democratic parliament area system in the future. i believe that is our common denominator. it is not about me. it is about freedom, democracy and human rights. i stand ready to serve them today in that capacity. i have always said finally the day we go to the polls to decide a referendum, to me that will be mission accomplished. and if they choose to play a more prominent role in iran, let them do this then. but right now this is a premature subject as to what i will end up. the point is right now to liberate our country, and that is what i am doing right now. [applause]

>> thank you very much. you have given a couple of examples, but when would you be able to say or what would be the sign or the person who would make the change of heart within the establishment that would signal you that there is something going on within the religious stab -- establishment as well? >> i am maintaining close contact with a highly placed element. we are tirelessly examining every possible scenario of the appropriate time for their own exit strategy. we are not re-inventing the wheel. let me explain the scenario that the security forces of any state that has been repressive, and we saw that in the case of

soviet union and check slav ya. seldom to we see military forces taking initiative. usually it has been refusal to carry out orders of repression by joining the people. i remember messages of mr. yeltsin. this was not a coincidence. it was a part of an evolution of thinking and a peeling away from the collapsing soviet system. we have seen more often than not security forces siding with the people or remaining neutral. you saw that in the 1979 revolution in iran, although they had orders to fire on the people. what is going to be the pivotal moment is three factors.

the resilience and sustain ands of the movement by the people. the fact that elements that want to peel away, to know their backs are not against the wall, that there is another boat they can jump to. dynamics is key. the behavior, taking a position, and much more tacit support than just verbal encouragement by the verbal community is always another factor. and ultimately, how much the more alof the remaining core group trying to hang on to the system, and the division of the ranks itself. it is not an overnight affair. we are not going to wake up tomorrow and see that everybody

in the revolutionary guard is suddenly on the side of the people. the good news is that it has already started, the extent of which i cannot tell you right now. it depends on many factors, and i cannot guess. but this is pretty much the dynamics of change. more often than not, we have seen that. this is not me in isolation that can keep people like her completely isolated. this is a movement now that has blown out of proportion. as i have said to you anecdotally, i have heard reports as late as today coming here, that we have already seen signs of solidarity, and we already have stories of members of the security forces who after their shift, go back home, dress in civilians clothes and rejoin the people on the streets, where five hours ago they were there with clubs. we will have to see how the

dynamics carry out. but the substance of the movement is vital. >> you said that you were in close contact with people at -- military intelligence -- >> i cannot define in detail because it will expose them. [inaudible question] >> you are talking to military cells then, and they are currently making plans to leave the country? >> there are two grooms. those with the regime core anticipating surviveability of the system and their plan. we can guess what that would be, ultimate repression to try to completely silence the masses. the others are contemplating where and how to join it. this is a very delicate matter. we have to do it cautiously.

first of all, not to put them on the spot and expose them. some of which is directly the coordination with them. and the other part will be in what way they would have to implement it in their own ranks. at this point it is under the radar for obvious reasons, but i would anticipate that at some point there will be much clearer positions announced by those who are more visible within the system. because today the moment of truth has arrived in iran. iranians need to know who stand with them and who stands against them. as much as people on streets demand that, elements stuck in this regime know they no longer can beat around the bush. they also have to make their position clear. favoring the likelihood of more

peeling away from the regime rather than the reverse. this is why it is so critical for the iranians to know that throughout this entire process -- and as i say, there might be some ebbs and throws in this movement, but the unconditional continued support for the cause of freedom of human rights in iran by the international community will help this movement and further deteriorate and fragment the regime beyond what it has already started to demonstrate. >> do you have any real information about death tolls, how many people were killed on the streets? by official physician, it doesn't reflect a real level. what is your forecast for the next month? how are events going to develop

? is the geography of the unrest going to expand? >> it is very difficult to have an actual head count because so many of the victim's bodies are dragged to places that even their own families can't recover them. that is part of the contingency of the regime, to hide the number of victims from the public eye and knowledge. so the difficult at this moment to give an actual head count. the victimming are numerous, not just in the main cities, but in the provinces. not all the numbers have been reported by the media, and i am not faulting the media. it is because you don't have perhaps access in iran to get such data. hopefully with today's technology -- and again i would like to express my gratitude to so money, not just the media, but those coming out of the

woodwork to connect and get this information. we may be able to get a better assessment. as for the veracity of the information, i am trying to be careful that the information we receive is accurate. in the middle of the game there are people who try to get cute and exaggerate numbers and things like that. so we are trying to be very cautious about any statistics or numbers that we get. but in principle, to address your question, the numbers have been higher than what has so far been reported. we hope this will not continue in the sense that we will try to encourage, as i said earlier, the security forces to reduce their crack down. what we can't control in any form -- and as i said, there are two elements. how long is it going to continue w the repression, but

