being here and your time and we'll continue following the rest of the conference today. thank you very much for being here today.

want to thank each of you for being here. we thank you. it's very timely. in 2009 the obama administration shifted the direction of u.s./burma policy. taking a leap of faith that an approach combining engagement and pressure would help usher in democratic reform where sanctions alone had failed. although many were skeptical burma's 2010 elections brought an opportunity to test a more proactive engagement approach. and in the ensuing years the united states worked to balance engagement with military and the democratic grass roots movement. undoubtably this had a positi positivefect on the burma's democratic reforms including the 2015 election. and while the 2015 election was historic, burma's democratic transition has been a work in

progress. along with its complex, ethnic and cultural history, the burmese military continues to control key ministries in large swaths of the economy. which is why there was some concern in 2016 when the obumau administration unilaterally rolled back most of the restrictions on u.s. engagement with burma. a year into the new policy the question is was this too soon? the burmese economy remains weak and projected flows of u.s. investment have not materialized. human rights regulations are untouched, structural reforms have not progressed and the peace progress is stagnant. in recent weeks we've also witnessed the appalling images of atrocities being committed by the burmese military against the rohingya minority. hundreds of men and women and children systematically killed, hundreds of thousands of people

fled as their homes burned. we continue to hear the truly heart breaking accounts of human suffering. international frustration at burmese government's failure to protect against such atrocities is even more heightened. given decades of hope, state department defacto leader. of course our first priority must remain humanitarian situation, including half a million men, women and children who fled to bangladesh. i also think we should not shy away from an honest assessment of u.s. policy towards burma. last year i raised specific concerns with ms. sue chae about her government's -- and i publicly shared my shock and dismay at her dismissiveness at these concerns.

an attitude that has remained even in the face of mounting internation criticism. her failure to acknowledge the seemingly systematic campaign of brutality by the burmese military, continues to undermine democratic transition as a whole. the united states should not abandoned burma, however, it might be time for a policy adjustment. hope to have a candid conversation about the direction of u.s. policy towards burma, including the role congress can play in addressing humanitarian efforts. i want to thank you again for being here. i want to take -- i think it's merkley's birthday today. is that right? >> yes, mr. chairman. >> yes, sir. >> as much as i -- >> i can tell you were not paying attention to my opening statement. and i want to know if you're listening. and i understand you're getting ready to go to burma?

>> we're certainly hoping to get that together. if i could invite all the members to join us. >> well, first of all, happy birthday and you really know where to go to celebrate a birthday. so we appreciate your willingness to take that trip. mr. chairman, thank you so much for holding this hearing. now it's burma. another country that's committing ethnic cleansing. another country under the watch of the international community that's allowed to purp trait an atrocity. make no mistake about it, trausties have taken place in burma. we have the humanitarian crisis. we have purp traitors who expect impunity. and there's no reason to doubt that in fact that may in fact

occur. this is ethnic cleansing. i know that the administration is evaluating that as we're holding this hearing. ethnic cleansing is defined by the united nations commitment of exprlths as rendering an area ethnically home genius by removing persons of given groups from an area. half of the population of the rohingyas in burma have left. 600,000 now of 1.2 million. there's been a systematic burning of their villages. this didn't just start. it's been a campaign that's gone on for a long period of time. since 1982 law denies them citizenship even though they have been residents for generations. they're denied freedom of movement, denied freedom of education, denied health care. this has been a systematic effort to destroy an ethnic

community. and once again we see this happening and once again expectation is well, it's far away. we'll just let it go along. we got to be outraged about what's happening. we need to see the international community come together and say no we will not let this continue. that we'll hold those accountable that are responsible. that we'll provide it humanitarian need immediately. that we'll stop this type of conduct in a civilized society. cannot occur. yes, i think it's genocide. i know there will be some discussion about it whether it's genocide or not. deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or

in part. that's what's happening. they're trying to destroy the population. are people arguing intent. what else are they doing this for other than the purity of their country and their lack of tolerance for a minority population? for decades the burmese government has systematically opressed the rohingya people. that is the fact. and they have deliberately failed to integrate the population into the general population. a u.n. high commissioner of human rights correctly stated that decades of persistent and systematic human rights violations have almost certainly contributed to the nurturing of violent extremism with everyone ultimately losing. they complain about extremism. they're creating it. in my opinion we're witnessing a

military-sponsored ethnic cleansing campaign on the rohingya and it will take significant init gaugement at the highest levels in partnership with the burmese civilian government to hold perpetrators accountable for these horrific acts. unfortuna unfortunately the rohingya crisis is not the only vexing crisis. the burmese military continues to hold significant influence in power and the economy. the peace process was sought to end, has stalled. the chairman's right. the state counselor was here. she's an impressive person. but she's not taking on the challenge. she's not responding to the crisis in her own country. the military control burma today. that's unacceptable. that's why we imposed sanctions

because of military control. sanction relief was given for what? so people can be ethnically cleansed? i agree with the chairman. we need to not only reevaluate, we need have a policy in regards to burma that we understand. that addresses these human rights violations. that reevaluates our position as far as having normal relations and sanctions. the psz will be attending the summit very shortly. will he be mentioned burma and human rights as a top priority during this trip? i certainly hope so. and i do want to compliment the bangladesh government for keeping the borders open. that's been one bright spot. but there is a humanitarian crisis of the refugees in bangladesh that we all have to

respond to. so i am looking forward to hearing from our witnesses. i thank each of them. they all have very distinguished records and great confidence in their expertise on the subject. but i do notice on a subject as important as this, it would we nice to have at least one witness that was confirmed by the senate that brings that degree of importance from the administration on the subject and lastly i would ask consent that numerous statements from ngo's about this statement be made part of the record. >> thank you for your strong opening statement. you and i were together i guess at vice president biden's home when it was very evident that the titular head, if you will of the country, is very dismissive as it relates to this whole group of people. >> particularly on the trafficking issue i remember you brought up. there was no reality at all it

