working for former vice president gore. when you look at capitol hill, there are the public statements that i think members feel compelled to say and they're the private sentiments they hold. many of them as you know, they give privately, they donate their time they go to africa. i actually think that beneath the surface, you actually do see movement on some of these issues. i actually do think a visit like this affects their members personally it effects their families. as we get out the primary move to the general election is whether or not we see a softening on some of the flatspointflats flashpoint issues. the primary is when both parties are playing more to the base. and it really won't be, i think, until the general election we'll actually start to see the impact, i think, of a visit like

this. >> i'd like to open it up to questions. i know we have, again -- there's a lot of interest -- we have several issues -- and a lot of them are interconnected as we saw. who is first? >> i under how important is the pope's science background to the development of his ideas? i know he's got degrees in chemistry? >> actually the vatican has held several conferences on science to help educate both the staff. and i think it's very interesting in the encyclical, he speaks to the importance of having a dialogue with science. and, you know, i think there's a misperception sometimes borne

from a lengthy history that the catholic church is somehow hostile towards science. i think that's really an outdated perception. engagement with the scientific community has been very strong, not just on climate change. the encyclical talks about gmo's. in a very nuanced and interesting way that talked about technology. so i'll say two things. first of all, i think it isn't just this pope bumt the catholic church has a strong interest in science. this pope seems to be particularly interested. and in the opening, say, seven or eight pages, he does walk through the history of the commentary in the space which i think is particularly interesting, but he is particularly able to speak to some of this science.

some of the reporting in the u.s. spoke to the fact that the encyclical addresses carbon credits. it wasn't just a science but he was able to speak to the rio convention, carbon credits. even particular policy initiatives that are out there and climate change and genetically modified organisms and else where. i think you'll find it very interesting the level to which they have a grasp and understanding of what's going on internationally and domestically. >> could any of you comment about the significance of the pope's visit to the corrections facility in philadelphia the broader issue he might be focusing on? >> i'm happy to speak about it a bit. it would be more from our point

of view that the pope with that visit and in general the conversation about disparities in america i guess is the way i would speak about it. when we think about that from a poverty standpoint i think the visit is important and important to us for a dialogue. we have invested in at aarp foundation for example a program in la which is important to us. fundamentally it's a food program called la kitchen but its premise is that neither food nor people should go to waste. it's an interesting combination of taking the abundance of fresh food and the growing amount of food waste in the country but of course in la. packaging that in nutritious meals that are available to seniors seniors. that's a multicultural population there. it's combined with a job training program which is for either individuals who have aged out of foster care system and/or

those who have been released from facilities. >> yes, as some of you may know, this is a significant issue in the more general immigration arena. a federal judge about a week or two ago has ordered the release of all mothers and minor children that are being held in detention waiting for their cases to be heard and be assigned, you know, a full hearing at a later date. the detention particularly of unaccompanied minors of children has become a large issue. this continues to be an issue in the next 30 day kz or sos days or so i wouldn't be surprised if the pope would address it. this is a pope that does not hesitate to enter difficult areas and waters. he speaks very frankly very forcefully about these issues.

he has done so in the european parliament. he does so regularly in rome. his first visit was in lampadusa is the place where all the immigrants used to come. they're coming in all sorts of different places in italy. he has spoken directly about the issue of unaccompanied minors how they cross the border how we ought to treat them et cetera et cetera. i wouldn't be surprised if he were to basically develop a narrative that would address the issues more directly than perhaps any other pope might have. >> right here. >>. [ inaudible ] congress is set on these treaty

positions. and that the pope may not be able to change much. let me put a question to you, jason, do you sense any give in congress on any of these three areas that might follow the pope's visit? >> i mean, i don't pretend to know the inner thoughts of -- or which way the speaker or majority leader or minority leader is. the speaker is a catholic. the minority leader is a catholic. nancy pelosi. and they don't put religion into their policy positions. i certainly would say that -- one of the most surprising political developments of the last ten, 15 years that i've witnessed. i've been in washington since 1998 is the rapid evolution on gay marriage. to the point where politically it's almost not an issue any

longer in congress. no member of congress really wants to really talk about it that much anymore because they see where the public is on it. and it is remarkable how quickly congress can change positions on things when they think that the public is getting ahead of them. and in terms of like, where we see the three issues right now. three of the thorniest issues that congress has dealt with in the last couple of generations, immigration, climate change, poverty and income inequality. we're discussing them in congress. but there isn't the impedis for members to talk about this. particularly with immigration. you have probably seen where congress gets very close they may even vote in one chamber overwhelmingly and the moment like just gets away.

and so there are so many variables about the issues that i think that it's -- it will be interesting to see how congress approaches what they -- if they issue policy statements as they're getting toward the end of the year. before the pope's visit and what they say afterward. >> i know this is not related to any of the three issues you've come up with. since the pope is coming from the u.s. in cuba and he played a significant role in releasing allen gross in december and the policy change towards cuba. i'm wondering with all the different bills that are going around in congress to soften or even lift the embargo, do you see the pope bringing up the issue, even if it's behind closed doors and not publicly? how will his role in this engagement between the u.s. and cuba, you know play in his

visit here? thank you. >> first of all, i think the white house would likely welcome his engagement on this issue. i absolutely wouldn't be surprised to see him address it in some form or another. finally, i also think there's more to come from the white house on cuba. i don't think they're done yet announcing joint initiatives there. and on foreign policy, right now, i think two pieces iran and cuba are shaping up to be two of the major pieces of the president's legacy. and so i think anything from their perspective that raises that -- the cuba peace will be welcomed by them. >> i think that that's a very good question. and a very good point you made. i think that we're focusing

perhaps, too much on exactly what the pope will say or not say and how directly or obliquely he may say it or not say it. during the days leading up to the pope's visit, during his visit, and the days after the visit, everybody else will try to use the aura of the pope in order to make statements. so even if the pope does not say the words cuba directly he will probably say something about you know, sort of facilitate in a dialogue and opening up within latin america. after all let's not forget this is a pope that understands, has lived all his life preached became a cardinal in latin america. he has lived with these issues. and the president if nobody else does that the president will speak about the pope's role in the opening toward cuba. i think all of these issues will be put on the table directly or

indirectly. >> i want to add to that great point which is to say -- i'll use an analogy. i don't know how many of you saw the film interstellar. a long complex movie. somebody said what it was about. i said it was about love. that was actually what the film was about. and i think in the end, what the pope would say this visit is about is probably about love. you can read the entire encyclical, and in the end when you look at it it's about interconnectedness and love between people and nature. so that's very tough to cover as a reporter because you can't write a story about love and interconnectedness. but we by our very nature by being washington wanted to cover all the political pieces. but whether it's cuba or something else it will be from his perspective on the interconnectedness and love and peace and joy.

i think you're right. both of my colleagues. i can't speak to your specific question but it goes back to the earlier point about this being the unique moment in time to come together and think about issues broadly around common humanity and sharehead accountability when we look at the issues particularly about lifting people out of poverty. anything we can do to be sure the facts are shared, about the status and disparities across racial and ethnic lines and providing some information on solutions that might work. we all do better when each and every member does a bit better, too. >> if i may, i -- one thing we do keep on coming back to is this pope's ideas about dignity about the essential dignity of human beings. and it's -- it is difficult sometimes, to convey that in a political system that's based on

conflict. i wonder is -- do you have as policy people, do you have advice for other policy people for reporters, for, you know the lay person or observer? how do you both address that this is a political event i mean, he's a head of state. he's going to congress. he's going to the white house. how do you mix those? how do you, you know, make that transition from talking about the politics of it and again our conflict driven political system to this other -- i know, unfortunately, alien concept of dignity and love for other people. >> let me sort of take this on for a second. i think this pope is a globalalist in the most fundamental sense of the word. we know that the catholic church

thinks of itself and is, you know, a universal church. we all understand that. this particular pope speaks very directly about globalization and he speaks repeatedly about globalization. in lampadusa he spoke of the globalization of indifference. and he contrasted that with the globalization with charity and cooperation. so here is one of many, many instances, you know, where the pope wants us to sort of -- wants to push against sort of the frames we think each would discuss policy issues and makes him larger. he borrows language from the university declaration and human rights. he speaks clearly about the application of the refugee convention. these are documents that have been around for 60 65 years.

