from experiencing the black hills. and so i think one of the powerpoints of the world center there's these it's it's magnetic i think. >> you can watch this and other programs on the history of communities across the country at c-span.org/citiestour. this is american history tv only on c-span3. >> john logan was a three term senator from illinois and a general during the civil war who served under grant and sherman. although he fought for the union, he was in a spoken supporter of slavery and fugitive slave laws. his views changed during the war and he became an advocate for the rights of african-americans. up next, gary ecelbarger, author of “black jack logan: an

extraordinary life in peace and war" discusses how this change came about and the impact on logan's life and political career. illinois state society of washington, d.c. provided the video. >> today's speaker is gary ecelbarger. this topic is general john logan, a life to memorialize. introducing gary will be state society board member rod ross. this past year, rob rejoined the board after a couple of years absence. back in the day -- well, 20 years ago, rod served as the historian for the illinois state society, having put on programs in the capitol building, arlington cemetery, hillwood, union station, the national

cathedral, and the lithuanian embassy. this past year rod has been a mainstay for the society's webinars. he facilitated a program on julius rosenwald, and efforts to establish a national park complex focusing on the establishment of the rosenwald schools in the american south. then he turned his attention to addressing concerns of a commission established by chicago mayor lightfoot on statues deemed "problematic." this includes taxes honoring abraham lincoln, john logan, and ulysses s. grant. the initial webinar was entitled "why we honor lincoln." for his talk today gary ecelbarger will take a different

approach. rather than attempting to address the concerns of the chicago monuments commission, people that his presentation speak for itself. with that, here is rod. rod: thank you, howard. i am privileged today to introduce gary ecelbarger. i first met gary a number of years ago and he was a featured speaker for a memorial day program organized by the logan circle senate association in washington. born in western new york state and educated in buffalo and then at the university of wisconsin madison, gary's masters degree is in science rather than history. his day job with the washington hospital center is as a

nutritionist, concentrating on those with feeding tubes and iv solutions. it is as historian that gary appears today. a historian with countless historical books, articles rather, and nine books to his credit. gary's talks that it material from his 2005 work, “black jack logan: an extraordinary life in peace and war." most if not all of his books and battlefield tours concentrate on civil war battles in the shenandoah and the battle of atlanta. for well over 20 years, he and his wife and his children have lived in northern virginia. gary is a former president of the bull run civil war roundtable, and a charter member

of the kearns town battlefield association. if time permits during the q&a session, i have a battery of backup questions related not only to blackjack logan, but also to gary's research interests. gary: thank you for the introduction. thank you for taking time out of your busy days to listen to a very -- the life of an extraordinary person. i don't have an elaborate slideshow. i would just have the information speak for itself. there is some quite dazzling information. i will take us back 135 years ago. we go back to friday night, june 12, 1885.

within d.c. today you have 36 roundabouts. we call them circles. most have statues in the middle. back in the 1880's they did not. the only one today that has -- that is in all residential circle in the downtown area is called logan circle. we will go to that circle. back then in 1885, it was called iowa circle. it was an all residential neighborhood back then as it was today. one of the residents was john logan, it was by this time a very famous person. probably one of the most famous in the country. he is a former five term congressman and about to start his third term in the u.s. senate. a failed presidential candidate and a civil war hero among other things, and the author of three books. he resides in the house that if you are facing the circle from

the south to the north, he would be sitting at 10:00. the house he rented still stands today. he is in that house having just come -- returned from a trip to new york city where he visited his dying friend, ulysses s grant. dying of throat cancer. the former president and war hero in new york. he will be serenaded this night. it's about 10:00 at night. a huge crowd is gathering within the circle. no statue in the center. it is iowa circle. they are chanting his name and giving speeches. there is a military company and a military band. by the estimate of a washington post reporter who is recording this event on pen and paper, he estimates the crowd size at about 5000. one unique thing, a commonality in the crowd except for the post reporter. they are all african-americans. this is a serenade to general

logan from crowd of african-americans who have considered him their hero for championing the rights. they are rewarding him with that third senate win. they know that will continue to serve them well because he will continue to fight for their causes. they are trying to bring him out. after this, maybe a 30 to 45 minute demonstration, the general finally appears on the second floor p.r. to -- piazza and addresses the crowd. it is typical of any logan speeches. there is someone who talked about logan speeches, not this particular night, but described them like this. all his words or ideas. they come forth flash, flash, flash, until you are dazzled at the quick succession and almost puzzled that your comprehension.

