we did have a luncheon for queen elizabeth and prince philip in here, the day of their state visit last fall. we were able to point out the mantle set i, the clock and the two chairs there that were her gift from her father, king george, to president truman when she visited the white house as princess elizabeth. so, there are years of history in nearly everything in this room. >> take a closer look at the spouses of our nations president, their private lives, public roles and legacies. watch all of our first ladies programs online at first ladies dot c dash span dot org. >> you've been watching american history tv. every saturday on c-span two, visit the people and places that tell the american story and watch thousands of historical stories online,

anytime at c-span.org slash history. you can also find us on twitter, facebook and youtube at c-span history. >> be up to date in the latest in publishing with book tv's podcast, about books. with current nonfiction book releases, plus bestseller lists as well as industry news and trends through insider interviews. you can find about books on c-span now, our free mobile app, or wherever you get podcasts. yeah >> you are watching book tv, let's talk nonfiction books and authors every weekend. book, ev television for serious readers. appy to be here >> hello. i am amy driscoll, the deputy opinion editor for the miami herald. really happy to be here today.

welcome to the miami book for 2022, taking place online and it downtown miami on the wilson campus of miami-dade college. i've been coming to the book fair myself for years, but at the second generation journalist, i'm especially thrilled to introduce these next two journalists and authors. tony dokoupil is a co-host of cbs mornings, he also anchors the uplift on the cbs news streaming network. previously, he was a cbs news correspondent and a cbs news sunday morning contributor. as a correspondent for cbs news, he has written about marijuana legalization, digital privacy and the second amendment. from 2007 to 2013, he was a senior writer at newsweek and the daily beast. tony dokoupil it is also the author of the last pirate, a father, a son and the golden age of marijuana. a member where he documented his father's exploit smuggling marijuana during the 1970s and 80s. katy tur the anchor of msnbc's

katy tur reports, the author of the new york times bestseller, unbelievable, my front row seat to the craziest campaign in american history. wonder what she's talking about. and the recipient of the 2017 walter cronkite award for excellence in journalism. in rough draft, a memoir, she writes about her eccentric and volatile california childhood, punctuated by forced, fires earthquakes and police chases. all seen from 1000 feet in the air. her parents pioneered what became known as a helicopter journalism, and became famous for the aerial coverage of events such as the reginald denny meeting, the 1992 l.a. riots and adjacent's notorious run in the white bronco. tur talks about her complicated relationship with her father, and she turns her own path from local reporter to globe-trotting foreign correspondent running from her past. she also opens up about her struggles with burnout and impostor syndrome, her stumbles in the anchor chair and her relationship with her husband.

rough draft explodes a gift and chorus of family legacy, examines the roles and responsibilities of the news and asks the question, to what extent do we each get to write our own story? i'm sure the dinner conversations are fascinating. i katy tur aunt tony dokoupil. [applause] >> thank you very much, thank you very much, amy, as well. good work. appreciate you all being here. people who suspect there may be bias and journalism, i can tell you it's 100 percent accurate in at least one respect. this is my wife. i think she is one of the most naturally gifted broadcasters in television. i think she is a grateful and

stylish writer. i think she has one of the best ears and eyes for language. and i'm so sorry that she's -- >> you're going to make me cry. >> i'm so happy she has written a second memoir under the age of 40. which some would say is self indulgent. because it brings me back to florida and to miami and the book fair. this is where i'm from, i was here until the age of ten, love miami. saga bay. we have great memories here as a couple. last time we are here, we just got married. >> last time we are sitting. here >> we are sitting here on the stage, we had just been married. there were stories, believe it or not, even up to i do, that we had not shared with each other. they were primarily stories about her our own childhoods. it's all in the book i had, written she had yet to write this book.