was going on. >> our first witness is deputy assistant secretary for at the department of state. thank you, sir for your service. second witness today is deputy assistant secretary for the bureau of population refugees miigation and migration at the department of state. our third witness is ms. kate siri. that was an approving smile. i did that correctly. thank you. acting deputy assistant of democracy conflict at the u.s. agency for international development, thank you for your service. if each of you could sums are in about five minutes, any written materials you have will be enteri entered into the record. >> chairman corker, ranking member carden, distinguished

members of the committee, burma has emerged from a decade's long struggle to defy authoritarian rule and to transation to a democratic society. however, it a devastating humanitarian crisis in rakhine state has exacerbate the suffering of ethic rohingya and other populations and threatened this otherwise peaceful transition. as do other long standing challenges that the elected government authority, civilian authority inherited a mere 16 months ago. although the new government is committed to improving the prospects for all the diverse populations of burma, today's hearing illuminates the fridgility of this conference. on august 25th, attacks on burmese security forces and subsequent violence and massive displacement occasionsed by the military's disproportionate

response have created a crisis that demands our undivided attention. support the dis placed in their return home. and address the perennial conditions that sparked this most recent colossal population movement of over 600,000 people to bangladesh and several 00,000s in internally. president trump has discussed the situation with other leaders. secretary tillerson called state counselor to reafirm support for the emerging democracy and urge action on this crisis. vice president pence denounced the heavy handed response at the u.n. where ambassador hailey called for an international role in ending the violence. our ambassador has engaged government military leaders. i visited burma, including rakhine state and met with

gumptd figures and displaced populations. we have consulted with many countries. our collective message to burma stake holders is clear. end the violence, protect civilians, expand humanitarian and media access, hold those guilty accountable. repatriot safely those who have fled and cooperate with the international community. we've inhad krjed burma's to overcome mistrust and missed opportunities for international help. although the crisis persists, our engagement is yielding some results. on october 12th, silaid out goals. we're engaging with her government to implement its goals. burma recently sent a senior official to bangladesh and more

senior contact is scheduled this week. a top u.s. official visited burma to address human rights access. i travelled to singapore, thailand and vietnam. others have engaged across the region. building support for constructive diplomatic engagement. we welcome the decision to activate its own humanitarian assistance mechanism for rakhine state. we know that a prerequisite is assurances of security. accordingly. the department of state has identified and announced new and ongoing actions to pursue accountability for those who have committed violence, including, among other measures, suspending travel wagers from military leaders, assessing jade act authorities to consider economic options available to target individuals associate would atrocities.

finding that all units and officers involved in operations in northern rakhine state are pursuant to the lehigh law. rescinding invitations for burmese security leaders to attend u.s.-sponsored events, maintaining an embargo on military sales. un, human rights counsels and other venues. pressing for access for the fact finding mission and exploring mechanisms under u.s. law, including global mag nitsky targeted sanctions. a failure will only result in a future replay of this tragedy. it is thus crucial that we support burma in implementing the recommendations of the rakhine advisory commission led by former secretary general to address underdevelopment,

shortcomings in services, access to justice and a citizenship process for all people in rakhine state. an emerging democracy, the country's success is important to us. to burma's diverse populations and to the future. the long-term viability depends on reforms to end violence and the potential for international terrorism. the very ingredients associated with the current crisis and other ongoing conflicts. in doing so, we look to partner with congress on burma as we have done across successive administrations for kedecades. we thank this committee for its leadership and bipartisanship.

chairman corker, ranking member carden, distinguished members of the committee, thank you for inviting us to this important hearing. i'm grateful the opportunity to update you on how the u.s. government is targeting life changing humanitarian assistance and the violence ahead. it continues to dev state vulnerable populations and cause families, mostly women and children to flee for their lives. the violent reaction that followed prompted more than 600,000 people to flee bangladesh, bringing the total number of rohingya in bangladesh to roughly 1 million peepl and force further displacement inside rakhine state itself. the magnitude and speed make it one of the most dramatic humanitarian crisis in decades. in burma our number one humanitarian priority is gaining access to those in need in rakhine state.

burma's civilian government has committed publicly and privately to provide humanitarian assistance through the red cross movement. the movement has stressed to the burmese government that it will not be able to fully meet humanitarian needs and the international organizations will also need operational space. we emphasize at all opportunities to burmese officials at all levels of government the requirement to allow hooum anitarian assistance to reach those in need. we continue to press the government and the military both publicly and privately to end the violence to protect the security of our communities and to allow rohingya refugees to voluntarily return to their homes after burmese authorities insure they can do so safely. responsibility remains with burma. we greatly appreciate the government of bangladesh for opening its doors, many of whom

arrived after walking for days in need of food, water, shelter and medical care. the monsoon season has exaser baited the situation as flooding has made aid delivery even more challenging. we urge them to uphold humanitarian principals while balancinging their own security concerns. in addition the united states is providing humanitarian assistance to help vulnerable populations aect iffed by the u rakhine state. an estimated $434 million required for emergency response in bangladesh to meet needs only through the end of february 2018. thanks to the support of this congress, the united states nearly $104 million in assistance to displaced

populations in burma and for refugees from burma throughout the region. of this funding department of state's contribution totalled nearly $176 million. 3/4s of the total humanitarian response. including 34 million in emergency assistance to address inlatest crisis. this allowed partners on the ground to respond immediately as refugees were already arriving to the newly stabbed camps. our contributions provide food, shelter, water, and core relief items both inside burma and in bangladesh. we also target assistance for victims of gender-based violence and larly for vulnerable children. yesterday in geneva, countries pledged over $400 million to

