welcome back to "prime news" on hln. continuing our conversation as we're hearing another account of what went on inside the sweat lodge led by self-help guru james arthur ray. contributor to the book "the secret." this was a spiritual retreat and it has turned deadly. we want to know what happens. we are finding out. we have with us ted schmidt. he is lawyer of sydney spencer. she was inside that sweat lodge, getting his account. we have a doctor with us, telling us what happens to the body when things get hot. also with us eric chase, criminal defense attorney. i know you've been patient, thanks. we hear this account, eric, and i would say -- most people hear all this and say come on, james

arthur ray set the table for this tragedy. how you going to defend him? >> well, first we have to separate into two parts. the criminal part and the civil part. in terms of the criminal part and what happened in the sweat lodge, i don't think there is going to be any criminal liability. >> you don't think? >> i don't think. for any type of criminal charge you at least have to proceed in the face of a known risk of possible death. i think he was just stupid. and stupid does not translate into being criminally responsible. look these people all had an option. they were all acting voluntarily. they could have left if they wanted to. they were just as stupid about what could happen in this horrible environment as he was. so in terms of criminal responsibility, which is different than if you sued for money, but for criminal responsibility, i just don't think there's going to be any. >> okay but civil, there's going to be some good cases? >> oh, absolutely. you know, they put their trust in him. they had a contract with him. and in terms of civil liability, i would be very concerned for him. >> okay ted schmidt, can you

comment on that on the criminal level? has there been -- deaths are being looked at as a homicide, homicides plural. do you see criminal charges coming? >> just, i am not an expert in criminal law. i am a civil lawyer. >> okay. >> but i will tell you, based on what we just heard, that what the -- i understand the sheriff is attempting to develop, is the fact that he had had sweat lodge experiences in the past, where people had passed out, and he had some actually did have some knowledge that there was a danger. whether they're able to prove that he had knowledge that this is life threatening, i'm not sure. >> okay and let's go back to eric. on that front, eric, we have all these people, from a lot of experts we've talked to in these sweat lodges, way too many people, 55 to 65, and only one nurse on hand. is that something to where you could build a case of negligence against james arthur ray? >> well, certainly was an awkward situation. i will tell you where there may be a possibility of criminal responsibility and that's what happened after people left the sweat lodge.

from what i've read, there were some people who could have been helped by some of the other participants, and what he called his dream team. his assistants, they were not allowing the assistance to be given. they looked like they were protecting their own pocketbooks, as it were, their own program, and weren't interested in protecting the people who had been put at risk. that could give rise to criminal charges. >> we heard that account from beverly bunn yesterday. she works in the dental field so she is trained medically and she wanted to help, but as you used the term, part of his dream team would not let her. so you make a good point there. ted, before we let you go, does your client, sydney, have any account of what happened outside, as -- as we know now people were dying around her outside of that sweat lodge? >> she was -- she -- she didn't regain consciousness until she was in the hospital. >> okay. >> but she has spoken to the woman that drug her out of there, and that woman said that she was foaming at the mouth, convulsing, and her eyes were rolled back in her head. >> so how, let me -- before we go, doctor, how quick does this get dangerous/deadly when it

gets that hot in there and there's no circulation of air? >> sure. well, it's a difficult question, but i guess the people by the window did better. but once your body temperature gets above 103, 104, you are at risk for seizures, which it sounds like she was already experiencing when they found her in the hospital. >> we'll continue to follow this story. ted, doctor, eric chase, we appreciate it, guys. coming up, another disturbing story. football star jazz par howard murdered. uconn students, he was murdered outside of a dance. 300 students went to this dance. so somebody saw something, but potential witnesses are being bullied online, threatened about snitching. are they not telling what could bring this young man justice? we'll take your calls, 1-877-tell-hln.

