brace yourself for the very first look inside phillip garrido's house of horrors. more than 100 new photos were just released of this disgusting hell hole. it's a firsthand look at what police say was jaycee dugard's nightmare. what insight does this give into the sick mind of a rapist and accused kidnapper? plus, from battling panic attacks to becoming hln's morning sunshine, robin meade is going to be with us to talk about her shockingly honest new book at her once secret battle with anxiety attacks. what could be a bigger expression of self-confidence than jumping out of a plane, and free falling hundreds of feet? that's exactly what the bubbly, beautiful host of "morning

express" did with former president george h.w. bush. all the more reason to be shocked. there she is, with the former prez. shocked that robin meade reveals in her new book that panic attacks almost caused her on-camera career to collapse. jump out of that plane, robin. three, two, one, there you go! that's a person who lacks in self confidence? robin writes about her ordeal in stunning detail. so others can learn how she battled panic attacks and won. her amazing book, "morning sunshine:how to radiate confidence and feel it too." we had a very revealing conversation about her struggle. robin, welcome. i read your book. and i really loved it. i want to congratulate you, first of all, on having the courage to honestly discuss a problem others might want to keep secret. why have you decided to tell this very personal story about your battle with your insecurities? >> yeah. you know what, for a long time i kept it secret, too, and it did no service to me to keep it under wraps.

to me, the book is about my story and the way i dealt with panic attacks, anxiety, really debilitating panic attacks. but it's under the umbrella of self-confidence. because who among us has not had some issue with self confidence? so i wrote this book, and i want people not buy a book and walk away and say i didn't learn anything from her. it's really revealing. i think it's funny sometimes that i'm really put out there, that it's stuff that you wouldn't normally hear from a news anchor, like all my little neurocies, like what i have to have on my bedstand every night. >> that's one of the reasons i loved it, it was so honest and revealed so much. and they say you can save your face or you can save your heinie, i guess you chose to save your heinie. but robin, you lead what many see as a very charmed life. when i was reading the book i was like, wow, she was the homecoming queen, which almost every girl dreams of that. you were also miss ohio. that has to be a huge validation. it seems like you were one of those people who had it all.

but as they say, happiness is an inside job and we can't compare what's on the inside with what's on the outside. why such a disparity between what was the appearance and what was happening inside? >> yeah. so i think that my panic attacks and anxiety manifested themselves physically after a lifetime of really making my value, to my value was, whether someone liked me. so is someone didn't like me, and i couldn't make you like me, then i was almost of no value to myself. isn't that the weirdest thing? in other words, i was putting everyone else's opinion about me on a pedestal above my own opinion of myself. so my self-worth was whether they liked me or not. whereas a lot of people go, self esteem is about how you feel about how you look. it wasn't that for me. it was whether i could win you over. and what i could do to make you like me. that was my power. or where i was powerless. >> one of my favorite parts of the book, embracing your inner bitch. i can say that, because it's in here.

>> because it's jane velez-mitchell, we can say that, all right? i love it. i haven't been able to say this on a tv show yet. i think when it comes to self confidence and really feeling self esteem, so many of us will dismiss little parts of ourselves that we don't want to embrace and say that's really not part of me. to me, i wanted to be polyanna, apparently, because i wanted to make you like me. so, therefore, i would conceal that bitchy part of me. i don't mean you should fly around on a broom and zap your neighbor. but we have parts of us that aren't very likable that we keep hidden from the public. my husband deals with it at home, right? he has to deal with the -- all sides. i'm saying that i think in order to be really confident and have self esteem, all of us need to embrace all those parts of our personality that we hide away. you know, what is like being nice anyway. so many of us women i think are like, we should be nice.

well, i think that you should be helpful to people and kind, but what is nice? where is that going to get you anyway? embrace the bitch. >> i'm embracing my inner bitch right now. watch out, people! i'm not a people pleaser anymore. >> through go. it's tough, because i think a lot of people are people pleasers. i fall in that category. jane, you admitted you've fallen in that category. that is what you call self-confidence. on the back of my book, it really touched the heart, i think, the issue. self-esteem comes from within. self-confidence is what you get from other people. self-esteem is right there. no one can touch it. >> it's ego based to seek approval from people is an ego-based thing. where as to be service to people, it's not about your ego, but it's about helping others. i have to tell you, i read your book, and i did one of the exercises. because like you, i have problems. and you say, if you find out how your problem is benefiting you, and you write it down, then you can get rid of that problem. so i took a problem that i have,

which i won't share, and i wrote down three pages of how i was benefiting. first i thought just like you, i'm not benefiting. no, i was. i am benefiting. every problem we have, on some subconscious level, we're getting something out of it, otherwise we would let it go. i thought that was brilliant. >> thank you. it is a real mind flip if you can tell yourself, this thing i really hate and it is such a big, you know, mountain of a problem in my life, is really a benefit to me. so for me these panic attacks, i had them about ten years ago, on the air no less. i'm supposed to be a news anchor, journalist with the voice of information. and i could barely breathe for some reason. i started having these panic attacks. not stage fright, but panic attacks because i wanted to be perfect. i wanted the audience to like me. if i screwed up, oh, no, i might lose my job. so i had to do a mind flip and think, how are these panic attacks a benefit to me? well, they don't. they suck! but i had to make my mind go, well, the panic attacks will make you examine why are you