a common phrase, he thinks lightning. a steam gun 100 shots in sudden and continuous succession is not more sudden, sustained or certain. keep up the discharges for three-quarter of an hour intermittently and you have something type of the physical effect of just one of logan's speeches. that description is very apt. usually he short changes logan. at the time those kind of speeches did not go on for three quarters of an hour. they usually went on for two to three's, sometimes longer than three hours. on the night of june 12, that description was very apt. logan perhaps did not speak much more than a half-hour, 45 minutes, primarily due to the lateness of the night. he went out and thanked the crowd for coming to serenade him. he told him he would continue to fight for their causes because there is still so much to fight for.

he talked about his visit to u.s. grant up in new york and talked about how together they will continue to champion the rights of african-americans. at the close of this fairly short address he said, again, thanking you for this demonstration and this evidence of esteem, i now invite as many of you as will to pass through this house so i may be gratified and shaking your hand. over 1000 people took him up on that offer. they lined up in front of that house beginning at around midnight and single file they went through the front parlor, shook hands, shook right hands with logan, and then out the back door. it was a very poignant event. one of the most incredible things about it is they knew who logan was. they knew what his past was.

this was a man who had a salt paul conversion -- saul to paul conversion. he was a former persecutor of african-americans and their rights in the 1850's. he had completely transformed and turned into their champion. they had forgiven him for it and have completed this serenade. he completed that conversion with the demonstration that you have just noticed at the end with him shaking hands with them. whatever like to do is go back to his earlier life and talk about this life we need to memorialize. discuss more in terms of his social philosophy. i will do a little bit of a cradle-to-grave version in a short time. let's go back to the 1820's. logan was born in february of 1826 in southern illinois. illinois, a free state, part of the old northwest territory converted to a series of free

states is a very long state from north to south. almost 400 miles. the northern part of the illinois is on the same horizontal as the massachusetts-new hampshire border. the southern end of illinois is online with north carolina-virginia border. that gives you an idea about how it is domestic and political philosophy might vary from one end to the other. the southern part was probably the first part that had the highest concentration in early settlement. most of the settlers of southern illinois were former southerners. logan's mother hailed from north carolina. probably a descendant of a slaveholding family. his father, even though he was raised in ohio, practiced medicine in mississippi and missouri. had purchased and owned slaves

before transferring into illinois himself. logan is the son of a slave holder. he grew up in southern illinois. by our standards he had a very primitive education. it was probably above the norm for his peers in that area at the time and jackson county, illinois. one of his early jobs was he was a jockey for his father. he raced horses. he was a very wiry teenager. very dark complected. that is what he earned the name of black jack. he had the long hair as well. he could race horses at breakneck speed. as a young adult he first got some notoriety because he was always known as a good talker and a natural leader. when the mexican war broke out, he entered the war with a lieutenantcy representing his area.

even though he did not see action, he and the company he was involved with never got past santa fe, new mexico, the experience taught him about how to lead a company of men even though they were never involved in battle. when he came back he practiced the study of law. he did that from his uncle, from which his middle name is derived. he became a lawyer. he ran for prosecuting attorney in the early 1850's and won. he was a prosecuting attorney in the third judicial circuit. if you remember from abraham lincoln, he practiced on the eighth judicial circuit. he opened up his own law practice is where he was mainly defending client. in this case he was prosecuting them. this leads me to a quick story. you can't do this anymore but back then you could. at the very end of his term he

