feast, every saturday american history tv documents america story, and on sundays, book tv brings you the latest in nonfiction books and authors. funding for c-span two comes from these television companies and more, including charter communications. >> broadband is a force for impairment, that's why charter has invested millions and infrastructure, upgrading technology, empowering opportunity, and communities big and small. charter is connecting us. >> charter communications, along with these television companies support c-span two as a public service. >> our featured speaker today is donald holloway. the curator for the gerald r. ford presidential museum, who came to the four presidential museum in 1996. since, then his helped

curate and shape our -- over 70 exhibits, including the centennial exhibits of both president and mrs. ford, as well as the renovations of the museum, the court exhibit in 1997 and 2016. he has a bachelors degree of history and political science from oklahoma baptist university and a masters from kansas, where he serves as an adjunct professor, teaching american history and ancient history. don, welcome. are you with us? >> i am, patrick. thank you for having me. >> excellent! how are you doing? and most importantly, how is the staff doing? are you guys reopen? there's obviously a lot of energy to get all these museums reopened. how are things there? >> we hope to share some of that energy, and soon. the staff is doing well. they are eager to get back. the library is in phase one, so some of the archivists are returning and doing some work on site. the

museum continues in phase zero, but the numbers are trending our way. and so we hope, in short order, to be in a position where we can reopen the doors to the public. >> excellent! we are excited because justice last weekend, we were open in washington d. c., the headquarters -- the rotunda, for a few hours on saturday and sunday. we are testing our systems here in washington and, eager as you, say to get the crowds back and start engaging with the public. because of our situation, that's why we are doing this series so folks can still learn and at least virtually experience the ford presidential museum. i know you have a great program for us today. i will turn disagreeing over to you, and let you run through it, and then we will come back, we will have a q&a at the end. >> okay, thank, you patrick! i think we can go right to the

first slide. i am going to talk just a bit about the library and the museum. i'm the curator, so you are going to get more gerald ford than you are brick and mortar in this presentation. just a little bit about the library and the museum, in any case. and -- and the library separated in different buildings. i'm thinking of eisenhower. they share the same campus. we are separated by a state. our library is on the east side of the state, on the north campus of the university of michigan, gerald ford's alma mater. the museum is 130 miles to the west in grand rapids, gerald ford's hometown, and the heart of his fifth district, which he represented in congress for 25 years. so we are unique among presidential libraries by having a facility separated in this way. and we can get into that in the q&a, just why that is. let me just say that this situation is set up in no small part because of the unique way

that gerald ford came to the presidency. so one of the things that we found, because of that unique entry into the presidency by gerald ford, is that we have to introduce gerald ford to our people. he's not known in the same way that other presidents who ran full-throated campaigns for the office are. so if we go to the next slide, thank you. i'm going to take you to the oval office on march 10th, 1975, and set this up by recalling something that david mccullough said after he had published his biography on john adams. by that point, having -- lesser-known presidents, harry truman and john adams, to a fuller attention of the american public through successful books, he was being interviewed and asked by interviewers, among the 20th century presidents, which president really needs to be known better by the american

public? and without hesitation, mccullough said gerald ford. so here we are, march 10th, 1975, a rainy monday spurring in washington, and gerald ford is sitting behind his oval office desk, which he has occupied for seven months by this point, talking to his chief of staff, don rumsfeld. in the background, sitting in the -- is john hershey. he has that -- a poll surprise winning novelist and journalist. he's working for the new york times magazine, and the magazine had asked permission from fort to follow him for a week during his presidency. president ford has agreed to that, the object was to write a lengthy story in the new york times magazine about gerald ford because, they said, america needs to know more about their president. the polling that was going on inside the ford administration at this time, and for its own since, confirms just what the magazine was asserting, that ford needed to be better known by the american people. he was well known inside the beltway,

on capitol hill, and in his fifth district. if we go to the next slide -- where he had run for office in 1948, and i love this image on the left of forward leaning against a tractor tire, talking to the three farmers. they, in their work degrees, he in his lawyer suit. it's one of those things that the district came to know very well about gerald ford. much what they already knew because he was well-known around grand rapids. they knew him in his district as a hard worker, as a straight shooter, as somebody who did not -- who had no pretense about him, that he was a good listener, that he was someone who kept his word.