thinking this way that led to your body to manifest an anxiety attack or, you know what? i wanted to find out what was wrong with my body, so i started eating good and i started exercising. so therefore, i had to come full circle and go, you know what, these are a benefit to me. you face your worst fear that is no longer your fear. >> i love it. i tell everybody out there, read this book. you will get something out of it. and do the exercises like i did. and you'll help eliminate some of your problems. robin meade, so great to talk to you. thank you so much for joining me. it was really great, exhilarating and i love the fact that we both love to talk about our problems, girlfriend. >> and on that note, look at jane's new book as well "i want." >> thank you so much. right back at you. great interview. back to the harsh reality of our show. a shocking twist in the haleigh cummings case. misty's brother recently arrested and now cops questioning him about haleigh's disappearance. plus, new pictures of phillip garrido's house of horrors.

this place is a mess. but what does it tell us about the alleged kidnapper? we're taking your calls, peoplei . (announcer) neutropéna tone correcting night serum with high performance soy to even skin tone and active retinol to speed cell turn over. clinically shown to visibly fade brown spots in 14 nights. i even out my skin at night so it looks younger, flawless in the morning. (announcer) neutrogena tone correcting now you can fade and prevent discolorations all day. new tone correcting spf 30.

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it's how business gets into the rhythm of saving. regions - it's time to expect more. a firsthand look inside phillip garrido's twisted world. new pictures just released. we're going to show you the hell hole where he allegedly kept jaycee dugard. but first tonight's "top of the block." a bizarre new twist in the haleigh cummings disappearance. cops question four, count them, four prison inmates for missing 6-year-old haleigh. and one of the inmates just happens to be misty croslin's brother. remember, misty, she's that

chain smoking teenager married to haleigh's dad ronald. she was babysitting haleigh the night she was abducted. but claims to have slept through the entire thing. remember, last month, haleigh's dad was arrested after he allegedly got into a fight with family members. turns out he was fighting with misty's brother, hank, the same guy who was just questioned by police. did this fight have anything to do with haleigh's disappearance? do cops have any suspects? this family really has to get their act together if they have any hope of finding this precious child. and that is tonight's "top of the block." horrifying, and i mean horrifying new developments just in to hln. police have found another bone on phillip garrido's property. and cadaver dogs hit on a human scent. are human remains buried there? >> after the dog gave what is determined to be somewhat of a tentative look at the -- or tentative feel for the cadaver,

we brought in the second dog, and he also indicated on that particular part of the property. >> just now, cops announce ground penetrating radar confirms there is something under that spot. is it a dead body? does this terrifying den hold clues into the abduction of two little girls? plus, gruesome new photos of phillip garrido's house of horrors. we're taking you deep inside the rapist and accused kidnapper's filthy, and i mean filthy, beyond comprehension filthy layer. did jaycee dugard's alleged captor hold other children hostage in this terrifying madhouse? check out what we spotted in garrido's dining room. how crazy is this? it looks like a portrait of garrido with a little girl. who is that little girl? police continue to dig through truckloads of trash searching for bones, teeth, in this chilling interview from jail, garrido hints of the nightmares

that occurred at his home. >> wait until you hear the story of what took place at this house. and you're going to be absolutely impressed. it's a disgusting thing that took place in the beginning. but i turned my life completely around, and to be able to understand it, you have to start there. >> oh, really? that's a completely turned-around life, that living room there. it will take days, the cops say the search will provide answers. straight out to my fantastic expert panel. pat brown, criminal profiler. let me ask you, what are the photos of that mind-boggling mess, filth, disarray, gross stuff, piled, the dirty dishes, it goes on and on, what does it say about this man's state of mind? >> i would say it's not terribly interested in that aspect of his life. he's too interested in what he can control when it comes down to little people. what's really frightening is did he get ahold of a couple little girls before jaycee that didn't cooperate the way jaycee did?

it takes a while -- you have to get the right kid. if the kid doesn't seem to go along with the program and objects too much, you know, you might want to get yourself another one. >> well, yeah, that's what's really scary. lisa bloom, they're saying that there are concrete slabs on the property, and those concrete slabs could hide the scent of human decomposition. that's why they brought in the cadaver dogs, archaeological dogs who can tell whether these are very old bones, let's say a native american burial ground, or if these bones are more recent. >> yeah. and if there's anybody capable of making a makeshift grave, it's phillip garrido. look at the elaborate structures of sheds and tents that he had in the backyard to hide jaycee and her two daughters. i think these photos of the home would be prima facie evidence in a court of law of child neglect if anybody knew that he had kids. but what about the probation officers who were supposed to be doing random home visits to his home? they said they did do them, but didn't go into the backyard.

but even if you went into the house and you saw this fill the and the way this man was living -- and you saw this picture of a little girl, good catch, by the way -- shouldn't that have led to more of an investigation? how did they allow this man to go unsearched for so many years? >> you know what i think? dr. dale archer, the outside of the house, and i've seen photographs of it, looks neat. the inside obviously a total sty. i'm getting the feeling they didn't go in. the parole officers never went in. i'm getting the feeling this was just such window dressing, because the neighbors could have told them that they had teenage girls there. because they went to their parties. one step inside this house, as lisa just said, would show you everything you need to know that somebody is cuckoo for cocoa puffs.

