visiting our website cspan.org/history. but we're so thrilled to be back open and to be able to have world-class authors and all around great human beings like craig back on our campus and i think m we are so thrilled to be back open and be able to have world-class authors and all around great human beings back on our campus. i think most of us know that craig is one of the definitive biographers on ronald reagan. in fact, the london telegraph hailed him as the best of the reagan biographers. but, he has proven through books such as mary ball washington, citizen newt, and december 1941 that he is also one of the best historian authors out there. speaking of which, as i am sure you all know, he is here tonight to talk about april 1945. his much awaited look to the previously mentioned december 1941. for me, the book could not have come at a better time, the reagan library's next special exhibition is called the secrets of world war ii and it opens on april 2nd. it is a collection of hundreds of artifacts from museums and

private collections, never before seen together in order to tell compelling stories of technological advancement, creative problem solving, and incredible human resistance under the backdrop of the world's largest and most destructive war in history. i quickly dug into craig's book, to refresh my memory on the end of the war, and to gain insight on what was going on around the world in those final few months. what i quickly found was a history book that read like a novel. a book that covered the war and what soldiers were encountering just as much as a book that was covering what happened in the home front and abroad. what averagre citizens we're seeing, doing, and even wearing, it is a fascinating look into that era our history. while preparing for our world war ii exhibition i have had the distinct honor and privilege to interview a handful of world war ii veterans. heroes, all. we also needed to speak with some historians to help provide context for our gallery videos of which those veterans videos would be played. thankfully, we set up an interview with greg. which we actually conducted

right before this event tonight. so, if you do come back to see our world war ii exhibition, not only will you see the interviews with our veterans playing in the galleries, you will see our interview with craig. craig is an informative and entertaining walking encyclopedia on world war ii. which makes me even more excited to bring him up here to discuss his book. let's get started, ladies and gentlemen, craig shirley. >> thank you. >> of course. >> so, i mentioned to craig before this started that reading this book led to like 93,000 questions that i know we are not going to have time for. i want to make sure we have time for your questions as well. we will try to get through some of these and if we do not get to one that you want to hear we will take questions at the end. so, as i mentioned you have a book on newt gingrich, books on ronald

reagan, you have books on mary ball washington. you have a book on 1941. and, now you have a book on 1945. why did you not just write a book about world war ii as a whole? >> that is a good question. i do not know if i know the answer. it was inspiration one day. i had this inspiration one day that there had been many books written about world war ii. there have been many books written about december 7th 1941. gordon prange's at dawn we slept, it is the standard by which every other book is measured. it is an absolutely marvelous book. nobody had ever written, to the best of my knowledge, a book about the domestic side of what was going on in the united states during the month of december, and how it radically changed because we changed completely. we changed governmentally, economically politically, culturally. we changed every which way because of that month. and, so, i pitch

the idea to my publisher. they liked the idea very much, i wrote it and took three or four years to write it, we came out to good reviews and was a new york times bestseller. i did not have a plan to write april 1945 after. it was not part of my plan to write a companion book because in the intervening time in the next ten years i wrote several reagan books, citizen newt, mary ball washington, a lot of op-eds and things. but it was just an inspiration that came to me, april of 1945 is just packed with history, every day is a red letter day. so that was what, after thinking about it i realized nobody had written a book about that monumental month. >> that leads perfectly into my next question, i mentioned this to you upstairs before we came

down here because we covered--there is a chapter on january, march, april, and beyond. more so in january than the other months you are literally saying in january 1st 1945 here are all of the things happening in the united states and the world. here's what's happening on january 2nd, january 3rd, how do you determine what you are going to cover? >> i don't know, when i get up in the morning i drive zorine crazy. she says, why aren't you writing, why are you writing? i say, i am writing, i am writing in my head. i am thinking about it. i'm thinking about it. when i sit down at my computer than it all, like raymond chandler said, you just throw up onto your typewriter. that is what i do, i let it all out into my laptop, and write it that way, what was the question? >> how do you choose which of these events each day to write about? >> i have a list, i have a

