welcome back to "prime news" on hln. phillip garrido, the man accused of kidnapping jaycee dugard when she was 11, keeping her cab tiff in his backyard, compound for two decades. allegedly fathering two children with her. remember this claim? when he was arrested? from his jail house interview. listen to this. >> heart warming story, give me a break. now he's making more wild statements in a letter he sent from prison to a tv station.

we'll unveil that for you in just a little bit. we're unveiling this. desperate times for families trying to make ends meet lead to this? a mom turning into an accused bank robber? there's some photos we've been showing you. she's a mother of five. there she is, donning the hoodie and brandishing the gun, pointing it at the tellers there. not much of a disguise. no mask there. she is a mom, she's married, a couple of step kids in the mix. even drives the red minivan. some neighbors say this family has really had their share of money troubles. let's listen. >> we were pretty stunned when we saw the police outside. it's very unfortunate, very sad. you've got to be desperate to rob a bank. >> well put. on that front. we'll take your calls, your thoughts, 1-877-tell-hln is the number. joining us, we welcome back stacy kaiser, our psychotherapist. antonio castelan, reporter xetv in san diego who has been covering this.

let's get more of the details out there, antonio. when did this bank robbing spree allegedly begin? >> supposedly it started on september 29th in poway. fbi agents are investigating that, and they believe that roxanne pennock may have robbed that bank. then on october 13th, a u.s. bank in the poway area was robbed. and then there were two other makes in the temecula area that were robbed recently, just a couple of weeks ago. >> so four banks in all. was she violent? did anybody get hurt in all this? how did those robberies go down? >> well, police say that she wasn't violent at all. she would go in, sometimes with a gun, and she would put a demand note and give it to the teller and just leave with some cash, didn't harm anybody. >> all right. do we know any -- let me ask you this first off. she's married. there's a husband in the picture. what's he saying? did he know anything? >> we went to his house yesterday. he opened the door, we shook his hand and he just closed it.

he didn't have anything to say. he hasn't said anything about the allegations against his wife. >> wow. i'm sure he's speechless at this point. do we know anything about the family situation that would lead to this? we're led to believe they had some financial troubles? anything more on that, antonio? >> a lot of her friends say she was going through some financial troubles. records show she did file for bankruptcy at one time. all we know is that she's a costco cashier. and she's just a soccer mom. she loves her children very much. hard working woman. just going through some tough financial times. >> let's bring in our psychotherapist, stacy kaiser. there are a lot of folks dealing with tough financial times right now. what would drive a mother of five to do this? >> it's definitely way more than just being involved in tough financial times, or we'd see mothers robbing banks every day. what is going on here is a combination of things. first of all, i do think that she's probably reached a point of desperation. but there also has to be an inability to think about long-term consequences. this is a mother, if her kids

were a priority, she would be thinking about that before walking into a bank with a gun. and then the last piece of this is, this is a woman who really ultimately was not thinking about anything but herself and the money. >> how does that happen? you've laid it out there. stay on that for just a mist. five kids. when does reason and realizing that there's a consequence to follow, just leave your mind and you go and do something like this? >> i think ultimately you have to have sort of that chip missing, that moral obligation, that sense of responsibility is missing in this woman or she would not have been capable of doing this. >> let's read a facebook comment. some people might think it's what they need to do at the time they're doing it, but they don't seem to think of the example they're setting for their own children. look at what she's teaching them to do, to lie, cheat and steal and that's the biggest tragedy of all. that leads to a question, stacy, how do you handle these kids at this point? how does this husband, or i guess they're going to need some

professional help, that mom is accused of being a bank robber? >> the fact that she walked in there with a gun and those kids are going to know that, is going to create more trouble for those children. and so what you want to do is surround them with really good rational family and friends, and then get them some kind of counseling. because their mother's likely going to go to jail for a while. >> let's bring in eric richman, our attorney. eric, how does the -- will the criminal justice system have any sympathy on a mother of five, and in how this all went down and how this came about? >> i think that there is a tremendous sympathy appeal. if you listen to the story for the first time, your reaction, and you are a hypothetical juror, your reaction is going to be really more sadness than anger. so if you think about that hypothetical jury, and that hypothetical juror, i think that's got to be taken into account by any prosecutor before going forward with these charges. and as her defense lawyer, i would try and really emphasize that sympathy that she's going

to get from any juror. >> let's bring back in antonio castelan reporting on this. you're there, antonio. what are people saying? are they outraged this could happen? and the effects on the kids? or is it sadness like eric suggested? >> a lot of the neighbors were shocked and sad. they can't believe that she could do something like this. there were some neighbors that say they can understand why she may have done it, because she loved her -- she loves her kids very much. and times are really tough. so there's a lot of sadness. and disbelief about these allegations. >> okay. you mentioned them. let's listen to, again, neighbors talking about this. antonio, you nailed it, they're shocked. let's listen. well, we'll get that in just a second. oh, there it is. >> very sad. you've got to be desperate to rob a bank. >> there you have it. desperation, stacy, again,

you're believing it's a lot more than that. as we cut through this. do you think we're going to see more of this, stacy? hopefully not. >> i hope not. but i have to tell you, this woman robbed four banks. it wasn't some distraught that one woman walked into a bank and robbed that bank. had she not been caught, i don't know how many banks she would have robbed. >> we'll take your calls, your thoughts on this. mother of five turning into an alleged bank robber. we're taking your calls at 1-877-tell-hln. we're also looking through her history. does she have a criminal past?

