner. take them to the white house. i have never seen anybody walk in there that their knees didn't

buckle. whatever side of the political spectrum they were on. and he's had a small, well contained group around him. national security and domestic affairs. no one wants a president to fail, republican or democrat, that's not good for the country. but once there's blood in the water, you know, then what happens is that everything is unleashed. so i think the next two years are going to depend not just on what happens on the republican side or in the democratic side or at the white house. it's going to depend on all of us. where is the country on all of this? these are issues that go beyond conventional politics. i have said it before and i'll say it again. i didn't think the tea party was good for the country because they were too narrowly cast and they were not interested in any compromise. but as a longtime political reporter, i was deeply impressed by their organizational skills. they got angry, they got

organized, they stayed on message and stayed in the fight. they're not going to have a great year this year, but they rose up from the ranks and they then wanted to take their place on the political field. and we need more of those citizen kinds of movements if you're going to change things, whether it's in the republican party or the democratic party. >> last few minutes here before i open it up to questions from the audience, so if you have a pressing question, start thinking about it now. that's your gift from me. give you sort of a barbara walters type of question here. >> please. >> all right. if you were any animal -- through your entire career, is there a story that haunlts you the most to this day? >> you know, it's interesting. i have never been asked the haunting question. i have been asked a question about the most memorable interviews and that kind of thing. i think the haunting question for me is what i see when i go to the third world.

and my wife has a project going now in malawi, one of the poorest countries in africa, one of the poorest continents. and i see the goodwill of the women who are running a canned tomato project is what it is. and she -- those of you who know her know how remarkable she is, but she went over there on some other project, loves doing the kind of things that we grew up with in the midwest, and she saw all these tomatoes and they didn't have anything to do at the end of the season, they didn't know what to do with them, they didn't have preservation, canning. she went back, shipped over, sold some property her dad left her, shipped over containers and canning equipment, organized women to go to africa and i went back with her. this is a very difficult country. i have been all over africa, this is about as poor as it gets. she organized a cooperative of these women. some were great in the field, others were great at managerial stuff. they were just a speck against

all this degradation of who they were and the aids that had infected their country, and the corruption at the top. and those are the stories that haunt me, while the rest of us in the west are moving with silicon valley and medical advances and all the other changes coming in our lives and there's so many people in the world who are just stuck in place. and they have real skills, and they have real intuition. these women, if you turned africa over to the women, men don't have leadership positions anymore, women are going to run the continent, we'd be a hell of a lot better off. >> and you bring that up as important, because i think this point should be made. it's difficult to cover that story because there's not a lot of appetite in the united states. there's an instant reaction that we have our own problems and our own things that are depressing. don't depress us anymore. there's a real challenge of

being a journalist to sort of get that point of view out there into the mainstream. >> it is, and the ebola crisis is a perfect example of that. the real ebola crisis is not in texas or in this country, quite honestly. you know, we've got to have a system for dealing with it, it's indisputable, but we really have had, what, one person die in texas at this point and a couple people quarantined. and we've got all these great agencies swarming all over it. i'm on the board of the mayo clinic. the mayo system is now in a complete overhaul of what they're going to do about infectious diseases, closing down icus and turning them into isolation units which may never be used. but in west africa, you have brave young western doctors going in there just trying to contain it in some fashion in these remote villages, and that's the really tough issue, frankly, that we're going to be dealing with. and it's hard for, i think, americans have compassion fatigue. and i understand that.

you know, we're in our third war. we've spent so much more money in iraq and in afghanistan than president bush and especially dick cheney and don rumsfeld told us. it was going to be profitable, they were saying, then we spent a trillion dollars in the first year and a half we were over there, and it's unending at this point. i think people are here withdrawing from the idea they have an obligation to the world and they're worried about their children and if you'll permit me this, the american dream is still there, but we probably have to kind of reconstitute it. the american dream was always seen in economic terms, my parents were perfect examples, they dream was i would go to college and have more economic security and a kind of grander life. they had a wonderful life, the two of them, but they could not have imagined the life i would have, but we had it. that was the american dream.

every generation would live better than the last generation. but we're kind of hitting the ceiling on it. how many houses can you have? and do you have the kind of working class job that my dad had, and does that pay for the house that you would like to have? and so we have to rethink what is the american dream? the american dream ought to be about other kinds of opportunities and how we come together and the government and other social agencies that are nongovernmental can do for you. i'll take 15 seconds and tell you -- well, it will take longer -- about one of my grand hopes. we kind of have it under way. i would reconstitute public service in america. i would make it a public/private enterprise. i could create six public service academies in land grants across the country and have them governmental and private sector. john deere fellows, for example, in sophisticated farming

equipment and water systems. johnson & johnson fellows, post graduate work in infectious diseases, nurse technicians, whatever. ge fellows and small power systems around the world, and they get the special training, the companies get a tax break, and the kids get paid well. and they're assigned domestically as well as internationally. domestically because when we have a national disaster, we send in the national guard. that national guard unit may have been in afghanistan twice already and they're not necessarily trained well to do this kind of thing, and then we give, it seemed to me, the younger people, the millennials a reason to care for the country and a hope they will get a skillset. we need a big idea, is what i think, as much as anything. so i would hope we are trying to gin this up and begin a pilot program at arizona state and maybe as something that can excite the country again. we don't have many things out there that are exciting folks right now. >> going through the cross

