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battle of world war ii and took place from april through june 1945. next historian mark depue , details the u.s. strategy in invading the island and the japanese plans for defense, which included kamikaze attacks on u.s. warships. he also described the months of hard combat that resulted in the deaths of more than 12,000 u.s. soldiers, sailors and marines, and over 200,000 japanese military and civilian deaths. the abraham lincoln presidential library and museum hosted this event and provided the video. okinawa on the doorstep of japan, the last battle of world war ii. if you recall our conversation last time about iwo jima, this is a larger, longer, bloodier version of iwo jima. the intensity of the combat was

every bit the same but it involved lots more troops on both sides. and it lasted about two and half months. so let's go ahead and dive right into it. and start with a little bit of background. as you recall from back -- last time, june or july of 1944, there was a high-power meeting in honolulu that involved president roosevelt, nimitz, admiral nimitz and admiral king, and general macarthur. they had quite a discussion about where to go to next. the decision they made was to go to it will jima but allow macarthur to continue an advance on the philippines as well. a couple of months later in september 1944 the navy brass meets in san francisco. you have asked most -- admirals nimitz and king again and they hash things out. again there is this disagreement. the disagreement is centered on where to go to next as far as

the central pacific is concerned. goingg was in favor of all the way to formosa. he thought that would be the logical place to go. nimitz remembering the conversation and agreements they had, was in favor of iwo jima. that iwo tough to see jima is right here, this little star in the middle of nowhere. of course, they had already decided iwo jima was going to be next. that starts in march. then where to go to after iwo jima? if not formosa, the next up was going to be somewhere in theryuku islands and the logical place was okinawa. here is the mainland, okinawa, the surrounding islands. that was the decision finally made, and they codenamed at operation iceberg. do not ask me how they come up with these names, they are colorful.

a little bit about okinawa itself. long and from anywhere from 2-18 miles wide. square miles. remember how tiny iwo jima was, this is a much larger island. it is part of the ryuku chain of islands, mountainous terrain in the north. , the landingarea beaches are going to be in this vicinity. fieldsow planes, lots of the southern part of the island, hard to tell, rolling terrain. the top half of the island is cut off, or mountainous. ae population of okinawa was half million. most of them lived in the southern portion of the island or the central area i pointed out. the southern third, you can take

a look, it does not look like nice rolling terrain, doesn't? it is steep national escarpment's, ravines, terraces, ridges, and lots of natural caves. primarily these are coral formations over the eons, that had developed. in other words, it is ideal terrain for the enemy to defend, very good terrain for that. there was one major city you can naha anshuri., and here is, shuri, the ancient capital of okinawa. and here is an ancient castle, that is going to end up being the headquarters for the japanese for the entire campaign. the population, it is not japanese. they are a mixture of malay,

chinese, philippine. they are smaller than the japanese. the japanese took control of the island in 1879, one of the first conquests. and the japanese looked down on the okinawans, do not think too much of them. and the okinawans were happy to reciprocate their feelings about the japanese in many respects. play, this is a picture of a typical village. you can see it is very much agricultural. i want to play this quote from bernie pyle. for those whom ever bernie pyle -- ernie pyle, he spent most of the door with the infantry in italy and was beloved by the gis. he ended the war it in okinawa.

[video clip] >> i will try to describe what this island looks like. it does not look different from most of america. in fact it looks more like america than anything the marines have seen for the last three years. the climate is temperate, rather than the tropical, so is the vegetation. the country rose gradually from the sea, and was formed in the small fields. it did not look at all unlike indiana in late summer, when things have started to turn dry and brown, except the fields were smaller. as you get inland, the country becomes rougher. in the hills there is less cultivation and more trees. it is really a pretty country. ernie p you go, that is again, acription, description that it feels more temperate and like home. a little bit about the japanese command.

