review the list of search results and click on the program you would like to watch, or refine your search with our many search tools. if you're looking for our most current programs and you don't want to search the library, our home page has many current programs ready for immediate viewing such as today's washington journal or the events we covered that day. c-span.org is a public service of your cable or satellite provider. so if you're a c-span watcher, check it out at c-span.org. now "the contenders," our series on key political figures who ran for president and lost, but who nevertheless changed political history. tonight we feature adlai stevenson, former governor of illinois and two-time presidential candidate. this program was recorded at adlai stevenson's family home in libertiville, illinois. it's about two hours. this is american history tv, only on c-span3.

ladies and gentlemen of the convention, my fellow citizens, i accept your nomination and your program. [ cheers and applause ] and now my friends that you have made your decision, i will fight to win that office with all my heart and my soul. [ cheers and applause ] and with your help, i have no doubt that we will win. [ cheers and applause ] help me to do the job in this autumn of conflict and of campaign. help me to do the job in these years of darkness of doubt and of crisis which stretch beyond the horizon of tonight's happy visions. and we will justify our glorious

past and the loyalty of silent millions who look to us for compassion, for understanding, and for honest purpose. thus, we will serve our great tradition greatly. i ask of you all you have. i will give you all i have -- >> and that was our contender this week, adlai stevenson, accepting the democratic nomination for president in 1952. we are joined by historian richard norton smith here in adlai stevenson's old study in libertyville, illinois. richard norton smith, who was this one-term governor of illinois? >> well, to millions of americans, that's all he was, one-term governor of illinois. they knew nothing more about him. they had never heard a voice like his. they did not know that in some ways a political revolution was being touched off that night and that for the next decade adlai stevenson would be certainly the

voice of the democratic party, someone who would transform american politics even though he was never successful in his quest for the white house. >> how did he get the nomination in 1952 and in 1956? >> he's arguably the last candidate to be drafted. he's last candidate to require more than one ballot at a convention. he didn't want the nomination is the short answer. especially if the republicans nominate as they did dwight eisenhower, who everyone thought was unbeatable and who stevenson secretly thought wouldn't be such a bad president. the fact is there was a vacuum in the democratic party. harry truman was retiring. there was no obvious successor. stevenson gave a remarkable welcoming address at the chicago convention that had the effect almost of william jenning brian's "cross of gold." it touched off this draft, and a couple days later he was delivering the speech you just

heard. >> and welcome to libertyville, illinois, and "the contenders." this is the ninth in our 14-week series looking at the men who ran for president and changed american politics. tonight, our focus is adlai ewing stevenson, 1900 to 1965 were his years of living. we are joined by well-known author and historian richard norton smith. we are live from libertyville, illinois, about 40 miles outside of chicago at the stevenson family farm. we are in adlai stevenson's old study right now in the house. in just a minute, we're going to be joined by newton minnow who worked and knew adlai stevenson for years. and we're also pleased to tell you that we will be joined by senator adlai stevenson iii, the son of adlai stevenson and ten-year senator from the state of illinois. richard norton smith, before we leave the office here, there are some things sitting around that i want to hopefully get to learn a little bit more about governor stevenson.

first of all, what is this hand? >> well, stevenson talked about himself, saying he suffered from a bad case of hereditary politics. there are multiple generations of stevensons that are part of the story. his great grandfather was a man named jesse fell who actually helped to persuade abraham lincoln to run for president in 1860. the lincoln connection was a very powerful one with stevenson. this, in fact, is a cast of lincoln's hand, part of the famous leonard volk life mast that was created in 1860. >> now also on the desk here on adlai stevenson's desk, is an address book. some of the names in this address book include eleanor roosevelt, walter and jean kerr, jackie kennedy, john steinbeck, archibald mccleash. >> it hints at stevenson's appeal. he was a very unusual -- he was a non-politician in many ways who was lionized by

intellectuals, academics, by men and women of letters. and eventually by millions of americans who proudly declared themselves stevensonians. >> and standing between us is this old office chair. >> yeah, very historic piece. this, in fact, is governor stevenson's cabinet chair. during the kennedy administration -- no doubt we'll talk about this later on -- he had a historic stint as american ambassador to the united nations. and as such, he was made a member of the cabinet. this is the chair that commemorates that. somewhat difficult relationship that he had with the kennedy administration. >> now richard norton smith, you referred to the stevenson political dynasty a little earlier. here on the wall are some artifacts, very quickly. >> yeah. governor stevenson's wife said that the stevensons all suffered from a bad case of ancestor worship. his grandfather was vice president of the united states. they had some pretty impressive

ancestors. >> under grover cleveland. >> under grover cleveland. then he ran again under william jennings brian, unsuccessfully. ncaa way, this is grandfather stevenson's hat. and you can see the campaign items from the grover cleveland campaigns as well. >> and again, welcome to you. thanks for joining us tonight for "the contenders," live from libertyville, illinois. richard norton smith and i are going to work our way over to the barn, the stevenson barn, here on the family farm. we're currently in the house, in the study. next to it is a barn. this was a working, semi working farm at one point, with animals, sheep, horses, et cetera. we're going to work our way over there where there's a new display about adlai stevenson. so you'll be able to see that, as well. first, we want to show you some campaign commercials so you can see some of the video of adlai stevenson. these campaign commercials are from 1956 and 1952, and in fact, one of them we're going to show was filmed right here in this study.

>> it's wonderful. i was sitting right here in my own library. thanks to television, i can talk to millions of people, and i couldn't reach any other way. but i'm not going to let this spoil me. i'm not going to stop traveling in this campaign. i can talk to you, yes, but i can't listen to you. i can't hear about your problems, about your hopes and your affairs. to do that, i've got to go out and see you in person. and that's what i've been doing for past several years. i've traveled all over this country, hundreds of thousands of miles. i've been in every state. many of them more than once. i've met thousands of you and millions of you have seen me. ♪ ♪ it's adlai to you adlai to me ♪ ♪ i don't care how you quote it

adlai, adlai, don't pronounce it, just go out and vote it ♪ stevenson! ♪ i'd rather have a man with a hole in his shoe than a hole in everything he says ♪ ♪ i'd rather have a man who knows what to do when he gets to be the pres ♪ ♪ i love the gov the governor of illinois ♪ ♪ i know the gov will bring the dove of peace and joy ♪ ♪ when illinois the gop double crossed ♪ ♪ he was the boy who told all the crooks get lost ♪ ♪ adlai love you madly ♪ and what you did for your own great state you're going to do for rest of the 48 ♪ ♪ we're going to choose the gov that we love he is the gov nobody can shove ♪ ♪ we love the president of the

you me and usa ♪ ♪ old mcdonald had a farm back in '31, conditions filled him with alarm, back in '31 ♪ ♪ got a chick chick here or a moo cow there ♪ ♪ just broken down farmland everywhere ♪ ♪ farmer mac doesn't want to go back to the days when there wasn't a moo or quack ♪ ♪ the days of 1931 when he didn't have bread when the day was done ♪ ♪ farmer mac knows what to do election day of '52 ♪ ♪ go out with everyone in the usa ♪ ♪ to vote for adlai stevenson to keep his farm this way ♪ ♪ with a vote-vote here and a vote-vote-there ♪ and a vote for stevenson everywhere ♪ ♪ for if it's good for mac, you see, it's good for you and it's good for me ♪ ♪ all america loves that farm vote stevenson today ♪

>> and if you should elect me your president next november, i shall be the better for having done it, i'm sure. because i know that the strength and the wisdom that i need must be drawn from you, the people. so finally, i hope that the next time we meet it will be person to person and face to face. i'm adlai stevenson. you and i have been hearing from our republican friends that things are so good they couldn't be better. better for whom, i wonder? do you think that things can't be better for the small businessman like this one? small business profits are down 52%. that they can't be better for our farmers like these? farm income is down 25%. are your schools good enough for the richest nation in history? your schools like this one need

one-third of a million more classrooms. and what about you? are you now out of debt? do you have a comfortable backlog in the bank? are you paying less for the things that you buy or more? do you really think things can't be better? of course they can. working together we can and will make them better. >> vote democratic. >> rising cost of farming, lower income? caught in a squeeze? then vote democratic, the party for you, not just the few. vote for adlai stevenson for president and kefauver for vice president. >> and we are back live at the stevenson farm in libertyville, illinois. richard norton smith and i are now joined by newton minnow. you may know him as the former

chairman of the federal communications commission. if you heard the phrase "tv is a vast wasteland," that was his phrase. but for our purposes tonight, he worked with and was an associate of adlai stevenson for many years. newton minnow, if you could start by telling us whether did you first meet governor stevenson? >> i was a law clerk at the united states supreme court for chief justice vinson. one of our law professors came to visit one day. he later offered my co-clerk a job as his assistant in springfield, as assistant counsel to the governor. turned out that howard wasn't interested, but i was. and i ended up being interviewed by governor stevenson at 7:00 a.m. for breakfast in the spring of 1952.

