not answered, at least planted in your mind as food for further thought and further discussion. we looked at just a few of the cars in our collection, but i think they represent a real cross-section of the american automobile over the last century and a quarter. announcer: you can watch this and other artifacts programs i -- by visiting our website, c-span.org/history. >> next on american history tv, three former white house photographers talk about their work with presidents george w. bush, bill clinton, and barack obama. and photographers share photographs showing presidents in their public and private moments. we also see first families and white house staff and hear the stories behind each scene. the annenberg space for photography hosted the event. it's about an hour and 40

minutes. >> good evening, everyone. how is everyone doing tonight? glad to hear it. i am the education and public programs manager here at the annenberg space for photography. welcome to our event, photographing the presidents, part of our programming roster in support of our newest exhibition, not an ostrich. this exhibition tells the story of america through photography from the archives of the library of congress, many of which have never been exhibited. through these stories, we tell pieces of history, both well-known and less so. nothing has shaped america like the history of the president of the united states. tonight, we are so lucky to welcome three photographers who have worked as official photographers at the white house for the past three

administrations. they have been in the room where it happens and they have the photographs to prove it. we will hear from them what it was like working alongside the president during big moments and small. joining us is a chief political correspondent for slate magazine and cbs news. he covers campaigns, elections, and national affairs. his work has appeared online and in print at the new yorker, the washington post, the nation, and other publications. he is from virginia beach, virginia, and attended the university of virginia, where he graduated with degrees in political and social thought and government. please join me in welcoming him and our photographers to the stage. [applause]

>> hello. thank you for coming out. i am going to introduce our wonderful panelists. to my immediate right, sharon farmer, a professional photojournalist and exhibition photographer for 40 years, shooting news stories, cultural events, campaigns, and conferences, and portraits. most notably, she was the first african-american woman to be hired as white house photographer -- [applause] >> as well as the first african-american and first woman to become director of the white house photography office. [applause]

>> she served as director of the white house photography office from 1999-2001, and as the white house photographer from 1993 documenting the beginning of the clinton-gore administration. next to sharon is eric draper. [applause] >> eric served as president george w bush's chief at order for for the entire eight years of the bush presidency, photographing him daily during his activities at the office, abroad, and in his personal life. he was eventually named special assistant to the president and the first white house photographer to be named a commissioned officer to the president. [applause]

>> during his tenure, eric also directed the photographic and archival conversion of the white house photography office from film to digital. millionover 1 photographs documenting the presidency. and last but certainly not least, lawrence jackson. [applause] >> certainly. certainly not. lawrence spent his career working as a virginia pilot for 10 years, covering sports and news before joining the associated press in boston in 2000. he transferred to the d.c. bureau in 2002 where he covered capitol hill, the white house, and major sports teams for seven more years. in march of 2009, he became an official white house photographer for the obama administration, where he stayed until 2017. in march of 2017, he began a freelance photography business, providing editorial, corporate, and portrait photography. [applause] >> so, we have a lot of photos.

before we get to those, i want to ask a general question of the panelist's. -- panelists. i am curious how you became white house photographers. if you could talk a little bit about how you got to that position. >> my parents always had a camera in the house. church,t clean to go to it was a miracle for me. i could barely sit still in church. i played clarinet and bassoon. my mother would say you look lovely, let me get the camera. i love music, but when i saw football, that's how i got started.

>> what was the path from discovering the magic of the dark room to photographing the clinton-gore administration? >> being an activist and the fbi record i say with pride. pride. pride, because if you don't stand up for something, you are going to get done in by everything. [applause] >> i am clear that photography was an activist thing to do. we had demonstrations on the campus of ohio state because things were going on. we had less than 300 black

students out of 40,000. we would get carted getting off the jitney bus. i started working for a black student paper. it was called "black choking times." i went on to be the editor, managing editor, and the photographer. so, we did all the things we were supposed to do to make it a democratic campus. that's what happened to me. the more you see injustice, the more you go, mmm. mm-mmm. mm-mmm. thank heavens, the members of my sorority felt the same way i did. the white folks didn't like what was going on either. one thing does lead to another. when you are taking pictures and folks are telling you how well you are doing, by now, i am loose in the community. i am shooting everything in columbus, ohio. i met a wonderful photographer named valentine. he was known by one name -- valentine. and he worked for everybody.

did babies and churches. i am like, babies and churches, ok. i did that too. the more i did, the better i got. then i discovered i liked all that stuff. it didn't matter what it was because it was photography. as long as i could explore, the city was big, the campus was big . i did not miss a beat. plus, you know taking pictures is fun. so, the idea of working in the field and getting paid for it, i had died and gone to heaven. and i still played my music. my dining room was my music room. we got crazy in there. we would jam and throwdown. so when you do stuff with good people, good things happen. sharon, shoot this picture. sharon, shoot this sunday school class.

weeks later, i have a great job. it pays $5,000 for the day. you don't know what you do until you do it. being kind is the best thing we can do for each other. be kind. that's what happened. [applause] >> i did not think i had an fbi record when i started. i don't know, actually. my story began without knowing i would end up in the white house. through my background, i was a newspaper photographer and i was also photographer with the associated press for eight years, covering every story you could think of from campaigns to sports. the 2000 campaign rolls around, and it began as an assignment. i was the last one to get the assignment, and you know -- you are covering texas governor

george w. bush. ok. but my desire to pursue the white house didn't start until after the election. you might remember the recount. [laughter] >> yeah, i blame everything on the recount, because if the election had been decided that night, i don't think i would have ended up where i was. during the recount, i decided to pursue the position. i had the opportunity to ask the president-elect for the job and i was invited to the christmas party in austin, texas. i said, ok, i need to make my direct pitch for the job. at the party, my wife was there, coaching on the sidelines when to make my move, and i walked up and said thank you for inviting us to the party, by the way, i want to be your personal photographer. he didn't blink. he looked at me like he had never thought about it before.

