c-span 3 every weekend documenting america's story funding comes from these television companies and more including comcast. are you think this is just a community center? no, it's way more than that. comcast is partnering with a thousand community centers to create wi-fi enabled lifts. so students from low-income families can get the tools. they need to be ready for anything. comcast along with these television companies supports american history tv on c-span 3 as a public service. coming up on american history tv a discussion about how the work of william shakespeare has been invoked in historic congressional debates and the political lessons that might be learned from his plays especially the tragedies.

the us capitol historical society hosted this event today is very special. mike evans comes to us a graduate of salem state university where he was just granted an honorary doctorate for his significant contributions to public service so we could now call him dr. evans. and then he went to a small law school called harvard. and from there he took all that education and became a public servant. he served as the democratic staff chief counsel, and deputy staff director has been involved with as a senate staffer for more than 25 years. but he's not here to talk about the senate or to talk about the senate finance committee usually known as the powerful senate

finance committee. but instead to talk about his passion. he's been writing and thinking and researching shakespeare and congress. he wrote something that nobody else would dream of writing. shakespeare's guide to tax policy no you of this taxation published in 2009. and if you're especially nice, he'll tell you how to find it. before he became chief counsel and deputy staff director for the finance committee. he worked for eight years as democratic chief counsel at the senate environment and public works committee. so his experience in committee leadership is vast and broad. he is now working on a book. called that is tentatively titled shakespeare's guide to american politics.

so we are fortunate here to have mike talk to us about how united states politics. has been historically influenced. by shakespeare and how we might look at it from shakespeare's eyes. michael thank you so much jane and thanks to chuck. in all at the capitol hill historical society for holding this event and thank all of you for coming to disclaimers. there will be no sword play. and for those of you who were hoping to get me to recommend some shakespearean influence insults for you to fling it your political opponents. i'm going to stay away from that and stick to the history. my interest in shakespeare came relatively late.

in high school and college. i read some of the plays but i never really got it. the language was hard to understand. and i couldn't tell my king richards from my king henry's. so the plots were hard to follow. almost 20 years ago. i decided to give shakespeare another try people. i respected kept talking about how much they enjoyed shakespeare. maybe i was missing something. so i decided to give it some serious study. i quickly became entranced i was struck by how profound yet thoroughly enjoyable the plays were. and i was struck by how much shakespeare focuses on. political leadership granted it's not his only or even as big as theme but it's there. many of the plays are about how

a leader achieves maintains or loses power. throughout the english histories which traced the struggle for the crown that begins when henry bowling book. deposes richard ii there are the classical histories, which tell how julius caesar. loses power and how brutus and mark antony contend for it. there are the great tragedies which tell the stories of hamlet macbeth and lear. each a king or prince who loses power. taking this all in i wondered whether shakespeare can teach something to those of us who work in and around congress after all shakespeare was one of our greatest thinkers. when he talks about politics, we may want to pay close attention. i submit that there is indeed much that shakespeare can teach us. but first i want to wet your

appetite with a mystery. why is the greatest shakespeare library in the world of the folger? located not in london or stratford but in washington dc it is essentially on the capitol hill campus. if you came over from the house side. you may have walked right past it. so two questions first again, why is the folger library here? second. why does it matter? why it is why is it important? that the world's greatest shakespeare library is in washington, dc. and i should note the wonderful shakespeare theater downtown. why does it matter that shakespeare is in our midst? let me start by giving you some background about shakespeare and american politics. america's european founders came

from shakespeare's world when the english settlement of america began in jamestown in 1607 shakespeare was at the height of his london career. after shakespeare's death is his works became increasingly popular in great bit britain. his popularity carried over the colonial america. the first performance of the shakespeare play was in the first american performance of a shakespeare play was in 1750. and there were many soon after that in new york, philadelphia and williamsburg. as the american nation developed shakespeare's influence grew two of the first distinctively american novelists nathaniel hawthorne and james frenemore cooper were heavily influenced by shakespeare. and shakespeare's greatest 19th century author mark twain was an avid reader america's greatest