i got the stories along with all of you when she wrote this. >> oh, by the way. i might have come with some baggage i didn't tell you about. >> so, katie, all handed over to you to introduce the book as you see fit. >> okay. so, this book, you probably know me from, at least at first, from unbelievable. and the book i read about the craziest campaign. which was my time condor covering lyndon johnson. [laughter] to bring donald trump in 2015 and 2016. one of the big questions i got after that was put politics aside, how did you deal with that? how did you survive the campaign trail with all the vitriol and anger? he would go after me. why did you leave? why did you go back to london where you are living, why did you tuesday and choose to keep covering it? one of the answers is a new story watching history unfold.

the other one was there is something deeply familiar about donald trump. it was something that i don't really know how to put into words, let alone give it an answer. so, when i was looking at writing a second book and what i was going to write about, it was the middle of the pandemic. that question was lingering in my head, why did i stay on there? the pandemic hit and i thought, well, what am i doing? why my journalist? did i really want to be a journalist? i work in cable news. am i making things where it's or am i making things better? if i'm making things worse, don't i have a duty to get out of this? all of these thoughts were spinning in my head. it was a very dark place, as we all were in in the middle of the pandemic. wondering what we were going to do with our lives. i'm talking to my husband, my mom sends this giant box in the mail. inside the box, it's the size of a microwave, inside the box

with a giant hard drive, it was so dry because it was filled with all the videotapes my parents shot in their 20 plus years in the news business. every new story day ever shot. they shot some real doozies. madonna's wedding to trump, and where she gives the bird to the helicopter. but then it, meetings the oj chase, the riots. the aftermath of the earthquake, every police pursued you can imagine. and also all of my childhood videos, they used the news came out like it was a camcorder, every piece of my childhood was documented. >> also some questionable parenting on the hard drive. it, arrived i think it was christmas time, we sat down after the kids went to bed and we were looking at the tapes. they roll out of order and there was one where a horse had fallen into a ravine, so there was kind of an aerial rescue. and katie and her brother in the back of a helicopter for a while. and then there is a cut,

suddenly her mom and dad are on the ground in the kids are nowhere to be found. we called her mother and we were, like what happened there? the kids were in the helicopter and that they weren't. she said, oh, we left you with one of the. neighbors put you on the hill, came back, you loved. it they gave you ice cream. >> they knocked on a random person's door on a cliff and said, can you watch our kids for a few minutes? we've got to hike down this ravine. we went through, it i was showing tony. it was alternately me laughing and saying, look at this wild and crazy thing. and then you would click on another video, it would be something very dark and ugly. i kind of see used up and broke down. i, thought the only way to get out of this, to explain to myself why i did 2016 and whether i should keep doing journalism, was to figure out where i came from. and to confront the things i didn't want to confront. it's hard, it's messy, it's complicated, it's also beautiful enjoys. going, through it made me

realize how much i loved journalism and the job that i'm doing, how important i think it is for all of us to continue to have hard-hitting journalists out there who are willing to keep doing the job in the face of all the ugliness that we are currently experiencing. [applause] >> do you want to read an excerpt from the book? because the book has layers, folks, i would say. if you are interested in stories of journalism, journalism history, also journalism or of the moment, there is that. that's also tough family stuff. at the beginning in particular, the first third of the book is a very cinematic -- if you like miami, let's introduce you to los angeles. >> in the 80s and 90s, which is unparalleled. >> her mother and father built, out of nothing, a full-fledged video and helicopter journalism operation.

just as american entrepreneurial ship. it's incredible, as a story. >> at one, point my dad walked into a helicopter company, he's 25 years old, still has pimples, he is beside my mother who is pregnant with my brother. and there is me. he says, i want to lisa helicopter. but i was, like what are you talking about? he said, can i lisa look up? he said, do you have any cash? my dad said, no, but i have this business plan. he presented the business plan and said, she is the camerawoman, pointed to my pregnant mother. and they were like, get out of here, what are you doing? he went to another helicopter company and did it again, managed to get them to hand over 1 million dollar helicopter to him. he had no pilots license. but he had so much chutzpah at the time that he went out and convince somebody at the los angeles fire department to teach him how to fly. he is that license, along with my mom, to cover news in los

