reporter of the magazine talks about national security. "washington journal" it is next. ♪ host: president obama returned from camp david a little later this morning, and tomorrow he will introduce the post 9/11 g.i.. bill. it will be a busy month in august to run the country for the president and his cabinet. also, members of congress on health care issue. we will look to follow the president a bit, and hit some town hall meetings with members of congress through the month as they continue to talk about the big health-care issue. we're reading in "the n.y. times" this morning, there are 1.5 million americans who will run out of unemployment benefits.

calls are rising to pass another extension this fall. it is sunday, august 2, lots to talk about on this three-hour edition of the show, including a piece by the cia director, leon panetta. he tells congress and his own agency that it is time to move on. stop dwelling on past mistakes of the cia. move on to protect the country. we want to get your thoughts. here is the headline to this editorial today. "congress and the cia, time to move on." last month leon panetta said that a meeting overseas of the intelligence surviveservice chid

a western ally pulled him aside and asked why the cia is a concern with the past when the most pressing concerns are in the present? leon panetta said that is a good question. he said that especially in congress it threatens to distract the cia from its crucial core missions. later in the peace, -- later in the piece writes that early in the states the obama administration made policy changes that ended controversial practices. it no longer operates black site or employes enhanced interrogation techniques. he writes that it is worth remembering that the cia employment presidential decisions and does not make the. -- does not make them. those conflicts fuel a climate of partisanship that intelligence officers and our

country would be better off without. michael as directors to do all i can to build the kind of dialogue and trust with congress essential to our intelligence mission. we wil-- he said that that is hs goal. good morning, i'll pass a, texas. what you make of this piece? caller: well, i do not believe that you can just move on from what has been done in terms of the interrogation. and the mishandling of the iraq war. there needs to be some type of justice towards the people responsible for things done during the bush administration, and only until some are prosecuted in found guilty and we can the kind of a tone for the sins committed within the

iraq war, can we move on. you cannot just forget about crimes of the past and just move on, sweep it under the rug. host: leon panetta goes on to write, and the spirit of building dialogue and tressed, on june 24, i briefed the oversight committees of congress on a highly classified program that had been brought to my attention the day before. unfortunately, rather than providing an opportunity to start a new chapter in

relations, the meeting sparked a fresh round of recriminations about the past. the move on now to tucson, arizona, republican caller. caller: hello. host: what do you make of this? caller: well, i think that we better do is go back to the idea that freedom and choice is what america has thrived on, and spread it around the world.

going back to government control and everybody in taking all our money is not going to solve anything. host: caller, it is over to the sentiment by the cia director that it is time to move on to the business of protecting the country and not dwell on the past. caller: absolutely, absolutely. we are in a place where nobody has ever been before, and going back to the past is not going to help. host: thanks for calling. pablo on the line for democrats from brownsville, texas. caller: there are issues that have never even been discussed. host: like what?

caller: there is a lot of secrecy and the cia and it goes back to a lot of people in my family who are now gone and not on this earth, but they worked for the defense department. there is something critical here. do we want the truth on everything? we want accountability. accountability to the people, our congress, and to our president. period. it is that simple. god bless you c-span for everything you do for public information and for freedom of speech. host: new jersey, on the independent line. leon panetta says it is time to move on. caller: i agree. i agree that it is time to move on. many of the laws we had on the books were outdated. many things done by the congress and president or changes to our

laws and intelligence gathering capabilities. so, it was evident we were not legally prepared to protect the country with what was going on then. while the laws were changing, bush and his people were not good is it back and wait for another attack. if the administration in power no ever had a surprise attack like the one the bush administration did, i am sure there would go as far as they can to reach to try to protect the country. the same people i hear calling and talking about the rule of law and how we have to do this because it is the law, well, there are millions of illegal immigrants in the country now and i do not hear them complain about those people breaking the law. the bush administration, what they did was protect the country. they did not do it for political favor. they were not trying to cheat at the other party. they were trying to protect american lives. host: a little more from mr. leon panetta here. this is in today's edition of

"the washington post." leon panetta says to congress and his own cia, time to move on. new jersey, on the republican line, vinny. caller: that lasts caller actually stole my thunder. i was there at 9/11, saw the two planes at the towers. i was pretty upset. with the bush administration did -- and the last caller hit on every note, was to protect the country. a lot of people do forget that. people who have not witnessed

what i did, those two plants going in, and destroying those towers and watching them crumble, was absolutely devastating. it is a vivid memory. i always re-live those planes hitting the stores. the bush administration having done what it did to protect the country -- host: things come vinny. here is a caller now from dallas, texas. caller: i have to tell you, i hope all the colors -- callers of the democratic party here my phone call. i am fed up. this is the last straw. we have majority in congress and in the senate and house, we

have the president -- when barack obama, president, ran for office, he promised to bring transparency to our government. i am really fed up. i'm fed up with bailouts. i want health care to pass, but we cannot even get our own democrats in line to move the agenda. i am voting against every democrat -- well, i am the state of texas, but i am voting against every democrat that comes up on any ticket. i am done. we cannot even support our own president? we cannot even have transparency. leon panetta the is completely wrong on this issue. i am dumb. we have had our chance. the majority of congress, the house of -- i am done. if we cannot even satisfy the

democratic voices that were heard in the election -- the host: thanks for calling in, jerry. here is a message from twitter. we are asking your thoughts on this column by leon panetta this morning. there's lots more in the paper to talk about on the sunday morning. "the new york daily news" follows up on major problems patch la guardia, which was evacuated for three hours. this is the brave cops dick down a deranged drifter with a fake bomb and a deranged steer just

as he pressed a button on what look like a detonator. the device turned out to the batteries and wire wrapped with tape. this is from "the usa today" roadside bombs ripped through their patrol while a french soldier died in a gunbattle north of the capital. there is also this piece about afghanistan. this is from the uk. it says that afghan mission falls short of expectations, and this is from a report from lawmakers. it says it has delivered much less than promised. this is from an influential committee of lawmakers. without a clear strategy stabilizing afghanistan and have become considerably more difficult than might otherwise have been the case. this came out this morning. back to the phones. charles, an independent caller from kansas.

would you make regarding leon panetta's comments? caller: i think what he is really trying to say -- and we have all heard stories and there probably true about the cia, big brother, some of the things they have done -- i think he is trying to say let's put the past behind us. there is a saying that only prostitutes and drunks looked at. i trust this man to give credibility back. -- -- they are the only ones who look back. i really do trust leon panetta to do the right thing. host: good morning. caller: it is hilarious to your obama voters, the little nazis who try to tell us for eight

years that bush was hitler -- yet we're still alive. dick cheney is right. all democrats are cowards. they know that if they release the truth will set everything that the bush administration did protected america. believe me, as a republican american, any democrat including obama who lived through the last day years for anything that president bush did -- they are not worth saving. you get leon panetta and all the rest of these democrats and they have not done anything to protect this country in their entire lives. we listen to all these veterans that say how great obama is, after what obama said about them, i believe every word he said about them [unintelligible] host: you can twitter. here is a message from twitter.

michigan, for the line for democrats, sue. caller: good morning, george tenet wrote a book and said the cia never tortured anyone. that was alive. -- that was a lie. leon panetta worse for the american people and we have a right to know what went on. if we do not examine everything this country does in our name, it will keep repeating. that is the way i feel. host: thanks, here's the world page of "the washington times." several stories about iran. iran began its first trial saturday. it is a mass court case against

more than 100 activists accused of plotting a velvet revolution to topple clerical rule. that is the lead there. we will stick with this for a minute. iran media is reporting the rest of three americans. state tv has confirmed that the government has detained three americans, saying they failed to heed warnings from iranian guards. kurdish officials from northern iraq said that two men and one woman were tourists who mistakenly crossed into the territory on friday while hiking into a mountainous area. if we get updates during the show we will get them to you. middletown, new jersey, an independent caller. jimmy, are you there? one more time? let's move on to mike in ohio. what is the name of your town?

caller: lickskillet, ohio. yes, in order to get a clear view of the future we need to get a clear view of the past. this continuation -- that is an old tool from we back. the copenhagen scientists study that said there was nano found in the 9/11 buildings that -- highly explosive military explosive -- i wonder what became of that information? thank you. host: liberty hill, texas, a republican caller. caller: i am really scared about what is going on in this country. fox have a special about how the cia was working during the

bush administration, what a great job they did. i'm tired of these democrats calling in and all this stupid stuff. if there were just watch fox news. thank you. host: ops of economic stories in addition to the health-care issue. here's the front page of the baltimore paper this morning. many states are in the red. maryland is not the only state struggling with its budget. this year has been one of the most difficult and history. and a reuters story from california says that the state's largest employe union voted on saturday to approve a strike authorization measure to protest

for los and pressures did officials to ratify its labor contract. -- to protest furloughs. here they're talking about 1.5 million people over the coming months. they will see their unemployment insurance benefits exhaust themselves, ending for some one has been the last bulwark against foreclosures and destitution. the story points out that because of emergency extensions and acted by congress, led off workers and nearly half the states can collect benefits for up to 79 weeks, the longest. since the unemployment insurance program was created in the 1930's. calls are rising in congress to pass another extension. back to leon panetta piece in the post this morning. ray, on the independent line, and texas. caller: i would say he is right,

that it is time to move on. but we need to get rid of all these naive people. we have to played regain the with the enemy does, otherwise we will lose. one more thing, -- we have to play the way that the enemy does. they are democrats, not democratic. host: more from the papers. this one is from "the new york post." they write that 11 months since the massive $182 billion bailout of aig, the company appears to be foundering.