and then his chief of staff pretty much offered me the job on the spot. his first question was, can you manage? i said yes. i never had before. [laughter] >> he told me working at the white house is like trying to drink water from a fire hose at full throttle, and he was right. >> i originally applied to be the chief photographer like these guys did. i did not get it. much to my chagrin. [laughter] but pete had my portfolio. he was named chief photographer and he called me up. he said do you want to work for

the administration? i was like, sure, and that was it. pretty simple. >> was there anything in particular that prompted you to want to be -- >> yeah, i tell the story about the night i was covering bush at the white house for the ap, and barack obama beats john mccain for the presidency, and i go out to the lobby, and all these college kids are celebrating and chanting. there was an energy to the whole thing. i was transfixed by it. i was going home at night and said to myself, if i can work for this president, i am going to do it. i told my wife i was applying. i applied. i applied. i didn't get it and then pete said i want you to work for me. it's funny because the job pays this much. i was like, how much? i had go back to my wife and say look, this pays less than what i

make at the ap, and she said i will get a job if you are taking this job, so if it weren't for my wife -- [applause] so we're going to go through the photos we have an chat about them, have some discussion. and after that, we will have some questions. the first photo -- i think you took this. >> i did. >> can you say what is happening in this photo? >> that is on hmx. the helicopter pilots were doing test runs to land on the south lawn, and they invited us to

participate. we did 4, 5, maybe six touchdowns, kind of circled around the city, and this is what they see every time they come in for the approach of the landing. >> i am sure you took similar photos to this. >> not in the cockpit. >> it's interesting. i took the exact same photo probably about four years earlier. [laughter] >> yeah, but it's an incredible view, one-of-a-kind. >> that one's mine. it's fun to try to figure out where to be before everybody starts. nobody tried to direct me what to do. i have to figure it out. i'm always looking for

composition. i am always moving around because there are journalists, photographers, and videographers i work with, and my crew. barbara kenny and me were having a blast competing with each other taking pictures, and when you compete, you get better. you get better. better. better. i have never turned down competition. if you ever want to see what you can do for yourself, compete with somebody. [laughter] >> this is mine again. gotcan always tell who's who. got.ow who we've

the fun stuff about being a fly on the wall is you read the papers the next day and they say something happened and you are like, they weren't even in the room. a picture is still worth a thousand words. it can tell you in a heartbeat what's going on. and some stuff is going on. i hear everything, but i don't keep it. i just record of photo that says this is a serious meeting. >> speaking of serious, this photo was taken in march of 2003, at the time president bush decided to go to war in iraq. this photo was taken right after he made that decision, which was made in the situation room. i will never forget that day because it was so intense leading up to that moment. i was standing outside the situation room waiting for the

meeting to end. the door comes open and ice he -- and i see his face. his eyes were full of tears. i wanted to take a picture but i had to jump out of the way or he would have collided with me. he walked out of the oval office, didn't talk to anyone, walked the entire length of the south lawn with the dogs, very emotional. i waited, and you could see the weight of the decision on his face. and he said eric, are you interested in history? i said yes, sir. he didn't speak to me every day. i didn't brief him. it was unusual for him to talk to me. he said, the pictures you are taking are very important, the ones in the situation room and

one here on the south lawn. then dick cheney and donald rumsfeld came over and started discussing the timing of the war. it was very intense. >> these fly-on-the-wall shots, i am curious to know the experience of being invisible, being in close proximity, watching and observing, knowing you have to document, but being unobtrusive. talk about the experience of being there. outou know, when you walk onto anyplace of that campus, it is government. and the government is mighty. it takes care of a lot of issues not only in our country, but

around the world. being a fly on the wall means you don't want anybody to respond to anything you do. i had a lot of gear. i have choices of cameras, choices of lenses, two cameras around my neck, a wide lens camera and a leica as quiet as it can be so that they cannot hear me move. i am a quiet mover. all that karate and took through the years paid off. i am stealthy. i move smoothly. i don't break anything. i am concentrating on the pictures because yes, i am a fly, a piece of the furniture. you are getting what nobody else is getting, and as time goes on, everything is going to get seen.

that's a fun about being a photographer. you go on.dead, but [laughter] >> it's a unique role in the white house because everyone else is there to interact with the president, and our job is to be a professional observer, to disappear into the background if we can. sometimes, we are too close to the situation. instead of a fly on the wall which can be annoying, i compare it more to furniture in the room where they trust your presence, and if you are not there, that rings more of an alarm. that's part of the job, just being there. sometimes nothing is happening and you are just trying to stay awake. and some days are intense. it depends on the situation. >> the obamas are what we call naturals in photojournalism. they are aware of the camera but

they don't care about the camera. it helps make our job easier. you can see them being held -- being themselves regardless of a camera being in the room. >> i can't remember the name of the interviewer, but he did an interview in the east room, and a fly landed on his shoulder, and he killed it. [laughter] >> and he went on with the interview, and after the interview, he took out a tissue and picked up the fly. >> that is such an on the nose story about barack obama. if you had not told me, i would not have believed it. >> it was mrs. clinton's

birthday and we were going to the mansion for the celebration at the rose garden. prettydy that is key on much both sides of their offices were in that. it was a happy time. i was still pinching myself every day. remember, i am from southeast washington, d.c. i was clear that me being there was an aberration. the fbi let me through and i was like, it must be a new day for

real in government. the other presidents didn't spend any time in d.c., but the clintons love to go out and eat and meet people, shake hands. i thought these people are different. it was so cool. >> so, i like to call this photo "timing is everything." [laughter] >> this was taken the first week of the administration. we all know that president bush was very timely. he hated to be late. he wanted to be on time or early. this was an illustration of that. i got very lucky. i literally raised the camera right as it was happening, and luckily, no one was walking up the hall. >> that was a foreign leader

call. i could not tell you who the leaders were. whatever the issue is, he would have people come in and have people brief him on the topic, then take the call. i don't know why he had to serious look on his face, honestly. i can't remember. >> my guy has a serious look is because all kinds of stuff is going on. rwanda. it was like, what next? people would give him advice, and i have the lenses for whatever i need, but i wait to shoot the shot. don't shoot your load before you're ready, if you wait until you are ready to shoot the shot, when you shoot the shot, it's too late. you are hunting. you want your first shot to be the one.