these are documents that in the united states have restricted use in the universal declaration of human rights. these are the kinds of things he speaks very clearly about. he expects his audiences, you know, since he has a captive audience every time he speaks, he expects people to actually engage. he wants to force people to engage those big issues from a far broader perspective. it goes well beyond catholic teaching, as it were. >> you know, i would agree. and i'm not speaking from a policy standpoint. but i think you're right. just the requirement of a conversation that is a global conversation that could be an opportunity for all of us, is that one needs to know our own place in that dialogue more solidly. the opportunity from my point of

view to speak about where we are at with the issue of hunger and how persistent it and poverty are across all age groups. becomes really important. it allows us to be a smarter participate. as you're saying, this important global dialogue. solving for hunger requires we solve it here, not just for children, but also for older americans. and that we solve this when we think about the interconnectedness of food chain around the world. i think it's an opportunity. it's also an opportunity for us to in the face of our conversation about what doesn't work to talk about programs that are supported by the government that do work, like the w i c programs and s.n.a.p. program. they are anti-poverty programs that have worked over time and bolster our sense that hunger is a public health issue. they highlight for us when we don't have adequate accessible nutrition, how difficult it is

for young people and also -- young people to participate and be educated as fully as they need to be to be successful. and for older americans without proper nutrition to become so ill with chronic diseases that, too, no longer can live their best lives. we're in a aging society where there will be many, many more older americans. the good news is we'll live longer. if you're in difficulty that can be challenging news as well mpts i do see this as a time to broaden our position in order to engage in the global conversation. >> i'll add to that by saying that the pope as a globalalist comes with ratifying a treaty is a big thing. we have the iran package before us. we also have the asian trade deal and the paris climate summit coming up at the end of the year. it's very difficult to muster 67

votes in the senate to give advice and consent to a treaty. at the same time, we have institutions that are aging the un, world bank, and the rise of counterinstitutions like the asian infrastructure bank and the question about the u.s.'s role in the world and whether americans should continue to run these institutions and how these elections happen and whether the -- how the chinese indians want to play and the fact the indian population will be that than china ten years earlier than thought. the pope comes in as a global leader as an embodiment of some of the change that's happening. in the u.s. we have a struggle between parochialism and globalalist. we had the reaction to the job losses from nafta, you can argue about when they caused them but there's a sense in the united

states that it did and the reaction against it. he comes in as someone who is engaging us as a global player. we are a global leader. but we're having difficulty even renewing the xm bank. so i think that is a fundamental undercurrent and challenge as we look at this through a political frame to say how are we looking at all of these thing? we have world bank, trade deals international treaties that we are having difficulty getting through our congress because we have the parochial versus global struggle. he is going to engage at this very broad level because the catholic church -- all of the growth is in the global self. we are struggling with that as a country. you see the backlash and struggle we're having with our changes of multiculture society. when whites become a minority in this country.

he comes in at this fascinating cross current in the middle of an election to indirectly in some ways -- he is the embodiment of globalism. he doesn't have to say it he is by virtue of being there. that will have the long term undercurrent and ripple effects that are very difficult to see right now. but you can look at it through whatever lens of whatever beat you're covering to see how the struggle is playing itself out now on so many issues on capitol hill. not just ours, but others as well. >> let me add one point if i might while you're thinking of your next question. the timing of his visit may be unfortunate, precisely for the reasons that kelly mentioned. in order we'll be in the midst about the argument about iran. we'll have to pass budgets. we know we won't. but, you know, none the less you know we will try to do

something or whatever. and so unless you folks begin to write about folks with -- in the next week and keep pestering your editors, you should have an article in each one of your outlets for whatever the next 30 or 40 days. it's entirely possible that the other issues that will simply be fuelling the fires of arguments of disagreements in washington may not allow the pope's message and his activities on immigration or climate or poverty and all that. and may make it -- you know, something that may disappear from the headlines within a day or two or three of his visit in washington. now, in philadelphia, the local papers and new york, don't

forget he's going to be doing and talking about all of these issues in several places. in new york he will be meeting with immigrant families. in philadelphia he will be dedicating a speech in independence square on immigration. this way people can pay more attention. but will his message be able to cut through the din of the arguments in washington? i donot know. >> this is yus an aside. i was thinking about when you were asking the question -- the question was asked about timing. the pope's visit is sort of the third and fourth week of the month. and s.n.a.p. benefits for individuals and families tend to run out by the end of the third week in the month. that's an interesting it is.

he will be here during the week of each month that is the most challenging for food insecure and/or hungry people. >> i'd like to ask each one of you to describe online resources where journalists can get data and statistics on your particular area of expertise? >> i can start. i brought literature sitting there in the front of the room. people will tell you. that is the legitimate and the authoritiative sources statistics and analysis. this is not what we say this is what others say. we have an amazing very interactive, very up to date website where you can get everything that you need to get on this particular issue. >> in addition to downloading

the encyclical which you can google and have it on your ipad, i'd recommend climate.gov which is the u.s. government site. it's good in general and they have photos and publicly sourced materials that you can use without having to get a bunch of information. i'd recommend -- i brought this because i happened to get it in the mail. national geographic has a cover about the pope francis visit which i thought was informative. and then climate nexus, which is a nexus climate nexus has a ton of sources on climate change which i think are quite useful. >> you can certainly go to aarp.org and aarpfoundation.org. you can find quite a few studies. on aarp functions we found

statistics on older americans as well as a recent story on baby boomers and beyond. facing hunger after 50. on our site you can find links to a number of important research reports on poverty and also on hunger more specifically. >> i might add, also, that with roll call, we definitely tend to focus on congress and more of the day-to-day policy and political fights. we have written about some of the issues. we will have our reporters on the climate change announcement today. we have the issues that make up the side things we've talked about a little bit. particularly the opening of the cuban embassy here in washington. several members of congress have said they -- particularly in the senate are going to do everything they can to block the confirmation of an ambassador to cuba. so, i mean these issues are --

they're things we deal with at roll call, a lot at rollcall.com. any questions? >> i wonder, will the pope's visit help to engage the u.s. catholic population, which is an enormous population in some of these political issues? and for each of you, are there activists for your issues who are actively working to engage that population to try to extend the impact of the visit? >> any order? >> please. >> very much so. there are probably around 75, 76 million catholics in the united states today. about 48%, 50% 52% of the

people that are here but born else where that include legally present, u.s. citizens, but born outside of the country like myself. they include people who are legally here and they're lawful permanent residents, people with green cards. they also include about 26% 27%, 28% of the total foreign born population that are here illegally. more than 50% of them are catholic. so the growth of immigration both legal and illegal immigration has created the growth of the catholic faith in the united states. if you don't mind i'll stay on this for another minute or so. i -- i don't push my cv because it was such a long time ago was

the senior advisor to the catholic bishops on immigration about 30 years ago. '84, '85 perhaps. this was the periods of time when we tried to kill each other when it came to immigration. we passed bills in 1986. two things that i remember distinctly because i want to contrast them with where the catholic church in america is today. the most difficult thing that i had to do was persuade senior bishops, cardinals to actually go to congress and testify or to make any public statements. or to pick up the telephone and talk to powerful people. they didn't want to touch the issue. the issue was too radioactive.

so everything that we did at that point -- and the second problem was the bureaucracy within the catholic conference. you know there was a -- they were reluctant to touch difficult issues as the senior people in the church were. contrast that 30 years later where now you can get any cardinal to speak on the issue, to sign statements, to go up on the hill and testify. to go up on the hill and meet with leaders up on the hill. so these folks coming to the united states at a point when the senior leadership of the church bishop and above are extremely active. extremely engaged. and address the issues as a matter of course. with statements, testimony, and with homilies in the churches at the local level.

