now on "showbiz tonight" this weekend, jon gosselin responds to "showbiz tonight's" shocking exclusive interview with the other kate. >> do you hate him now? >> i despise him. >> she's the kate who claims she had a romantic relationship with jon gosselin and you only saw her on "showbiz tonight." tonight the stunning reaction to kate major's explosive challenge. >> i will take a lie detector test and i would love for jon to take one. >> "showbiz tonight" dares to ask is jon gosselin turning into one of the most despiced me ed

america? the cougar and the kid. hulk hogan's ex-wife linda, she's 50. her boyfriend, he's only 20. and for the first time they're speaking out about their bizarre cougarific relationship. the tv's most provocative show starts right now. hello. i'm a.j. hammer broadcasting tonight and every night from new york city. this is "showbiz tonight" this weekend. the reaction to the blockbuster exclusive with the so-called other kate. jon gosselin is now firing back for the very first time after kate major's claims to "showbiz tonight" about their relationship and her big dare to jon that he should take a lie detector test. the "showbiz tonight" exclusive interview with kate major is making headlines around the

world, on air, online, and in the newspapers everywhere because the other kate is holding nothing back, and now neither is jon. it's the "showbiz tonight" interview that has sparked a firestorm. >> did you love him? >> no. i think i was in lust with him. >> from headlines from "people" magazine to "ok" magazine. the former tabloid reporter told me that she and jon gosselin of "jon & kate plus 8" had a torrid romance soon after he separated from kate. >> he called me and referred to kate gosselin as the ex-kate or old kate. "showbiz tonight" can tell you jon gosselin is hitting back hard exclusive in "showbiz tonight" tonight he called kate gosselin, quote, damaged goods. it's a new bomb shell in the

bitter he-said-she-said battle. >> he made his bed and he has to sleep in it. unfortunately it was with me. >> in her interview she shared with me her current feelings about jon gosselin. >> do you hate him now? >> i december spite him. >> and she says. >> i would love to take a lie detector test and for him to take one f for him to say there was no romance is a complete lie. >> gosselin continues to deny any relationship with major. he claims her statements are -- jon believes that the public is smart enough to appreciate the motivation behind statements from people like kate major. and in a final dig, the statement concludes, quote, the public doesn't need a lie

detector to identify the intense extend. of patent falsehoods. >> everyone seems to have an opinion on this relationship. >> entertainment journalist tells "showbiz tonight" that jon gosselin has a lot of work do if he wants to rescue his image, which has taken a hit thanks to kate a major's claims and his exploits. >> i think a lot of people believe that jon has been acting like a prepew bess end hormonal boy, that he's been going around picking up different women. >> after kate major's explosive words to "showbiz tonight" viewers are swamping our facebook page and many of them are divided on kate major. lisa s.wrights i don't believe her. she's in for the media. and tiffany c. writes jon is a tool going through mid life crisis too early. >> i think any woman who gets dumped is angry. i think most women would love to go on national television and ask their ex-boyfriend to take a

lie detector test and say whether or not he was honest na their relationship. even from what kate major said, it wasn't this huge romance a. it was a few-date fling. that's why they call it hooking up. that's why they call it fooling around. and right now it's just his word against her word. >> i'm not going to just go away and let jon get away with this. >> so are we going to need a lie detector test to sort all this out? >> lie detectors should be for capital murder cases, not necessarily for did we or didn't we hook up. >> lie detector or not, things aren't looking good for jon gosselin, who's now in the middle of two battles with two angry kates. well, the angry kates aren't the only ones angry with jon. could he be on his way to becoming the most despiced man in america? right now is carlos diaz and also leslie marshal host of the syndicated program, "the leslie

marshall show." one thing that has people buzzing is the smackdown from kate saying jon take a lie detector test. this is after he denied their fling. watch this. >> jon told me e he was falling for me. he called me the new kate and referred to kate gosselin as his ex-kate or the old kate. the thing that i really want to clear up is that the worst thing you can do is lie. and i will take a lie detector test, and i would love for jon to take a lie detector test because for him to say there was no romance is a complete lie that and there are people out there cheering on kate today for calling jon out. carlos, why do you think everybody is so fired up? >> because everyone can relate to what's going on in this situation. it's all about the "r"s. when you get out of the relationship you've got the random, the rebound girl, and something real. right now haley might be the rebound girl. but i've got news for you. kate, you are a random.

you had a rap dom fling with jon and you're mad about it so you're just shouting from the hilltops. what's jon doing? jon's giving the classic guy response. it wasn't me. i didn't do it. it wasn't me. >> that's making her even more mad. >> yeah, exactly. >> jon is saying no fling. we heard from his attorney who exclusively told "showbiz tonight" the other kate is dishing the dirt on two-week romance calling it nothing than looking for a mate. so jon is saying, no lie detector for him and kate is just out for the money. so, leslie, does that make it case closed on this or is jon adding more fuel to a pretty ugly firestorm? >> well, i think if jon keeps sleeping around there's going to be a lot more fuel because a lot of women are going to come out and ask for a lie detector test

and calling it a romance. carlos, really great research on the "r"s, by the way, but these -- you know, the kates out there, there are a lot of women. i'm married now but years ago when i dated, we've all had our heart broken. she's angry right now, and she's cashing in on it. so i think as long as these women like kate major cash in on it they're going to continue on. and i think jon gosselin is acting in a way that he didn't get to because he got married so young, et cetera. i'm not excusing it, but i don't think his behavior is going to stop. since it woen, the women are going to continue to be angry. >> i should also point out we have no independent confirmation that jon's been, as you say, sleeping around. i have been paying very close attention to all our comments on facebook page because there's so much fired up reaction. a lot of people hating on jon more than i've seen before. evonne r. righting on our wall, jon is a two-faced jerk.

allison c. rights does he realize all that he is doing is going to come back and bite him in the butt and teenage boys behaving like good old dad. i think that's a great point. kate majors says she despises jon. do you think, carlos, has jon gone from really one of the most beloved reality tv dads to perhaps the most despised man in america? >> yeah, and he could have done it so much better. i could have coached him. listen, jon, when you get out of that relationship that you meet don't say you're falling for them. say you're emotionally unava unavailab unavailable. after that whole thing with kate, you saw what happened. i can't love right now. stick with me, keep having sex with me and maybe something will happen. for now i'm emotionally unavailable. but instead he tells them i love you and it goes out of whack. >> quickly, leslie, is he

becoming one of the most despiced men in america? i think he is, and i would agree with carlos. he didn't handle this right. you know, women love a really sad puppy, and if he just sat there and cried about the pain of his marriage, he wouldn't have to tell the women he loved him. yeah, certainly he is not loved any more by america, and he is being looked at by a teenager when he's got all these kids. so his ex-wife is getting some points for this. >> carlos dias and leslie marshal, thanks very muchful and carlos deas, go write a book. i think you can. tonight i'm bringing the entire one-on-one interview with kate majors. she's calling him a flat-out liar. more of our exclusive. also the cougar and the kid. hulk hogan's ex-wife linda, she's 50. her boyfriend? well, he's only 20. for the very first time they're speaking out together. and did you see this? >> it was a foul ball catch that left folks in anything but a foul mood.

>> oh, no. you're not supposed to throw the ball back. i guarantee you this story about a dad and his little girl is going to put a big old smile on your face. this is "showbiz tonight" this weekend. it is time now for the showbiz show ticker. this is news making news right now. this is humiliating. stand still so we can get an accurate reading. okay...um...eighteen pounds and a smidge. a smidge? y'know, there's really no need to weigh packages under 70 pounds. with priority mail flat rate boxes from the postal service, if it fits, it ships anywhere in the country for a low flat rate. cool. you know this scale is off by a good 7, 8 pounds. maybe five. priority mail flat rate boxes only from the postal service. a simpler way to ship.