she's got a little girl missing her mom. it's going to be really sad if she's not around for the next 10, 15 years. >> financial crisises, you know. that's all i can say. pushing people to the edge, you know. to the most extreme. >> extreme indeed. we're talking about, those are neighbors, shocked, as a mother of five turns into an accused bank robber. those are the photos there. not even wearing a mask, a hoodie and a gun. and then the getaway vehicle, the family minivan. wow. we're taking your calls, 1-877-tell-hln is the phone number. we have our experts standing by. we're going to go back to stacy kaiser, our psychotherapist. stacy, i think you were bringing up a good point there, not just

one, because in a sense of desperation, oh, not that i'm absolving this, but we're trying to get into her mind here, that she would rob one bank. what happens where it all of a sudden becomes two, three, four bank robberies here. >> i do think there's a bit of a rush that comes out of it. but i think she had some success. she was thinking she got away with it. not only did she rob these banks, but she went in with just a hoodie and no face mask. that's cavalier to think you can walk in and take money and not get recognized. >> let's go back to antonio castelan, reporter xetv covering this. what more do we know about this lady? is there any kind of criminal past? any behavior that might say, oh, it might lead to this. >> we checked her out and she shows no criminal record whatsoever. many of her friends say she's been a good woman. she's never been in trouble at all. >> there you go. i want to read a facebook comment. there are options, smaller

house, no cable, one car, people don't want to give that up. and then they want to blame the economy for robbing a bank. it's really no excuse in this case. and to a point, yeah, there's no excuse for going to this level. but tell us about what's going on in this area, antonio. because let's face it, there's a lot of folks that they can't just downsize the house, and make a few moves and everything's financially okay again, right? this area's been pretty hard hit with the foreclosures and the economy, right? >> yes. there have been some tough times here in san diego, especially in the poway area. banks are closing up on houses. you know, the neighbors there say that pennock was going through these financial troubles. >> let's go back to our attorney, eric richman. by the way, we're not suggesting that we're trying to give her any kind of excuse. robbing a bank is a serious offense. we're talking about, what is the justice system going to do with

this? what factors are we looking at? kids in the picture. >> that's certainly a primary factor for myself. also, what you were saying before, the difference between an excuse, really, and an explanation. we're trying to explain her behavior at this point. the other factors would be, you know, it really goes against her, here she's using an armed robbery, using a gun. i think one of your guests before said this isn't a violent act. that's very violent to bring a gun in and threaten people with it. it's highly reckless. i think it's going to be hard to get sympathy. but going back to one of your comments earlier, that desperation, it's easy to objectively say she shouldn't have been desperate. but the truth of the matter is, subjectively, when people feel desperate, they might act completely irrationally. and that will go further to explain what she's done. i think the fact that she didn't wear any kind of mask cuts to the fact that she was really

desperate and had the myopic view of these acts, that they would have no re purr cushions. i think the evidence that we've seen so far, she would probably, you know, plead guilty. >> stacy, do you agree with that? >> i agree with a little bit of it. i do think that these are desperate times and we'll see people do desperate things. the piece that gets stuck for me is she did four of these. >> stacy, antonio, eric, we appreciate it. what would you say if your son or daughter said i'm going to get a degree in hip-hop. you would probably wonder what they would do with that. a minnesota school has some answers. but first this. an interesting new study by the american institute for cancer research. it highlights the impact of obesity and cancer of the and dr. sanjay gupta, chief medical correspondent for our sister network cnn, explains that. >> reporter: i can tell you we've known for some time that there is an association between cancer and obesity, or excess body weight.

what we haven't been known is to sort of pinpoint exactly how much of an impact is there. that's been the focus of research for some time now by the american institute for cancer research, trying to find the link, trying to sort of quantify the link as well. let's get right down to it. they think every year there's over 100,000 cases of cancer that are directly linked to obesity and being overweight. let me be more clear on that. when you reduce all the other potential factors, like smoking, like age, like gender, it seems it comes down to simply carrying too much body weight that increases your likelihood of cancer. >> dr. gupta also adds, researchers only studied seven cancers, so it's possible other cancers have this same association.

if someone told you they were getting a degree in hip-hop, what would you think? is it a legitimate degree? in st. paul, minnesota, they think so, and is offering the first college-level diploma program. >> we can study its impact on society, on people's lives. where does this music come from? when it's angry, what are people trying to say? >> joining me now, dr. james peterson, professor at bucknell university, and the self-proclaimed hip-hop scholar. who better to talk about this. all right, dr. peterson, is this a legitimate diploma? >> of course it's legitimate. i took a look at it online to see what courses they're offering. there's a couple different tracts. it's absolutely legitimate. and it's legitimate in a couple of different ways. on the one hand, there are courses of study that you can take in terms of learning the production of the music and the creation of the music which is just like creating or producing any other form of music.

but they also have courses that investigate the industry, the business side of it. the kind of courses i teach are the poetic aspects. there is a wide range of approaches to this kind of curriculum. >> i know you also researched making this happen at other schools. what were your concerns when you even started to broach the idea about hip-hop degree, a hip-hop diploma? i know you know people are going to think, what are you talking about? >> sure. the main resistance is related to people's perceptions of hip-hop culture in general. so what people see in the mainstre mainstream, they see a lot of violence and they see a lot of massaging and consumerism on mtv and b.e.t. and sometimes they equate that with hip-hop culture, when in reality that's just the tip of the iceberg. there's a tremendous amount of intellectual energy and potential. we have to deal with the public perception of mainstream hip-hop, kind of taking it out of contention for academic consideration. >> what kind of student would be interested in this? >> all students are interested in this.

when i teach a hip-hop course at bucknell university, and i've taught them at other universities, these are the first classes to fill up. they're the most diverse classes. and students are absolutely engaged. that's purely on the academic level. what's going on in minnesota's a little different, which is they're actually allowing artists and kids who are interested in becoming artists within hip-hop culture to perfect their craft. so there's multiple ways of getting hip-hop culture into the curriculum. i'm very happy to see programs like this happen around the country. >> so what can someone do with this diploma, this degree, once they have it? what do you do with it? >> can i also say that people often ask what do you do with an english degree or -- >> fair enough. >> but what you can do with this minnesota program is you can create music, and i know that's sort of a pipe dream to be an artist but there are young people out there who are committed to that as a dream. so the program allows them to learn how to use different aspects of technology, how to actually make songs, how to

produce songs, you know. the production within hip-hop culture has been democratized. you can make a hip-hop song with computer software but you still need to learn the craft, so when you come out of this program, you will be able to do some of those things. i applaud it. i think it's a great idea. >> thank you for your insight on this. you are the hip-hop scholar. who else were we going to call. thank you. for more, check out the december issue of "essence" magazine or log on to cnn.com/whatmatters. coming up, there he is, phillip garrido, the man accused of kidnapping and raping jaycee dugard and holding her captive for 18 years. we heard him right after he was put in jail and arrested, giving an account, a rambling of how this will end up being some heart-warming story. now we have more. this man writing a letter to a tv station. his ramblings coming up. we'll take your calls. 1-877-tell ln.