and he said to me, if hire you, young man, is there any reason why you wouldn't take the job? and i said, if my current boss, chief justice vinson runs for president -- and it was rumored in the press that he would be a candidate for president -- and if he asked me to stay with him, i'd like to do that. and governor stevenson looked at me and said, i don't think that's very likely. i then drove him to his next appointment. i went to work at the supreme court. i picked up "the new york times." it said "truman offers stevenson the presidential nomination; vinson out." this was the morning after president truman had asked adlai to run. well, i was hired. i reported for work, and he was then nominated for president. >> what was he known for as governor? >> even a student, i had worked in his campaign for governor, as

a college student in 1948. he was known as being, first of all, totally honest which is not necessarily a prerequisite for election in illinois. he was a different kind of candidate. he was honest. he was an intellectual. he cared deeply about good government, and he brought a whole different culture and tone to the office of governor. >> richard norton smith, the u.s. in 1952. set the stage for us. >> well, politically there's no doubt -- i think one of the reasons -- use would know much better than i -- that he entered hesitation about seeking the presidency was a sense that the democrats had been in power for 20 years. even the most partisan democrat who thought they'd been 20 glorious years, nevertheless thought that perhaps the party

as well as the country would be well served by a change. but the great issue was which republican party would replace harry truman if harry truman were to leave. would it be the isolationist conservative midwestern party of bob taft, or would it be the internationalist, if you will, modern republicanism of dwight eisenhower? and stevenson had to, among other things, weigh, calculate the chances of which party he might be running against. he was very reluctant to run, wasn't he? >> he did not want to run. and of course, who could have beat devise eisenhower? it was like running against jesus christ. it was an impossible thing to win. and as richard said, he has it exactly right. if it had been robert taft as the opponent, i think adlai

would have relished running because there would have been a clear difference in philosophy about america's place in the world. but you got to remember, the democrats tried to draft general eisenhower. the democrats tried to get eisenhower to run as a democrat. eisenhower was a candidate of both parties. >> well, newton minow, when adlai stevenson gave the welcoming address at the democratic national convention in chicago in 1952, was he a nationally known figure at the time? was he considered a candidate? >> he was not that well known. i remember the first time he appeared on national television was that spring. he was on "meet the press," first time he was ever on national television. and adlai was never any good on television. >> why? >> if you were with him, he was a lot of fun.

he had a great personality. and you always went away feeling better about yourself. when you watched him on television, he was either nervous, but he was never himself. but the country didn't know him. >> so he gives the welcoming address, and he essentially gets drafted, wins on the second or third ballot. is that correct? >> that's right. and it was really unfortunate for him because the timing was wrong. if he had run for president against a dwight eisenhower, he probably could have won. >> and remember, just how different the democratic party was in 1952. who does he pick for a running mate? john sparkman, senator from alabama. it's still the solid south. and in fact he has to worry about keeping the solid south solid. >> exactly. and it taught me a lesson also about how we pick vice presidents. john sparkman was picked at the

last minute. >> did he have a relationship with john sparkman? >> no, not really. and the way we do things in this country. it's amazed we've staged it so successfully for a couple hundred years. >> did kefauver want to be on the '52 ticket? >> i think he was always interested in running for president. adlai did not like kefauver at all -- >> senator kefauver of kentucky -- >> yes, of kentucky. >> tennessee. >> of tennessee, excuse me. who ended up being the vice presidential candidate in 1956. >> who harry truman liked to call cow fever. he liked him even less than stevenson. >> richard norton smith, norton minnow, harry truman in '52 and his relationship with stevenson. >> he's a great president, someone we look up to for his decisiveness, for his ability to

make big decisions, and to commit the united states and the cold war. but the fact is at the time he was a very unpopular president. the korean war was an unpopular war. he had fired douglas macarthur which again today, basically there is a consensus he did the right thing for the right reason, but at great political cost. harry truman -- and harry truman had been in power seven years. and he had decided seven years was enough. he had the power to prevent cow fever from becoming the nominee. he probably had the power to make adlai stevenson from being the nominee. with the power came the dead weight of the truman administration. my sense is that truman and stevenson's relationship never quite recovered from that fact. >> i think it was worse than that.

there was another factor. there had been a lot of corruption in the democratic party. there had been a scandal with one of president truman's assistants. and there had been -- it was not a happy things to become the democratic candidate for president in 1952. especially if you had harry truman's imprimatur on you. >> as i left the supreme court to work for stevenson, i went to see the chief justice to say good-bye, and he was very, very close to president truman, chief justice vinson. and the chief said, your guy's not going to make it. and i said, what? he said, no, he said, i was with the president last night. and he told me that he's lost patience with adlai. he doesn't say yes, doesn't say no. he's going -- it's going to be

barkley, alvin barkley. alvin barkley was then the vice president of the united states. >> age 74. >> right. and they've tried to -- actually tried to get it for barkley. but everybody said he's too old. so that will open it up again. and then stevenson was drafted. >> and we are live from libertyville, illinois, the stevenson family farm, about 40 miles outside of chicago. the phone numbers are on the screen because we want to hear from you, as well. especially if you remember adlai stevenson as a candidate. 202 the area code 737-0001. for those of you in the east and central time zones, 202-737-0002, if you live in the mountain and pacific time zones. the results in 1952, by the way, that election was held 59 years ago tonight, november 4th, 1952. adlai stevenson won 27 million votes.

he got 89 electoral votes and won nine states. dwight david eisenhower, 442 electoral votes. he won 34 million votes, and he won the rest of the states which would have been 40 some at that point. >> 41 states. >> one thing to keep in mind it that election is to compare it with 1948. in losing, governor stevenson got three million more votes than harry truman had in winning three years earlier. dwight eisenhower got 12 million more votes than tom dewey. so what you had was the largest increase in voter participation in four years since the 1820s. >> why? >> because you had two, in many ways, outstanding candidates. each in their own way, able to excite the electorate in a way that i don't think we'd seen in this country in some time. >> here's little bit more of adlai stevenson at the 1952

convention. >> what does concern me in common thinking partisans is a vote friday is not just winning this election but how it is won. how well we can take advantage of this great quadrennial opportunity to debate issues sensible and soberly. i hope and pray that we democrats win or lose can campaign not as a crusade to exterminate the opposing party, as our opponents seem to prefer, but as a great opportunity to educate and elevate a people whose destiny is leadership. let's talk sense to the american people. let's tell them the truth, that there are no games without pain. that we are now on the eve of great decisions.

>> newton minow, where were you 59 years ago tonight? >> i was in the governor's mansion. and i think one thing that really taught the american people about governor stevenson was the way he conceded defeat. he gave the most graceful, patriotic talk. he -- he pledged to support newly elected president eisenhower and give him every support. and he ended with a story that he remembered from abraham -- that abraham lincoln used to tell. it was a story about a little boy who stubbed his toe in the dark. and he said -- >> it hurts -- >> it hurts too much to laugh, but i'm not old enough to cry. >> too old -- >> too old to cry. with that, people saw he was a patriot, he loved his country

and was willing to supports a new president despite the fact that he lost. >> let's take some calls. the first call we have up tonight is paul in davenport, iowa. paul, adlai stevenson is our contender tonight. please go ahead. >> caller: hello. i want to first thank c-span for doing this. this is really a great series. my question is this -- i have recently finished reading conrad black's "richard m. nixon." in it, he puts forward a negative view of stevenson's '56 campaign for president. he claims he spent too much time attacking richard m. nixon, the vice president, rather than the actual president, and actually said it was kind of a blemish on a very stellar career. my question to you is this -- do you think the 1956 campaign was a low point of stevenson's political career? did he spend too much time attacking nixon?