19th century author. twain was a graded great was an avid reader of shakespeare. in huckleberry finn the barn the barnstorming rascals and showman the duke and the king performed a slapstick of mangled passages from various shakespeare plays and the humor depends on the readers familiarity. with shakespeare's original material shakespeare's plays dominated the american theater in new york city you could attend any one of three performances of macbeth. on a single evening in new york in 1849 it wasn't just the eastern elites. a settlement moved west shakespeare went along the tocqueville wrote. there is hardly a pioneer's hut that does not contain a few odd volumes of shakespeare.

his influence extended to politics the leaders of the american revolution including john adams. george washington and thomas jefferson were steeped. in shakespeare's work which they relied on to inform their political vision and sharpen their rhetoric. a particularly arresting image is from 1786 when atoms and jefferson both serving. in european diplomatic posts visited shakespeare's birthplace. soon they'd be bitter political enemies, but for that moment they were together because of their love for shakespeare. members of congress frequently turned to shakespeare's plays to express themselves during debate. in 1837 the senate was considering whether to expunge its resolution centering president andrew jackson.

senator henry clay acknowledged that those who wished to expunge the resolution appeared to have the votes. thus he said quote the deed is to be done that fowl deed which like the blood staining the hands of the guilty macbeth. all oceans waters will never wash away. another example occurred in 1846 rival factions were seeking control of the new kansas government under the terms of the recently enacted kansas-nebraska act. a pro slavery politician had purportedly been elected as kansas's first territorial delegate. but opponents argue that his election was based on fraud. they called for a special election to investigate. as a debate unfolded the congressman from ohio samuel galloway. spiced up his argument with a

quotation from macbeth. referring to the date of the enactment of the kansas-nebraska act. he said let that pernicious hour stand accursed on the calendar. later that day congressman john milson of virginia took the floor. milson also knew his shakespeare. he responded the gentleman from ohio favored us with a quotation from macbeth. i will give him an answering quotation from hamlet. he then quoted from the scene in which ophelia's brother expresses. his exaggerated grief at her death by leaping into ophelia's grave quoting from hamlet's reaction milson said dost thou come here to whine. to outrace me leaping into her grave. i'll rent as well as thou.

the most notable example of the use in shape of shakespeare in congress occurred in 1830 during the famous debate between senators robert haynes of south carolina and daniel webster. of massachusetts although ostensibly about public lands policy. it was the first major debate. about the relationship between the northern and southern states. after webster gave his speech about public lands policy. hain argued that websters stated subject was a smoke screen. webster's real problem came said was the disintegration of a coalition that webster hoped to establish between the north and west? against the south evoking a scene from macbeth in which the ghost of the murdered banquo appears to macbeth and lady

macbeth but is invisible. to the others who are sitting with them at a banquet table. senator haines asked has a gentleman's distempered fancy been disturbed. by gloomy forebodings of new alliances at which he hinted. has the ghost of the murdered coalition come back like the ghost of banquo to sear the eyeballs of the gentleman? and will it not down at his bidding? our dark visions of broken hopes and honors lost forever still floating before his heated imagination. that was han. the next day webster responded after making some introductory remarks. he said the honorable gentleman was not entirely happy in his illusion to the story of banquos murder. and bank was ghost. turning the tables on hane

webster explained the bank was ghost quote was an honest ghost. turning was an honest ghost it disturbed. no innocent, man. but appeared only to bank was assassins macbeth and lady macbeth. by identifying with those who saw the ghost webster argued hain head slipped up. he had unintentionally revealed his own sinister motives. after after reciting several lines from the play webster asked those who murdered bank were what did they win by it substantial good permanent power. or disappointment rather and soar mortification dust and ashes the common fate of vaulting ambition over leaping itself. then he said derisively. i need pursue the illusion no further.