tonight, toxic secrets and celebrity addiction. a special presentation of "issues." we're shining the spotlight on our addict nation. hooked on drugs, alcohol, power, and even -- first we go inside the horrifying lives of michael jackson and anna nicole smith. did their use of prescription drugs cause them their lives? one was rule an accidental death and the other a homicide but they were both found with a deadly cocktail of prescription drugs in their system. was there anything anyone could have done to prevent these deaths? or were these superstars determined to do it their way? addicted to fame.

nadya suleman and jon gosselin can't seem to get enough attention. every time we see them, it seems they're angling for a new reality show or airing their dirty laundry. are these people victims of the paparazzi or addicted to publicity? a special presentation of "issues" starts now. tonight, an avalanche of jaw-dropping celebrity addiction scandals. 2009, shocking and tragic details unravelled before our eyes. we witnessed the downfall and even the death of the rich, famous and infamous. no story more shocking than michael jackson's sudden death at age 50, and none more scandalous. michael jackson was an addict and guess what? he told us so more than 17 years ago. >> i remain out of the country undergoing treatment for a dependency on pain medication. this medication was initially prescribed to cede the excruciating pain i was suffering after recent reconstructive surgery on my

scalp. >> among the most unforgettable images, home video of the ambulance call to michael jackson's rented mansion on july 25th, 2009. just the day before, jackson appeared fine. in fact, he was rehearsing for his final comeback tour. but was he healthy enough to handle the physically grueling workouts or was he too emaciated and frail? and what role did addiction play? we may never get all the answers. we do know that the coroner ruled his death a homicide. the cause, acute propofol intoxication. a deadly dose of a powerful surgical knockout drug, plus a cocktail of other sedatives were found in his system. but ultimately, who is to blame for bringing on jackson's untimely death? law enforcement claims michael's personal physician, dr. conrad murray, admitted he gave jackson that toxic cocktail but what about jackson's handlers, his family and friends and the array of other doctors who cared for

him? did they enable a decades-long addiction to painkillers and sedatives? we will try to get to the bottom of the king of pop's downward spiral in our first big issue of the hour, celebrity addict enablers. meantime, m.j. is not the only fallen star on tonight's addiction special. anna nicole smith died of quote, acute combined drug intoxication. her companion/lawyer and two doctors charged with conspiring to furnish anna a known addict with prescriptions. and then, there is david hasselhoff from the red carpet to the floor of his las vegas home. in 2007, he was videotaped in an apparent drunken stupor by his own teenaged daughter. it seemed the whole world watched as the hoff battled the bottle. but addictions come in many forms. alcohol, drugs, fame, sex. over the next hour, we will investigate the most jaw-dropping celebrity addiction scandals of 2009. straight out to my fabulous and i mean fabulous expert panel. mark eiglarsh, criminal defense

attorney and former prosecutor. firpo carr, former jackson family spokesperson and jackson family friend. ken sealy, interventionist and author of "face it and fix it." amy palmer, senior editor of "in touch weekly" and dr. dale archer, clinical psychiatrist. dr. archer, was michael jackson ultimately cornered by an untimely combination of let's see, addiction, insomnia and pressures to perform, to sing and dance like a young pop star at the age of 50? >> i think you can put all those into the equation, jane. but i really think for him, the addiction was absolutely primary. in the video clip you showed, he hit the nail on the head. he was a narcotic painkiller addict. these are the most addictive drugs on the planet and his story is so typical. he started out needing the mad but then he needed the high more than he needed the pain relief. that started a downward spiral which ultimately led to his

death. >> our first big issue, celebrity addict enablers. michael jackson reportedly had an abundance of them. but these people were not apparently among them. listen. >> i screamed at him and i use the words michael, if you continue this, you will die. >> he said can you find me a doctor. i don't care how much money they want, i don't care what it is they want, i want this drug. >> i said michael, this is something serious. you don't want to take this. you just don't want to take this. >> i said what the heck do you want a narcotic prescription for. then suddenly dawned on me that he was already taking these and that he had probably a number of doctors who were giving him these prescriptions. >> michael, of course, had the financial means to get what he wanted. cnn's dr. sanjay gupta reported that during a european tour, michael traveled with his own mini clinic, complete with an i.v. drip and two physicians, one of whom was an

anesthesiologist. amy palmer, when celebrities addicts are determined to get drugs, do they have the money, the power, the clout to get them, no matter what? is it almost impossible to say no to a celebrity addict? >> you better believe it. michael jackson was a money-making machine. let me tell you something. the people around him, the people who enabled him to have this addiction and to allow it to continue knew that. michael jackson paid their salaries so what are they going to say to him, no, i can't do it? they would have been gone and michael jackson would have found someone else to get him those drugs. >> absolutely. i got to tell you something. i went to see michael jackson, the movie, "this is it" and i was totally blown away. after hearing all the talk of michael jackson weak and feeble, addicted in a wheelchair, i literally almost fell off my chair. he demonstrated extraordinary coordination, amazing singing and dancing skills, unbelievable

endurance. firpo carr, you're the family friend. how is it possible that this incredible performance could have been given by a man so weak and on drugs? this just doesn't jive with the concept of an out-of-it addict. you and i were both at the jackson trial together. we saw jackson many times looking like he was in a fog, let's face it. so how can you explain these two totally opposite michael jacksons? >> well, if you ask joe jackson, he had a body double in the movie. if you ask him. >> no way. >> i'm not saying that that is the case, but if you ask joe jackson, that's what he would say. now, here's what i would say about that. first of all, i think we should speak to michael's character. he became dependent on drugs because of pain. he did not use it recreationally prior to that. in fact, he didn't take drugs at all. so to put him in the class of an addict, someone who uses it recreationally, and who uses it just to get high for the feeling i think would be unfair because that would speak to his character. his character is such that he is