welcome back. football star at the university of connecticut, murdered in a crowd of 300 people. and now there are violent threats popping up online to stop witnesses from going to the cops. here's just one of the threats. and some of those consequences spelled out, stabbed, mugged, beaten, for talking to the cops. it's unbelievable. someone even posted a threat on the victim's million oriole web

page. a place to remember and honor jazz par howard, pay tribute. his mom and dad want justice. and you're going to go to a website and threaten those who might help bring justice? facebook page. it's unbelievable. joining us to talk about, we welcome back hln law enforcement analyst mike brooks. and also with us kate monahan reporter for uconn's newspaper the daily campus. all right, kate, let's be clear here, 300 people were at the dance. we're not sure how many people saw, but you figure somebody saw something. are authorities at this point us from traited because no one's coming forward? >> well, i think from what i've gathered, talking to them, that it's been a little frustrating because as we've learned, the police have said that there's evidence out there, videographic and photographic evidence that they know exists that hasn't been brought to them yet. so i think, because they've been reaching out and saying we know there's evidence out there, we just don't have it yet, i'm sure that they must be getting

frustrated at not getting all the information from that night. >> okay. where are these threats coming -- where are they popping up? facebook, where else? kate? >> well, there have just been a few. but one of the threats which was taken down was on the r.i.p. address for howard's facebook group. and another one was on a uconn student's football blog, it was a comment on a video he had done of student reaction to the tragedy. and both of those were pretty strongly worded threats that specifically mentioned violence, and it seemed as though the people were not -- they were outsid outsiders. which we do know that the people involved in this could be non-uconn students. the police believe that it's non-uconn students and uconn students were involved in the fight. >> okay, you mentioned facebook. here's a -- just a -- a disturbing post on facebook. again this is posted on a page

honoring jazz par howard, and it's pretty -- it's rough. we had to do a lot of ed itting here but you get the gist of it. and it's basically blank the snitches. i know you, jazz par howard, would not be down with that. this needs to be a lesson for all of uconn, you will be stabbed, shot, mugged or beating for blanking around. kate have you talked to anybody, a potential witness, who is intimidated by this and is keeping quiet at this point? >> you know what, i haven't found anyone to specifically point to these as causes for not coming forward. but i have reached out to people, to shoot an e-mail or a facebook message or something like that to try to get hold of them if it seemed like they were a witness and some people specifically said, no, i haven't talked to police. and they wouldn't say why. so i guess i'm kind of going on limited information on what people's motives are, or if they just think maybe they didn't see that much. or you know, something like that. i think we need to see this as a possibility for maybe why people

aren't coming forward. >> right. kate, let me ask you this and i'll get mike in on the conversation. have you been threatened? do you feel threatened by bringing this piece of the story to light? >> i haven't personally. but, i feel like it is the kind of thing where, you know, it is a little intimidating because, if there are these people out there that are, you know, feel this vehemently about this situation, obviously i do worry a little bit about my safety or other people's safety. but i am happy that the police have come out to say, you know, if you have fears about coming forward, you know, you can relay that to them and they can help protect you in any way possible. and that includes being anonymous, and -- >> right. >> -- when you call in for tips. >> well, kate, we -- we applaud your bravery by the way to bring this forward. let's bring in mike brooks. how much of a problem is this? eyewitnesses going silent because of this garbage, these threats online? >> you know, mike, it's a

problem. i mean, it's a problem in the public on, you know, on homicides around cities. i used to do canvasses all the time. no, i don't want to say anything, because they were afraid. they were intimidated because people come up and say you didn't see anything, did you? no i didn't see anything. but, these people who are saying don't snitch. they're the cowards, mike. they are the ones who are really the cowards. and you know what? please keep sending them to facebook. keep sending them to different blogs. because law enforcement can find you. you can run, but you can't hide. >> can they be traced? >> absolutely, mike. i'm not going to say how, okay. but they can be. and could there be possible charges if these are people who did see something and are intimidated? absolutely. tarvering with a witness. obstruction of justice. threats across the internet. when they started -- when the internet started becoming more popular, and just, as big as it is now, it used to be threats across the phone. same kind of things, mike. you know, use of interstate commerce. and, if it gets bad enough, and the fbi gets involved, you know,

