administrators who usually are a result of politics are really run the schools. >> okay. thanks. >> yeah, and secretary of education betsy devos actually made this point quite a number of times yesterday, that education really starts in the home, and one of the recommendations that the report makes or i guess it's not a recommendation, but just lays out the fact that, you know, children really need to have good, stable home situations. parents who love them, people who -- >> retirement plans to their workers and helps families start saving a little bit earlier and allows business to write off more of their initial investment start-up costs. the bill includes core provisions in the family savings act, which passed the house in september as part of tax reform two. this legislation builds upon the critical reforms as seen in hr1 and all across the country, our constituents and small

businesses are benefitting from these historic reforms. as we know, we have more people working in america today than ever in the history of the country. we have more revenue coming in than the history of the country. today, we have an opportunity to build upon this. we think it's a wonderful time to meet, and so we have two of the crack members of the ways and means committee, mr. neil and the young chairman from texas, mr. brady, and we welcome you both to the committee. but before we move further, we're going to hear from the ranking member, the distinguished gentleman from massachusetts for any opening statements the distinguished gentleman would like to make. the distinguished gentleman from massachusetts is recognized. >> and you pronounced it right, finally. thank you, mr. chairman. and i thank the witnesses for being here. this tax bill is so unpopular that it was already pulled once from floor consideration.

essentially, this bill is the ghost of christmas past. and only this version is even worse than before. it would repeal the johnson amendment prohibiting houses of worship from endorsing or opposing a political candidate. it would add another hundred billion dollars to the national debt and it doesn't even help working americans. and why are we taking this up now? the senate today finally moved to pass a short-term spending bill to keep the government open through february 8th and then they're leaving town, not for a day, not for a week, but likely for the rest of this congress. so, we'd be sending this bill to an empty chamber. but republicans are still in charge for a few more days, so again, i thank the witnesses for being here today, but for the life of me, i don't quite understand what the point of this exercise is, and with that, i yield back. >> appreciate the gentleman's comments. we're going to have two witnesses who will be able to not only elaborate on their ideas, knowing mr. neil as i do, he's not been shy about letting

us know his ideas also, distinguished gentleman from texas, so without exception, anything you brought in writing will be available to our distinguished young awesome stenographer this evening. ritchie, she's learned to speak -- hear massachusetts, texas, all sorts of things, florida, and she gets it right every time, so we're delighted to have her with us. mr. chairman, we're going to have you kick this off, tell us about all this great opportunity to continue the economic growth, development, jobs, job creation, investment and opportunity to provide more money to the treasury next year and the coming years than we've ever had the success of a rain dance has a lot to do with time and distinguished gentleman is recognized. >> thank you, chairman sessions. >> sir, can you -- >> thank you, chairman and ranking member mcgovern, members of the rules committee. first, chairman, thank you for your leadership of this committee. for so many years, you've

shepherded historic legislation and legislation that has improved the lives of every american, so thank you. as a fellow texan, and a member of your class, thank you for your class act as chairman of this committee. you've made a huge difference in america. so, i'll be very brief about testifying today. so, the main reason of why, the answer is, we've got a lot of families in california, carolinas, that are staring at burned out homes and homes they can't return to that need disaster tax relief now in this tax year, when they can use it immediately. i think it's irresponsible to wait until next year to deliver this crucial tax relief for families in 14 states and territories who are struggling to recover from devastating wilds fires, hurricanes, and other storms. both parties have always come together to help these communities now in a bipartisan manner and why it matters is that this package ensures people can write off their personal

casualty losses now in the current tax year, not wait a year for it. it makes sure the victims can immediately access the retirement funds, penalty-free, to be able to rebuild. for small businesses, trying to figure out how can i pay my workers when the economy just isn't there, this provides them relief right now in this quarter so they can keep their workers on the payroll as they try to figure out how they can survive these tough times. i think the reason we need to continue to push forward is we can and should and will help these communities rebuild. package is more than that. you're familiar, the bill we're offering bipartisan tax relief from some of the affordable care act's most egregious taxes, ones we've agreed on, republicans and democrats, relief from the cadillac tax, a five-year relief from the medical device tax, which passed the house with 58 permanent repeal -- passed with

58 democrat votes, the health insurance tax that drives up costs. for everyone who owns or has a health care plan and the tanning taxes. these harmful taxes stifle innovation, reduce jobs, and increase the costs of families' health insurance. the package will also help families save more on earlier throughout their lives, something we've worked together as republicans and democrats between the family savings act in the house and the recent bill in the senate, makes it easier for local businesses to offer their workers retirement plans. we also have spent now three years working together in a bipartisan manner to reach solid common ground on our efforts to redesign and restructure the irs. our bill, offering clarity and certainty to taxpayers, led by lynn jenkins of kansas and john lewis of georgia, received near unanimous support in the house earlier this year. it's time to send these reforms to the president's desk. the irs is an agency with one

singular mission, quality taxpayer service. next, temporary tax policy is hardly ever good economic policy. our tax code needs to reflect that. we have an opportunity here to set a new tone for how we treat these temporary extenders. moving forward each year, working with the senate and stakeholders, we're able to phase out the extension for biodiesel credit while making permanent the railroad track maintenance credit at a reduced level. hopefully these industries and individuals impacted by the remaining temporary tax revisions will step forward and work with incoming chairman neil, myself, and the senate and voice their support for permanent solutions where we, as a congress, believe there is merit moving forward, and so i think we ought to reward good behavior, and these industries are trying to find good solutions that make the tax code more permanent and more certainty. also, we proactively eliminate any potential uncertainty for our community organizations and churches, so nothing distracts them from their core mission.