a man who depends on his spirituality, he was a vegetarian for the most part, he was a healthy person. now, was he strong enough to do all of those shows? absolutely not. not 50. if you saw that show, if you saw that, i did not see it, i'm boycotting it, i'm not saying anyone else should -- >> you should see it because i saw it and i got to tell you, i don't know who else saw it, amy palmer, did you see it? >> yes, i did. i saw it. >> there's no way there was a body double. no way. >> you think he could do 50 of those? >> i watched it with my eye to see if it was a body double because his dad had already made that claim, and you're seeing his face and you're seeing him dancing with his face, with the dancer in the background. he's doing moves that would be hard for a 50-year-old to do, amy palmer. >> yeah. michael jackson in this movie is at the top of his game. it really shows why he is a superstar, why he is the king of pop. and that's why it's so alarming that michael jackson needed drugs to get through that

rehearsal or those shows. >> jane, it's not alarming that he needed drugs and his character had nothing to do with it. this is how individuals get hooked on these drugs. they do have real pain. but they end up with a real addiction because the high and the euphoria is something they crave more than the pain relief. >> jane, let me jump in here, jane. >> hold on, hold on. >> let me jump in here. >> jump in. >> let me say this. first of all, a lot of the addicts start off innocently enough using opiates. one of the problems with using opiates i found from my clients and personal stories i've seen, the opiates then create pain in the body. it's such an evil drug that then they need the opiates for pain. the opiates are actually causing a lot of that pain and it doesn't mean that they're lying down in the gutter. what's great about your show is you're letting the world know that there are functioning addicts out there. they can walk around, they can talk, they can dance, but they're still addicts which means they're powerless to control their addiction. they need help. >> let me rewind to 1984.

that was the pivotal day in michael jackson's life when there was this horrific accident during a commercial shoot for pepsi. just a caution, this video from "us weekly" is graphic. now, without a doubt, the pain must have been unimaginable. with 20/20 hindsight, it's believed that this first triggered his addiction. take a look at this. watch very closely. there he is dancing, poof, the explosion and then you see his hair is on fire, literally, and he keeps dancing. that's what's so amazing about it. but can't this be a teachable moment, ken sealy? i mean, what are the first signs that somebody's getting hooked on pain meds after the legitimate need to use them for medical reasons has come and gone? >> this is what i see all the time, jane, is what happens is trauma happens like this, and then all of a sudden, they stop getting their medication because it's not necessary, so they start doctor shopping, they start looking and all the addict behaviors is happening, and i think with some of your other

guests, that they're hearing that there's a judgment on addiction. there's no judgment. addiction is not prejudiced. it hits all walks of life. what we need to get through to people is that you have to take action as you have shown at the beginning of your show, people have seen all these red flags throughout his life but we don't take action. you have to get a professional involved. you have to take the action to help save their lives, because you don't have that day, you don't have the privilege of the day of when they're going to die. he looked great. >> family and friends have done that. family and friends have tried to help him, sir, to make that presupposition that they did not i think is reckless. the family tried to help him, as i mentioned many times. >> the question is to what extent? >> randy even went down to mexico. i beg your pardon? >> the question is to what extent. when you're dealing with life or death -- >> one at a time. >> let me answer that question. >> when you're dealing with life or death and intervention is

necessary. granted, the person won't get help unless they want it. but those are still back and kind of held back, they now have to deal with it. >> firpo, isn't it true that they tried to do interventions and he locked them out? >> absolutely. they have tried numerous times. they have had numerous family meetings trying to help him, and if he said no, i don't want your help, please believe me, as an adult, they cannot just bum rush him and said you will get it anyway whether you like it or not. so to judge -- >> i want to move on. >> i disagree with that. >> i want to move on -- okay. let me move on. because we want to cover another major case and that is the case of anna nicole smith. two years after she died, anna nicole smith's tragic downward spiral played out in the legal system. here she is in a very disturbing video shot just six months before she died. listen to this. >> other part? >> yep. >> i'm good.

i'm not. >> because of your baby? >> my baby's over there sleeping. >> your baby down there. >> your baby down here. >> that one. >> i think i just had a little gas. >> say it again. >> i think i'm having some gas trouble. >> six months later, she was dead. the medical examiner said her death was due to quote, combined drug intoxication. in addition to a lethal dose of the powerful sleep drug chloryl hydrate, there were at least eight other drugs in her system, muscle relaxants, anti-anxiety meds, none of them illegal. prescription drug abuse is a massive problem in this country, is it not, ken sealy? >> absolutely. it's one of the leading addictions in this country right now, prescription meds. so many people are dying from it and here, once again, we have seen the red flags. not only did the family and

friends, but all of us seen the red flags six months in that video, i'm so glad you showed that, and yet nobody took action on helping her. and i'm not saying that the family didn't try. i'm saying that you have to continue to try and don't stop trying, period, until you get through. >> how do you know -- >> there is a way to get through. >> how do you know that didn't happen? >> when an addict doesn't want to get sober, i have seen it myself, no matter what you do, interventions and everything, if they do not want to get sober, it is impossible to take them there. >> thank you. >> that's correct, jane, but -- >> disagree. >> then the family and friends' behave needs to change and the addict needs to know we will no longer enable you and the difference between enabling and helping is enabling is you're doing something for someone that they could and should be doing on their own. helping is they can't do it. >> that's a presupposition that they're enabling them. how can you say that? here's what i say about character. >> look at howard stern.

look at howard stern. >> whoa, whoa. let's leave howard stern out of it. >> let me finish. >> howard k. stern. >> as far as the character of the person is concerned and the motivation, just think of this real quick illustration. that is, you hear that a young teenager gang banger, his pants down below his you know what, and guess what, he pushes an old lady down the middle of the street. >> got to leave that right there. we could talk about this all night and we are. coming up, we're shining the spotlight on fame addiction every time you turn on the tv. there they are, jon gosselin and the octomom. are these two addicted to fame? but first, you know, this guy just by looking at him, wait until you hear what radio talk show host and former child star, danny bonaduce has to say about using and abusing booze, next.