meet the need. the united states is not carrying this burden alone. the primary goals are protection and establishing meaningful durable solutions for those that have been displaced include regturning home when conditions permit. the u.s. government humanitarian assistance f ancance provides at lifeline until this bekwms a possibility. we're grateful for the g generosity of the congress and american people who make our assistance possible. >> ms. siri. >> yes. thank you for invietding me to speak to you today. the violence in northern rakhine state has results in massive displacements in not only

myanmar but bangladesh. the this marks the decision point with the whole world watching. in response to the crisis providing humanitarian assistance on both sides of the border. this is in addition to our ongoing developmental assistance which supports good governance, economic development and the country's challenging peace process. through these programs we're wur working to address the things that created this cycle of violence. we're deeply concerned. more than 600,000 people have fled the recent violence and sought refuge in the bangladesh. stark challenges remain to adequately respond. the people fleeing over to bangladesh, many women and children arrive only with what they could carry. they are echoir urgent life changing assistance including

safe drinking water, emergency food assistance and shelter. inside rakhine state there's an unknown number of internaly displaced persons in need of assistance. in 2017, the united states provided nearly $100 million -- through use aids offer of foreign disaster assistance, the agency fro -- we expect to continue responding in fiscal year 20iny a18. in burma our main challenge is not the lack of resources but a lack of access. since the august 25th attacks many wrouf say its partners were forced to suspend its work due the military operations in rakhine state. government restrictions have prevented humanitarians from reaching people in need. false rumors about rohingya have

contributed to the volatility. we continue to allow unhindled how many anitarian access and we thu urge the media to allow monitors to assess the aflicted areas. the united states has stood by vulnerable communities in burma for decades. establishment of a formal mission in 2012 has allowed us to more effectively support those in burma. today foster national reconciliation and peace, improve the lives by increasing access to better health services and economic activities. and continues to support an inclusive peace process asuppors civil society. the path we face ahead is by no

means an easy one. and the challenges in burma are complex and deep rooted. it remains in the u.s. government pfsh interest to continue our support for burma's democratic transition while addressing root causes of conflict in rakhine and other parts of burma. this support is critical to sustain the transition and deliver on the dividends of democracy that the people of burma expect. the latest violence has exer baited the existing human rights crisis impacting the lives of thousands' you must be honest and forth right and clear on what we expect as humanitarians and as americans. in the long term our development efforts must continue to address the underlying drivers of the violence. but in the immediate term, untim the conflict is resolved, we shall remain resolute to alleviate the suffering of all

communities. we call all stake holders to ends the violence and seek a lasting revolution to this conflict. thank you for the opportunity to testify before you today and i look forward to your questions. >> thank you all for your testimony. >> i also thank you for your testimony. if i could get a yes or no answer on your personal views whether what's happening there is ethnic cleansing. i understand the administration is going through a process. yes or no would be helpful. >> thank you, senator. if you'll permit me a slightly more elaborate answer. >> no. >> my bosses have said -- >> i'm asking your view. >> unfortunately i'm not in a position to make a determination. you're correct we're referring to a process to lead to that determination. in the meantime we conclude there have been atrocities,

depopulation of villages that cause us great concern, therefore we're pursuing all avenues for accountability. hypothetically a determination of ethnic cleansing will not change our pursuit of full accountability. cou >> could you answer yes or no. >> senator, i worked in humanitarian affairs off and on for 30 years and i've witnessed over that time and in this case we've seen so-called clearing operations that have resulted in the clearing of 600,000 people in their homes to a foreign country and probably within 00,000 people from inside burma to other displacement. i'm not in the position like my colleague to characterize it today but i do want to say that to me this very closely resembles some of the worst atrocities i see. >> maybe i can get one out of

three. >> unfortunately the role of our organization is not to define legally what is happening. >> i asked your personal opinion. >> i'm not in the position -- >> i think this is one of the problems we have. clarity is important. this is ethnic cleansing. it's pretty clear and if we don't say it, it will happen again and again and again. now, i'm for the efforts for stopping the violence and i support all the international efforts for humanitarian assistance for those in bangladesh and those displaced in burma. i'm for pursuing the peace process. absolutely. it's got to be our top priority. but if we don't do something to end the cycle of violence with impunity. and mr. murphy i appreciate your

view that you want to impose sanctions against the military or use magnitsky, which is a bill i'm proud about. but where are the generals for what they've done in raping people, burning villages. where is the accountability for thoez who are responsible for directing this? >> senator, i agree with you. >> what is the united states doing? >> as i said in my statement we have announced measured to pursue accountability. including the consultation with the very orlg organizations that have those tools available to them. we are taking measured ourselves but we have to admit we have very limited influence and leverage. we don't have a normal relationship with this military. we haven't for decades.

and the process of lifting sanctions we have isolated restrictions on the military that remain in place. we will take additional measures as i've said to restrict travel here, to explore measures how we can sanction individuals found poobe accountable. and that's an important path forward for us to take. >> who's in charge in burma? is it the civilian or military? >> that's an excellent question and the answer like burma itself is complicated. this is a power sharing arrangement. >> who's reabsponsible for the atrocities? >> there are many contributors to violence. the security forces told the greatest responsibility for protecting civilians and they have failed. however, we must point out there

is vigil ante action, civilians conducting violence against other civilians. the rohingya militants -- >> it's not by the military? >> in some cases they are acting in concert with security forces, yes. >> so did we make a mistake on relaxing the sanctions because burma was moving away from a military government? >> senator, i think the decision to lift the national emergency was a reflection that sanctions had run their course -- >> so you're talking about imposing new sanctions? >> we're talking about targeted measures. >> that's an institution of its government. i would agree with you if you're talking about holding people criminally responsible for their criminal activities. i don't see that coming. thank you, mr. chairman. >> senator, young. >> thank you mr. chairman and our panelists for your attendance here today. i agree with the ranking member.