alexandria, va., tom, on the line for democrats. caller: hello, listen, the cia -- we do not know what they do as a clandestine agents. they are supposed to carry out the procedures of the president. i do not know if they're supposed to follow the constitution or not. they do what they do. we do not know what they're doing. we can only hope they're doing the right thing. the oversight is supposed to be controlled by congress. the me say something before i leave the phone. we have a cancer in this country and it is the republican party. these people are against everything for america. they don't want us to have progress. i do not understand what they're

looking for? we are trying to get health care bill passed. let's try to come together, america. let's stop chastising each other because of the parties we belong to and let's try to come together as people. host: moving on now to alabama. caller: yes, i think -- what i think what he is doing, a good example, he spent money on horses, turtles -- you have people up here who do not know whether next meal is coming from. old people are eating cat and dog food because they do not have enough money to live on. host: caller, let's return to the matter at hand here. caller: that is what kind of thing i think that they have done. host: we appreciate your thoughts. another tweet.

more on the front pages from around the country. this one from new jersey. they point out here that new jersey takes a 7% bite from the fed to be big, but dealerships remain packed. here is the front page from the sun. "denver post" where's says that a small ripple of jobs so far -- 1000 full-time slots are linked to federal aid and it says that thousands more are in the pipeline. supposed to create 59,000 jobs in colorado by the end of 2010. five months into the program stick officials can see fewer than 1000. that is from denver. here is that "send a free press

sunday free press." washington, cecil, on the caller: end in mind thank you for c-span. you are one of the best, paul. i think that you are excellent. one of the things that allowed germany to move on after the tragedy of world war ii was the nuremberg trials. i do not believe that america can move on. i understand mr. leon panetta's concern that he not be held responsible for what the cia has done in the past, that is true. however, we must prosecute those responsible for killing 1 million iraqis into this tragic war we got into. it is not right that bush can go off and do his library think and

live there peacefully in dallas. we need to prosecute. the international court of justice needs to prosecute if necessary in absentia, those responsible for the tragedy of the iraq war. the thing that brought on 9/11 was america's arrogance. it continues today. i'm a 31-year veteran and i say prosecute bush, dick cheney, a rove, and richard perle, and all those responsible for the tragedy america has gone through. host: health care and lots more issues coming up for the rest of the program. we will also focus on social security, the governor races in new jersey and virginia. also, there is "newsmakers" right after this program. he will talk about the cash for clunkers program, today at 10:00

a.m. eastern. oakland, calif. on the line for democrats. caller: hello, i really enjoy your program. as americans we have to give it our head out of the sand. as for the cia and leon panetta, basically, since world war ii we have been getting it wrong. we got wrong in korea through the bay of pigs. in the 1970's and 1980's the intelligence agencies the a lot of dumb operations. we are currently in a war because they got it all wrong. for people to say that we should just move on and not know why we continually get our intelligence wrong -- as for the caller who took the bell bush keeping us save, you know how you really keep a person say? you want them to find out ahead

of time, not after the building has tumbled. at the point when the building tumbled, the military is involved. if we will wait around to have intelligence and let terrorists run in and out of our progracous the terrorist did before 9/11, what is the point of having the cia? we could just say billions of dollars. i do maintenance by trade. i can easily go to a place and fix something, but to really serve my client i need to know why it broke so will not happen again. you can only go back and look at the origins to make sure that it will not be something that can repeat itself. that it was just a one-time thing. i hope president obama will talk

to panetta and get him to understand he needs to take a deep look into the cia to find out where we went wrong. so we will not do this again host. host: the house is now out in the senate remains in session. there will continue work tomorrow on appropriations bills. we expect them to take up that cash for clunkers money, the same the house approved on friday. we do think that tuesday is the day they will begin floor debate on the nomination of a judge at sonia sotomayor for the supreme court. senate coverage through the week on c-span2. hear, this writer writes about the so-called "beer summit" at the white house. he ends by saying that one of us and everyone took away from the conversation about race is the

same we have taken away from every other composition in the past couple of years. america has not transcended r ace. we can all say that again. we're just at the start of what may be a 30-year struggle. beer will not cool the fury of those who cannot accept the reality that america's racial profile will no longer reflect their own. the last call on the cia, lester, north carolina, dean on the republican line. caller: listen, i believe that leon panetta is right. we need to look afford, face the future. but on the other hand, i do not want my central intelligence agency to be pulling teeth out or breaking every bone in someone's body to get answers. i used those two terms for attacking the body because of

the report i have seen where one family in iran was given back their son and he was a broken up they could not even recognize him with his teeth was the doubt. we do not want the cia doing that to even our worst enemy terrorists. we can it was certain run- innienditioning get the answers. water boarding is not as bad as some things that can be done to people, but if we really knew everything the cia has done in our past we would probably be revolting and reza begins this country like never before host: stick around or try again later. we have plenty of time left for your calls on various issues. and a couple of minutes we will have a roundtable on all the issues on the table in washington this week.

our guest will be tony fratto, former the pity press secretary for president george w. bush. also, mark plotkin, a political analyst for wtop radio. first, our reporter update on health-care legislation, where they have been and are going from this reporter. >> finally after about two weeks of wrangling some of it in public and a lot of it behind closed doors, the energy and commerce committee was able to vote out its version of the health care legislation. they struck a number of compromises with some conservative democrats on the panel, those known as the blue dogs. after those compromises they approve their version of the bill. >> there's one more senate committee that has not yet reported a bailout, when can we expect that? >> that is an excellent question. we know will stretch into september.

so far we hear deadlines of september 15. we're talking about the senate finance committee. it is believed to be the best prospect for some sort of a bipartisan consensus. the problem is that they have been trying now for a few months and been unable to reach it. they say they need more time. the latest is they have been given a deadline of september 15. we will see. >> your story in the paper talks in general about the campaign against the health care reform. who is leading the battle and what is their strategy? >> it is interesting and a different environment from 1993 with the clintons. many industry players oppose any legislation back then are now trying to participate. but you see objections from them on some of the specific proposals. we have seen advertising from the insurance industry around some aspects.

also, the chamber of commerce and a number of business groups. the retailers. those are the organizations who have had significant problems with some proposals. some of the more traditional ideological groups, more conservative ones, have tended to side with republicans and say they do not like the shape of legislation so far. "washington journal" continues. host: at the table now, mark plotkin, a political analyst for wtop radio here in washington, d.c. and tony fratto, currently contributing editor and atcnbc, formerly deputy secretary for the george w. bush administration. here is this headline in the paper this morning. it says that for nancy pelosi, recess means selling the health plan. but we begin with you, tony.

what do you see happening in august? all of a sudden august is imported. guest: yes, usually it is important by accident, but this time by pimm. members of congress from both sides will be out there tried to talk to people in their district. you'll see lots of campaign- style ads to sway public opinion concerning the president's health care reform. it is something to host: follow what would it take for republicans to win this battle? guest: win might be the wrong way to think about it. republicans do want some kinds of reform. there want to push the positive message. the problem for democrats is they do not have a unified bill they can talk about to sell to citizens. they have the various ideas.

we are still in the sausage making effort we shall see here in washington. host: let me read a quote from this piece. it is from the spokesman for the national republican campaign committee. nancy pelosi has become alive building. her popularity is waning, affecting her ability to legislate within her own caucus. first speech to the health-care part of this, and then move it forward. guest: republicans feel they have a political stroke available to them in terms of if the president does not get the health care reform bill through, then they cannot govern well. in fact, it was centered dement of south carolina who said that

this is president obama and waterloo. bill kristol, a republican banker, supposedly, said the we have to kill it. -- republicans thinker. democrats will accuse republicans of using this as a political weapon. i am sure the republicans will say, no, we're just trying to make sure the health care reform legislation in specifics is valuable and worthwhile. in terms of man to plaza, look, issues from san francisco, a california liberal. brigid in terms of nancy pelosi. the cannot replace ted kennedy, are thor the

counterpart for newt gingrich. each party chooses a villain. the try to inspire people by saying that person is the personification of that political party. host: our guest will be here with us for just under one hour. if you want to call in, called this. we have lots more from our guests, but we wanted to hear from the speaker herself. she held a news conference on friday afternoon. here is a minute from that. what she saw as the accomplishments of the session so far. >> to we are this week in committee about to move closer to health care reform than ever in history. when we have our third committee report on the bill. on that note in passing the

renewed csh for clunkers legislation, we go home in august to promote health care reform and informed the public of the considerable accomplishments of this congress. right from the start we passed an economic recovery package, the largest in history. 100 days later, we passed the president's budget. in between the president signed legislation ,schip for children, lilly ledbetter. our colleagues will address these more specifically. we have the economic recovery act to begin with, helping americans save their homes. edward kennedy served america act.

