right now on "showbiz tonight" this weekend. rosie o'donnell's shocking confessions caught on tape. her revelations about oprah, rosie's startling claim of childhood abuse. >> whenever i would go to the doctor, the doctor would look and say to me do you touch yourself? >> tonight, it's rosie totally unplugged. and a brand new oprah controversy, tonight "showbiz tonight" with the big news about oprah winfrey and her weight loss. plus is oprah really giving jennifer aniston her own talk show? the showbiz truth squad is on the case. the weekend edition of tv's

first provocative entertainment news show starts right now. hi there, everyone, i'm brooke anderson in hollywood, and this is "showbiz tonight" this weekend. tonight, rosie's shocking confession. rosie o'donnell is never one to hold back. and tonight i can tell you she is revealing explosive new details about her life we've never heard before. rosie is sharing the horrifying details of abuse she allegedly suffered as a child. details that are so tough to hear that she avoided talking about it until now. and that's just the start of her truly amazing new tell-all interview. here's "showbiz tonight's" a.j. hammer. >> reporter: rosie o'donnell is making shocking confessions about molestation in her family. >> there were varying levels of abuse. >> reporter: she's setting the record straight about her troubled relationship.

>> kelly and i have a lot of issues and sex wasn't one of them. >> and best of all, she's settling old scores. rosie o'donnell was absolutely unplugged in her interview on howard stern's show on sirius xm satellite radio. >> we haven't heard from rosie in a while, but now she's coming back with a vengeance and being so revealing. >> rosie's most shocking revelations were about childhood abuse. which she's only hinted about in the past. >> she alluded to something in a book she'd written, but this is the first time we've heard her be very open about abuse that was going on in her own family. >> now, rosie's speaking out like never before about abuse. even though she's still somewhat vague about it. >> you've alluded to molestation, wasn't between you and your dad, though, was it? >> you know, there was some serious issues going on in the house at that point. and, you know, there were five children. there were varying levels of abuse. >> rosie tells howard stern she wasn't able to talk about the abuse when she was a child, but

describes some suspicious infections in graphic detail. >> i was like 6, 7, 8, kindergarten first and second grade, whenever i would go to the doctor the doctor would look and say to me, do you touch yourself? and i don't know if you know -- you know you have children, but that doesn't start for a child at that age. something has been introduced to a child if that's happening at that age. and it was not me causing the infections. so, you know, it's a very heavy thing. >> she's being so incredibly open about these things that happened to her as a child. but on the other hand, you still kind of have questions about exactly what happened. >> rosie also addresses tabloid headlines that she and her long time partner kelly carpenter are splitting up. >> we've been together for 12 years. and a family is a family is a family. we will stay a family. and kelly and i are working through a lot of the stuff that we have and the children are the priority. >> i don't know that we're going to be together. i think we're working through what's going to work best. >> but rosie being rosie

couldn't help but take a few shots at her sparring partners, like her former boss on "the view" barbara walters. >> i assume because she was the first woman to break all these barriers, she was very much a sister and i got on that show to realize oh, my god, that's not the case. i did find her to be inaccessible in a way that startled me and i did find her to be sort of a non-supportive in another way with the trump thing. >> oh, the trump thing. remember rose i on-air feud with donald trump? yeah, rosie's not over that. >> i simply said the truth about him and he went ballistic. what he did to me personally is just an example of how he feels about all women. >> don't count on the donald ever appearing on rosie's upcoming radio show. >> donald trump doesn't interest me in any capacity, i don't know what i'd say to him.

>> it almost seems like she holds grudges. seems like she hasn't let a lot of these feuds go. >> but once again, rosie's willingness to bear all is showing us she's still one of the most fascinating celebrities out there. >> one thing you take from this interview is that rosie is a complicated person and just when you think you know her, you realize you don't know anything about her. >> there was so much more to rosie's interview, including her account of an emotional phone call she placed to of all people oprah winfrey. why was she calling oprah? coming up on "showbiz tonight," we'll have the dramatic details of rosie's frantic call to oprah. tonight, david letterman under fire from the wrath of the writer. in a brand new hln exclusive, one of letterman's first female writers is speaking out and it's making for big news. nel scovell is claiming that letterman ran a hostile and sexually charged atmosphere at nbc. in a scathing new interview with

hln's own joy behar, scovell adds more fuel to the fire. so i have to ask, can letterman handle the wrath of the writers? right now in hollywood is carlos diaz, correspondent for "extra" also kim. carlos, kim. it was just a few weeks ago that david letterman admitted to having sex with women who worked with him on his show on cbs. now you've got nell scovell claiming that she quit because of what she called sexual politics. she described that dramatic moment on hln's "joy behar show." >> it was my dream job. i loved that show. and it was a breakthrough. so i moved back to new york to take this job. and five months later, i ended up walking away from my dream job because it was a hostile work environment.

>> okay. kim, here's what i'm wondering. if this was going on back in the '90s, why do you think no one would publicly call letterman out until now? do you think that maybe nobody would've believed her? >> well, it's interesting. because she did wait for a long time, obviously, almost 20 years to talk about this. so she obviously must feel this way. but you have to wonder why you're not hearing from other women who worked for david letterman. i personally know people both men and women who have worked for david letterman and i'm not hearing from any of them. she did only work for him i think four to six months, as well. so look, she has recollections, it seems in her piece that she wrote and her interview she talks about writer rooms in general on late night talk shows, not just dave's talk show. maybe it's just getting more women into these writer rooms, as well. >> maybe so. hiring more women as the writers. "showbiz tonight" did reach out to letterman today about scovell's startling claims and

he's not commenting. they didn't even want to address these claims. carlos, are you thinking that letterman's admission earlier this month to having sex with women he worked with makes her claim more believable? >> no, because she says david did not hit on me. letterman did not hit on me. but what it does -- what letterman's situation does is it opens up the avenue for us to talk about this and to talk about this men's club that is the writers room for late night tv. and if i'm starting a show today, i'm looking at what this young lady said in "vanity fair" saying wait a minute, i'm going to hire as many women as i can for writers because they're not being hired and maybe we can have a show that's different with a different kind of comedic point of view. >> yeah, very true. we women give you a little bit more flavor, i think, carlos. i do want you to hear -- >> i've heard those rumors, yeah. >> i do want you to hear what scovell said in the exclusive

interview with joy behar. because it does give us more insight into what it was like for her to work with letterman. >> if you're doing your job and you're working hard and you're in the middle of a soap opera, then you know, that's not -- i wasn't going to thrive professionally. and you know, i didn't get the memo as a young girl that said you should have low self-esteem and put up with crap. so i just quit. >> well, good for her. and while nobody is suggesting that nell scovell is making this up, do you think her waiting so long to make these claims could make someone question whether she is telling the entire story? >> sure, i think obviously people will wonder why she didn't speak up sooner and why she waited until now when all of this came out about david letterman. obviously she's done a good job for herself. she worked on a lot of other tv shows. she created another tv show herself. but she even in her article that she wrote said that part of the

reason there are not enough female writers is not enough female writers apply for these jobs. so you know, you can't totally blame david letterman or any of the late night talk show hosts when you don't have enough women applying for these jobs. >> get out there and apply -- >> be chelsea handler. >> distractions like hostility, harassment, have no place in the workplace or anywhere else for that matter. carlos diaz, kim seraphan thanks. how muhammad ali's daughter saved him. >> do you think if she hadn't, you would have pulled that trigger? >> i don't know. it's in a way it snapped me out of it. >> for the very first time on camera, hulk's emotional revelations about how and why he almost killed himself. also tonight, bad news for oprah. "showbiz tonight" with big news today about oprah winfrey and her weight loss advice. i have to tell you, i don't c e

think oprah is going to like what we reveal. plus is oprah working with jennifer aniston for her own talk show? and would you watch it? the truth squad is on the case. this is "showbiz tonight this weekend." and more stories making news right now.

welcome back to "showbiz tonight" this weekend, i'm

brooke anderson in hollywood. tonight, so fabulous. it's a showbiz special report. female stars who make over 40 look fabulous. "showbiz tonight" and "more" magazine have teamed up to bring you the incredible story of some of hollywood's biggest female stars who get better and better with age. the women that we are about to reveal really prove that age ain't nothing but a number. >> your visa application is denied, you're being deported. >> 45-year-old sandra bull lock plays a woman desperate to get married in "the proposal." her body of work goes way beyond acting. >> hello? >> oh. >> oh, my god! >> why are you naked? >> who could forget halle berry's sexy turn as a bond girl in "die another day."

>> they're women over 40 in hollywood and they really know how to pack a punch. >> they say that 40 is the number 30. i don't know maybe 40's the new 20. today women in hollywood when you reach 40, you become the woman that you are. and i think that shows in their work. >> it sure does. now, "showbiz tonight" and "more" magazine are teaming up to reveal that top hollywood women in films who are over 40 are absolutely fabulous no matter what part they're playing for the camera. say hello to 60-year-old meryl streep who plays the pompous fashion editor in "the devil wears prada." >> you have no style or sense of fashion -- >> i think that depends on what your -- >> no, no, that wasn't a question. >> and there's no question that streep could easily pass for the real julia child in the movie "julie and julia." >> i'm julia child, bon appetit.

