my sister-in-law is very religious. she believes in faith instead of doctors. we've been trying to get her to take her to a hospital for a week and three days now. >> that's extended family, worried for her safety and their worst fears came true as the young girl died before going to a doctor. we're taking your calls. 1-877-tell-hln. randy in north carolina, go ahead. >> caller: yeah. i just wanted to make the comment that the parents only getting six months -- it's neglect. all it is is neglect. and if i was to whip my kid and

make a mark with a belt i'd get more than six months just to make a mark. and they don't take her to the doctor or anything. >> right. >> caller: i go to church every sunday but my kid will always, any time any of my kids are sick they go to the doctor. i do what the doctor says. >> yeah. okay. thanks for the call. doug, what about the punishment? >> yeah, the caller makes an excellent point which is kind of the logical next step in the analysis, mike, which is that because of the view of religion and religious beliefs the courts have tended to hand down what i call sort of midway sentences and eric's point, i mean, if you accept that they honestly and sincerely believe that this would help their child, then there's really no intent to harm. but what i was explaining earlier is as you said, it has to give way. and another philosophical question is, do they have the right to automatically impose that on their child to the point where the child dies?

>> good questions. there are a ton of them out there. let's get wendy in on this. the couple is showing no remorse even through all this. >> i am dying to get in here. >> help us with their mindset. because not -- who understands it? not many. >> i have one word for you. delusion. delusional, mike. first of all, religion performs a very important psychological function in our culture. it gives us a sense of community, moral teaching, comfort in our own fear of dying. but if you think god is a trauma center who's going to step in and take care of things, come on. a priest told me this in a homily once. you know the old story of the guy who's drowning and three boats come by and every time he says, no, it's okay. i have faith. i'm praying. it'll be fine. god will save me. he eventually drowns and says, god, why didn't you save me? i prayed. and god said, i sent you three boats, you stupid dummie. right? >> well, help us out. >> it is a kind of delusion. >> okay. so then when they get in the courtroom and mom let me read

her statement again, no regrets here. she is talking about the judge and the dilemma the judge had. she writes, the judge had a difficult task but was wise to consider our children's well being and we are thrilled with his decision to allow us to stay as a family unit which was our main concern. the judge also realizes that jail time will not reform us because he has witnessed our faith runs very deep. dad same mentality. i believe he almost used the courtroom like a pulpit talking about his faith. so for them, it's what, the girl is a martyr and they're going to continue on in this? >> and guess what else that judge did though. he sentenced them to getting good medical care and regular check-ups for the other kids. so, yeah. he's maybe respecting their faith but he's also saying, hey. it is neglect. and like the gentleman caller who said a few minutes ago, if you lock your child in a closet and neglect them and do it unintentionally because you think it's best for your children, you still get sentenced. right? >> exactly. eric, did the judge give that part of it right, eric, to you, in the sense of they're going to

make i believe a nursing and check on the other kids every three months. they have to take them to the doctor when they get sick. they got some good wisdom from the bench. your thoughts? >> absolutely. i think once the family is convicted the judge did do a very good balancing act in terms of handing out his sentence. he didn't send them to prison like it was a murder case. i want to make another comment. i love the comment these parents are delusional. well, to some extent aren't all religious beliefs delusional? the fact that somebody died 6,000 or 2,000 years ago to atone for our sins? >> wait a minute. wait a minute. >> but isn't there, if we go down the path of saying somebody's faith is incorrect, aren't we then on a slippery slope to say that it's possible that all faithful beliefs have the possibility of being also kring incorrect? >> okay. doug, what about that? eric has been bringing up, playing pretty good devil's advocate, no pun intended, on this one. your thoughts on that? because he's raising that. where do we override faith is what he's saying, right? >> yeah. he's a good lawyer and knows how

to argue a position. and my hat's off to him. but again, not to be a broken record the reality is, you know, faith is a perfectly acceptable thing that we can debate all day long. but you draw a line again where a child dies under the care of their own parent because of their beliefs. again, you can agree or disagree with it. and then i take the side of our psychological or psychiatric analyst and say that it does become delusional. >> we lost somebody there. who did we lose? eric? if we lost eric, wouldn't it be appropriate? it is. someone might be talking, eric. great discussion. thanks again. wenldy, doug. we appreciate it. >> someone intervened. >> that's right. someone intervened. coming up, new barbie dolls just coming out designed to look more like african-american women. toymaker mattel says its new line is more realistic. what do you think of that? how about this? we're back at this again. 30 students at one school

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a doll almost every woman and girl has had or wanted but for african-americans it's been tough to find a barbie that looks like them. when the first black barbie debuted it was in 1981 and she basically had white features. an actress featured in chris rock's new documentary "good

hair" adds a little perspective. >> historically the afro-centric features haven't always been celebrated so in this it makes women, not just black women, but i think all black women go, especially black women because it is about us, but for all of us it makes us question the integrity of our beauty standards for ourselves and what really motivates us to make certain choices. >> joining me now, a long-time mattel designer and created the so in line style barbie which features dolls that are a lot different from the black barbie you may remember. thank you for joining us. if people are going to just kind of be looking and passing and think we're playing with dolls, this is a lot more than just playing with dolls. this is a long time coming. >> right. >> tell me what was in your mind as you were designing these dolls and if you felt any pressure when you were designing these dolls. >> no pressure. the dolls came from a positive place.