finally, working close with the public and members on both sides of the aisle, we've identified some minor technical corrections in the tax jobs act, a very normal part of the legislative process. these are minor but they're very important changes to ensure our new tax code works as intended so main street can continue to hire, grow, and invest through communities. i believe the package will have the meaningful impact for families and businesses across the country. i look forward to working with you. we do know the hour is late, but this session is not adjourned. let's do all that we can while we can, provide some help. with that, mr. chairman, i yield back. >> mr. chairman, thank you very much. distinguished gentleman from massachusetts is recognized. >> thank you, mr. chairman. and ranking member mcgovern and i do want to reiterate -- i want to wish you my -- your all achievement and opportunity as you move from this institution. i considered you a friend while you were here. i think we agreed more in

conversations in the gym than we did here in more of a public setting. but i do want to wish you well. >> sure, thank you very much. >> so, let me start by saying i oppose the bill. two weeks ago, chairman brady and i sat in these same two chairs and debated a different version of this legislation. however, instead of working together on a bipartisan basis to strengthen the bill, our republican colleagues have instead made it worse by including things like repealing the johnson amendment. last year, the gop crafted its tax bill behind closed doors and hastily passed it without a single hearing. on election day, 49% of the american people opposed it and 41% supported it and because of that rushed process, there are tremendous problems with the legislation. now, a year later, republicans are pushing through another package with fixes to their tax law, fixes. this is without a single hearing, without another witness coming forward, and without having a chance to vet the merits of the proposed changes.

a rushed and lopsided process resulted in this tax law, and now republicans want to duplicate that process with changes at the last minute. we've received the two-minute warning. the game is almost over. time to move on. in my opinion, it's critical that the ways and means committee return to what we call around here the regular order. and one of our priorities in the next congress is to have oversight hearings on the tax bill that our republican colleagues passed. before making any changes, we'll examine each fix thoroughly and have it explored in public debate. whether it's substantive or technical, that's the path we intend to follow. that's how we'll avoid making many of the kinds of problems that we are seeing here this evening. another reason i oppose this bill, it's because of the disaster provisions. two months ago when the ways and means committee marked up its so-called tax reform 2.0, we offered an amendment to ensure

that the victims of national disasters nationwide would be eligible for disaster tax relief regardless of where their communities were located. unfortunately, because of republican opposition, that amendment failed. well, i'm pleased that this bill is moving in the right direction by extending relief to victims of the most recent disaster that our nation has endured, i disagree with the approach our republican colleagues are taking here. we should instead take a national approach to disaster relief. we call that summarily, the national principle. we cannot turn our backs on any member of the communities that represent our nation. we want to make sure that those who need the help most get it expeditiously and we need to provide a path to help them get back on their feet. i'm also opposing this legislation because it's not offset. for the third time this year, republicans are asking for significant tax law changes without paying for them. in fact, it's an egregious act of fiscal malpractice and the republican party is actually removing any bipartisan effort

to find offsets from the retirement section of this legislation. today's bill, once again, demonstrates that republicans don't want to embrace their historic argument of being the champions of fiscal conservative thought. this bill significantly erodes the johnson amendment by allowing certain tax exempt organizations to make political statements during the ordinary course of their activities. this is a dangerous precedent and i must say as a professor, and teacher of history in a former life, one of the great things that the framers of our constitutional system embraced and freed us from the conflict in the rest of the world was the idea that we would embrace the idea of unity without uniformity but without making strident political commentary, whether it be at services or religious undertakings. since 1954, the johnson amendment has ensured that tax exempt organizations, including churches and houses of worship, do not endorse or oppose

political candidates from the pulpit. for decades, this policy has shielded our nation's charitable community against partisan politics and allowed it to work in furtherance of its mission in a nonpartisan manner. i strongly oppose returning this provision. the health tax provisions in this bill do nothing to increase accountability for the device industry employers or health insurance. if we are going to provide tax relief to corporations, we should have guarantees that savings will be reinvested in innovation, and i must tell you, i think it is beyond dispute when we have now had an opportunity one year out to survey what happened with the benefits of the tax bill, overwhelmingly, the benefits went to corporations in terms of share buybacks and dividends. we had a chance to do this because we all acknowledged that we had to do something with the tax code. we decided to go it alone with one party, and that's why we're back here this evening trying to address some of these challenges and problems as we go forward. it wasn't just about