had a case of a horse thief with very flimsy evidence. it was in one of these southern counties he represented in his prosecuting term. despite the flimsy evidence, his people would say logan was great at convincing everybody and a good talker. he was able to convict a man with a jury of his peers and find him guilty. the judge knew better. through whatever channels he could use the judge decided this child needed to reconvene in a different county any throughout the case. logan's term just ended. the man he was just convicted was wise enough to hire logan as his defense attorney. the trial convened in a different county a few much later. logan defended the man and guess what? he got him in acquittal. a reporter said, which verdict was correct? logan smiled and said both, of

course. convicted and acquitted the man on the same charge a few months apart. that has to be a record. it shows how convincing it can be, the gift of his gavin persuasion and have his leadership -- gab and persuasion and his leadership. his uncle was a u.s. congressman. his father was an illinois state legislator. a democrat. in fact, if you are familiar with illinois and you think of springfield, illinois, it is the county just north of it with the only -- the first sitting after lincoln -- sitting -- city named after lincoln. lincoln and logan, the elder logan, even though they were across the aisle, they were

friends. the younger logan followed in his father's footsteps. he wins his first of two seats in the noise state legislature -- illinois state legislature in 1853. the revised state constitution had passed five years earlier. there was a provision in that constitution that had a very draconian measure against freed african-americans. it prohibited them from settling into illinois. the legislatures between 1848 and 1853 decided not to take up that provision. the young logan was trying to make his mark with his very southern oriented district he is representing. that district is what became the lower 18 counties of illinois. it was called egypt, illinois.

one of the reasons or associations with that is the most southern point, cairo. it is pronounced cay-ro. that is logan's territory. he will see that provision carried through. he will bring it to the floor. he will debate for its passage against some opposition. it eventually passes. the will be coined as logan's black coat, or -- code. and imposed heavy fines on any freed african-americans that tried to settle in the state. people, freed blacks living there were exempt, but it imposed heavy fines. he will become famous for it.

remember, think of how i opened this talk. he becomes a champion of african-americans. this should be kind of astounding. we are talking about 32 years apart. that is how he makes his mark in illinois politics. eventually he will carry his political powers into the u.s. house of representatives. he will be elected two terms as a democrat. seven oriented democrat. we call them jacksonian democrats after andrew jackson at the time. logan will win his first one in 1858 and his reelection in 1860. in 1860, there is a presidential election. with two of the four candidates running are from illinois. stephen douglas, who logan is aligned, and abraham lincoln is the whig who converted to a

republican. the republican party started in illinois roughly around 1856. lincoln is the first republican -- second republican candidate for president in 1860. the first prominent republican in illinois. logan campaigns hard for his reelection in southern illinois, in egypt, for douglas and against abraham lincoln. when the dust settled at the end of that election, logan wins easily. lincoln wins illinois and the presidency, but he does it with only 39% of the popular vote because there are four people running. he wins illinois by almost embarrassingly low-margin. that was because of logan's campaign against him in egypt. of the 28,000 votes cast in 1860 in southern illinois, lincoln only got 5200.

17%. that's it. lincoln won't forgive logan for that and really drag his feet when it comes to efforts to get logan a command in the civil war. we know that right after lincoln's election secession and civil war initiates within that next year. by 1861. logan, even though he seemingly seemed aligned with seven proclivities -- southern folk liberties -- southern proclivities, he was -- he almost always denounced abolitionists. this is what really wrangled newspaper editors like those of the chicago tribune had nicknamed logan dirty work logan. sometimes they would shorten it to d.w., for dirty work.

logan is on the house floor, the house of representatives floor. the fugitive slave law was constitutionally protected. he said he was willing to do the dirty work. he was called dirty work logan. he is denied any chance to raise a regiment, which he wanted to do. he was convinced by the lincoln administration there was no need to do that. this is going to be a short war. he and i knot -- a knot of congers men go up to and is the first great land battle of the work in manassas, virginia. in a prelude in a place called blackburn's ford, he becomes a fighting politician when he sees a shirking soldier from new york state running from the bull run river. logan says give me your gun.