>> streep is so good that sigormey weaver said it was her best yet. >> so flooded with life and light and i thought she was awesome. >> and so do we. but she's not alone. let's hear some applause for 51-year-old michelle pfeiffer. everybody's favorite cat woman. >> it's okay. i had to go home. feed my cat. meow. >> she made black spandex look great. >> and pfeiffer looks great in real life too. >> she says she works at it and works hard at the gym and does it almost every single day. >> working hard is just another day in the life of our next fabulous over 40 star, cate blanche blanchett. she's even played a man. bob dylan in the 2007 movie "i'm

not there." >> who cares what i think? i'm not the president. >> and kate has proven time and time again that she's more than just a pretty face. remember when she starred in "elizabeth" that same year? >> she shaved her eyebrows and her hair back. >> i too command a win, sir. i have a hurricane in me if you dare to try me. >> the scary women in film set the bar high and make over 40 look absolutely fabulous. giving women everywhere a reason to celebrate. and they're not the only fabulous female stars over 40 that we are saluting tonight. kim basiger and marisa tomet make the list. a lot of people fired up about the new michael jackson controversies as his movie "this is it" comes out.

we've got a call from debra, she's furious about michael's dermatologist suing the estate and thinks joe jackson is trying to wrongly cash in on the film. >> i feel dr. klein is trying to get a piece of the action. and i feel the same way about joe jackson. he didn't want to be a part of michael jackson's life at one time and michael didn't want him in his life. why should he get anything he makes? >> thank you, deborah. but maryland from texas doesn't see anything wrong with michael's death making money off the movie. >> i think joe jackson should profit from whatever proceeds that comes from the michael jackson film and any other moneys that he has coming. he was the one who originally started them, all the hoopla concerning michael jackson. and so i definitely believe that he should profit just like everybody else.

>> thanks for your call, maryland. the showbiz on call phone lines are never closed. give us a ring 1-888-sbt-buzz. tonight, rosie o'donnell is dropping bomb shell new confessions you won't believe what she is saying about oprah. >> i called oprah winfrey one night. >> right. >> which was an error in judgment. and i don't know that i was even coherent. >> she's got this brand new radio show about to roll out. is she really going after oprah winfrey right before she debuts? wait until you hear this. and "showbiz tonight" with big news about oprah winfrey and her weight loss advice. i have to tell you i don't think oprah's going to like this. plus, is oprah really working with jennifer aniston for jen's own talk show? also, hulk hogan's startling suicide confessions. this is "showbiz tonight" this weekend on hln. @@@@@@@@@

now, on "showbiz tonight this weekend." hulk talks about muhammad ali's daughter calling him while he was holding a gun thinking about taking his own life. >> you think if she hadn't you would have pulled that trigger? >> um -- i don't know, in a way it snapped me out of it. >> for the first time, hulk opens up on camera about why he seriously considered killing himself and what's changed his mind. rosie o'donnell's explosive confession from her painful child abuse claims to a shocking revelation about oprah rosie isn't pulling any punches. plus, things get really dark

on the "late, late show" with craig ferguson. you have to see the moment when something totally unexpected happens in his interview with a big star. plus, more stories breaking from the showbiz news ticker, the weekend edition of tv's first provocative entertainment news show continues right now. >> welcome back to "showbiz tonight" this weekend. it is 30 minutes past the hour, i'm brooke anderson in hollywood. tonight, hulk's confession. the brand new explosive details about how hulk hogan almost tried to kill himself. for the very first time on camera, hulk opened up about how laila ali, the daughter of muhammad ali actually saved him from committing suicide. and you are not going to believe what hulk has to say about his ex-wife linda and why he says their marriage ended in divorce.

a brand new bomb shell confession from rosie o'donnell caught on tape. rosie's brand new revolutions about being sexually abused and just wait until you hear about rosie's frantic phone calls to oprah winfrey. right now from hollywood, leslie marshall, host of "the leslie marshall show." >> let's begin with hulk hogan's brand new interview on the "today" show, out to promote his book called "my life outside the ring." he opened up about how close he was to killing himself after his long marriage to ex-wife linda unravelled. he described a dramatic moment, a bottle of xanax, a bottle of rum, he was holding a gun, but then the phone rang. >> the phone rang and it was laila, she called with no agenda. called just to say hi and check on me. >> you think if she hadn't, you would have pulled that trigger?

>> i don't know. in a way it snapped me out of it to hear her voice. and at that moment, i switched gears, i got sick and tired of being sick and tired. and, you know, she kind of her voice saved my life, it really did. >> hulk says laila ali's voice saved his life. ken baker off to you first. obviously this is very shocking considering hulk never really let on how bad things had gone for him personally. we knew they'd gotten bad, but not like that. >> we know divorce is retched. around that time his son was facing all these serious charges and it was a very public messy divorce. it must have been really hard for him. but i've got to say right here. a little warning. hulk is the ultimate showman. he's promoting a book, and it seems like when celebrities have these sort of "i reached the bottom and climbed my way back to the top to happiness" there's always a gun and some sort of alcohol and pills involved.

i'm not saying he's making it up, but it's conveniently dramatic and fits that formula. i love hulk hogan, but at the same time, he says this book is called "my life outside the ring," we saw that, it was hogan knows best. >> you make a great point, ken. and i have become cynical. i always liked hulk hogan, and when i see him now on the "today" show, i sit back and wonder like i never did before, is it for real or not? now, in this bomb shell interview today, hulk also claimed his ex-wife linda's alcoholism and abusive language were the main reasons the marriage ended. take a look. >> it was tough. it was constant chaos. i was madly in love with linda. you know, old school married to her for life no matter what happened for better or for worse, doing everything i could to keep the family together. i used to brag that i was only the world's champion that never was divorced. and i figured no matter how bad it got, we could get through it. but it got to the point where everything was so negative, you

know, we couldn't be friends with the neighbors, i couldn't have people over. it got to the point where i just get sick and tired of being sick and tired. and a few years before the divorce, i started praying to be happy. and it got to the point where it couldn't go on anymore. >> he almost sounds heart broken over this still. leslie, there hasn't been a whole lot of sympathy for him right now. are you having any? >> i went from being cynical to feeling sappy because, yes, i do feel for him. i really do. marriage is a lot of work, especially if you have cameras in your household, and especially if you're a celebrity. you know, i think the neat thing about hogan being so open and, yes, a book deal does coincide or a book selling with this, is that he's a big, tough guy, a big strong guy. and even, you know, rich people celebrities have their problems and their relationships the same problems that we non-celebrity people do and that big strong guys can feel like little mice

emotionally and be made to feel that way by women. i think a lot of men might identify with this. >> how do you feel -- do you think that the sympathy factor, which as i mentioned has really waned for hulk hogan with all of the drama between his wife and son and all of that. do you think speaking out like this he's going to get people back? >> yeah, i think hulk has been in the public eye for about 30 years now. he's actually extremely popular. he has very loyal fans and i think he's playing to that fan base with this book, with this interview. he's a very emotional guy. i'm just saying he's an excellent showman and knows how to sell product and he's doing enough. >> i want to move on to rosie o'donnell and bomb shell confessions. in a brand new interview with howard stern, rosie confessed that her own mother didn't believe that her father was molesting her from the age of 6. now, in the interview, rosie says she had proof even back then and it's really painful to listen and hear rosie admitting this to us. take a listen. >> well, although i had a

tremendous amount of urinary tract infekctions, i constantly needed to be on sulfur medications and whenever i would go to the doctor, the doctor would look and say to me, do you touch yourself? and i don't know if you know, you know, you have children, but that doesn't start for a child at that age. >> she also told howard that she never got into much detail before because it was always very painful for her siblings to hear this stuff. now, leslie, as a fellow radio host, you know how brilliant howard is. he creates a safe space for celebrities to say things they might not otherwise say. but separate from all of that, why do you think she is saying this right now? >> i think she feels safe to say it, not just with howard. she's at a point in her life where she can talk about it. and i think she realizes as a parent herself and as she ages as a woman, it's something she has to do. there are so many children that are abused and molested by family members. and you know it's so sad, a.j., how many parents they go to

don't believe them when the perpetrator is within the family. i hear from people like this on my radio show all the time. and one parent won't believe them. >> and i always say, you know, hearing people like rosie speaking out can certainly help other people who may be dealing with it and don't want to confront it. hopefully it'll do some good, as well. i'm sure she'll do that with her radio show. she also confessed to calling up oprah winfrey in a panic after the whole tragic scene happened at columbine high school. >> at the height of my columbine insanity, i called oprah winfrey one night. >> right. >> which was an error in judgment, howard. >> really? >> why? was she not receptive? >> she was very kind. i don't even know i was coherent. and i was just saying we can do it together, we can do -- >> we can change the world. >> right. and she's at home in chicago going who is this girl and why the -- >> how did she get my number? >> i love her for being so candid. >> at the time she had her own talk show, her and rosie two of the most influential women on tv. we hear rosie admitting she

doesn't always have it together. ken, is that why people still continue to love rosie? warts and all the whole deal. >> yeah, it's been an attraction to her. her blog has been one of the most read celebrity blogs because she's so honest. but at the end of the day, rosie o'donne o'donnell's 47 years old, going through a cross roads in her relationship with kelly carpenter and i think she's saying, you know what? i'm going to be myself, i'm sick of hiding. and she's just letting it all hang out and it's very refreshing. >> and going to make for great radio when her show begins. leslie and ken, thank you. tonight, more brand new bad news for oprah winfrey. big news about oprah and her weight loss advice. and i can tell you she's not going to like what we're going to reveal. and is oprah going to give aniston her on talk show? would you watch? and kate gosselin's reaction to the halloween wig modelled after her hair style. she even admits to owning one. this is unbelievable.