angeles in a way that nobody had done before. there had been a helicopter, it was called a tele-copped, or ktla had, it a local station in l.a.. but they used very seldom lee, it was a gimmick. they said, the city's giant, whenever we get to a news event it's, over to fireplaces out when you really want to get the flames. car crash, everybody has been airlifted or ambulance out of their. how do we get there faster sweetened see this happening in realtime? we've got to do it from the air. they built this business called los angeles news service, and they changed journalism as we know it. at first, it was for good, you can see these things happening in realtime. they captured some videotape that held authorities accountable in a way that they had not been held to account before. there was a c h b beating the living daylights out of a group of migrants who had crossed the border, this was just a few

miles north of san diego. just beating them terribly. and that never would have been teen had my parents not been above it with a helicopter and training their camera on it. it didn't make them many friends, they could capture and hold authorities accountable in a way that they hadn't been held before. but also, this is reality tv as news now. the coverage i live police pursuit, not the, first it's the second. and from top to bottom, the guy was a carjacking and a murder, so those kind of the los angeles police department on a high-speed pursuit through all of l.a., up freeways, down freeways, sidestreets. >> sidewalks, curbs, everything. >> this wild video of this red cab, what with the license? plate >> cruel fate. i feel faith. >> they captured the whole thing in realtime, the news director, this is 91 or 92, the new director had decision to make. do i cut into a run of matt

lock? the station director. which date good numbers. or show this police pursuit, or do i keep matlock on? at the time, he made the decision to cut into matlock, which was a big deal. it was a gamble. the next day, the l.a. times was covering it, they said it was a marriage of tragedy and technology. >> voyeurism, they called it voyeurism as news. it was the beginning of the era where you could carry events live and it wasn't just an evening network broadcast where there would be a 15 second live shot. there was ongoing, rolling live coverage of an event where you don't know, at the time, you didn't know who is in the cabriolet. you don't know what they had, done with their motives where. if they're a good, guy a bad guy. and you are just a voyeur, observing it. >> it's context tillis. >> without context. of, course you could argue it's

a criminal, a bad, guy the cops are on the side of good here. but then the principle of taking the coverage without any of the information it's the same principle that goes into taking any kind of life political event without any surrounding fact-checking. >> it's stealing the thunder of my point that i was building too. >> please. i [applause] am a man and i like to explain. >> that pillar conversationally are a real joy. anyway, it was reality tv. the ratings came in the next day, it slaughtered matlock. it did so well, people couldn't get enough of these live pursuits. so, they started covering them more and more. news became entertainment, a reality tv version of what's going on around you. you can draw a straight line to that, let's just air it without context because we can't take our eyes off of it. to the way that we covered political realities or the way that we cover them in 2015 and 2016. where this is important, yes,

but it's also means context, yes, sure. but we can't take our eyes off of, it so let's just air it and figure it out later. that's what we suffered from in that time. it's part of how we are dealing with the aftermath of what happened in 2016 and the way that it ate away at trust in journalists and journalism. and we are trying now to figure out how to work back toward that trust. it's very easy to lose trust, it's very, very difficult to earn it back. >> if i may interject. >> yes, please. >> you are 100 percent right about that big national story. but there's also a really good personal story about you and your rise and your relationship with your father. some of the gifts that he gave you, it's actually very moving. so, i remember mickey mental supposedly had a father who threw baseballs at him in the crib until nikki, little baby

mickey, learn to put a hand up. that is how you breed a baseball prodigy. when i say she is one of the greatest and most naturally gifted television, broadcasters her father essentially did that to her. when she was a little tyke, he would turn on the, camera turn on the microphone, and he would meeker recount in live reporter form what happened during the day. >> there is a video, i have it on my instagram and you can go find it, of me when i was four years old. maybe even less, yeah, it was for. my dad had my camera on me and sit on the sidewalk and my brother and says, give me a news report. i look at him and say, like the lady on the news? we get him sideways again. like the radio lady, k n x. it dawned on me, oh, yet there was a fire in san diego. if i broke out and all my friends were there, we went to a party at mcdonald's. but it was the beginning of being forced to do these live reports on demand.