the 32nd army is stationed in okinawa. it had been there quite a while, upwards of nine months, when the commander showed up and took control of the islands'forces, approximately 100,000 troops. it is a mixture of front-line units. there's the 62nd division, the 24th division. the 62nd is a light division designed to fight in china, and guerrilla warfare. the 24th was a much heavier division, designed to fight against the russians. so they had what americans would consider, the equivalent a lot of artillery, fire support of various types, the logistical chain you would need to have a heavier combat operation. and some auxiliary units as well.

there was also about 20,000 okinawans. some of them were decent troops, but a lot of them had been conscripted, right before this campaign is going to start, so they are not reliable. they are not your front-line troops. and you're going to see them sacrificed on a couple of occasions as we move forward. is the commander lieutenant general, an interesting person, the embodiment of the summer i spirit. -- samurai spirit. he embraced the tradition of some right warfare, stoic and spartan in his traditions. in combat, and in the japanese military academy. he disagreed with the decision to attack pearl harbor, thought it was a bad idea. he had that respect for the american military force and their potential. he is described as ramrod

straight, unshakable self-control, very well respected and admired by his soldiers, across the line. and he takes command of the 32nd army in august, 1944. seend that time forward, we them doing serious preparations because they figure that was one of the americans next steps. the other commander i'm featuring his lieutenant general cho, the chief of staff for the 32nd army. he is a very different kind of person. would be the wet best way to describe, -- the best way to describe him, a quick temper. he was antidemocratic, anti-capitalistic, was in favor of a military dictatorship, to the point where in 1931, he had participated in a coup to overthrow the prime minister. the coup felt -- failed.

so what happens to an american who would do something like that? it would be bad news. as well,d news for cho they sent him to a command in manchuria. he stays in the army, that is what happened to people at that time, and that tells you a lot about the nature of japanese government and the military at that time, that he can survive and still be part of the system, to a certain extent. play,t, he has a role to in a couple of the incident that lead to the japanese getting involved with major combat operations in manchuria and then in china, he is in the midst of this. they are instigating these things to drop japan into these major wars. so that is who he has. he also is something of a sophisticate. he likes to have nice things around him, to include.

here's a quote i found. meals,e found, unrivaled the best scotch whiskey, the finest sock a -- sake, and the prettiest women. cho is.ls you about who the japanese defenses, ighq. imperial government headquarters, excuse me, imperial general headquarters in tokyo. there concept was that there are two major airstrips, and a couple of minor ones. the main job of the 32nd army, as far as the headquarters, was to guard those airstrips, to keep them operational, to maintain them, to upgrade them. all what thet japanese who were there, the commanders who were there. should happen and here's the third character that is very important to this discussion. it is yahara colonel yahara --

colonel yahara, the chief of planning for the 32nd army. you need to understand something about the nature of command and the japanese army at this time. they modeled their command structure after the germans. if you know something about the german army, the chief of staff and staff, have a lot to do with any kind of operational decisions. that was maybe more so for the japanese. certainly it was for the 32nd army. jima, as the men he stands in the background argue cho and yahara back and forth because those two john mack had dramatically different visions for how to defend the island and eventually it is yahara the alter ego and opposite of cho in terms of

personality, quiet, stoic, intense and believing strongly in his positions. theidea was to allow americans to land relatively unopposed, don't kebab down and defending the airstrips and wait for them to come to you -- don't get bogged down in defending airstrips and wait for them to come to you. to sound similar to thoughts on how iwo jima should be defended. once they land, dogged resistance to defend the southern third of the island. minimal defense for the rest of the island itself, and not much in the central area, the low lands area, where the okinawan troops often would be to resist. other part of this equation is kamikaze attacks. cozzi -ina use of, and hecozzi -- kamakaze

will jima. the idea was, because aircraft bombs they boats and could drop for aircraft, would destroy the american fleet as much as possible to the point where the american fleet would have to leave and isolate american troops on land. and then the japanese could go on the offensive. that was the notion. believessure yahara that would be successful but he was committed and able to shujima and others. and just like iwo jima we are going to fight to the last man and cozzi enemy as much blood and instruction as possible. here is the 32nd army slogan. one plane, for one worship.