because you don't want a lot of on because there is seriousness to what is going on. that's why the leica would come out. nobody even knows i was taking it. >> that was when the president decided to go for osama bin laden. in that moment right there. in, it was acame typical morning. he was about to take off for a launch. i could tell there was a lot of energy in the room, and i felt that something was off. or something was about to happen. the president comes into the room, and i am about that far away from him, and i take two shots. that's the first. the second, you can see them

waving me out of the room. that's happened before, no big deal. then that night, he goes on air and says we got osama bin laden. and i found out later that he is a "go."e mission >> we see presidents being very serious and somber, kind of whimsical with the clintons, and the photos of bush and cheney, my question for all of you, can you talk about the emotional tone of being around the president. i mean, like, obviously, every

day is not a serious day. every day is not a loose, lighthearted day. it is a job, and like all jobs, there are highs and lows. i think the public has an idea of what it's like to be around the president, but sometimes, not much is going on. >> it is in office. it is an office of serious responsibility, and as a photographer, you are part of the documentation. you are charged with capturing everything, not just a little bit. even in the downtime, there is something going on with somebody else. another national security person, or mrs. clinton, or the secretary of state coming in to visit, there are things going on. even when there's a lull. editing's a lull we are pictures.

otherwise, things get backed up. where are my photos? i was like to die, i came in one day and all my proof sheets were gone and there was a computer on my desk. i was like, what's this? they were like, it's your new computer. i don't want to computer. you have to have a computer. i fought them off for six months. where are my proof sheets? but it's about being behind. any time you come to work at 5:30 a.m. because you know you are behind, and you can trust your editors to do it, but i am the emotional part of what is being done and i have a little bit more insight that i don't even talk about. i know why some pictures are more important than others. also looking at the little eyelids. half-mast.en or

i don't take pictures of people with their tongue hanging out of their mouth. if you are blinking, if you are scratching your nose, i am not shooting that. so, there is part that's like, how many times is this guy going to pick his nose while he is talking to the president about what is over -- whatever is important? i'm gonna have to say. we are human. we are human. >> it's one of those things where, you study someone for so long, i mean, i studied president bush for eight years. i could hear his voice and know what was going on. i could study micro expressions. to the point, we kind of had nonverbal communication of when i should be there, when i shouldn't be there. he was always on my radar even

if he couldn't be. i would come out at certain times. but some things are like an emotional roller coaster. the morning started out seriously because the president would evaluate the threat matrix, threats to the country. so right off the bat, that's a serious document. from there, meetings. meetings,meetings, photo opps. you go to a meeting with the elementary school teacher of the year or you go to the situation room for a crisis, it's really a roller coaster. that's what makes it really interesting throughout the day. there is so much stuff going on. and everything in front of you is a story. with the president. but you look behind you, and there are stories. storiesof the staff,

president's senior aides. there are lots of stories going on. sometimes it's hard to just focus on the president because there is so much going on around you. it was like disneyland for photography, to be honest. every day, i could take a story to follow. it could be dull because of the repetitiveness, but all you have to do is have another cup of coffee, wake up, and there is another story to follow. >> if the president is in a good mood, you try to be in a good mood. if he is somber and focused on something, you try to follow

that. and like he said, you go from the situation room to a little boy's visit and he matches the tone of each meeting with the right words, the right everything. and that's tough. it's an emotional roller coaster trying to meet the needs of the time.ion all the you are trying to meet the needs of the situation all the time. >> next photo. >> this is the big meeting. we have lots of things going on. but at the end, he smiled, and the rest of them were smiling, too. the tone and the mood. this guy liked to have a good time. his mom liked to have a good time. mrs. clinton liked to have a good time. and then serious things would happen. he seriously tried to get health care passed. they seriously tried to get countries to take in refugees. they were seriously worried but

he tried. and you would watch all this stuff. i would say, lord, and my partner would say, what is wrong with you? it's been a long day today. but it's ok. i knew i could handle it. you would hear, can you handle it today? because you hear things no one else gets to hear. you see staff trying to get along. i'llave a big, huge, call it a sand pit. you have to decide which

want to stand on to make sure you get your picture. and then you've got somebody going, i don't work for you. step back. and six months later he's gone. when you are with somebody every day, getting up early to catch air force one, that's one thing. but the food is good. the camaraderie is wonderful. and we don't have to go through tsa. [laughter] >> i think that was fairly early on in 2009. i think that might have been his first meeting with netanyahu. a feel foretting each other. i think they were trying to get their points across. netanyahu is listening as the president is trying to make his

point. caught is when they dylan roof, the young man who shot nine churchgoers. this is when they were waiting to make a statement to the press. [laughter] special, but so was buddy the dog. if you come in at 8:00 in the morning, you are going with clinton all day. if you come in at noon, you don't know where you are going. because if they had guests staying at the house, he liked to give tours. he would tell you stuff, and he

would do research on his own and tell you stuff about the house you didn't know. and every time i heard him talk, unlike, i did not know that. so, he is a wonderful guy with everything. i love cats, i love dogs. i think everybody should be treated fairly. he is allergic to cats. but he would pick the cat up. >> president bush with barney. he called barney the son he never had. barney is the one who bit the hand of a reporter one day. this was when the president allowed me to observe some of his personal time. this was early on in the administration when he was a jogger.

later on, he started taking when his knee started hurting. -- biking, when his knee started hurthing. it was just a personal moment, just like any of us with our pets. >> that's bo. we were about to do an event with the first lady somewhere. i could not tell you where. my memory is shot. but bo was a great dog. >> that was -- he had just said goodbye to a world leader and he was walking back into the oval office. so nice lights, nice shapes. >> how did you get up there? >> there is a staircase. >> really? [laughter] >> you never saw it? >> no, i did.

>> a question i have about the presidents with their pets, how much are you thinking about trying to humanize a president, not just capture them while they are working in the office, but with their pets, their families, to humanize them? to present them as full people and not just symbols of authority. a president with a dog is kind of a vulnerable photograph, not a position you see the world leader in. >> it depends on the kind of photography we do. we are documentarians. what they do is what we shoot. he and the dog together, you are the photographer. if you miss that shot, you will kick yourself the rest of your life.

so if you see something, you don't wait for permission. none of that. nor are any of us thinking about humanizing anybody. they are human. we see them every day. we see them when they are upset, angry, and when somebody hasn't done what they were supposed to do and things are working. and then you go, somebody is going to be in trouble. like you are in school again. that's not good. but we are not discriminating about anything. we are telling a visual story. we are documenting what we see. we don't care if you're kissing the dog, none of that. we are the behind-the-scenes people. we are trying to show what real life is. not to show what says we are cowards. we are not cowards. we are serious photojournalists. documenting stuff that is going fore in encyclopedias years. that's what i thought when i was

a little kid. all of this is going to stand the test of time in some ways. lord knows now with computers and how many images they hold, we can get overdone with images, but humanizing, all we are doing is taking their picture. >> we just take the picture. we leave it up for everyone else to decide what it is. >> one of the things is establishing the relationship that allows you access to document those personal moment. you do not just open the door and say, on in. it takes time for them to warm up to you and to trust you. that is part of the job. it is their decision to open their lives. to have the opportunity to document the president as a father, dog owner, son, texan.

a lot of personal time on the ranch. you will see some of that later. >> we ran all over d.c. the fun part was when some guests would come, not quite in shape. had to crawl back to the van. some of the agents were in good shape. it was always fun because the president is jostling for position. we have been sat on the corner waiting for them to run by us. it is a hooked. hoot.is a the guy is running? he is seriously running. and the agents, they are running to. it is very, very cool.

