i ask all vietnam veterans or any united states veterans who served during the vietnam era, which is november 1st, 1955 to may 15th, 1975 to stand and be recognized. [ applause ]

. >> we can see and learn about three original vietnam war era helicopters.

normandy, a flight of eight apache helicopters into iraq and destroyed two critical sites prior to the start of the allied air campaign. jengeneral cody is a board trus of the intrepid fallen heros fund, on the advisory board for the warriors and the lead pilot

for the organization flying heros. >> thank you, everybody, for our vietnam veterans and their families. sometimes saying thank you for your service isn't enough. i want to tell you what i really want to do is say thank you for inspiring a young 16-year-old in montpelier, vermont, back in 1966. because i got to watch your vietnam helicopter pilots, your daring on tv. that inspired me to want to

become like you, a helicopter pilot. thank you for everything you've done for this great country. in 1991, when i came back from the iraq war, it was 3:00 in the morning. i had my squadron from the 101st. we landed in bangor, maine. we were some of the last guys coming out of the iraq war, the

first gulf war. my guys were watching on tv, waiting back in saudi arabia. we saw all the parades and everybody become welcomed home. my troops are saying, geez, no one's going to greet us. at 3:00 in the morning we get off that airplane and there was a cordon of vietnam veterans at 3:00 in the morning giving us a welcome home from combat that you guys never got. i'll never forget watching young soldiers exchanging their sandy caps with the bush caps of the vietnam veterans. it touched me in a way that you'll never know.

we should take time to honor them. i'm very pleased that the archives are doing that. what you all did in vietnam was really transform our army and our way of thinking about warfare in terms of a 360 degree battlefield. and today many soldiers are alive from battles of iraq and afghanistan and other places we have fought in. we learned from you the tactics and procedures of vertical lift and aviation in the ground regime. a lot of people don't know that we sent 7,000 uh-1s to vietnam

and eithover 3,000 of them got down. we sent over 1100 cobras into combat. over 300 of those got shot down. over 2200 helicopter pilots, our fallen comrades got shot down and paid the last final salute to the united states and sacrificed to all of us. and we learned from all of that. i think it's fitting that we take time to understand the sacrifices of you guys and those over at arlington cemetery and how important it was and the way you pioneered today's aviation force.

it was vietnam veteran pilots that we called back to active duty to form up the gun ship company, the little bird lift company. and it was again the vietnam veteran helicopter pilots that we depended upon to get the tactics, techniques and procedures down so we could form up that special helicopter unit which is today is known as the night stalkers, probably the world's best unit on aviation. today you're going to get to hear from several of our vietnam helicopter pilots. they all have great stories to tell. they're all heros. they're all great americans, great patriots.

>> it's now my pleasure to turn the program over to our moderator duane williams.

he's a decorated veteran and helicopter pilot. graduated from flight school in 1966 and was assigned to the 175th helicopter company, outlaws and mavericks in vietnam where he served as gun ship pilot. he was reassigned to fort walters, texas as an instructor pilot into his honorable discharge in 1969. in the '70s he was an offshore pilot in the oil industry and then began a 31-year career with bell helicopter, first in iran and then fort worth, texas. he currently resides in arlington texas with his wife of over 52 years. please welcome duane williams and members of the north carolina vietnam helicopter pilots association.

>> good afternoon. can you hear me? thank you all for being here. it's certainly my pleasure in being here this evening. and i think it's even more so a great honor being here with these guys. whenever i was called and invited to come out here and participate, the first thing i did was go and check my size 40 flight suit i wore in vietnam. i think i could get one leg in it. [ laughter ]. >> but these guys maintain a strict regiment of workout, diet. and they fit in their size 40 really good. but my wife said you're going to look nice. so she dressed me up and here i

am. we do have a story today to tell, several stories. before we get into that, i would like to introduce these guys. first of all, they're from the north carolina vietnam helicopter pilots association. and they are the ones responsible for those beautiful aircraft that you see out front. they come all the way from north carolina. they got here sunday night and they will be here through sunday. they have been standing out there every day, long days, taking care, answering questions and they did a great job. i'd like to give them a hand for that. [ applause ]. >> to my right here is joe dellfonzoe. he was in vietnam in 1968. he was the commanding officer of the 604th transportation