one boat, for one ship. one man for 10 of the enemy, or one tank. that was their idea. two bloody the american force at sea and on land, to the point where the american public and high command in the united states would say, this is too much. it is not worth it. let's sit at the negotiating table and forget about this concept of an unconditional surrender. that was the goal. seeking negotiated peace. ok. look atto take a closer the japanese fortifications. it.e diagrams illustrate the terrain in the southern third of okinawa was conducive to lots of tunnels, lots of caves. there are lots of natural caves people could use. the japanese had months to work

on their fortifications. they found the coral might be a few feet deep. you mix the car with water and it set up nicely, a most like cement. they had some cement brought in. they were scarce on logistics. they were concerned about having enough timber to shore up their tunnel system. fortunately, the northern half of the island was filled with forest. so all he had to do is figure out how to get those trees they could fell them selves to the southern part of the island, and fortify there. one picture is deceiving. you can see clearly these caves that have been dug into the side of a hill. that would not be the case when the americans first got there. i am sure the americans burned this off, this is afterwards. they would have been very well hidden, and incredible hard to find.

you can see how deep they might , that is deep. they would dig very deep. the goal was to have fortifications to the point where it was impervious to enemy shelling, to bombardment of any type, whether naval bob environment -- naval bombardment, heavy and medium apartments, or fighter craft. that is what they did. they had nine months and out this intricate system. you can see in both of these how small the aperture is, that exposed to the enemy. impossible to find in the first place, and very difficult to destroy once you do located. the problem is -- locate it. the problem is, this kind of a position very much limits the kind of fire the japanese can have going back and forth. they would solve that problem to

an extent by having a huge number of these bunkers and positions that could mutually support each other says the americans were advancing on it. -- as americans were advancing on it. i want to mention one thing. castle, thesuri headquarters where the japanese were. that was dug 50-160 feet deep. they were determined nothing was going to be able to get to them. an incredible lattice of tunnels and connecting positions that could provide support for over 1000 headquarters troops and everything and anything you could imagine and well-stocked cho'sovision to include luxury items. there were 30 young women, 12 japanese and 18 okinawa women helping with clerical duties and other things.

so that is the japanese spending months preparing for the americans. let's take a look at the allied commands. and themiral nimitz operational commander on the ground, or in the sea i should say, the commander of the fifth fleet. you can see his picture on the right. an interesting fellow. stoic, quiet he believed in pushing power down, giving as much latitude as possible to subordinates. he was the hero of midway and the hero of the philippine sea. like fdr for willing to tolerate his idiosyncrasies to include things like this

flagship was the uss indianapolis, the ship that carried the atomic bomb, and was sunk afterwards, after it had done so. would walk up and down the deck of the indianapolis in his shorts, no shirt, white socks and black shoes, thinking, three or four hours at a time, thinking and pondering on things. that tells you about the personality of spruance. admiral richman turner, a 1908 graduate of west point, graduated from the u.s. naval academy, he would skewer me if he heard that mistake, i imagine. theas the brains behind navy and brains amphibious training and operations, one of the key people that developed the notion of amphibious landings early in the war.

he is going to have there's possibility of being in charge of all amphibious forces, to include you can see at the bottom, the third amphibious corps, three marine divisions. i'm not sure how brains feel about having a navy officer command that but that is the way the command structure work. worked. lieutenant general buckner junior. his father was the one who surrendered to general grant at fort donaldson early in the war. he has this great pedigree, a 1908 west point graduate, he becomes an aviator in 1917. spends most of his early career at military schools. by the time you get close to the work he has had a series of successful commands. so he is going to be that tent army commander. -- 10th army commander.