shareholders that needed some relief. it was about the middle class in america that needed that relief, and i hope in the coming year that we'll have a chance to revisit many of those proposals and make sure that the middle class will once again turn to us in terms of support for the needs that they have every day across the country as well. thanks for the invitation to have me here today. >> thank you very much, m mr. neal. we're delighted that you're here. chairman brady, there was a discussion today about middle class in this country. middle class in this country had been unemployed for many years. we had the largest number of unemployed african-americans, largest number of unemployed youth that were in this country this last summer, as i recall. you would know better the dates. you would know better the numbers. we had some 9 million jobs looking for people. 9 million extra jobs looking for people as opposed to 9 million people looking for jobs just

several years before. how did that happen? >> mr. chairman, it wasn't by accident. so, under the slow growth, really anti-growth policies of president obama, our economy slowed to less than 2%, slowest recovery from many of our lifetimes, and every economist told us that the new normal in america is you'll never grow more than 2%. our families, our young people coming out of college and school, their opportunities would be so-so at best and we could just get used to watching our jobs and companies move overseas. we knew there was a different potential and now, because of this tax code in just more than a year, we've gone from a nation asking where are the jobs to now we ask, where are the workers. at every business, it seems like across the country, starving for workers. we also now have seen the lowest unemployment rates for many of the underdogs in our community, whether it's african-americans,

hispanic-americans, disabled, teenagers, part-time jobs are now full-time jobs and for those workers who didn't get a high school degree, not even a ged, they are the -- always the ones who are laid off first, they're always the ones rehired last, they're unemployment is at the best since america started measuring it. so, wages are going up for the first time in a decade. unemployment, as low as it is in 50 years. economists, including the fed, believe it will go even lower. it will get even better for unemployment and so i think we have the fundamental right for this economy. i still believe the long-term benefit of a competitive tax code is really long-term, so i think this growth is important, and by the way, we will finish this year with something we never saw under president obama, which is 3% annual growth in america. our average used to be 3.3% for half a decade. that hope went away. well, we've restored it and we've got more work to do, no question about that.

we continue to fine tune, make technical corrections, we look forward to working with the new majority in the house on any fine tuning or changes that can grow this economy more. >> mr. chairman, i don't want to disagree with you, but many disabled people are last to get jobs also. >> absolutely. >> those that have one way or another retina issues and those that are disabled by other intellectual or physical disabilities. so, they are -- they have been included in this march and drive as an opportunity and one of the things which you and i have been careful is to try and attract that ability that people -- mr. neal, what are we going to -- i heard you oppose this, but the numbers that mr. brady talked about are current records. you're going to do better?

so, let's start with -- >> why don't we start with one of the theories that was offered and that -- this all happened in the last two years. so, stock market has been going up since march of 2009, and we have now had 97 straight months of economic growth but i want to attach one caveat, we've discussed this here in the past. revenue is at 16.9% of gdp. we're back to what happened during the bush years when revenue slipped to 15.5% while we engaged two years and we borrowed $2.3 trillion based on what the fed did again today with raising interest rates. that's what this is going to come out to after ten years, $2.3 trillion for a tax cut whose benefits overwhelmingly went to people at the top, furthering wealth concentration in america. we accepted the idea you had to do something about the corporate tax rate. president obama recommended a 28% rate. david camp recommended a 25% rate. so, we go to 21%, and now we're

finding out from many of the stakeholders across the country that this was not what they had in mind, so you wouldn't dispute the assertion that i've offered, that the overwhelming benefit here has gone to shareholders in terms of buybacks and to dividend expansion. >> so, that's the stock market? >> no, those are separate issues, but i'm saying that the average american, for the most part -- >> the people who own stocks, though. >> you're making the argument that this all happened or that allegedly the argument is that this all happened on the day that president trump took office. i'm saying -- >> oh, no, no. >> there's been a steady period of growth coming out of the worst recession since the depression at the end of the bush years to where we find ourselves today. believe me, mr. chairman, we're cheering for economic growth. we all want to see that happen. >> i think it happened about 30 days after the president took office, not immediately. i think it took off then. >> we had a decade of less than 2% growth, averaging 1.9%. that was the new normal under president obama. now it's much higher than that,

and i would point out 3 out of every $4 in the tax reform bill goes to individuals, middle class families, main street businesses, and as a result, that's why we see consumer confidence, again, continuing at very, very high levels and main street optimism at record levels as well. >> well, i think this is a -- an analogy of a team that scores touchdowns as opposed to teams that score defensive touchdowns. we need an offense. we need to actually make money and provide that incentive back to us. i'm going to miss these fun times. i'm just going to miss them. mr. chairman, barbara angus is your senior tax counsel. i hope somebody's able to thank her for the strong work that she's done. we thank -- i saw towner french in here, towner used to be the

deputy staff director. he came by just to see a little bit of fun. but i want to highlight all of our staffs, your staff, mr. neal, your staff, the work that they've done, the opportunity to make this happen, and i know we're nearing christmas. we ought to thank them. but sincerely, we appreciate the hard work and respect that enormously to that. mr. chairman. >> i won't take a lot of time. i want to thank both gentlemen for being here and for my good friend, the chairman, pushing right to the very end. and i have looked at these things, and for the most part, these are pretty noncontroversial. i don't think any of us are against helping people in disaster situations with appropriate tax relief, and the health tax is -- we've dealt with in a bipartisan way, again and again, many of these things. so this seems very common sensical to me and a little bit of needed clean-up that always happens after a big piece of tax