then 100 days later, the budget. the president called for three pillars to turn around economy, investment, education and health care, and a new energy policy for america. we did just that. host: gentlemen, she laid it out there. let's begin with tony fratto. moving on with health care -- has it been a productive congress? guest: they have been able to pass some significant pieces of legislation i'm sure they see as significant for them. by all accounts the should have been able to do that with the large majorities in both the house and senate. something mark was saying about the leadership in congress and the democratic caucus -- we solve this debate of liberals and moderates and the board. it was a strategy a rahm

emmanuel in the election last year to go out and conservative districts and not care to much about where these members were on certain policy issues. there were elected and relatively conservative districts. some of the issues that speaker pelosi highlighted will be problems in 2010. they are forcing these guys to get out and walk the plank on tough issues that they then have to contend with with more conservative or moderate members in their districts. guest: welcome tony is right, there is a 38-seat majority in the house. they had 60 democrats if you and sanders and joe lieberman. julie berman does stray and try

to assert his independence, though. i am old enough -- joe lieberman does a straight and but independently sometimes. but i'm old enough to remember that the party is not a monolith. it used to be that there were a southern committee chairmen on the democratic party, some who were terrible on civil rights, but controlled the flow of legislation. if you look at them in terms of the health reform bill, they are led by liberals such as george miller. and christopher dodd in the senate. then we have someone like max baucus. it seems to me that what is happening is you have to get 218 and the house and 60 in the

senate, and it does not change. they have made some small achievements. it took me about 11 minutes to say one thing they have not done is past the washington, d.c. voting rights act which the republican administration said they would veto. it it passed in the senate with only one democrat leaving. that is max baucus. 21 democrats voted for some gun amendments. in 2007 the bill passed with only six democrats leaving the fall. that would be a great legislative achievement to provide for the first time voting representation in the district of columbia for the house of representatives. the public does not realize that

the 575,000 people in this city do not have a vote in the house. to be fair, there were 22 republicans who voted for it in 2007. in terms of the general thing, it seems to me they always want to get to conference. they want to move the bill. the house and senate bills will be different. then, in conference the president will be acted to try to get his way, and hopefully to progressives, they will get their way. the more conservative elements would drop off. host: on wtop radio, a mark plotkin host a program at 10:00 a.m. until 12:00 a.m.. tony fratto currently runs a program here in town for crisis management. on the republican line, matt.

caller: the far left only represents 20% of the voting population, but somehow they control the lead positions in government. therefore, they write all these bills that 80% of the voters do not agree with. the moderate wing of the democratic party is letting these people running amok. they are blaming republicans for killing the bills when the liberals, if they would just leave out some of this rhetoric like public-paid abortions, would get a no pass. it is frustrating. how did they get such control? what do they control the democratic party seemingly? host: thank you.

guest: for the law, i forgot henry waxman which will inspire you even more, of the 34 left committee chairman which you would probably describe as such. they are there because of seniority. the have gotten reelected and have become chairmen. in the senate, senator kennedy, if you were not ill would have been the center of the health committee. senator max baucus is also important, but many democrats did not feel he is a true democrat. independent voters are the most crucial in terms of general elections. as tony said, the legislative process is sausage-making. some good, some bad -- no one will be totally satisfied.

but i do think president obama will sign a bill and it will be called "the health care reform bill." not everyone will be happy. but they have been trying to do this since harry truman. guest: the reason that very liberal chairman head committees -- both parties have done an effective job going through redistricting cycles. we re-draw district lines. both republicans and democrats have put keep members in safe districts. --key members in six districts. that is where the longevity comes from. and addressing your the they lead up to these positions and find themselves out of step with members who come from more competitive districts -- and it

keeps them in these positions. guest: it is really the incumbent preservation or both parties make a deal -- do not tamper with my district because we both want to return to serve in office. redistricting is done by state legislatures who are very partisan. it should not be done by political parties, but by private citizens or judges. some who are not so intensely political. host: next call from iowa on the independent line. caller: yes, i have a question about the public option. it sounded really good when all this began. but i have been hearing reports that is basically nonexistent now. host: can you give us an update?

guest: when the speaker of the house was talking about selling the health care bill, still talking about the public option. it is not clear the senate will go for it. it is moving more towards what senate yourconrad is calling healthcare coops. there are proponents in the house for this. it is hotly contested. i look at it from an economic standpoint. i see it as the first step towards a government-run program. you can call it whatever you like, but it is hard to go out and say the government should not be running your health care at the same time you're proposing government insurance.

it will be a dumping ground for businesses. guest: i feel on firm ground if i will quote a nobel laureate. you should read the article it is to labilepaul krugman. i thought it was the clearest explanation. -- if is bypaul klugman. he opened it up by saying that a house member from south carolina was flailed -- look, do not take away my it medicare, thinking it was not a government program. it ensures people 65 and older. then medicaid it ensures people in terms of health who are very poor. schip is for children. president obama is correct. it makes the private insurance

companies honest. it forces them to compete. max baucus does not wanted. it will probably end up with a coop that we do not thathow it work. but making republicans constantly say, look, the government cannot do anything, is terrible, inefficient, wrecking private enterprise -- but they are scared of the efficiency. 47 million people do not have insurance. for the first time america is trying to cover everyone as an advanced society. not everyone will be covered at the same level and quality, though. guest: guess, we do have a large portion of our population in

government health care. everyone agrees that if we're talking about the verypoor, children, seniors, we can all agree that the government should have a role in providing health care. but getting into the vast middle is a problem. especially, if you are going to give an insurance company you will set up -- you will see that program will take all the space because it has advantages and how it defines itself, how it recruits citizens to be part of the program. guest: why are there 47 million uninsured people? guest: there are lots of reasons, lots of differences among that group. there are different ways to put reform into place. it does not mean you have to put government-run health care in place.

guest: why do they refuse people with pre-existing conditions? guest: that is a good question. there's no question that those do cost more to the system. guest: so, they should not have health care? guest: no, i'm not even opposed to a mandate. that said, you need to account for the economics of the delivery. someone has to pay for. who'll pay for the increased costs for someone with a pre- existing condition? it is not free. that is the debate we need to have. guest: this health care policy is a melange. what you have is that insurance companies are for-profit entities. guest: not all of them.

there are many insurance companies out there are already not-for-profit companies. so, why does the government need to come in? guest: but there are a substantial number of large insurance companies for-profit, and doing well. host: let's invite back of years. dallas, tx ,t.j. on the line for democrats. caller: well, i would like to asktony -- i have heard the same rhetoric. i'm 76 years old. i have heard the same rhetoric forever from republicans, however, it seems to be worse now.

now it seems they're totally against anything the democrats stand for. they are so determined to roll back the new deal. they have the right logo. rolling back the new deal? is that right? guest: no, i do not think so. republicans do recognize there is an appropriate role for government in certain cases. it is a rare public official here in washington who will say we should not have some kind of retirement program, or some kind of health insurance program. the question is, how to do it in the most efficient way? what is the most appropriate

role for the private sector? we know that the private sector does deliver services and the most efficient way. host: as a deputy press secretary under president george w. bush, tony fratto had to steer down the washington press corps. you recently said that they are "enablers." guest: i do an award-winning commentary every thursday. you only have to win one award. i will give a shame usplug for my station. i watched the recent press conference. first of all, i have criticism of the president. before, during the transition, he would come out and never let the appointees speak. i found that to be a bit odd. i am old enough to remember

presidents the mortgages. moving to what you asked, i remember a time when the might yes, presidents have it favors, but people would raise their hands, and the president would call on people. he did not have a list of the anointed few he would call on. all the press people sit there as a manikins and asked the questions of the day. there are never any surprising questions. they accept this protocol of not asking questions. yes, the president used to call them favorites. but this almost seems scripted. they are called and told that you will be allowed to ask a question. i think that there should be a rebellion. some courageous press person

should stand up and say, mr. president, i have a question. the worst offender is robert gibbs, the press secretary, who only calls on the tv people in a row, asks them to do follow-up questions, and then anyone considered obstreperous -- so, i think they are enablers. they let president obama dictate the subject of the day. there really is not the performing of their role. host: you sat in the room and worked with the last president. ah m theyannequins, these press people? guest: no, they are at the top of their profession. there are enormous changes going on in news media. for one thing, there are fewer

people in the room there are fewer members of the white house correspondent a suspicion than 20 years ago. guest: why? didn't president bush do the same thing? the names, there really is offensive to me, that certain people are anointed to speak and the others are supposed to sit there and not ask a question. guest: the people who are called the and do not know ahead of time they will be -- the guest: you never called announcement to entertain a question? guest: no, but the president did have a listing would work from. you would see movies about this. you see this incredibly chaotic scene of people jumping up in their seats. guest: that is what a free press is supposed to do. a rebellion, a revolution.

guest: but they do ask pretty good questions. guest: you obviously had a role in planning it and i do not mean in the conspiratorial fashion. are there certain people you: and certain people you will exclude? guest: there are limited number of news organizations. . .

minutes left with our guest. scott is on the republican line. caller: i would like to comment on the healthcare issue. one of the guests mentioned the wordville an and how parties need someone they can name the vilan. the president and the democrats want to name the insurance companies as the bad people. as you know meeting about a month ago with drug companies and insurance companies, they seem to work out a deal with the ena and drug companies.

for whatever reason they couldn't do it. since you won't do what we need you to do, we are going to call you the villan. that seemed a little over simple to me. i have never heard of insurance companies making a profit. we never heard of the gouging on the profits. why would they make out the insurance companies to be the bad guys. the math doesn't work. if you can explain it. >> you are right. the ama which was against medicare in 1965 is supporting it. they made some cost concessions.

the insurance company is the easy target. what they want to do so say, look, some of the practice that insurance companies have done just won't be allowed in a capitol is tick system because we are excludeing people. we want everybody covered. that's the concept. >> one of the biggest problems we have is accidental history. this goes to the post war period of price control, wage controls where employers needed to find some other way to compensate workers and couldn't do it through wage increases and added on health insurance benefits. that's why we have this system.

the difference is that americans buy the other incidences themselves. the difference is that most americans never see or have the choices. they have the offers their employer is able to negotiate for them and never see the cost of what is being paid. host: there was a plan to tax

benefits. 47 million people don't have insurance. the labor unions which are a big factor didn't want this. harry reid said he didn't want this. that's why it doesn't exist. there's a case to be made for taxing "cadillac plans." ahead of goldman sax. >> that's actually the royals royce plans. they are such a tiny part.