tabs -- well, let's give the brokaw plan -- [ applause ] >> are you running for president? going through the cross tabs on our latest state polling, what i found interesting on your point about the american dream is we're talking so much about isis and ebola and all these different issues, but the number one issue in all these states was job creation. and which candidate can help me there. and number two is breaking gridlock. which are sort of two things the media does not talk about that much in the context of coverage. on your point about the american dream, do you think we're doing enough as journalists covering the real income inequality that exists now in the united states at levels we have not seen and the ongoing poverty occurring in the united states in historic levels? >> no, i don't. and we're not going to turn back to happy days where mom stays at home and dad goes off to work, and you can afford everything. i grew up in that environment. you know, my mother did work because she wanted to work, but

she didn't really have to, but it did give us an added advantage, but almost every friend i had, and a lot of them were quite poor, the mom stayed home and the dad was working. and now, you know, the mom may have two jobs, and there are more single mothers out there, which is another issue. and the dad doesn't have a job that pays the kind of benefits that he got before. and a lot of that is economic reality. there's no question about it, but the disparity between the people at the very top in corporations and what the working class gets down in the middle or, it's quite extraordinary. truth in advertising, i get paid a lot of money. i get that. i understand that. i like it, but i have enough of a working class background that i think, man, this is a huge difference between what i'm earning and what these wonderful people that i work with, technicians and editors and the others, are getting as well. we have opened up all these big gaps between the earnings.

and then it becomes the goal to have the house that costs so much money. cannot imagine what's going on in manhattan right now. real istaestate has gone nuts. all of our working class people in the building are living farther and farther out because they can't afford anything in the city. one apartment was sold the other day now, 90th floor now for $97 million. you look at a small apartment in new york, it's got $2 million, nothing less than that. and this, it seems to me, feeds on rest. it's not just manhattan, it's the ever more crowded areas around america in which this is going on. more renters going on. and we are in a seismic shift about what expectations are. unemployment is coming down. they're not great jobs. there are a lot of service jobs.

so how we solve that is kind of beyond my ability to nail it. >> before we open it up to questions from the audience, i'll give you my last question. who -- and we'll keep this to deceased individuals. who is a deceased individual you interviewed throughout history that you found the least impressive? >> well, there are a lot of them. i mean -- there are a lot of them. i remember i went down, when cl colombia was trying to change from being a cartel to a democracy, and i opened with a question to a guy, and he absolutely went blank. he couldn't even talk for about 40 seconds. i looked at the public relations guy, and he said, i don't know what we're going to do. i said, we spent a lot of money to come down and interview this guy. you know, there were people

that, and tim i i used to talk about them in washington, who were not as prepared as they thought they would be. i'm not picking on him because he's had certainly enough of his self-induced troubles. john edwards was not as good as he thought he was. he would show up and he was slick and a courtroom performer, but your dad nailed him one of the first times he came on "meet the press" because he started to talk about support for israel, and he didn't have a clue, quite honestly, about what was going on. the problem with interviewing now is most of these people that you're interviewing have been so wired in a way, so preprogrammed, that you don't get the spontaneity out of them, you don't get the stuff out of them. are we on the record or off the record here? i wanted to tell a joe biden story. i interviewed joe biden, who i actually -- i thought joe biden was a great legislator. he was in the thick of things in the senate.

he cared about it passionately. and i was -- this is at a critical time in the iraq war. there were a lot of claims coming out of the pentagon we were really training the iraqi army and they were going to take care of their own country and their own security. i was over there a lot and i was watching these people coming in in tennis shoes joining the iraqi army, and i said to petraeus, how do we know who they are and where they're coming from? he said, we're kind of counting on their fellow warriors to tell us. not a very good vetting system. joe was running the senate foreign relations committee at the team, and he had his team evaluating how the training program was going, and they didn't think it was going well. i came down to interview him. he was right on top of his topic. this is sometimes the best part of journalism. when the interview ended, joe, who i have known forever, turned to me, his only joke, and said how are you and meredith doing with menopause?

that's comes out of the heading of a question i did not expect. and i said, well, like everybody else. and he said, god, i was blindsided by this stuff. now, i've got my camera crew and all my producers there and everybody. and i said, well, you know, joe, it's been around for a while. he said, yeah, i'm thinking about getting a federal study. i said don't go there. it's in every woman's magazine every week. you don't have to do that. that was, for me, the quintessential joe moment, and it was not -- it was not that he was unprepared for the topic at hand, but he just loves to talk ability whatever happens to be on his mind at that time. and there are, you know, there are lots of people who are -- they're not impressive. i'll tell you about putin. i interviewed gorbachev and we really did become quite close. putin, i interviewed twice. your mother was at the dinner that i gave for him, and your

dad was there as well, and your mother had done the thing on the banking system in russia. >> wonderful "vanity fair" article, she's here right now. god bless her. thank you, mother. >> we had a big dinner at 21, and he never cracked a smile. did he? and the first time i interviewed him in moscow, same thing. i didn't look into his eyes and see the soul of a christian. i saw a russian nationalist who had been a kgb agent. he was very tough and very determined. and you must remember, he was a guy who carried out orders and worked for people who had more standing than he did. so you get these different kinds. on the other hand, the most remarkable man i interviewed under the most remarkable circumstances was nelson mandela. when he came out of prison, i