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audition for "britain's got talent" became a youtube sensation. welcome back to "showbiz tonight" this weekend. i'm a.j. hammer. did you see this? catching a foul ball, obviously something a whole lot of baseball fans dream of and for one philadelphia phillies fan's dream came true. his daughter took matters into her own hand. >> it was a foul ball that left folks in anything but a foul mood. no, it wasn't steve's catch at the philadelphia washington game that had them laughing. it was his 3-year-old daughter's right arm. though she threw back daddy's souvenir, the heart-warming hug is what lingers, one of those moments that evokes this from women and from men -- >> i'm like, what are you doing. >> she was doing what emily is used to do, catching and

throwing a nerf ball with dad. it was a post hug. >> my husband would have had a fit. >> that hug turned him into a paragon of parent aing. what a prince. absolute hero. dad of the year. best dad ever. i want to meet this dad. yeah, well, he's already married. that's his wife with their younger daughter at the game. steve told us he hugged emily when she looked as if she thought she'd done something wrong by tossing away the ball. >> wow, classic. >> reporter: by the way, the phillies sent someone up to the stands to give dad and daughter the ball to replace the one that a emily threw back. when someone suggested that dad should have tossed her after the ball, the next person responded do us all a favor and don't reproduce. but let us reproduce the slow motion replay and watch steve's face as he realizes the beloved

foul may be gone, but the fairest of all is still in his arms. >> that was cnn's jeanne moos. don't worry o. steve who caught the ball and his daughter emily have two baseballs courtesy of the phillies. not only did they bring the family a ball during the game to make up for the one they lost but also on the "today" show steve and emily were given another fall signed by fielders outfielder jason werth. he hit the ball that made their family famous. they received their own personalized phillies jerseys. i love that story. a lot of people have called in about kate gosselin hosting "the view." we got a call from erica from texas. she loves kate on tv and is so happy that kate ditched that reverse moment. >> caller: i want to say i love

kate's new hairdo, her outfit and everything about it. i hope she keeps the hairdo. please do not go back. i love it. >> heidi from new jersey would walk a kate talk show. >> caller: i think it's great kate gosselin might get a talk show. it might be more of a set schedule for her and she'll be able to tend to the children just fine. you know, i think a lot of people criticize her, but, you know, if she was any weaker, she'd be a broken woman already. good for kate gosselin, and i hope she gets it. >> appreciate your call, hidy. you can call us. call 1-888-sbt-buzz. did you see this? tom and cameron were asked questions. they were asked about tv shows,

and other fun stuff. >> i know you're a pilot. what are you better at? flying or sex? >> well, this isn't a tough question. >> i don't know. i've -- >> i try to xcel in all areas and i've never been asked for a refund. you know, i don't know. >> you don't know. >> having sex with tom is -- didn't you say -- >> it's like flying. >> by the way, tom and cameron are shooting the movie called "wichita." it's going to be in theaters next year. tonight we're speaking with the other kate, kate major. this is a "showbiz tonight" exclusive. you did share some pretty intimate details about your relationship with jon while you were still together, among the things you scared, claims that the two of you were fooling around when his eight kids were sleeping nearby. yeah, i go one on one with the

former tabloid reporter who claims she was jon gosselin's other woman. did she really have sex with jon with the kids right there? also for the first time i'm going to show you president obama calling kanye west a jackass caught on tape. some amazing never-before-seen footage here. this is "showbiz tonight" this weekend on hln. and now "showbiz tonight" with 2009 prime time emmys hoochler are the top emny nominees this year. nbc's "30 rock" received the most nods. drew barry moore got a nod. it received 17 nominations in all. and everyone's mad for amc's "mad men." it received 16 nominations including a nomination for outstanding drama series. when this school district added aflac to complement

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intimate details about your relationship with jon while you were still together. among the things you shared, claims that the two of you were fooling around when his eight kids were sleeping nearby. now on "showbiz tonight" this weekend, a "showbiz tonight" exclusive, jon's other kate. tonight i am one on one with the woman who claims she had a roman mans with jon gosselin. why kate major now despises jon and why she wants jon to take a lie detector test. it is the explosive exclusive interview you'll see only on "showbiz tonight." the cougar and the kid.

50-year-old linda hogan unveils her cougar iffing new life with her 20-year-old. and are angelina jolie and megan fox in an ugly new battle? the weekend edition of tv's most provocative news show continues right now. welcome back to "showbiz tonight" this weekend. it is 30 minutes past the hour. i'm a.j. hammer broadcasting tonight and every night from new york city. tonight the cougar and the kid. 50-year-old linda hogan and her loverboy, 20-year-old charlie, tell all about their relationship. >> if he was, you know, any younger, it would probably be an issue because it wouldn't even be legal, but -- >> get ready for a story of a lifetime. tonight you're going to hear all as hulk hogan's ex-wife reveals the intimate details of her love affair with her kids'

20-year-old friend charlie including the stunning reaction to the first time she saw him. get this. linda doesn't hold back one bit that she and charlie are, quote, soulmates. are you buying this? is this a case of cougar and boy toy or is this a match made in heaven? but wait. there's more. is charlie afraid he's going to get his butt kicked by hulk hogan for sleeping with his ex-wife? with me in new york is the woman who asked all the tough questions, megan alexander, a correspondent for "inside edition." let me say it again. linda is 50. her boyfriend charlie is 20. how in the world did this match made in heaven actually happen? well, linda hogan tells her sweet story to "inside edition," and it's a winner. >> how did you meet? >> on the beach. i said, whoa, what's that? he's so hot looking. i'm like dang, you know. >> dang, you know. megan, i've got to go to you first.

you were asking the questions. what was your reaction when you heard that? it was so schoolgirlish and he was 20 and he was younger at the time. was it hard to keep a straight face? >> you know, it was, ancht jnchts and that's a 3-0, 30-year age difference. going into it, of course, i was skeptical. 50-year-old linda is dating a man who's the same age as her daughter and son basically. i was prepared to ask tough questions. i was not going to judge anyone. you never know what a relationship is like until you get to know people. the initial picture was rather shocking but after talking to them i asked some tough questions, a.j., and i think charlie actually is a pretty nice guy and it seems like he's treating linda pretty good, however, my concern was more linda knows what she's doing. she's 50. she's lived life. so what's she doing? >> i'm sorry. that particular sound bite is one of my favorite. can we roll that again, charles?

that was just delicious. >> how did you meet? >> on the beach. i was like what's that. whoa. he's so hot looking. dang, you know. >> leslie marshall, take it away. >> dang. if i had jumped in or jumped into bed with every guy i thought was hot working in radio or television or living in l.a., i would be a ho. i'm not calling the woman a ho but this is crazy. this is a 50-year-old woman. i understand. can't she get a breast implant -- wait. she did that. can't she get herself a car or jewelry. no, she had to get herself a 20-year-old. this to me is crazy. she's got kids. even though the relationship didn't work out with their dad, hulk hogan, it looks like charlie is getting free rent and a free ride and i don't know how long that's going to last. >> well, linda says this is a real deal. it's not a passing fancy.

it's a true relationship is what she's saying. now, she's been with charlie over a year, which would have made him 19, i guess, when they first got together. listen to what linda told "inside edition" about her feelings for her boy toy. >> i really love him now. and it's like we're good friends. and we're soul mates. >> okay. soulmates. that's pretty song terms for a guy you've nope that amount of time who's 30 years your junior. megan, let me ask you. it is cynical to say, no way, can't be true love. you were right there with them. what do you think about the relationship? do you think it's true love, or do you think it's truly twisted? >> obviously the relationship needs to stand the test of time. i'd like to interview them in ten years and see if they are, indeed, still together. i tried to ask them tough questions in terms of the age difference. i asked them do you want to have kids? obviously linda, biological clock is ticking. she said they've talked about it and they would be open to

adoption. i said, charlie, how do you feel about that? he said i'm open to it as well. his mother is the same age. i asked how that was. she said it was awkward but they've worked through and talked through that. most importantly what's been shared is the kids. brooke hogan has shared and been very vocal she had a hard time with. this charlie went to the same school. what's going on with my mom. why can't she get her life together. you never stop being a mother, even when your kids hit their 20s. said, linda, whaes what's your concern about your relationship with brooke and she's not cool with this. she said she would leave charlie if it would make brooke happy. she said she doesn't think that needs to be done. charlie says he would leave linda for brooke but we'll believe it when we see it, guess. >> brooke hasn't spoken to her because brooke doesn't like charlie. she said it doesn't have nothing to do with the age thing. she doesn't like charlie as a

guy. we know linda and hulk had a seriously bitter divorce. there was so much drama, so much outrage and a lot of smack talk. in fact, hulk was so mad that linda was dating that he compared himself to o.j. simpson in an interview when he said this to "rolling magazine." you know, there's that male instinct where you'd love to get him in a ring. i could have even went in -- i want you to listen to what they just told megan at "inside edition" about that. >> linda, were you ever fearful that your ex-husband would come hard harm you or come harm charlie? >> yeah, i was a little bit afraid because i didn't know how he'd react. he's a big guy. >> it's hulk har gn, 6'5", 6, however big he is. yeah, he can break me like a twig. >> let me go back on this. as they proclaim their love to the world on national television in that interview, did you stel

goat the sense that they felt hulk might harm them. >> i asked that. they said they've shaken hands and talked a little bit. charlie said if he sees him it's like, hey, how's it going rp they're civil to each other. but he did say he can break me like a twig. charlie is one brave guy to date hulk hogan's ex. we can all gray degree with that. he's so young. he hasn't lived enough life to understand that, you know, the history with their marriage and what it means to come into a relationship with someone who has kids. >> yeah. i mean brook is 21 years old. that's a year older than her boyfriend and linda's son is one year younger. i don't believe people are going to take these guys seriously at all. thank yu so much for sharing with us. leslie marshal, thanks so much for being here. right now i have to show you president obama calling kanye west a jackass. yeah, it was caught on tape, all started when he stole the microphone from taylor swift.

the video of president obama called kanye a jackass happening during an off-the-cuff moment and it's now online. >> she seems like a perfectly nice person. she's getting her award. >> why would he do that? he's a jackass. >> now -- this -- all this stuff -- >> i'm assuming all this stuff. come on, guys. cut the president some slack. >> well, apparently they didn't. tonight it's my one-on-one with jon gosselin's other kate. why is she calling him a liar. >> i would love to take a lie detector test and for him to take one. for him to say there was no romance is a complete lie. >> tonight i go one on o one in a complete exclusive with jon's other kate. what she thought after jon dised her on national television. and did she really have sex with

jon with his kids right there? you'll see it only on "showbiz tonight." are angel gentlemen low and megan fox --. ever worn your clothes in the shower?