the gun is handed to him. in his congressional clothes, he goes down to the stream, crouches in position it fires a few shots at the confederates on the others. he comes back to washington and really pushes to be given a regiment. they realize after the battle of bull run three days later it is not going to be a short war. lincoln finally awards logan a colonels commission. the regiment he raises is mostly within his congressional district, the 9th congressional district. they were primarily anti-lincoln counties. it became known as the 31st illinois volunteers, nicknamed the dirty first because of dirty work logan. logan became a natural warrior. for the course of the civil war he became a star.

he rose from colonel to brigadier general to major general, domenico regiment, to a brigade, iia division to a corp. by the time you're conducting the victory parade in may have 1865, logan is leading the army of the tennessee, the most successful army on the face of the earth at that time. not the biggest but most successful, down pennsylvania avenue. of the major armies that are officially disbanded after the civil war, logan is only one of four corp commanders who was not west point trained. this was a natural warrior, a natural start. so much so that when civil war commissioned generals go back to the regular armies after the war, they returned with lower ranks. let me give you an example of a name i'm sure you are familiar

with. george armstrong custer, who was a general in the civil war, goes back into the regular army as a captain. general logan -- by the way, custer was a west point grad. general logan, who had no west point education, no military experience except sitting in santa fe for a few months, because of what is prowess within the civil war is offered a brigadier generalship in the regular army. i will not talk about the civil war but i will tell you how much of a prominent general he really was. they will say he is the best political general, but that's a disservice. most political generals headlight a bit lacking. logan is one of the best generals, period, fighting for the north where the south, in the eastern or western theater. he is one of the best generals period.

he particularly shined in the vicksburg campaign in 1863, and atlanta in 1864. he ended up being grant's political general more than lincoln's. while lincoln capped dragging his feet giving him promotions, grant always intervened and saw that lincoln was a little biased against logan for rep is egypt, the lower 18 counties and pushed through from logan's promotion. logan and grant for very tight from the beginning. -- were very tight from the beginning. i want to talk about not only to the war make, star, it completely changed his social and political philosophy. the man that enters the war the writing and railing against abolitionists in the same breath as secessionists -- he deftly hated secessionists -- the same dirty work logan that i was talked about willing to do the dirty work, the son of a former

slave owner, the man linked with the black codes, entered the war that way but did not leave it that way. when i investigated that, i can't to this day pinpoint exactly when that happened. yes, i lie awake until 2:00 or 3:00 a.m. thinking about that. at least i used to i cannot pinpoint when it happened. it looked like it happened in stages. we know in 1862, he stationed in jackson, tennessee. all the evils of slavery are borne out in that place. there is an incident with a runaway woman named zela who escapes an abusive slave master and gets within union lines in logan's territory. that is up in logan's camp. they protect her from the owner who is trying to intervene and

get her back. they keep her protected. this very nefarious slaveowner sends a message to her that he is dying. this is a month later. she buys into this and slips through the union lines to go visit him for a last time, which was his last request before he died. he had faked the whole thing, recaptured her and sold her to another slaveowner in georgia. she will spend the rest of her life probably in slavery, at least for the next four years until the civil war ends. i think logan was certainly changed by that. he was probably affected when there was an accidental shooting of one of his men, young black boy. the red interchange of letters i could see that logan was personally embarrassed when asked the name of the boy and he

has to admit he does not know the name. one must wonder if he thought if he would have the same problem with the kid was white. all these things are starting to play with him. you see it in his speeches. what speeches is logan giving? he must be giving addresses to his men. newspapers that used to support logan were in the north, the southern-aligned newspapers in southern illinois and southern ohio and southern indiana. they start passing on little articles that logan is giving pro evolution speeches. -- pro abolition speeches. logan said i would not give political speeches. he did not rail against abolitionists. he just says i don't give political speeches. you can see that step change. he gets a leave of absence and gives a speech in southern

illinois in 1862. it gets a lot of play, a lot of press at that time. by 1863, after he has heroically as a division commander, he is given the post of honor by u.s. grant and is allowed to leave his -- lead his troops into the city that has just been captured on the fourth of july, 1863. vicksburg won't celebrate the fourth of july for the next 80 years. they were still peeved about that one. so, logan leads his troops in there and they were setting free confederate officers to return home to lay down their arms. they are supposed to be done for the war and they are trying to