so here he is, the attorney talking to the farmers, not pretending to be a farmer himself, but listening to them and promising that if they sent him to congress, that he would carry their concerns with him to capitol hill. the fifth district, these farmers, along with the fifth district, turned out in the primaries, the seated republican representative of the fifth district replaced him with gerald ford and then in november of 1975, the -- he won the general election, and in november of 1940, and he won the general election, and then was of to congress. those on capitol hill learned the same things about gerald ford, that he was a hard worker, that he

kept his, word that he was a good listener, that he had a sharp mind, and the leadership on capitol hill oman congress, and the republicans, rewarded him with important positions early in his career. by 1950, one he was on the appropriations committee. by 1953, the republicans come into a majority, and he's given charge of a subcommittee that oversees the armies budget. so on that image on the right, you see him with military personnel at a dmz in south korea. and -- when americas establishing bases in the pacific and in europe, he is traveling the globe, attending to the armies, needs listening to them how they spend their money, reporting back to capitol hill, and helping craft their budget. 1956, he's given oversight of the cia. he's placed on that committee. and in 1957, he's

placed on a select committee that helps craft legislature -- that establishes nasa. lyndon johnson then reaches out to him in 1963 as one of three members in the house of representatives to set as commissioners on the committee investigating the investigation -- assassination of president john kennedy, the warren commission. if we go to the next slide, he -- to use his own phrase, he decided early on, after council by some of his mentors on capitol hill, that he was going to be a workhorse, not a show horse. not somebody who is going to make his name by giving speeches on the floor, but somebody who was going to make his name by hard work on committees. and learning the ropes of congress. the

mechanics of congress. he was known for his constituent service, and that's what we see him doing on the left. he's eating lunch, sitting at his desk, reading constituent mail. he kept a small staff and had a standing order that all constituent phone calls and letters would be answered within 24 hours. his constituents in his district elected -- returning to congress with not less than 61% of the vote. he kept a diary. we call it, at the library, the ford diary. it's not really a diary. it's an aggressive desk calendar. you might say he jotted down notes, not every day, but often. we get a sense of his work flow. and for him, it was not a monday to friday job. it was a sunday to saturday job. he was often in the office, on saturdays and sundays, he would take the kids

with him they would play in statuary hall with other congressional -- kids from other congressional leaders, and sometimes, he would have them sit at the typewriter, typing letters to their mother, telling her how much they appreciated her. he earns a reputation for bipartisanship, and to the extent we know something of gerald, full often that's a term that's used to describe him. he's mr. bipartisan. he was! he worked well with people on both sides of the aisle. but it does as well to remember that he was partisan. he had a partisan side to him as well. he was a republican who sought leadership. he -- has ambition was to be speaker of the house, and he begins moving into leadership, and you see him here in 1966, with the republican leader from the senate -- and there, before the television cameras, before the press, they would help promote the republican agenda on capitol hill, and take shots at

president johnson, also. so he moves into leadership. by 1964, he sets his sights on the speakership, and his republican delegation is rewarding him at every turn. so if we take -- if we go to the next slide, there we see him in his alexandria home dining room, with his family, he with betty and his four kids. the kids were born -- mike the oldest, in 1950, susan the youngest in 1957, then there's jack and steve in between. the hard work that he did on capitol hill had a toll. he's often known also as having the all american family. and indeed, in many respects, he does. but we all know that all american families also had, at times, problems, challenges.

mrs. ford was raising four kids in the middle of the 1960s, the turbulent 1960s. and yet, her husband is gone so much, by the time he moves into leadership, and earns the minority leadership position in 1964, he could be gone over 200 days of the year, promoting the republican agenda and campaigning for republican members of congress. that was hard on her. when she began to speak, getting a larger platform as the first lady -- she was open about the psychiatric help that she sought in parts of the 1960s to restore a sense of her self, and how effective that was. it's not all rosy, there are challenges. the fords have to go through those, but they tackle then and they move on. so, if we go to the next slide, ford still seeking that