this is "showbiz tonight" this weekend on hln.

welcome back to "showbiz tonight this weekend." tonight the great oprah weight debate. "showbiz tonight" breaks big news about oprah winfrey and her weight loss advice. and i can tell you the news is not good. oprah winfrey might want to stop sharing weight loss advice on her talk show after we show you the results of a shocking poll sha only "showbiz tonight" can share with you tonight. speaking of oprah, the "showbiz tonight" truth squad has been on the case of another brand new story. is oprah really giving jennifer aniston her own talk show? right now in hollywood, senior editor for "in touch weekly."

>> this brand new oprah weight debate began when jillian michaels, who was one of the trainers from "the biggest loser" was asked by health magazine who she would like to take under her wing and train. she said this, "if there's someone i think is utterly misguided, it would be oprah winfrey." she said she had that thyroid problem and ate soy, i'm like, how, where is dr. oz.? she is so misinformed, it's shocking to me on a daily basis. soy is terrible for you if you have thyroid issues. we asked in the question of the day, oprah winfrey, do you trust her weight loss advice? the results just came in today, a whopping 84% said no, they don't trust her weight loss advice. only 16% say they do. kim, are you shocked by those results? >> you know, i am really shocked. because the fact is oprah is not a political operative, yet a lot

of people trusted her opinion on obama, on the election. she's not a book critic, but yet people, if she endorses a book, that book goes to number one, goes on the best seller lists. if she puts a product on her favorite things list, that product goes out of stock even though she's not a brand specialist. so i think, you know, you look at oprah, she's obviously struggled with her weight, but i think people really do trust her. i'm very surprised. >> they look at her advice like it's the gospel. is this bad news for oprah? >> i don't think it's bad news at all. last time i checked, oprah's never officially endorsed any product. so if you decide to follow her influence, oprah's speaking about what works for her. everyone's dna is different. so you have to adopt remedies and therapies and treatments that you think are best for your body. if it doesn't work for you, fine, but oprah's only sharing her experiences and i think for her to say what oprah should or shouldn't be doing or what she should or should not be sharing, her viewers have a will and choice to choose and that's what they do. >> that's true. and i don't think this is going

to make a dent in her viewership. her fans are not going to abandon her over this. but i do have to tell you that today the "showbiz tonight" facebook page still exploding about comments about oprah. samantha d. wrote, maybe oprah should can it for once and listen to what someone else has to say after all, jillian won her own personal battle with her weight and oprah's been trapped in a losing battle for years. do you agree with samantha's point that oprah should stop giving a little weight loss advice until she gets her own under control? >> no, because i think people identify with oprah, probably more people who try to lose weight have the same situation that oprah has rather than what jillian has. i think jillian obviously should go on oprah's show, it'll be a big ratings hit, they'll get another expert in. i think oprah has to talk about this. this is why people love her show. they identify with her, relate to her, and they struggle themselves. >> that's true. they can identify with that. i do think this is a tricky one. oprah needs to make sure she

approaches it very carefully. i do want to move to the brand new report about jennifer aniston getting her very own talk show on oprah's upcoming cable network she's launching. the "showbiz tonight" truth squad been working all day on this. and a rep for jen called the report "completely false." marvet, but i personally have doubts whether jen could pull off hosting a talk show. what do you think? >> i think jen is a movie star and she should stick to leveraging her brand against movies. i've never seen her host a show, i've never heard of her even being interested in a show. i think she should stick to what she does well. >> stick to what her strengths are. well, what got these reports started was this. jen's appearance on chelsea lately. she asked her what she's drinking because she's got a great body. jennifer was pretty funny. >> i drink vodka. >> yes, that's what i drink. >> that's my drink of choice, actually. >> really?

>> it's a clean liquor, yes. >> it doesn't seem like the same thing is happening. >> first of all, you're crazy. second of all, how many are you drinking? >> so, kim, she does seem to have a pretty good sense of humor. is this such a farfetched idea, jennifer hosting her own talk show? >> you know, she is really funny and if she ever did this, people would definitely tune in. but she would have to change her entire personality. the fact is jennifer aniston is known for being a private person. and if you have your own talk show, you have to be someone like oprah who is willing to put herself out there about her weight issues or someone like tyra banks who goes out wearing a bathing suit wearing her cellulite and takes off her wig. and until jennifer aniston is ready to do that, i don't think we're going to see that very soon. >> my thoughts exactly. she would have to be very open about her personal life, and she's not used to doing that.

kim serafin, marvet, thanks. i know some of you dressed up as kate gosselin for halloween. the kate gosselin wig was a huge seller. kate herself says she thinks it's funny even though she's not going to see any money from it. >> tlc pr e-mailed me, yes, one of the hottest wigs of the halloween season was going to be the kate wig. but they don't call it the kate wig because then, of course, they'd have to give me some of the proceeds. so there's nowhere on the packaging that says my name which i find very interesting and no, i do not benefit from the proceeds. i hear it's back ordered from now until the end of time. somehow i managed to get my hands on one and i'm just hanging on to it for the -- i don't know, my reaction, i laughed my head off. that is just plain ridiculous. and i hear everywhere that there's going to be all these jon and kates for halloween this year. now there's a wig for the woman. they line up their eight kids in

strollers and whatever. so i think it's funny. you know, it's humorous. i think that it's great that people can laugh at us and with us. >> you better get the kate wig while it's hot. kate says she's already thinking about what her next hairstyle should be. things got really dark on the late, late show with craig ferguson. you have to see the moment when something totally unexpected happens right in the middle of craig's interview with a big star. more stories from the "showbiz tonight" newsroom making news right now. 

tonight, many catholics are furious with larry david because of a joke he made on his show "curb your enthusiasm" involving jesus. did the joke go too far? then michael jackson may be gone from the world, but he's very much alive at the box office. his new movie opened yesterday, and we're going to find out what's up with "this is it." plus, wanda sykes is on stage, on screen, on television and tonight on my show. is she just on a roll or is she on speed? she'll be here joining me in the studio. all this and more starts now.

now, some people call this clip from larry david's hbo series comedy and others blasphemy. you be the judge. here's the scene from "curb your enthusiasm" on sunday, god's day off, that started the controversy. ♪ ♪ >> some people say why is there a picture of jesus in the bathroom? joining me to discuss this and more, andy borowitz

of the borowitz report, michelle collins, comedian and managing editor of bestweekever.tv and lorri morgan, country music star extrodinaire. now, we just saw that. what it is, he -- first of all, i find it offensive to watch people urinate. that part annoys me. but, you know, i know larry. he is hilarious and takes a lot of chances on that show. what he did was the urine accidentally goes on the picture of jesus and other people come in and religious people think that the portrait is crying. you know, these type of people who think that the face of jesus appears on a tamale and they get all excited. but it's that same group of people that he's making fun of. lorrie, i know you are a devout catholic. >> very much. >> does that offend you? >> yes, actually, it does. i -- i guess because i was raised to be reverent to jesus and to the church and that's my -- that was my upbringing. and that's how i feel.

i feel it would have been funnier had he had his mother hanging there or something. >> oh, yeah. as a matter of fact, before i go on with you two, the president of the catholic league issued a statement monday saying, last night's episode demonstrates that david's best years are behind him. he ought to quit while he's ahead. would he think it's comedic if someone urinated on a picture of his mother? >> oh, really? >> he would think it's hilarious. >> he would, yeah, i know. >> that's one of the things that donohue, whatever his name is, he doesn't get. he would think that's the funniest thing. >> that's going to be an episode for "sweeps," i think, for larry. peeing on his mother's picture. >> or his mother peeing on him. every show larry does something to offend someone. i'm glad finally the catholics are feeling a little bit -- >> they got picked on. >> it's about time. >> i was a little bit offended as a urinator. i've got to say. >> i can see that. >> that is my group, people with the heavy flow. i was a little bit offended. i was offended. >> he says, this guy, donahue, he says hbo only makes fun of catholics. what about this scene from