i expect that this will intensify in the days leading up to the pope's visit. and here we may have a significant comet's tail two, three four months after the pope's visit. catholics are engaged. the leadership is engaged. the big question is the question that we all opened up with will this make a difference. i don't have a crystal ball today. it was too big to carry. >> two interesting pieces to your question. i think first i think when we talk about the issues as political, we tend to lump americans together as if they're a blob. and i think that's a mistake. many of these issues, the silent generation and the baby boomers actually see these issue husband differently than millennials. so i would just urge us when we

say it's political or con contentious i'd urge us not to see 350 million people as the same because they're not. we see that on gay marriage and climate as well. for example on climate science if you look at an 80-year-old voter and a 25-year-old voter and they are absolutely not the same. in the climate profile. so i would just start by saying i think it's a real mistake to think that somehow an 80-year-old and 20-year-old are the same on climate change because they're not. young people have grown up with ap environmental science. they didn't even have that when i was young and i'm 44. i took ap biology. environmental science is taught in schools as an advanced placement stage. i think it's easy to say these

are political. but, really, they are perceived differently amongst generations. i'd urge you to -- if you're covering them to dive into it. one of the reasons you're seeing the sea change politically is that there's a buildup of young people in political powerogenics. where tiny generations were trying to make a difference. but the millennials are the wave that's coming behind the boomers. the second thing i'll say is, yes, i think you can easily look and see that the environmental community is doing a lot to organize. by and large their member profiles are coastal. most of their members are found on both coasts. i happen to be in a meeting the other day. they were talking about how many members they had in the state of wyoming, and i think it was ten. what you find is that most of their members are in coastal areas. i honestly believe what was just

showed as the most important. catholics are geographically dispersed throughout the country. what the environmental group does organizes around this. in a way it's different and smaller than what the catholic church can do in terms of the long comet's tail that was just described. because it reaches a whole different set of people and in a entirely different way. i'll explain that by virtue of saying this, i was really touched when i read the encyclical because it talked about life. and, you know, many environmentalists when they read it, the church has a position on life that goes from conception throughout life and opposed to death penalty. and it touched me in a way that i was really surprised by as someone who has, you know, been prochoice all her life.

and i really think that this pope and the church has a way of reaching people that is very very different than what any single interest group or linked up set of interest groups can do. so i do think that organizing is extremely important. but it is fundamentally different than what the catholic church does. i mean, the encyclical and these materials go out to every catholic school. you have church groups. it's just fundamentally different than what you and we understand advocacy groups are capable of doing in terms of reaching communities and children and people at all age groups. i guess i would say that's what i would focus on is that this is just different than what we in washington understand to be as post' post card campaigns and robo

calls to congress. it's fundamentally different. >> i would add a couple of things. to your question, i think -- i'll get to what we might specifically do. but i do believe that people across the nation care that 45 million americans live in poverty. they care that 20% are children. 27% are african-american. and that the poverty rate among hispanics is 23%. you're raising the point that generations are different. what we've seen at aarp foundation is that the intergenerational connections are really, really strong. and so anything we can do to bridge those dialogues, we have a program at the foundation called mentor up where young people across the nation ages 15 through college are taking on the challenge to help low income seniors, people who are 50 and older. we are growing the chapters in schools and colleges. and there's a keen interest. which i think is though there

are differences, that, to me is hopeful. not only about the dialogue but also about the actions. the intergenerational connection. it will be interesting to see whether or not and how colleges and universities and schools take on this public dialogue. you know beyond catholics that you were asking about, sets a platform that the schools are opening right in advance of this verify. at the foundation though we didn't connect it directly. it's important to us that the national day of service is just two weeks before the pope's visit. so on 9/11 aarp foundation is hosting a national day of service on the mall. where we hope to have really the largest event on the mall for service. we'll be coming together with an intergenerational corp of volunteers. about 6,000 volunteers to pack

and deliver 1 ..2 million meals to those who are hungry in maryland, virginia and d.c. with a high percentage of those being 50 and older. it's an opportunity for us in advance of the visit to call to the forefront all the issues that are faced for older people who live in poverty. >> if i may add, this generation -- or intergenerational set of activities are extremely important. i recall -- this is in a sense motivated from jason's point. he was talking about you know, what may or may not happen and how surprised i think we all were at the speed with which the issue about gay marriage and all that became a non-issue. i suspect that you know, ten years ago the conversation was about generational conflict. i don't believe i've seen this you know anywhere in newspapers or anything like that. you know for a number of years

now. you know this issue seems to have crested. now it's the intergenerational conversations. throughout campuses on american colleges, people get credit, people are volunteering to help very old people immigrants or not negotiate life in their 70s and 80s. fantastic initiatives that are taking place from temple university all the way to the universities in california. and in the case of climate change, unlike immigration where analysts pretend that, you know, the economics are clear, the effects are clear, et cetera and they're anything but clear, it's clear when it comes you know, to -- you only have to overcome the -- only, i don't mean to downplay it. you only have to overcome sort

of the politics and perhaps a bit of the economics. so i wouldn't be surprised if three years from now i don't know, what -- how much the pope may have contributed to it. we reach some sort of accommodation where we start taking steps that include slative legislative steps. on the issue of immigration i would be reallyneither surprised or anything else if somehow people started to put together piece piecemeal pieces of legislation. in order for that to happen -- if the pope's visit becomes a catalyst, perhaps the catalyst on this, i wouldn't be surprised to see it happen. as long as there is trust, you know, between the democrats and the republicans. or the administration and the congress. that's where we're missing more than anything else on the issue

of immigration. lack of trust. so for people who talk about small pieces of legislation, this way they can build up to resolving some of these issues. those small pieces of legislation can only be allowed to pass by either party if they can trust the other party that they're going to keep their word as to what the next step will be. that's a difficult issue in washington on immigration at this time. >> yes, in the back? >> follow up, you said earlier the big question is will the pope's speech matter. i think the closest parallel although not a perfect one was his speech in 2014 to the european parliament. did that speech move the needle in any discernible way? >> it certainly did. we're not talking about outcomes now. we're talking about you know, the european commission, truly engaged in the issue. now, there have been all sorts of outside forces particularly

people dying, particularly people dying in large numbers that have also contributed to this. the european commission has made more progress in the past four months since march, whatever it is than it did in the last ten years. member states are extremely uneven. take the case of germany, you know, not particularly in washington, the parochialism and the sort of not caring about knowing what other countries are doing. the sense of germany when i give lectures is these are the bad germans that don't like immigrants. the chairman took well over 200,000 isi 200,000 asylum immigrants. that's an amazing number. can you imagine what would

happen, all of them uninvited in a sense they're parachutding in or coming through all sorts of different waywise in germany. germany is a quarter of the size of the united states. that would be equivalent to two million illegal immigrants in a single year all of whom we would try to adjudicate the cases, et cetera et cetera. it's a remarkable change. on the other hand you have spain that in some of the eastern european countries that refuse to take any if they can help it. austria saying we're not going to adjudicate a single you know asylum claim this year. hungary putting a border four meters high, 12 13 feet with all sorts of concertina wire. people, they're trying to put five meter high. in other words the european member states' responses are all over the place. the european commission with

whatever authority has and it's a questionable authority has been making progress. it's been fairly consistent in trying to make -- to try to figure out what to do about all of this. unfortunately, they're focusing on the short term kinds of things, what do you do to encounter people in the medterrainian. the pope has spoken about the medterrain medterrain mediterranean not becoming a grave yard. there's a sense of what is going on, but the question is how do you keep people protected, fed, creating opportunities for them, you know learning -- in other words studying et cetera et cetera in the places near where the major four million people have left syria. what do you do about jordan and lebanon and turkey? that has taken virtually all of those four million people.

these are hard issues. the united states has to engage with europe on this. but we won't until europe puts some skin in the game. they have to do something. they have to really show that they want to do something and they have a plan. then they can ask us to participate in that. >> i can't help but think you'll see some of these issues really play out on the campaign trail. we have the first republican presidential debate on thursday. the republican front runner donald trump has made it the center piece of his campaign building a wall which is you know, he's a real estate developer to forward. but these issues are going to come up again and again. particularly in immigration because some of the principal rivals for the republican nomination, somebody like jeb

bush who has stated over the course of his career that this is an issue that the country has to deal with in a mature manner. another front runner, marco rubio is also -- he was one of the key players in immigration debates in 2007 in particular and recently a couple of years ago. so this issue whether all of the candidates want to deal with it or not, the issue will come up. it's a fascinating time that's coming up about a month, month and a half out. before the pope's visit. other questions? do you have anything for sort of as last thing that we didn't cover? something about the topic, like one last thing you'd like to leave our audience with? >> human trafficking.