speakership, and by 1964, the republicans took a shell lacking on capitol hill. 1966, two years into his minority leadership, they made great strides in recovering those numbers. 1960, eight the republican party secures the presidency in a rate other than election. his friend, richard nixon, is elected to the presidency. there -- alongside candidate nixon in his home district, and once the exit begins his administration, gerald ford is the minority leader, and is working closely with the white house to advance the nixon agenda on capitol hill, to help him shape that agenda. so then, 1972, nixon wins this historic landslide election. but the needle barely

moves for them a pumpkin -- republicans on capitol hill. they have short coattails, to put it in political parlance. then ford realizes that his dream of becoming speaker probably is not going to happen. so he and betty have a talk, they decide, in 1974, he would stand for reelection once again, and then, after helping to see the next administration promote its agenda in his second term, and then in 1976, would retire and return to grand rapids. next slide. history intervenes. ford cars -- i haven't even mentioned watergate during this time. but watergate begins in 1972, and in 1973, nixon's vice president, spiro agnew, has a slowdown, not for reasons related to watergate, but for other

reasons. and president nixon gets to exercise a provision of the 25th amendment, which had been ratified in 1967, that allows the president to nominate a person to fill the vacancy of the vice presidency, should it occur, with the advice and consent of congress. and as a tribute to gerald ford's bipartisanship, when the full congress has its hearing and they get to voting in november and december of 1973, there are only 35 members of the house that vote against gerald ford. there are only three members of the senate who vote against gerald ford, probably about as close to acclamation as you can get on capitol hill. so by december 1973, ford has moved from the house of representatives, to becoming president of the senate, to vice president of the united states. he holds that position for eight months. then, nixon, in august of 1974,

himself resigns. and for becomes president of the united states. i like this image of this french magazine that promotes the new -- a new america. there is the new president, seated in his betty ross fashion, not making the american flag, but mending in the american flag. and above him are two images from his 1948 congressional campaign. it's not just america who wants to know more about their new president, who has come this unique way to the office, but the world wants to know something about this new president of the united states. so we go to the next slide. what they find out is that he was not born in michigan, and he was not born gerald ford. he was born leslie lynch king

junior on july 14th, 1913. there, on the right, there is this child, with his mother, in the bed, where he was born, and on the left side, the house in which he was born. this was his father in law's -- leslie bench king in 1912, and in 1913, they have their one and only child, leslie king purse him self to be a liar, someone who is physically and mentally abusive. two weeks after the child is born, mrs. dorothy king secrets the child out of the house, onto a train, and off to chicago, then over the grand rapids, were her parents are developing real estate. she sued for divorce in december of 1913. that divorces granted by the courts. so we go to the

next slide. in the two years later, she's met a paint salesman at a church picnic, a fellow by the name of gerald ford. you see him on the left side, and you see junior in front of him. and she marries him in february of 1917. keep an evolution, a rolling evolution of ford's name begins at that time. he is known during this period as junior king, and then when he goes into school, at five years old, he in roles in school as junior king ford. and by the time he gets to middle school, he's just known as junior ford. and by the time he graduates from high school, in 1931, and goes to the university of michigan,

he is known as gerald ford junior. and in 1935, he and his father petition, his stepfather, petition the courts to have his name changed officially to gerald rudolph for, junior. there's never an adoption. but there is this official name change at the end. his mother and his father, his stepfather, are very active in grand rapids. his father moves from being a paint salesman to starting his own paint and varnish company. and they both, mother and father, teach their children. ford has three half brothers, also. they teach their children their moral and civic responsibilities, their duties to the community. one of the organizations that ford senior appreciated was boy scouts, which was relatively new at the time, and for four years, fort junior gives himself over to the boy scouts by -- you see him on national and with one of his fellow

eagle scouts in 1927. then, he also learns from his parents the virtues of hard work. as the depression rolls in, he -- a burger, join across the street from his high school, where he worked during his lunch hour, and then in the evenings and on weekends as well. you see him there, positions between two of his colleagues. it's at that restaurant, bill's place, where he meets his birth father. you say his birth father on the, right leslie king, who shows up one day and says, i'm your father. he takes junior out to lunch, and talks with him, encourages him to move with him to wyoming, where he is living, and ford says that was the darkest night of his youth. he talks about that to percy, who writes about it in the article. he talks about it with dick cabinet in a television interview and writes about in his memoirs. it was the darkest night of his youth, because he had to go home and tell his parents what had just happened.