legislation, so i just want to commend the -- both gentlemen from working hard to the end and look forward to supporting this when it gets to the floor. >> thank you, sir. >> yield back. >> that's an aye vote for you. >> yes, sir. >> there's one. >> judge hey hastings. >> mr. chairman, can you tell me whether or not this is going to be our last session of the rules committee? >> i do not know. i would guess that it's pretty darn close. it's a runner-up if not. >> all right. the only reason i ask was i wanted to follow and echo the sentiments of mr. neal regarding you and to express my appreciation for the years of work that you have done here on the rules committee, laboring

with us all through good times and bad. and i appreciate all your friendship. we've had lots of robust discussion over the course of time, but have maintained our friendship. >> yes, sir. >> and i just want to express my appreciation for all your handling of this committee. toward that end, i do have questions, and mr. neal, let me ask you, was there a hearing regarding this matter that we are here on today? >> there was no hearing on this. >> was there a mark-up? >> there was no mark-up on this. >> were you consulted? >> i was not consulted on this. >> do you know of any of the other members of the ways and means committee -- >> i'm not aware of the members of the ways and means committee having been consulted. >> would it be accurate to say that not only have a lot of democrats not been consulted but

some republicans have not been consulted as well? >> well, i can't speak to that with any certainty, but i do know the haste with which this was drawn strikes me that it would have been very difficult for anybody, given the fact that we're just back from a six-day weekend when that could have been accomplished. >> now, mr. brady, you know all of us have been around here when it's time to leave, and you and i, mr. sessions, mr. cole, and a lot of us on this committee have been around when we get to what i call the christmas dance. now, you knew last week that we would come to this position where we are two or three days from actually closing this session of congress. do you anticipate yourself that the senate will take any action of this measure if it passes? >> so, i defer to the senate in their efforts. i know a number of senators from both parties have called eager

to send these provisions over because they, as you know, the irs reforms passed almost unanimously here in the house that's in here, the retirement savings and package has been bipartisan. the health taxes that we're voting on here dramatically bipartisan and i don't know who -- i haven't found a senator yet who says, hey, let's just make families in california and the carolinas wait longer for their disaster relief. and so, my thinking is that we will continue to do our work. the senate will adjourn when they adjourn, but we'll continue our work in the house just as i would expect you to do next session. >> yeah, well, it's pretty much certain based on what leader mcconnell has said that they're going to leave here and therefore whatever we do, assume we go and exercise the process

here and this measure passes, i don't think the senate was ever going to consider this partisan legislation in the first place, and now they aren't even going to be in town to be able to do so. but i agree with you that we will be able to go forward and doubtless do something that will really help. we talk about the middle class, but the group that is just below the middle class are also hurting. there was an exit poll, and i'm not one that places a lot of faith in snapshots in time, but one of the exit polls recently said that only 28% of americans surveyed said that the republicans tax bill helped them, and 45% reported no impact, and 23% of the people that were polled in that exit poll said that the bill hurt

them. now, the harsh reality is this. as all of us are politicians and keen observers of politics, i noticed around the country, as well as in the state that i'm proud to serve, and in my constituency, that my republican colleagues stopped even talking about the tax bill, and joined us, quite frankly, in something that i believe that every member of congress and the house and the senate believe in, and that is that we need to do something about preexisting conditions, especially in the cost of prescription drugs. that became the mantra of a lot of politicians who won and lost their elections, but i found it interesting that we left here with y'all touting your tax bill and then you stopped talking about it. so, it couldn't have been all that popular if you stopped

talking about it. otherwise, you would have continued along those lines. and let me correct you also, chairman brady, on something. there are -- everybody believed that voted for this measure, i believe they believed, that corporations were going to gin up hiring and do everything they could to ensure that the benefits that they received, which were considerable, were going to pass on to their employees. well, all of us in here know what most of them did. they did buybacks. they started -- and i could give you the statistics. i won't. but there are a variety of companies that laid off a lot of people, and then we had the recent flap with general motors, which comes to the point that you made about the uneducated being the first fired. that's not always true.