also hire thugs by the regime. it has been reported. -- and i know for a fact that in one instance, that rights in the same complex, which was the olympics complex in tehran, there is at least a group of 5,000 people, if not more, who have been specifically trained and kept on ice so to speak to be used if the scenario was to be called for by the regime to use them. i have unfortunately also heard reports that the regime has been importing elements from abroad. from pakistan and from hamas who have been used to crush people on the streets. so how many elements from outside coming in has a direct correlation on how they could utilize them and create more possibility. >> i would like to come back on

a topic. i would like to know if you think that -- would you identify yourself, please? >> do you think that president obama's statement was forceful enough, and do you wish he would condemn more directly the reactions of the actual regime? >> as i said in my press conference, and this is not just directed to president obama, but to old world leaders. if we separate the issue of what could be argued or painted as interference from the issue of standing firm on the question of human rights violations, which there is no reason why this regime or any could object to the fact that

why they are taking a strong stance on that, would make life easier for such heads of state to be able to say what we expect them to say, showing absolutely no remorse or any kind of caution when they stand firm on that question, separating one from the other. let's not have the regime in iran define what is interference and what is not. that is what i hope the white house, state department and other governments and their foreign ministries could absorb and under, that this is expected, and they should have no fear or question in their mind that they would in no form give ammunition to the regime to use. >> but do you personally think that mr. obama was too cautious? >> well, he started on a curve, and i think he is catching up to what his colleagues across

the atlantic who are more force hul have said. president obama himself is showing more connectivity, language and tone with the streets of ran, and that is certainly a good progress, and we encourage and appreciate that as well. >> thank you. >> you mentioned that some elements of hamas are now in iran defending the regime. my question is about hezbollah? are there elements of hezbollah in iran? and a second question, what is your opinion of mouse wie -- mousawi? >> well, the regime will have the ability to call on things they set up years ago.

speaking of hezbollah, there are elements that are recruiting as far as venezuela and colombia members for them. so it is not just in the region. this can they call them for help? evidently they are in some cases. i don't have any specific information on hezbollah, but it has been reported that hamas elements have been called in to help with repression inside iran right now. as i told you, it is no longer a question of a particular candidate. it is about the contingent sinthity of the ballot box, and the legitimacy of the regime as a whole. the fate of people like him lies in my opinion as a clear demarcation from the regime. you cannot on the one hand be a candidate of the people who are

demanding justice and at the same time say you are there to preserve the system. this no longer is tenable. what answer he gives to that question would be my evaluation of whether or not he has actually peeled away from the system with the people. you cannot hedge any more. as we see in my country, it means you cannot want god and data at the same time. you have to pick one or the other. >> in your answer, you leave open the door for future participation in a democratic iran. can you tell us if you have any research today that tells how many people would support you in iran? in other words, in this turbulent time, what is your approval rating? >> well, people support me because the -- because of the

very fact that we are talking the same language, freedom, democracy, human rights, the right to choose and freely elect whoever we deem to play a role. i am not asking people to support me today because of me. i am demanding people support me so that i can best serve them to achieve their goal, which is freedom. again, for the umpteenth time i say if there was a choice in iran of the people saying we want mr. pahlavi, after we can decide for ourselves, if we want him sloffed, we will hear that answer then. that question right now is irrelevant to what we need to be doing now. i have just as many supporters

who are republicans and who would want to have a republican iran, but would support me committed to bring everyone under the same flag to fight a common cause for freedom. this is not about an ideology or institution. this is about democracy and human rights. this is what i am standing for. this is my unique platform. it is not about an institution or the past. it is about where we are now and where we want to go. and i leave that debate to the rapian people once they elect their candidates to debate in the constitution ultimately came form of government they want to have. but i sincerely don't believe this is today's debate. at least the people i talk to are not focused now on let's talk about our party affiliation or our socio economic program. no today the first priority for us is freedom, and we are there

to guarantee the fact that no iranian will be left behind, in his choice or vote. that is imperative. we are fighting first and foremost for that right to freely decide. i stand with 60 million iranians against the system. and that is where we all stand on the subject. [applause] >> i have question about the numbers that are coming out to these rallies. we have heard mixed reports about how many actually are attending both in iran or from outside. do you have any numbers or whether they have changed over the past week and whether you see them growing over the next few days? >> the numbers have been quite high.