former bay watch hunk david hasselhoff took a hard fall from grace in 2007 when video tail of him in an apparent drunken stuper went public. >> that video shot by his

teenaged daughter reportedly in an effort to help her dad sober up for good. hasselhoff has been in and out of rehab for years. sadly, he recently compared himself to amy winehouse. my next guest knows all too well the roller coaster ride of addiction to alcohol and rehab. danny bonaduce. thanks for joining us. you grew up as a child star on the partridge family, currently a talk show host on 94.1, wysp in philadelphia. danny, david hasselhoff has acknowledged this long-running battle with booze. do you relate and what's going on with you in that department right now? >> well, i relate in the sense that of course, i've battled getting on and off the wagon. it's just that i am 5'6" and when i fall off the wagon, nobody really notices. when david hasselhoff is 6'8" tall, it takes him 45 minutes to actually fall off a wagon. it makes a thunderous bang and we all turn and look what happened. so he's just a more interesting character. but watching david hasselhoff continually fall off the wagon

has stopped being appealing to me and just become embarrassing. >> obviously, when you get sober, you would think your aim is to stay sober, and then when you no longer are sober, you have slipped. but i was sort of shocked to hear recently that you say you have begun drinking again because you were talking about your sobriety at one point. what went on there? >> at one point, i was sober. at this current point, i am sober. through no fault of my own, by the way. i was just running late. the fact of the matter is, and i think you will know this quote very well, there's two schools of thought in psychology and psychiatry. there is einstein, there's freud and then there's jeug. jung said the definition of insanity is continuing the same behavior over and over and expecting a different yut come. if every time i fell off the wagon, i would take that literally, i would fall off the wagon once and hurt my head and fall off the wagon again and it would hurt and fall off the

wagon again, i decided why would i ever get on the wagon again. some people can ride it, some people cannot. >> that's very dangerous, though, danny, because it's a fatal disease. >> i don't necessarily adhere to that school of thought. >> a progressive disease. >> i don't necessarily agree with you, jane. i know that you believe that you suffer from a deadly disease. but at the height of my fame and popularity, you called me an ex-child star, i used to in exchange for my incredible lack of talent, i would do tours of children's hospitals and when you have seen as many 8 year olds dying of cancer as i have, that -- >> i don't know if that relates to what we're talking about. >> we're talking about a deadly disease. you want to tell the 8-year-old with no hair you have the same problems they do? >> you know, danny, we will come back to you. this is interesting stuff. hang in there. we are switching gears from drug addiction to fame addiction. nadya suleman and jon gosselin cannot stay away from the cameras. so are they just desperate for attention? or are they actually addicted to fame?

welcome back to our special on celebrity scandal and addiction. has infamous father of eight jon gosselin been on a fame binge? the last several months, he's paraded around with his young girlfriend as his nasty divorce from kate plays out in the tabloids. some feel he is addicted to celebrity and the attention it brings, even when it's negative attention. exhibit a, he was more than willing to go on tv and get a well-deserved smackdown from hln's own nancy grace. here they are, facing off on "the insider." >> you talk the talk, but you don't walk the walk. with one 22-year-old after the

next, while she's at home with the children, and say you want to work it out. >> i was passive. i was an avoider. >> why is it always about you? why are we talking about you? she asked you about your children. >> because she's an important part of the children. >> can he speak without you piping in? >> way to go, nancy. oh, boy. the days of jon and kate plus 8 are over and so is their marriage. so what will jon do once the cameras are gone? will he do everything he can to stay in the spotlight? i want to welcome back my fantastic panel. let's start with amy palmer. senior editor, "in touch weekly." you deal with so many celebrities, is fame a real addiction, do you think? >> yeah, i actually think it is a real addiction and jon gosselin is the perfect example. the guy cannot make a move without calling the press to come there with cameras. it's unbelievable. i mean, he says that he wants to redeem himself and become a better person and father, yet he has to do that in the public eye. he invited cameras to a

conference with rabbi schmuley on the upper west side of manhattan and says i want to be better, i didn't ask for this. absolute insanity. >> jon actually was recently busted trying to get what you might call a hit of attention. here he is with paparazzi reading them his e-mails from hiss estranged wife. got to listen to this. >> i just got an e-mail from kate saying she doesn't want to see you. >> she doesn't want to see you? may we see it? >> hold on one second. she wants to change custody. i would appreciate if you would pick them up at the bus stop tomorrow at 4:00 and stay until 6:00. that's ridiculous. i'm going to stay longer than that. i don't care. >> it was supposed to be a joint day because it's a birthday? >> yeah. >> that was for -- >> all holidays, birthdays, whatever, yes. >> how do you end up dealing with this when -- >> doesn't matter.

it's joint share. i can stay as long as i want, and i will. >> dr. dale archer, can fame addiction be as dangerous, even deadly, as drug addiction? >> absolutely. we know now that all addictions are really linked, jane, through a brain chemical called dopamine. doesn't matter if it's drugs, alcohol, video games, shopping, sex or fame. fame also comprises money and power and you lump it all together and you have a classic case in jon gosselin of a narcissistic personality disorder. every bit as deadly as, say, a bernie madoff. >> and you know, the thing is that when you take away the fame, if you don't have a valid identity, independent of the fame, underneath that, that's when you are really in trouble because you say who am i, why am i here. coming up, when the mother of six gave birth to octuplets, she gained international attention. is octomom nadya suleman bonkers for babies or is she addicted to

them?

toxic secrets and celebrity addiction. a special presentation of "issues." we're shining the spotlight on our addict nation, hooked on drugs, alcohol, power, and even babies. we'll investigate mackenzie phillips' shocking claims that she had consensual sex with her famous father for ten years. phillips battled drugs and admitted trying cocaine for the very first time when she was just 11 years old. we'll look at the impact of drugs, alcohol, addiction. welcome back to our special on celebrity scandal and addiction. can you be addicted to having babies? well, look at octomom, nadya

suleman. she appears obsessed with procreating as well as the fame that comes with it. the birth of her octuplets gave her a whopping total of 14 kids. she shows all the hallmarks of addiction. bingeing, going overboard, then that classic addict's remorse. don't believe me? check out this clip from radaronline. >> i still miss it. i screwed up my life, i screwed up my kids' life. i have to put on this strong facade and pretend i don't regret it. i can't regret it now because i love them, they're here. what was i thinking? >> very, very good question. every one of her 14 kids was conceived through fertility treatments so no surprise, they live in a completely chaotic home. listen to the utter calamity captured on fox's octomom special. [ babies crying ]