we need to speak with moral clarity on this matter. the united states clearly needs lead. ambassador hailey, i was proud of her. she assessed the burmese government is conducting a quote brutdal sustained campaign to cleanse the country. cleanse the country of an ethic minority. the u.n. high commissioner has referred to the situation as a fekst book example of ethnic cleansing. i understand your positions and we're in the course of an assessment internalty but i hope our government speaks with moral clarity on this matter. we often refer to the international community and the international community some have karlcharacterized as an ox moron phrase. i don't think the international community is going to end up in a position where they are not only condemning the behavior but

acting boldly to address the needs of the effected p populations. there are relativestic nations, those who will passively stand by and watch these sorts of actions continue unless the united states leads on these and other matters. so, thank you to my colleague, senator merkley. he worked with me on a letter we sent to ambassador hailey regarding this very issue of ethnic cleansing in rohingya some days ago. 21 of my colleagues signed on to it. have each of you reviewed that letter? okay. thank you. i saw an affirmative nod from each. we called on the burmese government to permit safe access to journalists, u.n. fact finders and to humanitarians. and secretaries murphy and

scarela, you indicated the number one humanitarian priority is to gain asche ccess to those need in the rakhine state. ms. seary, you called the lack of access the main challenge and you say that due to restrictions imposed by the burmese authorities that access is not happening. why is the lack of access to effected populations the main challenge and what is the burmese precise role in hindering that access? >> senator, thank you for your question and for the letter from you and so many other members highlighting that issue of access is absolutely essential. thank you for including that in your letter. the reason it's the main challenge is because there's northern rakhine state and central rakhine state. in northern rakhine state, which

is the area most dopely effected. the lonely international ngo that has access is the red cross movement and they have very limited aabilities. they have said themselves they cannot provide the range of support that is needed. our partners, the u.n. agencies stand by and are ready to provide that support but cannot do so. in central rakhine state there's more ability to provide access and help but it's also severely limited. we've recently been able to restore some of the service but only operating at 50%. the question about the role of the burmese government is that the burmese government authorities are the ones that provide permits necessary to access these areas and they have not given it. even when there are travel permits, there's excessive layers of bureaucracy and high levels of ethnic tension in those areas that make it

difficult to deliver the aid. and one more thing on the importance of access for journalists and media. this gets to the question of accountsability. unless we're actually able to see and document these areas that makes account nability in e future important. that's why we continue to call for and appreciate your support. >> i got 30 seconds left. i want to commend the administration. the administration has generally spoken forcefully about the need for humanitarians to gain access and on the diplomatic front i feel thus far they've been pretty strong. secretaries, you did indicate the burmese government's commitment to provide humanitarian access was encouraging. to me i'm not particularly encouraged. neither gestures nor statements nor some feudal actions at this

point are enough. we need bold action. i hope each of you will community that that to your burmese counterparts every time you're interacting with them. i'll certainly be delivering that strong message and thank you again for your service. >> thank you, mr. chairman and thank you for holding this hearing because i think it's so important we put a very bright spotlight on this horrendous situation. and i'll be happy to use the term that our representing us from the executive branch not willing to use. this ethnic cleansing. villages destroyed and not one word from our president. thousands of children slaughtered, not one word from president trump. thousands of women raped, thousands of men, women shot as they fled from their villages.

600,000 refugees and not one word from our president during this horrific situation. are you recommending to the president he speak loudly and forcefully on this issue if each of you could tell me yes or no. >> senator, as i noted the president has spoken with a number of leaders about the sachuation -- >> are you recommending he take a forceful public statement to shine the international spotlight on this issue? >> i believe the administration spoken with clarity. >> you are not saying yes or no so i assume the answer is no. are you, sir, recommending to the president that he speak and take a public position on this? >> senator, merkley, thank you very much for the question. we are recommending we speak forcefully and directly about -- >> thank you. can we expect such a statement from the president in the next week? >> i'm not in a --

>> thank you. appreciate you pressing for that. >> likes with i'm obviously as an agency we defer to our state department colleagues lead but yes, as an agency we continue to call on all parties to speak forcefully, to do what we can to end the violence and hold people accountable. >> you can't really call on all parties to speak forcefully if our own president is not speaking forcefully. i have a commission report of the united nations office by commissioner, september 13th through 24th if i could enter that into the record. >> without objection. >> i'd like to quote a piece of this and they use the term myanmar security forces purposely destroyed property of rohingya, torched their villages not only to drive the population out but to prevent the fleeing victims to return. the destruction of the burmese

military of livestock and even trees rending the possibility of rohingya to returning to normal lives in the future almost impossible. it also indicates an effort to ef effecti effectively erase all signs of the villages and memory in such a way that return to their lands would yield nothing but desolate and unrecognizable terrain. information received indicates the myanmar security forces targeted teachers and cultural and religious leadership and other people of influence in an effort to diminish rohingya culture and knowledge. does that sound like ethnic cleansing to you? don't everyone rush to answer. >> senator, first, let me say that through the support of the united states congress the united states government is the strongest supporter of the unhcr.