there are many other examples congressman william jennings bryan began a speech by directing the house clerk to read a passage from merchant of venice. a manager of president andrew johnson senate impeachment trial compared johnson's cabinet members to polonius in hamlet references to shakespeare were part of the ebb and flow of congressional debate. by my count between 1833 and 1873 there were 159 references during congressional debate to shakespeare himself or to the plays hamlet macbeth othello and king lear. let me add a fun fact about shakespeare and congress one of the foremost early american shakespeare scholars was julian verrplank of new york. chairman of the house ways and means committee during the fierce tariff battles of the

late 1830s. after leaving congress for a plank became the editor of the first major american edition of shakespeare's plays. today shakespeare continues to be invoked occasionally in congress. during the time i've worked in the senate. there's been one person who might give ways and means committee chairman for a plank a run for his money. senator robert byrd red shakespeare's plays throughout his life. and he frequently used shakespeare to make a point. doing senate floor debate another fun fact at one point or another during senate floor debate in 19 cent in 1994, senator byrd quoted from each of shakespeare's 36 plays. even the bad ones.

but senator bird aside, there's a difference when daniel webster delivered his reply to senator haynes. he knew that his audience would understand the light macbeth cast on current events. shakespeare was a central part. of what in the story and called a rich shared public culture? today that's less the case when contemporary politicians invoke shakespeare they're likely to do so superficially grabbing a line from bartlett's quotations or the internet in order to add a sheen of sophistication to their argument. i suggest that if we lose shakespeare, we lose something important to our political life. the full gear library is here to remind us of this. and that brings me back to our mystery. why is the full gear library here? in the early 20th century henry folger one of the leaders of standard oil of new jersey and

his wife emily amassed the world's finest collection of shakespeare's works shakespeare's scholarship and related artifacts. they owned for example more than a quarter of the first folios in existence. all of this piled up in the folgers brooklyn townhouse eventually the folgers decided to establish a lab a library to make the collection available. after considering several locations including london and stratford henry folger said quote i finally concluded i would give it to washington for i in american excuse me over eight years henry folger quietly purchased a block of townhouses near the capitol building. but there was a problem. it turned out that the federal

government was about to acquire the same property by eminent domain. folger sprang to work. he persuaded congress that locating a great shakespeare library on the site. would benefit the nation. in 1928 while considering a bill acquiring property for the library of congress congress modified the bill to allow folger to retain the property. at second and e street with the understanding that he would construct his library there. it was to use current terminology. special interest legislation although we're very positive kind. that is why the shakespeare library is on capitol hill. but why does it matter? why is it important particularly to those of us who work in and around congress that shakespeare is in our midst? i suggest two lessons one

practical and one perhaps deeper. first the practical and a handout that i think we have made available. or that we will make available. the green paper. oh, okay. i list practical lessons that i believe shakespeare teaches about politics. some lessons stress the importance of good strategic thinking and good management skills decisiveness pragmatism listening carefully to advisors and the deaf to use of subordinates. another lesson stresses the importance of empathizing with the common person like prince al and unlike coriolanus another lesson stresses that as with prince hal's transformation into king henry v. a leader must foreswear personal indulgence through it all runs the constant theme of balance. the leader should be decisive

like henry the fifth but not reckless like hotspur. pragmatic again, like henry the 5th, but not cynical like richard the third above the crowd but empathetic. a lesson coriolanus never learned let's dig into two of these lessons. one, is that a leader must listen carefully including to advice that he or she would rather not hear a good example is henry bowling book. who initiates the events that unfold? throughout the english history plays bolingbrook is in many respects a capable leader. and he's been wronged by richard the second who unlawfully confiscated bolingbrook's land. further richard himself is for all his faults.

the legitimate king under the english laws of succession deposing him. would undermine those laws and perhaps the very legitimacy of the english monarchy. at the beginning of act four of richard the second bolingbrook is meeting with his advisors trying to deal with trying to decide how to deal with king richard who has been defeated but retains the throne. bolingbrook exclaims in god's name isle ascend the regal throne. one of the advisors the bishop of carlisle objects. saying if you crown him bowling work. the blood of english shall manure the ground oh if you raise this house against this house. it will the woeffless division prove that ever fell upon the cursed earth.

polling book ignores the bishop's warning richard is deposed and bowling work becomes. king henry the fourth for all his skill bolingbook eventually fails, although he'll remain king until his death. and passed the crown down to his son and grandson. their reigns eventually will devolve into brutal civil war. this happens for reasons that were brought to bowling brooks early attention. by the bishop of carlisle but bollingbrook would not listen. there are other examples king lear divides his land. according to how profusely his daughter's flatter him and when the honest cordelia refuses to flatter lear eruption anger. he denies cordelia any inheritance. and banishes her an impetuous act that he will come to profoundly regret.

