schwarzenegger talking about closing --i am sorry, closing [unintelligible] one of the things with california having a lot of money spent in counties [unintelligible] the prison is sitting on one of the prettiest pieces of property -- san quentin. we're talking about california having such a large population of people making lots of money, but where's the money going? guest: on though san quentin issue, the governor has proposed selling a series of state

assets. it is not a bad idea, but it is not a panacea either. you get one-time money that does not deal with a structural issue of the state. but i will conclude with the prison system itself which is a great example of how spending has grown. it is an example of the fundamental problem. over the past two decades california has passed a number of laws increasing criminal penalties. as a result we have nearly 170% overcrowding in our state systems. every time one of those losses past no one has suggested how to pay for it. we need to decide what we want and need. then make a commitment to an ongoing stable source of revenue to pay for it.

i am confident we can and will be no it is tough now but we're not throwing in the towel and will get through it. you will read better things about california sooner than later, i hope. host: this is from one viewer saying that the governor's plan to close 80% of the state parks is the first up to private to the privatization of our state parks. guest: we do not want to do that, but it is a large part of our deficit. our priorities have to come under the issues of life and death, health care for kids, making sure we help those with developmental disabilities or those living with mental illness. those are the issues that must

come first. we will do our best to avoid the massive cut to stay pars, but we have to make priorities. host: finally, the deadline is at the end of june. william read it? guest: we will, and we will try to get at least a significant piece of work done by june 15, but we will wrap up the work by the end of june. we have no choice. as senate yourrunner said, people expect us to get this done. -- just as senator runner said. when the parties came together to knock out $36 billion, we will deal with this next $20 billion. host: our guest has been senator darrell steinberg. thank you for having been with

us. guest: host: thank you we will turn now to minnesota. thank you for being with us, tim pawlenty. we have been talking about the situation in california. what do you face in minnesota? guest: we also have a budget deficit, though not as large as california's. we will reduce spending up to 4%, but our state will have to live on 96% of the revenue available. that is not unlike what most families and small businesses are going through. it is not too much to ask during these tough times for government to live on 97% or 96% of the government imoney in it previou. host: what is your take on this recession? guest: this is rooted in the

mortgage crisis. there are layers of stories they're about greed it and bad behavior and bad decisions by all. states cannot look at that and say it is rooted in something that the state did or did not do, but in the case of minnesota the state budget since 1970 has been growing at 19% on average. that is unsustainable even in good times. too many states have been spending too much money too fast. when you have a downturn it means you cannot afford your payments. government must live more modestly. host: let me turn to national politics. here's a new book that says that part of the problems conservatives face is they do not have a spokesperson. he pointed to several figures. in his words they're the wrong spokespeople for the republican party.

guest: the republican party is going through a regrouping time. you would say if it were a sports team. there some voices of the previous effort who will continue to be part of it. the world be in inter- generational change. it will be more like a choir than a solo. we need new ideas, new talent, new energy. it will be a couple of years before one or two leaders emerge. it is a healthy process and is what happens when you get your tail kicked in the last two election processes. host: kenny walker's through the process you went through in deciding not to take a third term as governor? guest: it is simple. we do not have term limits in this state. but we do have good sense and common judgment.

the judgment is that you do not over-state your turn. it is time to give someone else a chance. the record under my term is very good. we have kept a lid on taxes and spending and try to bring fiscal discipline to the state. we have reformed their schools. we moved it to performance pay. we've done new energy policy. fattah fattait was a great recom retrospectives. host: if you were to seek the presidency in 2012 what questions would you ask yourself? how determine whether you would run or not? guest: i do not know what the future holds for me and have not gone through an exercise that would determine whether i would

consider running for president then. the country is going through great change on all fronts. it is a challenge for republicans of any sort. as you look ford, how do we take our principles -- a how do apply them to the emerging issues of our time as opposed to 60 years ago? the candidate will have to understand and articulate that. to win against barack obama you have to articulate conservative principles and the context of a changing country. host: is he doing so far five months into his presidency? guest: he inherited a big problem and i imagine the situation will get worse.

when he is done completing the nationalization or semi- nationalization of some in the industry's and soon the health care and energy industries and then he has his second phase which is higher taxes on entrepreneurial activities, i think it will be a negative set of developments for the economy in terms of global competitiveness. i am not optimistic that his prescription will set us on the right course. i'm very worried it will send us through a more difficult spot. you cannot spend that much and have that much government intervention without triggering other consequences which include inflation. host: we will get your phone calls an e-mails.