this is the topic of every conversation and none of the things that we don't like immigration can happen without facilitation industry. these are profiteers sind sinddicates. they aren't large enough. it's sort of like the markxist cells. small operations you don't know who the next operator is. make a ridiculous amount of money. and they incur none of the consequences of illegal movement. the people die, get raped, get trafficked, get beat up, die, et cetera et cetera. all of the costs have been pushed back by a country, you know, when they get to europe, they get pushed back. all of the costs accrue to the

individual. all of the fruits of the process accrue to the traffickers. so the pope has spoken repeatedly and clearly about human trafficking. he has aligned with other faith leaders -- i'm sorry you'll have to look up who the other faith leaders are -- an agreement that they will work together. faith leaders to eliminate human trafficking by the year 2020. we know that these are not realistic kinds of things. again, moral authority shining the light on one of the ugliest parts of these unwanted mass unregulated migration is extremely important. they have called it -- he has called it repeatedly as a crime against humanity. don't be surprised if he speaks in the context of some of the unaccompanied minors trying to

get it to the united states and what happens to them afterwards if he always says something about the facilitators of this movement in human traffickers. then, you know the other thing -- here, it's -- if you will allow me just an observation for 30 seconds this pope has spoken clearly about the complicity of all of us in this illegal immigration game. by focusing on the fact that we benefit from the presence of illegal immigrants. this is something, you know, that the church and most polite conversations don't really include, you know, when talking about illegal immigration. and he really has focus is eloquent. there's lot of paragraph issue if you just google it. i don't want to read a paragraph here. i'm not going to read it for you. basically saying we all benefit

from their labor. taking advantage of their presence. we discriminate against them, et cetera, et cetera. but we bear some significant responsibility for what is going on when illegal immigrants make and stay in our country. it's very significant. >> i wouldn't underestimate that pope francis took his name from st. francis of assisi. it is so interesting about him as a person. the second is that this is a pope who doesn't see the bifurcation that many of us see between poverty and the environment. this is something he comes to seeing both of these things as interwoven and interlinked.

the third thing i'll say is this idea of a pope as a globalist. he talks about the one-dimensionist technocratic paradigm, which may describe d.c. in a nutshell. finally, i'll say this, he talks quite a bit about the desert of the mind and he had a comment in there that we feel free as long as we have the supposed freedom to consume. so i'll leave it with this, my remarks, that when he talks about spiritual fulfillment, i think he feels there's been a confusion in society and each of us as individuals have a role to play in our community all the way up to the global. and that permeates all the issues we have spoken about

today. so when he talks about less is more and humility and gratitude these are -- we don't necessarily look at these as traits in washington that are often common as we work in a combative environment. but i think he is hoping to take us out of the sort of culture of relativism and to bring this holistic approach across these issues to washington and appeal to a higher plane within us whether catholic christian or a secularist, so that we can understand on a higher level. >> i agree and support what my colleagues have said. he really believes in looking at

anti-poverty work we need whole person solutions. i wrap up saying something else that's important to know, we talked about many nations around the globe that hunger in america is far worse than in any other western industrialized country. so that's important to know. and then i would wrap up by saying my mind is always this notion that americans -- seniors who are hungry in america are often too embarrassed to ask for the help that they need. to have the nutrition they need. to have productive and healthy lives. imagine in a land of our abundance that one in six americans across all ages is hungry each and every day. so i would say that the embarrassment is really shared. it belongs the all of us. >> and the pope has also talked about technology as a destroyer

of jobs. and the root of unemployment. you see the link between that and people having no choice, the lesser of two evils. but try to emigrate in order to survive. you know, this is a -- whatever you call the pope. the pontiff who works all of these issues at many different levels and unifies them. this is an intelligent person who is committed to the things that my colleagues have discussed and i have discussed. that he is willing to see the connections to go beyond sort of like the first order surface kinds of things and think second order and think about second order and third order relationships. this will be fascinating. i don't know how you put everything in a speech or series

of speeches and analyze it. i look forward to what he will say. >> we will drill down in a way that we often don't get to in the course of our daily lives. one thing that will be a nice segue talking to our next panel a panel of reporters and editors about some of these -- who cover some of the same topics is that washington tends to go to sleep in august. this is like our hibernation time. congress leaves and different people go on vacation. it's got its own rhythm. it is a time that is right for deeply reported, well thought out stories about things like this. i can't remember seeing anything that has the sort of potential in terms of a policy or a

cultural event in several years in my time in washington. and it's a great opportunity. i mean, i know some of you, the reporters here. and people from pbs, cox media. we have washington reporters from allentown and pittsburgh. these topics, the catholic population is disbursed through the the country. it's not a by coastal group, like a lot of the environmental groups, as kaley was saying. they are hungry, your readers will be hungry for stories about this. and in august they will actually have time to read them. i think this is a good transition. thank you again. >> thank you jason. >> demetrius kaley lisa. appreciate it. [ applause ].

tomorrow the senate banking committee holds a committee on the senate banking committee. you can see live coverage here on c-span3 tomorrow morning at 10:00 eastern. president obama goes to american university here in washington, d.c. tomorrow to talk about the iran nuclear agreement. he's expected to counter criticism of the deal and explain why congress shouldn't block it. c-span will have coverage tomorrow morning at 11:20 eastern. sunday night on q&a, former emergency manager of detroit kevin orr talks about his job overseeing the largest municipal bankruptcy in u.s. history. >> if detroit had taken that $1.5 billion that it borrowed in

2005 and 2006 when the stock market went down to 6,700 and if it had just invested in a dow jones index, standard & poor's, it is trading 18,000 three times what it was. they not only would have tripled their money, they could have paid the pensions in full and got back to declaring the 13th check. you've to be a practice of giving pensioners a 13th check at the end of the year in addition to the 12 they're due. so it could have fixed itself if there had been some sort of sober management going forward. just like any company, if you have strong leadership you can solve these problems but it takes a lot of effort. >> sunday night on c-span's q&a. when the senate takes its august break we will feature book tv programming week nights and primetime on c-span2 beginning at 8:00 eastern. and at the end of the summer,

look for two book tv special programs. saturday, september 5th, live from our nation's capital for the 15th annual national book festival. followed on sunday with our live in-depth program with former second lady and senior fellow at the american enterprise institute lynne cheney. television for serious readers. next remarks from carol fols, chance hrar from the university of north carolina chapel hill. this is an hour. our government today is carol folt chancellor of the university of north carolina chapel hill. a nationwide search following the resignation of the former chancellor amid a scandal that put the schools accreditation and ncaa standing at risk. an investigation found that about 3,000 students, many athletes, took sham classes over

two decades and received grades not based on academic performance. they instituted some 70 reforms. nonetheless, the accrediting body initiated inquiries. sanctions are not out of the question. and unc, instituted the carolina covenants, a program that awards low income students a combination of grants,

scholarships and work/opportunities to avoid student loans and graduate debt free. today our speaker will address the importance of preserving access to an affordable college education. please give me in giving a warm welcome to chancellor carol folts. >> thank you for introducing me. it's such a pleasure to be here. i'm looking forward to this and also your questions. be sure to put down a lot of good ones. i have to tell you i wouldn't have any other job in america. yes, chapel hill people! >> [ applause ]. >> if you're interested in higher education i think this is the best time to be a president or a chancellor in higher education in america.

what happens in higher education is so important for the nation. our business is a very serious one. people take it very seriously. we have a huge impact on the individuals of the nation. it is a time when we have the opportunity to shepherd in the great changes taking place. so it's a real pleasure to be here. carolina itself has a bigfoot print. it was the first to graduate -- the only public university to graduate students in the 1700s. and it has an extremely proud legacy. and we are as proud of what we're doing to get past these issues that you raised. we're very very proud of what we're trying to do. i will say working in higher education, the new normal is to be facing some of the greatest issues of the day.