company, call signs, caretakers. they provided maintenance for the 189th assault helicopter company maintaining 28 to 30 aircraft. sitting next to him is ed hughes, lieutenant colonel, retired. ed was in vietnam in 1971. he flew with the 116th, call sign hornets. and he is a survivor of 719. i don't know if you know what that is, but he is going to tell you about it. >> then we have jerry phelps. he was in vietnam in 68-69. he flew in the 101st. also i think he flew hueys and i

think he has an interesting story about flying 086 gun ships. last we have jerry sese siegel. he is the founding father of this group. he has done a tremendous job putting it all together and maintaining his aircraft. i know the work it takes. so i'd like for jerry to talk just a minute about this unit. >> first off, i'd like to thank the archives foundation and the staff of the archives here, bell helicopter and l3 technology for bringing us here to help honor the vietnam veterans. back in 1989, 16 pilots gathered

in north carolina to see if there was an interest in putting together a local organization whereby helicopter pilots could get together, tell war stories. i always say there's two things helicopter pilots don't do. they don't drink beer and they don't tell war stories. [ laughter ]. >> both of them are lying. >> and they don't lie. >> we started off with the 16 people at about 9:00 in the morning. and with two cases of beer, three dozen crispy cream donuts and a gallon of coffee. by 2:00 in the afternoon we had elected officers, written bylaws and a constitution and set up to be incorporated. luckily we had a lawyer present. three months later after some people decided we needed a helicopter to talk about, we

decided we would go ahead and try to get a helicopter. this took three years to get our first aircraft. after we put this thing together and got it presentable, we went to wilmington, north carolina, to do a parade. this was purely selfish on our part because we wanted to go down and ride in the parade. we did the parade. we were putting aircraft back together. we had 150 people standing around the aircraft. we realized then, wait a minute, there's an interest in this. from there, we proceeded to procure other aircraft. right now we have six aircraft. we do static displays up and down the east coast. we have done over 300,000 students in schools at no cost to schools. we can take these aircraft to schools and not only their historical part of their

education, but we can relate to source course of studies. this is the third trip to washington, d.c. this year. this year we did our third presidential inaugural parade with aircraft. hopefully we'll be around for another one. we'll see. one of the things i'm most proud of these guys is they put up with me and they go sometimes places that i wouldn't go with me. they put in long hours like they're doing out here today. we are self-supporting. we take no federal or state f d funding or no private sponsorship from organizations. we've been doing this for 28 years. we continue to do this

successfully. it can be done for organizations that's willing to put forth the effort to support these people. thank you all for supporting us here. >> the photos there are really not relevant to what we're talking about but they're really neat photos provided by bell helicopter. occasionally you'll see me flipping through this. right now i'm going to let joe talk just a minute about what it was like maintaining aircraft in a combat situation. >> thank you. it's a real honor and a privilege for me to be here. i was a young brash lieutenant down at fort campbell and gung ho and just couldn't wait to get to vietnam. i wanted to be the greatest

infantry platoon leader there ever was. fortunately the lord blessed me with a wonderful young lady who took me by the arm and said you're going to flight school. long story short, off we went. got to go to fixed wing flight school which was kind of unusual because in those days we needed helicopter pilots. but i went to fixed wing flight school, then rotary wing and aircraft maintenance and off to vietnam. i was confident i was going to end up flying a u-21, nice safe airplane, real high, no problems. i ended up at camp holloway and took over the 604th tc detachment attached to the ghost riders, the 189th assault helicopter company at probably the worst time in their history. ives -- i was talking there

earlier to one of our guys. we got there about the same time. it seems like in the month or two before i got there, there was some pretty intense combat operations up through that area. and the 52nd battalion had literally flown itself into the ground supporting the infantry and flying combat, as assault and evacuation missions of all kinds. when i arrived, our unit, it was 21 uh-1s, 20 slicks and eight gun ships, had absolutely nothing fly balable. we were short of parts. i just want to say a thank you to the maintenance personnel that worked behind the scenes over there. i had some of the best enlisted men and officers that i think the army ever saw.

they were professional. they were dead kadicated. they were competent beyond belief. maintenance guys are behind the scenes guys. you don't hear a lot about them. but let me tell you, maintenance is never ending. it's a marvelous aircraft. go it also takes a lot of maintenance, scheduled maintenance, unscheduled maintenance, combat damage to be repaired. our guys worked 24, sometimes 36 hours. we test flew airplanes after maintenance when we should not have, literally sitting there half asleep in the cockpit doing a half hour hover check to make sure everything was cool. jerry was one of my test pilots. the enlisted guys turned too.