caller: as an independent, i feel both parties are going down the road. what should happen is you should designate who is universal. 18-64. from there, you establish a health saveings account for each person and attach their children under 18 to each one of those. you take the medicare money that's going out. the $260 billion a year and credit that to each person 18-64. from there, their employer, whatever they are kicking in can also be credited to that account. host: financing healthcare.

complicated stuff here. what's the best approach? >> it is really tough. on financing medicare, it has been a successful program but not one that has done much to obtain cost. it has actually been a cost driver. it has proved to be completely impossible to rid of waste and high expense and wasted views. each time the government tries to put in place measures to cut spending as they are talking about doing today, congress comes back when it is time to make the cut, it repeals it. it's difficult to manage cost. to raise revenues. some would have to come from general revenues.

i really believe in making the tax treatment of health insurance between individuals and employer provided coverage. it's a clear way to do it. >> he wanted to say that those people who made over $280,000 would have to pay more. but 95% of the population wouldn't. i guess they are go have to be realistic. if i'm ready to pay taxes so more people can have insurance. it has to be a cooperative process for people in this advanced society. the only ones in the world that gives themselves that title has

everybody insured. it's going to cost them more. now americans are saying, that's the path to socialism or european social welfare. if you are going to provide these benefits, you have to pay for them. in some way, i don't think the president or either party has been straight up about saying if you want these benefits, you have to pay for them in a certain way. it's not an image yik bullet. even has to bear the burden. host: it looks like we'll be debating this for about a month or two. >> host: it's pointing out that

there are 1.5 billion people in the country. calls are out to pass an extension yet again. >> absolutely. people who don't have money to eat and live are going to take other means. in the past, the economy has recovered so thatñw the benefi haven't been exhausted to the same degree and haven't had to be extended. when do you say to these people. many of them, it's not like they walked off their jobs. they have to be sustained. >> i think congress will probably pass an extension again. they probably will pass an extension. people need to under the trade

offs. it will -- a lot of those people who have fallen off the employment roel. we can expect unemployment to stay in a double digit for some time. >> people need to understand the states vary. what is given in mississippi in terms of longevity.

host: caller, you are on the air. caller: it took a long time. thank you. the point you need to realize. healthcare. something needs to be done about it. i'm a truck operator. i own one truck now. i heard both you talking. do any one of you guys know anybody personally that had insurance that needed surgery done and couldn't get it done but they have been paying into their system all their life. found out they were going to die in 30 days. this is what is happening in america right now as we speak. people are crying, people are dying because they can't get a

surgery done. why don't everybody man up -- i'm going to tell you what healthcare is about. it's about racism and race. you got the spanish over there covering for minimum wage and you are saying we are not covering them. let's be real. don't worry about this coming from a black man but worry about this coming from#g an american o wants to help everyone. >> i know someone who lacked health insurance and did get medical procedure that seems to be the more usual situation. we do pay for the procedures of those without insurance. we all pay in different ways whether it is in higher taxes for government run programs or

higher premiums. hospitals do get funding to provide these services. they generally do especially when it is a life-threatening situation. host: hospitals get money in lew of "uncompensated care." the problem is that people who don't have insurance defer getting treated because they can't pay for the treatment. the emergency room in all of the urban hospitals becomes the primary provider. by the time they get to the emergency room, it gets to the point where it is too late. here is a piece in the "washington post." we started our program this morning about this. he is writing to the congress. time to move on. stop worrying about what the c.

i. a. did in the past. time to move on. we took some calls on this this morning. what do you think about that? >> i think he was a former member of congress and chief of staff. he wants to go forward. i can't completely agree with that. the most serious cases should be prosecuted. >> we are a country at war and these are dangerous times. these agents were out there doing everything they can to

protect the country. it seems like the director has some excellent point there's. there are some things i disa grow with. these are some important points. i hope that the attorney general will get up and read this piece this morning as well. host: john on the republican line. >> tony. listen, i love you. the only problem i have with you is you probably enough coffee. >> my wife would disagree with you. caller: the percentage of profit that health insurance

companies make. no one looks at who is wording all these bills and how all of these are expected. talk about bringing up the past. one thing i do know about ted kennedy, i have never had the issue. him and chris dodd were once the bread ends of a waitress sand witch in rhode island. chris dodd gets a favorable loan from country wide who is now out of business. he wrote the mortgage law was barny frank. i live in a state in a city near buffalo, which is the fourth poorest in the country. now they are going to complain

about this bonus paid to this guy. we have millionaires leaving the state by the droves. i am reasonably employed. for how long, i don't know. like i said, the fourth poorest city in the country. millionaires are leaving. one point i think will be up rising. there's going to be a strike by california unions. this is going to be one of these water shed moments. unions are killing us right now. new york has 130,000 people -- state workers that are unemployed. >> that was an assembly of a lot of different thoughts. noeg has been said about the loan from country wide. chris dodd is down in the polls.

there is a problem with committee chairman becoming too cozy with the industries that they are regulating. the whole profusion of political action committees that there is supposedly vol untarry contributions. dodd was considered too cozy with the companies. he's also chair of the banking committee of the company he was supposed to chair and have oversight. the ultimate punishment was the non-election or running a very, very tough campaign where before you had a very easy campaign. 0 host: back to the op ed piece. do you think no laws were broken

or that the laws don't apply to the executive branch? >> i think the executive branch went through the process of getting an executive opinion as to when was legal and what was not legal. that was the appropriate way to go about it. i believe that the legal opinions were sound. unless there are cases of individuals who violated the law as it was laid out, these people were following the law. we have to remember, what they were trying to do, which is to find the individuals and gather information. these people are heroes for trying to protect this country and trying to ensure that we have another terrorist attack in this country. these same people and some at the fbi disrupted another

potential terrorist plot in north carolina in resent weeks. these people are getting up every morning and night with the idea of trying to find those individuals who would try to harm and kill americans. host: scott on the independent line. good morning. caller: just wanted to say we cannot continue going forward with the american public being deprouded by the health insurance industry. as far as industry is concerned. american businesses can look to the bankruptcies of gm and chrysler and see why there's a reason why they were buried under the burden of the healthcare industry. health insurancers in particular who have 31% of waste being lost

and theirover head and massive salryes. if it's possible for us to compete in global industry, it's only possible for health insurancers. there's a reason why most other large nations has done away with health insurancers. appreciate it. host: michigan now on the democrat line. you are on. caller: hello. i have a question about the health insurance companies. they say they keep costs down. i have heard no vehicle that's been put in place to see they do this. if they pinky swaer, that's not enough for me. i watched a hearing from all the representatives. they said they would still drop

people if they became ill. they made their money by their paying in. i don't know why there's an issue. these people need some competition. >> there are ways to get competition and ways to deliver so that they can compete for americans in a way that can increase cost so that everyone gets covered. the easiest thing for most people to say is let's just let the government do it. we have to understand there are enormous costs not just in terms of how many dollars there are to do it but in terms of the treatment of americans and the care they are going to get. host: some criticism given to the democrats not leaving too

much up to congress. when do you make of that? >> the example is the clinton healthcare plan where they wrote the plan and presented it to congress and said here it is. pass it. they took the alternative, which is let congress come up with a plan and now we are becoming very washington in this conversation. where he will get into the specifics is in the conference committee. the house version will be different from the other version. i think he will dive in at that point and say this is acceptable, this is not. this is acceptable. this is not. his impact will be felt during the conference committee, not in the house. host: presidential politics, washington times front page.

what should, if anything, be different about the way your party goes about its business? >> that is such a long way off. they have to. they have to plan for their primaries. if you remember in the last cycle, there were a lot of states rushing to the front of the line to try to have as big an impact as they could on the presidential nomination process. it's difficult. you have states with tradition and some state was schedules that they need to maintain. whatever cast of potential candidates are out there they are going to adapt to the primary schedule. the election schedule will start earlier. it will be more expensive as it always is. it will be an incredible test of the eventual nominee. at the end of the day, the

primary schedule hasn't really altered who the eventual nominee or candidate is. host: in kaufl a talk about the future there. here's what he has to say. >> i want to talk about some breaking news. there's some developing news coming across the wire and tv sets. apparently, they are announcing that president obama is making great progress on climate change. he's turning the political climate of our country back towards republicans. [applause] host: would he make a good -- a tough opponent for president obama in 2012? >> not presently. he's trying to be this sort of wal-mart, working class

republican. i don't think it would ring very well. he's from minnesota, which is a democratic state. it's very open. i'm sure because he's not running for reelection views himself as presidential. i don't see it. host: too early to name names? >> too early. i have enormous respect for the governor of minnesota. he's a terrific representative of the party. host: one last call on the issues of the day. mary from florida on the republican line. caller: the abortion issue. clinics will close here if they

pass this. what happens if i like my insurance. i don't want any other insurance. i'm on medicare too. >> they can't take your medicare away. that is a government program. the government pays for medicare. a lot of medicare users don't realize that. this is a perfect example of a government program that -- i started the conference with this -- that cannot be taken away from you. if you are over 65, you get medicare, period. >> the number of seniors who think that medicare is not a government program or that it can be taken away is really tiny. most seniors i've come across know exactly what medicare is and who pays for it and how it is paid for and what they get for it. in terms of a choice for

healthcare for those below the age ever 64 or 65 and eligible for medicare. if there's a public option, lue see employers making that the only option for employees. there will be changes that will make that economic decision to dump their employees into the public plan. that probably won't be the best thing for those workers. host: tony, a contributing editor for cnbc and former press secretary for president obama bush and mark, thank you for joining us this morning. >> thank you for having me. >> thank you. host: coming up, a little later from the hot line, we'll talk about political races specifically the governor's

races in virginia and what they mean nationally. we'll go to the phone when we come back. >> tuesday, the full senate debates the nomination of sonia sotomayor. q and a tonight, the book "i am murdered" by bruce chadwick.