we would be in the car and he would, say give me a live report about what's happening on our drive to get pizza. for a long, time it was very fun. and then i as i got to be a teenager, i got to be very annoying. but looking, back it was the best, the best training for the job that i do now. because i found myself in situations in local news where you would get to a story two minutes before the broadcast. because local news this run, run, run. and they have been decimated financially, they just don't have the resources they used to. please watch local news, it's good for everybody. [applause] and read local papers, miami herald. with that through a story and, two minutes before, they would come to you and say, what's going on? you have to look around and say, let me tell you about what's going on. it was just observational. a lot of journalism is

observational, painting a, picture telling a story, building a narrative for where you are. there's a lot of that in this book. there's also a lot of humor. should i read the part about the vice president? >> yes, please read this part. >> -- >> so much of her identity is tied to being a journalist. raised in a family of journalist, she's a fantastic journalist. and then you become a, mother become apparent, become a wife, all these other identities come in and compete. those identities collided in this anecdote. >> i just given birth to my first son, teddy. it was, as anybody who has gone through birth, a traumatic experience what you're not really prepared for. you don't really understand what's happening. mine ended in an emergency c-section. and the aftermath of that was a lot. and so, i've just gotten home, this was four or five days

after. i just got back and i'm in the bathroom. and i'm working at the courage to look down at what has happened to me. and i have my phone in my hand. here, i'll start reading, this is chapter 16. it's kamala. right after we arrived home from the hospital, my phone rang. i was in the, bathroom trying to get a moment, alone sitting on the toilet lid, breathing deeply and working at the courage to look down at mash hospital briefs i had just pulled around my knees. i knew it was going to be ugly. i wasn't sure i wanted to know how ugly. i didn't even know my photos in my hand until it started to flash and buzz. i don't know why i looked at it except for that distraction, i was looking for any reason on earth not to look down. so, even though it was a 415 number, san francisco area code, a city where i know nobody, i picked up. hello? i said. katie?

the voice on the other side of the calls and it excited for me, like i was about to be presented with checks every week for the rest of my life. yes? i said. but voice was iconic, even then, midway through the 2020 campaign for president. it was the voice of the democratic candidate for the white house and senator from my home state of california, the voice of the current vice president of the united states, the voice of kamala harris. but was it really her? or was i still hallucinating? i also hallucinated at the hospital, it was fun to have the whole psych ward show up in, say are you okay? that's in here. it took me a second to register what might be happening. i was groggy, have drug, self pitying and the voicing at the name like the announcer on a daytime talk show. i imagine oprah, arms stretched out, head tilted back. is this a joke? this has to be a joke, somebody is printing me. hi? i said.

i heard you had to the baby, i just wanted to call and say congratulations. her voice was alive, it jumped out of the phone and danced around me like a technical or rainbow. oh my god, it's really her. oh, yeah, i said, still unable to do more than matched the energy of a soaking 12 year old, i did. how is the baby? how are you? i looked down. inside the briefs was a mat of cause folded up like an origami diaper, a catchall for what was still falling out of my uterus. ladies, you know. you think that when you push a baby, out you push everything out. or you think, if you have a c-section, like i, did they just moffitt up before they so you back up. not so different from a dentist after they remove a tooth, but no. her body spent ten months building a home for another, life and it takes weeks for

that home to dislodge in pieces and flood down a swollen mississippi of bodily fluid. six weeks at least, i'm sorry, gentlemen. i'm so sorry. most of you are married, you get it. >> i forgot this was in here, actually, i'm sorry i recommended it. >> they do tell you that a doctor's visit, or you read about it in some book with a contented goddess on the cover. but nothing quite ready for what actually comes out. they say it's like a really heavy period, that is being cute about it. what comes out is not cute. there will be blood, there will be tissue, there will be clots, golf ball sized or normal baseball sized or not. i thought about telling vice president harris the, truth making a joke of it, all telling her what i happen to be in the middle of doing. maybe that would have been the right move. but my professional filter