we got back to our mission required 12 slicks and six gun ships within about a month. and it was only the dedication and the professionalism of the nco that did that. i had an infantry first sergeant and he was a leader's leader. the ncos are the back boeb bonee army. this guy took these young men under his arm and trained them and brought them up the way they should be, made them just love what they were doing. i had a technical inspector that had grown up with the huey. he knew as much as the airplane as probably any bell engineer out there. so i was blessed. i had the greatest warrant officers in the crowd. one of my guys said he could do

a rotation at night and land the thing on a dime in the dark and not have a problem. they could. they were that good. as i say, 24 hours a day, seven days a week. we just fixed airplanes. they loved what they were doing and they did it very very well. one of the more exciting parts of that was recovering downed aircraft. that would run the gamut. there were airplanes shot down that we'd have to go down and pick up and bring it back to be salvaged or fly again. there were aircraft we had to fix on site. one of the most exciting times i ever had was i went up to a hotly contested piece of

ground ground. we had an aircraft that landed there and had damage to the rotor blades. i was putting duct tape on the rotor blades. he's standing up on a 55 gallon drum trying to change the tail row t rotor on that airplane. the bad guys started lobbing motor shells. fortunately they were on the other side. we climbed down off the airplane and jumped over and hid in a ditch. the gunfire would go away and we'd go back up and do our thing

until they started shooting again. i said to francis, i think they're having more fun with us than anything else. we might as well finish this airplane and go home. so that's what we did. hard. and the other group that often gets overlooked, again, i want to make a shout out to the wives and families. we get all the glory. we get all the thank you for your service. but the wives and families that were left back here in the states waiting, we didn't have cell phones. we didn't have any way to talk to them or communicate with them for the most part except letters. and they were there. they were waiting, and they didn't know from day to day where we were. we were too busy, folks, honest to goodness, to think about it. i never thought about dying or getting shot or getting killed. i didn't have time to think about it. i had airplanes to fix. but my wife did.

and she thought about it every day, as did all of these guys' wives and their girlfriends and mothers and their families. so i just -- i just want to say a shout out to them. they deserve our gratitude forever. and i thank them. [ applause ] >> echoing joe, my young wife who for four months dropped me off at ft. walter, november '55, and last august, we celebrated our 52nd anniversary. and that's quite a feat, i think. >> amen. >> but my wife, just like joe's, boy, we chose well. and all you wives out there, you get kudos. you really do. i know you go through, and my wife suffered through, like joe said, they didn't know. i know my wife woke up one

morning or during the night with a terrible pain in the knee. she knew i had been shot, which i wasn't. she didn't know that. she didn't know that for weeks. so like joe said, they endured. they suffered and endured. and good for you, i tell you, the wives, a round of applause. jerry, mr. phelps. he was with the 101st, then he had, and i think it was the whole time, but one of the things he started flying was a 086 gun ship. i'll let him tell that story, what that was like. >> i arrived in vietnam and was assigned to charlie company 101, black widows that flew by. flew huky slicks for about two months. called down and said they asked for volunteers to fly the 086

with the 3rd brigade. i volunteered for that. i went up and joined the headquarters. headquarters company 3rd brigade. camp evans, vietnam. started flying the 086 with a mini gun on the left side and the door gunner in the right rear, and a few hand grenades. and we would go out, our typical day would start first light in the morning. we would do a recon around camp evans. looking for any target with the ground radar and sensors picked up the night before. many times it was just water buffalo. stuff like that. but every now and then, we would find a few bad guys. then our unit, we had six 086s. six uh-1s. the uh-1s were more command and control. we also had an infantry patrol

blues platoon company, one of the 086s went out and found some enemy activity we could insert the blues platoon to develop the situation. and at that time, they were fully armed, very few rations, just bullets and weapons. we never left the men overnight. we would call on officers, infantry platoons and companies to develop it further and we would pull our people out at night. after we completed these recons in the morning, we would either marry up with another 086 gunship and we would see a sign that maybe an a0 to recon and develop the situation in other areas or if there was a mission came in from a ground support unit that was in contact and needed some aerial support, we

would go help them out as much as we could. we could also marry up with the 4th and the 77th ara culprit. which really gave us a little firepower there. so we would go down and hunt the treetops, look around at what we could find, when we developed something, we would call in for the culprit to help take care of the situation. that was pretty much our routine every day. we did this, a perimeter every morning. and we worked anywhere from the dmz, ousouth to purchase garden eagle's nest, up by the rock pile and the dmz, the marine pace. always interesting going there because the marines were in the valley and the mountains on both sides were owned by the bad guys.