julius caesar is warned by the soothsayer and others. about the impending assassination attempt but he ignores the warning saying am i not caesar? as if he's immortal. in macbeth the witches tell macbeth everything including about his downfall but he only hears what he wants to hear and he discounts. burnham wood ever coming to dunsinane shakespeare's lesson is clear when they achieved power these leaders stopped listening carefully. we see the mistakes the same mistakes every day is flatter as thrive. and as honest cordelia's are ignored. another lesson, which surprised me is that a leader must set personal loyalty aside in favor

of pragmatism. the best example is henry v. he has many good leadership qualities, but he has no saint. he is utterly. pragmatic the most vivid example is the repudiation of falstaff. falstaff is one of shakespeare's greatest creations. he is a wit and philosopher. also a drunkard glutton lecher braggart coward and petty thief he is in all a wonderfully rich character and he has some of shakespeare's best lines. as he accompanies prince how through hell's wayward youth. this makes falstaff's fate, especially heartbreaking. when falstaff learns that king henry the fourth has died making prince hal the new king.

falstaff thinks his ship has come in. he waits outside the palace expecting that when the new king passes by and sees falstaff in the crowd. the king will welp. it will welcome him. with open arms and grant him his due. but the new king seeing false staff in the crowd does not embrace him. instead he delivers a speech that is shocking in its ruthlessness. it begins. i know thee not old man and it concludes presume. not that i was the thing. i was for god doth know. so shall the world perceive that i have turned away from my foreigner former self. so will i those that kept me company. the young king orders fall staff

banned before long heartbroken fall staff dies why did shakespeare subject one of literature's greatest characters to such a sorrowful end? to my mind shakespeare is underlining this point. as king henry will forswear the way would companions of his youth. an adopt the sober demeanor appropriate appropriate to leadership. to shakespeare leadership overcomes friendship even friendship with a character as endearing. as fall staff so shakespeare teaches many practical lessons again. they're listed in the handout. and if my book is ever finished you can read them all in detail. turning from the practical there is another and probably more important lesson in shakespeare's treatment of

politics in a recent book the lessons of tragedy authors hal brands and charles adel. look at the ancient greeks. one of the central events was the public. each spring the citizens of athens gathered for a celebration lasting several days. one of the central events was the public performance of one of the great greek tragedies like oedipus rex antigone or the persians. these plays are brutal. heartbreaking and unrelenting why make them? the center of a celebration of the world's first democracy brands and natal argue that these performances were critical to the ancient greek civilization. quote for the greeks theatrical and other dramatic representations of tragedy were public education tragedies were

meant to serve as both a warning and a call to action. they were intended to chase in and horrify the citizenry and in doing so to inspire them. athens was capable of ascending to great heights. but only if the public understood the depths to which it might sink absent great effort. cohesion and courage shakespeare's plays can perform the same function shakespeare gives us many leaders who struggle to attain power only to realize that their power is empty or even destructive. generally speaking. there are no successful leaders in shakespeare only different types of failures. it's almost as if shakespeare's performing the role of the roman slave who follows behind a

general writing in a victory procession. crew rome whispering into the general's ear all glory is fleeting. shakespeare is whispering to us. there's richard the second. bleakly and poetically realizing that his power is gone. there is the evil but irresistible richard the third railing against the fates at the battle of bosworth. and there is again. bowling work henry the fourth the great usurper as the civil war grinds on king henry the fourth now old and tired longs. for rest declaring uneasy lies the head. that wears a crown in shakespeare political power comes at great cost

shakespeare's most specific essay about the cost of political power is macbeth. as a historical matter macbeth was a warrior who having been cut out of the line of succession. responded by murdering king duncan and successfully asserting his own kingship until he's killed. by duncan's descendants shakespeare transforms this material into a dark exploration of the danger that comes from the unbridled lust for power. shakespeare's attitude towards macbeth is different than his attitude towards other unscrupulous monarchs like richard the third. where we observe richard we identify with macbeth. shakespeare pulls us in until we share macbeth's horror at what