was with him 24 hours after he had been released. for 25 years he had been in prison. it was if he had just gotten back from a trip to zurech representing his country in some way, in his backyard in soweto. he was charming, completely versed in the western media and who we were and what we were interested in. and one of my treasured pictures of the two of us laughing as we're sitting there. you know, he had never met me before, obviously, but i had a soundman who had one of these boom mikes with a big, fuzzy thing on it to cut down on the wind. i said, mr. mandela, this is not a weapon. it's a microphone. he said, i'm so glad to hear it. i thought it was a shotgun pointed at me. we broke up in laughter. i thought, that was one of the moments that you kind of live for. >> you absolutely remember those, without a doubt. my father and you, you would have a descripter, brought this up when you mentioned john

edwards. no socks for a politician. what did that mean? real quickly. what does no socks mean. >> tim and i had a lot of short hand when we talked. and there was a candidate running, i can't get too close to it, the identification of it, democrat who was running in the midwest. and tim said, how is he going to do? i said, i can make a couple calls to find out. it was a guy who had a place in the east as well. he had gotten infatuated with the eastern seaboard south where luke spends a lot of time on nantucket. so i called one of my friends in the midwest, and i said, how is he going to do? he said, one line, he said, he doesn't wear socks. and it was that summer kind of thing that you see in the eastern seaboard. you can't do that in farm country. >> right. >> so that became for tim and me, shorthand for a candidate who didn't have a clue about where they were going. how are they going to do? he doesn't wear socks.

okay. >> and i use that to this day. it's a great descripter for those kinds of candidates. let's open it up to the audience. shelby. >> shelby coffey, mr. brokaw. you delivered a wonderful eulogy for our friend ben bradley at the washington national cathedral this week, and i wondered, it was great for the cathedral. you're now in a temple of free speech, so if you had another couple anecdotes about ben and what it was like to be with ben, kind of resemble being with james bond, we'd love to hear those. >> so question from shelby there, any more anecdotes about ben bradley? you eulogized him yesterday. you couldn't do them in a church. >> and i talked about it. i actually left out one whole paragraph about the business about his profanity, and about, you know, and i really had kind of euphemistically figured out

how to do it, and i kind of skipped over it, and it's just as well. but a couple stories. what i said was he had his own personal system that involved digits on his hand he would use to express himself to people when they didn't agree with him. but a british friend of mine had read, who didn't know him, had read all the obituaries and came to me said and i have been reading all these obituaries of benjamin bradley, the profanity, overstated? i said impossible. impossible. >> i really think it grew out of his war experience. i really think, ben and i talked a lot about what it was like for this harvard graduate to be in an area with kids from the farm and the inner city and all these places, and i remember this story vividly. he was on the phillip, and they were in the thick of it, and they had a kid onshore who was an artillery spotter for him. he was down, really out there by

himself in the jungle. giving him japanese locations. and they would talk to him radio, clandestinely, and the kid said i have to get out of here, i need a break. they had no idea who he was, so they sent a zodiac in after him, pulled him out at nighttime, and ben said he was about 5'3", he couldn't have weighed more than 120 pounds. he was from some small town in texas. he was our link. a guy who put himself way out front so we could hit the target, and it made a huge impression on him, and then on the way home, ben said, they all gathered on the fantail and talk about what they want to do when they get back. he was hearing aspirations and dreams he had never heard before because of how he had grown up. he wanted to be a journalist, and there were school teachers and farmers and all these other people. it was a real education. but one of my favorite social stories about him is that -- well, i have another one like that.

here he comes out of that brahman background, goes to war, goes to paris, invents "newsweek" conducts the greatest journalistic investigation on the greatest political scandal in the nation's history and everyone loved him at the post. i have been in journalism for 52 years. i never knew reporters who swooned around their boss. and it was in part because of how he handled them. this must have been the second year i was in washington. i was invited to a party, and i got there late. i had been at the office, and i walked in. meredith said to me, you have any idea who you're seated next to tonight? i said, no. she said, it's jan morris, the writer who has just had a sex change operation. now ms. jan morris. i kind of vaguely read about it. and i say, oh, my god. and we're immediately sat at the dinner, and she couldn't have been more charming. she said, i have been watching you cover watergate. how has that effected you?

and i said, not thinking, it's changed my life. now, i'm just, you know, i'm red in the face. how do i get out of it? and ben overhears this, and he bails me out. he leans over and says to her, when was the last time we saw each other? was it in algeria? i thought, why can't i say something like that? that's who he was. he never -- he was always joyful. woodward and i talked about him a lot because bob and i come from the same kind of midwestern protestant guilt, and he said ben never, ever looked back. he only looked forward. if they made a mistake, he'd say, okay, clean it up and we go on. instead of anguishing over it, he'd say, okay, got to keep going, guys, and that's what they would do. so he was really quite remarkable. >> who else do we have in the audience? there, come on up to the microphone here.

don't fall down the stairs. oh, great. let's do this. we'll come right back. go ahead. sure. >> i was just wondering, since you have retired, there's been a lot of changes in the way journalism is presented, like the rise of the 24-hour news cycle and sort of celebrity news personalities and just much more controversial sort of loud personalities. i'm curious like what you think of these new personalities and the tv shows, perhaps, you watch to get the news now. >> the question is, in our current day and age, we have this sort of celebrity journalist driven cable news machine, a lot more opinion on news, not like it used to be in a capacity also derived from social media. what does that mean for the country, and what do you watch as a media consumer?