and in 1956, what could he have focused on besides vice president nixon to perhaps make the election closer? should he have focused on farm issues more, or should he have focused perhaps on war and peace issues because of the suez crisis and such things? thank you very much. >> thank you, paul. >> caller: good-bye. >> thank you, paul. let's start with newton minow. 1956 campaign. >> 1956 campaign in my opinion was not as stellar as it was the -- as the 1952 campaign. the reason for the emphasis on nixon in '56 was the fact that president eisenhower had suffered a bad heart attack. he'd had some bad health problems. there was great concern in the country of what would happen if president eisenhower was re-elected, but that he died during the second term, and that nixon became president. so there was a very good reason to go after nixon because nixon would not as it turned out

later, sadly, did not have the character to be president. >> yeah. and i would actually say that i think the '56 campaign stylistically, i certainly understand where you're coming from. but from a historical standpoint in ways, it's the campaign that in many ways laid the groundwork for the new frontier and great society. and specifically, that's the campaign when adlai stevenson, against considerable odds, for example, embraced the idea of a nuclear test ban treaty. that's the campaign when stevenson endorsed a constitutional amendment so 18-year-olds could vote. i mean, in terms of foreshadowing policy to come, '56 turns out to have been a fountainhead of ideas. but you are right. the last speech on election eve where he said that basically the medical evidence suggested a real possibility in the next four years that richard nixon

would become president. remember, that's something that tom dewey hadn't done in '44 under somewhat similar circumstances when fdr's health was -- it's just something -- you didn't go there. i think in some ways he paid a price for that. >> well, you're right. the nuclear trust ban which was a very unpopular point of view to take in 1956, but he took it very courageously because he believed in it deeply. and i remember he said someone asked what the weapons would be in world war iv. and he said there would be sticks and stones. and he made his point. >> news on the minow, between

1952 and 1956, was adlai stephenson angling to get the nomination again? >> i'd have to answer that with a yes and a no. i think he -- would hope that he might someday be president. but he also knew if he ran against president eisenhower again that the odds were very much against him. i was one of the few people around him who urged him not to run in 1956. but he felt an obligation to the democratic party. >> here's a little bit of adlai stevenson at the 1956 convention, also held in chicago. >> i come here on a solemn mission. i accept your nomination and your program. [ applause ] and i pledge to you every resource of my instinct that i possess to make your deed today a good one for our country and for our party.

[ applause ] four years ago, i stood in this same place and uttered those same words to you. four years ago, i did not seek the honor that you bestowed upon me. this time, as you may have noticed, it was not entirely unsolicited. [ laughter ] and there's another big difference. that time we lost, this time we will win. [ cheers and applause ] >> newton minow, you started laughing while you were listened to that video.

>> when he said it was unsolicited, it reminded me in 1955, governor stevenson gave a speech at the university of texas. and i was asked to go with him. it was right after president eisenhower had suffered his heart attack. lyndon johnson, the majority leader of the senate, had also suffered a heart attack. and we were to spend the night at lyndon's ranch. we drove in the car with sam rayburn, the speaker of the house, got there late. mrs. johnson was very upset because the doctor had told her that lyndon should be sleeping, and here he waited up until very late in the night, until 2:00 in the morning for us. and on the way home, just the two of us were traveling. adlai said to me, sam and lyndon say if i want the nomination

next year, i'll have to run in the primaries. i said, they're right. i said, if president eisenhower because of his health doesn't run, every democrat is going to want the nomination, and you'll have to fight for it. if president eisenhower does run, you ought to forget about it. he said, well, i'm not going to run those primaries. i'm not going to be a candidate like i'm running for sheriff, running around those shopping centers shaking hands. i'm not going to do it. of course, he ended up doing it because that's the way the system operated. and he eventually won the nomination after winning a couple of the primaries. >> to joe in los angeles. we're talking about adlai stevenson tonight on "the contenders." go ahead with your question or comment. >> caller: yes, i wanted jump ahead to the 1960s and specifically what you thought stevenson's relationship with the kennedys, jack and bobby, was. and i know that he then ran for president or -- nominate in the

nomination convention '60. because of that there were ill feelings with jack kennedy. he wasn't made secretary of state. what would have happened if adlai had been made secretary of state? and would the situation in vietnam have been different? thank you. >> let's start with richard norton smith. help us to set the stage. >> that's a wide subject. i know we have material to talk about later. we'll talk about this with senator stevenson who was there. stevenson and who was there. it was certainly true that there was not a warm relationship between the kennedys and governor stevenson. in 1956, stevenson had done something no one else had done. he had thrown the nomination for the vice presidency open. he let the convention decide. and jack kennedy came within an eyebrow of winning that nomination. and in the end, kefauver, probably to stevenson's regret,

managed to eke out a victory. ironically, kennedy later on said, of course, not being on the ticket was probably the best things that had ever happened to him. it introduced him to the country, paved the way for his campaign in 1960. it is also safe to say -- i would defer to newt on this -- that the way in which governor stevenson flirted with the draft in 1960 and held back -- in fact, one of the distinguished visitors who came to this house one day was jack kennedy who very much wanted adlai stevenson's endorsement, who didn't get it, who did not go away i think with his admiration of the governor enhanced. and if he was ever going to be secretary of state, i think that possibility probably went down the drain right then. >> and we will talk a little bit later about the kennedy relationship and his years as u.n. ambassador.

but the results in 1956 -- adlai stevenson won 73 electoral votes. he won seven states in 1956. he won nine in 1952. he got 26 billion votes, but one million less than he got four years earlier. dwight eisenhower, 457 electoral votes. he won 41 states. it was the last election where there were only 48 states in t nation, and dwight eisenhower won about 35 million votes, about 1 million more than he had won years previous. next call, akron, ohio, kurt, you're on "the contenders." hi. >> caller: thank you, this is an honor to be watching this type of program. i a have a comment, then a question, really. richard norton smith, first of all, stole my thunder about the 1956 convention and jack kennedy.

but one of my favorite comments about stevenson is something harry truman had said about stevenson, that he spent more time thinking what he was going to do rather than doing it. and he said he spent a lot more time talking to college presidents than he did to cabdrivers. we have a hell of a lot more cab drivers in this country than we do college presidents. but anyway, 1956, richard norton smith made comment to adlai stevenson doing something unprecedented, which is opening the convention to picking a vice presidential nominee, jack kennedy being one and estes kefauver being another one. but very few people really know, unless they really studied this, there were two other candidates in contention for that position. hubert humphrey of minnesota. al gore sr. of tennessee as well. my question then is, seeing as how jack kennedy was out of it and estes kefauver became the nominee for vice president,

would that ticket have been a little bit better had it been al gore sr. or hubert humphrey versus estes kefauver? also, would -- well, i guess what i was going to say -- >> let's leave it there, kurt. that's a lot of question, and we're going to let newton minow, who was actively involved in the 1956 adlai stevenson campaign. mr. minow? >> certainly, kefauver didn't help. i don't know who would have helped given the fact that, again, president eisenhower was at the top of the ticket. but i think what richard said about kennedy was exactly correct. the opportunity to be at the convention and be seen as a vice presidential possibility introduced jack kennedy to the country, and i remember a few years later i saw him at a dinner, and i said, you know, we called him jack then.

i said jack, if you're still interested, you could get the nomination for vice president next time. he looked at me and said vice president? vice president? i'm going to run for president. he was only 39 years old, but he had made up his mind. >> can i ask you -- the caller raises a point that i'm sure governor stevenson heard many times during his lifetime, this notion that he talked over the heads of people. what was his reaction to that, what's your reaction to that? >> i think he did not talk over the heads of the people. used to call him an egghead and they called his followers eggheads, and he used to make fun of that. he said eggheads of the world unite, you have nothing to lose but your yolks. he joked. i think he reached people. he had a great sense of humor.

one time he gave a speech, i was with him in san francisco. a woman came up to him after a speech. she said, "governor stevenson, after that speech, every thinking american is going to vote for you." he said, well, thank you, madam, unfortunately, i need a majority. he knew what the situation was. >> next call for our guests comes from nashville, tennessee. hi, martin. you're on "the contenders." >> caller: hi, hi, thank you. great show. i was going to touch on this intellectual thing. my father was an academic. i grew up in washington, d.c. as a child of the '60s. i remember my father talking about how great adlai stevenson was, what a brilliant man he was, what an intellectual, of how great that was for the country. of course, he never won. but the reason i'm calling, i was struck by that 1952 electoral map. and i noticed that it seemed like the sparkman strategy won since he got all those southern states. but strangely enough he didn't get tennessee, which was

kefauver's state and he didn't get his own state, illinois. what to make of that? that reminds me of al gore in 2000. >> richard norton smith? >> i think, again, newt would know better, i think it certainly pained him that in neither of those presidential elections he won illinois. remember, he had been elected governor of illinois in 1948 by the largest margin in the history of the state. what was then a conservative isolationist state elected this new deal liberal democrat. and it was not surprising that, i assume, he thought he counted on winning it in '52. >> he did. for example, if he had run for governor in 1952 -- >> for a second term. >> -- even with president eisenhower running on the republican -- he would have won the governorship again by a larger margin than he won in '48. >> newton minow, today we talk about taxes, spending, social programs, social security, as some of the presidential issues