we are trying to deal with sexual assault. we are all trying to help that country understand the value proposition of higher education. these are the issues that we face. these are the issues that those of you in the press cover all the time. so i think it's really important that we have these conversations. it's exciting to be at the kick-off of the month of august speaking to you today particularly about the importance of preserving affordability, accessibility, and attainment in a great college degree. i would also like to thank the national press club members, everyone at the head table. mary cooper will be our speaker. first time to have a graduate speak. welcome. it's wonderful all of you here. we have members from the north carolina delegation. staffs are here. thank you all for coming.

of course carolina alumni, thank you for being here. >> i thought i would start by giving an overview of what the university of north carolina chapel hill is. we rarely understand what's going on in a university. it's good to know what are we trying to bring our students into. unc or we call it carolina has a budget between $4 billion and $6 billion a year. it depends whether i'm including our hospitals or not. so it's a major enterprise. it has more than a $3 billion endowment. we raise a lot of money through philanthropy. that is in a single year. that happens to be carolina's best year ever in philanthropy. so our alums are absolutely sticking with us through the times of trial. and i think that makes a really great statement.

we also get a lot of money from research. carolina has been increasing its research portfolio. almost a billion dollars in research. that's mostly washington based federal funding from the nih. it's the top seventh in nih. this is a huge investment in research that will save lives and change the world. we bring in more than $7 billion estimated in revenue to the state. more than $10,000 people employed in various aspects of our institution. we have more than 33,000 applications for less than 4,000 entry positions. and top 10 top one programs in so many fields from medicine global health, pharmacy humanities, social sciences. and i think one of the points i want to make is accessibility and affordability, especially of low income first generation should get them to the best

universities in america. i think that's really important that we consider that part of that mission. it's important that they come in and understand what's happening in the world. we just recently had a number of stories you probably read about in the paper. historic partnership with gsk for chapel hill to solve aids. that program is going to have a number of under graduates that will be working in it. we have a population center that got $185 million grant from usaid, the largest grant in history last year to basically look at the metrics for global health and gender relations throughout the world. we received a $100 million gift to build entrepreneurial through pharmacy. this is what we want students to learn about as they are going to college. so exactly two weeks from today hard to believe classes are going to begin at carolina. it's clearly one of the best times of the year.

you just can't beat the buzz that happens on the campus. it wakes up. it's exciting. there are people every place. and it is a school where people smile and they sing as they walk along. i think it's the light blue. that helps. it is really exciting. but they also are scared to death. this is a big deal. they're coming to college. and it is our job when they come to make sure they can be successful. i think that's a part of everything we've got to think about doing. for many of them at carolina it's over 20%. they will be the first generation to attend university. we're really proud of that. that's so important. more than 14% of them are going to come from the lowest income families, median incomes on of $22,000 or $23,000 a year. we will have students coming from all reigns of the socioeconomic across the

country. but that's what that place feels like. i tell students at the start of the year to try to remember the magical feeling they feel on that very first day. that anything is possible. whatever they want is what they are going to really be able to find their work to do. and i think that's my message always to them. feel as good on the second day as you did on the first. or remember that there is no limit. of course that first day on august 18th between that day, there is another important day on the calendar. that's friday, august 7th. tuition bills are due. i don't know how many of you have students going to college right now. how many in here have students paying tuition bills? okay. well, i'm going to give you a number i think will shock most people. the tuition at unc chapel hill is about $8,300. it is among the lowest tuitions in the country and among the top peer institutions peers in

public universities. it's at the bottom. we have very low tuition. the debt for students at north carolina has not changed in inflation scaled dollars for more than 15 years. so this is going to be a story about things that do work to try to do it. and i think it's really important because we have to understand how to scale the parts of our institutions that are working to be more effective. we have about 20,000 under graduates. and of those 43%, even with that tuition, will receive a form of need-based aid. so there is still great need out there. the median income in north carolina is less than $50,000 a year. so this can still be an important part of their experience. north carolina is one of possibly two public universities that still is need blind. which means we don't consider patient income in the application and the only one

that meets full need, which means after they fill out their equations, we cover the rest of that need. this is aoeenormously important to obtain a degree. students at carolina the start of the academic year is of great excitement. less than half will be going to college. they don't have that same sense of optimism. many self-select and think they aren't going to be able to do it. they're fearful they won't be able to afford it. and they're afraid to assume a debt load that they think they will never be able to pay. new data show that the average grad -- debt at graduation is about $35,000 for students who do go to college. at carolina it's $17,000. so again keeping those costs low is a way to really help attract capability students to try.

it's very important. if you look at the united states statistics, we have about 3.2 million students graduating from high school. about 1.8 million of them will apply to a four-year university. but in the end, only about 900 million of them are going to graduate. so that means about 2.3 million of our graduates right now high school kids that could do anything that are the town pool of america, aren't even making it into college. more than 50% are on average not graduating. so there's a lot of work here. many students who start don't finish. it's known to be a very negative cycle for them. we also know that educational attainment is one of the most prominent determine ant. it reinforces the socioeconomic gaps, the disparities i know

everyone wishes we could eliminate. applications are going down. at the very moment when we know the skills of college are more valuable. no matter what you read, we know the lifetime earnings of someone with a college degree are considerably greater. we know the new knowledge economy, the one bursting and growing, the one the country wants to compete in is requiring the skills of a college graduate. and it's not just their stem skills and their programming. it's their writing skills. it's their critical thinking. it's their problem-solving. without those, we will not bring the 2.3 million high school students every year back to be part of a flourishing national economy. so we know we have to do it. and i'm going to give you some examples of ways i think it's working well at unc. things i think can be scaled. first of all, you have to build universities that draw in the

talent of people from all incomes and all backgrounds. if you are self-selecting for weight, you're going to get it. but that's hard. most schools in the last five years when we had the pooling of funds from the state most dropped their need-behind commissions programs. they couldn't believe they could afford it. we need to know we can get them directly into the fields that contribute to the knowledge economy to they can be part of that burgeoning growth area. we know it is a world of change. if we are not getting students into programs that teach people change i don't believe you want to put people into single skill programs. everybody knows the skill today will probably not even going to be the business hiring in five years. it is our job to be training them to get the diverse skills of the multi-faceted learner. so our universities have to be

the catalyst the place where we nurture this type of opportunity. if we aren't, we have to get on the ball fast. that's 3.2 million students a year that could be going where we want to go. the hamilton project released a report that showed that family income is maybe the strongest predictor of graduation rate. that is a very sad statistic. because they can even control for s.a.t. and other levels of attainment. so that is something we are constantly trying to think about. the likelihood of a student from high income bracket graduating is five times greater than students from the lowest income bracket, all other things being equal. so these disparities are growing and they play out even more in under represented populations.

the trends are even greater. i have spent my whole life in higher ed wanting to fight these trends. i have actually found that southern part of heaven in north carolina. because i actually was able to come to the public university that really is doing this in such a deep and strong way. 14 times kiplinger named carolina the best value in american public universities. "new york times" recently ranked carolina the third most economically diverse top universities. and to be on that list you had to have graduation rates above 70%. ours are much higher than that. only three public universities were on the list. yet public universities educate more than 70% of students in america. so i'm proud of what we accomplished. i'm going to use some examples. that doesn't mean it's all right. we have a ways to go. how did carolina get here? you have to go back to 1789.

i won't make you go that far back with me. when carolina began as a great experiment. it came out of the revolutionary war. it was an idea if we're going to have freedom, we better have education. it was actually founded the same time we had our first president was inaugurated. it said we were going to give education to improve the life of new york carolyn yanns at the lowest price practicalable. the first student walked 133 miles to get to that university. but we still pride ourselves to reaching out to everybody in the community, not only in the state but across the country. and bringing people from every kind of means to the university. how do we do it? well, it's important that we think i have to start by saying we do it in part because we still have a very generous state. north carolina is still supported well.