>> today, joining discussion on race relations. "eyes on the the prize" that's on book tv. >> monday night, c-span 2, the communicators with david cohen. host: talking a little more on the "new york times" lead story about ending the jobless. they point out that prolonged aid to unemployed is uning out. 1.5 million people are facing a cutoff. calls are going in to the white house asking for help.

this piece says over the coming months as many as 1.5 million jobless americans will exhaust their benefits ending for some what was the last fight against foreclosures and dests9ñ a wave of job seekers is using up even this prolong aid. calls are rising in congress to pass another extension this fall possibly adding another 13 weeks. tens of thousands of workers have already used up their benefits. the numbers are expected to soar

in days to come jump above 1.5 million. first call from pennsylvania on the republican line. john. caller: can you hear me? host: yes. what do you think should be done if these benefits are ending? caller: the question is, what happens if you don't? these are people that are in the workforce. they have your mortgages and children and people to feed. if you do not, you are going to exacerbate the situation. i wanted to get in earlier talking about health benefits. i have a situation where i'm a small business owner, self employed contractor. i didn't have insurance at the

time i was doing some work on a rental property i have. i cut my thumb on my table saw. i went to receive care that night at the emergency room. the doctor that stiched my thumb up told me i needed to have a tendon graph. when i went in to have that done, the doctor did not actually do the procedure. the only thing she did was stich the tendon back together and did not add a piece. as a result, i have no use of my thumb. the type of care offered to people without insurance is not quality care. these people like me that walk no a hospital and need services are not given the quality care

that people that have insurance are. host: caller, thanks for sharing your thoughts. we want to move on and get more view points on the jobless issue. david from washington. what's your thought on all this? caller: it is a no brainer for the government on this. we have millions of people who have lost their jobs. companies shipping jobs overseas. it would be foolish for all of us to believe we should leave these people to twist in the wind because they can't afford to feedvñthemselves, they then want to resort to violence. we don't want to see people jumping out of windows like the stories go from the 1930's in the great depression. thank you for c-span. one more point.

i know the big issue today is healthcare. it is amazing to me how people don't see how we already have socialized programs. if you are on medicare, over 65, that's socialized healthcare. we already have them in place that we all pay for. it's only fair that the younger ones, my age and younger actually paying for medicare for our seniors, those that come before us should actually get a piece of that. host: jack from florida. independent caller. what do you make of these conditions and unemployment rising to double digits? should congress get involved? caller: i feel for these people.

how long should we extend these benefits? i also want to say something about healthcare. i am concerned about all the agency that's will develop to oversee what they do. host: caller, jumping back to the unemployment. you said how long should this go on? what is your sense of how long the government should extend these benefits? caller: i was out of work too where i completed my unemployment for 26 weeks at the time. way shut off. i understand times are bad now, everybody is paying for this. there is so many programs the government is paying for. where does it end? >> the "new york times" piece says benefits now a lifeline for 9 million americans. payments over $300 a week

varying on work history. large numbers have been unable to find work for a year or more calls are in to pass another extension possibly adding 13 weeks of coverage. as of june, the nation will rate was 9.5%. from south carolina on the republican line. should congress get involved again? caller: yes, they should. we have a huge group of people that a lost us, i'm one of them, have tried to extend our benefits. we have succeeded at that. it is coming towards an end now.

there's new people becoming unemployed. did the american businessmen actually sit and think about the future when they took most of the manufacturing jobs over to china. even if they got the tax breaks. i prefer formed a job for 28 years. that job was taken to china a year ago. april 4, 2008, was my date of employment. i have been reeducated as a displaced employees. now i am a contractor and i am on my own with health insurance

and retirement. we are on our own. i have to stop and be really proactive about myself. host: a twitter writing start cutting taxes on small business if you want an uptick in employment. back to the phone. jan? caller: i am approaching the end. where else will be go? host: what are continues there

in charlottesville? caller: they are ok. but the universities need to step up and start hiring people. host: what do you think about the stimulus situation? caller: i'm not sure i can get an extension. i've gotten it for 26 weeks. many of us are calling the unemployment commission. they are saying you'll get a letter. what does that mean? how long will i have to go without benefits before they start kicking in again. host: in 2008, 33 extra weeks were provided. earlier this year, congress provided that. the president obama stimulus plan provided an extra 20 weeks

in statesánñ where unemployment surpassed 8%. south carolina did not make the changes. benefit there's are running out more quickly. subsidizing the health benefits. host: calls in to increase or extend jobless benefits. what do you think should happen? caller: i think congress should not do it but i think they will have to do it. host: you said should not? >> i said should not but i think they will have to. host: why shouldn't they?

caller: part of the stimulus package was to pay for shove el-ready projects. now we are going to have to pay on top of what we've already said we are paying for or at least sold into what would happen with this money. you can't leave people in desperate situations for reasons other callers previously have head. this culture is just too fragile. host: good morning. what do you make of conditions out there? caller: it's very bad. it's scary. i believe they will have to beef up the unemployment benefits.

my husband became disabled at very young. he passed away three years ago, i was his home care worker. i could only work a part-time job because i took care of him. i have not had healthcare since 1992. i am an independent contractor. i get no benefits. i will turn 65 in february and bless the lord, i will be able to get medicare. i hope other people will not have to go through what i went through. i had to pay $2500 for hyper anxiety after my husband died. it's scary everyday. i am working and paying taxes

but i am not eligible for anything. god hope for my years that i last to 65 to get healthcare. host: this story about corporate bonuses. connecticut bonus. beyond outrage. they write that five months after the nation will slack over aig and wall street, the economic health is higher. 5,000 employees got million dollar bonuses. new york attorney general andrew quomo disclosed thursday in a

repo report. going to the phone now. jobless benefits are running out. what should be done? caller: my name is dan. i live in oklahoma. i am unemployed. i was working in real estate. nothing is selling. what i would like to discuss is why not instead of talking about jobless benefits and joblessness, why don't we discuss jobs and creation of jobs. why don't we start building new plants to create products to be sold in this country that people can afford so that the jobs that they have making these things are self sustaining so that they can make more jobs and more things here in this country that people can afford instead of

buying a bunch of stuff from other countries that may be cheaper and we all know aren't as good. the whole thing about medical care, i think that's a big problem. there is so much waste involved in medical care that it causes most of these big corporations to run to other countries including canada to eliminate the cost and the extra over on the cost that i am peakeds having medical care. in order to make medical care affordable, we really have to get rid of the middleman. the middleman, unfortunately, is in control. if you look at who runs the thing that's actually are getting done, it is still, even

though we've gotten rid of a lot of the worst of the lobbyists, they still pretty much run the country. host: tampa, florida on the republican line. rick. hi, rick. go ahead. caller: i've beent2w unemploye since july 2008. i have probably put out more than 600 resumes. host: what kind of work were you doing or are you looking for? caller: in construction. actually in facility maintenance. i owned my own business for 10 years and we kind of got pushed out. i don't see any foreseeable future in employment right now. there's nothing out there. the government, until they get something figured out and republicans and democrats can

come together and create jobs, i think we'll continue along this line. host: how have you been getting by this year plus. caller: with that $300 a week. fortunately my wife is in banking. she's not getting that million dollar bonus. we had to tighten our belts and do without some of the things we used to enjoy. host: thank you for your calls. we'll talk politics coming up later. also the future of social security. our guests will be allen sloan of fortune magazine. ray lahood will be talking about

the stimulus programs. the cash for clunkeres discussion. at the top of the front page of the post all about how president obama's team forged a path that surprised everyone. one interesting quote here is that he, the president, gave himself 25% odds, maybe 30% odds to winnerly -- early on. the quote from the president, "the way i would tell the story is what i have to say about america and where we've travelled."

that's from thev "washington post" piece there. kind of a lengthy piece there. pennsylvania on the democrat's line. jobless benefits. what should be happening right now? caller: you can solve this whole problem, jobs, homes, automobile, all industries, if you put cash in the hands of the american people. i don't mean $250.

i mean $1 million. let that money let people stay in their homes. buy cars. take the money you gave for clunkeres subtract it from that. let us get ourselves out of this economy. host: going to arkansas on the independent line. is it arkansas oral -- alaska? caller: arkansas. they can give them benefits, welfare or starve to death.

they let all the companies go overseas. host: 10% decrease in local prices forecasted throughout 2009. the sunday sun times in chicago. lowest tuition hike in a decade. the cost of going to illinois universities has nearly tripled in the last ten years. it hasn't risen much this year. here is a piece from pittsburgh. pointing out 34% of americans are obese. 17% of kids are overweight. on the republican line, john.

should congress be extending jobless benefits again? caller: no. i don't believe so. if they do, the money should come from the packages that have already been thrown out there and are just under -- they seem to be idling and not doing anything for increasing jobs. host: you are saying use some of the money that's already been -- >> exactly. and reduce that amount to try to bring some reality back into the situation in congress. as far as health is concerned too, i think the first mandate of any bill coming out of congress should include the fact

that all members of congress would have to be insured only by the policy that they make and are unable to procure any additional outside insurance. in other words, hold your hand to the fire. make them look at this situation that they are trying to create. make them live by it as long as they are in office. that goes for them and the members of their family. that should be right from the first few clauses of whatever bill comes out of that congress,

related to health. host: a little more about health. the economist magazine. they write that the next few weeks could determine the fate of obama's presidency. they say the cause is by no means hopeless. they point out that obama should come down from his cloud and start leading. leadi leading. host: joe on the democrat's line. caller: i think they should

extend benefits. the money is there. the few callers on the republican line. maybe the 50-year-old women laid off, maybe they can run out and grab a shovel. people have to wake up in the south. it's kind of ridiculous. they are not doing anything for their kitchen table. host: from new jersey, independent caller. richard? caller: i don't think there's any choice. of course they do. the problem i have -- let's go back to justice suitor quitting his job.