>> i surprise some people. i think we have so many more choices now than we have ever had. representing so many different points of view. but you can't be a couch potato anymore. you have to be much more aggressive as a consumer about what you watch and test it for its credibility. is it good for the country? i think free expression is good for the country, but at the somtime, i think there's a lot of mischief, and i think there's a lot of deliberate destructive mischief that goes on out there. my recommendation to audiences is kind of create, if you will, your own virtual newspaper. i get up in the morning and i, you know, i have a friend who runs the financial times. i like to check in, see what's doing there. then i run the traps on the standard american establishment papers. i read the post and the wall street journal and the "new york times" right away. i go to the counsel of foreign relations where i'm a board member and we have a very good overnight look at what's going

on, and there are terrific websites that are attached to think tanks or groups of one kind or another. i love the idea i can in a keystroke read the dallas times herald. i want to see what that paper is saying and i can get it from them. but i have to be proactive about it. i just can't take what comes at me. we have a ranch in montana and a wonderful couple working for us, but they're real ranching, isolated family in a rural area, and they're quite apolitical, and about twice a week, karen comes across the bridge, her eyes are about this big, and she'll say to me, you're not going to believe what i read on the internet this morning. my answer is always the same, karen, you're right. i'm not going to believe what you read. and you have to have that attitude a little more, i think. >> it's a very important point. in this day and age, everyone thinks it's easier to be a media consumer, and that's not necessarily true because you really have to separate fact

from fiction and be much more cognizant of who is delivering you the product. over here, what do we have? >> mr. brokaw, i really enjoy your time here this evening. and you may not remember, but i have sent you some pictures previously when you were in town for the tenth anniversary of the fall of the wall. pictures of you in berlin because at the time, i was a young army intelligence officer and assigned there from december of '88 until may of '92, so this evening, i brought you additional photographs attesting to the fact you were there, and also for the 20th anniversary, i published a book, but it's from the perspective of what the role the western allies play, which really hasn't been documented in many ways. so i would be honored if you would accept this from me, and again, i enjoy the fact that you came here this evening. and i had a chance this time to see you.

>> well, thank you very much for your service. god bless you. i mean, a young army intelligence officer who was in berlin at the time of the fall of the wall and has just written a book about the role that western allies had in the fall of the wall that is too often overlooked. what do you think in terms of some western allies not getting their due diligence in terms of the fall of the wall. >> it was brought on by the people in the ger. what was overlooked was what was happening in the week before. there were hundreds of thousands people out there demanding change, and there was a strike, and it spread quickly to the satellite states. so i give the generational -- it was a generational change going on in the east. they were willing to push back and making it harder and harder for them to be controlled. i had just gotten back, as i indicated earlier, and i interviewed a number of key people, a photographer who was clandestinely getting out video

to the west to say here's where we are and this is what's going on and we do need your help, so it really was a revolt that came from the bottom up. and at a news conference, for example, the east german press, which had been necessarily kind of toady like, they were very aggressive that day, that afternoon, and they were pushing him hard on policies, about the press and whether they would have the freedom to travel or not. and that was unusual for them. and when he made the announcement, not my interview, but when he made the announcement in the room, it was stunning because everybody kind of nodded off at that point. he had been droning on for an hour, and then he pulls this piece of paper out and reads it, and it seems to us it was saying you could come and go through any entrance. it turns out they did have stipulations on it and they honestly thought in their kind of bewildered way of looking at

the world that the east germans would go to the west and then return to their old lives, come back to the east again. when he left the news conference and drove out to the compound where the bureau members all lived, they had gone to sleep. and here, their world was crumbling around them. a wonderful new book out by a harvard historian call ed "the collapse." it's a wonderful new book, in part because she gives nbc credit for how we covered it. she has unbelievable detail about what was going on behind the scenes. it's quite riveting. the narrative take said you all the way through it. we'll be doing some things at harvard this fall with that. >> yes, sir. >> how do you account for the news media's failure to challenge the basis for the invasion of iraq? >> how do you account for the

news media's failure to challenge the basis for the invasion of iraq? something that's got obviously a lot of attention paid to it. there's the documentary. >> you know, that's a question that's been around for a while. my personal judgment, i was in there a lot beforehand. i didn't know about weapons of mass destruction, and no one really did. the u.n. couldn't quite figure out whether they had them or didn't have them. could they have been hidden? there were all these bunkers all over the country. what i did think was, and i said this on the air, was that we'll be successful militarily in the short-term, but then the country will begin to break up into its tribal feastms, and it's going to be a lot hoarder to hold it together than we knew. the state department had another point of view about the consequences of the invasion, but never said no, there should be no invasion. colin powell went to the u.n. and held up the little file or

talked about the file. so it was when the drum beats of war start in this country, and it was especially after 9/11, there's this kind of emotional tide. the only person who really spoke out, who had great credibility in this area, was brent scrocroft. we put him on the air and had him talk about it a lot, but you weren't getting much out of congress. a lot of people were voting for it at the time. there's so much that was unknowable. in fact, it was six or seven months later, i was over there with david kaye, and he thought that they had gotten so many computer print-outs, he thought they were going to find the cache of weapons of mass destruction, and two weeks later, he said they're not there. my own judgment is that, a, saddam was trying to persuade iran that he was prepared to fight back with weapons of mass destruction. and that his colonels and the others around him were coming up

with plans, getting money for it, and i think there were secret bank accounts all over zurich now with money they got for weapons of mass destruction. there was never a danger, in my judgment, of a mushroom cloud that we heard a lot about. >> i was going to ask. there never seems to be a compelling reason for us to do it now versus wait until they either came up or discovered something. we were not threatened, the united states. >> no direct threat. no impetus to do it immediately. it was sort of a rush. >> he was in a box. i mean, and we had on a box. >> saddam was on a box. >> at the time. rumsfeld will say we couldn't take a chance because he was getting closer and closer to our overflights. that's now the resize erevised it, and rumsfeld now is saying, intelligence, boy, when colin powell went to the u.n., that kind of told us those were not facts. that's what passes for