whenever we landed there, we took fire. but it was a very compelling job. i enjoyed doing it. i was extremely lucky. i was pretty good. i only got shot down one time. but we made it through, went back, got another helicopter and took off again. so i ended up with about 950 combat hours. >> thank you, jerry. [ applause ] >> jerry said 950 hours. i think the average, the average helicopter pilot in vietnam probably flew 1,000 hours. and that is a lot of time. that is a lot of time. you're involved in pretty much combat. from the time you lifted off, you could be shot any time. i think that was the average

time that pilots flew there. and when i introduced ed, when i first looked through their bios, i saw where ed hughes flew, he was in vietnam in '71, and he participated, and i don't know if you know the history of vietnam war. but this was primarily the south vietnam army operation. but that time, the station of the war was starting. a lot of the military, u.s. military were kind of standing down, so they didn't have the military support, but they weren't the primary units in this operation.

and it was the largest combat assault operation in the history of the entire vietnam war. and it was an incursion into laos to cut off the supply line. and they used 276 qes. and then i don't know how many culprits, but i'm sure there were several hundred. of that group, 168 helicopters were shot down. it was, i think going in, it wasn't too bad. it is always thickening up. lz, sometimes not so bad, but the pz, the pickup zone, oh, boy. that's when you sweated it. so anyway, i'm going to let ed tell us his story about 719. >> i showed up in vietnam in

july of 1970. was assigned to the 116th assault helicopter company through the yellowjacket platoon. as a new guy, they call you new guy. and for the first two or three months, you fly with the aircraft commanders that have been there and have earned the right to be an aircraft commander. after three months, or so, when you have accumulated 300 hours in country, then they put you up for a check ride. and you don't ride with one person. you ride with every aircraft commander in that unit that flies the type of aircraft you're going to fly. in my case, it was a uh-1d, and then a hotel model. you have to please every one of those pilots, those aircraft commanders. or you don't get called an aircraft commander. i was fortunate enough that i passed and i picked the hornet 24, and that's what i used for the rest of the time i was there. in qi, we ran normal missions of

an assault helicopter company. everything from ash and trash, carrying parts from point a to point b, resupply out to fire bases or to troops in the field. command and control. combat assault. could be two or three ships up to say ten ships in that area. in march of 1971, a lot of us were in the o-club, and we had a couple drinks, which we normally don't do, and they came across and made the announcement that all members of the 116th were to return to their units. so we went back to the unit, and our company commander, major henry hagwood, who retired as a two-star general, informed us we were going to program in federal 19. about an hour after that, we took off. i was flight leader of four slicks and two gunships. we got through the nang,

refueled, took off. started to cross the pass, for those of you who have been there, you know it goes down through the south china sea and from there it climbs up, i don't know how many thousands of feet, but it goes way up. in the dark, we all went in. everybody got out of it but me. knowing there was a mountain to my west, i pulled in torque and climbs as high and fast as i could go. about an hour later, i got radar patrol on board and he got me down into da nang. the next morning, we got briefed, that afternoon we were on our first flight into northern laos. that's where i developed my appreciation and respect for the world war ii aviators. i now have an idea of what they went through. you can imagine a helicopter flying through flats, not just an individual 51 or ak-47 shooting at you.

this was flat. you fly along and look up in front of you and a huey that was there a minute ago isn't there anymore. you would have cobras flying alongside, and they would find a 51 cowl, and they were told, do not attack individual 51 cowls. and the reason was they would sucker the cobra in, and then a second one would open up. they would shoot the cobra down. no army aviator is going to leave their buddy on the ground, so what happens? another cobra goes in, and then the third 51 cowl opens up. now you have two cobra pilots down there. we had a maintenance aircraft from 174th got shot down trying to get them out. those three crews stayed on the ground in a bunker, a bomb crater, for almost four days. until they inserted a platoon of rangers in there to secure it. when they did, that entire area

was surrounded with dead north vietnamese. those guys fought for their lives for three or four days. the federal 19, i never prayed so hard in all my life. from the minute we talk off to wherever we went west, back again, i was praying. some kind of hard. and then when we did the extractions, they were saying you're going to go pick them up. the first wavent in to pick them up. the south vietnamese were in panic mode. they were trying to get out of there because they were getting their you know whats clean. they were not being orderly about getting on the aircraft. the huey can carry about 13 people, eight combat troops plus a crew of four. these south vietnamese were cramming on the aircraft. i mean 13, 15, 20. whatever they could get on there. some of these hueys couldn't take off. they would try to and then they would crash as they went over the side of the ridgeline.