>> i think it has been perhaps the biggest gatherings that i remember ever in the history of iranian politics, not just in tehran, but the overall numbers of people being out there. and not just because of a political campaign or an election campaign. now the call on the streets is everybody saying we want freedom. this is well beyond elections now. this is about the sanctity of the ballot box, the flagrant stealing of a vote not because necessarily of this or that candidate. iranians say we have had it. how long are we going to put up with this situation? this is the spirit of this movement, which has grown well beyond an exercise in a process that always -- that has always

been phony. no iranian ever believed in the legitimacy of the elections. the world media would say iran is more democratic than surrounding countries because at least they have elections. well, the soviet union had elections, did that make them democratic? no. now it has grown. it is grown beyond a camp. it is not about those are supporters of one candidate or another. this is about all iranian people who support freedom and are by default and definition against this theocracy which has lost any last shred of dignity it could claim.

the maverick has come off, and the regime is moving pretty much in the direction of it becoming a complete police state and dictator ship. irrespective of whether it is religious or non-religious, it is just the nature. in terms of collective grass root movement, it is movement as i am speaking to you today more and more in terms of participation. that is the natural conclusion of the effect of people moving away from a regime that has lost legitimacy. >> i am full of questions today. >> you are. >> i was wondering if you could speak about the trouble going on with the religious clerics and the whole idea of sanjani

who went to move them and getting arrested? we have heard some of the items speak out against them. >> thank you for that question. this is a very good point you raise. i think that all prominent voices within the clerical hierarchy both inside and outside iran -- and when i say outside, i specifically hope that ayatollah will step in. it is a moment where i anticipate more and more members of the traditional clergy, who were outside of the system, would perhaps also be more encouraged to make

clearler statements. not just on mr. ayatollah ali khamenei, but on the fact that what he created back in 1979 goes against the principles of shiite islam. the clerics believe it is not the responsibility of the clerblingy to govern. they have been saying that from day one. some of them after saying such things put under house arrest. one was tortured in prison as i am standing here speaking to you. i have sent an open letter and appealed to the international committee to have a look into his case. this is a regime that doesn't pity a member of their own, let alone anyone else. this has become a define moment for clerics, not just in the

interests of the nation, but in the interests of the faith to show its complete demarkation from the system. i think we can anticipation that too. >> my understanding is that there are a fair amount of differences between iranians and the -- iranians in the countryside and those in cities. what proportion of the population live in cities and what do they represent the population of iran? >> i am sorry? >> to what extent do the protestors represent the total people of iran? >> you have people of all walks of life walking in the streets streets, representing every aspect of society, even including clerics and members of the militia that are part of the system, who also show solidarity or some kind of coordination or come policity. it is very broad-based.

it is not just limited to a group of students. it is all walks of life in our society that are in collective defines over this issue. >> as you know, musavi was a member of the republican guard and had to be selected by the clerics in order to run. do you really feel this is about the election and the corruption in the ballot box, or what we are seeing in the streets is the final straw on the back of a pressure cooker of people yearning to be free? >> iranians will examine with scrutiny after the dust settles, so to speak, everyone's track record one way or the other. what is important is to remain

focused on the job at hand. today we are not going to be judgmental about people. i'm not going to be judgmental about anyone who today wants to be with the people of iran. let the peel at the end decide who belongs and who doesn't in a position of political framework or responsibility. this is not our argument tonight. our argument today is anyone -- and i welcome anybody else who has been part of the system, if they choose today to join with the people in a realistic way, not just by words but by actual proof to earn people's trust that you are really on our side, to join that group, i welcome that. i encourage it. this is what this is all about right now. we know as long as this regime is there, as long as the system is in place, we will not see as

a nation the light of day. we know this regime must go. many iranians have tried. rewind the tape back to 15 or 20 years ago with the hope that reform may be at least attempted. remember the administration? they attempted it. it did not work for obvious reasons. so now, there's no question that iranians under clearly that the only way we are going to rid ourselves of all of our problems is a matter of this regime's ultimate collapse. that is what we demand. that is what we want to see happen, and this is our moment of truth. this is the other for iran after today. so anyone today in solidarity

with the demand of a nation, and iranians will speak more and more, even in the span of one week, ladies and gentlemen, i am sure that as media, you have seen that the demand that started on saturday, june 13, one day after the 12th of june, and i contrast the statements coming from iran initially to today, you will notice that in the span of just a week, how quickly more and more people have been telling you. i have heard some of it through your own broadcasts. aside from derek reports to me. more and more people are saying what this is really all about. and it will only become more and more, and these testifying will become more and more

prevalent. also under that there is still legitimate mately for many iranians, an atmosphere of fear to some extent. not of standing up and dying for their cause. they are doing so. but perhaps fear of expression that gives the regime the excuse to pinpoint them down. the collective movement will make people's lips or mouths open up even more. again, part of that success ten ands, and we will see more and more of that coming out. >> thank you. >> we are several numerous e-mails from iran, a than they are requesting why isn't the world treating the government of iran the same as