he's done and at what he has become. also unlike richard macbeth suffers from pangs of conscience he also suffers from mounting nihilism leading to the great soliloquy about life being. all sound and fury signifying nothing. still macbeth is impelled on as he says. blood will have blood. at base macbeth is undone by his own ambition. in american politics the consideration of macbeth takes us perhaps surprisingly to our greatest president abraham lincoln. lincoln was a deep student of shakespeare as a boy. he recited many of the great speeches which he had in a volume. as a young lawyer he traveled with a car with a copy of

shakespeare in his saddlebags when he became president. he frequently attended shakespeare's plays in washington. in the white house he often would read aloud from the great the soliloquies. five days before he was assassinated lincoln visited richmond, which had just fall into union troops. he was greeted. joyfully by soldiers and former slaves. and he briefly sat behind the desk from which jefferson davis. had led the confederacy. then he returned to a union riverboat to steam back north. along the way he pulled out a well thumbed volume of shakespeare. and rather in red aloud. to a surrounding group of officers for more than an hour from macbeth which was shakespeare's favorite play. this may seem as strange place to turn during a terrible war it

hardly provides solace at least. in a conventional way, but perhaps macbeth fit particularly well because lincoln understood that as the english poet philip sydney wrote in shakespeare's time. tragedy shows quote upon how weak foundations yielded roofs are builded. lincoln had a deep appreciation of tragedy we can hear it in the second inaugural address after explaining that the military situation was well in hand. lincoln described the onset of the conflict with warcoming even though both sides had tried to avoid it. then he cut right to the tragic heart of the civil war. he said fondly, do we hope and fervently do we pray that this mighty scourge of war? may speedily pass away. yet.

if god wills that it continue until all the wealth piled by the bondsman's 250 years of unrequited toil shall be sunk. and until every drop of blood drawn by the lash. shall be paid by another. drawn by the sword as was said 3,000 years ago so still it must be said the judgments of the lord are righteous. enter altogether lincoln then moves to his famous conclusion beginning with malice towards none with charity to all in which he calls the nation to finish the work and bind its wounds. by standards it could of conventional political rhetoric. this speech is extraordinary. on the threshold of a great victory there is no triumphalism. not even a modest note of

congratulation instead. there is complexity irony and hard consequence. surely lincoln was drawing on his close study of shakespeare. on the english histories, which began with the grab for power that ignited. a civil war that would burn for centuries. on king claudius in hamlet who seized power and then discovered that he was cursed and could not pray on macbeth. whose ambition impelled him on to his own destruction on lear who found wisdom and mercy only after he had lost all power. we hear in the second inaugural echoes of them all this i suggest is the second lesson we should take from shakespeare and appreciation of tragedy. like the athenians we should remind ourselves that our blessings are not guaranteed.

we may be tempted to think that fate is on our side that our constitutional checks and balances will counteract any serious threats. to our system of government that it can't happen here. but tragedy teaches otherwise liberal democracy is not guaranteed. it's fragile without constant attention including from those of us privileged to work in and around congress. we can lose everything. that is why it's important that shakespeare is in our midst why we should read. or even better watch king lear richard the second or macbeth all this brings me in conclusion back to the folger library. in the west garden is a statue of puck.

the mischievous spirit from a midsummer night's dream he's facing the capital. at the base of the statue is a quote from the play. oh, what fools these mortals be? it's a reminder by way of shakespeare that our status here is precarious and requires humility. we are in the capital of a great nation. but even so we are just a few steps away. from a tragic mistake that makes our work all the more important. thank you. our speaker has agreed to take some questions. so now aud maybe answered.