he said he had the best job in the worst city of the united states, that's washington, d.c. i don't think washington can handle this nonsense anymore. i don't know what will happen. i would hope that the states might be able to do something. california is a mess. i left there a couple years ago and came home to the east where my kids are. it might be nice to have justice suitor on. what did he mean by that. the best job in the worst city in the united states in the chief court? let's not depend on washington anymore. my goodness. we've to feed people and keep them alive but my goodness. it may be that the government should be in the drug business. i don't know. as i look across the river to philadelphia, drugs are being sold everywhere. let the government do it and at

least they'll get some income tax out of it. thank you for having me on. i appreciate it. host: thank you for your thoughts. the senate gears up for debate. nra threats to punish senators that vote for sotomayor. the gun rights group is used to getting its way about spooking lawmakers. it has never before weighed in on a supreme court nomination. the early caution may have been well founded. a week after the nra would count a yes vote against senators, several conservative democrats

and a couple of republicans have come out in support of the appeals court judge. they approve senator max baucus and the tennessee senator lamar alexander. that's in the washington times. last call on the jobless benefits from north carolina. welcome. . . .

host: we will speak with john mercurio. be right back. ♪ >> starting tuesday, the full senate debate for the nomination of sonia sotomayor for supreme court justice. watch it live. coming this fall, toward the home to america's highest court, the supreme court. >> he signed the declaration of independence and was also murdered. tonight, this author.

the killings that shocked the nation, tonight at 8:00 p.m. eastern >> today, join the conversation on race relations. live it today at noon eastern on c-span2. an executive with the nation's largest cable provider, comcast. their new take on the future of broadband in the u.s. "washington journal" continues. host: at the table this morning is john mercurio, executive editor of the hotline. here to talk about governor races in virginia and new jersey. the national implications of all of this. what do this year's governor's races mean broadly speaking?

guest: not necessarily anything. in the national media we look at these two unique, small states. we try to draw national implications, and really they are largely local races. they are largely run on local issues. in both states candidates are fighting over transportation issues. in new jersey we see a local corruption scandal having become one of the top campaign issues, although neither candidate has been and wicked. the caveat has been the fact that the national economy is something all candidates must address. so far for the democrats in both virginia and new jersey that has been a little bit of a burden, especially with the incumbent john corzine in new jersey. host: let's talk about that a

little more -- the incumbent is a former head of goldman sachs. this is the end of his first term and he is calling for a second. who is he running against? guest: against a republican named chris christie, the former u.s. attorney who has a relatively competitive primary that he won handily. so far the race has been focused on two issues. the economy and corruption. most recently the scandal broke over the last couple of weeks has forced john corzine, even though not implicated directly, to deal with it. it has always been on the back burner and new jersey. chris christie is a law-and- order candidate, relatively moderate. his running mate is pro-choice. new jersey is relatively moderate, so any republican who

hopes to win there has to hue closely to the center on most ideological issues. host: you mentioned his law-and- order background. here is the headline from july 24. take as a little deeper there. this john corzine pretty much rocked campaign there. is it still reeling? guest: is. you see certain columnists as the one and roll call this is you have four months to learn how to say gov. chris christie. the intended message is that this is really a race that at this time is over. the investigation does not focus on john corzine or chris christie, but on 44 people in new jersey, some elected officials of smaller towns like secaucus and hoboken -- those mayors, several rabbis from some prominent synagogues around the

state. to break down, it was a scheme or money-laundering scandal in which they were setting up an organization where people would pay money for human organs. that was the highlight. the office holders had worked with these jewish rabbis at synagogues to set up a money- laundering scheme for by they and their friends would profit. host: you can phone in with your questions and comments for john mercurio. we will talk with reporters from

new jersey in a couple of minutes, and virginia a little later. here is an advertisement from chris christie, called a sad fact. >> a sad fact, new jersey on the brink of bankruptcy. once again john corzine refuses to make cuts -- the latest, a sweetheart deal for state workers in trenton. the paper calls a pathetic, this deal is pathetic. taxpayers should be furious and cynical. this paper agrees saying that john corzine give away more than taxpayers can afford and negotiating contracts for government employees -- is a pattern. it says that when coming to standing up for citizens of new jersey, the governor caved. john corzine has buckled again -- the easy way out, pathetic.

his reputation is officially dead. it will take more than a recovery to get new jersey back on track. it will take a new governor. chris christie, governor. host: john mercurio, the economy? guest: that is a pretty harsh ad. it reflects not only the harshness of the campaign, but also the harshness of the media in new jersey in terms of criticizing john corzine. he has become extremely unpopular. his prospects now are very dim. he trails chris christie from six to 12 points. the focus is on the economy and corruption. host: we will get an ad for john corzine in a moment. here is our first call. caller: hello, this example of

the rabbis and the people rested -- arrested for the organized crime, it is all intertwined and what is going on with our country right now. selfishness. this is why all of our jobs and things have been shipped overseas. they are not considering that true americans. the people who live here and try to work to survive. it is all about selfishness and making our own pockets fatter. host: part of the mood out there. guest: that is an interesting connection. but i would have to differ about the scandal in new jersey -- it is isolated to the 44

individuals under investigation. but is an interesting point concerning the national mood. host: here is an ad for the incoming governor. >> the reason i really would like a second term to serve the people, the state, is i think we have made a lot of progress educating our kids, changing the energy footprint of the state. actually, lowering the regret for property-tax is and trying to get control of the fiscal situation completely out of control when i came here. expanding health care for kids, and making sure we have a secure future with an economy that can grow when national concerns are growing. i think i can do those things. if i get a chance to continue, when the economy turns, not only will we return to prosperity,

but we will lead the nation. i would like the chance to govern. when i have a friend of the white house, when the economy is growing, and when we can actually return to prosperity. host: based on the polls, that message may not be resonating. guest: not so much. he has had obama in new jersey to campaign for him, but on the dais where obama did visit, the voters did not necessarily connect the two politicians. host: an interesting ad, doing a straight to camera, impromptu, non-scripted speech. the attempt here is trying to paint him as a common man. host: hello, carl, on the

republican line. caller: i'm concerned. as far as the governor's race, they need to vote republican. the democrats are trying to run everything. there will run it into the ground. unemployment keeps rising. for the folks who are unemployed now, my advice is do not let -- don't stay off work -- go get the job. get a job with manpower. get yourself into a routine. host: banks, mississippi. john mercurio is a political reporter. what is the story line and the new jersey governor's race going into the new week? -- this is josh margolin. guest: it seems the whole race was thrown into chaos two weeks ago. we all thought the race would largely focus on the economy

john corzine saying he had laid the groundwork for recovery, and chris christie denying that. that is what everyone thought. then, corruption which john said, is always a perennial back burner or front burner issue in new jersey. it became the main issue with the arrests 10 days ago. john corzine now has caught his breath and is trying to shift the subject, we see the new landscape now. chris christie will continue to talk about corruption and in view do a tie-in. he will say how the corruption is bad for the economy and politics. host: how are the candidates doing on money? to those polls, are there any particular ones you look for in

the next week or two? guest: i do not know the schedule for the polls. the most important thing is that all of them seem to say the same thing. that is where people like john and a lot of national press have turned the attention. everyone says that chris christie is up by any number. even john corzine did an internal poll where he was down, not as much, but still down. it will start to change or people will start to determine something about the state of the race once the polls reports the new round after the arrests. nobody expects it to move and john corzine's favor. people think that the polls will be slightly worse given the 24- hour coverage.

up until this point, the race has been very hard. it started very early. john corzine had no real primary challenge in june, but as soon as chris christie won his primary, john corzine put up as going after him. it continues now with the republican governors association responded. no one thinks that a summertime tv ads move numbers, but it is all part of this early attempt to define the other side. john corzine as a failure, and chris christie as an unsuitable alternative. john corzine is colossally wealthy and is not participating in the public finance for the election. he is raising money. no one knows what his internal

budget is or will be. that will depend on the state of the race as the proceeds. chris christie is limited, participating in public financing, wealthy, but not cause a fecolossally wealthy tht corzine is. he and his campaign are spending as little as possible this summer knowing they want to hit the air come september. what is happening in the new york and philadelphia media markets that overlay new jersey, you say the republican governors association with independent expenditure adds, saying that john corzine was supposed to fix new jersey, but has not and is a failure. host: one more quick point on new jersey. in the back to washington. health care legislation? any other major legislation coming from the democratic congress? will likely help the new jersey

governor? guest: not necessarily. in some ways politically and organizationally the democratic candidates in both new jersey and virginia are hurt by the national movement for health care, cap and trade, and the aggressive legislation the president and congressional democrats have, because on the national level they are monopolizing many of the grass- roots efforts in those states. you see creigh deeds in virginia saying he needs the grass-roots volunteers to focus on his campaign, but this summer they're more focused on health care. host: we will see ads from creigh deeds and robert mcdonnell in just a minute. independent line, thank you for waiting. caller: thanks for c-span, good

morning. it seems to me when we have people called to say to vote republican that it all started there. they have the reaganonmics. it is a stepping stone to the white house. the races are very important. i became an independent after i voted for reagan and what he did. it seems that the republicans tend to put private profits over the public interests every time. it does not seem it would be corrected unless everyone is on public campaign financing. guest: interesting. she was responding to the previous caller and made an interesting point about the tim republican this year because democrats have all the levers of power in washington and in many of these states. that is a recurring theme you will hear from republicans throughout the 2010 campaign