this tweet asks if you will certify the senatorial election if the minnesota court rules in favor of mr. franken? guest: i will fall of the direction of the court. i cannot issue a certificate until the supreme court process is finished. it is not. there are many union groups and democratic groups wondering why will not sign it right now. i cannot do that. we have to allow the court to finish. then if i am asked to sign a i will. i would not defy the law. host: could this go to the u.s. supreme court under this circumstance? guest: it might if one side or the other appeals to it. it is possible that one side or the other could say enough is enough and the wood in it.

but if one side appeals there could be further litigation. -- they could say enough is enough and end it. host: i understand that you are friend of norm common, but do think it has become a sideshow? -- a norm coleman. guest: yes, i think so. we are at a disadvantage without a full congressional delegation. the citizens are frustrated, but that has to be balanced against making sure that the outcome is fair. we're interested in having a full delegation and are running up against making sure that we have a fair and clear elections. citizens are frustrated and won it finished. host: our guest is governor tim pawlenty joining us from minneapolis. caller: good morning.

i love you lots of messages about our own the budget. you brought the renewable energy. i watched those climate change committee meetings with waxman and others. i was concerned that they have in that bill that coal is considered a non-renewable. nuclear also, and so would behydro and oil. pretty much anything thatmines into the ground. i want to bring up a couple of more things to see how you feel about it. but cost according to the democrats is $2.30 trillion. the estimate is for 2.5 million jobs lost because of this legislation.

the fund is allocated to displaced workers. they also include -- the scariest thing -- they are proposing $1,500 per moving allowance. these people who campaigned for america's future -- thank you, c-span -- we are being run by these non-profits to were getting all these appointments. i am not happy with the loss of the freedom. how you feel about the fact that we will not have anything that costs us less than an arm and a leg for energy? guest: she raised a number of great points. let me respond to as many as possible. first, as we do with the energy issue think we need these goals in mind. it is not in our national and security interest to be this the

pennant on foreign sources of energy, so we want to migrate our production to america. as we do that there are lots of opportunities. we have a 250 year supply it ofcoal that is here. the only problem is that it is not as clean as we would like. as a country we need to invest money to do it as quickly as possible to create clean colal technology. the cleanest energy we have is that which we do not continue to use. we need to use sound conservation policies. thirdly, we need to use nuclear energy. the idea that we will shrink nuclear production is ridiculous. it can be very safe and other french and others are ready

processing in a way that reduces nuclear waste. and has little in mission. we should be aggressively building more nuclear energy. it has little emission. there is the great opportunity for technology to advance this without the heavy hand of government, but creating incentives for auto companies and others to build the next generation around hydrogen fuel cells. i concur with the concern of the caller that the waxman bill and others to run in this debate are too government-centric. there are common sense things we can do that don't involve having the government nationalize the energy industry. things that would bring us a better, more secure source of energy and reduce pollution. host: tim pawlenty is in his seventh year as governor and before that he was in the state

house of representatives. surely is on the phone. shirley. caller: thank-you, governor, and thank you, c-span. i think you would agree that we are nation a oflaws. to talk about -- i live in florida. we have a lot of illegal immigrants. my take on that is, the operative word is "illegal." we need to go after the employers and enforce the laws we have on the books and not keep giving the illegal immigrants benefits that other people have worked hard for. host: in your state what happens if you are an illegal immigrant? what benefits do get? guest: it depends on the program, but in many cases you do not qualify for state-based

benefits with a few exceptions. pre-natal care is not denied, but we also have some much fraud that for most health care providers and government programs there is a lot of spillover between those who are legal and those who are illegal getting benefits. we are country of immigrants and we celebrate and welcome immigration. everyone is an immigrant or descendant of one unless you are native american, but it needs to be legal and orderly. right now it is a mess. we are based on the rule of law and you cannot have a large segment ignoring the law. it has a corrosive the affect. as we go forward we need to reinforce the border. we need for visitors to have fraud-proof identity cards.

lastly, i think she is exactly right. if you want to get to the root of the problem treated as a demand problem, not a supply problem. most come here for a job. if employers knowingly -- emphasize knowingly -- if they knowingly and repeatedly hire illegal immigrants than they should get hammered. that would drive most of the illegal immigration problem in a big hurry. but you have to give the employers or reasonable chance to examine documents. we have a very bad system in that regard right now. host: good morning, north carolina. caller: good morning, one comment and two questions. programming content -- i love

the telephone shows. you have nothing in the evening. for the last couple of years i have been preoccupied with listening to c-span and enjoy comments from all across the nation. one question -- two questions, governor tim pawlenty, what is the cost of the post-election shenanigans in minnesota? how be you defend the fact that during this critical juncture in our history, that you have deprived your state of a body to understand the ramifications being proposed today? guest: thank you, maybe you were not able to listen earlier, a al franken sued me months ago. the minnesota supreme court said

that i cannot sign an election certificate until the minnesota state court process is complete. so, for though dfl, the democratic party who imagine that i deprive them of the certificate, they are ignoring that or not listening. i cannot have signed the election certificate until the state court process is complete. it is unfortunate. it is frustrating. it has involved delay, but it is the law. we're anxious to have our full congressional complement in washington, d.c., but need to be sure we have an election system free from fraud. we need to be a little patient. it is not something that i could have done anything about.