>> that is transportation secretary. one of the things that -- when eight is with the president, we had a hard time getting in. chuck, samantha and myself, so we tried to do other things, one of the things was to document the cabinet secretaries. spend four or five days with them this particular trip, he went across the country doing different types of events. i think we did maybe 7, 8 or nine of the secretary. it was a week and that is just one of those pictures. >> that is the final cabinet shot. we did it on the front lawn.

we have not tried the lawn out in front. this is our last shot together. it took time to get everybody's schedule together. then you have to deal with then you have to deal with secret service come the guys to move the furniture. you have to talk to the gardener to make sure you will not step on the plants or anything, because you want to make everybody happy. i have to talk to everybody to make sure it is all on board. beside having them out there like that, we do mock stuff to make sure. teedo the oh days before, i had different staff come out and pretend to be one person or another to make sure this was going to work. it is fun trying to set stuff up. it is the front of the house come the back of the house, all

of these wonderful cabinet people. look at them. men and women. it is cabinet. this is the cabinet. go in there. gore was in there. for that one.ere it is the last shot. this is stuff that goes on. making sure that they got it right, so i shot in color and black-and-white. >> any particular reason? >> i am a black and white girl. >> this photo was taken the first day of the administration, january 20, 2001. george w. bush sitting down at the oval office for the first

time. what i like about this picture is you have several layers here. you have that personal moment, the proud father watching his son. he loved the history of two president together. there is a story behind the story. the cord coming from the wall? that was a massage chair. i do not know who left it there. but that is what is leading to the laughter at that moment. the chair was gone the next morning. [laughter] >> this is the second inauguration. he had just given his address. taking a couple steps back to look at the crowd one lifetime. it is one of my favorite photos cap he is taking it all in -- my favorite photos.

he is taking it all in one last time. >> this is 9/11. i was with president bush at the elementary school in florida that morning. what is interesting here, you see the time on the clock. this is about 9:25. i did not know exactly what was happening until i walked into the room to see live pictures of the burning towers. i was waiting for president bush to stop the television. everyone was shocked, seeing that horrific image. bartlett, who is pointing in that photo is actually alerting

everyone in the room because we are seeing the first replay of the second tower getting hit. another frame right after this when the president turns to see that horrific image. i was with president bush the entire day on the airplane. this picture was taken as we approached andrews air force base. this was after spending all day on the airplane. we stopped in louisiana, in nebraska. as we approached andrews air force base, we noticed the fire jets -- fighter jets out the window. apparently they had been with us the entire day, but we had not seen them. it is really this shocking thing to see the fighter jets nearly touching the wings of air force one. out of the right side of the plane, you can see the pentagon still smoldering. it was very shocking as we

approached. later that week, to me, 9/11 seems like a long day. that entire week -- i don't think i slept the entire week. this is a day that president bush toured ground zero. the president stood on the rubble and the retired firefighter with him was there to mark the spot for him to stand. the president told him, you stay here with me. the moment was purely organic. it was powerful when it happened. president bush was hogging all the firefighters. you can feel this moment building. the firefighters are crying with them. this is day four. no survivors are being found. they wanted him to do something. they are telling him, go get

them, george. that is when he came through with a famous line of i can hear world hears you, and the people will hear from all of us soon. the same day, after the bullhorn moment, such an emotional roller coaster that day. this was one of the most difficult situations i had to photograph in. this is the president walking into a room full of family members that were waiting to find out about their loved ones that were missing. again, hope was being lost every second because no one was being found alive. no survivors. there were children walking around with handwritten signs of have you seen my father or have you seen my mother? the president spent three hours hugging and crying with every single one of them. it was very powerful. >> i would be interested to know

if you would like to talk about , it at all, how did you coming yourself deal, with the experience of all that emotion and pain? >> it was tough. it really was. i was hiding my tears with my camera. it was such a sad situation. i was confronted by a few of my -- a few of the family members who did not know while it was there with a camera. when i hit that frame there, i knew i had something. i walked out and gave them some privacy because it was so intense. >> did you have similar experiences? >> it was a weekend. president clinton it was about a , half day going down and he was on the lawn with his golf club. i saw one of the guys come out

to tell him what had happened. the look on his face? i did not know what it was, but he was sad as could be. he went from a happy-go-lucky golfer to upset. we go back into the oval, and i start to hear what was going on. harold told him what had occurred. it was bad. he cried because we were so close to getting peace in the middle east. the stuff that has been going on there has disrupted everybody and everything. i cannot imagine being a kid over there and hearing all that bombing and all that kind of war stuff going on every day of your life. rabin wasbeing -- and our best hope for getting to the next phase, and now we are not going to have peace. the people who make money off of war do not want war over.rabin s our best

the people who love peace, they are not getting it. we are not getting what we want. it matters that somebody understands that war is not good for things that grow, and that includes people, grass, cows, cats and dogs. we doesn't issues about our priorities being about money and not peace. i don't care how we get the peace. everybody has to give up something. we need peace in the world. the last 26 years of war, these are the things that have been going on. so do i watch tv? , no. no television. i cannot deal with the fantasy world of television when the real stuff is happening to all of us and to our friends and family. pictures tell that story. i love documentaries. i read everything i can. anytime i put my nose in anall caps on the book -- economic book trying to , understand what is going on with the business of economics, why am i looking at an economics

book are smart i know how to add and subtract. but policies about economics? if you do not go, you do not have a nickel or a quarter. you make sure you vote. >> when there is an intense moment, the usually do not see the photographer. this is a quiet moment. this is the king family. this is in 2002. they are holding the plans for the mlk memorial. typically, my routine for meetings was that i would photograph the people coming in, depending on the nature of the meeting. i was walking out of the room, just as the door was closing, i heard bernice. she said mr. president, will you

pray with us? i did a 180 and was able to get a shot of the prayer. >> this was the daughter of james byrd, who was killed in -- who was dragged to death in texas. i'm the state legislature would not pass a hate crime bill. she had been to see everybody in the state of texas. nobody would deal with what she was saying. her and her family. when he came, she was -- she was there to greet us. she cried and cried. it was one of the most emotional things i ever experienced. just see him -- just seeing him water.der, his eyes the things that we do to each other, we look for somebody to help us out of a bad situation that we are in.