yet they're like, he's on parole for year after year, decade after decade, no problems. >> the smartest person in the whole case was the neighbor who called in and said, he is a psychotic sex addict. she was absolutely right. and we know that one of the signs of psychosis is a thought disorder, which is jumbled into logical thinking, often these folks manifest this externally with very filthy and cluttered living conditions. so i think this house should be a red flag to any trained individual. >> that's what i said. i don't think they looked inside, drew! >> jane, i'm going to tell you -- jane, i've talked about it on this show before. politicians have taken the sexual registry which had good intent to go after predators, track predators, and they've expanded it and expanded it to cover false imprisonment and domestic cases. and these parole officers -- >> but this guy is convicted of kidnapping of a stranger and forcible rape. >> hold it a second. but the problem is, that the probation officer and parole officers that monitor people in the sexual registry are overworked. they're running around checking on people who shouldn't be on the registry. they should be looking after people like this person, but they don't have the opportunity. the same thing we looked at when haleigh cummings' case first started.

there were so many -- >> i don't buy it. and i don't think lisa bloom buys it either. >> i don't buy it. >> i think they're overstretched and you can only expect so much. if we the citizens don't fund them, we're not going to get the kind of searches that we want. but in this case, this is a guy who was convicted of grabbing a stranger, a 25-year-old back in 1977, taking her to a storage area that he had constructed for the purpose of raping her. and then raped her for many hours. that was what he was convicted of. this is a guy who should have been watched closely. since we know he constructs special shelters for raping people, my goodness, how did they fail to check the backyard. >> the people that should be checking on him are checking on people they have no business checking on. it's something that needs to be addressed. it's hampering law enforcement. and ultimately what happens is, somebody is victimized for 19 years, because politicians got in the way, so they can get a few extra votes. the problem is the sexual registry. >> that is ridiculous to blame this on the politicians. >> i'm not going to blame everything on lack of funding.

>> it isn't lack of funding. >> that's like a catch-all. everything's a lack of funding. you know what, sometimes it's a lack of brain power to put two and two together, when the neighbors are doing that. >> absolutely. >> i think it's laziness, really. it's doing the least you can do. let me say this. let me say one more thing. >> the real problem here is he should have gone to jail for life. he should have gotten life. can you end all of this problem. any man who steps across a line to abduct a stranger and put her in a shed and rape her, you don't have to go to a counselor don't have to worry about the parole officers, and check anything out. >> prioritizing cases where women and children are victims. that's a factor as well. >> when the parole officer was called by those quick-witted law enforcement officers who saw this guy with his teenage daughters, the university of berkeley campus, she called them and said, he's got two daughters and he's on parole. and they said, oh, no, he doesn't have daughters.

maybe they're granddaughters. in other words, even when presented with the facts, the parole officer said, oh, you know, he doesn't have daughters. maybe they're granddaughters. that, to me -- >> not making the safety of >> not making the safety of women and children a priority. he doesn't have any granddaughters. he's a convicted rapist. put two and two together and prioritize the safety of girls and women. i think that's the key factor. >> absolutely. >> again, we're talking about taking one step inside the house looking around with a complaint that's within filed saying, oh, wow, there is something wrong here. this needs to be investigated further. one look in the house, any trained individual would have known there is something going on. >> it would be more work. it would be more paperwork to do. all right. hang on, everybody. hang on. phillipe garrido admitted to using lsd and acid. this, national recovery month."f

how i got sober 14 years ago. click on cnn.com/jane. look for the order section. they say the only thing that has to change is everything. that's exactly what happened to. me. it's a shocker and more shocker from the garrido house of choose between paying their credit card or putting food on the table. our main objective is to reach out to the customers that are falling behind on their payments. a lot of customers are proud and happy that bank of america actually has a solution to help them out. i listen. that's the first thing i do is i listen. you know what, what happened? what put you in this situation? and everyone's situation is different. we always want to make sure that we're doing what's best for our cardholders. i'll go through some of his monthly expenses, if he has a mortgage payment, if he pays rent. and then i'll use all that information to try and see what kind of a payment he financially can handle. i want to help you., bank of america wants to help you,

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discover gives you a cash back bonus on every single purchase. what you do with it is up to you. what will you get back with your cash back? it pays to discover. he tied my head to my knees and my hands were handcuffed behind my back. he threw a coat over my head so i was below visibility in the car and he took me to a warehouse in reno. in a new warehouse in reno. in a very desolate area. >> larry: were you fearing for your life? >> i was. i thought i was dead. >> catherine callaway-hall kidnapped and raped by phillip garrido. he went to prison but was paroled 40 years early. then he allegedly kidnapped jaycee dugard. cops are searching his property to find out if he has more victims and they're coming up with bones. the question is, are they human bones? all right. the phone lines lighting up on

this one. amira, florida, your question or thought, ma'am? >> caller: hello. >> hi, we're on the air. >> caller: hi. my thought or question is, looking in his house, very disorganized and messy, could that aspect of his life reflect his need to control, for example, jaycee dugard and control these women? could that be some sort of psychological -- >> dr. dale? >> no. i think the messiness was a result of his psychosis. i think this man was psychotic and that was manifest externally in the filth and dirt and grime that was in the house. but he also had a psychopathic side and sexual addiction side. that's what prompted him to go out and commit these rapes and kidnappings and all of the atrocities that he did. so i think that the two were interlinked but they're not the same thing. >> all right. this search could blow two cold cases wide open.

