it's like the research. good morning, everybody. welcome to the session. i'm jeff urban. i'm the education director here at the roosevelt presidential library and museum. and on behalf of the fdr pres good morning, everybody. welcome to this session. i am jeff urban, and on behalf of the fdr presidential library and museum, i would like to welcome you all to the 20th anniversary of the roosevelt reading festival. fdr planned for the library to become the premier research

institution for the study in the entire roosevelt era, and the library research room is consistently one of the busiest of all the presidential libraries. this year's group of authors reflect the wide variety of research done here, and in similar institutions throughout the country. let me just quickly go through the lay of the land here. we are going to talk for 30 to 40 minutes or so, and there will be some time to do questions and answers. we are in the c-span room, so if you are going to ask a question, we need you to come up to the microphone. don't ask a question until you get to the microphone, ask the question, and then the author will respond. we want to make sure we get the question on audio. it's my pleasure to introduce our next author, david pictures a. author of many books.

in closing 1932, the rise of hitler. fdr, politics, betrayal and unlikely destiny. roosevelt sweeps the nation. gangster land, a tour through the dark heart of jazz age new york city. he has appeared on morning joe, voice of america, american heroes channel, espn, npr, c- span. he has spoken at the fdr presidential library in the past, at the john f. kennedy library and also at the truman presidential libraries. as well as grand cottage state historic site, the baseball hall of fame and museum and various institutions, universities and libraries and festivals across the country. he lives in new york state, and here to talk with us about his recent book is david pietrusza.

>> thank you. i think the first question i often get about a book is why -- first off, thanks to all the great people here for having me. it's an honor to be here. everyone is so nice. it's an event i look forward to even when i'm not speaking. i show up as a spectator. that's how much i like it. anyway, why write a book like this if you're like a presidential historian and such? before that, i was doing baseball history. looking at gangster and underworld figure arnold rothstein. a couple years ago, i got a call from somebody i had been doing one of these things on cable tv where you argue about the events of the day and he says i do a radio show about broadway. could you come on and talk

about arnold rothstein on broadway in times square? and i said, yes i can. because right after writing the book about arnold rothstein, which is now about 20 years ago, i did a walking tour of times square. arnold rothstein's times square. and because it's times square where you keep your hand on your wallet. i was stiffed on payment for that to her. but i kept all my notes. more remarkably, i can find them in the hovel that passes for my office. so i thought i will do the interview and maybe i could publish a little pamphlet. i tend to get carried away. one of the reasons i could get carried away is because unlike

today's newspapers, which we got all sorts of details, particularly about crimes, criminals, locations. the newspapers then were just full of details, and they had plenty of details to be full of in the prohibition era in times square. i took the thing forward and did like a part two in the book about the upper west side, which i was quite surprised to learn was really mobbed up back then. it's a direct shot from times square, from the upper west side to where the action was in times square. so the newspapers would tell you all of the details and they would tell you not only the street that something occurred on, they would tell you the street number and they would tell you the apartment number. i found a guidebook, which was from 1920. it listed the addresses of famous people in the city. so it would tell you where

under secretary of the navy, franklin roosevelt lived. okay, i imagine that in today's world. so one of the things i said, i said please, let me speak about this book at the roosevelt reading festival. i promise i will bring in politics front and center to that. because we talk about intersectionality now in politics, and there's an intersectionality or overlap about this story, and about how gangsterism worked in the 20s in times square. you have the usual murderers and shakedown artist. and speakeasies and bootlegging, but you also have, you have politics. this is a

big factor that plays into it. they need protection. it goes into sports with their fixed and certain sporting events, and it goes into the theater, where every gangster appears to have a showgirl girlfriend. not all gangsters, not just gangsters. maybe franklin roosevelt doesn't, but william randolph certainly does. his first wife and then his second wife, marion davies. we also see the plot lines of early 1930s movies which seem fanciful and hackneyed really are based on today's headlines, yesterday's headlines, in that case. so with politics, the cornerstone of the story is the democratic organization which runs everything in new york city at that time and for a

very long time, which franklin roosevelt makes his early representation in the early senate as being an early opponent of. with the most prominent tie in to the violence and the gore in this era, in this area and in this era is the tammany boss of the lower east side. a guy named big tim sullivan. sullivan, again, intersectionality, overlap. aside from being a state senator and a congressman, he was also a partner in a west coast vaudeville chain of all things. he had an office for his chain at 1440 broadway. so sullivan also protect up and coming young gamblers. one of whom is arnold rothstein. another is a guy named bean z rosenthall.