and if you believe that is true, then ask those people in ohio and michigan who are fairly well educated and have good jobs that were laid off. and likely are not to return to employment. so, while this is complicated, i just feel that today is much ado about nothing. this ain't going nowhere. and i appreciate the fact that you all played out the string and i'm glad you won't have the string to play out next year. >> i appreciate those comments and i disagree with all of them. an average family of four in your district sees a tax savings. you've pledged to take that money back for washington. i'm going to pledge my darnedest to keep it in their pocket and then we'll see what's more popular going forward. i look forward to that debate. >> i predict for you, mr. brady,

that by this time next year, no matter who's in charge of the house or the senate or the presidency, there will be a downturn in this economy and all you have to do is ask mr. powell today and his statement regarding cross current. that's one of the buzz words, a statement that he made signifying among other things that the growth that you tout, which i might add, mr. neal is absolutely correct, it didn't begin with the present administration. it has been on a glide path and that glide path is getting ready to go in another direction, and so i would urge most of the citizenry to hunker down and it will be critically important, what mr. neal and the ways and means committee that are going to be controlled by democrats, they're going to have to have a very delicate balance going forward to do what we can. this particular measure is troubling, and i would hope that

it wouldn't even pass if it did come to the floor tomorrow. or largely for the reason that it leaves out a whole lot of people, particularly those that have disasters. i'm going to try again next year to bring to the attention of this body and this country that we're in a -- an environment where disasters are going to continue and it is not based on any climate belief. i have argued for a number of years, after seeing what japan did, knowing that they were going to have earthquakes, japan established a committee of their diet that dealt specifically with disasters, and this particular congress needs to establish a committee that will deal with disasters, be they fires, floods, earthquakes, tornados, hurricanes, whatever of the disasters without us

having to piddle around the way that we do. i've seen blue roofs in my district that were from hurricanes, long time ago. i've seen drought areas that have yet to be repaired, and they're not just in democrat districts. they're in republican districts. we need to address this problem and we need to do so in a significant way. i yield back my time. >> gentlemen yields back his time. thank you very much. distinguished gentleman from georgia. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i think mr. hastings is exactly right, mr. chairman. that's my christmas gift here on the rules committee this cycle. there is leadership change happening in the ways and means committee, folks are going to have a delicate balance to walk. mr. neal is an able and capable leader as we all know, and i just want you to know from my side of the aisle, i'm glad that we have you there as the able and capable balance. i do worry about those revenue numbers that mr. neal mentioned.

if you're going to have spending above 21% of gdp, probably having revenue data down at 16% is not the right balance to reach the fiscal goals that i would like to see us reach and my constituents would like to see us reach. i'll wait patiently for the next mega deal that you all create that both brings down those expenditures and sorts out those revenues. but i don't just believe in your policies. i believe in you, and i just want you to know how much it has meant to me in these years of your leading the committee. for pete's sakes, you did things that folks said could never get done and that's the thing that i like most about this job, and i see it on both sides of the aisle, when folks say, you know that congress, they're just never -- they'll never get it right. they'll never build the coalition to do it. they'll never get it done. and you heard that every single day of your chairmanship and you did it anyway. >> thank you, sir. >> i'm grateful for that.

i did want to ask you, because all you do is work, all you and mr. neal both do is work that impacts people. all you work on all day long on the ways and means committee are things that matter. and so, as i look at reform, tax cuts have great support, revenue expenditures have great support, tax reform doesn't have as much support because that actually requires that folks do some more heavy lifting and part of the reform that you all are working on, i know you've changed the way that our rule electric co-ops would recognize grants that came to them, rather than recognizing them as inside money, they'd be recognized as outside money, which begins to impact the ratios required for their nonprofit status between their inside money and their outside money. big guys might be able to handle it. some of the small folks in georgia are going to have a really tough time with that.

can you tell me a little bit about why that change is being made and why there's something coming down the road. >> the industries brought that to our attention and not only that, there's two other issues here. one is that i think they'd like to do some modernization of the code in the area of those co-ops which they've worked with representative adrian smith and others, yourself and others, in filing legislation that addresses that issue, which is a sort of a very targeted one. and then does some of the new modernization also in this bill is a provision that actually reduces their contributions to pensions to sort of reflect the lower risk rate of that in nonprofit organizations like girl scouts of america, so they -- they have a very important vision in this bill, but they're also looking to work with us on more fine tuning in the future. >> okay. >> can i make point on the revenues? >> please. >> so, we really don't have a revenue problem in washington. we have a spending problem.

so, even with all the tax cuts in place today, we have more revenue this year than last, and the income tax revenue, despite all the cuts in payroll taxes, are up by about $105 billion. that's because more people are going back to work. and they're getting paid more, so at the end of this ten years, our revenue coming in as a percent of gdp will increase to 17.8% so we are going to grow revenue significantly even with the tax cuts in place. the problem is spending's going up to 24%. therein lies the problem in my view. i know that's an issue you show up concerned about and you continue to battle. >> well, it is, and i look forward to seeing how mr. neal and under this leadership, the committee tackles that challenge because yes, folks said we would never get a tax bill done, you led, you got a tax bill done, but that -- that next challenge, then, is what do we do about the

expenditures side, all that traffic that moves through the ways and means committee, that's heavy lifting, that's heavy lifting too. and i worry about those things going forward. i know you took some -- you took some shots at it and we you our problem here in congress is often we have good leaders who need to follow the strong lead. i will tell you i don't know what your christmas plans are, but mine will be a rules committee. i don't want this to be our last rules committee meeting, mr. hastings. there is more to be said about the people who are in the business of building bridges rather than turning them down. of late friend of mine said winners do things that losers just won't do and that is my friend pete sessions.