that we look at during campaigns. 1952, 1956, what were two or three of the main issues that were talked about on this campaign and that adlai stevenson stressed? >> '52, the big issue i think helped president eisenhower enormously was korea. we were bogged down in a war there. president eisenhower said i have a plan. i will go to korea. the country thought that meant he'll end the war in korea, which he did. that was important. the other big issues were really the same issues we've got today. we haven't solved the same issues that divided the country back in the '50s. the role of education, the economy was better then than it is now. i think there was less unemployment. but i think this country is

equally divided. if you look at the last ten presidential elections, with the single exception, i think, of johnson and goldwater in 1964, with that exception, they've all been decided by a few points. the country is basically equally divided. >> in 1956, here is a little bit of adlai stevenson talking about the democratic platform. >> we are on the threshold of another great, decisive era. history's headlong course has brought us, i devoutly believe, to the threshold of a new america, to the america of the great ideals and noble visions. i mean a new america where poverty is abolished and our abundance is used to enrich the

lives of every family. [ applause ] i mean, my friends, a new america where freedom is made real for all without regard to race or belief or economic condition. [ applause ] i mean a new america which everlastingly attacks the ancient idea that men can solve their differences by killing each other. these -- these are the things i believe in. these are the things i will work for with every resource i possess. >> and we are live in libertyville, illinois, at the

adlai stevenson farm. boston, you're on the air. go ahead, dick. >> caller: hi, how are you? hello? >> we're listening. please, go ahead with your question or comment. >> caller: i was very young during the era of president kennedy and adlai stevenson, and i want to share to you an emotional thing that i will probably take to my grave. in 1960, a couple of weeks before his assassination, meaning kennedy, adlai stevenson went to texas, where he was in a convention mood, probably the wrong convention, because they threw oranges to him -- to him from the balcony, and he called president kennedy and told him not to come to texas. at least get a bullet-proofed car, which he didn't do.

on the other side of the equation, i believe president kennedy and his brother just had, from football days, had a little bit too much ego, and if adlai stevenson knew that, then he would probably treated his demeanor coming down to jack's demeanor and i think there would have been a more listening to save his life. >> we're going to get an answer from both our guests, because they both started nodding their heads. richard norton smith? >> i think it was a united nations day event in dallas that he spoke to and afterwards was struck by some protesters with signs. i think he was actually spat upon, and a classic stevenson rejoinder afterwards when they suggested do you want to prosecute these people. he said, i don't want to prosecute them, i want to educate them. >> newton minow? >> i think he was very aware of the dangers, but i don't think

to go as far as the questioner did about it. i think president kennedy had made that commitment and he wanted to keep it. i do remember talking about the relationship of adlai and president kennedy. during the '60 campaign, norman vincent peel, a leading protestant clergyman, organized a group of clergymen and they said that jack kennedy was unqualified to be president because of his religion. and adlai was asked about it. and he compared peel to st. paul. and he said, i find st. paul appealing and norman vincent peale appalling. and he could always make a joke

or a good humor out of it. politics today has no humor. i don't see, with the exception of bob dole, i don't see any politician today, either party, who's really got a great sense of humor. >> do you think in any way it worked against stevenson, some people thought he wasn't a serious person because he always had these wonderful quips? >> well, and his answer to that was abraham lincoln went around telling stories all the time. i don't think it hurt him. i think people like to have someone who has a sense of humor. >> next call on adlai stevenson here on c-span's "contenders." poughkeepsie, new york. nick, good evening. >> caller: hi. >> please, go ahead. >> caller: i'd like to know when stevenson was a child, what was, like, was his incident where he accidently shot his friend, how did that influence his

presidential campaign in the future? >> newton minow, did he ever talk to you about that? can you give us a brief history of what the caller is referring to? >> never. >> there was a tragic accident in childhood when there was a loose gun in the family and adlai accidently shot and killed another child. i never heard him say a word about it. i never saw any evidence that it affected him, but i'm not a -- who knows. >> he was 12 years old at the time. but one did get the sense that the family kind of moved on, i mean, it was not something that they dwelled on, and i think years later, he expressed astonishment that his wife knew about the incident, which suggests he really kept it close to his vest. >> who was his wife? >> well, his wife was a woman who came from a very fine,

upper-class family. she was not very interested in politics. in fact, disliked politics, and when adlai went into politics, i don't think she was very happy about it, and sadly they came to a parting of the ways. >> and that was in 1949, after he had run for governor. >> he had been elected before the divorce. >> right, then divorced. did that hurt him in the 1952 and 1956 presidential campaigns being a divorced man? >> you know, it's curious. i was talking about this with my life. -- with my wife. years ago, people thought a divorced man could never be elected president. now president reagan was divorced. today, we have public officials living without marriage with someone else, nobody raises a fuss about it.

i think there's been a vast cultural change here. >> one more instance of stevenson being ahead of his time? >> could be. >> well, we are live from libertyville, illinois, about 10, 20 miles from where we are is north brook, illinois. theodore is on the line. please, go ahead with your question or comment. >> caller: hello, i appreciate the program very much. i am a senior in a nearby senior retirement community, and participating in a writer memoir group in which we've been asked to write what good thing from the '50s should be carried into the 21st century. i happen to have been present at his 1952 election where he voted in vernon township, in a little township building next to a congregational church, and i chose that as the icon.

my question is, what significance do you place to that icon of the whole in adlai's view and how would you summarize what good thing from adlai stevenson could be brought into the 21st century in our own time? >> let's start with richard norton smith. >> i'm just -- again, stevenson, whenever you think of his politics, stevenson was a man who flattered our intelligence, he spoke up to us. he didn't speak down to us. he is, arguably, the last national politician, i think you could actually say this of barry goldwater, who believed that a presidential campaign was, first and foremost, an educational exercise. >> what do you mean by that, richard? >> he was forever running out of time, you know, they would cut him off in the middle of a

speech. he couldn't believe that people wouldn't take a sufficient amount of time to educate themselves, to listen to thoughtful, sober, substantiative issue-oriented appeals from candidates on both sides. that's how he approached running for office. that's how he approached governing illinois. >> he once -- i've heard him say more than once that a campaign was an educational exercise not only for the public, but also for the candidate. that it was an opportunity for the candidate to educate himself or herself about the country and about the people. and he believed that. i also heard him say something i don't hear any politician say today, there are worst things that can happen to someone than losing an election. >> richard norton smith, what is a stevensonian?

>> oh, a stevensonian is an egghead, probably entertaining a certain nostalgia for a level of political discourse, of civility, urbanity, a whit, self deprecatory, someone who has very little patience with the political claptrap that handlers and spin doctors have foisted upon us. i cannot imagine adlai stevenson being handled by any such individuals. >> it would never happen. i was once member of a conference in japan and in our delegation was don rumsfeld, who then was a member of congress, and we were having dinner, and i said why did you go into politics?

and he said, it was all because of a speech given to my graduating class at princeton. i said were you in the class of 1954? he looked at me, how do you know that? i said i know the speech, it was the best speech adlai stevenson ever gave in his life, it was a speech why everyone should devote some of their life to public service. don stood up and gave me a paragraph by memory, verbatim of the speech, took out his wallet, took out a torn, tattered copy of the speech he carries around in his wallet. i said that's why you went into politics? he said that's why i went into public service, and if you read his new book, he starts off by quoting from that speech, so adlai, i'd say his biggest contribution was making politics respectable and honorable. jack kennedy used to say politics is an honorable profession.

i think he got that from adlai stevenson. >> three sons, adlai the iii, borden, john fell. adlai iii was a marine in 1952, but here's a little bit of a newsreel. >> governor stevenson takes time out from his campaign to celebrate the graduation of his son. adlai iii, from quantico, virginia. he presents his son with a sheaf of commissions for the entire platoon. it is a proud father and an equally proud son on an occasion important to both. >> and now live on your screen is senator adlai stevenson iii, he is in his father's study here on the stevenson farm in libertyville, illinois. senator stevenson, first of all, thank you for opening up this facility for us.

secondly, what was your role in the '52 and '56 campaigns? >> '52 campaign, as your remarks indicate, i was in the marine corps, i didn't know it, but en route to korea, so i did not have a role in that campaign. we were involved in the '56 campaign and i was a driver in the '48 campaign, which was sort of the beginning of my introduction to politics. >> now, what role did korea play in your father's campaigning in 1952? what was his position on korea with you over there? >> well, as newt -- i think it was newt mentioned, korea became an issue, though i don't think it really was an issue, but it adversely effected my father's campaign.