not only financially but through our diplomatic engagement around the world. we support what the high commissioner is doing strongly. we believe what he has described are in fact an accurate depiction of the atrocities. >> i appreciate that and i'm very glad to hear that because i believe that if you carry that message to the highest levels of the department that you believe this is an accurate description, that we will see forceful representation of america responding to this. i recall our secretary of state talking to me when he was being considered for nomination and he said he was going to provide moral leadership guidance and yet here we have this horrific instance and we have virtually noe voice, no pressure, no ---ing very polite words about supporting the evolving democracy in burma and stuff. almost things that sound like

well, we think they're doing a good job trying to address this. they're not doing a good job. and none of you testified the military is behind this. this is an act not by random forces. this is an act by the gumpovernt of burma and we need to respond with enormous moral clarity and force on this issue. and i hope you will make that happen. >> thank you very much. senator gardner. >> thank you, mr. chairman, to the witnesses for being here today at this very important hearing. i think all of us recognize the crisis as nothing short of a humanitarian catastrophe and the u.s. must be resolute in assisting the refugees and seeking accountability for the many crimes being committed. i reiterated that very message personally in my meeting with burma's ambassador to the united states and will continue to do so. deeply saddened and outraged at

the events. we all are and have to be. i visited burma in may of 2016 and had a long conversation, as well as the united states as well. with the leader. and expressed our condemnation in the strongest terms possible what's unfolded for decades. it threatens to -- and reform in burma i witnessed first hand during that visit. and we must also look to the broad eer questions of whether u.s. policy has succeeded in that country. and i know that's what this committee hearing is about today. and i thank the witnesses for participating. i'm struck by several of the answers. i guess i want to start following up on something that senator carden said to secretary murphy.

last year, last congress the decision was nide lift the sanctions against burma. will that be reversed? was it a mistake? >> senator, appreciate your long standing interest in burma and i think your visit there does equip you to understand many of the challenges this country faces. i want to take the opportunity to sbeek the moral clarity. there's been questions about where the administration is. we've stated in our testimony today we have witnessed terrible crimes. there is increasing evidence that security forces are associated with vigil ante action. these individuals will be held accountable. we will pursue accountability. i have also stated that american security forces have -- security forces bear the greatest responsibility for protecting local populations and have failed to do so. our sanctions program was des n

designed to see the expression of the will of the burmese people. we saw successful election, an elected government just 16 months ago began very significant efforts to end conflicts around the country and try to address the plight of the rohingya people. that does not excuse it for criticisms of its shortcomings. we're looking for all stake holders to take actions. we also have to realize what this government is up against. i don't take their position or defend it, but the elected government does not have full control over the military. ethnic rakhine leaders are opposed to humanitarian asins, they're opposed to citizenship to the rohingya. they hold incredible sway. the entire country has prejudice and racism directed at the rohingya. any government is going to have

difficulties in overcoming those obstacles. so we have to support those in government who see a better path forward and indeed this government invited the formation of the commission and adoptd and accepted the recommendations. they provide the best path forward for the rohingya people. broad sanctions, those are under discussion. but i have to allow broad sanctions could very well make those vulnerable populations that still remain more vulnerable, susceptible to the same violence and criminal activity that's taken place thus far. we have to be very careful with our approach so we can achieve the objectives we're talking about today. safe return, accountability for those who have committed atroci atrocities. >> i expressed my concern over and over. i even put a hold on ambassador over my objection that we lived

the national emergency order at state department that were put in place and i just don't understand, i still do not understand how we think somehow we are better off having done that and the actions that we've seen by -- in burma, how the rohingya are better off as a result of it. seems like we gave a carrot without any return to bav bhavior that would impruvl the plight of the catastrophe unfolding there. china, obviously very important economical economically. what have they done? >> senator, i think first on sanctions we are talking about targeted measures to acheechb behavior change and protect civilians. we have to realize in terms of broad sanctions the united states was the last country standing with significant restrictions. it was hurting our interests, the ability of this elected

government to have a good start in addressing the problems that had been ignored by 50 years of military authoritarian oppressive rule. it does it does not mean they received perfection. we knew there would be many challenges. we have to look at the tools available to us to encourage behavior change and proper actions. proper actions are required by all in the international community, including china. we would hope as a member of the security council, china could join us. and china needs to work with others to understand that the instability that's being created could affect the neighborhood, including china's own interest. >> has china publically condemned the actions. >> we are looking for better posture on their part. >> thank you. thank you very much.

>> well, thank you all very much for being here and for your ongoing work. i share the frustration that you are hearing among my colleagues on this committee about our inability to better affect the outcome of what's happening in berma. i understand that there have been allegations of sexual violations, of rape of other action targeting rohingya women by the security forces. can you tell me, any one of you, if we have raised those specific concerns of gender based violence with the bermese government? >> we share your concerns. the reports coming from refugees would suggest a wide range of abuses and atrocities including sexual violence, violence against women and children.

these are vulnerable populations within a vulnerable population. this is not a monolithic government that has full authority. >> no, i understand. >> so, yes, we have had considerations through our ambassador, with the commander in chief of the armed forces. we have expressed our concerns with other stakeholders, including local populations, local leaders, and we have pointed out that this kind of displacement threatens the transition to democracy, created a much bigger risk for the attraction of international terrorism and could set berma back. it is not country's interest to pave a path forward in the betterment of all 55 million people. >> i appreciate that. unless you have a different response, ambassador, i'm going

to move on. >> senator, i just like to say that our ambassador herself went and visited with victims of gender based violence so she herself could hear their testimony through the support of this congress we are providing assistance to thousands of people who have been victims of that violence. thank you. >> thank you. i do appreciate that and this week the senator and i will reintrotuesday the national violence against women act and i think it speaks to the sporns f importance of that legislation. i understand that there are an estimated 69,000 pregnant rohingya refugee women in bangladesh. i'm not sure if that number is correct. but the main assistance that they're getting is from the unfpa, and i certainly support that. i support the efforts that the

unfpa makes around the world to help pregnant women and women vulnerable, women who are need in pre and post natal care. can you tell me if the administration supports unfp a's efforts here and how we do that? >> senator, the united states does support efforts for women who are particularly vulnerable. we are working with a number of different agencies to ensure there are things like gender approapriate la treens availabl. >> but we're not supporting the efforts of unfpa. is that correct? >> we are limiting our support at this time. >> that's unfortunate and the women who really need that help.