please stand up. i appreciate your comments that lincoln's second address the humility that he showed. he was not standing victoria's arms up in the air and chanting. you know, we're about to win this, but i also want to comment on his or ask you to comment on his residency. he spent of course many a day and night in the white house, but he also had his residence up near the old soldiers home and i believe that the horse run carriage is bringing up the caskets fallen soldiers were buried under his watch and his backyard almost and i i sense it was that perspective as well plus his knowledge of shakespeare's writings that gave him this perspective as well. i whether you would comment i i think that's a i think that's a wonderful point about this paradox of our greatest president being so steeped in tragedy if you've been to the

soldiers home. it's a wonderful place. it's perhaps the best place. there is to get an unmediated sense of lincoln because it's been restored essentially to the way it was when it was the summer white house for him. and it's the same point. thank you. it's on the grounds. of a cemetery military cemetery and a military hospital if you get it feel for it back how it was back then when he was walking in the front yard. there might be 50 yards away. a burial being conducted there would be amputated veterans. walking about he that was his summer home. that's where he went. he went. four rest but he was comfortable being reminded. of the tragic circumstances that

he that he was was dealing with i was surprised at how much lincoln was a shakespeare guy if you go back to those stories, we all have of lincoln as a young man. reading books everywhere in the in the barn under a tree they've actually traced some of the books that he got they basically came from his stepmother when she married his father she brought with her a bundle of books. and one of them was forget the name of the author, but it was called lessons on eloquence and after giving some of the lessons it was a long collection of speeches and many of them were. the great shakespeare speeches henry and agincour mark antony at caesar's funeral. and and those when lincoln was under that tree reading a book he was often he was often.

reading shakespeare when he was president, he actually got in a little bit of a controversy. because he went to see. a famous actor playing the part of falstaff in henry the fourth probably at the ford theater. and afterwards an actor named hackett and afterwards shakespeare wrote him a letter. complementing him on his performance and suggesting a couple of ways that link in might change things if you were to do it. and hack it. of course that this is cool. i got a letter from the president of the united states and he showed it to his friends and it got published somewhere abraham lincoln complimenting my performance and lincoln actually became a controversy because some in the press criticized him for being so what they

considered frivolous. during a time of war. francis carpenter was painted lincoln's portrait in the white house and he wrote. a book about that that he talked about how at one point he was painting lincoln who is sitting there? and lincoln asked if he could rise and he rose and he delivered the opening soliloquy from richard. the third now is the winter of our discontent? from memory and carpenter said he did it as well as any professional actor. lincoln and and and shakespeare is is fascinating and the soldier's home is one of the best places to get. a sense for that. thank you. questions yes. other than cordelia we mentioned as a positive figure. are there any other women roles

in shakespeare's plays that might inform political leadership? that's a great and troubling question. shakespeare writes mostly about men and which is interesting because of course queen elizabeth was the principal ruler at the time. there are some queen margaret in henry the sixth is a strong strong. figure a cleopatra in antony and cleopatra is fascinating she is the better politician than mark antony. by far um, and of course the comedies different the comedies are. as frequently starring women as

men but in in the histories, it's mostly male figures because of the times that something that we have to try to overcome as we as we read it. joan of arc joan of arc is a figure in. henry the sixth there were three parts of henry the sixth and the you got henry the fourth bolingbrook takes the throne. he lives till he lives until he dies of natural causes henry the fifth. his son succeeds him. and it's very effective king but dies very young. his young son henry the sixth succeeds. and is a disaster. he's a it's interesting the way that shakespeare presents him because he should presents him in his history historical

support for this as a very good man. one of the plays three parts of henry the sixth is actually sometimes subtitled or titled the history of good king henry the 6th. but as one at one point queen margaret says you should be pope rather than king. because good as he is he can't make he can't make difficult decisions and things fall apart, it's a rebellion. in england and the french take back a lot of the land that henry the fifth one and in this with the french joan of arc is a very important and attractive character. she leads the french in taking. back land in france that henry the 5th had taken chuck

apologize. i came in late you might have addressed this but if you haven't i'm sure the audience would be interested in. knowing how someone would find out how often shakespeare gets alluded to or quoted. in the congressional register or any other notes of debates. how do you go about it? can't be just a straight-up word search. i mean that's impossible. there are thousands and thousands and thousands of of lines and shakespeare. so how do you go about that? well, sometimes you come across them in history the webster hayne debate. i just read because it's an important part of the pre civil war era. it really is the first time. that senators from the north and the south confront themselves confront each other. on the senate floor about in essence slavery and i happen to read that at the same time that