yellow legal tablet with a list of about 25 books i want to write. it grows ever longer and the list, i am going to expire long before the list does. writing the book about mary ball washington really got me interested in the 18th century so now i want to write something, not about valley forge, something about morristown. which was a winter encampment by the revolutionary army. it was actually far worse than valley forge, this has not been explored enough so i am thinking about writing a book about that. but, i am also writing a book about bojangles. i had that idea from bill robinson, my father when he was a little boy used to go to new york city for the st. patrick's day parade. bill robinson would tap dance down fifth avenue in the parade, that always gave me goose bumps, and he was like that. and then, this song, it got me to the nitty-gritty dirt band, i've had it in the back of my mind for a long time. nobody has ever done a book

about bill robinson. that is in the back of my mind. so, i am going to write more reagan books, i am working on it two right now. then i am going to write a book about donald trump, my dance card is pretty full. >> i can't remember to brush my teeth, i do not know how you do all of that. going into the january chapter just because it struck me interestingly. you are going through each day and talking about christmas of 44 leading into january 45, christmas of 44 was christmas sales shopping. spiked by 25%. and you are talking about the different months you're talking about which make up women are wearing, were americans not as concerned about what was going on in the world and the war? >> no, they were very concerned, this nation has always been divided, historians will tell

you that during the american revolution as many as 30% of the american people were actually opposed to the revolution, we were not unified at all. as a matter of fact something like 100,000 people left after the revolution because they did not want to live in the articles of confederation. they went to british canada, they went back to great britain, that right there is a book, right there. about 100,000 people leaving, the civil war certainly was an ennunciation of our divisions. the only time in united states history where we have been totally united is the afternoon of december 7th 1941, for several months after september 11th. but, even then that did not last. we are defined by our divisions, we have always have been divided. we are defined by the vietnam war we are divided by women's rights, civil rights,

the environment, we are divided about everything and then we form consensus. that is the brilliance of the american system of government. >> so this is a two part question you know, reading this book, of course, i think we all are aware of what was going on in germany. the holocaust, hitler, the nazis. i think, and maybe am i just naive but i forgot about the brutality of japan. in your book you are talking about how they would throw up babies and bayonet them for fun. two part questions, what made it about that air and these leaders that made it acceptable behavior that the countries can get behind? what was it about the japanese cruelty? i was shocked by it. >> i do not know how you explain either, i do not know how rational people explain evil-ness, it existed and exists today in the world. the japanese, first of all, there was a shogunate culture, a very

masculine culture that had grown up over japan in the 20s and 30s. that led them to want to create a militaristic government. you know, taking over parts of indo-china and what led to the december 7th and complete control of the central and western, without any interference from the united states. they were absolutely horrible, there was a story in the book about a pacific island of polynesians. they were peaceful, they were thought to be sympathetic to america, so the japanese knew this and they went in one day and machine gunned everybody on the island. just blew them away, just blew them away. they had a couple of american navy pows. in the shogunate culture, you

have to understand, that in the worst form of humiliation is one man can imprison another man. if one man can imprison another man then he is worthless. they had this attitude with the american pows. for instance, they had a group of american navy pows. they marched out, made them dig a trench in the sand. marched out and then covered, poured gasoline on them and then burned them to death. the reason it was verified is that some escaped and go back to mccarthy's forces and told their tale about them being burned to death. but, that was not unusual for that japanese culture, the japanese government at the time. they did not have the regard for life that americans did, for instance, i say for instance a lot, i am sorry. if a japanese pilot was downed in the pacific,

the japanese navy would not pick them up they would just let him drown. if an american pilot was down in the pacific he was picked up as soon as humanly possible. they had a much different regard for human life than we did in 1945. >> speaking about cruelty and nazis, i was glad your book did not just talk about the cruelty of the nazis but also talked about the insanity of hitler, if i can use the word insanity. during the march and april of 1945 and it was clear that the allies were going to win the war, did hitler really still think he was going to win? was that propaganda? >> yes, he was crazy anyway, let's say it, he was crazy. we had actually done--with the predecessor to the cia, the oss had done a psychological profile. they hired a harvard