kicked in. it suddenly occurred to me that this was a work call. i had been covering this person, one way or another. i would be covering this person one-way another when i got back to work. i thought, maybe i don't tell her about the carry movie in my pants. maybe i keep it up heat, build a bridge, make a connection, the human. that kind of human she will agree to sit down with during the campaign, or if it gets to that point, the white house. be nice, but be a reporter. i'm good! i said, trying to find a spare barrel of excitement. teddy is good, we just got back from the hospital. i felt like harris had opened a door by calling me. but instead of walking through, it i banged my head against the door frame. i was so flat, so lifeless. i was more's code to her technical or rainbow. she must have noticed to, because she banked off the call pretty quickly. okay, she said. well, i just wanted to say

congratulations, good luck, talk soon! >> if you ever interviewed kamala harris as vice president? >> no! >> i wonder why. >> no! i've to center the book and say, excuse me, can we talk about what was really going on? and the, let's talk about paid parental leave while we're at it. [applause] i immediately realized that i had failed a test my mother would have passed. she would've realized that, well you may be taking some time off from the news business, the news business is never taking some time off from you. i was also feeling on a frontier my father would have mehow conquered. my father had always been looking for the next thing in news, never stopping to find rules and regulations, risking life and limb. i wasn't going to be taking teddy of an helicopter anytime soon, but perhaps i should have been shooting video for social media. above the neck, anyway. anything to keep this new media connected to the me that

existed in the world as a journalist. and i was out of ideas and out of energy. i simply hung up and then sat there for a while longer, forcing myself to look down. [applause] the other part of this book that i found u.s. full to write down, and also i think is worthwhile of a deeper conversation, as the way that we cover big events. that's not just the rallies, but the way that we cover important news events and what we can do better as journalists. i know you guys have a lot of opinions on this, i'm sure you do, at least. i would love to hear them. and the book i talk, about right before i go on maternity leave, it's the end of the mueller investigation. the first special counsel, now that we have a second a special counsel investigating donald trump. and, so, i had covered trump

since the beginning and this felt like the end of something very big. i wanted to be around to know the outcome. i'm ten months pregnant, i'm huge. and i get it announcement that bill barr is going to release a summary over the weekend and to just prepare for, it is going to be a summary of the results of the mueller investigation. a barge into my bosses office and i, say you have to put me on the air on the weekend, give me any time slot. we don't know when it's going to come out, saturday or sunday at some point, but they gave me a few hours in the afternoon each day. it just happened on sunday the summary came out. you got a warning about it, 30 minute heads up. so, we tap dance up to the news and then we get the summary itself, which is a four-page statement with one half a direct quote from the actual report. and as you, know the statement was deeply misleading. it was a political statement.

but that's all we had to go on. so, this is me on live television, reading the statement without context, again. without any of the underlying -- the context obviously of the investigation that we've been covering, but without the context of the underlying report or the evidence of the underlying report. all we, had me and every other news organizations, was this political statement from a political appointee, summarizing what an investigation said. we did know it was misleading until three weeks, later when the actual report came out. so, the question is, we gave this document the runway to paint a picture about an investigation that was not true. to give the white house this win that they didn't earn. and it was bad for the public, it was bad for the country. but what do you do in that situation? we have caught ourselves in this 24 hour news cycle. both on cable news but also on

social media and in newspapers, these live blog, getting you up to speed on what's happening minute by minute. what do we do? this is a conversation you and i have a lot. because, in the moment, there was no other choice but to go with it live. because everybody else was going without, life we could all decide to, say we're not going to cover something until we know more about it. but then, fox news or bright by or whatever gateway pundit, whatever, will say they're not covering it because it's good for the president. so, you are caught in this rock and a hard place, tea is a bad cliché. with not being good for the public discourse, but also and having a choice to do it any differently. so, we are in this moment right now where we need the public's by an end of the public's critical thinking and critical