>> whoa. i'm getting dizzy just like at that. here's my big issue. could somebody be addicted to having babies and if the answer is yes, what can they do about it? what's your take on that? we say addiction can apply to any substance, if you're using it for the wrong reasons. ever heard of addiction to procreating? >> you just showed it, jane. you showed how she was remorseful after doing the act and that's exactly what addicts do. they get remorseful after the fact. and the important part that you're showing here today is that you know, addictions take all kinds of forms. all addictions are similar with the behaviors of the addict. they're self-centered, self-motivated and the key is that they get treatment for them. i know some of the top leading treatment facilities right now, what they're doing when somebody checks into treatment, they're doing an assessment on these

cross-addictions to see if there's anything else that they're addicted to so they can treat that at the time after they treat their alcoholism, their drug addiction, they can treat their fame addiction, their work addiction. >> or their food addiction. that's another big one in this country. >> food addiction. >> with obesity threatening to surpass smoking as the nation's number one preventible killer. it doesn't really matter what substance you're using. it's that you're using a substance for the wrong reasons in order to escape painful feelings in order to stuff painful feelings. is octomom trying to undo some past trauma by having all these babies? she says she always hated being an only child and had a difficult relationship with her mom. they aired some of their dirty laundry on radaronline. check this out. >> i felt sorry for them. >> because they're healthy, i'm thriving? >> no. because there are so many and how are you going to be able to provide for them? think about it, nadya.

14. >> i have to let go of my need to control everything and i have to accept the help that's been offered. >> i hope you'll get help. i really hope so. >> mark eiglarsh, do you think having a ton of babies is the way to cope with a tough childhood? isn't that the kind of problem you work out with a therapist? >> it is so sad. i have three children. i find it difficult to give them the quality time that each one needs. we're not just talking about food. we're not just talking about shelter. we're talking about exchange of ideas, comfort, building self-esteem. i don't know that it's possible for the best parent to do that with 14 kids. forget about her, a procreating bunny of, you know, with whacky intentions. >> now, i got to turn to another celebrity scandal. married tv sports anchor steve phillips, an admitted sex addict, after "the new york post" broke the story of his affair with a 22-year-old production assistant at espn, phillips came clean, he was fired by the network and promptly checked himself into rehab for sex addiction. listen to brooke hundley, the

young production assistant and paramour on abc's "good morning america." >> i was in a situation where i felt like if i didn't do what was asked of me, then everything i had worked for for the past six years, everything i had done to establish myself as a successful media professional, could be gone like that. >> dr. dale archer, isn't this a classic example of how an addiction really takes down other people around you? i mean, this has become a mess, his wife's divorcing him, he's got kids who have been impacted by this. this young woman came under criticism for her actions as a result of this affair. >> yeah. no doubt about it, jane. and we have to look at his history. this is not the first time that he had this type of involvement. i mean, he was actually sued for sexual harassment when he was general manager of the mets. so this has followed him but i

cannot give brooke hundley a pass on this, either, because there were e-mail messages that she had written stating that she was going to get to the top no matter what so i think they both got entangled in his addiction, but i think that there's equal blame to go around in this case. >> ken sealy, what is sex addiction? you know, it's a natural human craving to have intimate relations with somebody else, but when does it cross the line into addictive behavior? >> well, it's just like food addiction. it's a natural craving that we have, but yet you take it and you cross that line. you know, you do things that are going to cause the aftermath that we're seeing in this situation. we see the things with the eating disorders, either the anorexia or bulimia, and the aftermath, the drug addiction, it's all the same thing. it's when the addict crosses that line and they cross the line of addiction, it becomes fatal and people die from this. the aftermath is fatal, period.

i don't care what addiction it is, because if it's gambling, the number one with gambling addiction is suicide, because of the way they feel after the fact. >> well, amy palmer, it's especially complicated with a celebrity, because we know this in hollywood with movie stars, there are people constantly approaching them trying to have sex, which is not a problem that most of us face. >> yes, that's true. when you're in the spotlight, you're going to have more opportunity, which is why it's so important when you become famous, that you have to be centered in your core and know who you are and understand boundaries. it's really the responsibility of the celebrity to say no, i am the person who's responsible for my life and you can't enter it because i know what can happen. and unfortunately, that doesn't happen all the time, especially when celebrities are so narcissistic and they crave attention, which is why they enter the spotlight in the first place.

>> yeah. in other words, you can be in places that make you vulnerable to an addiction if you're a food addict, in a fast food joint, if you're a movie star hanging out with a bunch of young ladies at a club, those are entering dangerous territory, slippery slope. up next, mackenzie phillips' shocking admission that for ten years, she had consensual sex, she says, with her famous father. phillips battled drugs and admitted trying cocaine for the first time when she was just 11 years old. we will look at the effects of all those drugs.

sickening secrets revealed in an explosive tell-all written by former tv star, mackenzie phillips. she says she had sex with her own father, rock legend john phillips. in her memoir, "one day tight" she writes her dad pulled her in a frightening world of drugs and

forbidden sex at 19. she says she woke up from a drug-induced haze to find herself having sex with her dad. mackenzie exposed all her dark secrets to the public on "oprah." >> i woke up that night from a blackout to find myself having sex with my own father. your father is supposed to protect you. your father is supposed to protect you, not [ bleep ] you. >> yow. the book's title, "high on arrival"s based on a song john wrote and dedicated to macken e mackenzie. she's just 14, there isn't much she hasn't seen. she's always too high on arrival. as her drug addiction spiralled out of control, mackenzie says the relationship became consensual. she has been in and out of rehab and jail. did her father's alleged abuse fuel her drug use? joining me tonight, a very special guest. jody sweeten, former star of the hit tv show, "full house" and proud recovering addict, jody,

there are those who are saying ah-ha, now we know why mackenzie felt so compelled to do drugs, to escape the pain of this alleged incest. what's your take on that? do you think addiction feeds off emotional pain and emotional distress? >> you know, i think it does. i think it's a really vicious cycle. i know for myself, you know, you get into this habit of, you know, doing things that don't exactly help your self-esteem, then in trying to stop feeling, you know, you get high and then you get high and you feel bad about getting high, and so you go into this depression and then to try and make yourself not feel anything about it, you continue doing the drugs and it sort of repeats itself and repeats itself until you can really stop any of that behavior and really deal with the underlying feelings and emotions. >> my big issue tonight, drug cred. does a history of drug abuse hurt your credibility? some of mackenzie's show biz family members say you cannot trust an addict, period, end of story.