psychologist to do a psychological profile of a hitler. i talk about in the book, all of the problems, all of the problems of this man. what led him to be the monster that he was. is that right till the bitter end he believed his own propaganda. all of the other nazi bosses, the leaders, they all believed their own propaganda. even the army was advancing, the third army, the soviet army was advancing to the east. they were doing things, cutting off food supplies for civilians, they were cutting off communications for civilians, they were taking it out on civilians. they were taking from civilians and giving to the military to stave off the inevitable. hitler, right to the end, believed his own lies. >> one of the things i write in your book that i did not know, speaking of hitler, is somewhere in here it says that

he was considering surrendering because he thought surrendering would help lead to world war iii. can you talk about that? >> there was a great debate among churchill and stalin and fdr, whether or not we would accept surrender from nazi germany, whether we wanted unconditional surrender. we wanted them and the war trials. we wanted punishment meted out to these thugs who were creating this war in the first place. so, churchill was for unconditional war, unconditional surrender, whereas stalin was for unconditional surrender. but, there were people around franklin roosevelt who were just for surrender. not unconditional, let's just get it over with. let's end it, the war is won. let him stay in power, there were others --

eisenhower, for instance, wanted hitler deposed and put on trial with all of the other nazi thugs. >> which leads perfectly into my next question. fdr was our first and only four time president, i am actually going to read this. he was a president that ronald reagan once called a american giant, a leader who shaped, inspired, and let our people through perilous times. how critical was fdr's four terms in america's stance involved in the victory of the war? >> all encompassing, all encompassing. john patrick dickens was a historian who has passed away a couple of years ago. a friend of mine. he was actually part of the free speech movement at berkeley and actually did battle with governor reagan over campus protests. later, this liberal became an admirer of ronald reagan. he wrote a book called fate, freedom and the making of history. in this book this liberal professor says that our

four greatest presidents are george washington, abraham lincoln, franklin roosevelt, and ronald reagan. because, and he makes the academic case because they freed or saved many, many people. that was the criteria for greatness. does a president actually affect the outcome of for the betterment of many, many people? his criteria is pretty good. and so, fdr although he failed with the great depression, unemployment in 1939 was the same as it was in 1933. but, at least he gave the american people hope. he gave the american people hope and that was very, very important. he was a capitalist, he was not a committed socialist or something like that. but, he was willing to try whatever worked. the wpa, the conservative, the conservation corps. other new deal programs. where he was really, really masterful was as a war leader. because, he did not interfere. reagan, i think

reagan, i have not researched enough but reagan believed the way to a simpler government is surrounding yourself with good people and let them do their jobs. fdr had that same approach towards the war, if you think about it all of the brilliant man who we had serving in wartime. eisenhower, king, paton, marshall, mcarthur. he had so many others, omar bradley. superb military leaders. he did not interfere. he would meet with them, he would ask questions from them. but, he did not interfere. he let them conduct the war they saw fit. that was his real brilliance in conducting the war of world war ii. you know, he was, for all intents and purposes, he was not just president of the states during world war ii. he was president of the world. we were not only

supplying u.s. servicemen, we were supplying the british serviceman and we were supplying the soviet serviceman. we were sending them foodstuffs, material, uniforms, whatever they needed. we were supplying them. so, he was running a global war. he was coming as they fought varsity operator, churchill and stalin more junior varsity. i know that stalin conducted a brilliant, not brilliant but a massive campaign from the east. many, many russians died as a result, still, in terms of supply and command he was still a junior varsity operator compared to roosevelt. excuse me. >> it is funny, you just said roosevelt was president of the world, which is my next question. i said in my question, you called him in your book the president of the world, when he passed away when he died, it was earth shattering to the world.