"curb" when a holocaust survivor argues with a contestant from the show, "survivor"? watch this. >> have you ever seen the show? >> did you ever see our show? it was called the holocaust. >> look, all i know is i was damn close to that million dollars. all right? the whole time everyone's backstabbing me and undermining me trying to get me kicked off the show. >> don't talk about survival. i'm a survivor! >> i'm a survivor! >> i'm a survivor! >> i'm a survivor! >> i'm a -- >> he also took on the muslims in another episode. so he really is a religious basher on all counts. >> buddhists are next. >> maybe buddhists. they're pretty funny, buddhists. >> they are funny. >> i'm jewish. i laughed at that. my grandparents are holocaust survivors. we, as jews, have bigger things to worry about like our people not getting re-murdered in europe. we have bigger fish to fry. than our -- you know, the adl or whatever coming after larry david. >> to me there's still something that is so -- and i -- i

understand your point totally, but to me, it's just, i guess it's my upbringing. it's just my opinion. i would never, ever think of doing something like that to a picture of jesus. i just -- >> because it offends the catholic sensibility. >> it does. i'm with my mom, who is 78 years old. totally -- i mean, she could be the pope, you know, if she wanted to be. that's how strict she is. >> i don't think technically she could be the pope. >> i agree. i'm not familiar with all the rules, but i think there are some problems -- >> she could be in our family. i mean, her sisters are the same way. so -- >> is it common to have jesus in the bathroom? this is my question. i would feel more uncomfortable having a hot dude in a beard watch me pee than getting my waste on him. he's a handsome guy, joy. >> jesus? >> a very good-looking guy. >> well, in that rendition. we don't really know what he looks like. do they make up the way he looks? nobody knows what he looks like really. >> i would be heartbroken if -- >> if i found that out i'd be heartbroken, too.

no hunchback. >> no hunchback jesus for me. >> he looks like willem dafoe. as far as i know. >> i could never worship a man who looked like that. i'll be honest with you. >> speaking of leaking, levi johnston continues to leak dirt about sarah palin in their ongoing feud. did you know that? >> oh, yes. >> on "the early show" today he was asked about reconciling with the palins. take a look. >> is it too late to turn back now? is it too late to save that relationship? reconcile with the palins? >> yeah. i don't see myself over there for christmas or whatnot, so i don't know. >> oh, my god. >> do we really want this to end? andy, it's such a great thing. >> i never want it to end. first of all, i'm so happy he's posing nude. actually, i've been doing a little dance of joy in my office all day long. can't wait for the picture. like the tasteful wang on the antler shot. whatever they're going to go for. i don't know, but it's going to be tasteful. >> do you know he's going to drop his levis and showing us his johnston. did you know that? >> i know that. i think whatever floats your boat or whatever floats his

stuff. it's fine with me. i don't care what he does. i just don't want him bashing his family all the time. >> levi and sarah palin have become the republican version of jon and kate. they're like this fraught couple that doesn't get along. we haven't heard from bristol in months. todd, i -- >> she's laying low, bristol. she's smart to do that. >> todd, we've never heard from. >> what's todd doing? you know the palins, don't you, lorrie? >> i don't know them personally. i do not. i'm a sarah palin fan. >> you are? >> yes, i am. >> are you looking forward to her book? >> well -- >> i'm getting the english translation. >> are you? >> waiting for that. >> here's what levi said on the "early show" about his claim that palin called her son, trig, retarded. listen to this. >> you know, she'd be like, where's my retarded baby and all this. it wasn't right. i have no proof of showing you it's true, but i know it is. i was just in shock the first time i heard it. she would say it regularly. i was just like, you know -- i think she was joking but still, you know, doesn't make it right.

>> do you think she really said that? >> for sure. >> you do? >> oh, for sure. why would he make something like that up? >> because he's an idiot. >> he's an idiot. that's why he wouldn't make it up. that's my defense. he's too stupid to make that up. >> i can see levi being offended by the retarded remark. i think it probably didn't happen. think about it, guys. neither levi nor sarah palin has even been in alaska for the last 12 months. she's been out promoting the book and stumping for -- >> therefore? >> this couldn't have happened. >> they were at the convention together. >> okay. that brief photo op. >> she passed the joint around more than a joint at the grateful dead concert. >> i'm sorry. i just don't think she said that. i just really don't. >> i think she has a whole other side to her we don't see. >> here's palin's response. she said, consider the source -- i remember when i was a kid, they'd go, consider the source of the most recent attention-getting lies. those who would sell their body for money reflect a desperate need for attention and are likely to say and do anything

for even more attention -- meaning the full frontal in play girl. which by the way, does he know that mostly gay guys read that book? >> for sure. hello. that's where the money is. gay porn. he's not stupid. >> i like when levi is on the shows like the "today" show. they treat him like a serious political pundit, like he's george will or something like that. why does he have that credibility? i don't understand. >> i don't understand it either. >> by the way, his "playgirl" shoot is on the same day oprah is interviewing sarah palin. coincidence, you tell me. thanks, everybody, very much. up next, one of the rare women of late night, wanda sykes, joins me.

people ask me why i'm doing late-night tv. well, now whenever we ask our friends to come over, they want to know, are the babies going to be there? of course the babies are going to be there. they're like, oh, we can't make it. i have to go give blood. so clearly i had no choice but to find another place to hang out. so this is my home away from home. but just don't tell my wife about it because right now she thinks i'm out in the garage putting together a highchair. >> i've known this woman for a long time. her hbo specials prove she's one of the funniest and edgiest women working in comedy today. not just women, anybody. her new late night talk show premieres on november 7th and i love the title, "the wanda sykes show." has a ring. i always wanted a show named after me, too. oh, i do have one.

sorry. wanda, hi. >> hi. >> how are you? >> good to be here. >> so, listen. you've got so many things going on, girlfriend. you've got the hbo special, you're on the christina -- what is it again? >> "new invincible christine." glad you're a loyal fan. >> a laborious title but a funny show. and now you have a talk show at night competing with all the boys late at night. >> well, i'm on saturday night. >> oh, you're on saturday? >> the boys take the night off. >> chelsea has one, too? >> yeah. >> chelsea lately. that show. she's on every night. >> i think she's on every night. >> you're only on on saturday night? >> saturday night. >> that's how you can do all this work. >> yes. with a black president now i don't have to work as hard. >> that's true. okay. >> i just do -- they wanted me to work seven nights. i was like, no, race card, black president. >> pass the race card. >> we get two race cards a year now with a black president. sweet. >> that's great. so the last person to -- a woman

to have a talk show, late night, was joan rivers. that was 25 years ago. >> wow. >> you know, i mean, that was -- dick cheney was still on his first pacemaker. nothing for that. okay, fine. >> i'm with you. i'm with you. >> it's fine. no, they're brain dead. it's okay. rumor has it that you wanted a black head writer for your show. >> a blackhead writer? >> a black head writer. >> oh, oh. >> not a blackhead writer. how many jokes can you do on one blackhead? >> you can't. there's not a lot there. >> why is it important for you to have a black head writer? >> i didn't specify i wanted a black, you know, head writer. i said i wanted a funny writer. a guy who was good. it wasn't -- i didn't put that out. that wasn't in the -- >> it wasn't? so it was just a rumor, not true. >> not true. not true. i said i wanted a head writer with a large penis. >> oh. okay.

>> you can -- you know. however you want to go with that one. >> i guess they interpreted it that way. >> and big lips. that's all i said. large penis and thick lips. that's what i said, all i wanted. >> and a good dancer. >> great dancer. >> so they can come to any conclusion they want. >> i didn't say nothing about black. >> i see. everyone's talking about the letterman show and the staff quoted -- all the staff quotes on all the shows. i found out last night here that there are 50 writers on all three shows and they're all male. >> really? >> all male. 50 male writers. is that shocking to you? >> it's very shocking. i have female writers, male writers, you know, black, white, it's a mix. yeah. >> and you were a female -- a writer -- >> i still am. >> you're still a female show woman. >> yep. still there. >> and you were working with chris rock, right? >> working with chris rock, right. i was the only female on that

staff. >> did anyone sexually harass you over there? >> i wasn't that hot back then. >> that was before you were a lesbian. >> before i became a hot lesbian. >> now that you're a lesbian -- >> now i'm a hot lesbian. they would be all over me. back then, yeah, no, no one hit on me. i mean, come on. you know, i mean, we're filthy. comics are filthy. we talk, stuff we say is -- it's not appropriate outside of the comedy room. it's not. but, yeah -- but the guys over there, they were cool. >> they were cool with it. >> yeah. >> there's some kind of scuttlebutt about how the guys in the comedy room, they don't feel comfortable in front of the girls with their, you know, with their flatulence material. the girls probably go, that's not funny, and they don't like that. >> well, yeah. i guess. or, you know, they -- guys are -- i'm not going to even say intimidated, but it's, to me it's like they don't hear women in the writers' room. when you're there, you pick something and --