intelligence. there's a lot of sliding away from it from people who were in fact thought he was a grave threat from the moment they arrived in this administration. they had him in their crosshairs. the other thing, having been in there a lot, two things became very clear to me, first of all, the country was a lot more broke than they thought it was. it was going to be really hard once we took control to try to make it work again. the second thing was there was a complete misinterpretation about the sunnis and shiite and how they would fight each other. he was a sunni. shiite, larger population. i went out to a shiite university. this was a month before the war began. and ditched my minder and had 1,000 kids who were sitting, the american culture, listening to voa and they were all about john denver, and it was a graduation day. and we're having a wonderful time together. and at the end, i said to this one particularly voluble young man, what are you going to do

now that you have graduated? his eyes went cold and he said i'm going to join jihad and fight the united states. i said, i'm the united states. i'm going to fight bush. and then i went down to a suk in baghdad, and it snakes through the heart of the city for two miles. if you wanted a wind-up for a 1948 studebaker window, you could find one there, and they were all really tough shiite. and i had been there a couple times. now they knew me, and then they would corner me when i walked in. they say, you know, we don't need you telling us what to do. but i said, saddam, sunni. and they said, yes, it's our country. it's not about him. it's our country. i came back and my exchanges with members of the administration, trying to figure out what is going on, i said, this is what i have been hearing. oh, tom, they have to tell you that. i have been doing this a long time. i know when they have to tell me

something and when they don't. they would call up people like chalabi who had not been there for 20 years or other experts who had been stuck in princeton and hadn't been there for 20 years. and they said, these guys know what is going on, and i said, not like in the streets. but they were so determined to conduct the war that they were going to go ahead anyway, and people who were assigned to get in there immediately after they got to baghdad, including -- he had been a principal aide to james baker, said we had no idea about how broken this was. now, the state department had issued a big paper about the enormous task of trying to put it back together again, but there was such division between the defense department and the vice president's office and the state department that they weren't listening to each other. >> and on that point, there's a famous "meet the press" clip of my father interviewing dick cheney. he asked the question, what if

we are received not as liberators but as occupiers? and cheney's simple response is that's not going to happen. and that was sort of the response of not only the administration but those who backed the war in congress and the democratic side as well. so the media did put that out there. i think there in retrospect, it probably could have been covered more thoroughly. everything in hindsight is 20/20. people forget it's a post-9/11 mindset, but that was out there. last one. >> in some circles, there's a belief that the berlin wall came down largely because of ronald reagan. others don't really understand that. what's your attitude on ronald reagan's involvement? >> so, the belief that the berlin wall came down because of ronald reagan? and the pope, we could say, but ronald reagan specifically? >> they were all players, and they all kept the pressure on. the enduring legacy of ronald reagan is he came in a real hawk about how to take down the

soviet union with star wars and all that, and then was persuaded seeing what was going on over there by among others, nancy, by the way, and soviet analysts, that the system was crumbling from within, and it couldn't be sustained, and we could continue to put economic pressure on them and make them spend money on sdi, and that was what that was all about. and it was clear that they couldn't pull that off. now, gorbachev, who i admire, was a guy who didn't give up on communism. that was the one flaw, that's why he -- you know, he lost a lot of his inner circle because he wanted to keep the system in place that he knew they would have to change. you couldn't have both. but he was the best guy to be dealing with at that time, and we had never dealt with anybody like that before. so i do think that reagan and the pope had a role in all of this, but there are a lot of players on the other side as well, who were doing smart

things. a perfect example in poland, your dad and i were there when the president was there and there when the pope was there. >> i have pictures of you guys with beers which are at my mom's house, which is great. >> when the pope was there, there was a big movement on the left in poland about the church was hand in glove with the rulers. and in fact, the church was a pipeline. what the pope was doing was sending messages through the catholic hierarchy in poland to we're not going to have blood in the streets, and they were -- the church was very important about bringing that out peacefully. i'll tell you one quick story that some of you may remember. the polish president who has just died. david ignatius, help me out with

this? >> ouelletsky? >> so, i had interviewed gorbachev, and so i go to poland, and i have an interview with -- >> who is a history major here? >> anyhow, he's a man who had also kept the lid on things. and he came into the room. and he was a stately, career military guy in poland, came from a distinguished family. in shaded glasses, and he said to me, i had a producer from chicago with me who was a kind of unmade bed of a man, had a hilarious sense of humor, and he said to me, i have been interviewed by walter cronkite in translation, and i have been interviewed by barbara walters, by the editor of the "new york times," now, i'm about to be interviewed by the most important american journalist at all, because i just interviewed

gorbachev, mr. tom brokaw, and my producer said, no wonder this guy is in so much trouble. >> that's great. one last one to end the night on. and thank you so much for coming, everybody. you have been a wonderful audience. and we're going to get this flight out of here on time. real quickly, one reason for optimism for the future of the united states and the biggest reason for pesism that keeps you up at night? >> a big reason for opt mrcimis we're the most inventive country in the world and people are still desperate to come here and bring those skills with them. i have been dealing with health issues for the last year. at the hospital in new york, i have yet to meet a native born american, and these are the best people there are, all the scientists and the people in the corridors have come here from everywhere, from china and russia and from south america because this is where they want to live and where they can