>> my mother, god bless her, when she was still alive she is 89. she grew up in the 30s, she like many other american children thought we only had three presidents. she thought washington, lincoln, and franklin roosevelt. that is what she thought. there was no explanation for succession when he died. there was no explanation for the vice president, truman becomes president now. there was no explanation to her that she could understand. she was a young teenager. fdr, when fdr died flags in moscow were hung at half staff. it was a world shaking event. people just

could not believe it. of course, you know it is tragic, as well. obviously death is always tragic. he was only 63 years old. he was carrying the burdens of the world. he was obviously stricken with polio that had to affect him healthwise including his circulation. he was a good eater but he did not eat healthy. >> he ate a lot of butter and bread and fatty foods, things like that. he had his five seas. every day at 5:00 he would make himself a manhattan or an old-fashioned those were his favorite drinks. he was, not drinking heavily, but enough to cause damage. he smoked two to three packs of -- a day, he would filterless luckies. that's death on a wheel. and all the burdens of the government, and the war, he had four sons in the military.

all in combat. all in danger zones. he's got a wife who, wasn't henpecking him, but i have great admiration for eleanor roosevelt. i think she obviously modernized the office of the first lady, but she was obviously a very good person, i think. but she had her agenda. so he had to deal with that. he's dealing with his family, he's dealing with his staff, congress, our -- congress. they didn't low -- go into lockstep. they often opposed him. it's understandable, in a way, with the diet and everything else, and stress, why he passed away at age 63. but it was unbelievable. it was one of those things, and i'll shut up, but it was one of those things that people know where they were when they heard it. i know where i was. november 22nd 1963. i know where i was on

september 11th. i wasn't alive on december 7th, but my parents were, and they know where they were when they heard on december 7th. and fdr's passing, everyone knew what they were doing when he died. >> so you just mentioned your respect for eleanor roosevelt. what was her impact on the war and the american home front as a whole? >> well, she was the head of several different government agencies. but she was more than that. she's a one woman industrial complex, she was writing her daily column called my day, doing radio broadcasts every week. doing morale and promotional tours, u.s. camps, overseas and in the u.s., and also tending to her family affairs. she was -- there wasn't anything that she wasn't doing. she truly modernized the

office of first lady. but, she did so with a lot of grace and charm. she had a rough marriage, he always trusted her. she always said he -- he always said she was her best advisor. but his affair with lucy rutherford mercer, obviously caused great damage to the marriage. and i can't -- there is no written history on her finding out about franklin's, fdr's, passing away. he almost literally passed away in the arms of his lover. no one knew if he consummated it, in any shape or form. but he was in the little white house in georgia. and his daughter -- anyway, all think of, it it'll come to me. [laughs] his

daughter, anna, had surreptitiously arranged for lucie rutherford mercer to visit franklin roosevelt in the little white house behind her own mother's back. you know, there's no -- when fdr died, everyone knew that he was with his lover, including, obviously, eleanor. but there is no history on eleanor's reaction to that. she obviously had to be distraught but, like the classy woman she was, she flew down to the little white house, rode the train back, which president reagan used to use, and went to the funeral on high park. and she never, ever, betrayed her loyalty to her husband. that's one reason why

i do admire her. >> you touched on this a couple answers ago, but can you talk about the big three? churchill, roosevelt, and stalin, and how critical they were to ending world war ii? >> sure. churchill was one of the greatest inspirational speakers of the 20th century. and the british people needed his inspirational leadership. maybe there is a time and place for men, and maybe he wasn't right for the position in the early era, but he was perfect for the position in 1941, and actually, 1939, when germany attacked poland. no man -- i know i'm trying to think, the phrases of history, about the right man at the right time doing the right job. but he was the quintessential right man for the right job. and he and roosevelt were very good

friends. he said that -- he said, well, meeting fdr was like opening a bottle of champagne. he said fdr was one of his best friends. they were very, they were getting along, he came and visited fdr several times during the war, in the white house. they got along very well. stalin was an outlier. because of politics and because of his personal behavior. and it was obviously off putting to both fdr and truman. fdr did allow stalin to gobble up parts of eastern europe in the warsaw pact countries, and yalta. he also was interesting, i always wondered why they went along with it -- yalta was a falling down vacation home for the russian tsars. and when the communists came to power, they

chose it as the site of this important meeting, to decide what to do with the world after the war. how do we divide the world? how do we handle the world? how do we manage the world? they had this area to really run, this country, that country, whatever. but yalta had bad food, it was cold, it was bad, it was falling down, the beading was bad, all of this. fdr has to travel 12,000 miles, churchill has to travel -- travel a few thousand miles. but it was just a few thousand -- it was just down the street from stalin. and he was the junior member. when you have the big three, why don't you have this in miami beach, you know? why they had it in yalta, no one has ever explained that to me. and it took a toll. that traveling took a toll on fdr, as well. >> how do you think president