get all enslaved people that had been around the streets of vicksburg, trying to scoop them up and take them south them. the one that railed against this, we know in some writings and by people's testimony is none other than lack? logan. he's called blackjack because of his swarthy complexion. he's certainly starting to demonstrate his antipathy against slaveowners and is trying to work to keep slaves that have been recaptured by union and freda because of that. general grant will send logan back to illinois for 30 days in the summer of 63 to recover your health. logan was not sick. grant knew he was not sick. logan is grants political general and went to southern illinois to give a series of prounion speeches to disaffected

areas of southern illinois because the war is growing, there's hundreds of house's of people dying, and you have pockets within illinois showing the strains of this antiwar forever and it's really ramping up. logan, as this new war hero, is sent to southern illinois to give the speeches. he goes back to carbondale, his hometown where he just spoke the previous summer and is back with a crowd of 5000 and says he knows he has this reputation and this is a crowd of his former congressional district and he says if being against rebels and traitors is an abolitionist, i guess i need to be counted within that. he was not railing against abolitionist, wasn't calling

himself an abolitionist because he would be overthrowing the constitution but he said abolitionist had the same ideals about prosecuting the war against the confederacy. so that was quite astounding. this was dirty work logan. he's giving the speeches and then goes up to chicago and gives quite frankly about the same speech. to show you the power of his oratory, chicago is the seventh or eighth largest city in the country at the time and logan is giving this speech to the equivalent of one out of 10 people who live in the city. 12,000 people gather in the courthouse square in a time when there's no amplification of the voice with microphones and he can address that kind of crowd and he is making grant's leave of absence well worthwhile.

those speeches are reproduced in pamphlet form and he's becoming more famous on the homefront as well as what he's accomplishing in the war. you are seeing that stepwise movement from abolitionist to not railing against that to siding with them. by the spring of 1864, it's early june. logan is embarking on the atlantic campaign and he's a corps commander in that campaign . that painting behind me is logan on kennesaw mountain. which is part of that campaign. about three weeks before that battle. logan gets a message in this one is quite astounding. there's always little clinical parties forming because the election of 1864 is coming up and there are these tickets. a political ticket is your presidential candidate and his

vice presidential running mate for different tickets. logan found out he was being talked up as a vice presidential candidate on the abolition ticket. in june of 1864. he brushed that offense is that's quite the joke. you could see how everyone was considering him at the time because of the speeches he was making. he was very pro-lincoln at that time. after the campaign ended with the surrender of savannah, lincoln will send prominent political generals, including john logan, back to illinois after all logan did for grant in 1863, he sent them back in 1860 four. lincoln is a republic on the union party ticket and logan innocent back to illinois to

campaign primarily for the republican party. logan is a democrat, technically. he's no longer the congressman, but he had to give up his congressional seat. he's campaigning for the republican running for that congressional seat. in the district that voted against lincoln 23,000 to 5000 just three years earlier. this is logan planning 16 speeches throughout southern illinois, which is 16 counties instead of the previous 18. 22,000 voters instead of 28,000 the first time. it's a perilous situation for logan. southern illinois hates him. he has to bring a gun to his speeches and lay it on the dais and show he's not going to tolerate anyone who tries to rush him or shout him down and they tend to shout him down, including his sister, who

supports southern causes. his own mother won't speak to them several years after the war. his position, prounion generally, but now supporting the abolition of slavery is wrinkling all his former friends in southern illinois and is tearing apart his family as well. but he gives a series of speeches for all the republicans in southern illinois and the same district that voted so heavily against him voted for lincoln by 1000 boats. logan turned that district around. all the republicans logan campaigned for one by fairly narrow margins, but it was logan who was responsible. there's been no accomplishment by a true political general both at war and on the home front and you saw what logan did from may

in 1864 in georgia through september. dramatic change and that's why logan becomes his hero. when he gives up the brigadier general ship after the war ends, he is already promoting the 13th amendment, which gets ratified in december 1860 five. remember logan does not have a political position. at that put an end to slavery and makes slavery illegal throughout the land. now he starts promoting what will eventually become the 14th, which is citizenship for african-americans and all born in the u.s. that was the one logan really pushed for, the thing called need suffrage, but was for the rights of african-americans to