it is not coming fast enough. there are so many more james byrds. we have so far to go. photographers documenting this kind of stuff, we are on the front line of what is working and what is not working. what do we do next? we keep digging. we keep saying that we can do better. we have to do it through photography to show you that it is that bad. god bless all the cell phone cameras in america. god bless them because otherwise we would see even more james byrds. that is what makes that picture so sad. -- that is what that picture means to me. >> the supreme court decision came down that morning. a guy named jeff taylor had this concept a day or two before this.

everyone ran with it. it was a really beautiful night. >> i was out there, actually. >> listening to how the plane fell out of the sky in croatia. the military is trying to take -- to explain what happened. i got to hear all of that. i tell you, human beings are special. when you lose a special one because of something you hope would not happen but it happens? all the explaining in the world does not take away the pain of the loss. ron brown was a great guy. i remember him before he got involved with politics like this. before he became commerce secretary. he is there one day and now he is not coming back. it is a hard thing. plus, some of the people on the

plane with him our friends from the commerce department. no explanation will take away the pain of what happened. this was seriously like, this is what happened. we were like, oh, my god. a this was deep. very difficult to get arafat and midnight -- and then yahoo! together. the king of jordan and president clinton invited to get together. let's go to lunch together. everybody sat down and got some food. napkins on her lap. -- napkins on their lap. then, the king of jordan and president clinton get up. and they leave them in the room by themselves. the security was having a fit. president clinton is pushing them out of the room. you go, too. you leave. everybody left. president clinton turned to the secret service and said nobody

goes in, they do not go out. and that is how we left them for a while. >> i love this. i thought i'd died and gone to heaven. because the president of the -- that is a sacred, woven fabric done from the heart of people who work on this stuff. we are at a rally in ghana. i am on a huge pedestal in front of them. i got other photographers with me. i just happened to turn around and saw the crowd still coming. i thought, whoa. all you could see was clouds of dust because people were still coming. it was a magic moment in my time because never in my day would i have ever thought i would be at something like this. remember now. i'm from southeast d.c.

it was the beginning of my whole world. ohio state got me ready for all of this because what you do on campus you could do better in , real life if you learn the lessons they were trying to teach you. i can probably say i learned the lessons. >> the 50th anniversary. it was great. it was a great speech. just the energy. the foot soldiers to the right and john lewis, just the history of that moment, speechless. appeared onstage, praying. >> the president of china came. we had a big ceremonial thing.

they started the dialogue. always the first ladies are , always talking to each other from each of the countries in them a guys are talking to each other. each one has their own interpreter. each one. you are not missing anything about what is being said. so i just said, well, look at this. the delany sisters. boy. sharp as a tack. i hope when i get the old i can still talk, too. they did yoga every day. they had a huge jar of garlic. the book "having our say" had come out. we had to go to new york for another event. mrs. clinton wanted to meet the delany sisters. so we did. ,boy, oh, boy. i heard one of them say, look. they got a colored photographer.

[laughter] "child, how are you? " yes, ma'am, i'm fine. >> that was the first lady getting prepared for a commencement address to the class of virginia tech. she always prepared. she would go over her speech a dozen times before giving it. that is just going over the notes before giving the speech. we had a system in our office. amanda was the first lady's -- pete was always with the president. amanda was the first lady's photographer. pete liked us to rotate. every third week i would cover the first lady. this is one of her trips to london. her big initiative was always

girls. she had just given a speech. she is known as the hugger in chief, so she hugs everybody. >> this is the transition meeting that happens after every election. president-elect obama meeting with president bush for the first time. this was right after the election in 2008. i had to make this picture with the remote camera mounted on the mantle of the fireplace. you can see the iv creeping in. ivy creepinge the in. i was trying to hide the camera. i did it more as a backup. i was standing on the other side of the coffee table. they only allowed me in the room. they really wanted to get down to business. they were looking at me like are you done yet?

luckily, i had that camera as a backup. as i was walking out, i made two frames of them talking as the door closed. luckily, one of them worked. >> we are in the mansion in the middle of the day. he has been told by a couple people that stuff is brewing overseas. imagine watching 10 pots of soup bowling -- boiling at the same time. he is listening to what it is. trying to decide what the next step on it is. it takes a lot of strength as a person to understand all of the destruction that is happening from place to place. you are trying to fix it from place to place.

all these pieces have to come together to make it work. then you have to pray that the people on the other side, from another country get it. can we pull this together in the same direction? we are going to have wars. here we go. what are we going to do about this situation? it is a day by day every day. america is the police person for the world because nobody else will send people to do things to be helpful. even in natural disasters. a lot of other countries do not. not having the resources, not knowing how to do it. how do you do it starts with him. i get it. at some point, you get tired of clean frames. i was shooting stuff. understaffed. i would be around the corner

somewhere, leaning, getting that one too. you wanted to be exciting photography, not boring photography. i like to shoot between stuff. to get this. years getting the two of them together in a situation where they have the time to do it. sitting for a portrait at camp david. i wanted to get their faces together because they look so alike. for me, for eight years, to have that as part of the story come -- part of the story, the history of his father being president. they have a very traditional relationship. his father would stop by and talk about baseball mostly. never seemed like he gave him any advice or anything.

i was able to capture this portrait in 2007. >> they were joking around before this as well, making funny faces. you won't see those. this is president bush the texan at the white house in crawford , texas. the only place he could drive his own truck. he had 1600 acres to rome -- roam. this really captures his personality. he has that twinkle in his eyes. he has the iconic cowboy hat because he is really a texan at

heart. texas is where he was in charge before going back to washington. as we know, the presidency follows the president everywhere. the apparatus, all the people, the assets. there is a mini white house wherever the president goes, including the ranch. the timing of the photo is interesting as well. this is a month before 9/11. every time i see this photo, i see his sense of innocence before the world changed. >> that is the last photo in the slideshow. [applause] >> we are going to have a q&a and there will be people with microphones on the side or over here.