michaela garrett abducted in 1988. katrina rodriguez was the only witness. she told abc she was shocked when she saw garrido's face and car on television. >> i have not seen a photo that looks more like michaela's kidnapper than his. put a pit right in my stomach. i called michaela's mother right away and told her, you know, this could be the car. >> here is the very sketch katrina helped police draw in 1988. there's garrido's mug shot from the time with the long hair. pat brown, the resemblance is bone chilling. >> and not surprising. because i don't think this just started -- we know it didn't start with jaycee. there's always a long, long, long history of this. it's pretty sad, but i don't think they'll find a good ending with it. >> well, they've got at least one bone that they say is probably human, drew findling. now they're digging up for other bones, finding other bones, having them tested to see if they're human or animal.

then we heard cadaver dogs hit on a location and those cadaver dogs hit when they spot human decomposition. >> listen, i may be a criminal defense attorney but i have spent half my life doing this work. there's not going to be a good ending to this. i looked at the picture. it is uncanny. i will tell you from cases 234 the past, it just didn't start with this young lady. this has probably been going on for a while. >> this is right after he got out of prison. >> again, i don't want to confuse the fact that this guy was on the registry, jane. in other words, there were certain rules he had to follow and had to be monitored regarding his involvement with children, even his own children. that's what makes this so inexcusable. >> we have to leave it right there. a benefit concert this weekend at south lake tahoe to raise money for jaycee. her step dad plans to go. way to go, community. i love to hear that. thank you, fabulous panel. remember, click on cnn.com/jane, preorder your copy of my book "i want." you're watching "issues." ÷

breaking news tonight -- live to connecticut and the sudden disappearance of a gorgeous young ivy league doctoral student just before she's set to walk down the aisle. the 24-year-old beauty last spotted on grainy surveillance video walking into a yale research building. a false fire alarm mysteriously goes off in the building. people rush out. annie le is never seen again. and nearly the exact hour le set to walk down the aisle, wedding dress on a hanger in the closet, flowers ordered, the girl's body

found stuffed in a two-foot wall cable space there in yale's research building. bloody clothes found high over investigators' heads behind ceiling tiles. in the early morning hours, police storm a super 8 motel to arrest 24-year-old yale lab tech raymond clark on murder one. bombshell tonight -- we confirm lab tech raymond clark spotted frantically trying to clean his own cleaning equipment, bottles, a lab cart. now we know clark was allegedly trying to clean away le's blood. stunning lab results reportedly place clark and le's dna both in that 24-inch wall space. her blood on his boots. his dna on her body. waiting tonight to determine whether it's blood or sperm. we also confirm clark's favorite

signature green ink pen found lodged in a crevice in the basement where le's body concealed. he even allegedly went back to retrieve it. when asked on a polygraph, do you know where le is now? the alleged control freak's answer went off the chart. and tonight in a bizarre twist, did clark have help? an alleged accomplice to hide le's body? and finally the truth about who set that fire alarm. key card swipes placing clark at the crime scene before and after le last seen alive, revealing he's in and out of that lab no less than ten times. clark spending his workdays cleaning cages that house experimental mice. in play tonight, text messages between clark and his 90-pound victim. do they reveal motive for murder? he reportedly is covered with defensive wounds, a bead from

le's necklace found torn from her throat on the floor of the crime scene. cause of death -- le manually strangled to death. and tonight -- uncovered. an alleged history of stalking women, allegations from a former girlfriend claiming he forces her to have sex then threatens her when she tries to break it off. no charges ever filed. and finally tonight -- was this brutal and senseless murder all over laboratory mice cages? with a community and a university reeling, a family grieving and a young groom left at the altar with a broken heart, tonight we want justice for 24-year-old bride-to-be annie le. >> shocking developments today. reports emerge dna from the lab worker accused of killing annie le was found in both the ceiling

tiles containing the bloody clothes and the crawl space where le's body was found. not only that, but sources now tell "the hartford current" that raymond clark iii was seen trying to hide lab cleaning equipment containing blood spatters. he was also reportedly observed cleaning up areas that annie le was in the day of her murder. >> raymond clark, the man now charged in the murder of yale graduate student, annie le, in what police say is a place of, quote, workplace violence. >> apparently he was very concerned about how people kept their mice, their cages, there have been some reports that he got very upset when people wouldn't wear plastic booties into the lab or when people wouldn't keep their cages clean. >> police say he strangled this innocent bride-to-be, stuffed her body in a wall where it was found on what should have been her wedding day. >> a report that investigators traced clark and le's movements through computerized swipe cards inside the lab.