cycle. you have already heard the need for a check and balance from the house and senate republicans. you hear that more for callers and on the block as fear -- blogoshpere. guest: yes, only allowed to serve one term. you have an open race, two candidates -- a rematch of their 2005 race. robert mcdonnell won that race and had previously served in the house of delegates. he has been a one-term attorney general. is from northern virginia but lives down state currently. he is running slightly ahead it seems according to most polls. creigh deeds is a conservative democrat and one of very feisty

three-way primary with the former dnc chair and a former state house delegate. but it seems at this time that the republican has a slight advantage. host: here's a look at some of the ads. >> the democrats' most qualified to be the next governor, creigh deeds, a prosecutor who will put into law protections for children. he stood up to protect public schools and colleges. now, a detailed plan to rebuild our economy with innovative investments in transportation, local schools, and higher education. creigh deeds, new democrat more prepared to be governor. >> robert mcdonnell, character, express, a husband and father, molded by growing up in a middle-class suburban neighborhood the elected a colonel with 21 years in the army and reserves, business

manager for health-care company. as attorney general his pride partisan actions against internet sexual predators drew national acclaim. experienced and ready to be a job as governor. host: governor tim kane -- what is his role in this race? guest: is the incumbent, relatively popular in virginia. he is also currently serving as the democratic national committee chairman which plays a role in all governors' races. the role his plane is relatively minor considering. you see creigh deeds turn to run as much of an independent campaign as possible. -- trying to run as independently as possible. you still see democrats reluctant to commit themselves too directly with the national party.

it was a large reason why terry was unable to win. host: we will dig into virginia a bit more in a second. a quick call on the line for democrats. caller: good morning. i am the victor in new jersey and have lived here all my life. -- i am a voter in new jersey. i think it is too early for these write-offs of john corzine as the honor. we had a previous governor. i think that if corzine has had a difficult term, mainly because of the problems of the previous largely republican governors. they left him holding the bag on major debt.

i think he can get reelected and should be. he had some ideas on how to pull the state out of some of the fiscal problems it was having as a result of previous governors. he was shot down on some of those. i think they should be revisited. they made more sense than what was coming out from trenton from both democrats and republicans. host: anything you want to add? guest: she has a good point on not predicting results of an election more than 90 days ahead of time. on the other hand, i don't think you can say the democrats in new jersey have not been in control of state government and should not be held accountable. if you want to blame christy

whitman, you have to go back to 2001. host: back to virginia where tyler whitney is a political reporter and joins us by phone. what are you looking for this coming week? now that we are in august? guest: president obama will be in virginia on thursday for a rally and fund-raiser for creigh deeds, just across the potomac river from washington. deeds is beginning a tour of some rural areas of the state today. there will be a live telecast with the richmond times dispatch on tuesday. it will be an active host: week what is the strength of the presidential appearance? guest: it will raise a lot of

money and it is in an area that has gone more democratic in recent years. it should generate interest. host: remind us how the state has changed in recent years with demographics. talk to us about some of the key issues driving the race. guest: demographics, people moving in from the northeast. it has changed in virginia from the red state to at least a purple state. we have elected two democratic senators, voted for the winning presidential candidate for the first time since 1964. six out of 11 congressmen are democrats. the state is changing. the main issue driving jobs and transportation. host: this reporter and as with

the richmond times dispatch. guest: yes, tyler mentioned a visit from the president this week. that is an important visit because what we have seen recently is that creigh deeds is trailing the republican nominee largely because he has failed so far to motivate and excite independents and moderates. if he or barack obama is able to tap into that base of support and draw them into the deeds campaign you could see a huge change in the dynamic. bringing obama into the race despite some reservations by some democrats in virginia could really change things. host: let's bring in bridgewater on the republican one. what part of the state is that?

caller: it is in the beautiful shenandoah valley. host: what do you make of your governor's race? caller: it is a referendum on barack obama. i see it that way because he is terrified. he sent air force one out to bristol which is a tiny town on the border that hardly has an airport big enough to accommodate it. people are very concerned about his socialist views. many feel that young women and children are being asked to pay for all these things he is advocating. the right to life group is very much against president obama and his hedonistitc views. he has lied about everything he said in his campaign. virginians did not like muslims

in our common security. guest: that is a view from one part of the stick. i would not necessarily a touch myself to his comments. but he and the tone overall today reflect an interesting dynamic of both virginia and new jersey in their races. over the past 30 years and become a new political party comes into the white house, the opposition party is the winner in these two states. i believe that is over the past 30 years it tells you that both states are reactive to the referendum of the new party. host: one last call from

maryland, on the independent line. caller: i'm afraid you'll not let me say what i want to say, but i will try it anyway. i am a vietnam vet. i have two statements that really reverberate in my head about politicians. dwight eisenhower warned about the industrial complex. i remember in vietnam, read the statement by chairman mao about the chinese communist governmentmao once said that the western world people would sell -- for a dollar. i heard people calling in this morning. in the country is dependent -- dependent on the manufacturing capacity in the when we were

producing our own products we were the no. 1 producer in the world. last year china -- we gave all of our jobs away to the foreign countries in the bush gave our money away. when our manufacturing base transferred to foreign governments we stopped being the no. 1 producer in the world and have become the biggest debtor mission as a result. when these other leaders were running our government we wouere the number one producers in the world. manufacturing jobs reproduce repeatedly, that is what makes a country great. host: rap that by tying it to the governors' races? guest: one thing he did talk about was jobs. ec the importance of job

creation in both races. you see all four major party candidates, with those kinds of plants in both races. that will certainly be a deciding issue. host: john mercurio is executive editor of the hotline. guest: my pleasure. host: we have a half-hour left in our program. joining us now is allan sloan, senior editor of fortune magazine to talk to us about social security. you have a piece you have written and we can see it today in "the washington post" -- called a flimsy trust. was social security needs major repairs. what do you see right now? guest: fantasy numbers, and if you look it those numbers the social security looks healthy, but if you look at how much money is coming in compared to

what is going now, we either have a problem now or are about to have one. host: the problem you point out is something we have heard about in washington for quite a bit. the intake and the outflow. you say it is coming sooner than most might think? guest: yes, it might even be here now. the numbers are not available. so you cannot really tell. but the money coming in is way below people were projecting a there are fewer jobs. fewer people are paying into social it still has the same amount going out. host: what does this mean for the budget? please explain the economics as simply as you can. we hear washington talking a lot about health care and budgets and deficits, and the like. guest: the way social security works you could spend two hours

talking about it. you'd still be hopelessly confused. i am hopelessly confused and have studied it for years. it is just a question of money now. social security either this year or next is likely to take in less money than it spends the which means it will have to get money from the treasury. i define the as of bailout. it is either here or around the corner. -- i define that as of bailout. host: here are the lines to phone in with your questions or comments. this is allan sloan, a senior editor of fortune magazine. you can read his thoughts there. we also see him in the business section of the paper today. major repairs, what is the fix?

guest: again, it is the same fix as it has been for a long time been a people take less money out in the future, including those like me who are very well off, then we were originally entitled to. people retire later. and people pay probably somewhat more taxes. it is just a question of numbers. healthcare is really complicated. it involves very complicated things. not to make fun of social security, but it is only about money. money you can figure out in compromise. health care is much more complicated. i have stayed as far away from it as i can and will continue to as long as the let me. host: before we go to calls, bring us up-to-date on action here in washington, if any. what is congress thinking now? what is the administration thinking now on this issue?

guest: some longer-term people say healthcare first as in social security. you are in washington and notice difficult to get more than one thing at a time going on. healthcare is all-consuming. but if you speak to moyer, the majority leader of the house, and talk to some wonks, you can see people getting geared up for later this year or next to try to do a commission to deal with social secured. i was trying it in the article to explain in english with the problem is. people like me have paid in much more than we will get. that is fine, but the government -- even though the garment is $200,000 per head, will have to borrow money to pay our benefits.

that is when the trouble starts. host: as we look at the cover and speak with allan sloan -- the biggest bailout yet. we're talking about social security. minnesota, first off, on the independent line. jack, good morning. caller: good morning, and gentleman. i hope that your article focuses on a couple of things. -- good morning, gentlemen. i will focus on fica tax. it was supposed to be a dedicated tax. it is a wet dream as far asneo- liberals andne neo-cons. it is extremely progressive as a general revenue tax. guest: it is. caller: unfortunate, it was never considered to be a general

revenue tax. it is dedicated to pay only for social security. i believe that is written into law. i hope of future callers can reinforce that. the problem is the 1983 fix which turned out to be a disaster. people who devised that should have known that. anytime -- though fica tax was essentially double. it provided a huge surpluses. up until this point it still is. those were intended to pre-pay for the demographic bulge of the baby boomers. it was used to pay for our empire, the iraq war, money to israel, etc. -- and that money needs to be paid back. it is tough if it is going to

be hard on the wealthy. they need to pay back. guest: that is exactly what i write and what is in the article. the 1982 problem. i looked at the politics, but that is exactly the problem and what i wrote. host: next call, mich., on the republican line. caller: sir, if social security would be done away with -- medicare, medicaid, you might as will be saved from the one rule government. we will no longer be america. it impacts every aspect of our lives. dismantle all of those and make it federal, or taxes, or whatever.

we will cease to be america. host: let's hear from our guest. guest: healthcare is off the table. it is not what i did. what i'm a greed here is explain what is going on was a security and relatively -- what i am a creep hewriting here is how is d be for it to be changed with social security. host: remind us of the history of this program. its original intent of the ex tell us about its changes along the way. guest: it began in 1935. it was under president roosevelt. the point was to make sure that all people did not starve to death, to be blunt.