you have the tent army with the 24th corps, the heart of that. division.h, 77, 96 here's the difference between you and jim and okinawa, not just the number of units, but a sizable army contingent. -- between iwo jima and okinawa. corps. amphibious and army divisions, the third and sixth. hodges the other general in charge of the 24th corps. it is going to be buckner making most of the key decisions. like iwo jima, once you get into the combat, it is not a lot of maneuvering going back and forth, it is fighting at the squad and platoon and company level. a the time that company is combat for a day or two it is

the size of a squad or platoon. that is the way it is going to work a little more about the naval forces. consider these numbers. is fifth fleet, this spruance's fleet. 17 fleet carriers by this time japanese really are not much of a naval threat. nightlight carriers, 13 battle -- nine light carriers, 13 battleships, including the uss nevada. 18 heavier cruisers, including spruance's flagship, the indianapolis. 23 light cruisers, scores of destroyers, and all the other ships it takes to support this, landing craft, oilers, tankers, supply ships, everything. date think on the landing there was something like 1300 ships off the coast of okinawa.

[captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2021] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] so there is a picture of the vast armada that spruance commands. hass not just that, he also operational command of task force 57, a british task force, whose main mission was to isolate and concentrate on formosa. so they have complete command of the sea, and they probably thought at the time, complete command of the air. except for kamikazes which we will touch on in a little bit. -day" day, why not d-day? iwo jima is wrapping up when okinawa is being launched.

l landing day. the preinvasion preparations included six days of naval bombardment. before this time, heavy bombers and medium bombers had been bombarding the island for months on end. have every begun in the navy blasting away at okinawa, hoping and thinking they can destroy the defensive works. for six days, much longer than iwo jima. recall, what was one of the complaints about it will jima? they had not received report from -- support from naval gunfire they thought was necessary. they are going to be landing on hagushi beach. beach, and day -- and a feint by the second

marine division, in an area not conducive to a landing. but it was fairly effective and held some of the japanese forces in position in the south. the landing itself,

the neighborhood of 110,000 dead. look at the p.o.w.'s. now we begin to see the willingness of the japanese to surrender. percentage of the forces.

at the end of the campaigning in okinawa, you begin to see these japanese coming out of your caves and surrendering, many after the war had actually ended. the number of civilian deaths. this is devastation on an unimaginable scale. it has everything to do with what i wanted to conclude with here. japan.asion of plans for int was going to start november 1945, with another operation coronet beginning after that. the firstd would be one. early 1946, the 8th army and 10th army lands on

tokyo plane. three marine and 25 army divisions. many of those army divisions were being shipped from europe. 20th airic fleet, the force, and by the time you get to july and august, the air force was having a hard time finding good targets to bomb with their strategic bombers. anotherush was individual i interviewed. he was a marine and intelligence officer at the regimental level. he survived iwo jima. he went back to hawaii and spent the next couple months planning the invasion of japan. that's what you will hear him talking about. november.to be in the following march was to be

the invasion of the tokyo plane. 14 divisions on the island. plane, 38 divisions involved. 3 million men involved in the operation. at least one million casualties. 1 iwo, about 3 wounded per killed. it, ite i knew about became obvious i would not survive. truman's decision to use the atomic bomb he is convinced saved his life. who knows how many casualties the americans would have suffered if the japanese had continued to resist?

they were training japanese civilians to resist in any way that they could. it looked to be a grim equation. the decision was made by truman, noticed that they they had a workable atomic bomb, and nagasakihima on august 9. there is the devastation at the center of hiroshima. 14 that you have the japanese surrender, only after the emperor consists that is what they will do -- emperor insists that's what they will do. yesterday, september 2, 1945, the anniversary of this event. the formal surrender on the uss

missouri in tokyo harbor. the man sitting there is general douglas macarthur. time for questions and comments if you have any. you already have one. >> yes, thomas checks in. though it would have taken longer, would it have been possible to isolate the island, preventing resupply, essentially laying siege to the island and starving them into submission? the argument about whether or not to use the atomic bomb in the first place rages on to this day. most military strategists then and to this day think it was going to be necessary to invade mainland japan. that's part of the equation. to launch an invasion