mackenzie says hey, they're in denial. mackenzie tells oprah it really happened with her dad. listen. >> i know for a fact that i am the only daughter that this happened to. and i don't know why he chose me to visit his demons upon. i don't know that. i wish that he were here, still alive. >> would you have told the story if you were alive? >> that, i don't know about. probably. >> sister chynna says she believes mackenzie but stepmom michelle phillips says you lie. quote, take with a grain of salt anything said by someone who had a needle in their arm for 35 years, end quote. now, remember john phillips is not alive to defend himself. mackenzie says she's sober but her history of drug use, i believe, has damaged her credibility. jody, you admitted you spoke at the university about overcoming drug addiction and that even as you were speaking, you were coming off a cocaine bender and

using the speaking fee you got to pay for your habit. >> yeah. you know, like i said, i did a lot of things that i wish i could take back, you know, that i wish hadn't happened in some of the cycle of my addiction. and you know, i have come out and i don't expect anyone to automatically trust anything that i say. you know, whether or not i have had a history of addiction or not. but you know, i understand people's trepidation with trusting someone who has, you know, a history of addiction or a history of lying, and you know, the only thing that you can really say is you know what, i only have -- i just got 11 months sober. the past 11 months -- >> congratulations. congratulations. that's excellent. >> thank you. thank you. and i worked really hard and i try not to -- i do the right thing for myself now. i do the right thing because i know it's the right thing to do, and not to -- i don't do it so that anyone else will give me

credit or anyone else will think better of me. i do it just because it's the right thing now and i try and just be honest every day. >> i applaud. i want to bring danny bonaduce into this conversation because this is a really startling contrast, perhaps. danny, you had been clean and sober and then you admit that you started drinking again, and you're saying basically you're tired of slipping and so why bother. so how do you contrast your experience with jody's and mine, for that matter, i have been sober 14 1/2 years. >> congratulations to both of you. well, here's how i justify it. i justify it by first of all, being correct at least for me, but i congratulate jody on 11 months sober. >> thank you. >> didn't i meet you in rehab five years ago? >> yeah. >> so what happens is this vicious cycle goes on and on with people, and they completely do things that lower their self-esteem. i got tired of doing things that lowered my self-esteem so i just figured my place in life and stayed there and i'm quite comfortable. >> well, i mean, do you get

drunk? >> yes. >> okay. but isn't that a problem? i mean, because with addicts, we can't just have a couple of drinks. listen, if i could have a couple of drinks, i would have a couple of drinks. what happened with me is that when i had the first drink, i would develop a craving that completely overwhelmed my mind, and my mind would align with my addiction and justify any behavior that it took to get that alcohol. so i was not in control. i was a zombie. and i couldn't stop. so then i had to have six drinks and i could potentially knock on wood, thank god i didn't hurt anybody, or myself physically, but i was a ticking time bomb, you know, a loaded gun, whatever cliche you want to use, jody. >> that was a perfect example, though. at three drinks, i'm tall. at four drinks, i can dance. at five drinks, i'm zach efron. >> you are not zach efron, dude. >> when i wake up in the

morning, i'm a 50-year-old man with red hair and flesh like a shar-pei. why wouldn't i reach for the zach efron again? >> we will continue this discussion in a moment because we're talking about perhaps the most important subject in america today. stay right there.

i said we need to talk about what happened in florida. we need to talk about, i used the word rape for want of a better word. how you raped me. he said raped you? don't you mean when we made love? >> that was mackenzie phillips. we're talking about addiction with two people that have dealt with addiction. jodie you have written a memoir called "unsweetened." you document your addiction. talk about drinking at young

age, then pot, coke and crystal meth. >> i had my first drink at 14. from the beginning, it was pretty clear i was not able to drink like a normal person. a craving, once i had one, 1,000 wasn't enough. you know, i continued drinking throughout high school. drinking before school, drinking at school. still managed to get good grades, went to college. i had a period of time in college where i quit drinking and quit using for a little over two years. when i went back to drinking, i got into crystal meth by people i was around. i found that easier to hide than the drinking. i was married to a police officer at the time. >> you went to an opening or premier doing crystal meth after going on the red carpet. >> at that point, it got to an

all day, every day around the clock sort of thing. it wasn't about getting high anymore as much as maintaining the ability to function. i was that deep into my addiction. then, when it came out that i had gone to rehab and stuff, you know, i was outed by different, i believe it was "the globe" or something like that. i admitted having gone to rehab and the crystal meth abuse. i wasn't really willing to get sober at that point. like danny talked about, i was up and down for a long time. i was speaking about having got my life together. i wasn't at a point where my life was together at all. >> ha was the final bottom? why is it that one bottom is the one. danny is grabling with that. so many people grapple with that. >> it took the willingness to

get honest with myself. i have a daughter who is now 19 months old. i started seeing myself become the mom that i was always afraid of. i was adopted at a very early age. i had a biological history in my family of alcoholism. that fear of becoming that sort of parent, i just saw the things starting to happen, again. i wasn't using drugs, but i was drinking again. >> you broke the cycle. >> i hope i have. i don't try to say -- i try to not say for the rest of my life everything is going to be better. i try every day to remind myself, if i can just do it today. >> that's a perfect way to end this special edition. thank you both so much for joining me. if you are grappling with an addiction, check out my book, "i

want." you can check it out.