it was an emotional, traumatic experience for him. next slide. this is film, and -- if you could go ahead and started, we will show about the first minute and a half of it. this was filmed serendipitously and founded by the archivist of the special collection of the grand rapids public library. he called me up and he said, i found this film. i think you'd be interested and seeing it. and it was film shot by the father of one of the players on the ottawa high school team. gerald ford attended south high, and here we see in 1929, a football match between ottawa high school and south high. it's the first game of the season. south high kicks off in the dark uniforms, in the light gray uniforms, ottawa receives. gerald ford, this is his junior year. he's playing in here, and the film is good enough that you can look at it slide by slide, frame by frame, and find

number 23 in it. ford would become the captain of the team the next year, his senior year, be an all-state player. they would earn the state championship, and i'm going to come up here in just a minute, i'm going to freeze frame, so that you can see the only known footage of gerald ford playing high school football. just a minute, you will see, number 23, coming in from the right-hand side. slow it down. and there he is. there is junior ford, number 23. his junior year. so we can go ahead and stop there and move on to the next slide. but that's some unique film there. and ford would parlay that fame on the football field to admission to the university of michigan. they recruited him to play football. at this time, the big ten did not offer scholarships. ford had to work

his way through high school. -- through college, it took the community to get him there, and to help hold him there, for the four years. you see playing against michigan state, he would be named the most promising player in his freshman year, the most valuable player his senior year, and he would sit on the bench for two years behind an all-american center, chuck menards. when the team goes undefeated and earns the national championship -- he would become starter his senior year. he would take the lessons from football into adulthood. he writes about this, he taught him patients, teamwork, to give and take necessary to achieve goals, part of that bipartisan quality of his. but he would take with him friendships from

delta kappa epsilon, that's the image on the right, the fraternity house to which he belonged. it really was the animal house of the university of michigan. it was the party house. it lived on the edge of being decertified and kicked off campus. they had the lowest cumulative gpa of any of the greek houses. they were known for their parties that they gave and it was -- it was camaraderie and friendship that ford loved. he was never going to be the life of the party, he was never going to be the one wearing the lampshade, but he enjoyed that sort of fraternal activity. but it's friends here he would take with him into adulthood he's on the first row on the right-hand side, second from the end, and the fellow sitting next to him on the very end is jack beckwith, who would be his best man at his wedding, and would be the namesake of the second son, jack ford. on the back of the third row, left

side, second from the end on the left-hand side, that's jack styles, who would be a close friend who is from grand rapids, who would be an adviser to him during his congressional years, and an official adviser during his presidency -- but he and unfortunately that in an automobile accident before the primaries, into the primary season, into 1976. he took lessons from the football field, he took friendships from delta kappa epsilon, and if we go to the next slide -- he leaves the university of michigan with three football offers, all forced to play professional football's. from the packers, bears, and lyons. but he turns them down to go to yale, where he would become the assistant football coach, the junior varsity football coach, and of all things, the boxing coach. he knew nothing of boxing, but before he left for yale, he stopped at the ymca in grand rapids, took some boxing lesson so he would know a little bit about the language, a little bit about the moves, and hopefully fool enough -- the rest of the team. he stays with

it. he stays at yale for about 5. 5, six years, and these are the years that really we don't know a whole lot about. we don't know as much about four as we'd like to. there's still a lot of work to be done here, productive work. but we know this is where he learned to play tennis. he learns to play golf. he learns to ski and play bridge. he is exposed to new york. he is exposed to dating one of the top models in new york city, and ends up in some of the magazine spreads with her. he works on the 1940 window wilkie campaign, and it's also here that he did voice to his isolationism. as world war ii was boiling in europe and over in the pacific, taking shape, ford was part of what was the majority opinion

in the united states at that time, and that was isolationism. we are staying out of the war. so he helped found the america first chapter at yale, he worked to help other campuses establish them. but even as he gets to leave yale, he seems to be letting loose of that position, and it changes. if we go to the next slide, it as happens with so many in america, world war ii shed him of his isolationist position and makes the transition to an internationalist. he would go in -- out as a lieutenant commander in 1946. in 1943, 1944, he spends mostly on an aircraft carrier in the