>> this brings us to the q&a portion of the evening. if you have a question, please raise your hand. we are recording this, so please speak clearly into the microphone. our first question right up front. >> did you guys have much of a life while you were working? are these photos yours? >> we had no life, none of us. the photos belong to american people. this was on the taxpayer's dollar. this is your history. this is our history. i could not keep a dinner date for anything. if people invited me to do something, i could say maybe and then not show up ever. when i could show up at something, i could go home. i always showed up with something. i would say, i'm sorry i could come to this other thing, but i'm here today.

so, i could go home again. some staff at the white house could never go home again. some people cannot stay in touch with their friends. he had made a new life for themselves in d.c.. i am lucky. my life is in d.c., my work is in d.c., my family is in d.c.. i have the best of all worlds. and then the best part was making new friends at the white house. the next best part was traveling across the country and calling up my college buddies and saying we are coming to town. >> my life was the president's schedule. what you learn is, you kind of in-depth following his patterns. you eat what he needs, you sleep -- you eat when he's, you sleep when he sleeps. it is really tough. it is a grind. it is more like dog years , to be honest, because a lot happens within one day. lucky for me, i am married, and

married at the time. but my wife worked in the white house for three of the years, so that helped me a lot. >>pe i had a life. -- i had a life. pete did a lot of the heavy lifting with potus. we had a system where every third week you knew you were not working nights or weekends, so every three weeks i had time with my family. my kids recognized me. [laughter] >> we have a question to the front. >> good evening, ladies and gentlemen. two questions. is this the first time the three of you have given this presentation? and the second question, are you going to take your presentation to other cities? please come to d.c. >> this is the first time the three of us sat on a panel

together, and i am happy to do it again. [applause] i'm sure you can find another moderator. >> no, the whole package. [laughter] >> our next question is to the far left. >> i can't see. >> just a two-part question related to technology and taking photographs, first part to sharon, second part two lawrence. sharon, can you talk a little bit more about what it was like to transition from film to digital and what that did to your timeline? and your flow and your process? and lawrence, or maybe to the three of you, are you ever concerned about wearable cameras and perpetual presence of cameras taking future photographers' jobs away from them in your role? >> you're only as good as the

last shot you did, and it is competitive. part of the deal with being a photographer who is documenting stuff is to do the best job. you can't worry about other photographers. you have to worry about doing your job. if you do a good job, you are going to be there. if you start messing up, maybe not. the more cameras, honestly, i think it's better. of course, at some point you cannot have a camera, or if i forget my camera, i am dying. i will not use my phone camera. >> it is not a camera. [laughter] i would not use it. >> i broke my camera when i came out here. my x30. i'm still sad about it. and i've seen some pictures and i brought my cell phone up going, i should have got my camera before i left. when i go home tomorrow, what am i going to do? monday morning, i will be down at the camera shop. the computer thing with the

cameras, we had a lab out of andrews air force base and the lab would do our processing. they come three or four times a day in a truck with a metal case, official military people coming in and get our stuff. we marked the bags with the date, event, the principals are in the pictures. four or five hours, proof sheets would come back. we start going to the computer and communications people decided we will get you these other cameras and get the pictures sooner. we already had our hands full, but ok. now we are carrying a heavy camera that weighs more than two of our cameras around her neck, and is not a full frame camera so you can't see every nuance of what you are shooting. it was a little frustrating. what was more frustrating was having time to think. the fun thing about looking at proof sheets, you can think while you are looking. this looks good. the computer screen, you're like, what?

it's not in focus? oh, that's the screen. oh, i don't need these kinds of heart attacks. oh, no. [laughter] so i had a hard time. by the time we left, we were switching over. we are the first presidential library that literally put everything on discs. the first discs, they were done a year before we were left. the coating wasn't good. you know how you figure out the silver or gold coating? it didn't hang, it didn't stay. now i have to go to another company to do it again. i don't like doing stuff twice and we're running out of time as we are getting out of the office, too. i told the lab, don't make anything not dealing with turning our stuff from negatives into discs. that goes to the presidential library and the archives. but now the computer, i'm a computer geek i guess, kinda. i'm still reluctant. >> well, after sharon left

office, we -- i used the film process, you know the lab, and it was during my time that the transition happened. that directed the white house from film to digital. and that was a huge job because of the volume that happened in the white house. you all know, thousands of thousands of photos a day with the whole staff, to design a workflow and a system to handle the digital files and unfortunately, we had to decommission the lab and bring a lot of those positions internal inside the white house. and then also using digital cameras was another change for me, which was a turnoff because, leica camera.a that was the best tool for me in the white house. all the stuff on 9/11 was a leica. and then switching to the

digital camera, that was bulky, heavy, and noisy. i had to change my style of shooting because of the noise. unfortunately, the digital cameras were not quiet when they first came out. the first full frame camera canon came out with, that was when i decided to make the switch. it was a struggle, but it was something that had to be done in terms of keeping up with the technology and also it was where everything was headed. luckily i had the experience coming from the associated press, using digital photography and applying my skills to turn the white house into digital. >> i'll just say you're talking about wearable technology and how things are changing, technology has been changing forever. you can put a camera in someone's hands who is not a photographer and you get crap, but if you put a camera in someone's hands who is talented,

no matter what the technology is, you will get something pretty compelling. today's film cameras are near -- mirrorless, completely silent. i would love to be back in the white house. they would not hear a thing. >> we have a question on the far right. >> thanks for your wonderful presentation. are any of you in contact with current white house photographers? and what do they say what the heck is going on? [laughter] >> what do you mean, what do they say? sheila is a good friend of ours. she's the chief photographer and she does a good job. in terms of what's going on, she is just doing her job. [laughter] i mean, honestly. [laughter] >> i couldn't tell you. >> we talked a little bit about this before the event. i had asked you about this,