we have had more than 30% cuts in the last five years. but we are still generously supported. that is important. all of the future has to find a way to continue to get some public dollars. if we care about this, public dollars are going to be important. even though we supplement with philanthropy and other saturdays sorts of ideas. that is a real advantage for us. americans have a $1 trillion national student debt. they see tuition rising. so we have to be able to counter that. we have low tuition. that helps counter that. but to keep our tuition low, we have to make choices all the time. and some of those are not fun, are not very -- they hurt. in fact, we haven't been able to give faculty raise to the level we would like. yet faculty is bring anything a billion dollars in research. it is a very competitive environment. you're dealing in your university with very tough decisions because this accessibility and affordability

is probably at the heart of everything that still tends to be our default position. but it won't exist if we don't continue to have that great faculty. so with affordability, keeping tuition and debt low is a top priority for us. so is need blind and meeting the demonstrated need. and i think those i'll come back to in a minute with an example from the carolina covenant. how that has had a huge influence on student success. and i'll come back to that. accessibility has been the next part. that means we do a lot of action going out and going into all 100 counties. carolina still has almost 82% of the undergraduates come from the state of north carolina. so that covenant with the state has been very important. i think that's why the state still supports that at such a high level. that's a very strong relationship. lots of international students at the graduate level. very global campus. but that's important.

we have also developed a lot of programs to go right out into high school. if you want to solve these problems, you can't start with the applicant. you need to get into the high schools. i'll give a clear example of that in a moment. you also have to focus when they're on campus very much on the advising especially what take place in the first year. and if you don't put the money into that first year and the money into getting them ready no matter how much money you spent on getting them to start, they aren't going to be successful. the third area we do is try to make sure that we're doing it in an institution that is still at the highest level of excellence. i don't believe affordability and accessibility without strength of program means much. i don't think low income students should be put in less than great education. i think that's completely unfair. and i think you need these three working together to really solve these problems. our graduation rates are 80% at four years and over 90% at six years.

putting carolina right up there with the best of the privates. and when a student is accepted to a school where they believe they are going to graduate, there is a lot of information coming out. some good data i think you collected that shows believing in them investing in them is a major factor that will determine their success. you heard a little bit about the carolina covenant. that's this program that brings students in from very low income. the big thing about that program, not only do we work to get them in, they graduate with no loan. and they do work study, they get grants. but that complete belief in those students has been so important. the program began in 2006. looking at students from the exact same income and similar numbers and comparing graduation rates preand post covenant it's been extraordinary. precovenant low income students in that program graduated at best at 57%.

african-american males were graduating down in the 30%. since the covenant has been in, the entire program's average of graduation rate is just 3% lower than that 80%. it has skyrocketed. and the african-american males has doubled. so this investment and the advising that goes along with it is very important. i could tell you stories of students. they come in with extraordinary records. their average gpa coming in is over 4.0. they are very talented students. yet they have families back home that need them. they don't have the advising. and they frequently lack the confident. we have so many who say i'm going to drop out. yet if they get that advising they stick with it. the stories are amazing. i met three covenant scholars recently. all three told me stories about their lives. and two of them graduated had great jobs. one already bought a house. two of them were putting their mothers through college.

because their mothers had been so instrumental in what they were doing. so these pay forward for society in an incredible way. we also have programs that reach directly into the high schools. in north carolina, the low income high schools, about 65 of them, we are part of a program called the carolina advising core. it is probably one of the best programs in america right now. it started in virginia and was housed at unc and now has branched out. they take recent graduates, the most dedicated students you could ever meet, and put them into high schools. we're in 65 of the 90 poorest schools in north carolina right now. the time in those schools that can be given to any student that wants to apply to college, can you gu spend talk to go them about college? less than five minutes a year. they don't have parents, families people to get them

in -- they can't possibly do it. since they have gone in with the advising program they have seen application rates about 12% to 15% just in the first couple of years. i went to one of them and i talked to the students there. a number of them will go to junior college. and another from junior college to carolina. i went as a junior college as part of my own background. i had no idea how meaningful that would be. the students had a couple on tape afterwards and said the chancellor at unc went to junior college. so i don't think we can underestimate how few touches can have such an impact. the students come in and get that advising with a young, amazing north carolina graduate. and it just changes the world. then we built another program to work with the junior colleges and carolina in about the last six years started to really can admit students. if they get selected in their

first year and they achieve a certain level of success first of all, they graduate from the two-year school. and the graduation rates are extremely low. they get automatic guarantee to get into unc chapel hill. it has been phenomenal. and if you meet some of those students, you would be blown away. one of them i met grew up in nigeria from a very poor family, war-torn area. saw is a poster of unc and dreamed about being at unc. how she ever made it i can't tell you. went to unc, head of her class in nursing, going to medical school. so we have to keep remembering not all students will do the traditional path. but if we're going to make accessibility, affordability the brand for our nation, we need to do this. we need to start before. we need to give the support they need. we need the advising on the ground. and we need to continue to draw from such a broad range that we

don't miss so many students who are out there. if we start doing that and we have programs that can help universities do this and we have programs that can do it in places where graduation is what they do, i think we have a real chance to change things in the next three to five years. so i look at what's happening in the news right now. and i hope you'll ask me a lot of questions on any of these subjects. how are we going to make the dream of higher education really the dream of this country and reverse the trend that really has been taking over our nation fewer people applying higher sent. i hope in the next decade we really do achieve that. i wouldn't be standing here if i didn't go to college and work as a waitress and pay my way through college. i did it years ago. couldn't be done now. i wanted to make sure all the other people like me and probably like you out there have

that chance. and i think we have some good ideas about how to do it. so thank you for listening. and looking forward to answering questions. [ applause ]. >> thank you, chancellor. we have quite a few questions. i'm glad you're ready for this. the 2015-2016 tuition, i think you mentioned the price is $33,644 for out of state. and $8,562 for in-state. while that's still a good deal the growth and tuition since the early 1980s has increased six times rate of inflation. in-state students it is five times the rate of inflation. what has caused this huge increase? will we ever see the costs slowing down even dropping below it. >> thank you. it's a really great question. well, i mean, i am in a great

public university. and i am part of a university where the state tax payers do really expect the majority of the support to go for in-state students. what we have been doing, and so in times when there was annen trenchment, we didn't choose those. they have been ledge slated for us where to take the increase. that $30,000, as you said, is stillo compared to our peers. right now i think it's hard tore get into unc chapel hill from out of state than any school in america. it is a great place to go. they want to go. so what we have been doing to counter that is using philanthropy and nonstate targeted dollars. they're eligible for the covenant, which i think is great. some of our covenant scholars do come from out of state. it is 50% of our covenant scholar ises are first generation out of state. 60% are students of color. we really do try to use these banner programs to attract them.

for me in the future a lot of our money that is not already targeted will be going to try to keep those levels down. i think many states don't understand truly the benefit of the influx of students from out of state. first of all all the students want to meet people from everywhere. when students move to a place like chapel hill, they want to stay there forever. but they do come. they are important parts of building a state. and i think other institutions handle that differently. that's something we think about a lot. >> a host of students now coming to universities that are undocumented immigrants but spent most of their lives in the country. many cannot afford the pay the high out of state tuition. is there anything the university can do to help the students in this situation. >> you are hitting the really big issues i was saying earlier.

i'm wearing the pin from our latino/latino organization. it is a growing part of the population in north carolina. we are not one of the institutions that forgives for out of state. so we use philanthropy to be able to cover out of state rates. it's huge if they can't get the out of state rate. we have recently had -- our state now makes it possible for all active duty mill personnel to have in-state rates. that is another under served population we want to get actively involved. so we're moving in that direction. there are about 30 states. weren't you saying earlier that might actually do that. i think beyond that what we have to do right now is continue to find resources that can be used in the areas of most critical need. until you can get that -- if you

can forgive it at the state level, it would really help in that area. >> some have argued making college more accessible can be a decrease in academics for the university students. do you agree? >> this one i would have paid for you to ask me. that's such a great one. this is great. i have a figure, we don't show tables and figures here. good thing. academics will never leave the stage. it shows a diagram of all the students who come in on the carolina covenant. it imposes them on the quality of the entire unc entering class. if you were to pull out the covenant and the need-based aid students every single metric valedictorian, gaap, goes down. so i am absolutely -- i don't buy into the argument that it has anything to reducing

quality. i do also realize, though, being part of a great institution you do get to draw the students who have is that capacity. and so part of the issue is what do we do then for the next tier of students who don't have that? how do we get them performing at a level they could? but we are really drawing an incredible population. so their ability to graduate and lead the world in many different ways is is absolutely there. we have to make sure they can graduate. >> a lot of questions in the united states now about testing. how do you monitor the quality of your education? some of the factors you mentioned, problem-solving critical thinking et cetera. how do you monitor that? how do you the grade that in some form? >> i think i have an english professor with me. she might tell you how hard it is to grade a paper and even feel like it is absolutely perfect. university versus many ways of assessing individual performance. we give tests and grade papers and give lots of feedback.