to counter that, we went through the maintenance people, vehicular maintenance, and got as much axel grease as we could get and greased the cross oo tubes and skids so if they were hanging on, they didn't stay long. that was the only way to save the aircraft and the crews and pilots. we did that for two or three days. i was telling dwayne earlier, i still have at home today an inch and a half piece of mortar round that went through the right of my aircraft going into one of those ridgelines. but, i mean, down south for a year, you got shot at. yeah, we took a bunch of hits here and there, put aircraft into maintenance because of it, but i tell you what, it woke me up. it really built my respect for the world war ii pilots. >> thank you, ed. [ applause ] >> like i said, when i saw ed, i

said we have to here this story. vietnam was a helicopter war. and i think it's where the helicopter -- it was in its infancy, and it had to crawl and walk and jog and run in a span of ten years. exactly what it did. across the board, all the military, all the branches combined, there was over 12,000 helicopters served in that war during that period of time. we lost 5,600 of those. through accidents, but most combat. and the iconic huey and the

cobras you see out front, general cody touched on that. the huey, it personifies that war. in fact, i don't know if you know it, but the united states postal service saw fit to put the huey on the stamp of the '60s for the vietnam war. so it's the face of that war. and there was over 7,000 hueys sent into vietnam. those 7,000 hueys flew 7.5 million flight hours. and we lost 3,600 of them. almost half. of the 12,000, we lost almost half. of the 7,000, we lost almost half. as general cody mentioned, the cobra was the johnny come

lately. didn't get there until late '67, '68 time, and it managed to fly over 1,000 hours. we lost 300. it was a risky business. i have read several articles where it listed the most dangerous job in vietnam. which one do you think is number one? helicopt helicopter air pilot. number two was alert. long range recon patrol. and oh, boy, those guys. third was the tunnel rats. let me tell you, tunnel rats should be at the top of the heap. so it was a risky business, and i think -- you know, that was just part of the price. and we lost a lot of good men. general cody mentioned the men

we lost. percentage wise, we represented a small number, but we had a high casualty rate overall. i read an article once where it said that the marines lost a lot of people, they lost over 13,000. and that the helicopter crewmen in the marines still -- you had three times as great a risk of being shot down and killed as a helicopter crewmen as you did being infantry. and the -- you know, we could sit here and talk about that, but i think, you know, the takeaway from that is i think as general cody said, it kind of was, it started a new -- now there's not a unit of military

in the world who doesn't have a lot of helicopters. i think these guys are the ones who kind of set the stage. any of you have anything you can add to this that would kind of -- >> i would like to add two comments. one, i want to back joe up on the maintenance personnel in vietnam. i flew 1100 combat hours in 12 months, never had one mechanical failure that was want caused by me hitting a tree. never had an injury failure, never had any problems at all. and the second thing is, one officer, any one officer pilots out here from our unit, outstanding. >> okay. >> medevac. >> flight school taught us how to fly the helicopters. the one officers in vietnam taught me how to really fly that helicopter and what it would do. everything i did after that, i owe to them, just like general cody said. they taught me how to fly that helicopter. what it could really do and how

to make it do it. >> when you get to vietnam, like you said, you're treated like a leper. like you said, the new guy. they don't know you. you're coming -- really, when we went, i graduated one month and i was in vietnam 20-some odd days later. and when i got to the unit, it was in the early -- we were really strapped for pilots. but they tried to -- every one of the eunicunits, it wasn't li throw that boy into the meat grinder. they all tried to give you time. i heard ed mention ash and trash. that was the fly, resupply in between combat assaults. and i think it took me -- it was 25 days, and i think it was 25 hours before they put you into combat is all. and i think on the fifth day, i was in a combat assault.