even our democrat secretary of state agrees he could not have signed it. not until the state court process is complete. host: where would you put your political ideology? moderate, conservative? guest: definitely a mainstream conservative in the reagan tradition, but i also want to take that classic tradition in a modern way. that does not mean that we dilute will we stand for. but we have to do a better job of communicating. there is a great opportunity for that. host: why did you decide the career in politics? guest: initially wanted to be a dentist. i love public service and public policy.

it is something you can make a positive difference in your city, state, country. i get very energized about the ability to make a difference. host: are there any parallels between being a dentist in dealing with the budget deficit? guest: yes, every once in awhile you probably need to give the patient a little pain medication. but it definitely reflects what is going on around the country. most states except north dakota and texas are in a deficit. this is an economic collapse we have not seen since the second world war. this is a moment where we just have to deal with. it is not unreasonable for state governments to live on 97% of what they were doing produces. caller: i am a registered

republican and was trying to get in on the independent line. i am a retired state california employee. i told the governor not to raise my taxes. if the illegal immigration thing is encouraged by the government because clinton passed the law -- because the mexican consulate has roving consulates, of a hand up this matriculate forms so that they can get a driver's license. we have to apply when i registered to vote, the first time i did, i filled up the application in the persian read it over and asked for my naturalization papers were -- and asked where was. and i said they were in a safe

place a home. she said she could not register me until she saw them. now anyone can give a funny name and is encouraged by the government. the mayor of los angeles is a honcho. host: could you respond? the stress in an emotional chord with our viewers. guest: yes, clearly the country is a country of immigration but it needs to be legal and reasonable and orderly. we have the technology to create such a system. unfortunately, it has not happened. part of it is enforcing the law. regardless of your feelings on illegal immigration, everyone must agree you cannot have a country that is premised on the

rule of law and then have large segments of society openly flaunting it, ignoring it, or turning the other way. it is extremely corrosive. host: another tweak from a viewer who says he has listened to you want to spend many times. he thinks that you be a great candidate for president in 2012. guest: well, i have 19 months left of my term here in minnesota. i will finish that with diligence. we have a lot of challenges here in my state, but i will try to lend a voice to what i think the republican party needs to do to improve. in forward. i don't think the answer is to have the government take over everything. host: what is the mood of your family if you were to run? guest: i have two daughters and my spouse who have been very

supportive over the years. we understand you do not have to be a politician to serve. there are many other ways to serve through community and charity. i enjoy serving. i like people and the the issues and policy. i'd like to be involved in public policy in some fashion. they have been very supportive. host: we're joined from los angeles. caller: good morning. thank you to c-span. without it i don't know if we would be so informed. secondly, to governor tim pawlenty, i am an african- americans in the mother. i have two boys. my young guest son just graduated from a minnesota college. they are thriving there.

minnesota should be the model of how a state should be run. but i am not a republican. i have to say though that it is a class act the way that you run the state and the city. could you explain to us as a 5- rolled what you do concerning the immigration status in los angeles. i know what you do for the country, but we're struggling now. i am afraid that politicians from both parties in california are afraid to say what should really be done. guest: i cannot speak to the los angeles situation relative to anything unique fare. i know immigration is a huge issue there. -- to anything unique there. i can speak to my situation in minnesota. several cities have adopted

sanctuary notices. they prohibit law enforcement and others from even asking about someone's immigration status in the course of their duties. from the state's stan. we have out what those kind of ordinances. you have to be kidding that you cannot ask as a police officer what someone's immigration status is. but that is a corrosive the affect on the rule of law. that would be one practical thing i think city should remove if they have them. we have to be able to enforce the law and did determine people's legal status if we want to have a rational attempt to enforce our immigration laws in the country. host: good morning caller. caller: it is fantastic to speak with you. how many bills have been passed

in minnesota since the dawn of this whole fiasco with the senate? guest: we have had a whole legislative session since last november. i don't know what kind of bill is you're talking about, but a bunch of them passed. in terms of election reform issues i did veto a bill because i have objections to keep components and no republican voted for it. that might be where you are referring to, but the air earlier caller asked about the cost. most of it has been borne by the two campaigns and lawyers fees, but there has been some extra cost to the cities as they have had to recount and send people to trials.