"the hartford current" records indicate clark was the last to see le alive. special guest tonight, she skydives, she nascars, and she writes. talk show morning host hln's robin meade live tonight with her new book. what's with your penchant for jumping still? >> still feels good. >> you look really good. nobody told me how to get out. >> all this stuff. >> clutter. >> so when they're ready to make the robin meade museum, i'm the girl. good evening. i'm nancy grace. i want to thank you for being with us. at almost the exact hour a gorgeous young ivy league grad student, annie le, set to walk down the aisle, wedding dress on the hanger, in the closet, flowers ordered, the girl's body

found stuffed in a wall at yale university's research building. tonight -- stunning details inside the hunt for a killer. >> this was not a street crime. it was not a domestic crime. it was a workplace crime. >> police looking into whether clark's attitude may have led to a deadly confrontation. >> annie le was strangled to death in the lab she worked. clark who also worked there is charged with doing it and trying to hide her body behind a wall in the basement. >> reports surface that dna from accused murderer raymond clark iii was found in both the ceiling and tiny crawl space where le's body was uncovered sunday. according to reports, police observed clark trying to hide lab cleaning equipment containing blood spatters. a law enforcement official told "the hartford current" that clark was spotted cleaning up areas le was in shortly before she was reported missing. >> co-workers tell police he was a control freak and territorial when it came to the lab and the

mice that he took care of. >> being reported that he who maintained the cages and animals was upset at her, annie le, because she was leaving her cage in disorder or dirty. >> it's being reported that there was a text message the morning of the day she went missing asking her to meet with him at the lab. >> arrested and brought into court, facing murder charge at just 24, the police chief makes it clear the lab where they both worked is where the violence was born. >> straight out to thomas kaplan, editor and chief with "the yale daily news," what can you tell us about the possibility that there was an accomplice? >> well, that's what some reports have indicated today. now, we did hear from police yesterday. they said they have no additional suspects and they indicated that they don't really anticipate to have any further suspects. so the police have kind of put cold water on that, but there have been some reports today. so we don't really know right now, nancy. >> now, what i want to talk about very quickly is the dna

result. out to jean casarez, legal correspondent, "in session." i'm understanding that he was seen frantically trying to clean his own cleaning equipment. he was responsible for cleaning the experimental mouse cages and other cleaning in and around the research area. he was the lab technician. i understand that her dna is on his cleaning equipment and that he was trying to clean away was her blood? >> it's really interlocking today, surfacing that when investigators realized that annie le was missing and they went to the lab building and they were talking to people that routinely were at the lab building and at least one investigator noticed someone that seemed to be trying to take cleaning equipment and put it away. it was later found there was blood spatter on that cleaning equipment and that was raymond clark. >> what about the rest? you're seeing photos of the suspect, raymond clark, from

myspace. jean casarez, what can you tell me about other reported dna results? >> well, in the ceiling tile, we heard originally there was bloody clothes. now we're hearing there was dna of annie le and dna of raymond clark and also in that crawl space, in the closet where her body was found, there was dna of raymond clark, especially a green pen that he adored, apparently. he used to sign with it every day, sign into work. it was his green pen. everyone knew he always used it. >> and to rupa mikkilineni, our producer there at the police station in new haven. rupa, about these allegations that the entire motive may have been over mice cages? >> reporter: that's right, nancy. there are reports out there that are coming from other media sources that there had been an e-mail chain prior to this week in the past between them about her level of taking care of the animals, the mice in the cages.

then most recently that morning that she went over to the amistad laboratory building, she received a text message, supposedly from him asking her to come over and meet him to talk about this. >> to al jones, reporter, he was in court when he appeared in court. he is there at the police station joining us tonight. al, i understand that immediately after this story happened, after this really kidnap and murder went down, yale issues a policy about zero tolerance of harassment in the workplace. now i'm hearing reports that for a long time this guy has been a, quote, control freak, driving everybody crazy, and now we find out about repeated text messages to the 90-pound victim about how she cleaned the mice cages? >> yeah. we're hearing a little bit of conflicting information on that. you have the story from investigators who paint raymond clark as someone who guarded his turf very jealously.

that basement lab area was his area and he felt like he was in control of it. he became very irritated when researchers would leave a mess. >> okay. hold on, hold on. al, al, i'm having a really hard time hearing you. let me go quickly to jean casarez. jean, do you know anything about this alleged motive? >> well, i think they're saying they're not the sure of the motive. if you look at the text messages, which i am sure are part of the search warrant that are still sealed, there are allegations that he was upset at her because she as a laboratory scientist was not keeping the area as clean as it should have. that was raymond clark's duty, and there may have been issues between the two of them on his part, raymond clark's, in regard to annie le. >> everyone, you are seeing video, you are seeing raw footage of him in court. still dressed in his preppy khaki pants and his polo shirt. to you, sheryl mccollum, crime

analyst, what do you think police have against him? >> they're stacking up some beautiful pieces, nancy. first, he failed the polygraph. he hid some bloody clothes. he has got his dna in two separate places that match he and the victim. (announcer) time brings new wisdom