i don't know if any of you can answer this question, but i do know that i have heard from people who have in new hampshire and other places who have expressed concern about why he has not spoken out more forcefully on this circumstance. mr. murphy, i guess this is for you. what is your assessment of the situation there? why do you think she has not spoken out more forcefully and what do you think would happen to that power sharing arrangement if she did? >> senator, my parents are residents of new hampshire and asked me the same question. what i do know in berma, one of the fundamental problems we're facing is widespread prejudice and racism directed specifically at the rohingya. there are also many populations that have suffered from discrimination, including inside

rakine state. they have suffered from centrally directed discrimination. it is a very complicated environment. we could like to see more champions, more vocal voices for the rohingya and repressed populations and we know it is a complicated environmentment speaking out on behalf of the row is a dangerous proposition right now. i don't think that can withhold us from criticizing, from urging broader human dignity and respect for each other. our particular message is not just to the government. also to the armed forces. local ethnic leaders but also the broad members of the bermese nation. think about your fellow human beings. the terrible treatment of the rohingya is a real achilles heel

for the country and its transition. we need a broad public campaign of education for all bermese to understand they are in this together. they are part of the pfabric. they need to find a way forward, and that's a broad message. we're looking not just for a singular champion but for all tho understand human dignity is a real aspect to this cry sglis so what kind of message do you think it sends to people? could i just ask one more people. >> as long as you don't ask him to answer it. >> that's fine. it's a rhetorical statement. what kind of a message does it send to bermese leadership, military and civil yan when in the united states we have a travel ban on members coming into this country. thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you very much. >> i want to thank all three of you for your service.

i think what you are seeing here today is some considerable frustration and outrage amongst members of this committee. there is no difference in our feeling. all of the committee in that regard. we all share this outrage. i want to thank you for your leadership on this issue and for speaking with the clarity that you have spoken with today. i appreciate you do not communicate directly with the president and can't pound on his desk and tell him what he should do and shouldn't do. as the state department certainly you speak with the full force and effect of the united states, the foreign policy behind you and for that we appreciate. that our job of course in this committee is to help craft foreign policy. and that will be done i'm sure as we move forward through resolutions or statutes that

address this problem. i think today you have been very clear in assessing how difficult this is to da and one of the things that i find that shows the difficult nature of this and these are my words, not yours, but it seems like you are facing an entire population, a country, that possesses a prejudice that we're -- that's not appropriate, obviously. and it's manifesting itself in some very bad things. now, i don't know how you address that. certainly sanctions are one way to do that. but prejudice is not easily overcome and frankly i don't know that sanctions are something that are going to convince people that they should be thinking differently than what they are. but i'd like to hear each of you address briefly if you would this issue that we're dealing with, not an individual which we

frequently are in some countries. n not even just the military but really the civilian government plus the population of the government that is really turning a blind eye towards this. do you have suggestions for changing that conduct? >> senator, very much appreciate your perspectives. and this current crisis is appalling. it's sad. it's outrageous. i want to share with you my frustration doesn't begin with this crisis. it began 20 years ago when i first visited northern rohingya state and have worked on the particular challenge of the repressed rohingya population. it's been a long standing problem. unfortunately of course frustration doesn't translate into action. we need to take measures to achieve behavior change and a

path forward. we have identified something new in the current elected government environment, and that is a willingness to tackle the underlying challenges in the state. a path to citizenship, development for all of the underdeveloped populations that reside there. i want to revisit that advisory commission. it is no small measure that this commission was formed under the leadership of the former un secretary general and came up with 88 very specific recommendations. the new government has embraced them. we now need to see implementation. we need other stake holders to support those recommendations, local leaders in rakine state, including cooperation with bangladesh. accept to basic government services that have been lacking. most importantly a path to citizenship. so this population has a means to participate and gain from the

benefits that other citizens enjoy. it's not going to be easy. these recommendations are both short term and long term. but we have a government that is willing to do something where previous military regimes simply repressed and ignore it. that does not mean this government has taken all the right steps. we are calling on the government to do all that it can to end the violence, stop the hate speech, pave a path forward for repay treeuated refugees and find a way towards national peace. this government has convenieed conference unprecedented since the 1940s, bringing together all representatives throughout the country to pave a path forward and ending conflict. as we talk about conflict today, there is ongoing conflict in the north. berma has been at war with itself nonstop for over 70 years.

and this government is trying to achieve some peace. we need to work with those stakeholders who see a better way. at the same time, we talked about targeted s eed sanctioned measures for those not with the program. >> thank you very much. my time is up. i apologize. i really wanted to hear both of your perspectives also. i would say thank you again for your service. i know how disheartening is as we listen to these facts. don't give up. represent us as you have and continue with the development of policy that will do the best we can to do something about this. >> thank you very much. >> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you to the witnesses. this is an important hearing and i missed a little bit of your opening statements, and i apologize, but i picked up on some rhetoric and language i want to pick up on. just for the record, the french president macrone at the end of

september said what was happening to the rohingya was constituted aga ed geneside and turkish president also labeled it genicide. we need to determine what it is and labeling it. you talk, i think it was mr. murphy i heard you use the word wills veg lanty action. you think of sort of rogue individuals, not connected with the government doing things. but this is clearly action. it isn't just vigilantes or an expression of prejudice, but there is official actors involved, including the muilitay in ways that are not deniable. you also condemned the military's disproportionate response and i think that's a disproportionate response on the

actions of the military. but i don't view the military as just being a responder. i think they have been a participant and often an initiator on many of the attacks of the rohingya. so i think if we want to be careful about language like ethnic cleansing and genecide, we ought to be careful about it. but all the evidence would suggest it has more of an official sanction and i guess that's the basis of the work underway in the state determine to determine exactly how the label it. i want to ask questions about bangladesh. these reef gees are largely going to bangladesh which has its own set of challenges. could you tell the committee how the flow of refugees is affecting that country? are there things we could do?