pacific. we might know, because he talked about, it him coming close to losing his life in the tornado that struck halsey state in december 1944, but a closer examination of his time aboard the uss monterrey shows just the intense amount of action that he actually saw at the gilbert's, and calvin, and the carolinas, in the marshals, at saipan, off the philippines -- he earns eight battle stars. he is the athletic officer, the gunnery officer, and the assistant navigator as well. and you see him here on the left-hand side, going up for the rebound. he's the one on the left, going up for that rebound. and then, with the sexton, and then, i think that image is -- as a japanese tory no plane is battering down on the monterrey, they're returning fire. so he comes back in 1946, and his interest in politics is stout. his interest in reforming politics in grand rapids and in the state of michigan is also

prominent. he begins to shape his -- if we go to the next slide. he goes into congress, we've rehearsed that. he ends up in the presidency. and unfortunately, at this time, too often, ford is seen as something of a place holder, a steward, if you will. somebody keeping the chair warm, as some right about him. after nixon

anticipating quarter and ronald reagan. then his day in the presidency is 195 days, and it's so much more than that. as he comes into office, he has to select his own vice president. he has to deal with what he is going to do with the nixon cabinet. how he's going to shape his own cabinet. that's going to take a while. we know, in september, he pardons richard nixon. what we might oversee, overlook, is that two weeks after that, that's when betty ford finds out that she has cancer, and ends up in the hospital, in what is the darkest night of his presidency. at night, he spends alone in the white house, anticipating her surgery the next day. he's also dealing with inflation at this time. with inflation now -- with salt talks, vladivostok, meetings with brezhnev, as he is advancing the strategic arms

limitations top, hoping for -- he's also dealing with the crisis in cypress between two nato allies, turkey and greece. we go to the next slide. the final slide. just how crowded his 895 days are, and how consequential they are, he has to pivot quickly in december of 1974, into january of 1975, dealing with inflation, to dealing with a recession. a mounting recession. vietnam is falling apart. even -- vietnam is falling apart. in april, we -- he's operation baby lift, in early april of 1975. then in may of that year, the cambodian seizure of the ss my go as, he has to deal with throughout the summer into the fall -- you see the daily headlines, one of the things also that comes to us from the fourth administration that we remember, because that headline is reprised so often in different ways. four to city, drop dead. what they fail to account for is the same editor who wrote that headline also wrote the endorsement for gerald ford in the 1976 general election. and, we failed to remember, all the other cities that we are -- facing similar crises to new york city who were watching how the ford administration dealt with that

and pivoted themselves, and also the reagan challenge that emerges in 1975 and then the campaign in 1976, the bicentennial celebrations of 1976. but i want to leave with this. betty ford in that famous picture, her striking a dance pose on the table of the cabinet room, and a lot of people write about the statement that this makes, considering betty ford and her strong advocacy for women, and in the administration, she said the one disappointment that she had was that she was unable to get a woman on the supreme court. carla hills was housing -- as secretary in foreign cabinet, there were other women appointment -- appointed to other positions, and armstrong was considered for the vice presidency. i want to take a different take on this. she's

and company with david kindersley, the chief white house photographer, and this was taken on january 19th, 1977, the last full day in the white house. what she is doing is she's taking a tour of the white house, and she is meeting with the white house staff. as many as she can find. she is thanking them for having made the white house her home. having welcomed her into the peoples house, and making it her home over the past two and a half years. and it recalls something juggled ford did in his first day in the white house. for two weeks, he commuted from his home in alexandria, as the nixon material was being taken out of the residents of the white house. on the first day, his limousine pulls up, jumps out the door, walks up to the north entrance of the white house, where a marine guard is standing at attention, and he sticks out his hand to the marine, shakes his head, and says, hello i'm jerry ford, i'm going to be living here for a while. what's your name? and