truman handled the end of the war? >> he always said in his diaries he had no regrets. he never looked back on dropping the bomb on hiroshima and nagasaki. he believed that in order to save millions, thousands had to die. i wish, my personal perspective, that i wish he had demonstrated the power of the bomb first, like, in an open water test, tokyo bay or something, so you witness it, and see what damage it would cause. i wish he had done that first. but he had never looked back. and his appointment of eisenhower's commander, eisenhower developed these spheres of influence, so

it's at the sphere, americans at the sphere, it made a mess. in fact, the province of today, i memorized it. but on the other hand, douglas mcarthur's trip of japan was brilliant. he should've won the nobel peace prize. he literally rebuilt society, the culture, the government, without any overthrowing or backlash or anything like that. we had bombed it. the country was just destroyed. he took it over and rebuilt the whole saying made it into a peaceful and democratic country, a constitutional democracy. that appointment by churchill was a very good one for what he did. >> in 1945 as concentration

camps were being liberated, what was the overall feeling for america and other ally countries when they saw the horror and devastation of what was in these camps? started in april 45 started reporting on these discovered death camps. and by the way, is that when you think of europe you think you know about world war two you think about triplinka you think of auschwitz something there were dozens of nazi death camps all over europe all over poland hungry germany, there were dozens of them. it wasn't just the big one. so ones that get the notoriety there were little ones too americans were so war weary after it and it was it was a crime so big and so monstrous a lot of people in didn't believe it just didn't have enough information. they just couldn't comprehend of it, but the major newspaper so

say before would report on for instance new york times reported on the discovery of auschwitz, but never just reported that was -- who were being killed at auschwitz that only came much much later. why the new york times did that and also by the way what the washington post did too is that these camps are being discovered and they never reported that it was that they reported the people were being. murdered partners was happening, but then it never reported. there was -- or homosexuals or gypsies or poles or russians that were being that were being monstrously murdered these camps so when news breaks that pretty close to one another that mussolini is executed and hitler's committed suicide and people believe this what was the like. oh, yeah. well we the united states for a period we believe that hitler had a we had all during during 30s and during the war hitler

had a double the look just like him a couples presley. yes, exactly. exactly. so we bought that but but when it was it was confirmed that it was he we know we were invading berlin. we were wiping out berlin renews in a bunker. we knew his days were numbered. so it just took it as i mean, obviously there's a great wonderful thing that he committed suicide but we took it kind of in stride. we took a lot of things in stride, i think because the war had had worn down in a way the american people, although we did create the united nation and we we united nations and we became forever internationalist country after world war two, you know, you think about today, is that if russia was invading ukraine in the 1930s, we would have been

the second thought we would not have so what you know, it's only the legacy of world war two that we care about even though we don't have we can't there's not demonstrable american steak in ukraine. but we're moving toward possible conflict there and that's a legacy of world war two. so i think my final question will be one that i actually asked you when we were doing this. pre interview upstairs. i really liked your answer. why in this i realized i'm starting this question, but why should we care about world war two? why should we still study world war two, you know the memory senior moments because there are lots of great quotes about the reason you study history. there's the you know, you study history or we failed to repeat it. he was a i can't think of his name. it's a hardware professor. but anyway is that we should study history for many many reasons.