he had a house on 45th street. also protected by sullivan, called it lieutenant charles becker. becker is one mean crooked cop. rosenthall says do you know who i am? i'm a friend, i'm a protigi of big tim and you're picking on me. i'm not going to take it. the gambling house is wrecked by the police. this happens one more time. and rosenthall -- this is a bad time for tammany. manhattan, at that point, is one of those rare intervals when manhattan has a republican da. he's going to go to the da, he's going to go to the press. trouble in river city. becker and big tim sullivan, by the way, the father of the first gun-control lot in the

united states. the sullivan act. also involved in the murder of beansie rosenthall, which is the first drive-by shooting in united states history. they just sort of go by hand after hiring some killers through another gambler named richie weber, who had a feral house at 102 west 42nd street, which is now a whole foods. the one by bryant park. so rosenthall is no more. becker goes to the chair. he is the first. so many first in this case. the first and i think only cop to go to the chair in the united dates of america. we have that. surviving this nice is arnold

rothstein. rothstein, there are many sites one can visit that were associated with him in new york city. most notably, the park central hotel, very near the carnegie hall. big hotel, still in business now. 200 west 56th street. he is killed in an upper room there. find another gambler named george mcmanus. well, that's my theory anyway. and it was the das theory, as well, but not the juries. pretty much, i think, the fix was in there. to let him go. rothstein was involved, and, like i say, rum running, loansharking, bootlegging, speakeasies, fixing things. is the great middleman of

things. one of the middleman, there is an adjunct, or a detour from the rothstein story, and he has a relative of, a relative of his is a cousin, married to a guy named george ringler. george ringler what sort of get around in political circles, in politics, and he also worked for the new york daily news. he has a photographer and a go to guy, a guy who feeds stories to the reporters and stuff like this. he showed up as a fellow who served the summons. there was an entertainer at this time by the name of frank tenney. a black face entertainer. you can listen to recordings of his act. not in blackface, on youtube.

one of them is called frank tenney's first rank recording. and the second is called his second recording. it's remarkably funny. but as a person, not so funny. so after beating up his beautiful girlfriend, and the jean wilson, he is accosted by a photographer in times square and he beats him up, too. whereupon george ringler will serve him with a summons on behalf of the beat up photographer. ringler is also connected to mary james jay walker. the corrupt mayor of new york city was removed from office by governor franklin delano roosevelt. and ringler is so close to walker that he accompanies

walker up to albany. to argue his case and try to save his office. if you think ringler going up to albany is impressive, i will tell you it's impressive. we happen to have george ringler's granddaughter sitting in the front row. brandy ringler. so you are not expecting that, were you? she's got information which we are not going to discuss further. even though this meeting is hosted by the feds. okay. another politician who was involved in the rothstein story is a guy named maurice cantor. he has an office at 152 west 42nd street. the assembly man on the upper, upper, upper west side, somewhere past columbia university.

he's in there for a couple of terms. he is rothstein's attorney at the end. his fixing everything for him. when arnold roth in his shot at the park central hotel, and he is dying at the polyclinic hotel, which, by the way, valentino died at. marilyn munro was treated there. and when rothstein is dying, cantor produces -- he shows up at the deathbed and he says arnold, remember that well you asked me to prepare a few weeks ago and you never got around to signing? i happen to have it right here. sign here. this was contested by arnold's relatives, but that's the sort of shallow that marie's cantor was. the sort of people that were often in politics at that time, which is why tammany was about to collapse. they also had to that arnold

rothstein's papers. which she may have with her, i don't know. no, she says no. was the 17th district leader in manhattan. a guy named nathan burke on. the tammany guys were not done. he was the best entertainment lawyer in the country. you name all the stars of the silent era. here represented them all. his grandson, jonathan birkin is the congressional cochairman for the new york state republican party. the story never seems to end. bill fallon, another arnold rothstein lawyer had been