vote. -- called negro suffrage. although former pay for -- although former papers that hated him in the 1850's love him now because he's fighting for the cause of african-americans. the papers that supported him, the states of the old northwest hated him. the perfect example is a southern illinois paper writing we are tired of the vulgar and vile logan. maggots would sicken on him. he would lose the seat as a republican. he would switch parties. his social and political philosophy is completely changed, and now he's supporting causes of african-americans at a time when it was not, not, not politically expedient to do so. perfect example -- logan enters ohio in the fall of 18 627,

campaigning in a special election that will be held in october for a series of republican candidates, but also to have an amendment for the rights of african-americans to vote in the state. it is not the law of the land yet, but there's a handful states that have allowed it and are trying to push for it. it is so unpopular that i gets cremated and that election by 40,000 votes, which is a huge margin in ohio. but the speeches had quite the effect of showing what his true colors were. one of the former supporting papers called it to something of the effect, they called logan's speech his abolition harangue. he said general logan is a humbug.

his negroes, ditto. those who are completely against voting rights for african-americans showing their true colors. he's now becoming their worst enemy. as we know, logan wins the seat, becomes a very powerful member of the ways and means committee and i will end by showing how that has an effect on him. but i should let you know the 15th amendment does get ratified in 1870. so logan's efforts have worked well and he is well-regarded in the african-american community. by 1880, frederick douglass, the world famous frederick douglass is campaigning with logan, sharing the stump when they are giving political speeches together.

in 1884, douglas is supporting logan for the presidency of the united states and he says the republican party is generally supportive of african-american rights but says in a party of candidates for the republican ticket, most of them are invertebrate animals but general logan has a spine like the brooklyn bridge. frederick douglass is a huge fan of general logan and the new york times had several articles in 1884 with the title "negroes support general logan." early war hero and hero of the antislavery movement. even though it's not really true that he was the early mover of the antislavery movement, he is being linked with it. you can see where this complete

conversion has taken place leading to that june 12 event i just talked about. when, before he even became a senator, he's finishing what his terms in congress in 1868. he used his war hero status, his congressional power, and his work as a second president of the grand army of the republic. he turned that fraternity organization of civil war vets into a powerful, political lobbyist association which would fight for pensions for civil war soldiers. but he used it for a special purpose in 1868. he took part in a series of regional grave decorating ceremonies and decided to nationalize that with the dar documents which set aside may 30 as a day to commemorate soldiers

graves, primarily union soldiers by strewing them with lowers because they bloom at that time of the year, and to celebrate that every may 30. decoration day, logan was in arlington to metairie, celebrating with ulysses s grant and other civil war heroes. the very next year, he's celebrating in different areas of the country, but beginning in the second year, in 1869, he calls it what it is today -- memorial day. the only thing that has changed is it changed from may 30 to the last monday in may. logan will call that in his later years the proudest act of his life. the nationalization of memorial day. the last days of his life turned out to be dramatically short. his war service will eventually kill him, you will develop

rheumatism around fort donaldson in february and he dies from one of these attacks, internal attacks shortly after christmas in 1886 and he is dead the day after at the age of 60 years of age. he becomes the seventh person in our history to lie in state at the u.s. capitol and he's buried near the old soldiers home today in a mausoleum. he was honored throughout the country. if you read most black newspapers, they were highly commemorating him and how his loss effected their cause for the future. that is how logan was looked at. indeed, it has been a life to

memorialize. today, he's commemorated in various areas. iowa's circle is now logan circle with a statue erected there in the 1920's. there is a famous statue in grant park put up in the 1890's. in southern illinois, i'm wearing a shirt for john logan community college in southern illinois, not too far from the home he grew up in, which is now and archaeology excavated the cabin, it is the john a logan museum just off the 13, which 2005 -- there's a sign for it behind my left shoulder, between murfreesboro, his hometown and the state of kentucky. in an era today in which there is discussion and events to