i in order to navigate this very complicated information atmosphere we live in, with social media and with 24 hour news and with the politicians ability to circumvent us. it's just very difficult, and we're all trying to figure out how to do it better. and so, my question to you guys is, do you know a better way to do this? the floor is open for questions. if you have one, i would love to hear it. took that out of your hands. >> very good, wise choice. >> so, i don't know if i have any answer, maybe just to add to the complications. as the new york post put down at the bottom of the front page, after the announcement, florida

man makes an announcement. page 26. i read part of that article, which was just one little column on the left of page 26. i talked about, we don't know about his cholesterol level. and they described him as a man who plays golf a lot. >> it was a very short blurb. >> short blurb. comparing that to what the press gave president trump, billions of dollars of free airtime. the question is, where do you feel you need to reside in that full spectrum? >> i think that, listen, it's news that the former president is running again, 100%. that something that needs to be, covered but needs to be covered in context.

in the way that we weren't able to do in 20, 16 because we didn't have the foresight, that we weren't able to do with the bar summary because we didn't have the foresight. we can now say, donald trump, twice impeached former president who is currently under investigation by the fbi and the doj is running for president again. then we can say, that we can talk about the news value that comes or the news out of his speech, not necessarily everything he says. even fox news cutaway. when we talk about the field of republicans who are either in or, out what lawmakers, arguing the way they are reacting to it, what the donors are, doing the way they are reacting to it, what the friendly press is doing about, it the way that they are reacting to, it's the new york post. it's something that's worthwhile. but also talking about what it means for congress and how the republican party in the democratic party legislate together going forward. what sort of hearings are? their ad is kevin mccarthy navigated? there are all these news equestrians that effectively

one of, us because they are the people in charge of legislation. and the money that we get as a country and the laws that are made. so we don't just cover it wall-to-wall for the sake of having it on the screen. >> very good, thank you. >> hi, my name is roberto velez. first of, i wanted to say you guys are definitely couples goals. >> thank you. >> someone who works in corporate media, how do you view the rise of popularity in independent and online media? not just from the right-wing, they have newsmax, right side broadcasting, one american news. but also from the left wing. you have the young turks, majority report, secular talk. two people, that work in corporate media, if you them as a threat? do you feed them as more immediate, the better. >> i don't view anybody as a threat. and in corporate media has a certain implication.

i don't consider myself working for a big corporation in the sense that it is directing anything i say or any stories that i cover. and i think that is kind of misleading, people think that comcast is coming in and saying, katie, we want you to cover this and not cover that. that's not the case. but i think the independent news outlets do a wonderful job and, like, propublica doesn't credible journalism. the more the merrier, in that respect. >> anybody who can interest the public and current events, i think, is doing got work. so, whether you're coming from the left or the, right as an entry point and for any member of the public to become interested in who is being elected and what they're trying to do, more power to them. >> what they say about all media is it is good, independent, corporate, whatever. make sure that you understand how they do their journalism, as a source. what are the rules for sourcing

information? what are the rules for fact checking? how they are accountable. transparency there. >> the other thing that's important about, smaller more transparency driven news markets on that left and right is they are only able to exist because of larger, sometimes denigrated as corporate, media lids funding actual reporting and actual difficult places. on, campaigns and board zones, in disaster zones. finding things out that then are fodder for conversation. and it includes, in a huge way, newspapers and print media. the associated press, reuters, the miami herald, all the other big papers. if i had to choose a world where one of them went away, the big guys with the little guys, i would use the little guys. but i like living in a world where both exist. because i think they feed one another. >> symbiotic. >> thank you. >> one other thing about corporate media, the point of corporate media, yes, it's a

moneymaking enterprise. but because it's a moneymaking enterprise, his mission, it's cool at a place like cbs or abc or nbc, it's the broadest possible audience. i think there is virtue in america of having a news source that is attempting, succeeding or failing on sundays or, others attempting to reach this spectrum as opposed to this spectrum or this spectrum. [applause] >> the best thing about the last two years that we haven't had to listen to unfiltered trump go on and on on national news. [applause] and last night, i stumbled on nbc's streaming. and they had trump on, from a conservative dinner in mar-a-lago. where they gave him like ten minutes to thank all the people, all the people that he has supported, we supported him. then they cut away and they say, we will come back because we only are interested in hearing