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but it's nice. announcer: learn how to lower your cholesterol, naturally, at cholestoff.com. nature made. fuel your greatness. with his head bowed, ankles in shackles, 24-year-old raymond clark iii was brought before a judge and charged with the strangling murder of yale graduate student annie le. >> the body of annie le his alleged victim described as a brilliant student was found inside a wall of the yale medical school building on sunday on what would have been her wedding day. >> what kind of relationship did raymond clark iii have with the victim annie le? >> the police chief did say about the relationship was that it was not a romantic relationship, calling it -- >> an issue of workplace violence. >> he was a lab technician who cleaned cages for laboratory mice that were used in that lab. she, a ph.d. student, who did research in that lab. >> apparently he was very

concerned about how people kept their mice, their cages. there have been some reports that he got very upset when people wouldn't wear plastic booties into the lab or when people wouldn't keep their cages clean. and there's some thought that maybe that contributed here to why he might have had a problem with annie. >> i want to go straight back to thomas kaplan, editor in chief "yale daily news," who broke the story of the missing student. thomas, what can you tell me? have we gotten to the truth finally about who set off that fire alarm? >> no, nancy, unfortunately no news there tonight. there have been some reports addressing that maybe raymond clark did set off the alarm to give him an excuse to leave the building after he killed annie le, allegedly. but no official information from police on what happened there. >> what about it, rupa? what do we know? >> reporter: nancy, there have been -- there's been a lot of

speculation from various people in various law enforcement agencies. what i've been told by chief lewis with the new haven police department is they are still unsure whether he tripped that alarm on purpose. but i believe that the connecticut state police is still investigating this. >> well, according to "the daily news," they have a source inside the police department that states, police now believe raymond clark tripped the fire alarm. now, that would suggest to me -- let's unleash the lawyers. anne bremner, high-profile lawyer out of seattle. christopher amolsch, defense attorney out of washington, d.c. anne bremner, if it can be proved that he tripped the fire alarm, there goes all of this claim for insanity, his claim for crime of passion in the heat of a moment, in the middle of an argument. because he is laboriously and methodically covering his tracks. >> well, that's a great argument, nancy. when i listen to your intro, i

felt like as a defense attorney if i was sitting in court i'd be just thinking, oh, case over. but the thing is, this is so weird, of mice and murder. he's worried about the mice cages? you know, he's upset to the pint of wanting to kill somebody? i think in this case there's more to be seen in terms of what's going on in his noggin. it's too bizarre. it will go down in crime as one of the weirdest motives if, indeed, this is a motive. therefore, i think there could be some kind of mental defense. >> okay. i think that was you answering that question by claiming -- >> it was -- >> -- that even though he methodically hid the body, was seen cleaning his own cleaning equipment that was spattered with her blood and he set off a false fire alarm to evacuate the building according to "the daily news" and hide the body, that he's still crazy. now, you know what? christopher amolsch, if you can pull all that off in the middle of yale university in a building that is high-tech security, you're not crazy.

>> well, i think there's a different obviously between being insane as a defense and having mental issues, which is a mitigation as it relates to sentence. you're probably not going to be able to find him not guilty based on that, but you could probably find him guilty of something less than first-degree murder and maybe spare him, you know, a life in prison. >> based on what? you said something less than murder one based on "that." what is "that," sir? >> well, what you're pointing at is all the things he did afterwards, which really doesn't go to what his state of mind was when he committed the crime. >> it's within the same hour. it's not like he went insane and then got well. >> we don't know exactly when she was killed. we do know that afterwards he took steps to try to hide his crime, assuming he did it. that doesn't mean that the time that he didn't he wasn't operating under some sort of mental deficiency. >> i can't let you get away with that, christopher amolsch, because we know for a fact she was murdered and hidden within 10:00 to 11:00, 12:00 to 1:00, 3

hours, within a 3-hour space. a quarter of one. less than three hours. he goes crazy and gets well in 2 hours and 45 minutes? >> nobody is saying he's getting well. the difference between smething you do now and three hours later when you realize the horrible mistake you made absolutely goes to the level of couple blt. >> could you put amolsch back on the screen, immediately? did you say mistake, his horrible mistake, like oops? >> no, i didn't say that. >> you did say mistake. >> i don't think that's what i said. >> yes, you did. you said horrible mistake. >> i'll say what i said again. what he did was, after -- well, people can be guilty, nancy, while making bad choices, and i think that's what happened in this case. there was a time i wouldn't step out of the house without my makeup.

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mr. clark has been a lab technician at yale since december 2004. nothing in the history of his employment here gave any indication that his involvement in such a crime might be possible. >> 24-year-old le was strangled to death. >> her body was found in the building she was last seen entering. >> stuffed in a two-foot wall cable space. >> police say that this arrest warrant has been sealed and because of that they did not speak about the motive. >> apparently he had certain standards and he was concerned that she wasn't taking good

enough -- clean enough care of the animals. >> based on what we've heard so far, his issues of control. if she confronted him or criticized him in some way or even this e-mail exchange where he -- she wasn't doing things the way that he wanted her to -- >> there is a rage there. there is a very controlling and absolutely from everything that we've learned about him, there's definitely you can see it. he's definitely very focused. >> joining us right now is renowned forensic scientist, world renowned, distinguished professor at university of new haven, dr. henry le. henry, thank you for being with us. my first question is -- >> thank you, nancy. >> -- if clark did try to clean up, how could you tell? how could you tell by looking at the dna, by looking at the blood markings that he was actually trying to clean up?

how do you know the difference between a cleanup and blood spatter? >> okay. the blood spatter usually have defined characteristics, have shape and patterns. cleanup usually considers a smudge. if you use water or cleaning solution, now it become a diluted blood stain. we as experienced scientists easily can tell. the thing i don't understand, your report say police officers saw him cleaning bottles. if the police officer saw him cleaning, should right away stop him, seize the evidence, and the blood spatter, which, of course, which we can use hemorrhaging to restore the pattern to determine that a drop or medium-velocity impact spatter. even the impact spatter then would have to have another type of traumatic force cause some bleeding.