took me four days to get 25 hours. and imagine if you will a young man who just got there, didn't really know what it was all about, and i'm sitting as a co-pilot in a lift. the lift is comprised of ten aircraft. i would be in the second lift. it's an ld. they called it cold. which means nothing is going on. there are no bad guys. >> in reality, it meant nobody knew what was there. that was our experience. >> every tree line had a cobra. if there's a cobra in there, it's going to stirike. i just didn't know. i was sitting there, and there were jets on call, you know, and then there's a little air force

fax. and i'm listening to all this talk, you know, okay. and they're hearing gentlemen, we're on short final in the lz. 30 seconds. want to be in the kill zone, 30 seconds. well, they say your life span is 30 seconds in a kill zone in the lz. they start mortaring, eight seconds. but i'm sitting up here and that first lift hits, and they're about five minutes ahead of us. i mean all hell breaks loose. oh, my god, screaming, taking fire, getting shots, and i see shooting, and they're bringing in jets and the guns are hammering away, and i'm hearing screaming, taking fire from 2:00, 3:00, 4:00, and i'm thinking. whatever length of time i have between now and the time we land in the lz, that's how long i

have to live. i can't say i was scared. i was overwhelmed. i just kept thinking, how did i get in this movie? let me off. and then we come in and we landed. and the aircraft, the helicopter is hit, just when it comes in and slows and settles in, in our case, we settle in to the rice paddies. when it starts settling in, much like a duck on a pond, it settled and you are at your most vulnerable. you can't fly. you're settled in, and they know it takes you a while to get those troops off. 30 seconds, gentlemen. 30 seconds, get them off. get them off. and just when -- i see tracers flaggi flashing bys and guys in the water. okay, things slow down. okay, it's not good. and i am already, my gut is

sucked up and i'm already trying to shrink into that seat. and then i hear the trail, you have the lead in the front, now you have the trail. he's the eyes for the lead. he goes, they're dropping mortars in on us, lead. they're dropping mortars. i hear this clump, and i look over and i see this -- thank god we're in a rice paddy. if mortars, if it would have been a hard surface, we would have been flattened, but the mud absorbed it. i see mud flying and dirty black smoke or flame from it. then i see that and i hear aircraft is rocked. and gunner behind me screams, i have been hit. now, i am shrinking. doing my best to get behind that chest protector. i think, what have these guys got against me. then finally, at long last, the

trail says, troops are out. let's go. i tell you what, lead did not have to get a second feed. that aircraft came up and that nose ducked and we were right there. and we cleared the lz, one of the aircrafts called out mayday, i got to get in. my hydraulic has been hit. that's the life blood of the helicopter, and he's been shot, taking hits, so he managed to get out of the lz. and i'm thinking, and now we get out. we get away. we're going back to pick up more. and we're going to go back. oh, yeah. we're going to go back. you know, i think that was the mantra of the helicopters. those guys on the ground, we're going to be back. we took them into combat. took them in to the lz. and we brought them out. we picked them up and brought them home. in between, like ed said, we carried supplies.

we carried ammo by the ton. we carried water, we carried food. if they got hit, they knew that we were going to be in there to pick them up. they knew that within a matter of minutes, a medevac is going to be in there to pick them up. it didn't matter what we lose, we're going to be in there. when those guys were engaged in combat and called for guns, oh, yeah. they're coming. and i think that's -- i will have to say, that first combat assault, i remember thinking oh, this is going to be a long war. this is going to be a long year. maybe i could be a -- think of anything, a tank driver. but as you went on, i think it became accepted. it's a risk you accept. i didn't really know when i got there, i know these guys will

say the same thing. i didn't really know why i was there. i can't say i was there to fight for democracy. i was there because my country sent me. they asked me and i went. i volunteered. every helicopter pilot, all 40,000, can you imagine that? 40,000 helicopter pilots served in vietnam. we all volunteered. every one of us. and i think if there's a legacy, it's the fact that we never left anybody on the ground. be it american, in my case down south, we supported the army of the south vietnamese army. we made no distinction. they were our flock. we were their shepherds. we would die for them. and after a while, you know, i

knew what i was there for. i was there for these guys. i was there for that guy who was flying. i was there for these guys. i was there for these guys on the ground. that's what i was there for. and every one of us can make that statement. i don't know what more we can say, but i think -- are we getting close to where we want to have some -- go ahead. >> you need to recognize the door gunners. they had the discipline, when you think about a door gunner, an m-60 and a bungee cord sticking out the door. they had the discipline and presence of mind not to shoot the rotor blade, not to shoot the skid. a whole different ball game. a lot of these door gunners weren't aviationests. they volunteered.