what we aren't so good at doing is the emergent hole when you finish. most schools, and through accrediting, many of us have been leading in this way. there is a lot of effort put through every major to understand that very clear skill sets, critical thinking problem-solving, are increasing. again, i'm most concerned if we move to an educational system that starts looking like mass production, we will lose the critical piece of feedback experimentation, risk taking that are the great thinkers that cannot only create a job but take new jobs. a chapel hill study that i do want to mention in the new york times where they redid all their intro s.t.e.m. courses. we want the population to be

able to take science, technology, engineering and math. they did two separate classes. one where everything was discussion based, hands-on learning. they still had to take the same tests. another more traditional. the gap between low income students in those two ways of teaching completely closed. so there are ways that we can change the way we educate that will have really measurable progress. but that's kind of in the infancy. i'm sure metrics are part of that. but it's not always something easy to measure. >> let's talk politics for a second. higher education seems to be bearing the brunt of fierce political attacks across the country. as we have seen, for example, in wisconsin. as head of a major public university, what message do you want to send to politicians to have greater accountability and faculty who want to keep their tenure and academic freedom? >> this is when i turn to you. you probably have the answers to that question.

i think one of the big problems right now about higher education is we tend to talk about it as a monolithic. i'm talk building carolina. i told you what it was like to begin. to make clear, it's the same as many other institutions. we need to be much more knew answered and understand what community colleges do and look at our historic black colleges and universities. we need to find what the great research universities do. we need to start building in the metrics of success based on what they are their mission and what they're actually doing. i think that's one of the problems. second, everyone is quite willing to do efficiency. it is a big -- it isn't true -- i mean, yes, universities are like herding cats. but they are innovation centers. every single invention that makes your life better has actually come from a university.

some beginning of that innovation. our industry right now in america used to be 70% r&d and industry 30. it has moved to less than 30% in industry and all in university. so to be that innovative you have to be flexible. again, we need to talk about the specifics. it's important to understand that where economies come in, you should allow universities to feed it back in to the innovation. i think there's a lot of misunderstanding there. the biggest misunderstanding is what they bring value. i saw the university of wisconsin did this study. we did one in north carolina. and that's $7 billion, about a $7 return for every dollar. well, it's more than that for every dollar given to us by the state. we just aren't -- i think in part we aren't giving the knew answer. the last thing tenure and

academic freedom, i think you would destroy america. if you destroy american universities by eliminating academic freedom. i think that is at the core. what it is exactly might be misunderstood. it may be abused. it may be things like that. but in general the idea that what people study and the work they do has to be held to a standard that is not bound by the mores of the day is really important. tenure still serves an important purpose. although i understand i don't think tenure means no accountability. that's another mistake. even tenures go through post-tenure review. they have to achieve levels of accountability that are important. i think we need to make those things understood. >> by your answer i'm going to guest that you supported president barack obama back in all of his plans to have government rate government

higher institutions. >> yes. >> we'll get through a lot of these if the answers are like that. speaking of college costs, do you think the trend of colleges including public universities, having nicer and fancier dorms fitness facilities buildings contributes to the problems of the rising college costs? >> it does. it does. you know, people try to figure out what are the main drivers that have increased cost. facilities are part of it. most of america's great universities were built in the '20s and '30s. we have an aging infrastructure. they cost a lot more money now than they used to because we have to comply with all sorts of standards that are very different. to say it's -- it's a tiny fraction of what it really is. there is also a race for better facilities for students, where

they live. and i understand that. i do think though we are part of the times. i used to send my son to a camp that didn't believe in having mosquito netting. i wanted him to be tough. you they aren't coming out of that. that's not what they're looking a lot. he didn't like that either. that was a new hampshire thing. but, you know i do think we are sort of working with the student generation. and i think what's actually more important than fancy facilities is that they feel they are part of a place where the facilities will allow them to be part of the great things that are happening. so, for example, if i'm going to put something in at unc i want to put in maker space. you might say we shouldn't do that. they are just rooms you build into dorms. they might have a 3d planter, new expensive digital equipment. in the basement in a dorm of

north carolina last year, a young student in his junior year had been working with a disadvantaged child in the region who had to have an artificial hand. as he was growing, they couldn't afford the $100,000 to build the hand. for $20 with a 3d printer in the basement of a dorm, he built him an artificial hand. that's what students want. access to stuff that will let them do great things. they want to be fit and feel part of the action. but they are really still looking at things that we want to give them. and that's really where i think we get the best return. >> thank you. now to a little bit more controversial question. recent events, including campus shootings and campus police use of weapons of pepper spray and guns put a spotlight on the powers of the police officers. what do you consider to be the role of campus police and what limit should be place on them

with when dealing with students or citizens? should they be allowed to be armed with live ammunition and should students be allowed to carry guns on campus? >> well, the idea of whether you carry guns in a public institution, i don't get to make that choice. that is a decision by the state legislature. of course we know across the country there are different decisions by different legislativers. a lot of them do want guns to be allowed on campus. usually they have to be locked up. it's rare. i don't see a campus where people walk around with pistols and are doing that. i think every college president and chancellor is deeply worried about that. our campus police, what you saw and what has been in the news, i do not think reflects the majority of campus police. most campus police, and i'm not

speaking directly from my police, but i knew every single one at darting mouth. i met so many of them when we had our recent tragedy and we worked together. most of the campus police officers are campus police officers because they love students. i think there is a huge role for campus police to play as a liaison and safety coordinator on campuses and to interface with their towns. we have to get those partnerships to be very strong. we need to keep them really working. but students often really like their security police if they developed a relationship that is positive and strong. so i think there's a lot of work to be done there. but there are many great examples where they do it. our police just recently voluntarily decided to get cameras together with the local towns in part so they could stay to the students, we want to do this because we will do anything to make you more comfortable. these tragedies are highlighting

it. every time something happens we go back and ask ourselves again i have meetings with the police in all of our towns and the security police on our campus the next day. saying what can we do better? are we prepared for making sure this would never happen? but i think it's a tragedy. i don't think it reflects most security forces on campuses. >> sticking with the controversial for a minute. on the periphery of the campus is the silent sam memorial. in july it was vandalized to say kkk, murderer and black lives matter. as chancellor should the statue remain. if so, should any changes be made to the signage accompanying it? >> well, we've been through a major year our campus was really looking at not just the memorial but also names on buildings, and the issues associated with that.