first of all, it's fun second law is that we learn not to make the same mistakes over for instance. i'll give you previous example first mistake we've made over again and why biden didn't study unfortunately didn't study the history, but in 1979, jimmy carter was doing an interview and he was asked if afghanistan was part of our defensive perimeter and he said no and within months soviets invaded afghanistan is that joe biden a couple months ago was asked about our interest in or no. he asked about about ukraine and he said what a little invasion is. okay, so i'm paraphrasing here something like that. but but anyway, he telegraphed to putin he could make he could make the move without without cause for concern and so now he said obviously backtrack on that previous thing, but imagine if he'd been more careful with this words how this might not have

happened. so that's a good example. that's as good example as anything. i can learn i can think of about we study history to to learn from it, but you know, it gives us a sense of dignity gives us sense of purpose. it gives us a sense of where we belong it gives it, you know, we need to know why like for instance when the second continental congress when they were working on the constitution, is that the first men everybody knows about, you know, freedom of speech freedom assembly freedom religion, but at the jammed in there is freedom of the press doesn't really fit but it's in there because it not because the founders liked the pamper tears and tabloids at the time. they hated them they despised them, but they saw the newspapers as a valuable ally of

the american people against their against their government and so it's important that we know why we have freedom the press in this country today. that's great. so i have 93,000 more questions. but and if there aren't questions from the audience, i will continue to ask but if you have any questions, we just ask that you raise your hand. we are recording this so it's important that we bring a microphone to you before you ask your question. so if you have a question, feel free to raise your hand. otherwise, i'll just keep asking. we hold on one second. there we go. go ahead. what would be what if the world would have invited russia in tomato in the last 25 years. would it be a different world? it might be it might be i'm not an expert on world affairs. i can't do it deep answer for you. it might it might have been i if i'd been a position to invite them and i would invite them then, you know, it's always better to have you know to deal

with the adversary that you know, really the adversary. you don't know. i wish i could answer that question more fully for you, but but i'm not an expert on that type of. but i think you've really you're nodding ahead. so is the navy things will be better certainly after the fall of the berlin wall and the advent of the breakaway republics and and the warsaw pact is that is that i can't imagine why obviously is politics. obviously, there are people against it but bringing people in to talk is always i think he's always better than negotiate peacefully rather than you know being sent into war into, you know wartime, so, i'm sorry. i can't answer that better for you, but it's a good question. any other questions from anywhere in the morning? so i heard the good news there that you are going to write two

more books about ronald reagan. yes. yes. all right. that's pretty exciting. so, can you give us a sneak peek? sure. yeah. sure. well, first of all i say is that serene knows that you know doing all this that you keeping off the streets and all the pool halls. i'm writing i'm editing a book about reagan and grenada and grenade is significant because it's the energy time. it's the end of the time it's beginning of the end of the soviet union. it leads the straight line projection of history from grenada to the fall of the berlin wall. and then the eventual fall of the soviet union liberation of the warsaw back countries. i'm doing a book on also reagan the negotiated reagan the compromise reagan dealing with people on the other side, you know, whether or you know, like for instance picking george bush. he didn't want to pick george bush but he made the most sense at the time at the detroit

convention to producing unified ticket, you know, the republican party has more or less less than divided since the 1940s and with liberals or moderates and conservatives and you had eisenhower the moderate and nixon the conservative or lodge the moderate and nixon the conservative are so that continued that program where he had to reach across to pick bush to unify the convention unified conventions tend to win the fall and divided conventions tend to lose in the fall. but also he's tried to pick richard schweiker. who was then a senator from pennsylvania as is running late 1976 to try to win the nomination over gerald ford. i also is a chapter on the the briggs. amen. this is interesting. this is tells you the the

suppleness and sophistication of reagan's thinking was that in 1979 as he's getting ready to run for president one more time. there's an amendment in california called proposition 6, which the brinks of men and the proposition prohibited gays from teaching the public schools or advocating a gay lifestyle. now reagan needs the support of family groups, you know, their pro-family groups and things like that running for president, but this also offends his deeply felt principle about privacy and dating all those other things. so reagan was the only major conservative in california to come out against proposition 6 and in the summer of '79 it was winning two to one it lost in november by by two to one and john briggs who state senator at the time he was going to use this as a vehicle for national office and a back part. he saw what anita bryant was

doing in dade county and was going to kind of ride this issue and briggs was asked the day after why proposition failed. he says ronald reagan and that was it and reagan never suffered any political consequences fortunately for him family group still supported him running for president. so, but every chapter is on briggs on bush on schweiker on the screen actors guild on, you know, things like that. so, yes, sir. man, right sir. getting back getting back to the book in 1945. yes back in september 39 stalin and the russians invaded poland from the easterns portion as hitler came in from the west right? yeah by time 45 rolled around it seemed like stalin was much more powerful in the big three that