that's just for. those qualities that he brought with him from grand rapids, that he learned with his parents, that crafted on capitol hill, that constituent service he plays so much importance on. people criticize him for not pivoting -- for continuing to be a congressman while he was president, but those congressional qualities we ought not overlook because they served him so well in dealing with the people while he was president, also dealing with foreign leaders and others, that personal quality that both he and betty sherr and -- for the common for. that's the presentation. i hope i didn't go too long. but -- >> now, fantastic! and a lot -- you've covered a lot of ground, as they say. so we have a few questions. i want to encourage folks to use the u2, chat ask your questions there, i want to welcome folks from all over the country. savannah, georgia, folks from the d. c. area, fairfax station, d. c., dance

burrow, in delaware, michigan, terre hill, new jersey, alamo, sex colorado, rock chalk -- not sure where there is. rearview, florida, connecticut, lots of jerry ford fans out there, which is fantastic. let me start off while the questions are getting in the queue here. something we've been talking about, in a lot of these conversations with presidential libraries, and we also have a series on first ladies we've been doing, is about legacy. so obviously, over the last year, the country has really been looking at the legacy of our founders, and how people are looking through a different lens now. can you talk a little bit about, especially since you had a fair career, a fairly long career at the ford museum, about how his legacy has changed maybe from when he first came out of office, the

lens we looked through now, i know you mentioned the mccullough quote. but i'm curious on your take. >> it's growing. and i think it really began to change with the attention that mccullough shined on him, if briefly. but, then after his passing, he passed away on december 26th 2006, over that holiday. the remainder of that holiday, we had his funeral, his body lay in state at the capitol. the service -- the services in california, in washington, d. c., and grand rapids. the television coverage of that. but i think the outpouring that grand rapids gave him when he arrived, when the casket arrived in state at the museum, for 17 hours, overnight, thousands and thousands of people lined up, stood in line

for hours and hours, to pay their respects to him. and the cameras rolled and showed that and talked about this -- he lived for 30 years in his post presidency. and that's long enough, in some respects, to be forgotten. but people recalled. it called to mind something david broder wrote about ford after he left office. that he was the kind of person we always wanted as president and didn't know that we had. and i think that is that has burnished his image. and help

his legacy. he is a pivotal president to. he begins deregulation, and we often credit that to carter, and to reagan, rightfully, even george bush. can but it begins in the ford white house. he makes this break due with this sort of the as the -- fdr legacy, can the deregulation of telecommunications, of transportation, of the airlines. this begins in the ford administration. and it's being carried forward through the remainder of the 1970s, the 19 80s, and into the 1990s. so in a number of ways, when we need are more biographies of ford, and i will just throw a plug out there. i think we can anticipate next year, richard norton smith publishing a key lengthy biography of gerald ford. it should come out hopefully in the summer.

>> terrific! we've got a few questions in. i want to make sure we get a chance to answer some of them. the ford family -- this is the kind of question we get at the presidential library. are the family members involved with the library, the museum? and if so, how? >> they are! and even more involved after president ford passed away, and then after mrs. ford passed away in 2011. marty allen, who had been a longtime chairman of the ford foundation, stepped down about that time. jack ford then became the chairman of the ford

foundation, and acted with activities at the library and the museum for about three years, and then steve ford took up that mantle for a while. jack ford is -- i'm sorry, mike ford is the chairman right now. so susan plays an important part. she was a sponsor of the uss gerald are forward. she is active with many of the programs that we had, exhibits that we do, they have been very supportive. the foundation has been very supportive of the library and the museum and the exhibit programs and the digitization as well. >> you touched about betty ford's -- obviously, the cancer experience. in the museum itself, is there -- do you talk about that, and obviously later, on the addiction connection, what kind of narrative do you have in the museum about betty ford? >> we were fortunate to have a first lady who was so open, as open as betty ford was, who was open to talking about health

problems. as she said, i assume if i'm having these problems, others are having these problems also. they might benefit from that. so we renovated the core exhibits last in 2016, and increased betty ford's footprint in that, so we talk a great deal about her advocacy on behalf of women's rights, the rights amendment, the breast cancer there -- before clinic, in her post first lady ship. her advocacy for the arts, in particular american art and dance. but also, her advocacy for children, who were suffering health problems, mental problems, handicapped children. when she first came to washington, she adopted the hospital for sick children, which is just outside of d. c.. she stayed with that throughout her time in washington. it harkened back to a hospital here in grand rapids, mary

