tonight on "the joy behar show," a former female writer for "late night with david letterman" breaks her silence. on what it was like to work in the late night men's club. it's not pretty. dieting with cookies, does it work? does it not? who cares, they're cookies. three nutrition experts weigh in. and joining me in the studio, hulk hogan. he wrestled more than just people. he struggled with a lot of personal demons, too. and he will tell me all about it. all this and more tonight.

a lot of people go to bed at night watching david letterman. and it turns out a lot of female staffers were going to bed with him during the day. but this news wasn't a secret to everyone. joining me now for an exclusive interview is nell scovell, a former writer for nbc's "late night with david letterman." hi, nell. >> hi, joy. >> how are you, dear? i want to say up front nell worked at the letterman show and never had sex with any of the staffers, right? >> that's correct. >> okay. i just wanted to get that out of the way. tell me what was going on while you were there that made you uncomfortable. you were a writer there for a few months. >> right. well, i was the second woman ever hired. the first was the great meryl marko. she helped create the show and she was my hero before she became my friend. and i wanted to be on that show. i was a journalist. i wrote for "spy" magazine and "vanity fair" in new york. i applied for the show in 1988,

i filled out the classic submission. i didn't hear anything from the show for two years. i got offers in l.a. i worked on the last season of "newhart." i was there when bob woke up with susanne pluchet and i wrote "the simpsons" episode. and then, i finally got the call that dave wanted to meet me. it was my dream job, so i moved back to new york to take this job. and five months later, i walked away from my dream job because it was a hostile work environment. >> what was going on that made you leave? you loved the job. you loved the show. something was going on that made you feel uncomfortable. >> i was not going to flourish. and it was just a situation where i was -- you know, you talked about it on "the view" yourself. and how if you're doing your job and you're working hard and

you're in the middle of a soap opera, then that that's not -- i wasn't going to thrive professionally. i didn't get the memo as a young girl that said you should have low self-esteem and put up with crap. so i quit. >> good for you. although, some people say you should have stayed. >> it's hard. >> some people say you should have stayed because when you quit a job like that, a guy will get the job. >> let me also, historically, it was 1990. it was a year before anita hill. there was not that much awareness of sexual harassment or sexual favoritism. and so i knew it was dysfunctional. i didn't think there was legal recourse or -- and, you know, i did -- i didn't have options. i didn't have a job to go to at the time but i was lucky. it wasn't my first job in television. a few months later i was working

on a top ten sitcom, "coach," which i loved. created we barry kemp and i was on there for over two seasons. >> what was your reaction -- by the way, that anita hill story was the tipping point for all of the sexual harassment suits and everything else. women everywhere now realize that these guys cannot get away with that type of behavior anymore. now, what was your reaction when this all came to light? >> the what? >> the blackmail, the -- >> well, first of all, it was a terrible thing. and no one should be blackmailed. i should say that. i -- i really did move on. and, in fact, i had written a piece supporting dave and the sarah palin joke just a few months previously in "vanity fair." i dug up this great quote from johnny carson making fun of lyndon johnson's daughter. and i thought if johnny can do it, dave can do it.

and so the extortion plot was unfortunate, and certainly dave's exposing himself, so to speak, on the air about the plot. that wasn't news to anyone who worked on the show. but then as more people voiced opinions about what it was like in that environment, and i talked about "the view" in my article and the misconceptions. i felt that burden to bear witness. and it's crazy because it's just the tiniest injustice. but you don't choose your injustices. they choose you. >> let's talk about the time that you spent as a writer in the writer's room. how many women were at the big three shows when you were there? and how about now? >> okay. so forget feelings and opinions. let's talk numbers. between letterman, leno, and "the tonight show," there are about 50 comedy writers, of which exactly zero are women.

>> 50, 5-0. is that what you said? >> yes. there are 14 male writers on letterman right now. why 14 is interesting is historically, in 27 years, there have only be 7 women writers on the show. so today, there are twice as many men as in all 27 years. >> do you think that comedy suffers, that these shows suffered because they don't have women writers? or is it just -- >> oh, absolutely. >> to me, it's like they never put a woman in late night and all of the men are running late night, and the comedy writers, and the stars, and there just isn't a shot. i'm very happy that wanda sykes is getting a late night show. i wish her all the best in the world. believe me, we are all rooting for wanda. >> but she is hilarious. >> it's very hard to break through that. >> yeah, i do think that -- you know, the funniest room -- writer's room that have i been in was when i was at "murphy brown."