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she wants jon to take a lie detector test to come clean about their romance. this is the other kate's very first interview since jon dissed her in a prime time abc special. so how did she go from reporting on jon and kate's split to being the other woman? >> i went to jon's house in pennsylvania for "star" magazine, and as most people know, we met because his bodyguard, mike, who was working there, sent him a picture of me. and jon got in his car, his bmw, and drove to the end of the driveway. and then we went to this area near his house and just talked. this was no flirtation, but i was thinking this is awesome because jon never had really been talking to the media at all. so at that point i kind of wanted to see what he was all about. >> was it the kind of deal when you walked into the room or first met him, did you feel sparks? you said there was no flirtation, but did he hit on you at all? what exactly did you feel?

>> not at first but then at the dinner we started texting back and forth at the table and then other people had joined us. he asked me to go outside with him to smoke a cigarette. there were fans everywhere. and he certainly wasn't trying to hide me. so i just thought it was -- it was a little bit fast how he invite med to dinner, invited me to this party, and then we held hands and kissed in the car. >> that was on the first night? >> yes. >> you kissed on the first night. >> unfortunately, yes. >> you did share some pretty intimate detailses about your relationship with jon while you were still together. among the things you shared, claimed that two of you were fooling around when his eight kids were sleeping nearby. do you regret that? >> that didn't happen. i'm not sure how that all came about. >> clarify that. >> i want to clarify that. >> please do. >> i had never been in jon and

kate gosselin's house ever. i would have never went there with the kids there. me, never. i'm not that girl. what i did say is jon asked me if i could go there when the kids were asleep. he asked me. i said where would i park. there's gate. and he said i could park at his neighbor's house and he could get his four-wheeler and pick me up. and, you know, i just thought that that was very strange. and i'm like, no, i definitely -- i'm smart enough to know that that is just wrong to do. so he had propositioned that but that never happened, ever. >> a week after your first date you quit your job and this is what appeared on the "star" website. it says -- tell me how that went down. did you walk into your boss's office and say, hey, you know

what? i think i might be in love or really in to jon? i can't work here anymore? >> i don't want to really go in detail about how my boss called or anything like that, but i felt it was the right thing to do, to resign from my job because, you know, i even said can i have ten minutes because i really wanted to make sure. and it was just jon in the house that told me that i should quit my job. >> so it was jon's idea for you to actually quit. >> yes. he told me that i was supposed to be his assist aunt. we even discussed this after he went back to haley. i was still supposed to work for him. he even asked me what i made. we talked about it. >> and then came jon's side of the story. we started hearing from him about this. he gave an interview shortly after you resigned from "star" to "e," and i want to read what he said to "e" about you. he said i care about kate major.

now, this is around the time that the two of you were also seen out in the hamptoms, having a great time. seemed like there was something going on potentially. what was it specifically that jon said to you? >> jon told me that he was falling for me. he called me the new kate and referred to the other kate as his ex-indicate or old kate. i fell for him. i believed everything he said. i was reluctant to get very romantically involved. i really didn't know what to do at that point because it has blown up into such a media frenzy, and i felt like every day something negative was coming out, and it was hard. he had promised me, you know, that it would be okay, that things would work out. yeah, just listening to myself speak about this. i sound very dumb to do it, but the think i want to clear up is the worst thing you can do is

lie, andly take a lie detector test and i would love for jon to take a lie detector test because for him to say there was no romance is a complete lie. >> okay. jon recently gave a very revealing interview that i'm certain you saw to abc's chris cuomu. and i want you to watch what he told chris about your relationship. >> okay. this is funny. >> so kate major was a romantic fling, but it was not a girlfriend. >> no romantic fling. >> she'd tell stories. >> she'd tell stories. >> you heard that. she'd tell stories. there was no romance. what goes through your head when you hear that? it's got to make you pretty angry. >> of course, it makes me angry. of course, before he wasn't saying anything. he was beating around the bush. yeah, i laughed because i can tell he's lying with his body lab gaj and how he got very nervous. you know, it's a shame that he's a liar. >> did you love him? >> no, no. i think i was in lust with him,

but, no, i did not love him. >> do you hate him now? >> i despise him. >> i can tell you job's firing back against the other kate. jon gosselin has always maintained that maintained the entire story line with kate majors is a fabrication trying to create a salacious story. he believes the public is smart enough to and the public doesn't need a lie detector to identify the intense stench of patent falsehoods. a lot of people think there's a new version of angelina jolie. it is definitely time to call in the showbiz truth squad. we'll set the record straight. this is "showbiz tonight" this weekend on hln. you something aboutll

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#. some friends says he was friendly and nice. others describe a darker side to this accused killer. neighbors say he controlled his fiancee. and a girlfriend said he once forced her to have sex against her will. co-workers say clark took his job very seriously. and sources reportedly say he complained that le had left several lab cages dirty. could this have led to annie le's murder? did custodial clark see himself

as lord of a lab? the hofstra co-ed who claims to be gang raped finds herself under the hot lights of the media. now it's her turn to be scrutinized. so why were prosecutors trying to protect her identity? after plastering pictures and names of the accused rapist all over the media. brace yourself for the very first look inside phillip garrido's house of horrors. new pictures released of this disgusting hell hole. it's a firsthand look at what police say was jaycee dugard's nightmare. the house is a complete dump. garbage everywhere. what insight does this give us into the sick mind of a rapist and accused kidnapper? "issues" starts now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com insight into the horrific murder of annie le. take a look at this. the new york daily

news reporting a trail of shocking physical evidence against raymond clark iii who was charged with punching and then strangling annie le. the daily news reports state dna tests prove, this is from the daily news, annie's blood is on clark's boots. which bizarrely have his name on them. the paper also says annie's dna and hair were found on raymond's body. the news adds, raymond clark's special green pen which he used to distinguish himself from his co-workers was also allegedly found in the lab basement after it fell into a crevice. you will not believe how he allegedly tried to retrieve the pen. the daily news reports that clark returned to work the next day with a backpack that contained wire, fishing hooks, and chewing gum to try to fish out the pen that got stuck in the crevice. does this guy think he's ma

gifr? ptic in hartford claims cops are interrogating a possible second lab worker. all of this, as a chilling portrait of clark as a "control freak at work" is coming into sharp relief. as for clark's high school buddies, they're not having any of it. they came to his defense last night on larry king. >> raymond clark is ray-ray -- i shouldn't even refer to him as raymond clark. ray-ray. he's now the -- as of right now, the suspect in the annie le slaying. >> this is not the raymond clark that i know. and honestly, at the time being, i can't say that i believe he's guilty. >> ray-ray? is that his nickname? tonight's big issue. a theory we proposed right here on "issues." did raymond clark fancy himself lord of the lab? we'll investigate what some say was his need to be in charge. i am taking your phone calls. but first, straight out to my

fantastic expert panel, drew findling, criminal defense attorney. lisa bloom, cnn legal analyst. and yale university law school graduate. pat brown, criminal profiler, and ceo of the pat brown criminal profiling agency. dr. dale archer, clinical psychiatrist. brian santoro, who is known raymond clark since 12 joins me by phone. first, randi kaye on the ground in new haven, connecticut. randi, you have some information about how they tracked raymond clark? tell us about it. >> reporter: i do, jane. we got to talk with a source today who has some very good knowledge of this investigation. he's very close to it. and he told me that they have been tracking raymond clark since before annie le's body was even found. he raised their suspicion when they saw him after viewing about 700 hours of videotape from the lab building security camera. they noticed him, i'm told, on that video walking out of the

building after someone, possibly him i'm told, pulled the fire alarm the day of the murder. they saw him on that videotape walking out of the building with his head in his hands looking especially distraught. i can also tell you tonight that they -- the same source with knowledge of the investigation is also telling me that they did confirm that the victim's dna was found on raymond clark's body. >> wow. okay. the victim's dna, now, i've got to get my head around that, lisa bloom. the victim's dna allegedly found on raymond clark's body. but it was a while between when she disappeared and then was found, and when they finally picked him up. and i remember asking the question, when they cuffed him, well, wouldn't he have had ample opportunity to wash his hands? >> he's got a problem, jane. according to one report that i've seen, he told police initially that he didn't even see her on the day that she disappeared. so he's stuck with that story.