he had any right to be not only being a junior member but being the turncoat at the beginning of the war. he was part of the access powers. like what do you think by time 45 rolled around gave him that? gravitas with roosevelt and what churchill? you know, i'll try to answer it as it can is is that the soviets got a very very favorable press in the united states look magazine and life magazine which went out to millions every week. you can't underestimate their influence, you know, but they depicted soviet union as a worker's paradise is that you know, he he the moniker uncle joe was used often by the intelligence here. so he had a very even though he was million killing millions with his with his resettlement programs things like that is that he got very favorable, press in the united states. he had a lot of sympathetic

supporters. there were a lot of you know, it was it was not it was not if you called somebody a communist in the 1930s. it didn't carry the same heavy burden as if you called somebody a communist today. it was it was were i would say we were more open, but we were more on educated about the collectivism or the socialist philosophy. and also is is that is that you have the contrast is that it's down versus hitler stalin versus mussolini roosevelt versus hitler roosevelt versus mussolini, so he just he wins or by versus tojo he wins basically by default by comparison because you know what? this guy's even worse than this guy. so, i hope that explains it. yeah, i know. there's more questions. we're going to go back to you, but i just had a question something just popped in my head. i got to speak with a different

historian last week and he said something that i found really interesting and there are no other story and this author, you know called the stone together. he said something i thought was interesting. he said yes, we won the war because of normandy because he would because you know the atomic bomb right but we really won the award because of detroit and yeah, so in the american factories, can you talk about that sure know whoever you talk to is absolutely right? is that maybe you just stumbled into the truth? i don't know but is that three weeks immediately after december 7th roosevelt tells detroit. you're not gonna make any more cars and we didn't make any new cars for the duration of the war. people had to drive over my grandfather saying well, i bought that little sail before the war, but i sold it after the war. is that is that the roseville

administration nationalized a lot of industry including detroit they told he told troy he says you are not going to make cars anymore. you're gonna you're gonna become the arsenal of democracy and interestingly enough or miraculously is that within three weeks of december 7th 1941. we are taking fabricated parts from ford auto parts of ford auto body from fisher-price fisher auto body and goodyear and were manufacturing b-24s and b-25 airplanes. three weeks after and it's that that happened all over the all over the country all over the country calvinator was was a company in detroit that made women's you know appliances they made refrigerators and they made mixing bowl and and they made

what do you take cake mixers? yeah like that and again in a short period of time now that they're making helmets and they're making propellers for fighter plans, but it's like that all over the countries that this this country this company that is whatever you stop making you know this thing and start making that thing and then the women in the workforce as well. i yes. yes. yes, i think i told you before melissa both my grandmothers were rosie. the riveters one was a machine gun inspector. she would stand there and a machine gun machine guns would come down the conveyor belt and she'd pick it up and she'd fire like this and she put it down and the next one would come she picked it on fire. and that was that was her war work and then my other grandmother was a bomb inspector and i i have no idea. what obama's but she does but

she was bombs, but i never got a chance to ask her about that, but i certainly wouldn't want that that job anyway. but that there were women it was not unusual at all. in fact, it was very usual for women during world war two to leave the kitchen and go to the factory floor. they were doing it they were and they were also participating too is that there's a rundown airfield back there in massachusetts or back there in virginia, which is no longer news, but it used to be a refueling stop for women flying b-24 planes to europe. they stopped there that fuel up and then fly 3,000 miles across the atlantic to deliver a b-17 bombers to the american servicemen. credible yeah. yeah really was it is a time. i doubt we'll ever see again in the history of this country of

the world a google go back to the audience. i know there were a handful of hands. are there any other questions? he gently but let's bring the microphone here. one second. thank you. just a touch on your point about when well goodness participating, you know during the war professional. i know a lot of the women that play professional baseball during the world war two europe. yeah, that's right. i deal with that in this book too or months, and i have not read your book yet, but the four months they were off they all came out here, especially like santa monica airport. they were like you said riveting building planes doing this they all did that they all came from the midwest to the west coast vacation time, but they would do that 90% of those women did that dedicated? yeah and your military female soldiers. when they are discharged they became escorts to these teams.