assistant da. she was born near the church of saint mary near times square. if you are over there, go see it. it's a hidden gem. go see it, it's beautiful. but he became shall we say quite flamboyant, great jury, fixer, great lawyer, et cetera. at the hotel the eau claire in 1926, a mystery woman burst into the room where he is and throws some form of asset into his face. remarkably, they get him to the hospital and not only is he not landed, he's not even scarred. he is sort of the type of lawyer that is pretrade like in the music, the musical chicago. william randolph hearst is

bringing charges, when they are bringing jury charges against fallon at one point. he puts hearst on trial. he says they are picking on me. and you know why? because i have the secret birth certificates of the twins fathered by william randolph hearst and marion davies. there was no birth certificate. there were no twins. there were no children. he was acquitted. those are the sort of people we are dealing with. last but not least, in the early 1930s, there is a judge. judge joseph fourth-grader who goes to dinner at the chophouse on times square and steps into a taxi cab afterwards and disappears, and is never seen again. force is one of the

many, many, many corrupted judges in new york city at that time. a product of tammany hall. connected to some pretty respectable names. he had been the secretary to senator robert wagner. the father of social security in the wagner labor relations act. then he moved on from that to being a supreme court judge. appointed to that position by governor franklin delano roosevelt. there are some theories as to what happened. none of them stand up to absolute proof. he may have been propositioned by legs diamond, who had a grudge with them, and taken to coney island to have some sense beaten into and your can they beat a bit too much sense into him and he was buried under the boardwalk. that's a theory.

or that one of the things which i've talked about, intersectionality, or did not talk about, prostitution. that he may have gone to one of poly others in famous or famous brothels in the city and had not survived the evening in a different form and was dumped in the hudson river, but you pay your money and you take your choice on what happened to him. speakeasies are just everywhere, particularly in the last 50s. texas guinan is the most famous speakeasy operator. there are movies made about her while she is doing this. helen morgan, a big musical comedy star, she stars in the original showboat. like a day after it opens, speakeasy is rated. okay, that's how commonplace

this was. another big speakeasy operator is a guy named larry fay. he operated a bunch of taxicabs and he would send them up to montreal. they would come back with booze and such and such like this. he owned the club on west 45th street. then later on when he is sort of down on his luck, operating the casablanca on west 56th street. he has to cut wages, the doorman shoots him dead. shoots him dead. he had $.10 in his pocket when he died. crime does not necessarily pay. he is also noted for something else. before it was unpopular, or before it was really popular in some places and really unpopular everywhere else, he would festoon his speakeasies and taxicabs with giant

swastikas. so anyway, goodbye to larry fay. others that you may have heard of are jimmy durante. arnold rothstein has a craps game operating in the basement of the club durand. billy rose was a great showman. he did the movie in the 50s with jimmy durand called jumbo. he was at one point married to for any price. the rainy speakeasy called the backstage club which he was propositioned to buy one of these, then, those guys. i'd like to buy a share of your establishment, mr. rose. i'm not interested. so it's rated by the cops. everything is smashed up. same thing happens again. finally, he gets the message. it's really not these, then,

those guys who is doing it. he is doing it at the behest of arnold rothstein. so rothstein gets a cut of everything, like that. being married to fanny price , okay. fanny brice had been married earlier to a guy named nikki arnstein if you remember the movie. what was left out of the movie was that nikki arnstein was a confederate and a great admirer of arnold rothstein. he was a con man in his own right. as i talked about, jewel robberies, a lot of government bond robberies back then. the bonds were not -- they were bearer bonds. so you could just cash them in. if you have a shipment of bonds coming in from wall street to a bank or something, they would be hit. and robbed. he was involved in this, went on the land at one point, got

sick of being on the lamb, turned himself in. arnold rothstein gave him some advice. why don't you, instead of just turning yourself in in some boring way, they would have a police parade down fifth avenue every year. what you get in the car and write down in the police parade passed the commissioner of police? he did. the police were not amused. for bail money, arnold rothstein provided that bill money to fanny brice. he also said because it was not just all tourism, he said while we are here, i have an importing business and you have a new apartment. what you buy all your furniture from me? and he did, and it was seriously, seriously overpriced. she was that amused. nor was a woman named ann

nichols. and nichols produced, wrote a show in the 1920s called babies irish rose. the old plot, jewish guy mary's irish girl. god knows where the first of anything start. she had the first big hit with that. the longest-running show in broadway history for a long time. it was a big hit, but it was not at first. like all those broadway show musicals, musicals in the 20s. if we only can stay on, the show is going to have legs, it's going to be a hit. i believe in it. and she goes to arnold rothstein for money to keep it going. because rothstein actually financed the building of the cell one peter on 42nd street. he would put the money up for just about anything if he could make money back.