he can't change it, and say, oh, well, i can explain my dna was on her because we hugged. we said hello. i gave her a kiss on the cheek. in the course of my lab work, i cut myself and i bled on her. all that is out, if indeed he made that statement and he didn't see her that day. i think of all of this dna evidence is true, it's over for him. it doesn't matter what the motive is. there's no explanation for it. >> ryan santoro, you know raymond clark. you hung out with him. is this the raymond clark that you know? >> i wouldn't necessarily say that i hung out with him. i haven't seen him for about six years. we played baseball from about 12 to 18 years old. we're both the same age. >> okay, then you hung out with him from 12 do 18 years old, with all due respect, if you played baseball with him. it's a slow game, it lasts a long time. >> it's definitely not the ray i know, or knew. absolutely not. a lot of me and my teammates

were absolutely shocked over what's going on. >> i'm going to read some information here and then get your reaction to it. clark allegedly sent annie le e-mails talking about her lack of hygiene issues. now we're hearing chilling descriptions of his behavior with co-workers and they could support our theory that clark called himself lord of the lab. they speculate concern was his need to be in charge. they described him, abc news quotes a co-worker who called him a control freak, very officious and very demanding. so ryan santoro, you played ball with him. does that match the person you knew? >> not really. he just played the game competitively and went out and played hard. i wouldn't necessarily see him as a control freak or anything along those lines. then again, like you said, they're all theories. when it comes down to it, i think the facts need to play

themselves out. in the long run, it's definitely not the person i knew. and a lot of people change from when they turn 18 to 24. >> that's for sure. sometimes the ones who seem like the most clean-cut end up being the kids that you've got to watch out for. and sometimes the ones that look like they're trouble end up being the pussycats, you know. you can never tell. >> jane, one small point. a lot of guys who commit acts of violence against women are very friendly with their male friends. we're not seeing any ex-girl friends coming out of the woodwork saying what a great guy he is. >> as a matter of fact, there's an ex-girlfriend who according to published reports that i cannot confirm allegedly called cops when she tried to break up with him when they were back in high school. and according to that police report, she reportedly said that he forced her at one point to have sex against her will, although no charges were ever filed, because she continued the relationship for a while. >> i think that you often see that with an abusive individual.

lisa's exactly right, they're very, very friendly and seem totally normal to their male friends. but with their girlfriends, is when the controlling nature really comes to the front. but i really think that what we have here is not the fact that he was a lab control freak, or that he was efficient or demanding, we all know efficient, demanding people that can be very good at their job. i still stand by the point that this was unrequited love. >> me, too. >> 90% of america has suffered unrequited love. we've actually done psychiatric studies on this and we know how horrible it is. >> i've suffered unrequited love. i didn't bludgeon somebody. i suffered it several times. i just made a fool of myself, that's all i did. >> most of us go through it. and we're sad or wiser and said, just because i love somebody, doesn't mean they're going to love me. for somebody who's right on the edge, this stress can be enough to tip them over the edge. >> let me go to my panel for a second. let's look at the whole panel.

has anybody here not suffered unrequited love, raise your hand. okay. so everybody has suffered it. all right? so that's -- i understand what you're saying, but that's no excuse. >> that's very important, though, it's not an excuse, but for somebody who is already right to that edge, this stress can be enough to tip them over the edge. i think that he went down in that lab not to murder her, but to profess his love to her with hope against hope that she was going to reciprocate to him. and when she did not, he absolutely snapped. this was a passionate and brutal and emotional murder. there were fabrics of the cloth found deep inside her neck. it takes five minutes to strangle somebody. so this was very emotional in nature. and love is the strongest human emotion. and when it's not returned in a person that's already on the edge, this can be the result. >> we're going to take a break. thank you so much for updating us on this story. all right. more on the brutal murder of

annie le in just a moment. we're also taking your calls on this, 1-877-586-7297. five young men nearly had their lives ruined by a college co-ed who lied about being randy by them. why are prosecutors trying to protect this girl's identity? but first, inside the mind of accused killer. was raymond clark living separate lives? some people describe the dark side of this accused killer. but friends see a totally different side. rogaine? >> at the time being, i can't buwas like, hey, this actually works. (announcer) only rogaine foam is shown to regrow hair in 85% of guys. i'll check it out and i'm like, nice., (announcer) rogain foam. stop losing. start gaining. if you're using other moisturizing body washes, you might as well be. you see, their moisturizer sits on top of skin, almost as if you're wearing it.

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[ chuckles ] [ female announcer ] swiffer dust & shine. in 2003, in high school, there was an altercation where ray became involved in that girl, and whether it came to physical or not, i do not know the extent of that. >> he never was arrested or anything like that. but it just didn't -- it just seemed like there was a problem within the relationship. and it was something between them two. >> in 2003, raymond clark's high school girlfriend filed a police report after what she says was "forced sex." listen to what ray's neighbor

had to say about his current relationship. >> i could just tell he was controlling over his girlfriend. and anytime she tried to talk to me, he would just say, let's go, hurry up. i didn't know him that well, but what i did know of him was that i did hear them yelling upstairs. mostly him yelling at his girlfriend. >> this current jennifer pictured here with raymond on the cbs.com website recently made headlines. last year she shot down rumors that an alleged affair between raymond and a co-worker at the lab on her myspace page, and there's just a mountain of evidence coming in. randi kaye, cnn correspondent, thanks for sticking around. you say you have some new information to give us. >> reporter: our source with pretty good knowledge of this investigation, jane, told me how they tracked raymond clark and how they eventually arrested him. it turns out they were tracking him from even before annie le's body was found. they actually went to his parents' home, which is about 24 miles away from the yale campus

where i am right now, and then on sunday, the day that the body was found, jane, he was playing softball and detectives were in the bleachers, in the stands watching him play softball, keeping an eye on him. and then, of course, we know they went to his apartment, that's when they demanded the dna samples, the saliva sample and a sample from under his fing nails as well. and eventually they tracked him down at that super 8 motel, also about 25 miles or so from here. and made the arrest. which is really interesting here is that they say at first they didn't want him to know they were tracking him. and that they were on his trail. but then eventually they did want him to. they were almost baiting him, walking around, making sure their badges were displayed when they were walking around his apartment almost playing a mind game, hoping he would come out and talk to them and maybe even confess. >> fascinating stuff. pat brown, i am always stunned when i say when somebody is suspected a horrific crime and does something like play softball. i mean, that's chilling if he

did this. >> it's a little creepy, yes. jane, i want to go back to the unrequited love thing. i'm happy about what i hear, because i've been angry all day about this. he killed a girl over some dirty cages. that's just ridiculous. the unrequited thing is not unrequited love but unrequited, why can't i get the cheerleader. i'm not the most successful guy in the world. six years out of high school, i'm cleaning rat cages. here i have this girl in front of me. annie le is stunningly beautiful, brilliantly educated, why can't i get that girl. that's an insult to anybody who has a psychopathic nature. they believe they're entitled to that. if a woman doesn't respond to them when they want that woman, that's an insult to me. how dare you turn me down. >> remember, he was a member of the asian awareness club in high school. and she's vietnamese-american. rachel in florida, your question or thought? >> caller: hi, jane. i was wondering, what

factually -- have they questioned his fiancee or talked to her? they're talking to his high school, and his friends. have they faukd to his fiancee? what exactly is she saying? >> i'm sure, lisa bloom, that they've interviewed his fiancee. first of all, she worked at the lab along with his brother-in-law and sister. >> i'm sure they have tried to. she may have refused to cooperate. remember, the people that we're seeing on tv are the people who have agreed to give media interviews. it's not the same group that have talked to the police. she may very well have given a police interview. she certainly has not spoken to the media yet. and i'm sure all the morning show bookers are circling her house trying to get that interview with her. so far she's kept her mouth shut. >> wtic reporting today cops are interrogating another lab employee in annie le's murder. >> are you saying it's possible there could be more arrests? >> you never know where the evidence will take you. i don't have any reason to

believe that, but as i told you before, we don't have tunnel vision here. >> all right. we just mentioned raymond clark's fiancee, brother and sister-in-law all work in that same animal testing lab. none has reportedly been inside the building since clark's arrest. clark spent an hour with annie le's lifeless body before he left. so drew findling, the question, what did he do during that hour? obviously they could make phone calls before disposing of the body. >> clearly they'll put a time together and time line to see whether or not he was text messaging, making phone calls during that period of time. obviously they're going to make the allegation during that period of time if they believe he did it, which they do, that he was trying to secret away the evidence of the crime. that's fairly obvious. they're going to allege that. jane, i do want to say, though, i feel compelled to say there's a lot of conjecture about him lofrg and stuff like that. a psychopathic comment was made.

i can tell you right now the defense attorneys would be remiss not to look into psychological, psychiatric issues. remember, we're not necessarily talking about insanity, but you have to anticipate as a defense attorney in these public defenders will, mitigation. if you're getting slammed with dna, you have to start thinking about it. >> except -- except, dr. -- >> when he hides her body in a wall. this sounds like premeditated to me. >> wait a second. the president of yale said there's nothing in his history that would lead us to believe he could be capable of murder. >> i doubt that the president of yale spending time with willard over here, okay -- >> let's not insult the animals while we're talking about this. >> no, no, hold -- i think ben was the animal. willard was the owner. but as dr. archer will tell you, though, most mental illnesses so often start manifesting themselves in the early 20s. >> oh, please. >> jane, you make a good point about the imals. there was a good "new york

times" piece how people worked in this particular lab and had to kill animals on a regular basis became desensitized. >> when you kill, you become accustomed to killing. thank you, fantastic panel. disgusting video inside phillip garrido's hell hole. announcer: "it looks like nothing else on the road right now," proclaims "gq" magazine. did you see that? the interior "positively oozes class," raves "car magazine." "slick and sensuous," boasts "the washington times." "the most striking vw in recent memory," declares-- okay, i get it already.