thank you all for giving us a reason to be here tonight. i yield back mr. chairman. >> thank you mr. chairman and if this is our last meeting for this 115th congress, let me also join in in thanking you for your work on this committee and i know that this has taken a lot of your personal time and family time, so i think you and i thank your bride for sharing you with all of us. in regards to the agenda that we have before us today, this is a rewrite of what we saw

last month. with two possible changes. i am disappointed that this was introduced on monday, and i am disappointed that our incoming chairman of the powerful ways & means committee committee was not brought into the conversation. i'm disappointed that we are utilizing the victims of climate change as a way to try to maneuver a yes vote on something that was already voted down on the floor a month ago. so, let's not do this again. let's figure out a way to work together and to come together and not attend that we are helping the little guy or the vic adams of climate change, when we really are trying to help our corporate partners.

and with that mr. chairman, once again, thank you for the time that you have spent with us in this congress. thank you for the hospitality that you have shown is here. >> yes ma'am, thank you very much, the gentlewoman yields back. let's go to michael burgess. >> i find myself in the uncomfortable position of agreeing with the gentleman from georgia, mr. woodall. i hope this is not our last time meeting here because i have enjoyed serving of your chairmanship and i want to take this opportunity to thank you for the confidence you had in me several years ago in insisting to then-speaker weiner that i be part of this. popular legend is you had to go back five times to convince him but i'm glad you prevailed and i hope it has been truly an honor to serve with you on this

dais and i hope i was worth all of those extra trips that you made to his office. >> i enjoyed it especially when the gentleman from oregon showed up and you can decide which was your favorite chairman. >> is the jury still out? >> i suspect it is. and i want to thank our witnesses for being here today. mr. brady, chairman brady, i used to be a student of medical irony and i feel i have branched out now into the legislative irony. i mean you and i were on the joint economic committee several years ago. we received those jobs number on the first friday of every month until of course the democrats were in charge at that time and they actually stop having those hearings where he paul where the

department of labor statistics would come in and share with us the grim results of what the previous months employment had been. i remember those hearings with christina romer and lori summers, the dark clouds were just ahead as far as any i could see and there was no hope that things would ever be any better. i mean those were some of the most depressing hearings that i have ever encountered. and then, i'm willing to admit that perhaps things had started to improve before the current administration, president frump took office but i have got to tell you, i went back and redo my 401(k) statement from 2015 and it wasn't a pretty picture. i reviewed it from 2017, and it was a significant and marked improvement. now i recognize the markets have some volatility and this perhaps may not be to be as robust as last year was but

that is a stark difference in the last full year of the obama administration for the first full year of the trump administration, 2015-2017, if people still have their 401(k) statements in their shoeboxes in their closets, pull those out and look at those if you have a question in your mind as to whether or not things were okay economically even the last years of the obama administration. it was not okay. it was 2 % growth , we were told this is the new normal, get used to it it will never be any better. and mr. chairman, your chart comments about people in the middle class it used to be people ran their elections on, we want to take care of the middle class, we want to build up the middle class. well, the last to years the

trump administration has done just that. the middle class has done mighty well. now i am concerned because when i turn on cable television and i listen to all the talking heads, people who are a lot smarter with economic things than i am, we hear that there is now on the cusp of an economic downturn. it's almost as if they are willing and wanting that to happen so that they can then point to president trump and say see, he didn't know how to make the economy better for you. and now it's getting better. but they are trying to talk them economy. i can remember when george w. bush took charge in 2001 and he made mention of the fact that it seemed like the economy was a little shaky and tom daschle and all of these folks jumped on him and said don't talk down the economy, for heavens sakes you will investors and the market will come down. and the self-fulfilling prophecy and i tell you i cannot turn on the television now without hearing some smart

person talking about this is the end of this economic expansion. nonsense. nonsense. the only reason that should happen is if we turn our attention away from things that have actually delivered this economic revival to this country and in fact rebuilt the middle class. and we should be rejoicing on that. the congressional budget office, it's no secret i have had my feet within this last two years. where's the congressional budget office this figure on the number of people who are covered by employer-sponsored plans who weren't covered two years ago? if the economy has added 2 1/2 million jobs in my limited way of thinking about things, those are two and half million people who may have the availability for employer-sponsored insurance. if their family or if there is a spouse or child covered under that policy, that could be 2

1/2-5 million people who have coverage you did not have it under the obama economy. that should be something to celebrate. we should be grateful for that, unless you really want, only the government to be in charge of your healthcare and you don't want people to be in charge of their own healthcare and you certainly want them to get from the employer. i don't even understand why someone would make that kind of an argument. it seems counter to everything that certainly i have been taught. but the concept of people talking down the economy to her this administration is one that, it bothers me significantly and it bothers me because like you, i sat in that joint economic committee and i heard those dire warnings from christina romer and larry summers and all the smart people that president obama had