>> right. so, dr. lee, my simple rudimentary interpretation of what you said is with blood spatter now a theory is emerging that he struck her before the strangulation. that could explain some of the blood. you would see as if you had paint on your hand and did like that on the wall. >> yes. >> as compared to cleaning it. you would see a smudge mark where -- >> right. >> okay. i got it. very quickly, dr. henry lee, can you get rid of dna with, for instance, a cleaning solution? >> yes, in fact, yes. uv light can destroy some dna evidence and bleach solution can destroy some evidence. however, what this case so important is his clothing, boots, from her dna.

>> exactly. >> her clothing upon his dna. depends on the inner layer or outer layer. the most inner layer clothing on his dna become even more important. >> to a neighbor of raymond clark's, annmarie goodwin, a special guest joining us tonight from hamden, connecticut. ms. goodwin, thank you for being with us. what was your impression of him? how stunned were you when you heard this news? >> i was shocked, but knowing him like i did, which wasn't that well, i believe that he could have done it. >> why do you say that? >> just because he seemed like the type of person that could snap at any minute. >> has it ever been reported that he had a controlling personality, a control freak? >> yeah. i've said that. i said, i know him to be controlling with his girlfriend. >> in what way? >> just bossing her around, telling her to, come on, hurry

up, like if he dropped his keys, i've seen him drop his keys, she'd bend down to get them. she always walked behind him. that type of thing. >> huh. and you personally observed that? >> yeah. they had to walk by my door twice a day, coming in, coming out, every time they left their house. >> and what, exactly, would he say and do? >> he was just a very negative person. every time -- i've never seen him say a positive thing. he wouldn't stop to say hello to you. he yelled at my son one time. >> about what? >> trash being in the hallway. >> how old is your son? >> i have three sons. the son that he yelled at at the time was 16. >> huh. now, when you first learned that he had been charged with murder, what was your initial reaction? >> i knew that guy was a weirdo. >> well, that says it in a nutshell, ms. goodwin.

i want to ask you an evidentiary question. did he, in fact, live with pets? >> yes. in fact, he had two pit bulls he left locked upstairs in like -- you know those metal dog cages? he used to leave them locked up in the summer months, all day long, barking and yelping. >> well, our first reports were that he had three cats. >> i know. my son, taylor, said that and to this day he swears he has cats. i never seen any cats. i'm not saying he didn't have cats. >> well, you know what? if he doesn't have a cat being he better get one. he told police that all those defensive wounds were from cats. you're seeing suspect, raymond clark, from myspace. we're speaking with annmarie goodwin, a neighbor of raymond clark's. to melissa vranich, psychologist joining us from new york. what's your take on it? >> i've been on the edge of my

seat, nancy. thank you. i have to disagree this has anything to do with mice or clean booties or control. we're talking about a really disturbed, twisted individual who has a history of misogynistic behair hafr. my focus is completely digit as a psychologist. >> what would you say the motive is? >> i would say he has a history of hating women and in this case he called her in to be able to hurt her and possibly kill her. so this does not have anything to do with mice and doesn't have anything to do with control. it has to do with anger and someone who has a really twisted, twisted, disturbed personality. >> to al jones, what can you tell me about that green signature ink pen and how his favorite pen plays into a murder investigation? >> well, nancy, investigators believe that one of the ways that raymond clark tried to distinguish his work from that of other lab techs was to use green ink. he used a green pen to sign in and out of the log each day.

now, "the daily news" is reporting a green pen was found in a crevice in the lab room where annie le's body was. in a twist from a macgyver plot, the day after she was reported missing, the day after she was murdered, police noticed that clark was walking around the room and had a backpack. they looked in the backpack and what they found were fishing hooks, wire, and bubble gum. obviously the equipment you'd need to retrieve a pen out of a crevice. >> okay. i'll just trying to soak all that in, al jones. sheryl mccollum, you and i have handled a lot of cases together. why, why do they always go back to the scene? there could have been a million ways he could have explained away that pen. he was rightfully in the basement on many occasions. >> absolutely. >> but he had to go back with a fish hook and bubble gum? >> yeah. it is mind boggling, nancy, that he would go to that much trouble to hide bloody clothes in the ceiling, hide her in the wall,

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does anything look familiar to you? yeah. i mean, do you recognize anybody around here? if you know? >> no. >> no? >> very pretty. yeah. >> come on. everybody needs a little sparkle even when you're working on

habitat for humanity houses. why not? i'm just doing my job. thank you so much. nice to meet you. thank you for the job that you do. this is one of the makeup artists that transformed me from jaba the hut in the morning to anchorwoman. ♪ so lonely >> forget about my book. let's talk about hers. with me, my friend and colleague robin meade. will you just stop looking beautiful for just one minute? >> nancy! >> i demanded that they ruin your lighting but apparently it's impossible. >> you're such a doll. thank you. >> this is great. your book "morning sunshine how to radiate confidence and feel it too." it was very hard for me to believe, and having been a trained observer since i was in the courtroom many, many years ago, that you have ever had a confidence problem, much less one so severe that you have had panic attacks on air, which i for one have never noticed and the twins and i watch you every morning.