exercise the skills that they have developed over the years. that's just a snapshot of how we're constantly renewing this american dream. there's no other immigrant nation in the history of the world like what we have. and we need to figure out how we're going to deal with immigration and how we can keep that going on, it seems to me. the reason for pessimism is the withdrawal of people from taking an active role in their own destiny. i think there's something going on. i can't codify it completely, but i think there's such a rejection of washington that federalism as we have known and is important to us, is in some peril. if you go around the country, we have become a country of urban nations. seattle is an urban nation. it has its own culture, its own economy, its own freight policies with the pacific rim. and it's a place where there's such vibrancy in terms of getting things done, and the

political system at the municipal and county level works so well. in san francisco, it's still developing, but there are great universities and medical systems and the money coming out of silicon valley is really recharging it. what is the mantra in silicon valley? be disruptive, find new ways to do things. don't be afraid. los angeles is an urban nation, south american urban nation. texas is an energy urban nation with what they've got going on. move across the country, it's true in all of these big metropolitan areas getting ever larger every year. atlanta, miami, all the way up the eastern seaboard. not quite as true yet as far north as it is in the west where there's it is in the west where there's constant renewal going on. but these are big seismic shifts in the country. that will have consequences it seems to me. >> tom brokaw, living legend.

[ applause ] the 2015 c-span student cam video competition is under way, taupe all middle and high school student to create a 5 to 7-minute documentary with the theme three bafrmg branches and you. showing how the federal government has affected you or your community. there's 200 cash prizes for student and teaches totaling $100,000. for the list of rules and thousand get started go to studentcam.org. c-span veteran's day coverage begins tuesday morning at 8:30 eastern during washington journal with director verna jones.

then at 10:00, the annual uso gala featuring joint chiefs of staff dempsey. then at 11:00, live at arlington national ceremony for the laying of the wreath ceremony at the tomb of the unknowns. then later, selection of the white house medal of honor ceremonies. >> each week american history tvs reel america brings you archival films that help you bring information to the 20th century. ♪ ♪ >> poor barbara, not for her, carefree hours of happy play. nor the busy hours of work and

study. what has happened to her that she lies there so hot and feverish? so weak and dizzy? so miserable with suffering and pain? her body is just like a little country that's been invaded by an enemy army. but the enemy in this case is not the soldier, and can be seen only through a microscope. it's soldiers are the germs of communicable disease. some of these disease-causing organisms are so small that they cannot be seen even with the most powerful microscope. they are detected only because they can pass through the tiny holes of this filter.

a communicable disease is one which can be caught from someone else. this means that the germs have to least body of a sick person and enter the body of one who is well. the usual gateway by which they enter is through the mouth or nose. how do germs make the trip from sick to well and thereby spread disease? they may travel by one of several ways. coughs and sneezes which are not protected send germs in a direct spray. kissing also gives germs a direct short trip. a public drinking cup is a favorite means of travel.

water as we find it in nature may have harmful germs in it. if we drink such water without first boiling it, we are giving these germs a free ride into our bodies. milk is the best food there is for us. but if it comes from unhealthy cows in dirty surroundings, or it is handled by people having a communicable disease, it could become a good conveyer of germs. rats and some insects particularly the fly are of great help to germs of certain diseases by carrying them from filth to the food we eat. you see the germs have several ways of traveling from the sick to the well. as individuals and as a community, we can do many things to help this movement of germs

and prevent the spread of disease. a helpful community must have a safe water supply. here we see sedimentation and chlorination, a part of the process of water purification. in rural areas, a sick water supply requirees a properly constructed well, located on higher ground and at a considerable distance from the toilet. the purity of acidic water supply is further protected by the sanitary treatment of sewage. rendering the waste not injurus to health. in rural areas, the problem of disposal of human waste can be the disposal of a proper septic tank. or if this is impractical by

building properly constructed sanitary toilets. care in all steps of handling will help with milk born diseases. cleanliness in the dairy, keeping cows clean and healthy milkers, sterilized buckets and cans so constructed as to keep off dust and flies all help to bring us safe milk so important in our lives. pasturization which does not take the place of all of the

other precautions is one way to make sure that milk is safe. anti-fly measures, particularly in manure places, will help in places where germs travel. tight-fitting screens are effective. not only against flies but also against mosquitos. we can do much to prevent the spread of disease by keeping away if those who are sick. common sense tells us to stay away from indoor crowds whenever communicable diseases are prevalent. always call the doctor early

whenever a communicable disease is suspected. early treatment may lessen the severity of the sickness and halt its further spread. it is the duty of anyone suffering from a contagious disease to remain home until the doctor feels it is safe for him to go out among other people. some diseases such as smallpox, diphtheria and typhoid fever could be wiped out entirely if each and every one of us took advantage of the time proof protection offered by vaccination and preventive inoculation.

one of our best weapons in preventing disease is cleanliness, which is of utmost importance when there is a disease in the house. certainly cleanliness should be observed in all places where food is sold or served. all dishes used by the public should be sterilized.

our hands may pick up germs, the one act of washing hands before going to the toilet and before eating is an invaluable health measure. using plastic cups instead of drinking glasses will help keep down the transmission of disease. we cannot keep all germs from entering bourd peeps but wise old nature placed within us natural forces capable of fighting the invading army of disease. the better the condition of our health, the stronger this last line of defense against the invader. building up this resistance

depends upon a well balanced diet which satisfies all the food requirements of our body. outdoor exercise and the fresh air and sunshine. at least six glasses of water daily. and plenty of rest at least eight hours of sleep every night. every step we take means increased happiness and better living efficiency for all of us.