he was advised to say if elected president, i will go to korea. that's exactly what general eisenhower said. my father refused to do that because he felt that if he made that commitment to go there and settle the, you know, arrange the troops, he'd be weakened, and, in fact, the eisenhower administration was weakened by this commitment of eisenhower to end the war. i don't think it -- my involvement didn't have any effect at all, but his integrity had an adverse affect on his campaign because of korea. >> adlai stevenson iii served in the senate for the state of illinois. from 1970 to 1981. he voluntarily stepped down in 1980. ran for governor twice for this state. senator stevenson, what made you enter the family business? >> well, i was just born with an incurable, hereditary case of politics, if by business you mean my career.

we never really thought of it as a business. i'm, by the way, paraphrasing my father, because he was asked the same question. >> and, of course, the first adlai stevenson served as vice president. the second as secretary of state here for the state of illinois, then, of course, we had adlai stevenson the governor and now we are joined by senator stevenson, who is adlai iii. he is in his father's study in the home, in the stevenson family home here in libertyville. we are over in what used to be the barn, and it's right next door. it is now set up with an exhibit. senator stevenson, what is going on here, what is being set up where we are? >> yes, this home, which really became our base over the years as we served in washington, london, springfield, everywhere,

is now the home of the adlai stevenson center on democracy where we try to bring people together from all parts of the world to address systemic weaknesses in democratic systems of government and continue the stevenson legacy. this was the home, but it really became a base from which we, my father, arranged the world, not only to serve in springfield and so on, as i mentioned, but also to study the world. the travels, the study of the world from on the ground and within it were incessant. never stopped trying to learn about the world from within it. in the marketplaces and slums and the monuments and ruins, as well as the universities and ministries, trying to see the world from within it, and the united states from without it, and i think that lifetime of on the ground study of the world

with a perspective from no ivory tower really helped to create the record and make him an electrifying figure, not only at home, but in the world. which ultimately led, of course, to president kennedy's appointment to him as the ambassador to the united nations. >> we've got one hour left this evening in "the contenders." this is our ninth in our 14-week series. adlai stevenson is our focus. our guests, senator adlai stevenson iii, newton minow who worked for years with and for adlai stevenson, and former federal communications commissioner under jfk.

and of course, well-known author and historian richard norton smith. we're going to take this call from sally in chicago. hi, sally. >> caller: hi, let me correct something, i was born and raised in chicago, but i live in california. and i'm calling because i -- adlai stevenson's 1952 election was my first presidential -- in other words, when i was eligible to vote, so i went door-to-door and did whatever i could. i was crushed that he didn't win, but on retrospect, i thought he would contribute so much more on the world stage as a statesman, and in a way, he did. but i will never forget how disappointed we were. one other thing, being a chicagoan, i worked at the

tribune tower when the dewey-truman election results -- you never saw such panic in your life as was in the chicago tribune. i will let you go and get your response on air. thank you. >> i think we could talk -- i think we could talk to sally all night, but senator stevenson, if we could start with you, you heard the emotion in her voice, could you talk about his campaign style a little bit? >> i'd like to amplify. i think richard and newt have done a very perceptive job, but getting back to '52, he was also reluctant to run for president because he had been elected governor of a state which we loved and were deeply indebted to, and it succeeded a corrupt republican administration.

he reached out and he recruited the best qualified professionals that he could find. it wasn't pay to play in those days, it was sacrifice to serve. they were reforming state government, and he wanted to finish the job. newt and richard are right, he was also reluctant because eisenhower, the returning war hero, would be very hard to defeat, and i think secretly, not so secretly at home, he wasn't convinced that, perhaps, it was time for a change. now, remember, he started that '52 campaign. he was drafted. he started that campaign at the convention with absolutely no program, no money, no staff, and it went on to electrify the world. for him, and this is -- i may be repeating, but for him, democracy was not a device, not

a system for acquiring power, it was a system for informing the people so that they could make a sound judgment. he said trust the people with the truth, all the truth. what wins is more important than who wins, so in response to another suggestion, the '56 campaign was really more substantiative because he'd had more time than the '52 campaign, but he used the campaigns and the interim as leader of the party. we don't have them anymore, and advisory counsels to relay the programatic foundations for the great frontier and the great society.

i heard arthur schlesinger once call -- we always called jack, jack, john f. kennedy, the executor of the stevenson revolution, but those campaigns were aimed not only at the american people and they were substantiative, he used half-hour blocks of time for eloquent, subsequent speeches. they were also aimed at the world, and it listened. >> you talked about the '52 and '56 campaigns. your father lost about a million or so between those and a couple more states. what did he not do as well in '56 or what do you think, did he make mistakes? >> i think -- first of all, eisenhower's enormously popular. remember, these were years of economic prosperity and growth. ike was popular, the war was getting -- i can't remember when exactly, but ended -- no, that

would come later in korea. no, what happened -- one of the things that happened, i think eisenhower would have gotten reelected probably anyway, was the uprising in hungary and the invasion of suez by france, britain, and israel. these international crises rallied the country, as they always do, behind the president, and, you know, from then on, there just really wasn't much doubt about the outcome. >> richard norton smith? >> well, i just want to go back to the '52 campaign, and senator stevenson's point, which, of course, is absolutely accurate, that he started out with nothing. in fact, there was a debate over where to have a political headquarters, whether, you know, truman expected it to be in washington, well, no, it was in springfield. but the story is told, and you can tell me if it's true or not, the story is told that he didn't expect it to be publicized,

which again is revealing, that one night very shortly after the convention, he came back to springfield and conscious of these crushing responsibilities that had just been handed to him, he left the executive mansion one night, by himself, without guard or entourage, and walked to the lincoln hall on 8th street, walked to the door. of course, the custodian recognized him, it was not then a national historic site, let him in, and he sat all by himself in the lincoln parlor for some period reflecting, meditating on a man who had confronted even greater responsibilities 100 years earlier. but the interesting thing about that story is not only that it happened, but that stevenson didn't publicize it. he didn't expect anyone to know about that story. is that accurate? >> it's true.

in fact, he didn't -- none of us knew about it until later. years later, i said i read this, is this true, and he said yes. but he didn't talk about it. >> you have to understand, this story, the family's involvement goes back to jesse phil, five generations. i've tried to record it, american politics in history as we knew it in the black book. it begins with jesse phil, who was lincoln's patron. lincoln was a constant presence in this family, right here is little evidence. lincoln was an inspiration. woodrow wilson, former president of princeton, my father was a graduate of princeton in 1922. wilson was an influence also. the enlightened internationalism of wilson heavily influenced my father, but lincoln, who might never have been president without jesse phil, the citizen, among other things proposed the lincoln-douglas debates.

lincoln was an inspiration and forever a presence in this family. >> and our next call for our three guests talking about adlai stevenson comes from oak island, north carolina. jimmy, please, go ahead. >> caller: thanks for taking my call. i am a world war ii veteran, and, of course, it was part of the eisenhower army, but i didn't feel like, at the time -- i'm from north carolina, which you see was one of the blue states that voted for adlai both times, and we felt that adlai was a politician and more able to handle the political things and general eisenhower was more of a military person. and you would know times were good.

i was wondering what do y'all think, how would the united states have changed in that eight years if adlai stevenson had been president rather than dwight eisenhower? >> senator stevenson, let's start with you. >> you know, dwight d. eisenhower has been quoted first by edley donovan, then by "time life" and recently by a member of his family by saying if he'd known stevenson was to be the democratic candidate, he would not have run for president. i think on the large international issues there was probably not a great deal of difference between them. one thing my father really, you know, felt strongly about,

richard nixon -- richard nixon was loathed by just about everybody in washington. his strength was at the grassroots, and, you know, after the checker speech and that incident and eisenhower's retention of nixon on the ticket, i think that, you know, caused some doubts in his mind about eisenhower. but he respected eisenhower. and my father was such a figure in the world that john foster dulles, perhaps reluctantly, made him a roving official ambassador of the eisenhower administration so that in his travels throughout the world, he could officially represent the united states. if there'd been a difference, and the real differences then were between democrats and the eisenhower wing of the republican party with the taft wing. eisenhower's problems were with taft in the conservative wing of the republican party.

if my father had been a president, you probably would have had the new frontier and the great society accelerated. medicare, federal aid to education, other, you know, such programs might have taken effect earlier. as it was, much of it didn't take effect until after the assassination of kennedy, when johnson very shrewdly -- i remember him consulting my father, what should i do now, you, adlai, should be in these shoes, but you're not. what's your advice? my father was very flattered, i guess you should take time now and put your program and administration together, and he said, no, this is my moment. and within 100 days, the program was all through congress. you know, he knew timing.

he was a real politician, but that program had been developing over, you know, since the '52 campaign and might have been accelerated, you know, a little had my father won in '52 or '56. >> newton minow? >> i think adlai's got it exactly right, except i would add one thing. i think because adlai was so committed to getting rid of nuclear war, i think we might have had faster progress than actually occurred later in dealing with the russians and dealing with nuclear disarmament. i think that was such a passionate belief that i think he would have given much more attention and persuasion to it than occurred. and i think also that the -- we would have had more friends throughout the world than we ended up with at that time. >> richard?