>> you're invisible. >> you're invisible. it's like they don't even hear. another guy will pitch exactly what i just said and they think it's the funniest thing in the world. >> why is that? >> i'm like, what, didn't i just say that? you know, i just said -- i think guys, like, when they're at work they tune off their ears to listen to a female's voice. you know? it's like, okay, i'm at work. no need to hear that. then when they go back home they turn it up a little bit and, okay, all right, okay, i can barely hear her. i hear her voice and that's it. >> i'm going to change the subject if you don't mind. >> we want to roll with that. it's your show. it's your show. >> moving along here. because i want to talk about the fact that you came out as a -- you came out of the closet. i don't know if you were in the closet. >> i really wasn't in the closet. >> i knew you when you were married when you were wanda sykes-hall and the next thing i knew you were gay and just wanda sykes. i never saw that coming. >> you didn't see that coming? >> no. >> after we were making out, you

didn't see that coming? >> does that make you -- for goodness sakes. you came out at a same-sex marriage rally in las vegas in 2008. >> right. there was a lot -- i'm very proud. i'm proud to be a woman. i'm proud to be a black woman. i'm proud to be gay. and i love you all. now, let's go get our equal rights. come on. >> i'm not proud of that hair color. >> this is cute. this color's cute. when did you realize that you were gay? how did it happen? tell me. >> how did it happen? >> was it a slow -- >> i think -- you know, it was the way i was born and i think earlier on, like when i was in maybe second or third grade, i knew. >> oh, really? >> yeah. yeah. >> that you were attracted to the girls? >> i remember telling one of my brother's girlfriends or

something, i was like, i wish i were a boy or whatever, so then you could be my girlfriend. yeah. she was like, oh, no, no. you can't say that. you know? you can't think like that. so, you know, so you just go, okay, that was a bad move. you suppress everything and get in line. okay, this is the way things are supposed to be. >> you got in line for a long time. >> yeah. >> there must have been a trigger, though. where were you when it came to you? were you at a bowling alley? where were you? >> okay, yeah. bowling alley, softball game, come on. >> where were you? come on, tell me. >> i don't even remember. it just happens. you know? it's -- you know, you have the attraction there, i guess. >> you're not the first person. it happened to a -- >> i'm not the only gay person? get out of here. >> no, women comedians. women comedians who thought they were straight and then they turned out not to be. their so much happier now that they're out of the closet. >> so much happier. >> i want to talk more about

this and other stuff when we come back with wanda sykes, not wanda sykes-hall. >> first black president. but i got to tell you, it's a little bittersweet. it is. first black president and the country is broke. what the [ bleep ]? hahahahahahaí

rush limbaugh said he hopes this administration fails. you know, so you're saying i hope america fails? you're like, i don't care about people losing their homes or jobs or our soldiers in iraq? he just wants the country to fail. to me, that's treason. he's not saying anything differently than what osama bin laden is saying. you know, you might want to look into this. i think rush limbaugh was the 20th hijacker but he was so strung out on oxycontin he missed his flight. i'm back with a very funny woman. her new late night talk show premieres on november 7th. that was from the washington correspondents dinner.

you caused a lot of controversy at that dinner. everyone who does it causes controversy and gets criticized for it. it's a thankless job. why did you say yes? >> i mean, cause, come on, it's the first black president. >> got to do it. >> you got to do it. i had to do it. it's just an honor to be invited, you know? so -- i said -- i made a decision. i was like, you know what, you asked for it so you're going to get it. i'm not going to hold back. i'm not going to hold back. you know? i'm going to show up and be me. so it was -- >> was limbaugh mad? >> i have no idea. i don't know. who cares. >> who cares. so what? who cares. >> it was so funny because i was so wrapped up into doing it, focusing. i was sitting at the table. the first lady is there. i'm going through my notes and going through my cards. okay, i got it, i got it. she leaned over to say something to me and i -- she leaned over and said something. i literally looked at her and went -- and went back to my cards.

that's how focused i was. i brushed off the first lady, like, i'm working, woman. >> she was interrupting you. >> yeah, interrupting me. hey, hey. busy. >> busy. working over here. >> people ask me, what was that experience like? i don't even remember. >> let me go back a minute to your family. because i'm very interested. you have twins now. >> yes. >> and what's your girlfriend's name again? >> alex. >> alex. i keep thinking kelly. i'm thinking of another couple i know. >> yeah. okay. >> so alex gave birth to the babies, right? sorry. and so -- has your family seen the babies? how are they dealing with all of this? it's an interracial gay marriage. >> right. >> it's a lot to digest. >> so we should stay out of louisiana is what you're saying. >> mississippi. i would say alabama. >> we should just take a ride through the south and just film it. we should. just see how many states we can get through.

you know, here's the mississippi border. >> i mean, has anyone in your family come to see the kids? are they accepting of it? do you care? >> my brother and his wife, my nephews, they've seen the kids. and it's just like an issue as far as with distance, i guess. my parents do plan on seeing the kids. >> so everything is copacetic at home with this? >> not going to say that, but it's getting there. >> when does your new show start? >> november 7th. >> do you feel nervous about it? >> a little. but usually everything just comes together. you know? i work hard at it. keith robinson, a very funny comic, we've been friends for 20 years. so it will be -- it's great. i get to hang out with keith and just every week just rip him apart. >> i just want you to be successful at this, because it's been so many years and there's never a woman in late night,

particularly on the big three networks. we have "chelsea late night" and now you. you know, those real money-makers. >> mo'nique is on b.e.t. >> mo'nique. did you see precious? >> not yet. i want to see her. >> she -- i hope she comes on this show. i want to tell her what a brilliant performance she gave in that movie. oh my god. the levels -- the levels -- she's a comedienne. who knew she was such an -- it was like meryl streep level. really very interesting stuff. so what do you think about how the country's going now? do you feel positive about it? >> i feel -- i feel positive. i just hope we don't lose focus because when you see how we all jump behind balloon boy, that's scary. >> i know. >> that's scary. that balloon boy -- >> did you think he was in that thing? you didn't think -- i said, he can't be in that thing. >> no, no. i knew he wasn't in there.

look at the father, he looks like a big dummy. it was like what makes you think this idiot could build a spaceship that could carry a child? look at it. it looks like a big bag of jiffy pop. what the hell? >> exactly. >> everybody wanted -- they loved the drama of it. loved the drama of it. everybody was disappointed when they found out the little boy was okay. like oh -- >> they weren't disappointed. >> joy, they weren't disappointed. they wanted that boy to be found in the woods somewhere being protected by like a bear or something. they wanted a bear to come out of the woods. >> have you seen the new michael jackson movie? >> no, i have not. i plan -- that's another thing on my list. because you know i have a lot of free time now, joy, with a show and kids and everything. >> i haven't been able to see it. >> why are you asking me like i have free time, like a life or something? >> i'm sorry. i thought maybe you saw it. now that he's dead he's making a lot of money.

>> he is making a lot of money. >> a lot. is it the third or the fourth? the third wealthiest dead celebrity. >> the third? >> the third wealthiest. >> elvis and who? >> elvis is fourth. >> who are the other two? >> yves saint laurent, the designer. composers rodgers & hammerstein. one and two. then michael jackson, then elvis. isn't that something? it's fascinating to me. >> i was going to say something very inappropriate. >> go ahead, say it. >> no. >> we can cut it out. we can cut it out. we have a seven-second delay. come on, say it. say it. do you want to say the "f" word? want to say the "f" word? >> no, it's fine. >> say it, come on, wanda. >> nothing. not going to get it out of me. >> what's the most tasteless joke you've ever told? >> what i was about to say. >> i'm telling you, we have ways here to cut things out. go ahead. >> you get it and then you air it. what this [ bleep ] said. >> no, we wouldn't.

i promise you. >> i'll tell you later. want me to write it down for you? okay. >> now, what's the thing you love the most? is it standup, is it the tv show? is it acting? you do everything. >> it's all of it. >> you love all of it? >> i love all of it. i think i would probably get bored if i was just doing one -- but stand-up is the -- that's the key right there. that's where it all starts. >> it's the most stressful. why is it? tell people why it's the most stressful. i'm tired of saying it because i know it is. i know it is. >> it's just you. you know, you, it's the audience, and it's never the same. because you don't know what kind of audience you're going to get. you don't know what the building -- you know, the venue is like. it's just, you're alone. you're alone. there's no edit -- okay, i'll cut that out. you know? >> everybody's wearing clothes and you're naked. that's how it feels. everybody's looking at you and you have no clothes on and

they're sitting there in tuxedos. >> you're alone, right. >> it's make me laugh, bitch? >> exactly. >> do you think it's harder for women? >> i think it's -- well, i don't know about harder for women. you do have to get past this first. you know, it's, okay, stop looking at my boobs. can you hear me? let's have some fun. let's have some jokes. >> do you think it's easier for lesbians? >> easier for lesbians? >> yeah. >> hot lesbians or -- >> no, not hot lesbians, just lesbians. just plain old lesbians. you think it's easier? because the men, if they know you're a lesbian -- >> no. because now they're all doing is fantasizing about, i bet i could turn her. >> exactly. >> or picture me with, you know, fantasize about joining in. so -- actually, it's harder for me, joy. it's harder. >> is it harder for you? >> it's harder. >> anyway, good luck with everything. you're doing great. you're on a roll.

it's great to have you here. >> thank you, good to be here. >> the show is called "the wanda sykes show." producers are so clever, aren't they? it premieres on fox on november 7th. i'll be right back with gale king.