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brace yourself for the very first look inside phillip garrido's house of horrors. more than 100 new photos were just released of this disgusting hell hole. it's a firsthand look at what police say was jaycee dugard's nightmare. what insight does this give into the sick mind of a rapist and accused kidnapper. plus, from battling panic attacks to becoming hln's morning sunshine, robin meade is going to be with us to talk about her shockingly honest new book at her once secret battle with anxiety attacks. what could be a bigger expression of self-confidence than jumping out of a plane, and free falling hundreds of feet.

that's exactly what the bubbly, beautiful host of "morning express" did with former president george h.w. bush. all the more reason to be shocked. there she is with the former prez. shocked that robin meade reveals in her new book that panic attacks almost caused her on-camera career to collapse. jump out of that plane, robin. three, two, one, there you go! wow. that's a person who lacks self-confidence? robin writes about her ordeal in stunning detail. so others can learn how she battled panic attacks and won. her amazing book, "morning sunshine" how to radiate confidence and feel it, too. we had a very revealing conversation about her struggles. robin, welcome. i read your book. and i really loved it. i want to congratulate you, first of all, to have the courage to honestly discuss a problem others might want to keep secret. why have you decided to tell this very personal story about your battle with your insecurities? >> yeah.

you know what, for a long time i kept it secret, too, and it did no service to me to keep it under wraps. to me the book is about my story, and the way i dealt with panic attacks, and anxiety. really debilitating panic attacks. but it's under the umbrella of self-confidence. because who among us has not had some issue with self-confidence. so i wrote this book, and i want people not buy a book and walk away and say i didn't learn anything from her. it's really revealing. i think it's funny sometimes in that i really put out there stuff that you wouldn't normally hear from a news anchor. like the things i have to have on my bed stand at night. >> that's one of the reasons i loved it, it was so honest and revealed so much. and they say you can save your face or you can save your hiney, i guess you chose to save your hiney. but robin, you lead what many see as a very charmed life. when i was reading the book i was like, wow, she was the homecoming queen, which almost every girl dreams of that.

you were also miss ohio. that has to be a huge validation. it seems like you were one of those people who had it all. but as they say, happiness is an inside job and we can't compare what's on the inside with what's on the outside. why such a disparity between what was the appearance and what was happening inside? >> yeah. so i think that my panic attacks and anxiety manifested themselves physically after a lifetime of really making my value, to me, my value was, whether someone liked me. so if someone didn't like me, and i couldn't make you like me, then i was almost of no value to myself. isn't that the weirdest thing? in other words, i was putting everyone else's opinion about me on a pedestal above my own opinion of myself. so my self-worth was whether they liked me or not. whereas a lot of people go, self-esteem is how you feel about how you look. it wasn't that for me. it was whether i could win you over. and what i could do to make you like me. that was my power. or where i was powerless. >> one of my favorite parts of the book, embracing your inner

bitch. i say that because it's in here. >> because it's jane velez-mitchell, we can say that. i love it. i haven't been able to say this on a tv show yet. i think when it comes to self-confidence, and really feeling self-esteem, so many of us will dismiss little parts of ourselves, that we don't want to embrace. we just want to say that's not really a part of me. for me, i wanted to be pollyanna, apparently, because i wanted to make you like me. so i would push away the -- part of me. which we all have. i don't mean you should fly around on a broom and zap your neighbor. but we have parts of us that aren't very likable that we keep hidden from the public. my husband deals with it at home, right? he has to deal with the -- all sides. i'm saying that i think in order to be really confident and have self-esteem, all of us need to embrace all those parts of our personality that we hide away.

you know, what is like being nice anyway. so many of us women i think are like, we should be nice. well, i think that you should be helpful to people and kind, but what is nice? where is that going to get you anyway? let's go on a campaign. >> i'm embracing my inner -- as of right now. watch out people. i'm not a people pleaser anymore. >> there you go. it's tough, because i think a lot of people are people pleasers. i fall in that category. jane, you admitted you've fallen in that category. that is what you call self-confidence. on the back of my book, it really touched the heart, i think, the issue. self-esteem comes from within. self-confidence is what you get from other people. self-esteem is right there. nobody can touch it. >> it's ego based to seek approval from people is an ego based thing. where as to be service to people, it's about helping others. i have to tell you, i read your book, and i did one of the exercises. because like you, i have problems. and you say, if you find out how your problem is benefiting you,

and you write it down, then you can get rid of that problem. so i took a problem that i have, which i won't share, and i wrote down three pages of how i was benefiting. first i thought just like you, i'm not benefiting. no, i was. i am benefiting. every problem we have, on some subconscious level, we're getting something out of it, otherwise we would let it go. i thought that was brilliant. >> thank you. it was a real mind flip if you can tell yourself, this thing i really hate and it is such a big, you know, mountain of a problem in my life, is really a benefit to me. so for me these panic attacks, i had them about ten years ago, on the air no less. i'm supposed to be a news anchor, journalist with the voice of information. and i could barely breathe for some reason. i started having these panic attacks. not stage fright, but panic attacks because i wanted to be perfect. i wanted the audience to like me. if i screwed up, oh, no, i might lose my job. so i had to do a mind flip and think, how are these panic attacks a benefit to me. well, they don't. they suck. but i had to make my mind go,

well, the panic attacks will make you examine why are you thinking this way that led to your body to manifest an anxiety attack? or, you know what, i wanted to find out what was wrong with my body, so i started eating good and i started exercising. so therefore, i had to come full circle and go, you know what, these are of benefit to me. you face your worst fear that is no longer your fear. >> i love it. i tell everybody out there, read this book. you will get something out of it. and do the exercises like i did. and you'll help eliminate some of your problems. robin meade, so great to talk to you. thank you so much for joining me. it was really great, exhilarating. i love the fact that we both love to talk about our problems, girlfriend. >> and on that note, look at jane's new book as well "i want." >> thank you so much. right back at you. great interview. back to the harsh reality of our show. shocking twist in the haleigh cummings case. misty croslin's brother recently arrested. now cops questioning him about haleigh's disappearance.

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and one of the inmates just happens to be misty croslin's brother. remember, misty, she's that chain smoking teenager married to haleigh's dad ronald. she was babysitting haleigh the night she was abducted. but claims to have slept through the entire thing. as if this case couldn't git any more bizarre, haleigh's dad was arrested after he allegedly got into a fight with family members. turns out he was fighting with misty's brother, hank, the same guy who was just questioned by police. did this fight have anything to do with haleigh's disappearance? do cops have any suspects? this family really has to get their act together if they have any hope of finding this precious child. and that is tonight's "top of the block." horrifying, and i mean horrifying new developments just in to hln. police have found another bone on phillip garrido's property. and cadaver dogs hit on a human scent. are human remains buried there? >> after the dog gave what is determined to be somewhat of a

tentative look at the -- or tentative feel for the cadaver, we brought in the second dog, and he also indicated on that particular part of the property. >> just now, cops announce ground penetrating radar confirmed there is something under that spot. is it a dead body? does this terrifying den hold clues into the abduction of two little girls? plus, gruesome new photos of phillip garrido's house of horrors. we're taking you deep inside the rapist and accused kidnapper's filthy, and i mean filthy, beyond comprehension filthy lair. did jaycee dugard's alleged captor hold other children hostage in this terrifying madhouse? check out what we spotted in garrido's dining room. how crazy is this. it looks like a portrait of garrido with a little girl. who is that little girl? police continue to dig through truckloads of trash searching

for bones, teeth, in this chilling interview from jail, garrido hints of the nightmares that occurred at his home. >> wait until you hear the story of what took place at this house. and you're going to be absolutely impressed. it's a disgusting thing that took place in the beginning. but i turned my life completely around, and to be able to understand it, you have to start there. >> oh, really. that's a completely turned-around life, that living room there. it will take days, the cops say the search will provide answers. straight out to my fantastic expert panel. criminal profiler, pat brown. let me ask you, what are those photos of that mind-boggling mess, just filth, disarray, gross stuff, piled -- the dirty dishes? it goes on and on, what does it say about this man's state of mind? >> i would say it's not terribly interested in that aspect of his life. he's too interested what he can control when it comes down to little people. what's really frightening is did

he get ahold of a couple of little girls prior to jaycee that didn't cooperate like jaycee did? you have to get the right kid. if the kid doesn't seem to go along with the program and objects too much, you know, you might want to get yourself another one. >> well, yeah, that's what's really scary. lisa bloom, they're saying that there are concrete slabs on the property, and those concrete slabs could hide the scent of human decomposition. that's why they brought in the cadaver dogs. archaeological dogs who can tell whether these are very old bones from, let's say, a native american burial ground, or if these bones are more recent. >> yeah. and if there's anybody capable of making a makeshift grave, it's phillip garrido. look at the elaborate structures of sheds and tents that he had in the backyard to hide jaycee and her two daughters. i think these photos of the home would be prima facie evidence in a court of law of child neglect if anybody knew that he had kids. but what about the probation officers who were supposed to be doing random home visits to his home.