they'll find a way to get involved. if it goes from state to state, they could also face federal charges. >> let's get a call in. kathy is with us in massachusetts. go ahead. >> caller: hi, mike, how you doing? these low lives cowards making those threats to the people, they really ought to be shot. i'm sorry. but their only power is by threatening people. and when people talk to the police and they tend to do it anonymously, they should help the police because the police deserve the public's help to close cases such as this. to get justice for the family. >> exactly. i mean this is -- you know you look at jasper howard, described as a great young man, father-to-be. a team captain just received the game ball after a big win over louisville so, mike talk about that. i mean, police can protect people who feel that they might be a little threatened. they can bring their anonymous information forward, right? >> absolutely. you know, sometimes they set up different programs where you just call in and you're a

number. a crime stoppers program. sometimes you don't have to give a name. they just assign you a number and they contact you that way. no, you don't have to give your name. so, and there are, you know, tips you can call in to this, the tip number we're showing right now, mike, and you don't have to give your name. but, that's the problem. >> got you. >> it's really an epidemic out there, people don't want to get involved. you know, this poor boy, this poor guy he left miami to escape the violence. and what happens to him in connecticut? >> yeah. kate, are police continually on a daily basis reaching out to the students to please tell us something? >> pretty regularly, the uconn students get e-mail updates from the police on how the investigation is going or what steps they're taking. but, i don't think that in the last day or so we've received too much more. so it's sort of, i don't know how things are progressing. but i heard too many new developments. >> kate monahan, thank you. thank you for your bravery. mike, good talking to you, as

well. >> richard roundtree, the biggest movie role in the '70s. this guy, i was the man back then. well now he's facing breast cancer. it's coming up in "what matters." how youl doing? my name is way leff jean. at the first annual cnn heroes tribute show i had the honor of performing helping to recognize the great works of everyday citizens changing the world. as the founder of yearly haiti, an organization which seeks to improve lives in my native country, i am thrilled to help cnn introduce one of this year's top ten honorees. now more than ever, the world needs heroes. >> life after katrina is really hard for kids. violence, the drug life. i'm just tired of it. my aim is to get kids off the streets. my name is derrick tabb and i started a free music education

program for the kids of new orleans. let's go, horns up. we do more than just teach music. we offer transportation. we offer instruments. i feed you when you're not hungry. give tutoring. call it the no excuse policy. you have no excuse why you're not here. press downen it just like that. we meet five days a week year round. we constantly learn. that's what keeps the kids coming back every day. ♪ i don't say that i'm saving lives, i say i'm giving life. a whole different life.

all right, everybody knows shaft, richard roundtree made the character famous 1970s, suave, gun toting, slick-talking detective. now he's also a breast cancer survivor. "prime news" correspondent richelle carey had a chance to sit down and talk to him. >> you gotten from it being devastating to being a survivor to now calling it a backhanded blessing. >> yes. >> what was that journey? how did you get there? >> it was quite interesting, what happened. five years later, when i was diagnosed as a survivor, i didn't say anything about it until that time. until i was over that hump. that five-year hump. and i was at a golf tournament in north carolina, wilmington,

north carolina, and the beauty of this event is that every year you get to see where the proceeds from the previous year went. and this particular year, they were raising money to buy a vehicle to go out, outside of the city, and test people. and i said, that's incredible. i mean, people can get free examinations and whatnot, and it's much-needed. because being a survivor myself. and the shock on everyone's face. yes, i am a breast cancer survivor. well, that was an eye-opener. i said, you know, i should start talking about this. and the feedback, so many men have come up to me and said, you know, as a result of reading your story, i went and got tested, and i'm -- i got early diagnosis and i survived. i'm a survivor, as well. and those stories, i characterize it as a backhanded

blessing, because if shaft can survive it, it's a good thing. and men are being tested. and raising the awareness level that breast cancer specific. >> absolutely. and not only survive it but clearly i think there's a certain type of a man that will listen to you that won't listen to anybody else at all. >> i say in my speaking when the doctor told me that i had breast cancer, i said that's something that women -- i thought that was only something that a woman could get and not something a man could get, and certainly not something i can get. i mean, we are talking about shaft up in here. >> yes, we are. well said. well said. well, shaft, mr. richard roundtree, thank you for sharing your story with us. i think people really perk up and listen. and they need to hear this

message. and keep on being a hypochondriac if that's what you need to do. i appreciate it. for more of "what matters," check out the november issue of "essence" magazine, or you can always go to cnn.com/whatmatters. ddddd