they taught the women ordered discipline while playing ball, too. so yes, i'm glad that you expounded on that because the women did have a big part, you know a domestically yeah again back to my mother she grew up in the midwest and she is a child who went to see women's baseball in illinois. so yeah. writing this book and researching this book. is there something that surprised even you as you were finding out the different reasons a lot a lot as a matter of fact, i think about two three things right now. is that first of all bill buckley who is the founder of national view was a young was in the army at the end of world war and world war two. he was part of the honor guard for franklin roosevelt's funeral the engine. he said he's used his magazine

to bash the new deal and fdr for the rest of his life and he was part of the honor guard the second one. and by the way, this should be a movie is that serena and i we had a neighbor of ours down back in virginia by the name of -- snyder now -- snyder had a great story in and of self he was part of the only three year class of west point there was rushed out. into the war he flew of p-47s close air support for the dna invasion. he was he was shot down. he survived fortunately, but he was hid he was hidden in a belgian farmers of barn. and he was there for about three weeks before german patrols picked him up and he went into appear w camp and spent the duration of the war in the pierogi camp. before he left in gratitude he gave the belgian farmer's wife his silk parachute, which is

silk was highly prized. flash forward now 50 60 years later. is that his -- wife. mary was great surfer of the internet. she's elderly but she's very proficient with a computer and she comes across a story about a woman in belgium who is getting married, and she's getting married in a silk dress made by her great great grandmother of the parachute of an american pilot and this every woman in that family going down from the 40s right up to the present and warned that that parachute it worn that parachute that made into a wedding dress. yeah. yeah the third one too. was that how deeply fdr's funeral after hours death affected everybody. bob dole was was in the was in italy and he wrote in his book

about eyes in their box holes hearing them weeping over fdr's passing. so is passes is death affected americans very previously. we're almost out of time. i'm going to ask one last question and we'll go to the book signing as i mentioned in the intro. i've had the fortune of interviewing a handful of veterans, you know, 99 years young. they're right spectacular and a lot of them share the story that they were, you know, 15 16 17 joining the war and in fact one said he joined the navy at the age of 17 to learn how to fly and at the age of 17. he proved to be so proficient. he became a trainer he was training other pilots how to fly he was 17. can you talk about the heroism of these kids? is that the one who comes to mind obviously is my uncle is that everybody in my family and my family is not unusual. it just gave me a lot of ideas and inspiration. is that my uncle ellsworth avett

shirley? barney was shot down and killed. is 20th birthday in january 1945? he had enlisted what he was 17. he got his parents permission you could they had it was it was really messed up, you know about enlistment, you know, this is that the enlistments and the draft and the the ages kept changing and did you need parents permission or didn't but at the time if you were 17 you could enlist if you had your parents permission, but there were obviously a lot younger boys who were just, you know, telling you with a wink and a wink to the draft board. we're going into active duty is young as 15 years of age, so it's not unusual for literally boys to be fighting this war and when we were upstairs you shared i just thought that was really great. why they were joining. do you remember what you saw

sure? well, there were there. i'll tell you why there weren't drawing they weren't joining for the food because it was uniform formally mediocre there weren't joining for the pay because it was lousy. they weren't joining for the benefits because they were not existent. they were joining certainly for the camaraderie because everybody came back and talked about their friends and their buddies and things like that. they made in the war, but they're definitely enlisting for the patriotism. they wanted to fight and win for the country. and on that note we are going to thank craig for coming out tonight. because i'm actually holding a pre-sale. this is the book if you've not purchased a book yet, please go and buy one in the museum store right behind us craig and i are going to walk out and get situated in the bookstore and then he'll be happy to sign a book for each of you. so we hope to see you over there. thank you allwell, good morning.

everybody. good to see you. we've been looking at aspects of gilded age and progressive era american life for the last couple weeks. we've looked at the west we've looked at the jim crow south. we've looked at capital and labor and progressive reforms. today we're looking at how the life of one crucially important figure from this period helps thes