they said they did do them. they said they didn't go into the backyard, but even if you went into the house and you saw that filth and the way this man was living, and you saw a picture of him with a little girl, good catch, by the way, shouldn't that have led to more of an investigation? how did they allow this man to go unsearched for so many years? >> you know what i think? dr. dale archer, the outside of the house, and i've seen photographs of it, looks neat. the inside obviously a total sty. i'm getting the feeling they didn't go in. the parole officers never went in. i'm getting the feeling this was just such window dressing, because the neighbors could have told them that they had teenage girls there. because they went to their parties. one step inside this house, as lisa just said, would show you everything you need to know that somebody is cuckoo for cocoa puffs. and yet they're like, he's on parole for a year after year, decade after decade, no problem. >> the smartest person in the whole case was the neighbor who called in and said, he is a psychotic sex addict. she was absolutely right.

and we know that one of the signs of psychosis is a thought disorder which is jumbled into logical thinking, often these folks manifest this externally with very filthy and cluttered living conditions. so i think this house should be a red flag that there was something. >> jane, i'm going to tell you, i've talked about it on this show before. politicians have taken the sexual registry which had good intent to go after predators, track predators, and they've expanded it and expanded it to cover false imprisonment and domestic cases. and these parole officers -- hold it a second. >> but this guy is convicted of kidnapping of a stranger and forcible rape. >> hold it a second. but the problem is, that the probation officers and parole officers that monitor people in the sexual registry are overworked. they're running around checking on people who shouldn't be on the registry. they should be looking after people like this person. but they don't have the opportunity.

the same thing we looked at when haleigh cummings' case first started. there were so many -- >> i don't buy it. and i don't think lisa bloom buys it either. >> i don't buy it. >> i think they're overstretched and you can only expect so much. if we the citizens don't fund them, we're not going to get the kind of searches that we want. but in this case, this is a guy who was convicted of grabbing a stranger, a 25-year-old back in 1977, taking her to a storage area that he had constructed for the purpose of raping her. and then raped her for many hours. that was what he was convicted of. this is a guy who should have been watched closely. since we know he skructs constructs special shelters for raping people, my r my goodness, how did they fail to check the backyard. >> the people that should be checking on him are checking on people they have no business checking on. it's something that needs to be addressed. it's hampering law enforcement. and ultimately what happens is, somebody is victimized for 19 years, because politicians got in the way, so they can get a few extra votes.

>> that is ridiculous to blame this on the politicians. >> i'm not going to blame everything on lack of funding. that's like a catch-all. everything's a lack of funding. you know what, sometimes it's a lack of brain power to put two and two together, when the neighbors are doing that. i just think that it's laziness, really, it's doing the least you can do. let me say one more thing. >> he should have gone to jail for life. you could end all of this problem. any man who steps across a line to abduct a stranger and put her in a shed and rape her, you don't have to go to a counselor and check anything out. >> it's not priority idsing cases where women and children are the victims. that's a factor as well. >> when the parole officer was called by those quick-witted law enforcement officers who saw this guy with his teenage daughters, the university of berkeley campus, she called them

and said, he's got two daughters and he's on parole. and they said, oh, no, he doesn't have daughters. maybe they're granddaughters. in other words, even when presented with the facts, the parole officer said, oh, you know, he doesn't have daughters. maybe they're granddaughters. >> -- not making the safety of women and children a priority. he doesn't have any granddaughters. he's a convicted rapist. put two and two together and prioritize the safety of girls and women. i think that's the key factor. >> and again, we're talking about taking one step inside the house, looking around, with a complaint that's been filed and saying, oh, wow, there is something wrong here. this needs to be investigated further because one look in that house, any trained individual would have known there is something going on we've got to investigate. >> it'd be more work to do. >> -- all right. hang on, everybody. hang on. phillip garrido admitted to using lsd and acid, this by the way national recovery month, great time to get sober. i've struggled with addiction. in my new book "i want" i detail

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tonight, live to connecticut and the sudden disappearance of a gorgeous young ivy league doctoral student just before she's set to walk down the aisle. the 24-year-old beauty's last spotted on grainy surveillance video walking into a yale research building. a false fire alarm mysteriously goes off in the building. people rush out. and annie le is never seen again. at nearly the exact hour, le set to walk down the aisle, wedding dress on a hanger in the closet, flowers ordered, the girl's body found stuffed in a two-foot wall

cable space there at yale's research building. bloody clothes found high over investigators' heads behind ceiling tiles. bombshell tonight. in the early morning hours, police storm a super8 motel 30 miles away to arrest 24-year-old yale lab technician raymond clark on murder one. clark, under police surveillance 24/7 for days in the late-night hours connecticut police opened the crime lab for emergency dna tests and, within hours, the arrest goes down. in the last hours, clark brought in full shackles to a new haven courtroom. there, for a hearing, including a reading, out loud, of formal murder charges. tonight, we confirm key card swipes placing clark at the crime scene just before and

after le is last seen alive. revealing he goes in and out of that lab no less than ten times. clark spending his work days cleaning cages that house experimental mice. in play tonight, multiple text messages between clark and his 90-pound victim. do they reveal motive for murder? reports clark sending murder victim le a text the very morning she's last seen alive. five days later, her body found stuffed inside a wall. clark reportedly covered with defensive wounds. also, blood evidence, including bloody surgical gloves and a bead -- a bead from le's necklace found torn from her throat on the floor of the crime scene. cause of death? traumatic asphyxiation due to neck compression.

le, manually strangled to death. and tonight, uncovered, an alleged history of stalking and harassing women. allegations from a former girlfriend claiming clark forced her to have sex then threatened her when she breaks it off. no charges ever filed. with a community and a university reeling, a family grieving, and a young groom left at the altar with a broken heart. tonight, we want justice for 24-year-old bride-to-be annie le. >> an arrest warrant was signed by the honorable judge fisher charging clark for the murder in the death of annie le. >> -- number 15, raymond clark, iii, m. clark i read you your

rights down stairs earlier in the presence of your attorneys and you understood those rights. >> yes, sir. >> raymond clark, 24 years of age was arrested at a motel in farmworth, connecticut. >> police have arrested a lab technician in the killing of yale grad student annie le. raymond clark's bond was set at $3 million. he was taken into custody in a motel near the campus. the arrest happened this morning. this after raymond clark was staying at a hotel that had been under surveillance from police. the police chief here in new haven made it clear that arrest was really hinging on dna samples being tested to the hundreds of pieces of evidence that they say they have gathered in this case. >> through our sources, there could be e-mails linking clark to le's murder. and from those e-mails and correspondence dealing with the treatment of lab animals. >> he did not enter a plea. investigators say he is the only

suspect. >> good evening. i'm nancy grace. i want to thank you for being with us. at almost the exact hour gorgeous young ivy league grad student annie le set to walk down the aisle, wedding dress on the hanger in the closet, flowers ordered, the girl's body found stuffed in a wall at yale university's research building. bombshell tonight. the arrest goes down. >> based upon numerous interviews, forensic evidence and information learned from viewing video surveillance, detectives have secured the arrest warrant for clark. >> the man suspected of killing a yale grad student is behind bars. >> nine police cars, sirens on, road was closed, we saw him taken out in handcuffs. >> ray clark, iii, walked into a new haven courtroom. his legs were shackled and

appeared to have redness on his left eye. his bond set at $3 million. >> it's obviously a very serious case. the bond set by judge fisher of $3 million is appropriate. >> authorities compared dna from his hair, fingernails and saliva, to more than 250 pieces of evidence collected at the scene at the lab. >> we don't have any other suspects at this time. we do have a lot of evidence. we still have to analyze. >> as far as how raymond clark's path crossed with annie le, the graduate student, they worked in the same building. his job was to look after laboratory mice. >> police there say they've had their eye really on raymond clark all along. >> mr. clark, i read you your rights. you understood those rights. >> yes. >> straight out to cnn correspondent mary snow joining us there at the police station. mary, thank you for being with us. can you explain to me the details of how the arrest went down? >> reporter: yes. nancy, tonight raymond clark is in a maximum security prison,

this after he was taken into custody shortly after 8:00 a.m. this morning. he was staying at a motel just about 30 miles outside of new haven. he was released on wednesday after police took him into custody to gain those dna but have kept him under surveillance ever since then. police swarmed that hotel. it was without incident he was arrested and taken here to the new haven police department to be processed and then over to court, where he was arraigned. he was not obligated to enter a plea in that arraignment today. and police are saying that because that arrest warrant was sealed the new haven police chief did not reveal details about the case, only to say that the arrest warrant was based on forensic evidence, on interviews and also on surveillance tape. in terms of the relationship that young had with le, he's -- would not comment on that, as

well, but only say this was a crime of workplace violence. >> that is interesting, mary snow. of course, the prosecution does not have to prove motive at trial. but, police refer to it as "workplace violence." i don't know what that means. because it's pretty rare that you manually strangle your 90-pound co-worker to death and stuff her body in the wall. any idea what he means by "workplace violence?" >> reporter: well, the police chief would not comment on reports that there had been some e-mail exchanges, this based on according to various reports, on the condition of some of these cages that contained the mice. the police chief wouldn't comment on that at all, but that gave us some indication into some of the conditions at work. he was the lab technician looking after mice. police describe the