>> you know, it's interesting. it is hard to imagine, and, of course, that's what we're doing is imagining, but it is hard to imagine president stevenson sending that u2 plane in may of 1960 on the eve of a great summit. one quick thing. i do think they had real respect for each other. i think they also, as most political adversaries learn to discover the weaknesses of one another, i suspect eisenhower, over time, grew rather resentful of the implication that stevenson was the only wordsmith, the only great eloquent persuader in american politics, and he once said that

really, if words are all that matter, the american people can vote for ernest hemingway for president, which i think was a veiled criticism of stevenson. >> next call for our three guests here on "the contenders" comes from portland, oregon, hi, joe. >> caller: howdy, and thank you for taking my call. in '52, i was a high school kid living in a republican household, but in '56, i had spent the previous summer as an intern for wayne morse and was fixed forever. i remember well in '56 there was a disappointment, kind of, at the convention, because there wasn't really a contest as there had been in '52. i wondered if you could elaborate more on how the decision was made to throw it open to convention, whether it was so everybody could have a good time or whether it was at least, in part, to be able to dodge the animosity of all of the candidates that didn't get it. >> newton minow, if you could start, then senator stevenson, we want to hear about your role. >> i think adlai felt that he had seen firsthand how the vice president was picked in '52 was so casually done. he realized it needed much more attention. he also was under a lot of pressure.

he was fond of hubert humphrey. he didn't like kefauver, even though he had been in the primaries. he thought jack kennedy was very promising but was too young and too inexperienced, and so he decided -- also decided it would give a lot of excitement to the convention, which had been pretty much prearranged to his own nomination, so he decided to open it up, and i think it turned out to be as he predicted. it turned out to be an exciting contest and introduced jack kennedy to the country, so there was a lot of good things with it.

>> newt has it right. the outcome of the presidential balloting was a foregone conclusion, so to create some excitement and interest, he decided to throw up the balloting for vice president, and quietly, we were all rooting for john f. kennedy, though my father adored hubert humphrey and sr. senator al gore were first-rate public servants, but i remember at the state house and at the convention when the his own nomination so he decided to open it up, and i think it turned out to be as he predicted. it turned out to be an exciting contest, and it introduced jack kennedy to the country. so there was a lot of good things with it. >> newt has it right. the outcome of the presidential ball lotting was a foregone conclusion.

so create some excitement and interest, he decided to throw open the balloting for vice president. and quietly, we were all rooting for john f. kennedy, though we had -- my father adored hubert humphrey and senator al gore were first-rate public servants. but i remember at the statehouse inn at the convention when the balloting was seesawing for vice president and kennedy was ahead running downstairs to kennedy's suite where sergeant shriver's brother-in-law was holding the -- guarding the door, running in, jack kennedy was pulling up his trousers, shook his hand and congratulated him. and by the time i got back up to my father's suite, i saw him lose. we, all of us, were rooting for jack kennedy, but newt is absolutely right. this brought kennedy to the nation's attention. and it also spared him involvement in a failed campaign for president and vice president. >> well, let's move four years ahead to the 1960 democratic convention in los angeles. senator stevens, how would you describe the relationship between your father and jack kennedy in 1960? >> well, i think actually, the relationship between my father and jack kennedy was close. i know my father respected kennedy. and i believe it was mutual. but there was, and newt was closer, really, a circle, a very protective circle around john f. kennedy, which was always fearful, always resentful. and in this case, concerned that stevenson was a threat. people were pouring in from across the country. by the tens of thousands. literally hammering on the doors, in some cases knocking down the doors of that convention to demand another nomination for their candidate. eleanor roosevelt was there.

and gene mccarthy gave a brilliant nominating address for stevenson. and this caused a little anxiety in the kennedy camp. and it probably caused a little, you know, interest, thought on my father's part that maybe if things deadlocked, he could still win the nomination. he had felt that a leader of the party and out of loyalty to eleanor roosevelt and supporters, he should be neutral and he was neutral. i was thinking if he had a chance, maybe neutrality was the best way of getting there. the former secretary of labor was also involved in state administration told me he was in my father's suite on the eve of the balloting. and my father said when bobby kennedy calls, tell him i've gone to bed and i've left instructions not to be woken. well, sure enough, bobby kennedy called.

and said i've got to talk to the governor. and willard said i'm sorry, he's gone to bed. well, you just tell him this is his last chance. and he better talk to me, or he won't be secretary of state. and willard wuertz responded, i'm sorry, but he has instructed me to tell you that he has gone to bed. so that was the end of any chance for secretary of state. so that was the end of any chance for secretary of state. but it signifies a very protective circle around him, and in the cuban missile crisis, when my father was villified.

>> and we'll start at the 1960 convention, adlai stevenson at the podium. here it is. >> i want to tell you how grateful i am for this tumultuous and exciting convention. i have, however, an observation. after getting in and out of the biltmore hotel in this hall i decided that i know who you're going to nominate. it will be the last survivor. >> the details in my participation have not been worked out, but i campaigned where he wanted me to and i

suspect that will in the west and in the east and possibly in between. >> do you think you can persuade all the stevenson followers to vote for you? >> i hope so. >> what will you do about it? how would you go about it? >> well, i hope by this participation in the campaign that i haven't had much doubt that they would split the ticket. and i hope that they will support it vigorously and in the same manner that i do. >> i hope they will follow you as strongly as they did in los angeles, governor. >> i hope they will follow you as vigorously as they followed me. >> i hope. >> and we saw a bit from the convention and a press conference after jfk got the nomination. newton minnow. >> well, i had the most extraordinary experience involving adlai stevenson and

jack kennedy, was on may 29th, 1960, his birthday. was the day after the last primary in oregon. and jack kennedy was flying from oregon to hyannis to a family birthday party, and bill boyar, our law partner, had suggested that he stop in chicago. we had concluded that it was impossible for adlai to be nominated again. we were hoping they would come to some terms and adlai would support kennedy. so we got in the car and adlai drove out here. and in the course that bill was driving, jack was in the front seat. i was in the back seat. jack kennedy said do you think i should talk to him about

secretary of state? and bill was smarter than i did, he didn't say anything. and the silence, i couldn't stand the silence. i said i wouldn't do that if i were you. and he looked at me and said why, i said well, adlai will be offended. and second, you ought to decide yourself who you want if you're elected. and came out here, and adlai and nancy were here, adlai iii, they managed to get the two of them alone into adlai's study. and the minute they came out i could see it had not gone well. and we're getting back in the car to go back. and -- i was dying of curiosity. so i said jack, did you say something about secretary of state, and he looked at me with those steely eyes, and he said you told me not to! i thought what have i done?

so as soon as i got home i called adlai and told him the entire thing from beginning to end. he said you did the right thing. he said i would have been very offended. and he said besides, he should decide who he wants. and then i decided i better tell the kennedys. so i called hyannis, jack had not arrived yet. i told him exactly what i told adlai, so i felt i had a clean conscience and had not screwed it up. >> can i ask you a question? we saw that clip from 1960, the joke stevenson made at the podium and a moment of maximum suspense. they described the scene, almost that it was stevenson's moment and he threw it away. that he was in a position with the right remarks to have taken that convention away. is that unrealistic?