i was studying macbeth. and and kim came to it that way. some of it also was from senator byrd. i'm a senator byrd fan. i love senate process and procedure and he was the great defender. of the institution and its processes and and so i i've read a lot about him and i came across a reference in one of his one of the eulogies. to him quoting from each of the 36 plays during debate in 1994 and so i've read a lot of those they're never throw away quotes. it's not a rose by any other rows or the slings and hours of outrageous fortune. he he gets into it. he explains how the play reflects on. what we're doing here today, so i've come across them in

different places and and in different in different aspects of history. i've had to look a little bit. i've done some text searches too. yes. you have an example for us about 21st century references. current politics what i'm going to stay away from anything. too close to home. there was a law in england doing shakespeare's time that you could not write a play that featured a living politician. and i think it's good advice for me to stay pretty close to that. too but i'll give you some examples from american history of. where some of the lessons kind of teach us in american history

one of the examples that comes really from richard the second is that you have to understand the source of your authority richard the second thinks that because he's the legitimate king. that's it. hey, i'm the legitimate king what can happen to me? he doesn't realize that he also has to be an effective king. and that's the cause of his downfall there are others like that. i mentioned julius caesar who? five lines before he's assassinated. he assassinated he's talking about how he is the immortal caesar on the senate floor. king lear thinking he can divest himself of his land and keep his authority all of these leaders who think that because they have the title. they have the power. we see that a lot. any time congress changes hands you have new chairman and subcommittee chairman and subcommittee chairman, and they

think i'm chairman. i can do what i want. they don't realize that all they can do is call hearings and get a few extra spaces for their staff in the senate parking garage, but that everything else is hard work. so you see that in many cases in american history. i think you've seen it in the supreme court and the supreme court thinking that because it was the supreme court it could do what it wanted without regard for the source of its power. examples dred scott were justice taney thought that he could resolve the issue of slavery just because he wanted to and thought it needed to be done. and bush v gore where the supreme court decided? that it could resolve issues that were not before the court and announce. that this was one time only this was not a president. so an institution is getting too

big for their britches others in the 20th century pragmatism knowing the best way to get to my mind and my experience the best example, jim gould is here. bob packwood during tax reform in 1986 senator packwood once said i like the tax code the way that it is. but when his effort to write a bill disintegrated in the senate finance committee over several weeks in the world was watching he completely reversed course. throughout all of the provisions that he'd previously sponsored and went for a clean tax reform bill. he was pragmatic. he wanted to win. and that was the way to win a couple of a couple of others. i think you often see.

well i mentioned lyndon johnson lyndon johnson to my mind is shakespearean and two respects one one positive and one negative when we talk about the kind of machiavellian shakespeare richard the third iago. always always coming up with treacherous ways to get ahead. that's early linden lyndon johnson. that's early lyndon johnson and robert carroll, right so brilliantly about all of that, but there's also another johnson and one of the lessons i think shakespeare teaches is empathy that you must that you must have empathy prince hal henry the fourth there's a lot to the fact that prince that before becoming king henry the fourth lived in east chief with all the common people, but that's an important part of his connection to the people the night before the

battle of agincourt. king now, he's king henry v he puts on a cloak to disguise himself and he walks among the troops talking with them as a common soldier not as a king. shakespeare's teaching about the importance of empathy and with coriolanus it's one of my favorite plays who is a great warrior who can't stoop to the rituals of democracy because he thinks they're beneath him. we see a counter example well to my mind lbj later gives us that. after montgomery bridge when he at a moment of national crisis gave a speech which is one of the greatest in american history. about civil rights and how we were all in this together and how we were all there. at the bridge to my mind it

compares in a sense to king lear. king lear fell from power he was foolish when he was powerful he fell from power and as he fell from power he grew in wisdom until he's there on the heath in a storm and he's being pelted and he's in rags and he has nothing. and at that point he asks. if only i had known more about the poor. if only i had known more about mercy. if only i had done more for those lesser than me lear. in his powerlessness finally achieves wisdom and and i i see that in lyndon johnson in his career. as president achieving he hadn't fallen from power in the same way, although he sort of would but he found clear like wisdom i