relationship, he was the guy who would clean cages that these lab mice, where they were held. she was the ph.d. student who did research in that laboratory in the basement of that building at yale, where her body was found on sunday. >> mary snow, what he is doing bunked up at the motel6 when he has an apartment he shares with his fiancee just a few miles away? >> reporter: police had went into -- had gone into his apartment when he was taken into custody. they had been searching through that apartment and had executed two search warrants even yesterday. why he was at that motel, you know, police had said after they released him that he was free to go but that they were keeping him under surveillance. >> joining me right now al johns with 1010 radio, in court hours ago. clark, raymond clark, the lab technician charged in murder i in connection with the death of

a 24-year-old graduate student annie le. al jones, what happened in court, is the bail set and is that a tattoo i see on his arm? >> it's a tattoo on both arms. it was a strange court appearance as you can imagine. connecticut courts like most courts usually drag out. this was a very quick affair. they cleared the courtroom, took out all the traffic violation people. they brought in all the reporters. we all got a seat and within a matter of ten minutes they brought in raymond clark. there was also a camera and microphones in the courtroom, this for a first appearance. now, clark was wearing a striped polo shirt, bare arms, khakis no belt and chain irons. in fact, we could hear the irons clanking as he came walking into the courtroom, that was about the only sound. we couldn't really see any marks on his arms, of course the shirt would block any marks anywhere else. there was a noticeable bruise on his face. clark really had his head down throughout the three-minute proceeding, said almost nothing except to acknowledge he did understand his rights. bail set at $3 million and he

will be back on october 6th. >> al jones, it's my understanding that he has already given a statement to police and now if this is correct he's locked into this, by the way, that he blames the defensive wounds, to my understanding, bruises and scratches on the arms, the chest, the bare chest, the back, under the right eye, there's also bruises, scratches and abrasions. he's blaming all that on his three cats and injuries from a recent softball game. have you heard those reports? >> he did play softball on sunday. in fact, police surveillance teams were on him at the time. they had sent a narcotics unit to follow him since sunday. narcotics units, as you know, are covert by nature. on sunday they were doing it undercover. they did see him playing baseball. he did go to a local fair, did normal sunday things. no word of any cats and neighbors didn't know how many

cats he had in his apartment. >> al jones, is it true that, at this jailhouse -- i know mary referred to it as maximum security, but is it true that he has access to yoga classes, poetry classes, dance classes, a whole list of amenities, al? do we have that list, norm? >> i'm not sure what he's -- what he has at his disposal. it is a higher level jail than say the local correctional center. >> art classes, step aerobics, sculpture, dance, poetry, foreign language. what about it? let's quickly unleash the lawyers, we are taking your calls live. susan moss, john burris, michael mazzariello. susan moss. step aerobics, yoga, did you hear that? >> i don't know whether it's some sort of club med or a prison. but we're going to see how this

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authorities are relying on computer records detailing use of key swipe cards to gain access to parts of the lab including the basement. "the hartford current" report they indicate he was last to see her alive. >> the state medical examiner says the 24-year-old le was strangled to death.

>> what happened here could have happened anywhere. it says more about the dark side of the human soul than it does about anything else. >> straight back to al jones, reporter in court today when clark appeared in full shackle for an outloud reading of charges on murder one. so, you got a look at him in his khaki pants and nice looking polo shirt. what do the tattoos say on either arm? >> they really didn't say anything. more of a herringbone encircling his biceps. both of them halfway up the arm. with the short sleeves you could see it quite clearly. there was nothing spelled out or spelled out there. he had a dazed look on his face. >> what do you mean? >> herringbone-like thing in a pattern sort of like a sport coat but around his arm. >> so going around just below the elbow. >> a band between your elbow and shoulder. >> what, to like show off his muscles?

>> if you like that kind of thing, yes. >> okay. good to know. we are taking your calls but first to jean casarez, legal correspondent with "in session." jean, i want to find out about two things right now. what can you tell me about this former girlfriend that states he terrorized her and harassed her, made her have forced sex, that's rape, okay. everybody keeps saying forced sex. that is rape. no charges ever filed, number one. and, number two, i want to find out about these e-mails between him and the murder victim. what do you know on either of those two topics? >> all right, number one, nancy, the incidents you're talking about, 2003, raymond clark was in high school, he had a girlfriend. she wanted to break up with him. he retaliated by writing on her locker. the police were called in.

the school called them. end of incident. but then she and her mother went to the police station and she told the police that they were boyfriend and girlfriend but he forced her to have sex. that is what you are equating with sexual assault, rape. she would not fill out an affidavit so it was case closed before it even began, but she has reportedly when she saw he was a suspect she relived that 2003 incident. >> i wanted to find out about these e-mails that went back and forth between the 90-pound victim, annie le and this guy now charged with murder one. what do you know about these e-mails? >> it is reported the text messages or e-mails had maybe two different subject matters. one being that he, who maintained the cages and the animals, was upset at her, annie le, because she was leaving her cage in disorder or dirty or not in the condition that he wanted the cage left in. most importantly was it is being reported that there was a text message the morning of the day

she went missing, asking her to meet with him at the lab, that they were going to meet together. and that is evidenced by the key card access code. >> i want to talk about those swipes, everybody you are seeing photos of raymond clark we obtained from myspace. thomas kaplan, with us from the beginning. thomas, welcome. i want to talk about those swipe cards. putting him in and out of the building. no less, maybe more than ten times in those crucial hours including after work. >> so, it does appear that the record from these swipe cards are sort of a crucial piece of evidence in this case. to get anywhere in this building, this is a new building, you need to swipe the i.d. and a computer system records where you go. so, that's how the investigators can tell who was where and when. >> thomas kaplan, isn't it true he was going into rooms he typically had no business in? >> that is what some reports have said, yes, indeed. (announcer) carefree introduces protection, times ten.

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early this morning, police say dna evidence came back and it set off a sequence of events. >> raymond j. clark, iii, 24 years of age was arrested in the murder in the death of annie le. >> the warrant signed, booked into the police department and already in front of a judge. annie le was strangled to death in the lab where she worked. clark, who also worked there charged with doing it and trying to hide her body behind a wall in the lab's basement. >> there are two key pieces of evidence that could definitively

link clark to the scene and possibly to the crime itself. >> detectives looked at some 700 hours of video surveillance from inside and around the building, including a camera showing le -- >> we are taking your calls. out to winnifred in nevada. hi. >> caller: hi, nancy. >> thank you for calling in. what's your question, dear? >> caller: i've watched you since were you in georgia with your hair on top of your head. >> i only wish i could still put my hair on top of my head but i hardly have time to deal with it. with the twins. >> caller: i love your babies. i'm older than your mother and love to watch your family. my question is isn't it possible he threatened her in those text messages, that's why she rushed over there quickly and left all of her belongings in her apartment? >> that is an excellent question, because she did leave all her belongings behind but, jean, i thought she left all her belongings behind at another office. >> she did. she did leave it at the other office. but, nancy, this is so interesting, it goes with

winnifred's question. the president of yale university said in the upcoming weeks they are going to promote yale's zero tolerance policy for violent, threatening and abusive behavior. he linked those three words together. we know the violence is there. she was murdered by somebody. but, threatening and abusive? >> you know, winnifred in nevada may be on to something. jean, when do you expect the nature of these text messages to be released? i know that they were confronting her about her so-called treatment of the mice, in other words, cleaning or not cleaning the cages and keeping them clean. >> well, you know, nancy, they are keeping so much close to the vest, as you said, last friday, which was the second day on your show of this case and they said that there was no evidence of foul play and it's gone on from there, so i don't expect those text messages to be released anytime soon. >> you know, dr. bethany following up on winnifred's question and what jean told us and reported, so many times in

the workplace, especially women but people are afraid to speak out. if somebody's harassing you or threatening you, just like his alleged first victim didn't want to press charges. he raped her, according to her. she didn't want to press charges. and then vandalized her locker for everybody to see. but, it was all dropped, all swept under the rug. so many times in the workplace, you're afraid if you say something about how you're being treated, you'll the one that's penalized, you'll be the one that's blackballed. >> it's true to follow up on what winnifred said was he guilting her about the mice and she rushes over to make sure the cages are okay. i think when he said maybe you're neglecting the mice, maybe he was saying you are going to get married and leave me behind and that's neglecting me so i'm going to kill you. >> back to the lawyers -- susan moss, john burris, michael mazzariello, what about it? he's already spoken to police to some extent. now he's locked into those statements. >> well, that's true, he is locked into the statement,

depending on the questions that have been asked of him. i think from a defense point of view, you really have to kind of go slow here, you've got to wait because you don't really know what the evidence is. there's a lot of dna evidence but you don't know where that dna evidence is coming from, whether it really links him, any direct evidence or not from a defense point of view this is really a question of making sure you cover your bases but don't go too quickly because you don't know what he said or what evidence they have. from my point of view, you have to be careful here because you just don't really know and what your defense is going to be right at this moment. >> you know, isn't that ironic, michael, veteran trial lawyer, what burris is saying is absolutely true. it clinches my stomach, but it's true because what he's saying, michael, is, let's wait and see what the state's got before we come up with our defense. let's don't commit to anything right now, because in the end, we may have to go with something like insanity if the evidence is too strong. if it's not that strong we'll come up with some other who did it. >> what they already have is a