it was split exactly half and half. and it was not only the funniest room i've ever been in, it was the crudest probably. and, you know, one of the reasons i wanted to become a comedy writer was i saw a movie albert brooks had called "real life." and albert wrote with a woman, with monica johnson. and, you know, i think the more viewpoints, the more comedy. and if everyone is shooting for the same joke target and no one is off looking in the weeds for the unexpected, then the whole product suffers. >> thank you, nell, for coming on the show. i know that you blew off a few other shows just to be here. i really appreciate that. thanks very much. >> i appreciate what all you had to say on "the view." >> thank you, nell. >> now i would like to bring in jami floyd. an anchor at the legal network in session. jami, i want to read part of

what she wrote. there's a subset of sexual harassment called sexual favoritism that, according to the eeoc, can lead to hostile work environment. that's the part that bugs me. >> yeah. >> is the favoritism. speak to that as a lawyer. >> it's what nell wrote. but it is what i would have written because that's what a lot of people don't understand. sexual harassment is not just about sexual touching or sexual activity. it's about a hostile work environment that makes one group, generally women, feel uncomfortable in the work environment in any way. it can be about posting pictures that may be offensive or it can be about what knell talked about, sexual favoritism. and in an environment where some women are receiving favors because they are having sex with the boss or with other men in the environment who may have power, those who choose not to participate in that behavior are at a disadvantage. >> or not asked. >> let's call the women out, by the way. it's just about the man. it's about the sisterhood. so girlfriends, if you're participating in this, you're not part of the sisterhood. >> it is really like dating a married man.

it's like you really have an obligation to sisterhood not to do that. but let me, before we go, because we're running out of time already. it's impossible for somebody to report david letterman to human resources. nothing is going to happen. he's a multimillion-dollar organization in himself. what is a girl to do? she had to leave. >> it's interesting that you brought up anita hill and the eeoc. and there are these laws. we've all had a greater recognition of what is legal and what is not legal. the law can only go so far. it's just like civil rights legislation. there comes a point where society has to take it a step further. we, as individuals, the morality has to go where to the law hasn't gone. law can only do so much. >> amen, amen. thank you, jami, very much. coming up next, eat cookies to lose weight? that sounds like a really good idea, stick around.

have you heard of the cookie diet? it's a diet where you can eat six cookies a day. can i just mention, to me, that's not a diet. that's a way of life. joining me now to discuss it is dr. sanford siegal. creator of dr. siegel's cookie diet. welcome, dr., how are you? >> hello, highway. >> so tell me, how does the cookie diet work? >> what the dieter is required to do is to eat six cookies a day which helps suppress his or her hunger and then a meal at night. there's only one meal, and that's the evening meal. the cookies control the hunger during the day. the meal gives you real food at night. the total calorie count, 1,000 calories a day.

i can tell you on 1,000 calories a day, you lose weight. everyone loses weight on 1,000 a day. there's no exception. >> that's not enough food for the average person. 1,000 calories a day. what is in the cookies, amphetamines? >> no, there are no drugs in the cookies. the cookies are strictly a food. however, you said that's not enough food for the average person. of course it's not. that's what we want. not enough food. >> yeah, but doctor, i could never sustain 1,000 calories a day. i'm too busy. i'm too active. >> the point is, i have had 500,000 patients over the last 34 years who were able to sustain it. the point is that if you're not hungry, and hunger is the main problem in dieting, if you're not hungry, you can live on 1,000 calories a day. and what's more, you can lose weight with 1,000 calories a day. >> i know. but first of all, i don't know what's in those cookies that is suppressing your appetite. i tried diet pills in college, and all i did was cry. i never lost a pound.

i just cried all day long. so what i'm saying is those kinds of stimulants are not healthy for you. >> joy, there are no stimulants in my product. my product is 100% food. but they are foods that are known to be hunger suppressers. >> like what? tell us what it is? what's the food that's a hunger suppressant? >> the general term is protein. however, there are specific proteins. let me tell you how this came about. in 1975, i was writing a book on the subject of foods that are hunger suppressing. it's well-known that certain foods are and certain foods are stimulative of hunger. i put together a formula based on knowledge that was in the literature at that time that certain mixtures of amino acids are far more hunger suppressing than, say, carbohydrates. i baked them into a cookie. totally food substances, no drugs.

and it was an instant success. >> i just tasted one. it's not that great to taste, i have to be honest with you. is that part of the diet that you don't want to eat more cookies? >> no. there are various reactions to my cookie. some people love them. some people say they're all right. and some people truly don't like them. but the point is, we don't care if they like them. the cookie is not for entertainment. the cookie is -- >> it is like medicine. >> -- a serious medical problem which is overweight. >> yes. >> and i have treated 500,000 patients with this cookie over the last 34 years and i can tell you that they're well tolerated. some people actually like them. i truly don't want them to like them too much because that's what got us into trouble to begin with, liking our food too much. >> okay. thank you very much, dr. siegal,

for coming on the show. i appreciate it. now i want to bring in my panel to talk about the diet. registered dietician and author of "joy's life diet," joy bauer. jorge cruise, best selling author from "the new york times" and the author of the upcoming book "the belly fat cure" and michael roizen, the co-author of "you, the owner's manual." welcome, everybody. first of all, i tasted the cookies. and they tasted like insulation. would you like one? >> i'll smell one. >> i think maybe i'll pass. >> what is in these cookies? doctor, do you know what's in the cookie? can you help us out here? >> i took a look online. there are 2 grams of sugar, 11 carbohydrates. they are a little higher in the carbs and sugar. i didn't ask how much protein there was in there. >> well, that was his point. that it's protein. like atkins, sort of. >> the combination of protein and fiber, he is right. it does keeps you fuller for longer. but you can get the same effect and you can lose weight from having a one serving bowl of whole-grain cereal with skim milk.