remove statues because people depicted in the statues are not living by today's moral standards, general logan is a guy who we need more statues for without a doubt. we need more statues to memorialize him for his accomplishments as one of the greatest political generals in world history, as a fighter for the preservation of the union for the early champion of the rights of african-americans and, of course, memorial day. we need more statues for him because it's commemorating this country. it is what we stand for. this is a country that not only celebrates the best and brightest where they succeed, but for people like logan, the over achieving be students, only in this country can they succeed

as the best and brightest and best educated. that is what we celebrate with logan. the other thing we celebrate is second chances, where we give people the opportunity to overcome past decisions and make amends of that. no better example than general logan himself. i liked and with one thing we know about general logan and we commemorate him, it is in the state song. don't worry, i'm not going to sing, but the song is adopted from a poland -- from a poem from the 1890's and it the state song of illinois in 1925. so it's about 100 years old. there's only three surnames mentioned in that song and of the three surnames, only logan

is native to the state of illinois. his is one of the two names repeated and this is how the final stanza goes. on the record of thy years, abraham lincoln's name appears. grant and logan no tears, illinois, illinois. grant and logan and our tears. i thank you. rod: that was wonderful, gary. before we move away from your career, talk about the logan statue and the two bus reliefs in washington -- by reliefs in washington, d.c.. gary: you will probably have to speak on the reliefs. the statue was put up in the early 1920's. that was the iowa circle. one of the bas reliefs --

rod: it's almost a take off on your book title. logan and his corps commanders. gary: the other 1 -- was that the impeachment one for andrew johnson? rod: i think it has to do with the luminaries even though he was sworn in and already a senator by then. mary logan said it should be inspirational and not a static representation. gary: i'd don't remember the -- i do not room numbers bas reliefs. rod: how did you get interested in logan in the first place? gary: most of my early books on the civil war were battles and

campaigns. i remember getting one of those gray covered time life books in the 80's that was about the atlanta campaign which i end up spending the last 12 years working on. i was really taken because the center images and there were from the atlanta cycle rama, which is currently in the place it needs to be, the atlanta historical center. i believe it is the second largest oil painting in the world. there are lots of cuts of that painting in this version of the time like -- time life books. when i decided to do a little background work, i finished different biography of a very

obscure union general and i found logan's life was very fascinated -- very fascinating. the other benefit is living fairly close to washington dc, he had sets of papers in various areas of the country but the largest collection by far was the library of congress. that allowed me several times to go visit and do research on his papers and i must say, of all my books, it was my favorite one to write and i don't think i could do another great biography because of that book. he can't be topped. rod: all of your books are military related, except the one on lincoln and the one you are working on for washington. gary: they washington one is military as well. the lincoln one was about his nomination for the presidency.

it was lincoln before the beard. the washington one i'm working on is george washington, looking at him in one year during the revolution between the fourth of july, 1777 and the fourth of july, 1778. that's more of a military book. rod: speaking of logan and the military, logan succeeded general mcpherson after his unfortunate demise. why was it logan did not get permanent command of the army? gary: the battle i just talked about, july 22nd, 1864. mcpherson was killed during that battle. he's the only major on the union side, the only major general in

charge of a major army to be killed in the civil war and this happened in the last 10 months of the war. immediately, logan succeeded him because he was the supporting officer and coordinator and ranked the other two commanders there. he was responsible turning this chaotic moment of losing the commander and helped by his presence to win that battle. but logan was not west point trained and the overall commander was william tecumseh sherman. he had a proclivity to hire in top department commands because he looked at these departments as not just field armies which logan excelled at. logan said he was perfect in combat, but he looked at it as a

department as much as an army. there's a lot of papers to push and statistical and logistic things and he felt a west pointer would have been more beneficial. for that reason, he chose oliver otis howard, for which howard university is named. just a few days after the battle of atlanta, howard was put in charge of the army. logan's party sulked about it for a day but he went and served in that role and it was all for the wrong reasons sherman did this. but, in the long run, logan is better suited at the core level rather than leading a full army where his full commanding presence would not be in front of the troops and could be in a smaller role. but, as it turned out, about eight months later, before the