they would come in and fight. in my case, the gunner was also my crew chief. >> he mentioned there, i have always said that laziness is the mother of invention. in vietnam, it was survivable. to survive, you had to be inventive. and i know back in those days, you have to understand, we didn't have -- we didn't have any of these things you have today. we were lucky to have a wrist watch, if it worked. and i was down south, and i didn't have to worry about mountains. a lot of rice paddies. the rice bowl of asia. rice paddies and rivers, creeks, ponds. but up north, they had mountains. these guys flew in mountains. i didn't vt to worry about that. one day y had one of my closest friends flew with the 71st rattlers, firebird.

and i was at the reunion, and they were talking about swish boom method. i go, what? what are you talking about? they go, well, the way we navigate. how did you navigate with the swish boom? quite easy. said, you know, up there, when you were scrambled out, when a call went out, you scrambled out, didn't matter what it was, in the wee hours of the morning, you have not seen black until you have seen black over a jungle. oh, my lord, is it black. well, those guys knew the environment, and they could navigate out. but when they would go out, maybe it starts getting a little drizzly. so it didn't matter what kind of a firefight they got into, all these gunships would save two or three rockets, because they all knew they had to go back through the mountains. and they were pretty sure they

knew where they were going, but not real sure. you know, kind of dark, and they're going along. so what they would do when they would become unsure, they would slow down to about 35 knots, and the crew chiefs and gunners would stand outside on the skids and they would fire rockets, swoosh. listen for a bang. if they heard a bang, then they hit a mountain. so they would take another -- the lead ship run out of rockets, then the second one -- i said, well, you guys, you certainly top my story. but like you said, those guys that led the way taught us, they taught us so many tricks that we would not have survived if they had not done that. and i am still in awe today, and to be sitting here with these guys telling these stories. posturing and telling war

stories, but anyway. >> one quick thing. joe saved me from myself, i guess, because i had the luck of getting shot at for nine months flying slicks and gunships out in the field, and he came along and they said this guy is qualified for this, this, this. and so he would work as a maintenance test pilot. so i wasn't getting shot at anymore, but i was losing engines, tail rotors, hydraulics. and a lot of times we did test flights. we flew, take off in the fog, climb over the fog and rotate back to the runway. and in that process, you may lose an engine, may lose a tail rotor. so he took me out of the safety of getting shot at and put me over there so i was going to fall out of the air. i really appreciate what he did for me. >> make it quick. >> real quick. okay, he talked about the local area check-outs and all that. they put me in the cockpit with

on officer, probably 19 years old but more flight time than i had, and he took me out on an ash and trash mission to get my orientation and teach me how to fly in vietnam. we were taking mail and food and supplies to a fire base. lots of fire bases around vietnam, typically on a pinnacle. maybe 20 guys and an artillery station. so if you don't know much about flying, you want to understand, but the wind gets squirrely and you're loaded heavy. we came around to make our approach, and the warrant officer said you got it, put it on the ground. it's a team effort. the crew chief and gunner are back there like a baseball chief. you're doing great, long story short, i missed the approach. too hot and fast, had to go around. i came back and did the same thing, and they're talking, this time, i'm a little too slow. we had to go around again. so i'm on my third approach in there, and the ward officer looked at me and said, you know

what, if you don't put this on the ground this time, they're probably going to shoot you down because they want that mail and they want that food. we got it on the ground, thank you god. >> we could sit, we would love to sit here. i know, but we would like to take, if you guys have any questions on either side. question number one. >> is it on? can you hear me? so 48 years ago, i remember you guys as young and handsome and bulletproof. you're still handsome -- >> whoa. whoa. >> you're still handsome, but you're not young, and neither am i, but we were there for you. i was a young army nurse. i was 21 years old. [ applause ] and that clapping is for my patients, because you guys came

to us. i was there in '68, '69. and our casualties were by the hundreds, as you know. our heroes were you guys. the pilots. they were bulletproof. we were young. but they would go into the worst conditions and be shot at. and land just so they could bring those wounded to us. and because you were so brave and because you were so quick and got to our hospital, 27 of them, 27 military hospitals in vietnam up and down, and then of course, the navy, the hospital ships, their nurses were pretty because they got prettier because they got to wear white. we were in jungle fatigues. the marines were happy when they got to the sanctuary. the guys came to us and we looked just like you, jungle fatigues. but if you -- if a patient made it to our hospital, we had a 90% save rate. we saved 90% of our patients who