gathered around him and they weren't able to figure it out. we had a stimulus but it did work, we probably need another one, and it needs to be bigger. well, here we are now, two years into the trump administration and the sunshine has been shining. look, i have served when there is a bad economy and a good economy and i know this purely from, not schooled in political science, i was schooled in the biological sciences, but i do know this. i look a lot smarter if there is a good economy. and that is what i want. so i thank you mr. brady for the work you did on the tax reform. i am thankful that you are bringing this before sedate terry can i just ask you question on what you referred to as the cadillac tax? and i see the section 302 in the bill you got before us. we are not getting rid of it we are just delaying it. "so the medical tax delayed five years. the health insurance tax 2-year

delay. and the cadillac tax punishes workers who get good healthcare at work. you anticipated my question. >> which republicans, democrats have long agreed. >> and would you stipulate, in case anyone is watching this who doesn't understand what a cadillac tax is? are they going to tax my car? no we are going to tax or health insurance benefits if it's too generous. >> we won't tax the better company that the insurance that the government says is too good for you. whether, wherever you get your insurance and raises premiums 4- 5 %. so in this bill we are making healthcare more affordable for workers and for families, regardless of where

they get their help. >> let me just add one other thing. people who get their insurance through their employers, i heard pre-existing conditions mentioned. under the erisa plan, there is no exclusion for pre-existing conditions. once the person is through the probationary part of their employment, they received their insurance coverage, regardless of previous health history. that is not from the affordable care act, that is from a group of laws called orissa from 1972 or 1974, i think it was senator gaddis of new york, a republican, but that protection on pre-existing conditions, if we expand the employer- sponsored rule we are in fact protecting more people against being charged the additional penalty for a pre-existing condition. and i think that is something we should celebrate. take you for bringing this bill and i think we need to do everything we can not to damage

the economy but to encourage the economy and encourage the american worker because they are the ones who have actually brought us this prosperity. and the president and the american worker. take you mr. chairman i yield back. >> thank you very much, professor burgess. the distinguished man from alabama, mr. byrne. >> i don't know if this is our last meeting or not, you are one of the most decent people i've known in my life. one of the most fair people i have known in my life. you conduct yourself with grace and it has made our work here a lot easier. you also took a lot of arrows for other people. and so we should all thank you for doing that and doing that in a way that you have done it. and i will never forget your leadership here and i appreciate it. i appreciate these two gentlemen and i say mean that when i see gentlemen.

we talk about the deficit? i have a simple question for the american people. how much you want government to pay for? and sometimes we want more government than we are willing to pay for. and i think we need to just say that. this is how much money we are willing to pay and let's get the government down to how much we are willing to pay for it. the truth of the matter is we are not willing to take 20 % of the gross domestic product of the united states and pay it. now we dance around that by saying we are going to make the rich people pay for, i have read the studies, we can tax the rich 100 % and was still come up with enough revenue to get to the gdp. it doesn't work. so let's be honest and ask ourselves, read represent the american people, how much money are we willing to pay for government? and i'm telling you it's not 20 % of the gdp. i think what it really means is we have to have a talk with ourselves, we're supposed to be leaders. what do we need to do to bring

the government within the means of what the american people want to pay for? that means we've got to talk about the 2/thirds that we don't pay for. i'm looking at how much you are spending the last fiscal year for medicaid and food stamps. and comparing it to what it looks like in a recession because you would think with the economy be way it is that those numbers would come way down because most people have jobs and they don't need medicaid. what happened? why not? we didn't even get to ask that question because we are going to appropriate that money. and if we are not willing to ask that question, we are not willing to actually go in and ask the hard questions about where we spend money across the board i'm on armed services, i think it's absolutely imperative that we ask the pentagon now that we have an order on them, why do you spend money this way? i think we have an obligation to do that but we have an obligation to do it across the

board and until we are willing to do that, and sometimes i think tax policy is getting out ahead of fiscal policy. i'm not saying that what you're doing is wrong, i'm saying that we understand that tax policy can only go so far and fiscal policy has got to go the rest of the way. i listen to all of these debates over and over again and i just want us to sit down at some point as the representatives of the people of america and see how much government are we really willing to pay for? not that other guy over there but all of us together? how much are we really willing to pay for? if we are honest about it, it's not as much as we want to spend, that means it's time for us to make some hard decisions about spending. that is not general motors job, i understand that. but we've got to get these two together in the same room and until we do, we need to quit playing games. and with that, i yield back. >> think you be distinguished

man goes gentlemen from washington. >> thank you mr. chairman, i didn't realize that this might be our last meeting and it's better that you did not give us time to prepare speeches to recognize your service. but i just want to make mention and note of the fact that if it is, mr. chairman, mr. sessions, you have been a mentor, you have been a friend, in heck, you have been my best man. >> yes her. >> you have been a great example for all of us here and i just want to tell you that it will be hard to keep up to the same level of service that you have shown us in your tenure here. you have been more than fair to everyone who has come before this committee, to us that sit on the dais here, allowing unlimited debate, and that's not something a lot of people would do. but you have seen the importance of making sure that

us, that american people have a voice in these important matters. so i applaud that. you have always held the people of this country, the constitution of the united states and this institution in the highest respect. and i just can't say enough about the level that you have helped all of us rise to in our service to our country. >> thank you, sir. i appreciate that very much. >> i also just want to briefly say i concur with many of the remarks i heard tonight. chairman brady you said something about we now have employers looking for employees, absolutely true in my district. it has been a tremendous turnaround in just a few short years. i think, i have got to think that some of the work that you both have done, that we have