♪ be careful what you do be careful what you do ♪ ♪ because the lie becomes the truth ♪ ♪ hey, hey ♪ billie jean is not my lover she's just the girl who claims that i am the one ♪

>> michael jackson's "this is it" debuted this week among acclaim and controversy. everyone is talking about it. take a look. >> right there. ♪ into the nighttime ♪ if this town is just an appetite ♪ ♪ and they say why, why and they say why, why ♪ ♪ and they say why, why >> joining me to talk about the movie, the man, the money, frank dileo and gayle king, editor at large at "o" and host of "the gayle king show" on sirius xm. gayle, let me start with you. it seems like it's a fabulous film. do you think it's oscar worthy?

they're talking about nominating it for best documentary. >> i actually do think it's oscar worthy. what's so funny to me is my own reaction to it. i was always a fan of michael jackson's music, but i can't say i was still into michael jackson the way i used to be. but after he died and hearing all of his music, it brought it all back about why i liked him. so when i went to go see this movie, i can honestly say to you i was blown away and not expecting to be. i was blown away because you see his passion for what he does, his humility, his kindness to people was really something to see. >> yeah, yeah, yeah. frank, did you see the film? >> oh, yes, i've seen it, many stages. of course, i've seen the finished product many times. gayle is right. it shows the warmth of michael. it shows his work ethic. it shows how passionate he was about this show and how perfect he wanted it to be. >> joy, he was a perfectionist in every sense of the word. >> the music is great. i mean, when you just want to move. >> and i'm telling you, joy, it

brings it all back to you. what bothers me when i hear people criticizing the movie. because this was not a movie that was supposed to be for public consumption. this was for his own personal library. we were never supposed to see this. when people say, they had to use subtitles, well, he wasn't talking to us. there wasn't a microphone. >> do you think he would be upset if he knew everyone was watching this movie? >> no. may i butt in for a second? >> yes, frank, please butt in. >> please butt in. >> what this is, this is the documentary part of all of his tours. my history with michael, we always filmed rehearsals backstage. crowds. that's all we were doing. unfortunately when he passed away, as we were sitting there talking amongst ourselves remembering the great times, we threw on some film and we were just looking at it and somebody said, you know, this would have been such a great show, but the fans should see what he was really about.

that's how this came to pass. >> let me ask you something. did he seem healthy, frank? because protesters were saying he was unhealthy and aeg was using him to make a profit. >> no. that's an absolute lie. >> it's a lie? >> michael was healthy. >> then why all the drugs and the doctor 24/7? what was that about? >> well, i'll explain it to you. he was 136 pounds. now, for some reason, michael wanted a doctor to go on tour. i wasn't aware of this doctor. we met him one time. all right? >> yeah. >> i don't know why he wanted that. the man was 50 years old. he made decisions without me. i was in charge of the tour, not his personal, personal, personal life. >> you didn't really know what was going on? >> no. no. if i would have known, do you think i would have let it happen? >> i can't say, joy, he looked unhealthy in the movie that we saw. you know, it's my understanding, frank, they recorded 100 hours. we only saw two. but he was very, very thin.

but i have no way of knowing -- i don't think anybody really knows whether he was healthy or not. >> joe jackson, his father, his father claimed body doubles were used. >> i didn't believe that. i think joe jackson said a lot of things that are very skeptical to those of us who have seen the movie. i didn't see indication of a body double. >> what do you think of that, frank? >> there are no body doubles. was there a stuntman? any manager or any studio would not let somebody in a blue screen maybe slide down a banister or jump through a window. >> do you think joe is mad because he's not making money on this film? >> you'll have to make that decision on your own. >> what do you think, frank? come on. >> no, no, no. >> frank, what do you think? >> come on, frank. >> you know joe jackson. i don't. do you know joe jackson, joy? >> no, but i've seen him on television and don't believe a word he says, frankly. it's interesting. i mean, there's a lot of money we're talking about. because michael jackson -- i just saw the crawl yesterday that he's the third richest dead

celebrity in the world. do you know who the first one is? yves saint laurent. worth $350 million dead. michael jackson, $90 million. elvis presley only a mere $55 million. i would have thought he was more than that. >> i'm not surprised the numbers have jumped for michael jackson. i didn't have one michael jackson song on my ipod. after he died and i started hearing all the music, i decided that i wanted to get all of the top things that i remember. i know a lot of people have done that. >> it's interesting. >> you didn't do that, joy? you don't have michael jackson joys on your ipod? >> i don't know how to even download. how much do you think this film's going to make? frank, do you know? >> well, i -- we think it's going to do very well. right now, two days, we're at about $22 million. but you have to remember something. that 90% of all the profits go to the children's trust. >> that's good. >> not only that, they're saying right now it's only going to play for two weeks.

i don't believe that, joy. i believe there will be such a demand for the movie, they'll say, well, why don't we extend it another week, why don't we extend it another two weeks? right now, it's really genius when you think about it, to be told you only have two weeks. you think, i have to go see it now. >> it hasn't sold out everywhere. did you know that? >> no, i did not know that. >> it has not sold out everywhere, frank. did you know that? maybe it's too much of michael right now or the economy? i don't know what the reason is. >> i heard it was sold out everywhere. >> it may be -- it could be in certain areas that it hasn't sold out. our research hasn't been, you know, that great today for me to comment on that. >> yeah. >> but i'm sure there's small pockets that haven't sold out. i'm sure buffalo didn't sell out. >> would you go see it? >> i would love to see it. >> we never sold a lot of records in buffalo. >> i would like to see this movie. a lot of the money is going to go to the kids. do you think the children should see the movie? will it have a negative effect on the kids or what? >> well, it's funny -- go ahead, frank.

>> i'm sorry. the children do want to see the film. they both have had the flu. they've missed two of the screenings set up for them. they will see it probably in the next week or so. >> a lot of the -- a news article i read said that these being used as pawns in the financial tug-of-war that's going on. >> see, i don't know anything about -- are the children being used or not used. i think whether the decision is made for them to see it will come at a time when they're ready. but when i was sitting there watching it, i was watching with my daughter who is 23, and i said i wonder how difficult it would be for his kids. i found it difficult to watch, and i never met michael jackson. i never had a conversation with him, but i felt such sadness for the life that he had. i really did. it made me so incredibly sad. so i can't imagine what it's like for people who loved him and knew him. two of the brothers were on oprah the other day, jackie and tito, and i believe it was tito who said it was too painful for him to see it yet, that he was not able to see it.

i'm curious about the people who loved him and really knew him. the way frank does felt about him. >> i want to talk about when we come back about his legacy and how it's being affected. we'll come back and talk more about the michael jackson movie in just a minute.

tonight, live, colorado. the whole country on pins and needles. a little 6-year-old boy's life hanging in the balance and a beautiful space-like balloon, soaring through the clouds. police, sheriffs, national guard, volunteers, the faa, even a whole airport and commercial carriers trying to save the life of a 6-year-old boy whose brothers and parents say is trapped inside that homemade balloon. eyewitness reports say something

or someone fell thousands of feet to rough terrain near the colorado rocky mountains. after 60 miles of terror, the balloon lands. no boy. was he dead? was he injured? was he lying down a ravine with every bone in his body broken? no! he was hiding in the family attic the whole time, blurting out on national tv it was all, quote, for the show. on not one, but two, morning shows that same boy so nervous, he vomits when asked the question. breaking tonight, a stunning confession blows this case wide open. we learn the mom confesses to police it was a hoax from the get-go. the heenes forcing their boys to lie on tv and to police, all to make the family famous. more disturbing news about the boys' home environment. video of another attempt of daddy using the boys as fodder

for a reality show. we have the video. in addition to an alleged domestic abuse 911 call to the home, the boys appear on youtube in a rap song allegedly their dad wrote and taught them full of filthy language. the title is so vulgar, a smear on women. i will not repeat it on the air. richard heene's ex-wife with us live taking your calls tonight. looks like bye bye reality show, hello, cell block. >> is the flying saucer gone as well? >> yes. about 20 minutes i think. >> they've both been missing for about 20 minutes? >> yes. >> okay. >> we've got to find my son. >> did you hear us calling you at any time?