you can have a bowl of oatmeal with a nonfat yogurt on the side so you get the same effect from real food as well. but there's nothing dangerous in the cookies. >> no, nothing dangerous. in other words, there's no speed in there. >> here's the unfortunate thing for me because i have this passion that i'm on here and a revelation trying to start next year and it's really work from gary talb. it's his whole idea that what we're doing right now is a conventional world and what conventional doctors and experts are saying that calories is the problem. the reason we're overweight is that we eat too much and don't exercise enough. we hear that all the time. >> i'm so sick of that explanation. >> because it's wrong. it has been going on for over 60 years. and this diet is based on that philosophy that less is more. what i tell people, that doesn't work. because if you do that long term where you starve yourself -- >> you won't keep it off. >> thank you. right? >> also, this dr. siegal says that you need quick weight loss in order to not feel discouraged. dr. rozen, what do you think

about an idea of a quick weight loss plan? is that healthy? >> what you want is a steady weight loss plan that you can stay on for the rest of your life because weight cycling, the quick loss and regain is much worse for your health than slow, steady loss or maintaining a higher weight. in fact, what you want is a slow, steady rate. the second point is it's 1,000 calories. which, if we could stay on, if people can stay on it is a actually a calorie-restriction diet. which would be great if you can stay on it forever but people can't and that's one of the problems. >> the other good news is that when you just start eating better and you reduced your calories from what you normally eat, the first couple of weeks of a sound diet, you will see that euphoric drop on the scale. >> right. but mostly it's water, isn't it? >> it doesn't matter, though. it's so great for the psyche to see those first few weeks, a significant drop because it gives you the staying with it

power. and then you have the slow, consistent weight loss afterwards. >> maybe his idea of this cookie diet, it's easy to bring these things to work. >> but you can't meet your friends at a restaurant for lunch. >> this is the most important thing that anyone listening right now has to hear. because i represent a lot of new forefront thinking. and this is the idea that calories, in the sense of how many calories you eat, really don't matter as much as the kind of calories. the number one driver of weight gain is insulin. it is all hormonal based. it has nothing to do with how many calories you eat because if you eat 500 calories of cheese and meat and proteins and good carbohydrates, whole grain carbohydrates that i love and things like that, the right amounts of sugar, not too much and you will keep your insulin levels low. and what happens in america right now, joy, everyone is doing this. everyone is in a high insulin state. when that happens, we constantly lock in not just fat but what i call belly fat. and it never goes away. for anyone to watching to lose

belly fat, you have to keep insulin levels low and it has nothing to do with eating less. >> okay, or get liposuction. more with my panel next. stay away from that fridge, all of you out there. te buds

were drawn to it. but today's world, i mean, sugar, unfortunately, is everywhere. one coca-cola. >> and tastes so good. >> it's addictive. >> it is a drug. >> you want more and more. that's what we tend to forget. >> a lot of people think it's avoiding the sodas. i've been working with president clinton with the obesity initiative for children because he's trying to get sodas out of schools. >> i'm all for that. >> and that's a big, big thing but people are drinking too much sugar. and orange juice has more sugar by content than coca-cola and milk does, too. >> it's all of the liquid calories. and they don't satiate you like the solids. >> you need pulp. >> if you just ate an orange, that is fine. most people, a glass of orange juice is made up of six or seven

oranges and there's more sugar in that than a spoke which spikes the insulin. >> we talked about cheese before. the latest thing that i hear constantly is i don't need dairy. this is from skinny girls all over new york city. i don't eat dairy. i wouldn't look at yogurt. i don't like cottage cheese or cheeses. what do you say to that? >> the trick is really looking at what you are eating. and it's protein. is it protein, fat, or carbs? in my opinion. and cheese has protein. has no sugar. most cheeses, 99.9% of cheese doesn't have sugar. if it doesn't have sugar, it doesn't spike insulin. you don't have this chronic state of insulin in your body. >> however, full-fat cheese, although it doesn't have sugar, it does have artery-clogging fat. it won't raise your insulin levels, but it will promote inflammation throughout your body. so this is where i argue with you here. >> all right. all right. >> i'm all about the dairy. i want to promote low fat and nonfat dairy. then you get all of the good. the calcium. >> but it tastes like rubber. >> i disagree. and i disagree strongly on that.

>> let's hear what the dr. roizen thinks. >> food is not "let's make a deal." yes, we get addicted to sugar but we also get addicted to saturated fat and salt. >> yes. >> and cheese has a lot of salt and saturated fat. not only are those addictive, but they turn on genes that cause inflammation. the cholesterol effect of saturated fat is a little bit. the gene effect is a huge amount. so it isn't protein. it's got to be protein without saturated fat. if you're not going to die like you're a cigarette addict, that is thin. so cigarettes are great appetite suppressant but we die early because they turn on bad genes. >> wait a minute. we are taking a break. i really do think that the french women who say french women don't get fat is because they smoke. stay right there. more fact or fiction on diet plans when we come back.