lawrence, about how this style of photography is so different. she's just doing her job. that's obviously what the president wants. i would be curious to see what you all think. your photography feels traditionally journalistic. and the photos coming from the white house, they're not as candid. they don't seem to be -- >> they're posed. >> they're posed. they seem to show the president with a figure of authority. they are not communicating the same presidency at work, at life, as your work does. >> this is why pictures are still worth a thousand words. [laughter] and she's going to be all right. she's just got to work it out. it takes time. everybody is not the same kind of subject when they become president of the united states and it takes time to flesh it out. as people get more comfortable about who they are working with, i mean, i was scared to death of

the clintons for more than a year. i wouldn't say anything. one day mrs. clinton said, she speaks! [laughter] because i still piss myself every day i came in that place. where am i going? am i hanging out with the girls and the guys? going to work? oh, boy. when you realize the magnitude of what you overcome as a kid and your parents have been wonderfully helpful and pushed you to do the things that are all correct. and here you are with these folks who are trying to run the world in a good way and you're like ain't the way to run the , world. but i'm from southeast. they have new ideas. i am trying to be flexible and understand. you look at somebody who reads mad magazine, ok? [laughter] comic books. i need another way of looking at things besides the way the newspapers tell me i need to look at them. so the more information, the better.

give the other photographer a chance. we don't get to go out like we did before. she's busy. that hasn't happened yet. >> i'm sorry. you also have to understand, the pictures they are showing, releasing, you are not seeing all the pictures they are taking. as the communication office, this is the message they are pushing forward visually. >> that was the point i was going to make. we don't know what going on inside. she may have amazing images just sitting in the archives waiting to be shown at some point. and we may see those when everything is over. we may see them during the administration. we just don't know. time will tell. >> our next question is at the center right. >> thank you all for being here. i loved what you said about studying these men as presidents. i wonder, we are sort of implicitly talking about this, but if you could synthesize what

you learned about each of these presidents and who they are as people as you are photographing them. >> great question. you know, you learn a lot. you learn about leadership, especially in a time of crisis. you learn that, about discipline, and president bush was very disciplined. he, like i said, schedule was very tight. he made sure he put exercise in his schedule every day. it was very important to him. and if anything creeped into that time, he was very very upset. i learned that everyone looked up to the president for leadership. and he did a great job of leading our country through some really tough times. jarrett?

>> what can i say? my guy. [laughter] my guy. >> for me, watching president obama, it was always a lesson because he was so compassionate with people. and he gave himself to a lot of people. when people met him, i saw it a thousand times, they were kind of sometimes skeptical of him. but once they met him and talks to him, they felt like they were being listened to and heard and came away with a positive impression of him. so just how to treat people with respect and kindness. >> president clinton was late all the time. [laughter] because he talked to everybody. and even if they put up barriers to direct him how to get to the line quickly, he'd lose the barrier and step over it. [laughter] they would say, we're 15 minutes behind, 30 minutes behind, 45 minutes behind, and this guy is

doing his thing. keep moving, keep moving. what you say? he disagreed because of what? if you disagree with him, he wants to really understand why. he talks a lot. mrs. clinton turned into a talker when she started running for office, too. i realized he finished his line, she hadn't finished hers. when you meet people, you have to take the time with them. there's a ton of us that blow people off because we think they're not important. each and everyone of us are important and for the president of the united states to talk to you, he's telling you you're all important and i want to know what you are thinking. and if you disagree with me, i really want to know why. what if i didn't like that? what do you think of this? hearing him give scenarios and listening to people giving scenarios back. unbelievable. >> we have a question to the

center-right. >> thanks so much for being here today. i think lawrence is shaking his head because i am his niece. [laughter] just hearing each of you talk about your experience in the white house, it seems it was a highlight of your career, almost an understatement. i'm curious about how you went about thinking what your next step was and what you want to see out of your next role and if you could really match how meaningful and significant your job in the white house was. >> after leaving the white house? >> yes, after leaving the white house. >> it's a tough act to follow. we talked about this. for me personally, i still want to take pictures. it's what i've always done and what i love to do. if i'm taking pictures of a college basketball game or a corporate event, i'm happy taking pictures. it is not at the level of covering president obama, but

it's still real emotions and still doing some freelance work for news organizations. but there are real emotions and moments in that, and i enjoy that. >> everything's a letdown. no. [laughter] just like lawrence said, it really is tough to experience the same level of intensity and importance and travel and it's one of those things, too, once it's over it's over. it's like cinderella, the clock strikes midnight and you are behind the gate and you can't get in anymore. your life starts over. its almost like leaving high school. and like lawrence said, i've always been a photographer and i will continue to work on stories and i love politics, and i will continue to do what i've always

loved to do no matter what the story is. and so, yeah. >> i'm lucky. i got great, wonderful clients around d.c. a lot of them are nonprofits. whatever the mission is that they are doing, if i agree with the mission, that's what i want to work with. i'm a part of a group of 40 plus photographers called the exposure group, and we meet once a month doing the art and business of photography so we can keep the next generation coming. pictures is a wonderful way to make a living, be an editor, of processing, because all this stuff leads to other stuff. and it is creative. photography stays creative. that's my joy. the other thing is, i keep meeting new people. i don't stay home. i do not watch tv. people are my juice.

because every person brings something with their personality or their job to the plate. by doing that, letting the shoot it, i'm telling you a story because you let me, and i get to meet new people. it is just a wonderful way for me to live my life. i still play music. i still mess around, goof around. i'm still with my neighbors, my friends. i'm lucky. i've got everything one could want after doing the white house. steady money coming in, happy life. pets who love me. a partner. it's about love in the house. so and then the neighbors, what can i say? good neighbors make good friends. and it takes time for that. you get new people coming in. hi, neighbor, welcome. welcome people to the hood. i live in columbia heights, in washington. when we first moved over there, nobody wanted to live over there