very end of the war, howard left the army to take charge of the freedmen's bureau and logan got command of the army in tennessee back and was able to lead it down pennsylvania avenue and discharged it as the only commander of the union army that was not west point trained. rod: tell me how it is that you, a scientist, have made such a contribution in the field of history. gary: i always like history as a kid. my father was a big washington man, for example. i took it as all my electives in college, so i always like history. the only crossover i could say with my science degree is i learned at least in graduate school how to really dissect research articles and i had a knack for that with historical

works, where i could take primary sources from the general author and look at it and study it and come up with a different version that other people who had written about it. at tends to be a crossover. i'm i chose one as my profession and the other as my secondary. >> for the record, you have nine books to your credit. we have mentioned the be i -- biography and we have talked about lincoln's election, the book. what other books have you read in? -- written. ? >> my personality works on people named with an owl. the third was frederick lander,

for whom lander, wyoming is named. my first book was about the shenandoah battle call. i did another book about a battle in a campaign called three days in the senate dona, about winchester and fort royal. my last two battle books were the battle of atlanta, the july 22 contest we talked about and the battle six days later. i had written another book about logan that i will get to. it is about the battle of dallas in georgia, not texas. the other books i had written or cowritten -- i was hired by time

life to write shenandoah valley book and do research articles for that. that one is my work primarily. i did a lot of work on the next volume they are working on, the battle of fredericksburg. that adds up to nine books. >> before i let you go, talk about how you got into the gate of getting -- giving battlefield tours. >> ok, that was actually -- when i first moved to northern virginia from wisconsin asked her i -- after i got my masters, i joined a roundtable called the bull run civil war roundtable. i was the president one year. we started something called the we are cheap and proud towards where we got members of the organization to get together on various weekends and in a caravan, we would go to

different battlefields. that huge advantage was most of the battles of virginia and maryland and gettysburg were not far away from where we were located -- an hour, hour and a half drive. we would designate different stops on the battlefield where we would presentation -- prepare presentations. that is where i got my start by giving those stores. -- tours. i lucked into a national tour done by a civil war society that was in charge of a magazine and got hired by a couple history groups and local groups and took off from there. i've been doing tours for over a quarter of a century. this is my 26th year doing tours. >> where does the marine corps -- >> that was late 1990's.

one of the members of the roundtable happened to be the marine corps historian. we got together at local manassas pub after a meeting one night and he knew my special interest was the shenandoah valley. he invited me to give a co-tour with him without chronicle marines --with the marines. i benefited from having the right connections. it very lucky at times. >> special interest in atlanta. when will be the time -- next time you give any atlanta-based pores? >> i did a five year series that just ended pre-covid, 2019. i think maybe not for another two years. i am doing more revolutionary

war towards lately -- tours lately and back to the shenandoah valley in the fall. it has been for about a year, nobody has been giving tours. it's just started back up again. another tours i had print --a lot of tours i had planned had been postponed. everything is pushed back into fall. i will have a huge run in september. >> if you would have last words for this program, do you have any last words you would like to share with the audience? >> i had so many before. [laughter] last words is hopefully everybody appreciates -- i have a feeling most people never heard of logan or didn't know anything about him. my job today was to introduce you to who he was and what he did. what logan is -- i consider him

the most noteworthy 19th century american who has almost completely escaped the notice of the 20th and 21st century. my job was to bring him back to you so you understand why he was so noteworthy in the 19th century because he dropped off the face of the earth after the state song was adopted and we hadn't heard about it --him since then. that was my job this afternoon. i hope that was accomplished. >> thank you very much. if you are still there, do you have final words before we say farewell? and i hear silence. thank you very much, gary. you are wonderful. gary: thank you very much. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org]

>> follow us at c-span history. american history tv is on social media. >> in 1796, dr. jenner created the world's first vaccine to combat the smallpox virus, a contagious disease that killed early percent of those infected. karen sherry gives the history of the vaccines development and looks at the controversy surrounding its distribution. she is an