friedman, that her mother was part, of that she worked at herself. that has been a long time concern for mrs. ford. we talked quite a bit about her. not as much as we'd like to, but as much as space allows. >> short. you talked a little bit about, obviously, his role in congress. i'm curious to talk a little bit about relations. this is a two part question, i will answer -- that you answer in whichever or they're. his relationship with ron reagan leads to him -- reagan takes another shot at it, and ends up winning. he goes to terms. so -- just the inter personal relationship there, and then, you talked about congress and obviously, the

deregulation. i read somewhere in preparation for this that he vetoed 66 pieces of democratic legislation because he disagreed with the fiscal approach. that seems like a large number, these days. can you tell us about the relationship he had with congress, having served in congress? >> perhaps i can answer that part in unison, those two questions in unison. ronald reagan hammered forward for this ballooning budget, as he made a bid to unseat forward in the primaries. in 1976, ford was left stretching his, head wondering -- had i not vetoed all these bills! he vetoed 66 bills. well it was the one effective means he had for exercising some control over what was a democrat capitol

hill. with strong majorities in both the house and do in the senate. but it was also a time where there was a greater mix among democrats. southern democrats, northern democrats, they were quite different. and they were an imagined voice, but he could craft blocks of either effective minorities or effective majority positions on capitol hill, even among democrats. he did not know reagan that will. ronald reagan

had been governor of california, and ford didn't mix that much with governors. so he didn't know ronald reagan that we'll. he certainly hoped that reagan would not challenge him, but reagan had run in 1968 and had come close, in 1968, and considered himself next in line. it was his turn and ford was in the way. ford had come to this office in an odd sort of way -- craft a way to persuade you to not run against, him and not -- march of 1975. he and mrs. ford -- me with the reagan's and have small talk and just try to, in a soft way, -- they were both convinced ronald reagan was going to run. so it was a testy relationship, forged in that primary. but

remember, in 1980, there were strong indications that ronald reagan might pick gerald ford as his vice president. a chicago newspaper, touting that very thing, they thought better of it, and they both decided that wasn't the right course, and ford was supportive of his four years, oh i'm sorry, it's eight years in the white house. so a couple of more questions on the q&a here. can you talk a bit more about his role in participation in the warren commission? >> if you tally up the amount of time that each of the seven commissioners gave to the warren commission, no one is going to top earl warren. he is going to have -- for some, a controversial pick, ford had a relationship with the fbi, and he was the, mouth eyes, and ears of the fbi, on that

commission, it's nothing of that, there's no evidence of it. but forward and earl warren flew to dallas to question jack ruby after jack ruby killed oswald, and question him at length -- and met with mrs. oswald and met with margaret oswald's mother. and he did a lot of work, produced a book, and jack, styles that fell i pointed, out wrote a book. i think it came out in 1966, called portrait of the assassin. he believed in the conclusions that the warren commission published. he helped shape those conclusions, crafting the language, there is

no evidence of any other participation of any collusion, or of any any other players that -- oswald is the lone assassin he was also open with those critics and would say, i heard him say, on a number of occasions, that if you have evidence, bring it forward. we are still willing to consider it. but in the absence of any other evidence, the conclusion stands. let's -- >> let's see if i can see a couple in here before we wrap. can you talk to us about why did he dumped rockefeller as vp

in 76? >> it was a tough decision, and it was one -- for made principled decision, but he also made political decisions. decisions that had political calculus behind them and that was one of them. he wrote himself out, he wished stood to the red -- it's going to be ford rockefeller, and you need to accept that, but he and rockefeller had a meeting in the oval office discussing the obvious problem that the polls revealed, that with rockefeller, it was a good chance it gerald ford was going to lose the primaries. then, rockefeller, if you want my resignation, as for remembered the conversation, he said that if you want my

resignation, you will have. it and ford said, it will be easier if i had it. so rockefeller bowed out of the ticket. it's interesting, as the convention in kansas city approached, reagan -- over the vice presidency as well, when he cited schweikert. and made that announcement before the convention began, and that was his undoing. this >> so let me give you a chance to answer questions come through, but you teased it earlier, about the actual facilities -- >> when ford moved into leadership in 1964, as the minority leader in congress, he struck an agreement with his alma mater to house his papers, so he began archiving his papers at the bentley library, at the university of michigan.