came to our hospitals. i worked in the burn unit. and helicopters crashed and burned. and i took care of a lot of burned helicopter pilots who went home very disfigured, never to fly again. and my hat just goes off to those chopper pilots. we loved you guys. we still do. i'll get my hugs later. i always do. but these guys were true, true heroes. they were there to save lives. and those of you who didn't fly dust off, i'm sure there were times you touched down to bring wounded to us. so i have very fond memories of all of you and it was a great privilege to be a military nurse in vietnam. and all of us nurses feel that way. so thank you. [ applause ] >> i wanted to thank you

gentlemen, because of you i'm alive today. as a member of a medevac company, 498, 44th med brigade, i served in the central hilands from the pacific ocean to the cambodian border. i took place in the evacuation of 2,000 combat civilians and personnel. i flew over 1800 combat hours, 26 air medals and i wouldn't have any of them if it wasn't for you guys. any time we had a hot lz, we would call you guys first. you would go in ahead of us, get the enemies to duck, we would fly in at 129 knots as fast as that bird would carry us at treetop level. we would get on the ground. if i'm on the ground more than 30 seconds, i'm dead. my mission was, number one, put them onboard while they're breathing, and get them off the helicopter at the hospital or wherever, next to a medical doctor within 30 minutes. without fail. we evacuated over 285,000

american combatants who would be dead today if it wasn't for our job and their job protecting me while i was doing mine. so thank you guys. [ applause ] >> i think we have a short -- i think we have a short video clip, if we could roll that and show that. if they could do that. very short, but i think it's of a jolly green rescue mission.

>> we're coming in now. >> okay. >> we have you in soilight. helicopter is close by. >> what is your position? >> he says he's got both legs broken so he hasn't moved around any. >> we're coming in over you. >> over him now, jack. >> okay. you're right over him, he says. >> he's going out the door now. >> roger.

>> got you. turn your beacon off. turn your beacon off. turn your beacon off. he's on the ground. >> 243. >> go ahead. >> two broken legs, possible broken arm. >> we're going to put you down. >> put you down to help the guy. >> roger. >> got both on the ground. >> are you ready?

>> okay. can you come and get us now? >> coming up. don't drop him. >> roger. >> hurt pretty bad. >> they're moving out now, breaking to the left.

>> there they go. all right. >> fantastic. i can't believe it. >> that says it all right there. that's what the helicopter does so well. i mean, it's always there. we have no more questions, i certainly appreciate all of you being here today. and speaking all all these guys. thank you. it's been quite an honor for me to be here. thank you. [ applause ] >> god bless america. >> amen.

>> on newsmakers, tom stooier, the founder of the need to impeach campaign, talks about why he's spending $20 million on an effort to impeach president donald trump. newsmakers, sunday at 10:00 a.m. and 6:00 p.m. eastern. on c-span. >> c-span's cities tour takes you to springfield, missouri, on january 6th and 7th, while in springfield, we're working with media com to explore the literary scene and history of the birthplace of route 66 in southwestern missouri. on saturday, january 6th, at noon eastern, on book tv, author jeremy nealy talks about the conflict occurring along the kans kansas/missouri border in the

struggle over slavery in his book "the border between them." >> in 1858, john brown left kansas, came back to the territory, and he begins a series of raids into west missouri during which his men will liberate people from missouri and get them to freedom. in the course of this, they'll kill a number of slave holders, so the legend or the notoriety of john brown really grows as part of this struggle that people locally understand as really the beginning of the civil war. >> then sunday, january 7th, at 2:00 p.m. on american history tv, we visit the nra national sporting arms museum. >> theodore roosevelt was probably our shootingest president. he was a very, very avid hunter. first thing he did when he left office was organize and go on a very large hunting safari to africa. now, this particular rifle was prepared specifically for

roosevelt. it has the presidential seal engraved on the breach. and of course, roosevelt was famous for the bull moose party, and there is a bull moose engraved on the side plate of this gun. >> watch c-span cities tour, springfield, missouri, january 6th and 7th on c-span2's book tv and on american history tv on c-span3. working with our cable affiliates as we explore america. >> navy pilot john mccain was shot down over north vietnam on his 23rd mission. on october 26th, 1967. he ejected from his sky hawk bomber into a lake and was captured, beent, and held in filthy conditions with poor medical care despite life threatening injuries. two of the more than five years he was held as a p.o.w. were spent in solitary