written statement which you're absolutely right, nancy, he's locked into that statement. try swaying -- >> come on, his cat did it? what was his cat doing on his back, on his bare chest? >> maybe the baseball slide while he was playing softball. he had all those scratches on his chest sliding into home plate. it's ridiculous. he's going to go to jail for the rest of his life. >> put michael up again, please. here's the problem with that. if he claims he was injured at the softball game they can bring in first base, second base, third base, shortstop, pitcher, catcher to say, no, i don't remember a ball hitting him or him sliding into any of the bases. >> if it's under the shirt, nancy -- >> he could turn out to be a liar on something as inconsequential as a softball game. >> nancy, if he had raspberries under his shirt, no be would see that. they have the detectives, narcotic agents watching him at the time and probably have photographs of it. if he didn't slide, he's done, nancy, he's absolutely done. making that statement without an attorney present was mistake

number one. >> out to ben levitan, telecommunications expert from raleigh, north carolina, an expert. the prosecution apparently has him going in and out, in and out, in and out obsessively even in areas where he's not supposed to be according to our sources even into that basement. he did have access there. but, around the time all of this was happening. how does that technology work? >> well, that's pretty standard, nancy. you see that -- that's a very mature technology. you see that on credit cards. it's just magnetic strips. even if you check into a hotel and get a electronic keycard simply a database is created for you at the security site, probably yale security. and in that -- when you swipe your magnetic card it simply sends your identification

information back to the security database. the database checks to see if you're authorized to enter that area. and that was done ahead of time. if you are, the door unlocks. this is not technology that can be lawyered, if you want to call it that. it's very secure. >> well, unless they have cameras, they could easily argue that his swipe card was missing or stolen. there's all sorts of ways to get around that. but, there's a little problem of alleged dna evidence. to woody tripp, former police commander joining us from the atlanta jurisdiction, woody, what about the fact that you could claim some type of accident regarding those bloody clothes if it is, in fact, the victim's blood, if it's the defendant's blood, you can claim all sorts of things about it to explain it away. innocently. but, the fact that it was then hidden up above the investigators' heads, behind the ceiling tiles, if it had been an innocent accident that caused blood on the clothing, it wasn't her clothing.

she was dressed in her clothes that she's spotted in on that photo we keep showing. but now that it's hidden, that gives it a nefarious interpretation, woody. >> absolutely, it does. and i don't know of anyone that's going to hide their clothes that are bloodied in a ceiling tile or anywhere else. if it's an accident, it's an accident. you don't hide your clothes. >> what do you make of this guy? >> you've seen the photos. he's buff, clearly works out, the tattoos, accentuating his arm muscles, his guns, so to speak. >> what do you make of this guy? the victim was a 90-pound asian woman and, i've learned, that he was a member of an asian appreciation club. >> i find that very interesting. and certainly, we know that many times, you know, in the asian culture, they're subservient to males many times, females are. there is a rage there. there is a very controlling and absolutely from everything that

we've learned about him, there's definitely, you can see it. he's definitely very focused. >> to wesley tack joining us tonight, a friend of the murder suspect, raymond clark, iii, everyone you are seeing private video of annie le in 2005 from abc's "good morning america." wesley, you are a friend of raymond clark's. what do you make of all this? >> [ inaudible ]. >> i believe i have wesley tack with me. are you there? >> yes, i am. hello. >> hi, wesley, thank you for being with us. does all of this come as a huge surprise to you? were there any hints in his personality? >> uh, no, i can't say that there were. he was always perfectly sociable to me. he never said a cross word to me. he was a bit of a hell-raiser in elementary school, but nothing out of the ordinary. >> what was he like in high school? how would you describe him and were you aware of that incident with his high school girlfriend?

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get 40% off this bonded leather sofa, just $299, with very cool styling and so affordable. at 40% off, just $299. from jennifer. an arrest warrant was signed by the honorable judge fisher charging clark for the murder in the death of annie le. >> from the moment we first saw him in the back of that cop car, people have been wondering who is raymond clark? we know he worked in the building where annie le did research and where her body was found. >> mr. clark has been a lab

technician at yale since december 2004. his supervisor reports that nothing in the history of his employment here gave any indication that his involvement in such a crime might be possible. >> straight out to dr. michael bell, palm beach county chief medical examiner, thank you for being with us. we know she was extremely petite, weighing in at only 90 pounds. but how could you stuff a human body into a two-foot cable space? >> you'd be surprised what you can fit a body into. i've seen them stuffed into suitcases. even smaller metal containers so while it's unusual, it's far from rare. >> and what do you make of the formal -- the official cause of death that it's finally been released, the traumatic asphyxiation? how is that different from any other strangulation?

>> you know, it's interesting the way it's worded, because usually i reserve those terms for deaths that are due to like neck holds, bar holds, rather than manual strangulation. usually if it's a strangulation, i call it a strangulation. >> back to wesley tack joining us tonight, a special guest. friend of raymond clark iii, suspect in this murder case. thank you for being with us. you could, in your own words, describe raymond clark's personality? >> raymond was somewhat reserved in high school. a little on the quiet side. not so much that it would put you off. he was always friendly towards me. he was a good artist. i remember he was very neat, very fastidious. he had very neat penmanship. he was very well-groomed. but, nothing really stood out about his personality that would

really put you off. i remember -- >> go ahead. >> i do remember that, when -- when in a heated baseball game, he might occasionally lose his temper but no more so than any other athlete i've seen on fields, so -- >> what do you know, wesley tack, about him being a member of the asian appreciation club? >> the asian awareness club. >> okay. >> the asian awareness club was part of -- was a part of cultural diversity at high school and it was a club that promoted tolerance and understanding of asian cultures in the school. >> hmmm. and what prompted him to be a member of that club? >> i couldn't venture a guess. um, i think it was mostly because he had friends who were asian. >> everyone, you are seeing high school photos that we have obtained of raymond clark, iii. with us, wesley tack, a friend of his at that time.

and through the years. we are taking your calls live to janice in oklahoma. hi, janice. >> caller: hi, nancy. i love your show and i think it's wonderful how you speak for people whose voices have been silenced. >> janice, i really, really appreciate you saying that. what is your question, dear? >> caller: my question is, if he's been possessive with other women, could it be that was stalking annie le for quite a while before he killed her? >> excellent question. dr. bethany marshall out of l.a., what about it, bethany? >> i think that's a great likelihood and i think in the face -- possibility in the face of her impending wedding there was a built-up of unbearable distress, homicidal rage and that he could only neutralize that by killing her. the idea of the wedding made her feel that he could no longer control the victim, that she was rejecting him and that in fantasy they had a special relationship. and when you go back to the

cages, he's the one that was supposed to keep the cages clean, not her. so, he's making this accusation that she's neglecting the mice. maybe he feels she's neglecting him, in his own crazy little way. >> back to the lawyers, susan moss, john burris, michael mazzariello. susan, would you have expected to see if there was a sex assault those charges today, or do you think it depends on further lab testing? >> i think it's going to depend on further lab testing and the dna. they still can bring more than a more charges to this guy but if his dna on this yaly, you can bet he'll spend his life in jaily. the reality is, the science is so good now, that if there was a sexual assault, we're going to know about it through the dna evidence. >> what about it, john burris? >> that's probably true. it wouldn't surprise me they are able to come up with that in a very near future. he's going to be charged with murder one, it sounds to me. >> what? >> then the question is -- >> did you say he's not going to be charged with murder one? >> no, i said he will be charged

with murder one, given the evidence that we have. and if you add another charge to it, i don't know that it matters that much unless you want to go to the death penalty, which i don't know if connecticut has that. certainly the more important question is the murder and the defense has got to deal with that. sexual assault or not. >> michael mazzariello, there is a death penalty in connecticut. and i imagine what they're doing right now, if there had been any semen on or about her body, i mean, she had a fiance. they've got to do a dna comparison there to determine the origin of that. >> absolutely. and he has no priors but it's certainly a death penalty-eligible case due to the violence and if she was sexually assaulted, that makes it even worse. a jury is just not going to like to hear that, that's for sure. >> jean, what about the d.p. in connecticut? >> right, they have it. in order to be eligible for it or life in prison without the possibility of parole you have to have special circumstances one being a sexual assault, we

don't know about that. another is kidnapping, i looked up the meaning, abduction and restraint. the buzz words in connecticut. abduction can be a restraint so someone cannot have freedom. someone cannot have freedom. >> taking your calls live but right now we recognize a tiny crime fighter, a second grader, 7-year-old presley. loves hannah montana, reading, spending time with her kitty cat. she is on her way to becoming a prosecutor. tonight thoughts and prayers lieutenant anderson and soldiers of the 244th brigade. with them, command sergeant major glen bowens. tonight their message, all their love home to their families and wives.

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