talked about the repudiation of falstaff. i sometimes when i think about that i think about presidential candidate barack obama and his in essence repudiation of jeremiah wright. that in order to show that he was prepared to take that next step. he had to step away from an old friend and spiritual advisor so this those are some and i'm thinking of others and always looking for suggestions. i hope that that you can come up with some as well. other question do i have time for another? lee i'm gonna go a little bit different direction. you've shakespeare wrote these plays during elizabeth's time

certainly an unsettled an unsettled time in england with a lot of constraints on it. i think in your article you pointed out that essex was considering trying to run richard the second before he tried to overthrow elizabeth. what is your perception particularly in the histories of the political pressures that shakespeare was under as he was writing these plays knowing that this was not a time of freedom of the press or playwrights and things could happen to him. that might not be good such as losing his head. when when the earl of essex tried to start a rebellion against queen elizabeth were her advisors. as he said one of the things that essex did was commissioned a performance of richard the second the night before the rebellion because richard the remember shows bowling book. deposing the legitimate king all

of the members of the company that performed it were imprisoned except shakespeare. he was very very careful at the time. every play had to be reviewed first before could be performed in london by by the master of the revels. who made sure that it was politically, correct? moreover shakespeare performed his play his company eventually was called the king's men and it was sponsored by king james and they performed 20 or 30 times a year before the court. so people were watching. so his political views had to be expressed shall we say very carefully? he could get away with a few things like macbeth macbeth is clearly about. king james it's about what the

trouble that comes from assassinating. legitimate ruler catholic catholics had just tried to assassinate king james by blowing up catholic conspirators who tried to assassinate the new king king james by blowing up parliament. and james was scottish shakespeare writes this scottish play in which james's side of the family banquos side. everybody looks good, and you're taught not to assassinate the king so that one was pretty easy to see who he was talking about, but it was pretty safe. but with the others it was it had he had to do it much more carefully some of his contemporaries were jailed or killed because of plays they wrote. kid marlo and and by the way, i'll concluded with this. that's one of the reasons why it's very hard to tell shakespeare's political ideology. i argue that he teaches a lot about political leadership. but you can't really tell.

about his political ideology. i mean as far as i can figure it out and this is a deep disappointment to me, but it may come as a helpful to my friend paul stymers is as far as i can. shakespeare was no liberal. but he was more a conservative in favor of conserving the existing. structure he's what i'd call an edmund burke. george will kind of conservative and you can see that in in some of the plays for example in some cases where he's very afraid of the mob. like in coriolanus or parts of julius caesar and in places where there are speeches about the importance of maintaining the existing hierarchy so he was very careful, but he also was in

the midst of it. i mean london was the political center. he was writing in his company was performing. before the crown and many in his audience were kind of going to the place to try to get some sense of how to appreciate current events, so a lot of it's there. the ideology is difficult to understand but the lessons about leadership i think are clear. thanks. thanks to all of you for coming. thank you so much. don't forget to take your pink sheet come back and join us. thank you all very much.

attorney general merrick garland testifies wednesday before senate appropriations subcommittee on the budget for the justice department. watch that live at 2 pm eastern on c-span 3 online at c-span.org or listen live on the free c-span radio app. weeknights were featuring american history tv programs as a preview of what's available every weekend on c-span 3 june is pride month and on wednesday. we feature programs about lgbtq+ history starting with santa clara university professor nancy unger discussing the role of gay bars. professor unger says that by the end of the 19th century bars and clubs catering to queer individuals could be found in most major american cities. she argues that these establishments offered them not only a place to socialize but served as venues for creating movements to push for more social and legal acceptance watch american history tv,

wednesday beginning at 8pm eastern and every weekend on c-span 3 next on american history tv author donald miller interviews jessica shattuck about her novel the women in the castle. she explains how her family's connection to nazi germany influenced her work and how her research informed her understanding of german citizens during world war ii this talk was part of a conference hosted by the national world war ii museum in new orleans in 2018. so welcome back. this next session is a unique one for our conference. you know, we're for those who come here. regularly. you're used to seeing the biggest and brightest minds in the field of world war ii history. this normally means the best-selling authors of history books leading professors documentarians, but when we were planning this year's program we decided to mix