what he has to say about the special prosecutor. they come back in and he did talk about them appointing a special prosecutor. and went on and on about how persecuted he has been. and how he has given 11,000 pages of documentation, they have everything on him, what do they keep asking for? i finally had to turn it off, because it was going on for too long, unfiltered. so, i think we are back. and that is upsetting. >>, when it was barry. >> i don't know if there is a question. i didn't see it, so i can't -- >> i'm all for a community meeting style. statements or questions as fine. >> ask a question, i won't make a statement. my name is barry, this isn't meant to be a caught you question. but the most important thing i've been listening to his keith over menendez podcast. i'm not saying it because of

your situation. do you think of his podcast? do you think it's as great as i think it is? >> i haven't listened to it, i'm sorry. >> i have it listed, either but there is a keith olbermann anecdote in the book. >> please listen to it, just one episode, it's great. i wish everybody would, thank you. >> pardon me. my name is paul johnson, actually i was in the media about 25 years ago. that is the senior producer for money aligned with lou dobbs. i got out of that business and now i'm a u.s. attorney, not the u.s. attorney. you asked how do you solve or what are some suggestions for guests moving forward. i don't know that there is, i'm not a defeatist but how do you compete with social media? that's not there to enforce, it's there to get you back. you know? like the old batman, same bat channel, same path time, just come back. i don't know how you do, it can be mcneill layered, one of the side, one on the side. no one is going to watch. >> i think part of it is, first

of all, let's all point went out for twitter while we're here. >> need that, right. >> i think part, of it i've had these conversations recently, it's just the -- where we think the other person we're talking to his coming from. if they say something we don't agree with or find offensive or isn't in line with what is acceptable today. or if you want to say accurate. something about the person, i think there's a knee-jerk reaction to assume that the person is a bad actor or is, you know, angry or mean or trying to do something nefarious. i'm not heartened by politicians, i'm talking about every day your neighbors, your friends, your relatives. i think it would be good for all of us to assemble the person you are in speaking to, or if you're speaking to them on social media, is not a bad person.

and maybe just somebody you need to have a more calm conversation with to understand where they're coming from. and then you could tell him where you're coming from. just have a dialogue that we haven't been able to have because everybody believes that the president they are speaking with is the devil. and we're, not we're all americans, we're trying to make the country as good as it possibly can be. but we are all dealing with a lot of everyday junk in our lives. we are all getting information from, now, different sources. some of it reliable, some of it not reliable. but it is worthwhile trying to find common ground, trying to find a way to speak to each other again. i think it's great that twitter is falling apart. i mean, twitter has been good for a lot of things. it's done a lot of good in the world, that's enabled a lot of people to come together and to push back against a violent regimes. it's open the world up to a

dialogue but it's also more recently been very angry and mean and divisive. and so, my advice to everybody would be to log off, if you haven't already. log off facebook, maybe if you go on instagram, just like pictures of dogs and cats. but before us. instead, if you're getting into a conversation with somebody, try not to assume that they are a bad person. try to talk to them. >> and if somebody were to deliver a news program that is substantive but maybe a little boring or dry, maybe it's good for, you i don't know. in the uk, the bbc is actually quite boring. they have a culture of the news is vegetables there. we don't have a culture of the news as vegetables, we have a culture of the news is bright and shiny, happening now. and if you look, let you're going to miss the most amazing thing. it's going to be bloody, funny, it's going to be exciting. i, wish as a person who worked

in journalism, that it was a little bit more less entertainment, more kind of miami-dade college. like, it's an education. [applause] >> well, thank you all, that was a wonderful conversation. another round of applause for our authors. [applause] that concludes this session. the next session will begin in a few minutes, thank you. >> but tv has featured many politicians who are also authors who won elections in this year's midterms. democrat wes moore became maryland's first black governor, he has appeared on book tv several times to talk about his books. >> it isn't just about, can we make sure that police officers have body cameras? it's not just about how do we add on clauses