>> mm-hmm. >> you did? >> you did? >> why didn't you come out? >> um, you guys said that we did this for the show. >> this is a hoax. >> i'm really sorry i yelled at him. >> it was a publicity stunt. >> absolutely no hoax. >> mayumi heene came clean on the whole thing. she lied to police. >> you think he is flying around in the air somewhere? >> he's in the air. >> he's in the air? >> yeah. he's only 6.

breaking news in florida. a 5-year-old girl tucked into bed. five hours later, she's gone. daddy comes home from the night shop to find not a trace of haleigh. even in one brief interview, she can't keep her story straight, including a 180 on a failed lie detector, claiming she passed. then admitting on tv she failed. bombshell tonight, according to sources inside the search and investigation little haleigh is dead. search teams pack up and leave

town, convinced haleigh is no longer alive. tonight as insiders announce haleigh is dead, croslin goes awol, skipping town again. why? >> i pulled into the yard, the front door was wide open. she was standing in it. i asked her what she was doing up. she told me the back door was wide open and haleigh was gone. >> new developments in the missing 5-year-old girl haleigh cummings. the search says she is dead. >> i didn't do anything to that little girl. i love her. >> they believe haleigh is no longer alive and authorities will be lucky to find her body. they say they will no longer

search for haleigh as they only search for missing children who could be found alive. >> did it ever disturb you that misty croslin's story actually changed? >> yes, ma'am, it did. >> putnam county authorities continue to work day and night on the case, poring over 500 leads, hoping to come across the one tip that would bring haleigh home. >> we would love to have a break in this case. >> misty has been deceptive, her stories don't make sense, and the key to this case lies with her. >> in other developments, stepmom/babysitter misty croslin's 911 call has been released. >> some black guy jumped in my car and said he was going to shoot me. >> croslin called cops after being robbed at gunpoint after allegedly trying to buy drugs. >> we've seen people commit crazy crimes against their own family members because the drive of these drugs are so strong. >> good evening. i'm nancy grace. i want to thank you for being

with us. bombshell tonight. a stunning confession blows the case wide open. we learn mom confesses to police it was all a hoax from the get-go. the balloon hoax, the boy in the balloon, and video surfaces tonight of another attempt of daddy using his own three boys as fodder for a different reality show. tonight we have the video. >> the flying saucer. it wasn't supposed to fly. >> okay. >> we thought we had this thing tethered down. >> okay. and i think my 6-year-old boy -- >> what's wrong? >> he got inside and it took off. >> he says he was hiding in the attic and it was because i yelled at him. scared the heck out of us. >> the act was convincing. >> i'm really sorry i yelled at him. >> first there was the tear-filled post-attic news conference.

then to top it off, you had the mayumi heene gave quite a performance. >> we were doing an experiment. the flying saucer was supposed to be tied down. i don't know what happened to the tie. it got loose. so it is flying. >> so you think he's flying around in the air somewhere. >> then on cnn, the story started to crumble. >> you guys said that we did this for the show. >> mom. >> one of the guys told him it was for a tv show, so that's what he was referring to. and that's what he was referring to when he made that statement. >> and i know i want to point

out that the sheriff's office said last night that they believe your account of what happened, but they do want to question you a little bit more. >> you are seeing the heene family on the nbc today show. out to nia bender. i understand that mommy made a confession. >> mommy made a confession. she did. >> after all this, what happened? >> apparently she went ahead and confessed in an affidavit -- well, they were taking an affidavit, that she was aware of the whole thing, knew it was a hoax, that her husband knew it was a hoax, and they planned it for about two weeks before it took place. >> clark, give me the story surrounding this alleged confession by mommy. after all they've been through, she called up police just like that, they told their boys to lie to police and on tv? >> it didn't go exactly like that, nancy, there was a bit more involved, and here's how law enforcement convinced the wife to talk.

in fact what happened was they talked with the husband they said -- this is on saturday, the hoax happened on thursday -- they said come on down to the police station, we've got the aircraft for you and we'll give it back. he came on down and they started questioning the husband. at that time law enforcement converges on the home of mayumi and the children, they question her. she talks with them willingly. they take her down and she begins to talk. >> it's my understanding, clark goban, the morning after, the lawyers are all mad that the affidavit she submitted to was released. they didn't want the public to know. the parents are admitting it was a hoax. they're not talking about, hey, we're sorry we cost thousands and thousands of dollars. we had everybody upset, we used our own flesh and blood, our 6-year-old boy, we made him vomit on tv. they're not worried about that. they're mad that the affidavit was released. am i right? >> yes, nancy, and in addition to that, the husband's attorney was also saying, well, the confession may not be all that important because the wife's

command of the english language is not that great. >> well, hold on, hold on. norm, let's play part of that 911 call. let's check out her english. i'm waiting on that 911 call. tell me when you've got it queued up, norm. you do have it? okay. let's roll. >> hello. >> hi. >> hi. what's going on? >> we are doing experiment. the flying saucer we made here. it is supposed to be tied down. so it is just floating 20 feet up. but i don't know what happened to the tie but it got loose or something so it's flying. >> okay. you think he's flying around in the air somewhere?

>> yes. >> unleash the lawyers, sue m s moss. the husband is saying she has a problem with english. did you hear the rest of that call? not only is her english not fluent but perfect, she even knows how to inject emotion. this is all a big act. she's crying, she sounds like she's hyper ventilating about her little boy that could die at any moment? >> nancy, if this case does go to trial, if they're ever charged with anything, it's going to be a case about mitigation of sentencing. >> put odom's face up. why can't you address -- forget it, odom. you had your chance. horowitz, what about that statement that she doesn't understand english? >> it is a lame excuse. it is just one big hoax. it is an american tradition.

>> okay, tradition. b.s.

at least if you are going come with up a story, come up with something i can kind of believe. we all heard that 911 call. not only is she speaking perfect english, she's also using perfect emotional inflection throughout to display her distress that her son was about to fall thousands of feet through the air to his death. i have right here in my hands, the affidavit. let's see a full screen of that, norm, that she signed, mayumi

heene signed, where she states, the hoax was planned approximately two weeks earlier. the flying sauceer was specifically made to carry out the hoax. that she and her husband had instructed their children to lie to authorities as well as to the media. there you have it. but let's see the other attempts they've failed to make a reality show, some kind of show for tv. that is a show you'll see of their father called "box time." you'll see the little boy, i believe the youngest one, falcon, jumping in and out of the box. to susan moss, you are the child advocate. what the hay is going on with this bunch? >> this is absolutely awful. these children are not only being taught how to lie, but they're taught they need to lie on such a grand scale that it caused one kid to throw up repeatedly on national television. this is just devastating, and there will be penalties for this.

>> what is heene saying right there, norm? do we have sound with that? >> i don't want to hear the rest. >> the boobs, what do you think fake or real? what i do want to see is the rap video that mr. heene reportedly allegedly wrote and produced for his children. it's been all over youtube and the title is a slur on women. let's hear the sound, norm. where are the lyrics? ♪

♪ we're out in the road ♪ drop our pants ♪ take a big load ♪ colorado, dallas, amarillo ♪ south dakota, north dakota, kansas city too ♪ ♪ oklahoma city ♪ wichita, omaha too >> we're going to show you those lyrics shortly. in another shot in that rap song, peter odom, daniel horowitz, defense attorneys joining us tonight, they actually have one of the children smeared in i assume fake excrement sitting on a commode. and you all know the lyrics by now, i'm sure our producer sent them to you. it's full of filthy language. calling a gay guy a faggot up a

tree, using slurs on women, sexual slurs on women. that little boy is 6 years old now, daniel horowitz. i don't know how old he was when he was spewing that kind of filth on youtube. what about it? you've got a child to raise now. a new child. what do you think, horowitz? >> well, nancy, unfortunately, i think it's a sign of our times. this type of conduct is seemingly widespread. and he's not going to lose his children because of it -- >> if that's your best defense, i'm going to give you the commercial break to come up with something else. >> all right. >> everybody, as we go to break, congratulations to georgia friend of the show homecoming queen miss taylor minton. miss west side 2009. now, coincidentally, it runs in the family. her mother, dana graham minton, was on homecoming court several years ago. congratulations, beautiful taylor.

>> i hate these pajamas. these pajamas always stick to me. >> pajamas are [ bleep ]. ♪

♪ ♪ ♪

♪ okay. it gets worse after that. and i'm leaving out the part where you have the sex slurs on women. i want to go back to patty, richard heene's ex-wife. you alluded to the fact that you got out of the relationship because your children were in fear. what, if anything, did mr. heene do allegedly that caused your children to be afraid, your two little girls? >> well, they watched him

verbally throw fits and throw things at us. he was like a master of mental warfare. he put us down, hollered at us a lot. he pushed me one time over a couch and then flipped the couch with me and the children on it, threw things at me, and sometimes you know, the things would not hit me but hit them. i filed a police report in lake arrowhead, california. and that was the night he flipped us over the couch and flipped the couch and he left marks on me from throwing things. >> with me is patty. this is heene's ex-wife. giving a little insight to their family life. out to the lines. tamara in texas. hi, dear. >> caller: hi. >> what's your question? >> caller: first of all, let me tell you, god bless your family. god bless your twins. and they're just adorable. >> and they're almost 2. >> caller: i know it. >> it went by just like that. >> caller: but with this heene family, nancy, shouldn't there

be somebody, cpa or some kind of, you know -- these kids are going to need counseling for so, so long. and i cannot believe -- to me the parents need to be throwed under the jail and these kids need to be got out of the environment they're in. and maybe it won't be too late to fix them. >> to dr. janet taylor, psychiatrist and m.d., what about tamara's point? >> well, i mean, clearly they do need some intervention, some psychological evaluations. and my hope is that the kids wouldn't get taken away from the parents but some real strict -- you know, if somebody has to go to jail, they go to jail and you keep this family together and teach them about how to raise their kids from here on. because potentially that could be more destructive if you remove these kids. >> right. out to the lines. ann in iowa. hi, ann. >> caller: hi, nancy. first of all, prayers for your mom's speedy recovery coming to her from iowa.