with live coverage of the u.s. house on c-span and the senate on c-span 2, here on c-span 3 we compliment the coverage by showing you the most relevant hearings and public affairs events. on week ends c-span p is the home to american history tv with programs that tell our nation's story, including six unique series. the civil war's 150th anniversary visiting battle fields and key events. american artifacts, tour museums and historic sites to discover what artifacts reveal about america's past. history bookshelf with the best known american history writers. presidency look at policies and legacies of our nation's commanders in chief. lectures in history with top college professors delving into america a past. and the real series, real america featuring archival

government and films from the 30s to the formal conversation with nbc "nightly news" anchor tom brokaw, expressing his thoughts on today's news media. next, three medal of honor recipients reflect on their service in world war ii, vietnam and afghanistan, at a history convention in annapolis, maryland. the program is approximately an hour and a half. good morning. i'm captain west huey, the director director of the division of leadership education and development, or lead, a rather expedient acronym. it's my honor to welcome you to

this morning's panel discussion entitled beyond the call of duty, a conversation with medal of honor recipients. there will be an opportunity for you to engage our panelists during the q &, portion of the panel. we ask that if you have a question, use the microphones provided or you can just speak loudly from your seat and in that case, we'll have the moderator repeat your question. moderating this morning's panel is dr. joseph j. thomas, retired colonel usmc and professor of education and leadership an established warrior, leader and scholar before retiring from active service and joining the lead faculty in 2005, where he has earned a national reputation for excellence in leadership, education and scholarship, was recently named the honorable j.r. johnson, a one-year

research professor ship to -- dr. thomas will introduce his distinguished anni eed panelist dr. thomas and the other panelists kindly take their seats on the stage, please. welcome to all distinguishested guests, the many people who have traveled a

long way to be with us this morning. especially the mid shipmen, i think i speak for everyone here that this is a truly unique experience and i feel incredibly privileged to be up here on the panel with these three gentlemen. now captain huey mentioned that we both work at the leadership, education and development division and the study of leadership is our calling, an advocation as well as a vocation. but before the study of leadership existed as a stand alone field, there are biographers and historians such as plutarck, behavioral scientists added to although some might claim deluded the analysis of leadership as a component of human -- thomas carlyle himself said that heroism is the divine relation, which at alls unites great

men to others. and heroism, whether in peace or war is the sheet anchor of a people. as psychologists and sociologists have dissected acts of heroism, we have become accustomed to the treatment of heroes and the heroic, not as the culmination of human potential, but as a peculiar phenomenon, a curiousoma anomaly. rather than treat our heroes as an anomaly, the underlying theme of this gathering is to treat them as we all aaspire to be. heroes will be treated as they were traditionally, as exemplars of all we could be. so with that, as an opener, i

propose we do this morning three things, as an opener to this panel. i'm going to present three artifacts, three pieces of evidence that i think will put us all in a mindset to look at heroism, and acts such as these, and traditional view of the culmination of human potential. these are three distinct acts from three separate wars, decades separating them, and three unique individuals who distinguish themselveses all in these acts, but all three i think we'll find are connected to what they represent for the rest of us. culmination of huma potential. exemplars of what we all aspire to be. these three artifacts, these

three pieces evidence. colonel woody williams. for conspicuous gallantry, in action against enemy japanese forces on iwo jima, volcano island, november 20, 1945. quick to volunteer services when our tanks were maneuvering to open a lane for our infantry, through a series of pill boxes, corporate williams went forward alone under devastating machine-gun fire from unyielding positions. covered by only four rifle men, he battled for four hours against enemy fire and returned to his own lines to repair democrat in addition lines. struggling back frequently to the rear of hosti40hostil40host. he -- through the air vent.

kill the occupants and silence the gun. on another grimly charged enemy rifleman, who attempted to stop him with buyon nets and a burst of flame from his weapons. his unyielding determination and extraordinary heroism in the face of ruthless enemy resistance were instrumental in neutralizing one of the japanese strong points and aided in enabling his company to reach its objective. corporate williams fighting spirit and devotion to duty sustained and enhanced the highest traditions of the united states naval service. ladies and gentlemen, corporate woody williams. [ applause ] >> thank you. . >> in the center of the panel today. the technical director of assistance team, headquarters u

u.s. military assistance command vietnam. for cook pi -- while serving as s.e.a.l. advisor, headquartered u.s. assistance -- during the period 10 to 13 april 1972, lieutenant norris k34r50cleetde unprecedented rescue of three downed helicopter mights. lieutenant norris led a five-man patrol through 2,000 meters of heavily controlled enemy territory, located one of the downed pilots at daybreak and returned to the operating base. on the 1th of april, after a devastating mortar attack, lieutenant norris led a thr three-man team for the rescue of the second pilot. a forward air controller located the pilot and notified lieutenant norris. dressed in fishing disguising,

lewis norris and one vietnamese traveled through the night and found the injured pilot at dawn. covering the pilot with vegetation, they began a return journey successfully evading a north vietnamese patrol. they came under heavy machine-gun fire. allowing the rescue party to reach the fob. for his outstanding display of decisive leadership and undaunted courage in the face of extreme danger, lieutenant norris enhanced the united states military. ladies and gentlemen, lieutenant norris. and finally staff sergeant clinton r