and that continued through the time as a congressman, and when he became vice president, he extended the agreement to his vice presidential papers as well. but then it becomes president. and now he can build a presidential library. he wants to keep his commitment to the university of michigan, so he builds his library there. but he wants to do something for his hometown, and the heart of the fifth district, in west michigan. so he builds his museum over there. it breaks up synergy of the staff. it's that good bipartisan decision, where you split the baby. but the solomon like decision -- it's actually put into effect. it has its challenges. it has its benefits as well. we have a presence over the state of michigan but it does present challenges for people who want to visit the general bar for library and end up in ann arbor

hoping to see the museum, hoping to see these events. we offer some exhibits at the library but we do labor with that split facility. >> we have two last questions here and then we will throw something up on screen. you reference his football, high school and football -- college, prowess. as you are well aware, there's a document here from a curly lambeau that is -- offering him this drop to play for the packers. i did a little research. the packers, they were doing pretty good there in the late 30s, early 40s. the lions were kind of middling, and they -- the bears -- they had three offers from three top clubs in the pre nfl, and i was just curious if you had comments -- would they have had a shot of the packers with him? >> sure, they would have! of course! of course they would have. he was not an all

american. he was an all-star. so he goes to -- he was selected to appear in the east west shrine game at san francisco. he takes a trade out there, they practice along the way, and all these nfl team owners and coaches were on this train with these all-american all-star players, and nobody's paying attention to him. and with his luck, the game starts, and he's playing backup center. the center in the first couple of snaps damages his knee, has to come out. ford placed the remainder of the game and does a stellar job of it, such that on the way back, lambo and others are seated next to ford,

cooling him, trying to get him to sign on the dotted line. he puts them off and eventually turns them down because he wants to go to yale. he goes to yell without the promise of getting into law school, but because he has a job with the athletic department, and then protections the law school for entering, which eventually earns. >> very good. and then, another sort of light spirited -- i

wanted to bring up chevy chase here. so gerald ford's spoofed a little bit on saturday night live, opting not to show any clips today, but just a couple of things -- clumsy and so forth. was that just unfair? is that sort of a hazard of being president and being under the microscope? was there any truth to saturday night live's take on president ford? >> there's a grain of truth in any caricature, in any good caricature. and i'm not saying the -- chevy chase was good at caricature, i will say that forward laughed it off. i will say that it got under his skin. because he was -- arguably, the most accomplished athlete ever to occupy the oval office. as you pointed out, three offers to play professional football. and a natural at just about any sport that he picked up. he had bad knees because he played football. he had an operation on one, me and an operation on the other. so he had weaker knees than would bother him, particularly as the weather changed. and he'd have the unfortunate experience of bumping his head on marine one as he was getting out of it, and hitting somebody with a golf ball, where you swing the club often enough, that will happen, especially to people

lining the fairways. yes, it was unfair. yes, it was part of the turf. for understood as that. he had a conference at the library -- at the museum, humor in the presidency, and he invited chevy chase to it. so we've got a nice picture of him tripping chevy chase. >> that's excellent. excellent. well, don, this has been terrific. i know our audience has appreciated it, we really added to our presidential library series. before i let you go, hopefully, reopening soon, so encourage people to visit your website. is there anything you can tell us about -- assuming all goes well, with health numbers and reopening, but over the fall or next year or anniversaries -- that folks might put on their calendar? >> i would say keep your eyes open and your pen ready to write these things down. but in september of this year, we celebrate the 40th anniversary of the library and museum. we will see how we are able to do that. we are hoping that we can do that in a full-throated way. and god willing, we will. but also, we are moving into, as we

get into 2022, the 50th anniversary of the break-in at the watergate hotel, and the 50th anniversaries of the ford administration ruling out, and i know the foundation is focusing closely on making the most of those opportunities that are coming out, so stay tuned. you will be seeing things roll out as we get this pandemic behind us, get back to full business, and began celebrating the anniversary's, not just of the library and the museum, but of the ford presidency. >> terrific! lots to look forward to. the anniversaries are coming up, so that's a good opportunity for the presidential libraries. again, thank you for your time today, and all your insights, and your contributions, and on a great presentation. sign up for the american history tv newsletter today and

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