is that -- was that convention jack kennedy's no matter what happened, or can you see a scenario in which stevenson at the peak of his form may have in fact set something on fire? >> i think he knew that it wouldn't -- wasn't going to happen. i think he had talked to richard daley, mayor richard j.daley, i think he knew. one other thing, i have always thought that in mccarthy's speech, it was not sincere. i felt he was working for lyndon johnson, because he had never been that close to governor stevenson. and i just finished reading jackie kennedy's tapes. and she says that jack kennedy said the same thing. so there are two people who

thought that gene mccarthy was -- >> let's let senator stevenson get in here. >> i don't think i want to attribute the motive to gene mccarthy, the gossip at the time was that gene was jealous, because it was this catholic instead of that catholic who was getting the nomination. i think that is unworthy of gene mccarthy. number one, newt minnow's advice was absolutely right. my father would have resented it. he had encouraged everybody to go out and support the candidates of their choice, including richard j. daley of illinois. including the pledge, you make a pledge, you don't break it. the nomination was sewed up. but yet, there was a lot of tension and fear and a lot of

dynamism in the works. after the convention, my father campaigned strongly all over the country for john f. kennedy. and bobby kennedy's first stop on the campaign trail was right here. at the home where we had a great rally out on the lawn for bobby kennedy. now newt minnow referred to the book put out by carolyn kennedy, regarding audiotapes attached to this that arthur sclesinger taped with ms. kennedy, shortly after the assassination. and they were just released. here is jackie kennedy talking about adlai stevenson and jfk. >> and then the big thing with governor stevenson wanting -- telling him that he would have

to have the u.n. i can remember jack telling me about that. >> does that give him a lot of difficulty -- or was he rather amused by all of it? >> it was unpleasant. he didn't like having to do it or anything. i remember at the earliest times when we spoke of it he knew that governor stevenson would get the u.n., it was sort of unpleasant to have to tell someone that. and i remember their conference on the doorstep was -- rather vague, or stevenson said he didn't have anything to say. something funny. >> why do you suppose he started against stevenson? >> stevenson never lifted one finger to help him. but yet it was not just bitterness, look at all the people jack helped who had been against him. he knew -- felt that man had a real disease of being unable to

make up his mind. and stevenson irritated him. i don't think he could have borne to have him come in every day to complain about something, as secretary of state. i mean it would have been an awfully difficult situation. >> senator stevenson, can we get your reaction? >> well, unfortunately, i couldn't hear it. i knew jackie kennedy. and i can tell you that i don't think she was political at all. in fact, she was a very artistic woman. an intellectual, who used to leave washington on weekends, would sometimes spend time at bobby's home. she was not athletic, she would go to new york to the theater with my father. and from all i could see they had a very good relationship. and he gave her you know, kind

of an escape from washington. i've heard about these -- heard these comments. not just these, but all of her comments that they are critical of just about everybody. so i don't know what to -- kind of credibility to place on that. but from what i could see her relationship with my father was very good and in some ways, closer than to some of the kennedys maybe. >> minnow, a short comment? could you hear the audiotape of jackie kennedy? >> yeah, i think -- i was with adlai and jackie, not often but several times. i think they had a very good relationship. >> what about jfk and adlai stevenson? >> jfk and adlai and -- had a very important experience about that. i had had a very minor role in the cuban missile crisis.

but i was involved a little bit. when it was over it was an article in the "saturday evening post." and in it there was some critical comments, not attributed to any single person about what adlai had proposed. which was actually what the united states did. it was -- we've closed our missile headquarters in turkey and greece in exchange for the bargain that was reached about cuba. but it was critical. and i knew that adlai was upset by it. and early in the morning one day president kennedy called me at home. and he said will you tell your leader, he always would refer to -- when he talked to me about adlai, he said tell your leader that i did not leak that story.

he said -- there was a rumor around that i'm the one who leaked it. tell them i did not leak it. well, i called the gov, and i had his number and got him on the phone in five seconds. he picked up the phone in the embassy in new york. and he said i can't talk to you now. i'm on my way to "the today s w show" to be interviewed. and i said well give me one second, the president has called and told me to tell you he did not leak that story. the guv didn't say anything. 15 minutes later i turned on "the today show" and he gave jfk holy hell about the episode and got it off his chest. later jfk wrote him a letter apologizing. saying he didn't do it. but he made it clear that what adlai had contributed to the cuban missile crisis solution

was indispensablindispensable. >> thank you for holding, bill, please go ahead with your question or comment about adlai stevenson. bill? >> caller: can you elaborate on the influence of richard j.daley, of course as you already referred to mayor of chicago. and the influence that daley had on stevenson's rise in illinois politics? >> senator stevenson, can we start with you? >> it's the other way around. my father got richard daley started in politics. as i mentioned earlier, my father recruited these extraordinary professionals from -- and they came without the endorsements of political leaders and campaign contributors. there was one partial exception and that was richard j. daley

who had been a state senator and maybe did have the endorsement of the cook county chairman. and he served with great distinction as the director of the department of revenue. he is a great officer. and later my officer supported richard j. daley when he contested in chicago against the incumbent mayor of that city. this is incredible. the governor of that state siding with the challenger to the incumbent governor. so my father was -- had a lot to do with the rise of richard j. daley. it was not the other way around at all. >> washington, d.c., go ahead, dave, we're talking about adlai stevenson here on the contenders. >> caller: hi -- >> hi, congressman, how are you

sir? everybody know congressman dave obie? >> caller: i just want to tell a story about adlai stevenson in madison, wisconsin, in the '60 campaign. i was a student at the university of wisconsin. and adlai had come to madison to give a speech to the civil war round table. and afterwards he was scheduled to appear with then governor gaylord nelson at the old park hotel. and we had a large crowd of democrats gathered. they were over an hour late. the crowd was very restive. and finally, they ushered adlai stevenson to the front of the room. gaylord gathered the microphone and said i'm sorry we were so late but there were a lot of questions at the round table. so he said i have to get the governor over to the mansion and get him to bed. he has a long day tomorrow. and he said i'll give a

typically short speech. and adlai said i'll give a typically long one, he said you do and i'll leave. he said go ahead, see who the crowd follows. and the crowd erupted in laughter. and i think that just shows how quick adlai was on his feet and how clever he could be in making the audience feel good about it. he was my hero. >> congressman obie, a lot of talk this evening about the fact that adlai stevenson was the architect of the later great society. would you agree with that? >> caller: i think he certainly defined in the '56 campaign what most of the issues later became that the democratic party ran on and stood for years. he really set the agenda for the coming democratcade in that cam >> that was congressman obie, we didn't know he would call, a

longtime congressman from wisconsin, thank you for joining us. seattle, richard, hello? >> caller: i -- am the author of a book about eleanor roosevelt and adlai stevenson just published last year. and i would like to relay one of the anecdotes from the campaign trail that was a favorite of the campaign team. and then give you a little comment from that. all about adlai. and the incident is about the clubwoman who came up to him after a speech and said oh, mr. stevenson, your speech was positively superfluous, to which he replied, thank you, i have been thinking about having it published posthumously. >> senator, i know you're in

your dad's office over there. and there is a set of books of his speeches and they were actually best sellers, correct? >> yes, and incidentally my own book was here, little black book which i tried to record of american politics as we knew over the five generations, including the humor, which enriched our politics and could be used to really very good effect, too. you could for example use it to denigrate on opponent without being mean-spirited. but the memories, i try to record over the five generations starting with lincoln and ending with china and the epilogue on the life cycle of nations and empires is aimed to recall what we're doing tonight. the values that created this country and contrast them with those of which i'm afraid are undermining it today. >> and we talked a little bit

about this. richard norton smith, i want your reaction, the cuban missile crisis, adlai stevenson was u.s. ambassador to the united nations. >> and remember it didn't happen in a vacuum. a year earlier you talk about the strained relationship with the white house. the kennedy administration had in effect put its ambassador in a humiliating situation on the bay of pigs. later, in 1962 you have a situation in which we have irrefutable evidence that the russians are installing missiles on castro's cuba. and what transpires -- the great paradox. i cannot think of a less sound bite political politic than adlai stevenson. and yet if you go on youtube today he is immortalized by one

of the great sound bites of the 20th century. >> and we'll listen to it right now. >> let me ask you one simple question, do you, ambassador zoren, deny that the ussr has placed and is placing medium and intermediate range missiles in cuba, yes or no. don't wait for the translation. yes or no. [ speaking in a foreign language ] >> mr. stevenson, would you continue your statement. you will receive the answer in due course, do not worry. [ speaking in a foreign language ] >> i'm prepared to wait for my answer until hell freezes over,

is that your decision? >> richard norton smith. >> until hell freezes over, one of the great sound bites of the 20th century. and afterwards, one of the kennedys, maybe it was the president, or bobby, i'm not sure, who allegedly said i didn't know adlai had it in him. >> that's true. >> well, you know, you mentioned the bay of pigs earlier. he was fed a great deal of misinformation which he relayed to the security council and of course it came out that this information was false. he felt very embarrassed but it was the kennedy administration who was embarrassed. nobody doubted my father's integrity. and newt alluded to the pbay of pigs earlier. the bay of pig's suggestion was exactly like my father's, maybe trading bases in turkey for the

absolving of the missiles. my father didn't want it to be secret because he didn't want to embarrass khrushchev. he wanted to give him an opportunity to retreat. that didn't happen, and of course khrushchev was embarrassed just as my father feared. he fell, he was succeeded by a group from which emerged breschnev, because they had to be tough in giving him a way out. >> one of the goals of the contenders was to figure out how they changed their policies, changed american politics. and after we take this call, we'll move into the topic area. please go ahead with your question. >> thank you. i was just curious as to whether or not you have ever heard of an organization called the builder

berg, and if adlai stevenson had been to the conference before. >> thank you for your call. >> this adlai stevenson has been to a builderberg conference, i don't know about my father, how far back that goes. and i don't know what the implications are, builder berg conferences were occasionally meetings against senior figures around the world. they got together to discuss the problems facing the world. absolutely nothing sinister about them. yes, this adlai stevenson has been to a couple of them. i don't know that my father was or even if they existed during his time. >> we were in the stevenson barn, and in the stevenson barn is a new exhibit about adlai stevenson. richard norton smith, you and i looked at this before we started. this is in 1945, the u.n.