and he says sure, i can lend you the money. she says do you want a piece of the show? no, don't want it. just want the money back with interest soon on time, and also, while you're here, you know, i'm in the insurance business. i'd like you to take out some insurance policies on your life with me as the beneficiary. this was common practice by him. she was not amused. if he had taken the original deal, he could have made a really big fortune. as it was, he only cleared about $3000. that's the sort of wheeling and dealing which was going on there. as i said, a lot of showgirls involved in these things. everybody had a showgirl, chorus girl girlfriend. legs diamond did. when the marx brothers are on

broadway, in their second show called the coconuts, harpo decides i've got a new gag. i'm going to try to catch groucho unaware and see if i can get him flat-footed and not know what to do on stage. i'm just going to have a blonde run across the stage and chase her, honking my horn. and groucho knows exactly what to say but that's not the point of the story. the point of the story is afterwards someone says do you know who that chorus girl is associated with? no. that's legs diamond's current girlfriend. one to get another blonde? so he did. but all those things would be going on. they also make a show called room 349. that's the remember of where rothstein was killed at what is

now the nederlander theatre just below the 42nd street. it's not a good show. it lasts for a handful of performances. it is done very, very soon after his death. the names are changed to protect the guilty. what is remarkable is that his mistress is in the show. a woman named inez norton. these are wild, wild times. sports. there's a gangster who most people have forgotten, but was big then. his name was on the killer madden. when you have a nickname in these circles like the killer, yes, he did and he went to sing for about eight years or so. but he comes out to be a big bootlegging guy of the west side, and also involved in sports with a couple of associates.

big bill duffy and frenchy demands. they promote a guy from italy called primo carner a. big giant of a guy who cannot backs is way out of a paper bag. if you have friends like madden and duffy, you will become heavyweight champion of the world because fights are fixed. how are they fixed? in one case, a friend of madden is a guy named george raft. the actor. the actor. before he became an actor, he was associate of guys like madden. also worked in a speakeasy is perhaps the foremost charleston dancer in america. see if you can find on youtube where he does a brief charleston. and he is good. at one point, he is propositioned or asked by madden to go to a guy named

eddie boy peterson. a fighter, to throw a fight and threatened him. he does not want to threaten him, so he just slips him a mickey and makes him a little shaky before the fight. this happens at the hotel claridge on west 44th street, which is the headquarters of lucky luciano. all of these things in circles that keep happening and happening. the jewel robberies, amazing, amazing numbers involved. $305,000 in jewel robberies. 265 murders. showgirls, again. one of the showgirls is insured, the jewels are insured by arnold rothstein. just before she is robbed and murdered, the policy lapses.

okay, these are tough times. tough times. one of the jewel robberies and the $305,000 robbery is a woman in the rob a man of the glenn be here that fracturing fortune. so she is involved in that. one of her associates commit suicide. she shows up in our story a couple of decades before that when she comes in from chicago with a rich businessman. they check into the hotel and the place is rated by detectives, except they are not detectives. not detectives. this is a badger gang. it's a blackmail operation. they wanted to shake this guy

down for money. he says i don't care, i'm not paying. she has to take it on the lamb. she comes back into the city, where she becomes the mistress of one charles a stone on, who was the owner after 1917, of the new york a small giants. remember, they moved the giants to san francisco. or a stone him was a stockbroker involved in a type of operation called a bucket shop. what's a bucket shop? when you go in and they say oh, you should buy the copper. they know it's a stinker. they know it's overvalued, and you give them the money and they don't buy the stock. because they know it's a stinker. it has been inflated by rumors and it's going to go down. then they may both show additional rumors and press reports and as to how bad the

company is. and then a sale, i think you should get out before it goes lower, and they return a little sliver of the money that you paid him for it, and they keep the rest of it. horace stoneman was involved in that. these sort of operations were protected by tammany hall. and they were protected by arnold rothstein. so you have all of those things going on as well. i think i'm about ready to be inked off in terms of this. so there is much more. it's in the book. i will be around later on to discuss anything you want, discuss anything you want to talk about now to the microphone. >> okay, if there's any questions, come on over and have at it. here comes one.