never seen any confidence problem. but they were so severe that you sought help and have written this book. >> yeah. this was about ten years ago so it's before i came to hln. for me, my confidence issues were not about appearances. i think a lot of people think, well, if you look a certain way, then you must not have confidence problems. >> are you suggesting that you're beautiful? >> no, not at all. >> okay. >> nancy! i think most people -- >> because you are. >> thank you, sweetheart. oh, honey, you should see this face before the makeup people get ahold of it. >> so it's not about looks. >> for me it was about whether you find me likable or not. whether the viewers find me likable or not. this is when i worked in chicago. >> so you wanted to be liked. >> i wanted to be liked. >> see, i don't have that problem. >> you know what, and therefore, people like you. how is that? >> no. actually, a lot of them hate me. but what i thought was, the more you try to please everybody, every time you change something about yourself, you lose a little bit of yourself.

>> bingo. that's what happened to me. that's what this book is about. so for me, you know, coming up through the ranks of broadcasting pretty quickly, you go through you a lot of different bosses. but this need to be liked started when i was a child. that was my power. that was my popularity in school, right? so do you like me? if you don't like me, let me make you like me. along the way, you lose little authentic pieces of yourself because you're filling someone else's prescription of what perfection is. so on the air it manifested in panic attacks on live tv about ten years ago. >> and would the viewers actually know you were having a panic attack? >> i couldn't breathe so it's a little bit hard to deliver the news when you can't talk! so i don't know if they knew what it was, but i know that they probably thought, what is up with her? >> robin, how did you overcome that and become what you are now? because there are so many people that have not only that problem but other problems that they have to surmount in order to

survive and reach their dreams. so many dreams are cast aside or forgotten or derailed because of various problems. but you grabbed yours, grabbed the bull by the horns, and you wrestled. >> well, for about two years i wanted to leave my job and i wanted to leave this career. >> i read that. where you said you gave up. >> i really did. and my husband -- >> on page 68. >> thank you for reading it. you know, my husband was one who said, if you really want to quit -- this is me when i worked in miami. that is me in chicago just about the time i was having panic attacks. on the outside, that's me reporting at the '96 olympic here in atlanta. on the outside i was happy, smiley. those are my parents. you know, on the inside i was, i want to quit my job. my husband said, if you want to, fine. but i really think there's something up internally. i don't think this is the robin that i married, basically. so i really had to find out, what is the deal?

and come to an understanding where my opinion of myself is just as important as other people's opinion of me. and that is full circle for a lot of people to come at because we're people pleasers a lot of us. that's where the problem came in. >> well, on to page 75, when the twins were born, i promised my family i would give up cursing. but for you i'm going to make an exception. you state that you released your inner bitch. explain. >> can i say that on your show, nancy? >> yes. >> all right. >> a lot worse has been said on this show, robin meade. >> how many people, women especially, for some reason we think being nice is the end all-be all. what is nice? i was nice to a fault. i was somebody's doormat. i would let people walk on me because i wanted them to like me. through talking with a -- >> you a doormat? >> i was. i had no backbone. >> don't you think everybody, even me, wants to be liked but

at a certain point you can't let that desire stand in the way of what is right. >> being yourself. >> what is right and saying what's right and speaking the truth. >> it took me a while to come to that. so yeah. i always say, let's go on a bitch recognition campaign. for me, it was that i now recognized, you know what? there is a part of me that is a bee-otch. but before would not recognize that part and i kind of put that away and hide that from the world. >> i've got to disagree it. i see that as you being forceful and believing in something. and that in no way equals bitch. i've got to say this. i'm so knocked out by robin's book "morning sunshine." she overcame a hurdle and is now beautiful and successful and a friend. thank you for being with us. >> nancy, thank you so much. i appreciate it. >> so run, run, rush. "morning sunshine." >> for anyone who has self-doubts.

and who doesn't every now and then? except for nancy. everyone, as we go to break, a very special happy birthday to beautiful ella stokes, jacksonville, florida. at 100, she inspires us. born on a farm in macon, georgia, she walked three miles every day on a clay road to elementary school. she met her husband at a little united methodist church. he was a lifelong railroad man and together they had three sons. a dedicated member of the eastern star. her joy, providing a loving home for her family. and, oh, what a cook! happy birthday, aunt ella. and happy birthday to california friend, simon. he's not just celebrating his birthday today but is now an uncle for the second time of a new baby boy, austin, just born in dublin. dear simon, happy birthday. and our thoughts and prayers for lieutenant colonel jeffrey henderson gs13 and soldiers from the 244th, they are in iraq and afghanistan on a special

mission. tonight their message, command sergeant major glen bowen sends his love to his wife, daughters, major matt jutson says hello and i miss you to daughter stacy an. colonel al -- molly and daughter emily also waiting for his safe return. friends, hurry home. announcer: "it looks like nothing else on the road right now,"

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