>> senator kaine, the fresh of refugees entering bangladesh is hard for this country. also facing difficult weather, it is nearly impossible. i think that bangladesh has done an extremely admirable job, first by opening its borders. then by working with the international community to permit opportunities for assistance to reach the people that are there. one of the most important things they have done is to work with the unhcr to undertake a registration of those arriving. i spoke with the dcm yesterday. he told me 13,000 are being registered per day. >> there are about 600,000 fled. >> 603,0 0 by the last count.

i think that bangladesh has demonstrated a great deal of patience in working with the authorities. there was a meeting today in which the home affairs minister is working -- of bangladesh is working with the bermese to pave the way for eventual returns. >> that 603,000, that's about half of the total rohingya population of berma if what i have heard is correct. is that accurate? >> we don't know the exact population because there has not been a ken scensus, but we beli about a million is more than half of the rohingya population. >> could you offer your perfective? >> thank you. so usaid worked closely with

them in bangladesh and agree with the ambassador's assessment in terms of the beangladesh's government. the ability to take in this massive, massive influx. our program through food for peace there is supplementing the efforts in terms of providing much needed food assistance, nutrition and a lot of it to give you the sense some of the work is going towards building roads to have a delivery into this confined area. we do have a robust development assistance program in bangladesh and we're looking to how to shape that to communities in those areas. >> mr. chair, i'll probably do questions for the record to flush out the extent of activities we're doing to help bangladesh and other things we

might do. >> thank you for being here. >> thank you, mr. chairman, ranking member for holding this important hearing and to our witnesses for focussing today on the appalling treatment of the rohingya. i'm grateful to all the members of the committee. in july, we held a briefs about the displacement of the roe at that point as the crisis has been discussed today, there is more than 600,000 that fled because of the military's brutality. there has been great debate. on september 17th, a moving letter was wrote in which he said, quote, if the political price is your silence, the price

is surely too steep. it is in congress for a symbol of righteousness to believe for your country. i agree with him. so if i might first to you, you just answered questions from senator kaine about what's happening on the ground in bangladesh. i'd be interested in whether you foresee the rohingya being able to return to berma and what steps you are taking to urge the government to recognize and protect them upon their return, whether they will get documentation of the citizenship and residency and what you believe the long term plan is in bangladesh and berma for their safe treatment and care and their return to their nation of

origin in berma. >> thank you very much for focussing on what is absolutely a critical question, the possibility to maintain the path open to returns. i think the first thing is we must under all circumstances insist that returns must be the goal and that they must voluntary and that the government of berma must provide for the security of returning refugees. we have seen some elements of progress, despite an otherwise dismal scenario. initially, as you know, the government of berma said they would not permit any funds to go any assistance organization whatsoever. they denied many of the things that everyone knew was going on. we insisted they go to humanitarian organizations like the red cross. that has now been permitted. the red cross has limited access because it shines a lot on what is going on there. over time we have seen that the statements of stake counselor this evolved.

in her statement of october 12th she outlined that the goals for repatriation, resettlement. that's in the right direction. we need to keep pushing on that. as i already mentioned in response to the question by senator kaine, we have to continue supporting bangladesh to make it possible for those returns to take place. i have worked on returns in other countries. this is going to require a lot of work at a political level to make it possible. but also requires working with the key institutions that will be able to monitor and set the conditions to ensure that those returns actually can be voluntary. so there is a path, and i think we have to just keep pushing down that path and not give up. >> thank you. i'm interested also in hearing as i might about the role religion has played in this crisis and what contribution the

conflict mitigation efforts might make to keep tensions from further exacerbating this. and i think the senator asked a relevant question, what impact it has on the world response and how our response is seen at a time when there is repeat litigation in our courts and repeat assertion by our president that we need to have a ban on those who might come to our country from the majority of muslim countries. >> thank you, senator, for that important question. part of our work in not only northern rohingya state is focussed specifically on this issue of building tolerance, ethnic and religious tolerance and promoting that. we build dialogue. we have found society groups more moderate in their views but don't have the space to speak out in terms of religious

tolerance and cross community efforts and our role is to create space for that and strengthen those organizations and link them up together. many moderates don't feel safe doing that right now, so i think that is a critical issue. we're happy to provide more information to you on that and what our programs are doing to support that. >> thank you. >> senator? >> thank you, mr. chairman, very much. it's a very important hearing. it's an absolute crisis that has broken out. and many in the rohingya community who have arrived in bangladesh following these clearance operations claim that soldiers entered into their villagesed civilians, rapeed women and girls.

some people bear gunshot wounds consistent with being shot from behind and some women and girls have injuries consistent with sexual assault. it is clear the military bears responsibility for these crimes, even if perpetrators at lower levels are unknown. berm a's commander in chief is responsiblesystemmatic crimes. >> thank you, senator. we share your concern about the abuses and atrocities. there is no reason to discount the credible reporting. it is for that reason we have announced measures at the state department to pursue accountability. and accountability will apply to all individuals and entities

responsible for per pet chew waiting. but in answer to a previous question or comment from senator kaine, there are other actors. there are the rohingya militants who conducted a tax on august 25th and subsequently have attacked other citizens. there are local civilians who have taken action in their own hands. sometimes as when i was in the state a few weeks ago in their own hands, that particular circumstance involved attacking a red cross shipment and indeed security forces helped forward that attack. that was a welcome sign. but there are vigilantes that are part of the equation. all of the military leadership is subject to our restrictions for travel to the united states subject to our restrictions for any assistance. that applies to the senior