i think this is a very national issue. it isn't just the confederate flag. i'm very happy to have my friend sam here. we have been thinking about it as an institution. and the aborted of trustees took action. they decided to rename one of the houses that had been named in honor of a person known to have been the leader of the kkk. they changed the name. it is now called carolina hall. at the same time they said we are not going to go down the road of changing every name. our state actually said you can't change memorials unless you get action from the state is. you know, so sometimes you're working in a very changing environment. so i have to adjust and work with whatever is happening around me. but what we really said we were going to do is spend amount of time understanding how to contextualize history. that is a big job. and that is going to require

voices from throughout the community to come together to have those conversations what does it mean to be from the oldest public university in america. people's names are on buildings from a time in the past to a time in the present. how do we honor the past learn from the past and then respect the dialogue that shapes today. so i can't give you the answer. but that is probably one of our top priorities going forward in this year. and i think that that memorial to silent sam is really just one of the pieces i think we're going to end up with much broader conversations that talk about the role of race in the south. i think we're going to be talking about the role of race in america. so these aren't confined to any one campus. these are some of our biggest issues of the day. >> recent revelations at such places as the university of oklahoma have cast a spotlight on the system of fraternities

and sororities on campus. do you see it as a help or hindrance to your efforts to make college more accessible to a more diverse population of students. >> he is going down the list of all the hard issues. you really did mean it. you know there's a great article -- actually the chronicle of higher education and a lot of the journals have been covering a lot of issues surrounding this. chapel hill is is less than 20% fraternities and sororities. so it is not a numerically that large. they are influential. they have a real place there. i think that the scrutiny that has been coming to campus starting with sexual assault but also binge drinking hazing, this is extremely healthy for universities. we need that kind of conversation. i will tell you as someone in

higher ed for 30 years and a woman in higher ed. when i started in higher ed nobody would go talk to anybody except the woman in the biodepartment. students suffering from sexual assault felt very little opportunity to talk. and most of the people driving these issues especially with gender, would have been women. this is really changing. we are seeing a lot more men and women talking about things. so i'm looking at the way the councils are changing our institution. the fraternities were the first to put in a whole program of sexual assault training. i'm not saying it is all perfect. but i am saying we need to continue to turn to the students themselves to involve them in the process. social engineering is a very difficult idea. and if you're going to really change people, you have to work with people. that does still mean you have to have very serious consequences when people are doing the things

that we believe they should do. i think that the national organizations have started to be more active. i think you're starting to see a much bigger movement towards getting people spaces that are not just associated with so errorities and fraternities. that's the big issue on a college campus, is they own houses. and students want to be part of a place that has separate spaces. so to really make this work we have to give alternatives where students can still have spaces so they don't necessarily find their only alternative in a greek system. they can find other things to give them that richness and experience. >> thank you. what would you like to see high schools do differently to improve the college readiness over incoming students? and along that line of questioning north carolina is reviewing its commitment to the common core state standards, most states have adopted them. do you think adopting common core will help the readiness of incoming college students?

>> i feel like i have an answer to the last one. i have not gotten that involved in the common core debate. although we spend a lot of time in education. the big focus for our university and the whole unc system is actually to get more ready teachers to really improve the pipeline of teachers and also improve the success of teachers in the classroom and the retention. and they have recently been really trying to deal with that issue. it's very important. i think we need to teach students in high school how to write and critically think. i think those are skills. i know every one of my generation is going to agree with that one. but it is something that we do see. the online world has done some positive things. some students read more because of the online world. i've never been a purist and said you have to read only one kind of book and write only kind of to be learning those skills.

so we have things a lot our fingertips to engage students. a lot of evidence shows if you can get a student to read anything, you can probably start directing them to read more of what you want. the online world has probably not helped very much in good writing or even critical thinking. people can use the online world to completely ignore critical analysis. in high schools, if given though right amount of help, they could take advantage of the age these students are, their excitement about this online world and use that in new and exciting ways to improve their skills. we need to make sure we schools have class sizes small enough to have engaged learning. there's not anything the same in being in a class of 60 or class of 30 no matter how super human that teacher is. i tend to believe we need to pay

our k through 12 teachers more if they're going to be held to a standard that's absolutely right. why we need to make it a viable career because we want great thinkers bring those 3.2 million students through high school that does prepare them. writing. i'm going to say math, too. that's an important skill. if we let them say i don't like algebra or geometry, we're allowing them to cut themselves off. >> two questions. how have unc's athletic recruccing processes changed and are there other lessons other universities can take from your experience particularly regarding the athletic scenario. >> more than 70 reforms.

i think some of those reforms are cutting edge. reforms not only in the way we monitor classes. the event that happened really that we talk about all the time should have been stopped. there should have been a process in place almost instantly that evaluated that chair every year and could have stopped it. it's the great tragedy to say, my goodness. we could have stopped it. we would stop it now. the better parts of it why we're a much stronger institution coming out of it than we might have been is we've redone our advising. so for example all this that i was telling you about the covenant scholars and that advising program we have a pilot program to share that exact same advising with all of our students including all of our athletic advising. we developed presumption eded programs

to make sure they're not being tracked into a few majors. this is not just carolina but it's really important. it's true for many students. many who work or may have other outside activities. may find themselves with a narrow subset. we're changing all of those sorts of things. these are the types of programs that help us recruit. most athletes that come to carolina are going to be great. they'll be on absolutely outstanding teams but they'll graduate and go on to careers that are not as active playing their sport. it is our job to recruit them to get a chance to play on a great team and go to a great university. it's putting our effort increasesingly on that duality. we of course you can come here and do both and then you have to

make it real. >> unc students have put issues of race and diversity high on their priority list. how do you facilitate the conversation about these tricky topucics as chancellor? >> when we have the death of the three muslim students, it was the most terrible moment you can imagine for anybody to wake up or to hear that that's going on. what i saw then was the beginnings of real opportunity. we saw that in charleston too. the families of the slain students were incredible. they came forward and they too said we want to talk about the love, the hope of these students and how our families produce wonderful children, how they grow and nurture a community. the community almost as a whole

turned toward the celebration of life. and it had a big impact on the way people started talking about these conversations. it doesn't mean people weren't extremely angry. but the anger was not the driver. we immediately put in a program we're calling carolina conversations and invited students to help us do it. it's going to be starting this year. the very first conversation was on race. in setting that up we went around to all the student groups. i invited students from every organization. students from across the political spectrum and every one of them committed to bring people to that meeting. one of the most meaningful conversations that i heard at that was between two young men different races talking and one of the students going, why are we here? we're supposed to talk about race. this is really hard. i'm not sure why i even came. this is so hard. and the other student said you

came because this is the first time and maybe the only time you would have ever talked to someone that looked like me. you don't have to worry about getting everyone in the conversation as much as starting the conversation and bringing students in and building these conversations out with real action items that people can try. the more experimental on these issues, the better. if we think every time we meet we have to change the entire curriculum, we won't make progress. but if we have an incremental idea try it and test it and back it back in place students will come and start believing in that process. i think that carolina conversations is one step, and stay tuned. i'll come back next year and tell you about the rest of them. almost every campus in america is going to be doing something

or trying something like that. i hope they are. >> before i ask the last questions, i have a few announcements. the national press club fights for a free press worldwide. for more information about the club visit www.press.org and to donate to our non-profit journalism institute, visit www.press.org/institute. tomorrow we're hosting the xhantd commandant of the united states coast guard and the john reverend bryant. and on august 18th mitch landrieu will speak from this podium. and registration is open for the beat the deadline 5k. go to press.org for more information. i'd like to present our speaker with the national press club mug

which i'm sorry is not in carolina blue. >> thank you. it's great. it's not duke blue either. >> so for our last question the last question, unc/duke basketball score this season and we're going to hold you to it. >> oh, my gosh. it's going to be a really good game. a high scorer. i'm giving carolina 96, duke 88. >> you heard it here first. thank you, chancellor folt. i'd also like to thank the staff and the broadcast center for organizing today's event. if you'd like are a copy of today's event go to press.org. thank you.

we are adsjourned. on the next "washington journal," stephen dinan of the kw washington times" talks about a recent article on the first six months of the 114th congress which examined congressional gridlock. and then myron ebell and jeremy symons of the environmental defense fund look at the obama administration's clean power plant which calls for a 30% reduction in green house gas emissions from power plants. plus your phone calls and facebook comments and tweets. "washington journal," live at 7:00 a.m. eastern on c-span. wednesday the senate banking committee holds a hearing on sanctions relief in the iranian nuclear agreement. we'll hear comments from wendy sherman. see her comments live at 10:00 a.m. eastern on c-span3. and after that more about iran with remarks from president

obama at american university here in washington. he'll speak about the nuclear agreement as he continues to argue for congressional and public support on the deal. the president begins live at 11:20 eastern on c-span. c-span radio takes you to the movies. hear four supreme court cases from "woman in gold." >> concerns mr. chief justice. the can of worms argument. we recommend opening the can. and extracting just the one little worm with a pair of tweezers and quickly closing it shut again. >> to "the people versus larry flunt flint." >> if jerry falwell can sue when there has been no libel