done collectively contributed to the better economy that we are experiencing, if you look at most of the economic indicators they are all pointed in the right direction. i heard an individual say not too long ago, kind of reminiscent of the 60s, give growth a chance. and that's what we are able to do, and witness now in this country. we are at a tremendous pace and i do also want to make note of the desire that you have expressed, let's not wait another 30 years to take a hard look at our tax system. let's make sure it's fine-tuned and changes are made on a continuing basis, no matter who is in charge, mr. neal. let's make sure that the climate in our country is one that allows people to be as successful as they possibly

can. that allows the united states to be as competitive as possible in the world economy. and i think with that charge, mr. brady you will have left a very important legacy behind. into the future, if we can follow that advice. >> thank you both for bringing this forward and i yield back. >> thanks gentlemen, the gentleman from colorado, mr. buck. >> think is mr. chairman and i want to join everyone here thanking you for your service. the first week that you and -- introduced me as a member of the rules committee you said that it would be the last of the committee and 100 weeks later i am still here. and i am very proud to have served on this committee with your leadership and very proud to have learned from you. you have been a mentor to almost everybody in the house and your style and fairness are

an example and i very much appreciate it. mr. brady was kind enough to call me yesterday and visit with me about life, in general. and i have to tell you i came in here with an open mind and you have convinced me. i agree with you absolutely that we are overspending in this country, not under taxing. and you have convinced me to vote against the spending bill this week. [ laughter ] in response to mr. burns comments, we have attempted, we have formed a committee earlier in the year and we had the committee meet and we have received testimony and debate and leadership decided that it was to toughen

issue. and leadership on both sides of the aisle is my understanding decided that it was just too tough an issue and until we get a backbone in congress, and we take on issues like that, we are going to continue to have unsustainable deficit. and it is i think incredibly sad that a good tax bill like this, a bill that reduces the burden on americans is caught up because we don't have the discipline to tackle the spending issue that we need to tackle. and so i thank you for your remarks earlier, you are incredibly persuasive and i will look up at the board and i hope that you have persuaded many others to act accordingly. i yield back mr. chairman. >> gentlemen, both of you have taken a great deal of time and the seriousness with which you approach this issue is important to the nation. it is important that this article one body. but perhaps more importantly it is the spirit in which you both

have been able to approach not only doing your job at getting your job done. mr. neal will look forward to not only next year your ability to effectively come and offer a pathway that you believe would be better. mr. brady, i want to thank you for your service. we did come in together. i met you for the first time in the courtroom in madison. >> in a town hall meeting. >> perhaps more importantly, your service during these times has been exemplary and for you to follow the pathway that you saw would bring economic growth and development, you should gain the standing for that. >> well done, mr. chairman. >> i want to thank both of you, i want to thank her staffs i

want to go back to once again thanking ms. angus for her sincere appreciation and taking my calls sometimes when she didn't want to call me back and i wanted thank the deputy staff director mr. french who is here to watch this committee meeting tonight. i hope it's not our last meeting, we do need more. and i think we can be back to finish off a couple of items what i want to thank both of you very much and thank you for your service and your time here today. >> these make sure whatever you brought in writing that you do leave for the record. >> okay, we had previously had a brief discussion with the distinguished gentleman from massachusetts, mr. mcgovern about the circumstances in which we find ourselves in. i have not gotten an update but i believe the senate has not finished all of their work yet and so not knowing where they are on that hill, we don't know exactly what we have to offer in this rule as we approach.

but what we are going to do is subject to the call of the chair we are going to figure this out. so, we will be back, it's now about 6:15 in the east coast and we will be back a little bit later tonight as we figure out the resolution of that paperwork from the senate. so subject to the call we will reconfirm at that point.

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coming up thursday morning, we discussed a possible friday government shutdown and the

robert mueller investigation with texas republican conklin hung gehsmann jody arrington. and stars & stripes reporter nikki whitley on the top veterans issues going into 2019 as well as tuesday's testimony by veterans of foreign affairs robert wilkie on the mission of the agency. and during holiday week sure to watch washington journal for authors week starting sunday, december 23. featuring like seven segments each morning with crystal fleming, orin kass, juan williams, ellen dershowitz, alyssa cord, motor chair and, sarah kinsey or and chris christie real. government under which we live was created in the spirit of copper mice and the spirit of mutual concession. >> thomas jefferson questioned the need for senate.

>> let's follow the constitution. >> the framers established the senate to protect people from the rulers and as a check on the house. >> the fate of this country and maybe even the world lies in the hands of the congress of the united states and senate. >> the senate, conflict and compromise. a c-span original production exploring the history, traditions and roles of this uniquely american institution. >> please raise your right hand. >> wednesday, january 2 at 8 pm eastern and pacific on c- span. up next a panel discussion on how journalists handle concerns further personal physical safety as wares how they secure and verify the information they gather the resources and research in the process of doing their job this hour:20