i was reliving my childhood watching my 6-year-old daughter play with her dolls. i wanted dolls that represented her and african-american women in our community and i wanted the dolls to reflect what we see in our families or around. >> so what do you want people to see when they see these dolls? explain why these dolls have little girls with them. >> i wanted them to see themselves. they have fuller lips, fuller nose, and they have curly hair and features that represent us and they also have a positive message. these dolls are mentors. these are teenage dolls. >> okay. >> they also mentor these little sisters in their community. >> okay. and we're going to address one thing off the bat that some critics have said. i want to read a statement from a playwrite and mother. she says she immediately goes to the hair. as many black women do. let's just be honest. she says, why are we always pushing this standard of long

hair on our girls? why couldn't one of the dolls have a little short afro or shorter braids or something? because one thing that you were sure to do, they're all different skin tones. >> right. >> so any young african-american girl can find a doll that looks like her in that aspect. but they do all seem to have long hair. and all african-american women don't have long hair. do you feel that you missed the mark on that? >> i feel like i put my heart within these dolls and dolls are for girls to play with. they love combing the long, beautiful hair. these are dolls but i did represent that in the little sister kiana with little curly afro puffs. >> do you know why -- do you get why that matters so much to the african-american community? i know some people who are watching may just say why are they making such a big deal about dolls? but do you know, do you get why the dolls mean so much to people? >> they mean so much to me because they did come from a positive place. my daughter loves the dolls.

i've had dads thank me for creating this line of dolls that represent their little girls. >> and i would assume that mattel and you aren't targeting these dolls specifically for young african-american girls to play with. these are for, i would hope, for all girls to play with. >> girls all over the world, yes. exactly, with the positive message. >> and when can they get the dolls? >> they can get them now. >> all right. for more of what matters check out the october issue of "essence" magazine and log on to cnn.com/what matters. stacy, we appreciate it very much. >> thank you. well, a huge sexting scandal. one high school in pennsylvania, 30 kids under investigation. 30 kids accused of looking at a naked picture of their classmate. well, cops are investigating serious child pornography charges. when will kids get the message? when will the message finally sink in? mike is going to dig into this.

1-877-tell-hln.

welcome back to "prime news" on hln. 30 kids accused of sexting. here we go again, huh? this is just one school in pennsylvania. 30 kids. that's an entire classroom looking at photos of some naked girl. that's what we have. let that sink in for a minute. now cops are considering child porn charges. that's a felony. could label these teens as sex offenders. that's the quandary we have here. how are we going to deal with this? we'll hit this on a couple fronts. number one, don't these kids get it? there are serious consequences. we have to get that message to sink in. then what's the proper punishment? so they understand what they did was wrong and can't do it again? joining us to talk about it, welcome back, radio talk show host, former teacher,dom, also a

judge, mike powell, who made headlines earlier this year with an excellent solution and real wisdom from the bench. dom, let's you and i start. man, here we are again. what do you make of this? why i guess is the question. why are kids not getting the message that this is wrong, demeaning, wrong on so many levels. where are we missing the mark here? >> mike, i would tell you, you probably remember, too, and for viewers this is not too far from another place in pennsylvania where there was a national case around this in a showdown between the prosecutor and a girl who did this and part of it is apparently even some parents and others don't think there's too much wrong with this. they have the notion if you're just sending it to the boyfriend what's the big deal? you and i know what happens. the big deal is the boyfriend becomes disgruntled or they just share it with another guy and it's minor to 30. this can go to thousands of people. so i think it's with the person

sharing this either conned into believing this is normal to send to your boyfriend pictures like this and then once that happens, anything can happen from that trail with the boyfriend. >> exactly. that's what we have to get through to these kids, the real world consequences. you mentioned it. once you send that picture you don't know where it's going to stop or end up or how many people are going to look at it. and also if you get in trouble for this you could be labeled a sex offender. >> absolutely. and, mike, i think it's extreme to imagine labeling the people that sent it sex offenders and all that. that's why i'm intrigued with what the judge did as a punishment but there has to be something fairly severe here. >> agreed. >> otherwise there is no deterrent effect and kids think they're just hitting a button and moving pictures around. >> here's where basically life ruined, philip albert, want to hear his story. he gets the sext, he breaks up with the girlfriend, gets mad, sends it out. next thing you know labeled a sex offender and life ruined. let's hear his story. >> you will find me on the registered sex offender list

next to people who have, you know, raped children, molested kids, things like that, because i sent child pornography. i've been punished for the rest of my life for something that took probably two minutes or less took probably two minutes or less to do. >> something that took him less than two minutes to do, could be punished the rest of his life. judge mike powell, presided over a sexting case. we've applauded judge powell for getting it right. it was a tough sentence. it wasn't just a slap op the wrist, but these kids aren't going to be the next phillip albert and have their lives ruined. let's get back to what's going on in pennsylvania. 30 kids. isn't felony child porn overkill here, judge? >> you know, i don't think that's for a judicial officer to say, mike. you know, in our system of government, that is committed to the executive braj to decide what people ought to be charged with. at least in the first instance, does the judicial branch have to

defer to that. but once we get the case we have some discretion as to how to handle it. i think that's particularly true with juvenile judges. and for instance, in ohio, even if i would find that a child has committed the offense with which they're charged, i have the discretion to dismiss it or to reduce it if i find that's in a child's best interest. >> i'll ask you this. should someone be punished for the rest of their life, or a good part of it anyway for sending a text at the age of 5 or 6, judge? >> i would say no. i would say they should not. but what the appropriate punishment ought to be depends on a number of factors. i think in large part, we have to identify what the motivation of the children involved in the incidents were. >> when we come back, we'll let you know what judge powell did. i think he got it right. we'll hear more from dom as well. we want to hear from you, 1-877-tell-hln is the number. stay with us.          

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