general as well. the armed forces have responded -- >> have you yet imposed a travel ban on general min being able to visit the united states? have you imposed that yet. >> senator, there is an existing travel ban as a result of his rank and his position. that remains in force and we will under no circumstances right now pursue any waiver for his ability to travel to the united states or gain assistance from the united states. >> okay. so what other steps, then, would you recommend that we take given in the very near past we were as a government talking about enhanced military cooperation with berma. so that was a significant that was being sent to these people that obviously would have given them some assurance that they would not have to be concerned

can't any of their actions. so how has that been communicated to them? that is, how has -- how has the fact that working with other members was successful in having that language struck from the legislation as it was moving through a couple of months ago? what was the interpretation that they made of that action legislatively? >> senator, the reality is that our military to military relationship with berma is not normal and had not been for many, many decades. what we have communicated to the military in relation to the current crisis that that their path to normalization is obstructed by their failure to protect local populations. there is a conone drum here, and we have to acknowledge it. we hear this from government

figures inside berma. the armed forces has been isolated and not exposed to international standards, norms and regulations. they need more exposure to understand how to behave properly, how to be a professional military force, focus on national defense and not abuse its own people. unfortunate unfortunately, that's going to be for another day. that's a clear message that they have failed to protect local populations. >> and you agree with that message? >> absolutely. i have delivered that message directly to military figures. >> and the response is? >> look, i think part of the problem here is a failure in berma among many stakeholders to recognize what's taken place, massive displacement, failure to protect citizens and residents of the country.

that's part of our messaging. they need to see exactly what they have done. i think message that may resonate is most is their actions create a greater risk for international terrorism. they think they have a terrorism problem now. our message is that's not a real international terrorism problem. the kind of problem that could visit the territory is a real significant challenge they won't be equipped to handle and they are exacerbating that potential risk with these actions now. >> but it reminds you of el salvador in the '80s where we were giving money to the government and the generals were the leaders of the death squads. so i think this is a big issue that we're going to have to really press harder on in terms of their military and how they

are using the resources that i have. thank you, mr. chairman. >> i have a question and we have some closing comments here. i want to thank everybody for participating and thank you. obviously, this is all very damning to the leadership of berma. each of you have stated that clearly and the questions that have been asked have all been in that direction. if mrs. suchi were here, what would she be saying in defense of what has been happening in her own country? >> senator, i think it's a fair question, but honestly, i can't speak for her. i can relate to you in our conversations with her. secretary tillerson has spoken with her as well. we have tried to impress upon

her the need to take key actions. i think we have also recognized that it is a complicated environment. by describing the complexities, that doesn't absolve the government. i think she would point to we frankly need to support. that's hard to describe in this environment when there is such a crisis underway that behind the scenes there is a government elected represented the people and is taking unprecedented actions. a clear departure from authoritarian military rule. we don't want to behave now in a way that reverts berma back to military rule that would not be in the interest of other vulnerable populations. it wouldn't be in the u.s. interests. what we need to to is encourage the kind of actions they are taking now to make a better path for the rohingya. but we need other stakeholders to support those actions, primarily the armed forces and also i hasten to point out,

inside the state, ethnic leaders need to lower the hate speech, realize they need to share this space together. they all need to benefit from better treatment and benefit from development and international assistance, which has been the course of action to date. all international organizations are providing assistance to all vulnerable populations. i think, senator, the bottom line is we want to help berma succeed. this is an enormous crisis that could revert berma backwards. and it is a challenge. we need all stakeholders to contribute to that process. >> thank you, senator. i just really wanted to thank the witnesses for their efforts here and for what they are doing in representing our country. i do want to make a couple of comments. government has a responsibility, understands responsibility to

all parties. but when you assume the government responsibility, you have to show leadership, and we have not seen that from the bermese government. in regards to return, let me make this comment. if your village has been burnt down, it is going to be difficult to see where you are returning to. and if you are going to return to a situation where you are going to be in a detention camp, that may not be an acceptable safety issue and permanency issue as to how long that lasts. i would urge us to be very careful. we have to realize it is not only the ethnic problems. we also have physical problems and safety problems on the return. and lastly, secretary, i just want to emphasize, i have heard this argument many, many times about we don't want to impose sanctions that could hurt the people we're trying to help. that's like chalk on a chalk bard, on a board for me. i heard that argument about

hurting the jews in the soviet union if we impose sanctions and the jews are better off. i heard that about the blacks in south africa. i heart thd that about iran. we were able to engage iran because we imposed sanctions. i would urge us to understand that sanctions are much more preferred over military. and that we shouldn't be shy in using america's economic strength. >> i'll do a one minute commend if i could. two things i'm concerned about. one is that in regard to our military contacts with berma, we are currently hosting folks from the military in comprehensive

security response, transitional security cooperation, advanced security cooperation. so we do have -- we do have military officers have berma and i think we have to ask ourselves the question. the military organized the burning of nearly 300 villages. often the villages surrounded by a platoon set fire and then shoot people as they flee. i think we need to think about all the levers we have to pressure the military. they are really in charge. we can talk about the civilian side of berma, but it is the military that runs things, which is part of the reason that some folks say we should be careful about criticizing her because she doesn't have that much power. the military has the power.

the second thing is twice you have used the term vigilantes, which is the official excuse. a few people just acting randomly on their own do not surround hundreds of villages and shoot people in a coordinated action. i think use of that term gives cover to the military in a way that's totally unacceptable. >> thank you. thank you. thank you very much for your testimony and service of the country. we're going to leave the record open until the close of business thursday. if you could answer them fairly promptly, we'd appreciate it. again, we appreciate if you have been here and i know this committee will stay on top of this. we look forward to the report when he's back. with that the meeting is adjourned.

yesterday officials from two united nations announced that 340 million there are commitment to help more than 600,000 rohingya muslim refugees. here's more about that now. this is 20