formation. do you remember that photograph over there? you were commenting on the different players in the photograph. >> well, yeah, i do. i haven't got it in front of me. >> also remarkable. >> you have john foster dulles. and of course adlai stevenson, before the governorship. >> and nelson rockefeller. harold statson, before he was taken seriously. secretary of state, who was about to be fired. so what was adlai stevenson's role in the founding of the u.n.? >> you want to take that? >> had to do with a proprietary conference as i understood. >> he was also a delegate to the conference in san francisco. and then he was -- at which the

united nations was adopted. or approved. but by late 1945, we were living in london where he was the u.s. delegate to the prepatory commission, which laid the foundation, i mean, actually started to put the building blocks together including the location in new york. he represented the united states at that commission where great men from all over europe and candidate -- andre gromiko were there. they used to gather at our home because we had access to the commissary. an extraordinary group of people. but he was in on the birth of the united nations and incidentally, he died 20 years later just a couple of blocks from our home in london in 1945. that was '65, still serving the

united nations in this country. >> and we want to talk about adlai stevenson and his effect on the democratic party. here he is in 1952, talking about the democratic party. >> i have been pardoned by the conduct of this convention, you have argued and agreed. because as democrats you care and care deeply. but you have disagreed and argued without calling each other liars and thieves, without destroying our best traditions. you have not spoiled our best traditions in any nation's struggles for power. and you have written the platform that neither equivocates, contradicts, nor evades. you have restated our party's record. its principles and purposes in language that none can mistake. nor am i afraid that the democratic party is old and fat and indolent.

after 150 years it has been old for a long time and it will never be indolent, as long as it looks be indolent as it looks forward. you will hear many sincere and thoughtful people expressing concerns about the continuation of the one party and power for 20 years. i don't belittle this attitude. the sake of change has no absolute merit itself. the democratic party is the people's party and not the labor party, not the farmers party. it is a party of no one because it is a party of everyone. [ applause ] [ cheers ]

>> i think -- adlai's contribution to the country was to -- he hopes campaigns could educate people and he succeeded. he succeeded in teaching all of us of politics that something all of us should be involved in. i recently met the governor of indiana. >> mitch daniels? >> mitch daniels. i said i am sorry you are not running for presidency. he said w"why do you say that, know you are a democratic." he said i learned from my boss, stevenson, that the best people should run and not the worse people. >> adlai talks to all of us. it is a legacy that is extremely

grateful that his contribution is enduring today. >> yeah, i think historically, of course, it is abridged between the new deal and the new frontier. he holds the loft of the better of the liberalism in the '50s. adlai stevenson believes in america's exceptionalism. it was an exceptionalism about ideas and ideals. it was leading by examples. it was not an exceptionalism and forced by military force. he brought a whole generation by young people who were inspired by his words and examples and his approach. he's very unorthodox approach to

politics. we have a caller. >> caller: in 1952, when i was 13-year-old, i was privileged to meet adlai stevenson. he came to the hotel warren where my mom and dad owned the hotel and i was privileged to wait tables on him. we, kids, grew up in the hotel and after meeting him, i admired him the rest of my life. i am now 72-year-old, and i am still just so admiring this wonderful democratic person and i am just so thrilled that he was a man of morality and he was a man that fought for the working people. we need more adlai stevenson in this world right now. and, i am just so happy that i

met him and he -- the rest of my life -- >> all right, carrie joe, lets you talk to an adlai stevenson. >> all right, the question we are left with is adlai stevenson possible today in this money drenched corrupt, dysfunctional politics? would he or even he compete for president of the united states going from stand to zastand and raising money for interest for jingles on television of the half hour block of time would be impossible. i am not sure that he would be possible today, led alone franklin roosevelt, he would not be physically possible for him which is why we created this

stevenson's center. we try to recall his values and history that created in this country and contrast them with our politics today. can a politic as corrupted as ours be expected purified or reformed itself? >> i have faith in the american people. >> senator stevenson as adlai stevenson the third. if you had to go to the store and show your name some where, do people react? >> i saw this young woman at the counter looking at my credit card and she was -- looking at my name and she was like, is

that name familiar to you? she said, "no, but it is cool." [ laughs ] >> our politics have been forgotten, too. >> jim in east brunswick, new jersey. >> caller: yes, i would like to relate in the governor's life. i recently reviewed several hours of cbs news coverage. throughout that afternoon, continit was referred to governor stevenson visiting dallas a few weeks earlier and warning the president not to go there and i researched that and it seems like an airport event, a woman

hit governor stevenson over the head with a plaquer and seems a little more than that. i wonder if the panel could we flekt reflect on that and any regrets. >> all right, jim, we got that call, richard, you talked about this earlier, the situation. >> yeah, very briefly, he gone to dallas for a united nations event. it was confronted by this not an an gry people. >> he was struck and he certainly left with a vivid sense of potential dangers that the president might encounter. >> did he call the president and warn him or was that just a thought? >> i don't know the answer to that. >> senator stevenson, do you know the answer to that?

>> no, my recollection, first of all, he was asked if he wanted this woman who hit him over the head prosecuted, he said, "no, i want her educated." >> my recollection was he did not worn the white house and deeply regretted afterwards that he had not. i am sure add had he called and describing this experienc experience -- but, he felt guilty trying to prevent the president to go to dallas >> what have we did not talk tonight and bringing this out. >> we are going to take this call from phillip in fort worth, texas.

>> caller: good evening, i really appreciate this on c-span. i grew up in the 1960s, i was just 12-year-old. >> i grew up in the '50s. while i am a conservative and always been so. i doubt that mr. stevenson and i would not agreed very much. i have been exposed to his speeches and rhetoric and a lot of the things he said and i am in the opinion that he's one of the last really great political speech makers in our age and we were speaking a moment ago about jingles and things like that. i saw him making that speech, he was takeing some of it from his notes and pre-teleprompter days. i always admire his speech making able.

he had something to say, he took a little time to say it. he was a man who knew what he wanted to say and said it well. newton. >> he took great efforts on those speeches and he worked on it himself. hour after hour, he was criticized by the politicians. that's his legacy. as we whine up his program, i have to say one of the biggest surprises in my life was when he died so suddenly. adlai three called me and tell me that he and i record seculars of his will. i did not know anything about that. that to me was a touching thing of our relationship.

he won the hearts of millions and millions of americans and the place of history. >> he raised the standards. >> one question i love to ask mr. stevenson because at the end of his father's life, it is becoming a vocal and ambassador stevenson was seriously contemplating, resigning from the united nation. -- i am wondering if he ever discussed that with his dad and what his senses of his dad's intent. i think this label conservative and liberal can be misleading. he was a creature of reasons.

we were not right or left o or -- products of the enlightenment and ideology did not play much in our role. >> i did hear from a very, very close friend that he was planning to resign from the united nations at the end of the year. largely because he was very uncomfortable advocating policies that he did not supp t support, by that i mean vietnam and he died in june of '65, july

of '65 before he could resign. i think he was planning to resign. >> quietly, no protests, that would not have been his -- his way at all because he really could not continue to advocate policies. >> that'll have to be the last word. adlai stevenson, the second is buried in bloomington, illinois. >> senator adlai stevenson, the third, thank you for being with us this even and newton and richard norton smith, this has been a contender. we leave you from this 1966, convention. >> i say trust the people. trust their good sense and decency and faith and great decisions. i say it is time to take this government away from men who only know how to count and turn it back to men and women who

care. [ applause ] we are showing you american history tv normally seen on weekends. coming up, adlai stevenson's 1952 acceptance speech, democratic convention and the discussion of the 1952 campaign between adlai stevenson and dwight howard. >> american history tv primetime continues wednesday night with a look at 1964 presidential campaign of barry goldwater. a two hours discussion of the nominee. at 10:50, a look at his role and the conservation movement in the 1950s