clinton third squadron, fourth brigade combat team, fourth enfan try division, combat outpo outpost, afghanistan on october 3, 2009. on that morning, staff management rom me shea, occupying the high ground on all four sides of the complex, with rocket propelled grenades, mortars and small arms fire. the staff sergeant returned under intense enemy fire and seek re-enforcement from the barracks. the staff sergeant took out an enemy machine-gun, and the generator he was using for cover was struck by a rocket propelled grenades. undeterred by his injuries, he continued to fight and relied

upon another soldier to aid him. he rushed through the assembly to -- mobilized a five-man team and returned to the fight equipped with a sniper rifle. with complete disregard to his own safety, he -- confidently throughout the battlefield engaging -- while orchestrating a successful plan, he maintained radio communication at the tactical operations center, as the enemy forces attacked with even greater voracity, he aid identified the poechlt of attack and ordered air support. after receiving reports that woungded soldier -- allowed the injured soldiers to safely reed the aid station. his teams pushed forward 100

meters under overwhelming fire to recover and prevent the enemy fighters from taking the bodies of their fallening comrades. his her-ic -- his extraordinary efforts gave bra voe troop the opportunity to regroup, reorganize and prepare for the count ever attack that allowed to troop to secure combat outpost keating. his extraordinary heroism refle reflect -- fourth brigade combat team, fourth infantry division and the united states army. ladies and gentlemen, stf sergeant clint romeshe. >> it's important to understand

where we'll go with this conversation. i had a friend a few years ago, he was a former a-6 pilot in the marine corps, turned psychologist. he's been teaching at northern state university for a number of years who has written expensively, researched expensively the concept of extreme bravery in combat. his name is terry barrett. using congressional medal of honor recipients as case studies, he tried to draw some themes in preparation of these incredible human beings and the lessons may have or hold for the rest of us. for that dr. barrett's work is backdrop, the first question for the panel. the first question we have is, can you provide us some background about your youth, upbringing, reasons for serving that will help us understand you better. >> do i get the privilege of

going first? >> yes, sir, you do. >> good morning. well, before i answer his question, let me clear up a couple things, i do possess the medal of honor, it's in my other suit. i was at a function in past weekend -- >> just like a marine. >> just like a marine. and we can't depend on the navy to help us when we need help. ouch. anyway. i had a function this past weekend and i had my medal in any coat pocket and i changed suits and it's home. i want to also say that i am rather privileged to be a cherry river admiral.

in west virginia, we have a cherry river admiral association, we have 36 admirals in that oh. -- and i happen to be one of them. i think circumstances have a great deal on what happens to us. i am an american because i was born in america. i'm a west virginia because i was born in west virginia. i was in war because somebody told me somebody was trying to take my freedom.

growing up in the country on a dairy farm, with no military influence in our community at all, seldom ever saw a person in uniform. but we had a couple individuals in the community who didn't like to hull corn and dig potatoes and pitch hay and shuffle cow residue. i cleaned that up for you. so they decided to go into the marine corps. they were not related, they went in at different times, but they went in the marine corps to make a living, because jobs were very difficult to obtain during the depression. their enlistment period was six years, that was the only contract the marine corps had at that time. when they came home on their one

time a year 30-day furlow, they were required to wear their marine corps dress blues. i'm in my early teens, and we kids would get around them and we wanted to be around them because they would tell us fantastic stories about battles and all that stuff, that probably most of it wasn't true. but it was entertaining and interesting to us. and they had to wear their dress blues all the time. that was the only uniform they brought home with them. so somewhere in the recesses of my mind, i must have decided if i have to go to the military, and i have no plan for that all, i'm going to be a farmer for the rest of my life. i'm going to be milking cows the rest of my live.

but somewhere in the recess of my mind, i said, if i ever have to go or do go, i want to be one of them. they became a local model to me, so when we were told in our community, we had no newspaper, very few people had a radio. i had one uncle out of five that had a radio. so the information we got was filtered into us by other people. we're talking about after pearl harbor. we're talking about 1942. somebody was trying to take our freedom. i had never heard of the japanese, certainly i had never seen one. but i decided that's not going to happen to me. or to us. i had a schoolteacher who taught

us very severely that we were americans, we were free, but we were only that because of what others had done for us. somebody had provided that freedom for us, so i'm going into the marine corps to protect america. my concept was that all of us going in from all over wherever they were and i had hardly ever been out of west virginia, that we would all gather in the united states of america and just dare anybody to come to our shores and try to take our country and our freedom. when i finish ed boot camp in sn diego, california, they told me i was going to the south pacific, which i had never even heard tell of, it was quite a

shock. because i thought i would stay right here. just -- they're not going to take my freedom. that was my upbringing and my teacher is the one, not my parents, my teacher was the one that instilled in me my love for my country. and that freedom was one of the most precious possessions we could ever have. never dreaming as i was going through the grades, that we would ever be at war. remember, world war i was supposed to be the war to end all wars. so most of us never thought there would be another. i was in the marine corps

because of circumstances. i'm proud of my service, i'm proud that i am an american. and i'm proud that i could do what i did to keep us a free people. thank you very much. >>. [ applause ] >> i guess its my turn now, i'll try to be a little bit shorter than woody. where i grew up, i grew up at the end of world war ii, my father was in the navy, he served in world war 2. he taught me the values that i grew up with and i lived by. and he taught me respect in the love of this country, and what it stands for. though as i was a child, w