>> i guess my main question, and i am guilty of it myself, is where we so fascinated by such bad people? >> when you are baptized, the priest asks the infant do you reject satan? do you reject the glamour of evil? evil has a certain glamour, that's why it succeeds, that's why satan is so successful. he doesn't come to you with someone who is repulsive to tempt you. comes to you with all those showgirls, you know, with the bubbly, the champagne, the good times. the '20s. whether '20s? what we talk about the 'wendy's so much? it's sort of a fun era. it's fun, but in a bad way. as i like to say about sin, sin

is like eating at mcdonald's. it seems like a good idea at the time, but you always regret it. next question? >> things very much. can you talk about fdr's involvement with tammany hall? the state legislature and his time as governor. >> well, back when they had united states senators elected by legislators, there was a deadlock. fdr is a big part of the deadlock. the democrats had majority in the legislature, which was unusual at the time. a deal is made eventually putting another democrat in. in the meantime, you know, he creates a lot of enmity from

tammany hall. but he is a damn good politician and realizes if you're not going to move to wyoming or wherever, you better make your peace with tammany hall. by the time of the 1920 convention, he has already been a member of the wilson administration, learning the ropes more and more and he also picked up a guy named louis house, who is going to say cool it, franklin. don't shoot all your ammunition here. you got to live to fight another day. he is palling around with al smith up in 1920 convention. at some point, he gets in a vote or two. and at that point, he becomes a protigi of smith. smith builds him up at the 1924 convention, at the 1928 convention. makes him the governor. really? and when tammany dedicates a

new wig lamb or headquarters on union square, you know, franklin roosevelt is there. he's not hands-off anymore and he has appointed guys like judge crater to the bench. he does not have to. politics is the art of the politics. also a particularly nefarious friend of mayor walker during that time and many, many more. even when walker is going down, he is kind of careful as to not go too far and not get too inflammatory, because it's a balancing act. once he's in the white house, the patronage goes to other people like laguardia or flynn in the bronx. thank you.

yes. >> just a fun thing that if you could comment on is david was sitting with arnold all the time at rothstein's taking notes. so his stories that people would have a lot of fun reading are based on these real-life characters. in guys and dolls, it was based on arnold rothstein. the bending of the cheesecake, the strudel. i think if you follow all the damon runs stories, because he liked that and sports. >> at some point, not too far into that story, and there is one in times square now which is not related. there were two on opposite sides of broadway for a while. the first one where arnold rothstein was and got the phone call to go to the park central

hotel. come on up, we have something to discuss. either way, i would like to kill you. i don't think he wanted to kill him. i think it was some sort of accident. whatever. that's an interesting thing. that was a mob hit, right? no, a mob hit blows your damn head off. it does not shoot you once in the stomach so you can wander down the stairs to be picked up by the police and go to the hospital. that's not professional. that's an amateur who does that. that's, you know, whatever. across from lindies by carnegie hall, in 1956, he is killed in the barber chair there. also i think in 1956, or around that time, there is a crusading newspaperman who i met later on. a guy named victor rozelle, if you remember him.

he went to the unions corruption hammer and tongs. one day he came on the radio broadcast nearby, standing in front of lindies . this is in the 50s. this is not the roaring '20s. and a goon throws acid in his face. and he is not as lucky as bill fallon. he goes on. the goon is killed by the mob. good. the silence him. rozelle goes on to continue with the column for decades afterwards, and became head of the international newspaper reporting situation. i met him and i looked into his face and saw the sunglasses which were covering the scars, and i do not admire those guys.

thank you. >> i guess we adjourned to the lobby. you can have your book signed out there in the lobby. >> if you're enjoying book tv, sign up for our newsletter, using the qr code on the screen. to receive a schedule of upcoming programs, author discussions, but vegetables, and more. book tv, every sunday on c-span 2 or online at c-span.org. television for serious readers.