>> thank you so much. this is a blouse she gave me for my birthday last week. i'll pass that on to her. what's your question, dear? >> caller: i'm a parent and a grandparent, and i don't condone anything that i've watched about this family. my question, though, is do you think that possibly the mom confessed "a" to potentially avoid prosecution but "b" to possibly think it was the only way to get out of an abusive relationship? >> excellent question. sue moss, peter odom, daniel horowitz. there's nothing that says police cannot trick you into a confession. miranda applies when you are in custody. she was not in custody. she was in her own home. so that's not going to apply here. so do you think she did this to avoid prosecution of her, of herself, peter odom? >> it very well could be, nancy. the authorities are no doubt going to use her confession. they're going to try to get her to cooperate against him.

and if he's as abusive as people are talking about, that might just happen. >> okay, guys. i'm hearing in my ear we are going live now to our story on little haleigh cummings. insiders in the investigation and the search now say the little girl is definitely dead. take a listen. >> ronald, do you feel that misty is the key to this investigation? >> no, i don't. i think they're barking up the wrong tree. >> i don't believe you. i think you do suspect your ex-wife, soon to be ex-wife's story -- >> i seen the back door open, and then i go in her room and she's gone. and that's all i know. >> here's the back screen door, the one that was propped open with the cinder block. okay? now, if you see, when it closes, it slams, it makes a loud noise. but if you leave this door, this slowly closes as well. >> this is such a travesty and such a circus that i'm waiting for the acrobats to come in. it's one ridiculous story on top of another. it's all very ludicrous. and what about haleigh?

>> ron marries a woman that is questionable as to losing his child. and his child is missing, maybe being raped and tortured -- >> if this girl keeps doing what she's doing, it's only a question of time before she's charged with something having to do with this kid's disappearance. she just repeatedly -- >> to art harris, investigative journalist at artharris.com, art, people inside the search now saying they're packing up and leaving town. they've left. they say haleigh is dead. why? >> i talked to tim miller a little while ago. he believes that haleigh is dead. not so much for the evidence that he has but for the lack of it. he is the one who set up the polygraph. nothing she has said has helped investigators at all. so many inconsistencies. and nothing solid has led anybody to believe that she is alive. they can't prove she's alive. they've traced down, tracked down leads, about possible sightings, about one side of the family or the other. >> art, this pronouncement that

haleigh is, in fact, dead is coming from people inside the search and people that have had personal access to misty croslin, the new stepmother. what, if anything, has she revealed that makes them so sure it's over? >> nancy, it's pretty much what she hasn't revealed and what she -- they believe she is hiding. and i've spoken with people in the investigation, and they agree with miller privately. they will not say so publicly. they say they're treating this as if a child is still missing, but they investigate it the same way. >> joining me right now, special guest teresa neves. this is the paternal grandmother who has been front and center since the day haleigh went missing trying to find her, trying to publicize her photo and the tip line, which is 888-277-8477. there is a reward for information. teresa, i know that you disagree with search insiders that say she is dead. give me your side.

>> i absolutely disagree 100%. i believe that god hears prayer. i believe that there have been thousands and thousands of prayers for haleigh. i believe that she's alive. and i do not believe that tim miller is god or has a straight line to god. so until he can produce something else, i don't -- i just refuse to believe that my granddaughter is not alive and with us. >> well, miss neves, if the lord listens to a sinner, i hope he's heard my prayers, because i and so many other people are praying that you are right. we are taking your calls tonight on haleigh cummings. i want to first give you tonight's safety tips. a baby can drown in less than two inches of water. keep your baby safe at bath time. never leave the child alone.

have all your bathing supplies ready at one time. and if you forget something, take the baby with you if you've got to step away. baby bathtubs can help stabilize a wet slippery child so they don't fall. but they should be slip resistant, made of thick plastic and stay firm under the weight of water. stay away from those bath rings and flotation devices and suction seats that don't have restraints. they flip over, and babies can drown, and baby's stuck in the circle. always drain the tub completely when you're through. and know cpr. for more info go to kidshealth.org.

so are you saying that you didn't fail the polygraph like

people and law enforcement are kind of claiming that you did? >> no, i did not. >> okay. so bottom line, you don't know where haleigh is? >> bottom line. >> breaking news in the case of missing 5-year-old florida girl haleigh cummings. the head of a search group involved in trying to find haleigh admits he's convinced that haleigh is dead. >> do not lie to me. you've never lied to me before to my knowledge. don't tell me that you didn't know police want to talk to her again. >> founder of texas equusearch tim miller says his group focuses on children who still have a chance to be alive, and that does not include little haleigh cummings. the family disagrees, maintaining their hope that haleigh is still alive, being held against her will. >> i believe haleigh is alive. i have faith in god to take care of my baby girl and find her. and i don't care who had something to do with it. >> meanwhile, croslin's 911 call released. misty croslin called 911 last week after being robbed while allegedly trying to score drugs.

>> oh, my god, my leg and my arm hurt so bad. >> do you need an ambulance? >> yeah, i think so. oh, my god. my purse is ripped. i can't move it. >> you have made an accusation that croslin was on a drug binge. do you have any evidence to support that claim? >> no, i don't. >> then why did you say it? >> it was just a thought. i mean, maybe she was. >> well, my apologies to crystal sheffield, the ex-wife of ronald cummings, because apparently when the new stepmother, misty croslin, calls 911, her two cohorts with her are saying they're out scoring dope when they get armed robbed. that's a good one. let me go to the lawyers. susan moss, what does she say to cops? come help me, the dope dealer robbed me of my dope and money? >> if you lay down with fleas, you know what they say. this is just absolutely ridiculous.

and it really shows what type of person we're dealing with. and the fact that her credibility is absolutely nil. this is just one further step to get her to hopefully, hopefully break because she is the key to tell us where this kid is. >> norm, let's hear that 911 call where she was allegedly scoring dope. >> i need you to stay on the phone with me, okay. >> oh, my god. my leg and my arm hurt so bad. >> do you need an ambulance? >> yeah. i think so. >> oh, my god. my purse is ripped. i can't move it. i can't move it. >> ska, stay on the phone with me, okay? >> okay.

oh, my god. >> do you know what he was wearing? >> all black. i know which way he ran. >> what did his gun look like? >> i don't know. >> you go score some dope right near a crack house, and then you call police crying because mr. dope dealer grabbed your arm during the transaction and you got a bruise. okay. i think that sums it up. let's get back to the issue at hand. to ellie jostad, our chief editorial producer, what can you tell me about reports of insiders with access to croslin who say this child is dead? >> right, nancy. well, that's tim miller. he's the founder of texas equusearch. he is saying that after being with misty croslin during that polygraph that he set up, after that layered voice analysis, he says that she keeps insisting that haleigh is alive, which makes him think that haleigh is actually dead and they're not going to find her. >> to marlaina schiavo, when she

says that on the lie detector, that the child is alive, was that proven to be a lie? >> according to tim and his polygrapher, yes. i mean, they said that it was full of deceit, all of the answers that she was giving. but at the same time, nancy, we have to keep in mind that as much as tim miller doesn't have any evidence that she's still alive, he hasn't really given us much evidence that she is dead. >> absolutely correct. and that is the point made by grandmother teresa neves. i want to go to ron shindell, former nypd deputy inspector. what, if anything, can police do now? they seem to be at a dead end. >> nancy, they have to keep going out doing standard, good old-fashioned detective work. keep shaking the trees, keep interviewing people, keep following leads even if they don't seem important. you have to get out there. someone knows something. and you have to keep searching at this point and keep the pressure on. >> joining me right now, dr. joshua perper, chief medical examiner broward county, author

of "when to call the doctor," renowned in his field. dr. perper, if this child was killed that night, let's say she was not put in a trash dump or anything like that, her body was put out in the elements, which would be the most logical thing to do given the time constraint. could she be identifiable now? would her remains be identifiable? >> considering all the month which pass since her death, most likely now the body show advanced decomposition changes, which should make identification difficult. although some tissue might be still present for dna identification. but the advanced decomposition is also to make -- is also going to make difficult the determination of the cause of death if the injuries are limited to soft-tissue injuries --

>> you mean like a strangulation or a smothering? >> correct. or even a beating even or even a stabbing if the soft tissue has melted away. >> right. >> only they are injuries of the hard tissue, of the bones, then it would be possible to conclude what really happened to the child. everyone, it is national breast cancer awareness month. tonight women's person health resource founded by oncology nurse barbara, whose mother struggled with cancer. women's personal resource helps breast cancer patientings with skin care, scars, exercise, lounge wear, swimsuits, lumpectomy, even recent surgery patients. if this touches your life, go to womanspersonalhealth.com. together, we can win the war on breast cancer.