of mainland japan, which they thought was necessary, given the experience that they had in iwo japanese knew that the were totally dedicated to the point of exterminating the entire race to defend themselves. was that actually likely to happen? we can speculate until the day has ended. to be able to invade mainland japan, it was important to have okinawa as a logistical base and a palce -- place to fly aircraft. but i wille this, say that they had made the right decision to invade okinawa. >> do you have any comments on 82 days publication "

on okinawa"? mark: there has been all kinds of recent literature. i have been reading some that were written quite a while ago. i cannot answer that. i haven't read that one. >> we have a question from bill. bill says, i understand that the airfields in okinawa or never used by the u.s. army air corps or navy after the battle ended. was the victory worth the cost? mark: i think the ones on hiroshima were used and i think the ones on okinawa were as well. one of the early things that would have happened after you land the major forces and move south is you start to seed these lines and refurbish the airstrips. >> we have a comment here.

several different comments. a number of people have mentioned relatives or grandparents, grandfathers that served. was a staffmy dad sergeant originally involved with inventory and supplies. as the battle escalated, he and his unit were charged with inventorying the american soldiers killed in battle. i imagine that was a grim duty but a necessary one. they neverny times, find the bodies. they have been lost. thatof the casualties would have been initially buried one okinawa would have been moved to other cemeteries. the american policy is that you don't have cemeteries on land that wasn't the enemy's at the time of the war. that heris person says

grandfather was killed april 10, was in the seventh infantry. her mother has all the letters that he wrote to her grandmother, as well as all of the letters that were returned after his death. a good example of preserving that family history. mark: i would imagine that our manuscripts department would be happy to have those letters donated in the future, so that others can have that same experience and begin to appreciate the sacrifice of these young men. anything from the audience here? it looks like we are good. mark, ladies and gentlemen, for the friends and family that were here, let's give a round of applause for dr. dupue. a wonderful presentation. >> if you like american history

tv, keep up with us on the weekend with facebook, twitter and youtube. learn about what happened on this day in history and see the preview clips of upcoming programs. panhistory.@cs reflectsford bale, on the ford family time in the white house with ann compton. here's a preview. >> let me ask you about this. most dramatice part about betty ford's time in the white house. women who were diagnosed with breast cancer often kept it quiet, did not want attention. it was almost an embarrassment to them. ritical, often fatal diagnosis. your mother had just stepped

into the national spotlight. she decided that she could help women by treating this as publicly as she did. so you talk to us about that early in the admin astray -- administration? >> it was an interesting discussion. she talked to all of us as a family and said, how do you feel about this? we were like, its fine. it's not a big deal. it wasn't a big deal to us has family members. when we started to read the material of the women who had been hiding in closets and had not undressed in front of their husbands for years, and women dying of this disease, she didn't choose to go public because it was going to give her fame or attention. she did it because she wanted it for women, for families, for that.

to get it out out of the closet so that people would learn about it. as you will remember, the women who went in for mammograms and the lines to get treated were off the charts. it was the best thing that could happen to women in breast cancer. she changed that and saved millions of lives. >> learn more about the ford family's time in the white house here on american history tv. >> you're watching american history tv, every weekend on c-span three. explore the nation's past. american history tv on c-span created by america's cable television companies. we are brought to you by these companies to provide american history tv to viewers as a week on american history

tv's real america, as the nation prepares for the transfer of power from the trump administration to the biden administration, we look back to past presidential farewells. first, from january 18, 1989, skate -- two days before leaving office, the president and first lady, nancy reagan, enter the east room of the white house to extended applause. we will show president reagan's last radio address. in a 25 minutes from january 1981, president jimmy carter's farewell in which he thanks the nation for the opportunity to serve and warns about the continuing threat of nuclear war. resident dwight d. eisenhower in the oval office in 1961. the speech is best membered for the presidents morning about what he called the military-industrial context. -- military-industrial complex.