. now everybody wants to live over there. [laughter] you know, i think something's wrong. [laughter] >> our next question is in the far back center. >> hey, so, you both being photojournalists with the associated press and then moving into a white house position, there's a little inside baseball. sorry, i'm l.a. times photographer so i can ask. [laughter] and i worked in d.c. with all these guys, so. there's a little bit of controversy within the journalism world, with the idea of access to media photographers covering the white house. having done it, it's a tight space. we can't get everybody in all the time. being chief photographer, did you have a role in any of those? i don't know if you have any controversies with obama were

there were more photos handed out. lawrence, i am curious what pete's role was in having control, let's let people in or not let people in. talk about that a little bit. and sorry, it is a multi pronged question. about the humanizing when you are shooting your subject, the president, dean that he -- in that humanizing them might not be your objective while you are shooting but clearly, when the photo is released, it is of the city. so we know it there's some role the communications office place. but as a photographer, where you were a photojournalist, you're doing news, these are the photos. when you were at the white house in doing these photos, do you have any input? do you say, i have some great shots of them smiling, these will look great. how will that go in your daily

job? or is it all done by communications? >> the communications people did not touch our staff. bob mcneilly, bless his heart. we are skilled people. we know what we are doing. and communications people muck it up. that's what happens. we go through them in our group. you trust the eye of the person you hire to do the job. bob trusted us. he saw our work, and you what we could do, and we knew what we could do. you talk about confidence, about what we could get done. didie shell, the way she ar stuff, a prime example of bad photographer, bad is good now, y'all. [laughter] she could shoot like crazy, get stuff done, tell stories. she was a heroine to me in the photography world. it was how the other people act

around you, you have to make sure you don't act like them. you have to keep yourself grounded. look in the mirror and go, in my and i doing the right thing? and that people make fun of you, so you know you are grounded. if they're messing with you, you're human. >> that's a great question. digitaly time, with photography becoming so prevalent, and the internet exploding, 24 hour cable, and the demand for images became great, where my office was always being hounded for images, and i was always a part of the process in terms of generating selections for photos to be released. but that decision, the final decisions were made by the communications office. and they would decide on photos. sometimes i would argue with them that i thought some photos were better than others, but

they would look at them with different eyes. sometimes it's with overly political eyes. but that's just the nature of the business. and i see where you're getting at in terms of photo releases and what it meant for access with the other photographers, media photographers, and we received the same criticism because we released more photos than the clinton administration, and i'm sure the obama administration released more photos than us. but that doesn't necessarily equal less openness in terms of allowing photographers to come in. but we received the same criticism. but it's just the nature of the time. and just like the evolution of the white house, now, everyone just expects the next

administration to do just the same thing. but they're not. that's why everyone is kind of surprised. they're different. everyone has a different mindset and everyone uses the technology differently. i don't know if that answers your question. >> pretty much what eric said, but i'll just add a little bit. the explosion of social media during the obama administration, the pictures fed so much of that to social media. you had facebook, you had flickr, instagram. all that stuff needed content and that content was produced by photographers in the photo office. in terms of access to the media, i really think that the communications office realized they could reach their target audience by going around

newspapers or magazines and going directly. and that was a choice. you had the first president do an interview between two ferns. [laughter] that was hugely, hugely popular and successful. i used to be ap, eric used to be ap. we know the power of newspapers. but at that time, there were just going another direction. i don't think he had that much, i don't think he was opposed to it, but i don't think he had that much say in terms of who was going to cover the president, what media outlets were going to cover the president. >> we were in that a more flexible. we would bring in a newsweek photographer or time magazine for a day or so, or somebody from the new york times would shadow one of the photographers. everything,me to take pictures.

diana from time magazine, diana walker, she would come. when you do stuff like that, they know the rules. when we tell you you have to go because stuff is getting sensitive, you got to go. so part of the deal about being with the white house photographer, you get to cover what we cover, see what we see. but when we say it's time to go, you got to go. we did a lot of that, and we had a wonderful large pool of photographers. because of money issues for all these companies that do the publishing and all that, they are always shareholders. they seem more about being shareholders now than about content. they don't care about content. they care about shareholders. i watched film crews go from five or six for each outlet, and now they share. whenever they shoot their tape, everybody shares the same thing. there are still photographers who used to freelance, beginning

to lose their work working for washington post or newsweek or the wire services, because they were not given the access. the companies decide to make things smaller. when i was working at associated press, i was a photo editor. we get to see everything, and we decide where people need to go to get stuff covered. and then you find out some people are not allowed to shoot some stuff. i'm getting a phone call saying, now they are telling me where to put my cameras up to our eyes. excuse me? they're telling you what? they are telling us to leave our cameras on the ground until we they tell us to put them up. what are you doing? we are talking to them. keep talking, negotiate. what do i do? i said if you take a picture, i'll be happy. to take a picture no matter what. well, ok. people took pictures anyway. it started a fight between press handlers, everybody.

they made their own problem. not the press, the handlers. the people from the press office trying to tell people when to be creative. you know that ain't right. [laughter] >> one last question to the far right in the front. >> thank you very much. i was very interested in the photo that eric, you took with president bush and president-elect obama with the remote control. i was curious what the rules of the game are with that, if any? can you shoot remotely from anywhere, when you are not in the room? it's one thing you are in the room if they know you are in the room. i imagine as technology changes, maybe more so with you lawrence, if you had similar advances the technology that lets you shoot more remote, more hidden, in a sense that they didn't know you were there. so i'm curious about the rules of the game and advance

preparation that goes into thinking about, i will put it here above the fireplace, etc., what security issues might be involved as well. >> in that situation, i asked president bush if i could put a camera above the mantle. actually, i didn't ask. the true story was -- [laughter] i asked the staff and they were like, yeah, go ahead. [laughter] so i showed up at 5:00 in the morning and i put it there, but i had to get the blessing of the president. he walks in at 7:00 in the morning. he sits at the desk and looks up, goes, what the hell is that? they all look at me. i said that's for your meeting with the president-elect. he thinks about it for a second. ok, let's make sure we clear it with the president-elect because we don't want him to think we are trying to spy on him.

but yeah, it was all his blessing for me to do that. or else it wouldn't be there. >> so you said what the rules are, in the rules are if the president approves it, that is the rule? >> yeah. [laughter] >> nobody can bother you if it's ok with him. >> all right. that is all the time we have for today, so please give our speakers and moderator a round of applause. [applause] and this is not a canned question at all but lawrence, where can people find you? >> on instagram? >> yes. >> jack images. >> perfect. and eric? prezphotog. get it? [laughter] >> sharon?

>> sfphotoworks@att.net. [laughter] >> jamel? @jbouie, on instagram. >> thanks everyone for coming out. [applause] make sure to get your parking validated if you haven't already done so at the front desk. have a good evening. >> good job. >> that went really well. >> thank you. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2018] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] >> next on the presidency, we hear from a panel of experts on the design history of the white house and what changes, if any, the future may hold. panelists include architecture professors from the united kingdom and ireland, as well as white house historians. this program was part of a