back then there was no means of support. there was a depression. you went on home relief if you could get it. it began as a system to keep old people from b poor. in 1935 if you were 65 years old you are really an old person. i am nearly 65 and i am not an old person. then along the way, congress began to add benefits, sweetened it. the taxes went up. in 1983 social security almost ran out of money and had to borrow from medicare to pay the checks. we then had this tremendous revamping of social security which raised the taxes, made the program bigger. but for whatever reason, no one figured out a way to set the money aside to prepay for me, you, and some of our callers. now on the books we have a

healthy looking system, but it has the money. host: explain the trust fund. there's an interesting" sure i would like you to elaborate on, from david walker. the trust fund has no financial significance. if you did bookkeeping like that in the private sector you would go to jail. what is he talking about? what are youwriting about? guest: ok, i talked to him about this for years. the way that this works is buying law social security which now for 25 years took in more money than it spent. it took the extra cash and give it to the government. the government gave its treasury securities. so, this came down reported budget deficit for reasons i don't want to get into. it made social security look

very healthy, but the problem this that in order to turn these trust fund securities back into cash, the government must go out and borrow the money to buy the securities so that you and i can be paid. so, in the real world or corporate america if you did bookkeeper it would never be allowed. he is exaggerating some for dramatic effect, but in corporate america a company with publicly-traded stock or debt, if it did anything like that there be in trouble and seconds. host: fla., on the line for democrats.

caller: i and nonrailroad returned. i believe they put it -- and i am on railroad retirement and i believe it is the same as senators and congress people. we get no increase, but they get 7% of an increase this year. my wife and i, as soon as i turned 65 a lost all my medical. my wife has no medical. i'm paying $511 per month to keep her cover. all i get from that is a $40 copiague. host: want to add anything there? -- >> all your from that is afford a dollarco-pay. guest: the consumer price index is down.

that's why there's no increase in the social security benefit. i know nothing about the railroad retirement benefit. as for congress, they are your problem in washington ago i live in new york and stairway at all times if i can. host: one viewer asks by twitter that if the income limit on social security tax were eliminated, would fix the program? guest: the limit is over $100,000. let's say if you took off the limit, you'd be quadrupling the tax for many people who make more than $107,000. if you do that for five minutes to a balance soldiers security, but the first time there is a

conservative administration and congress if you have imposed another 12.4% income-tax which is what this is on everyone making more than that amount, even people like me who really loves us as a dirty and honored for what it did for my parents, to say suddenly -- who really like it -- you have to pay this and no one has to retire later take a cut in benefits, we would just take your money, people in my income class will turn against social turnen masse. the next time there is a change in a master's in you will not have social security. -- there will turn against social security en masse. we have to do with it in a way that does not alienate an comeclasincome classess.

. caller: i have to take exception to what he said. if people who make over $100,000 per year against the rest of theclass, that amounts to class warfare. in 1983, someone said the baby boomers would retire in 25 years and what are we going to do? the money was never intended to go into the general fund. the laws written says it has to be satisfied. the government has barred incessantly from this fund. now at 58 years old, i look and see that will not happen. secondly, my 401 has been decimated. thirdly, my house value has fallen by 25% in the past year. and i listen to focus gentleman makes a lot of sense in many ways. the problem with social security

is not the baby boomers pinup we have been paying into it. the problem with social security is that people in washington have beeno guts. the do not have industrial policy, so our jobs have been eliminated. it reduces the amount going into this. lockbox -- i laughed when i heard that term. thirdly, you are telling us that you have to work longer. i already have to work a year -- and i do not have a problem. i like to work. i have no problem working until i'm 70. no problem. do not have a problem paying a little more tax pen. what i have a problem with is the amount of money that has been so misused and taken from taxpayers. now they are saying we cannot pay the bill that is coming due?

they have known about it. host: banks. guest: that is what i've read about. i'm not trying to push any of these media outlets, but if you read the online version of the paper, you will see the point you're making which is that all this money was never set aside and now it is not fair. that is exactly what i am saying and proposing to fix by having the government bailout the social security system a little at a time. if we can bailouts every bank in creation -- i'm exaggerating -- we can bail out people under water on their mortgages, insurance companies, then we can bailout the people who have paid for their entire lives into social security. we can make it work. it is not that hard.

we just have to summon the will to do instead of pretending everything is ok. it is not. host: another message by twitter. why do we get more money -- what do we get more money by taxing more in giving people the option not to participate? guest: well, no. this is social insurance. everyone pays and every gets. when i was shoyoung i benefited tremendously because my wife became a full-time homemaker when we had to amiga i did not make a lot of money in newspapers as you can imagine. -- when i did not make much. there were survivor benefits if i died young. that would have been a tremendous benefit to my family. thank god we didn't need it.

left to my own devices and never would have bought it. i would have thought i would live forever which is what young people generally think. if you do not make it that everyone pays and everyone gets, you do not have social or secured. host: you all sowrite what to do about all this. but the section of what not to do. you say do not depend on taxing the rich. tell us more about your not to do list. guest: it is to not decide that the 12% of the population make a lot of money and we should just take it and pay for it. that will not work because even though they are 12%, if you do this, it has a disproportionate influence in the world. i write about these people all the time. that would not work out.

there is another thing horrified ,means testing. if you have more than a certain amount of income or what you just do not get social security. you do that and you're turning it into welfare from an earned benefit. for someone like me, i am well- off, and if i had the income that i have also the east coast might be demonstrably rich. 25% of my benefit goes back to social security through income tax. so you are already means testing me. anyone who makes any significant income other than social security -- so, i would keep it social and for a room. if you want to tax a little more, that is fine. if you want to raise some limits, that is finding a but to

say that we will get "the rich" whatever that means, that is the end of the program. host: we have time for a couple more programs. baltimore is up next, our republic caller. ray. caller: [laughter] the only thing i have to say -- can you hear me? when you put up the numbers for everybody, the republicans should be on top since this is august. democrats are on top. for host: thank you for that. caller: i hope that i can get it. i'm 56 years old and chances are that i will not be able to get it. host: let's move on to

washington with robert on the line for democrats. you are on the line with allan sloan. caller: good morning. i called to agree with the one lady who called earlier about becoming aware of the fact that it appears as though we have a definite class war going on in the united states. i have just become aware within the last -- i'm 65 now -- and the last maybe four or five years watching the elections how our politics work. it is almost frightening how if you become aware of it, what we are dealing with how divided classes are. and you talk about the issues, there is a very definite divide betweenclasses and their

perceptions of needs. i will listen for your answer. host: any response? guest: yes, it has gotten more severe than it has been. but there has always been -- i do not like the word were fair, because it means you are out trying to kill people. -- i do not warfare which means your tried to kill or destroy people these are class differences, but not everyone acts the same with this and eachclass. if you read my article in see that i'm making more than $107,000 per year, theoretically i am rich and i should be with the people defending whatever, and i'm not. you'd be surprised to see how different people the. a lot of lower middle class people have economic values that are the values of the upper classes. it is all very interesting, but

i agree that the divisions have gotten bigger over the years. but i do not think that it is warfare. i think it is just the normal give and take you love, maybe more extreme than usual by little. host: one last call for our guest from arizona on the independent line. caller: good morning. in the st. petersburg, florida newspaper some time ago which are read on the internet, there was a thing about getting jobs for people which were paying $1 million. why don't they use some stimulus money and give the people from, that are on social security, why don't they give them a lump-sum? it would give them time to build up. i'm not sure what a good amount

would be. $250,000 is what you are supposed to put away. instead of monthly payments, give them starting at 60 or 65 $500,000? for people going on to social security? they will get money anyway. it is not like they are getting a gift. they have earned it and work hard for it. host: your final thoughts on the future of social security? guest: if for once we get together in washington and in the rest of the country and act like grown-ups and look at the numbers and stop complaining and operating our grievances, both the upper class who claim they are being ripped off and the lower class who say that rich have all the money -- if we get together and act social we will have a chance to be socially

secure. so that my children in their 30's know that we will have this. we would be good for another two generations. after that, we will see. host: allan sloan, senior editor of fortune magazine, this week his article is about the future of the social security program. thank you for your time. we will back tomorrow morning. these are everyday at 7:00 a.m. our guests include the following. stuart taylor has written a column concerning sonia sotomayor ,gates, and race. the senator from nebraska will join us after that, talking about agriculture and many other issues. coming up in just a couple of minutes, "newsmakers how will

deal with stem the spinning around the country. also cash for clunkers program which was running short of money. the house acted and we expect the senate also to act later this week. while we are finishing we will show you a couple of minutes from the floor on friday. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2009] the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. obey: mr. speaker, i yield myself three minutes. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman is recognized. mr. obey: mr. speaker, late yesterday, it came to our attention that the cash for clunkers program which enacted a few days ago has proven more wildly popular than its strongest supporters had predicted. just last month, congress passed the program which provided up to $4,500 if you trade in your old gas guzzler for a new car that gets better mileage. that was done in the hopes of spurring some new car sales and encouraging people to be a little more environmentally

friendly. we provided $1 billion in the supplemental to get it going, enough for about 250,000 sales. the program kicked off monday, and it's already officially received 40,000 requests for reimbursement worth about $160 million in rebates. in is survey done by the national automobile dealer association this week suggest that at least 200,000 deals have been completed but not yet officially submitted. if that's true and we're being told that it probably is, then the entire $1 billion is just about exhausted, so we have before us a bill to provide stopgap funding for cash for clunkers by allowing the administration to transfer up to $2 billion from the department of energy innovative technology loan guarantee program which doesn't expect to award funding until late next year. some would call this letting the markets work. consumers have spoken with thei