breaking news tonight in the case of 5-year-old north carolina girl shaniya davis. little shaniya reported missing from the sofa of her own home. major developments tonight. is there a break in the case? she's spotted on surveillance video at a hotel 40 miles away. the citing 6:00 a.m. 40 minutes before she's reported missing. investigators make a new arrest after a tipster sees mommy's

boyfriend driving away with the little girl. charges are dropped with the boyfriend. mario mcneill confesses. there's still no sign of little shaniya tonight. where is she. >> reporter: police in north carolina said a man admitted to kidnapping a 5-year-old girl, but we still do not know where shaniya davis is. >> she vanished from her home. someone is arrested, now that guy is out of jail. an ex-con is behind bars. there he is. >> reporter: we were able to gain information from tips and interviews we conducted overnight. we picked mr. mcneill up at a location that was disclosed to us. he was questioned continuously

overnight. >> november 10, 2009, kidnapping unlawfully, shaniya davis. >> she was spotted with him an hour before she disappeared on tuesday. she was seen with him in a hotel 40 miles from her home. they confirmed their identities. what we know from investigators is they were only at that hotel for about an hour. around 6:11 a.m., just this past tuesday morning. >> police are going to have to see if there's a relationship between them. what happened prior to this. why was this child targeted. >> what exactly are the conflicting stories of the moth ere? none of this makes sense. >> bring her home safe. we miss her and love her very

much. breaking news tonight out of oregon in the disappearance of a young satellite tv sales woman, the mother of two vanishing from the shower. signs in the bathroom of a struggle. the search comes to a tragic end. her body found buried in a grave sight in the last hours. the murder suspect, jayme's own brother-in-law. shocking developments in the search for missing mother of two, jay my awe tin. she was buried in a grave and they arrested her own brother-in-law. >> someone had been in my bathroom. because of what the bathroom looks like, they listed it as

suspicious. >> jayme's mom talks about clues left behind. the throw unfolded on the counter. the most disturbing, a necklace jayme liked in the bathroom. >> they vacuumed up the sopping wet bathroom felt there was no rush. >> someone who knew her mother's habits. patrick was arrested late last night. air, land, sea and tracker dogs cull min nate with bad news. >> breaking news. is there a break in the case of missing 5-year-old north carolina girl shaniya davis. she's spotted on a surveillance video in the arms of a man in a hotel 40 miles away. >> we have made another arrest

in the davis kidnapping case. we have arrested mario andrette mcneill. we have ap hended him and charged him with first degree kidnapping. he admitted he took miss davis. >> cops say a convicted felon admits he took the little girl from home. he's behind bars. >> she was spotted with this man an hour after she disappeared tuesday. shaniya was seen with him in a hotel 40 miles from home. police used surveillance video to confirm their identities. >> he checked in with little shaniya after 6:11 a.m. tuesday. police say a tip led them to the hotel. by the time police arrived they were gone. >> the kidnapping charges have been dropped against the man police arrested wednesday. police are looking for shaniya.

her father just wants his little girl home safe. >> i miss you so much. i'm waiting for you. i'm not going to give up. you don't give up, either, honey. >> astonishing images of this little girl in that man's arms. perhaps a little bit of hope that she is alive. gurnal scott, reporter from wptf radio. what is this man telling cops? >> reporter: right now, nothing. they have him in custody. they have been questioning him as you heard. when they took him in custody, they questioned him all night. he has not given up the location of little shaniya. police are frantically trying to search for the little girl, who looked in the pictures as we all seen them she was in reasonably good health and being taken care of. now, they don't know where she is. she is apparently been handed

off, again. >> that's a very good point. is she handed off? did he indicate he gave her to someone else? do we have knowledge that happened? >> reporter: if that has been told to police, they are not sharing it with us in the media, maybe to protect their investigation. what you know, at this point, we have no idea where the where abouts of this child is, if she has been handed off to someone else involved. that's the big question. >> it's extraordinary to look into the eyes of that child, grainy as it may be and ask yourself what is going through her pretty little head. motive. in order to construct what might be a motive. we believe this man to be the exboyfriend of the mother's sister, do i have that right? >> that's right.

we are getting that from two sources. we spoke to shaniya's half brother today and he said that's the relationship. also, we spoke to clarence coe, the man falsely arrested yesterday. he said that's the ex-boyfriend of the mother's sister, the sister they were living with in the trailer. >> we have the mother, the sister and shaniya. are there any other children in the scenario? >> reports came out, we heard there was a 7-year-old also in the home. then, there was a report that said there was an infant. police will not talk about the children in the home. they have been tight lipped about the details of the investigation, much of which was the people who were in the home. >> crime analyst, director of cold case pine lake pd. we have the trailer, the hotel. what are police going to be focusing on?

>> the direction he was traveling. if he dropped that child off with somebody else, it's past the hotel. he went in the same direction to drop her off. >> it's frightening, gloria alred. he has a criminal history, nothing sex related or child related. what concerns you tonight. >> what concerns me is he had this sweet little girl. there's not an allegation he had her with consent. what did he do with her? is she okay? in whos hands or arms is she now. what is he telling law enforcement, if anything. >> are you concerned about the other child or children who are in that environment? >> i am. it may be this little girl knew him, if he was the exboyfriend

of the mother's sister and maybe, who knows what he told her. i am concerned about the others all though they appear to be safe at this time. >> i want to go to lillian glass, psychologist and body language expert, author of "i know what you are thinking." when you look at the images, i'd like to believe she's not scared out of her mind. tell me what you are thinking when you look at the images. >> she looks like she knows him and is comfortable. there's something that's a give away that doesn't look comfortable. later on, she crosses her legs. her knees are together. is she sexually molested. what's been done with her? >> dr. of emergency medicine, the question we are all hoping and praying there's been no harm. i mean kidnapping, bad enough, putting the fear of god in this child. no physical harm.

what will we look for so we know? >> doctors will have to look for signs of trauma, bruising, general well being. to determine if there's rape crime, they have to do a rape kit. that's an investigation where they collect evidence, secret n secretio secretions, body fluids to seal the case and understand what the extent of the trauma was. >> this man, apparently has confessed to kidnapping. you know, if he wants to make a good deal for himself, he better tell where that child is, correct? >> yeah. that's one thing that could happen. i mean, what's unusual is the time line and that she saw the baby at 5:30, he gets to the hotel at 6:11. i'm concerned with what the mom knows in terms of how it all occurred. how he got in the trailer,

grabbed the child. there's a lot of things to look at here. we're still conducting interviews on following up on leads this morning. >> is she alive? >> i can't speak to if she's alive or not. we hope to find her alive. we have not found shaniya, yet.

investigators say par owe mcneill's time on the run ended here in this courtroom. the little girl was not with him when he was taken into custody, but he admits to taking her. >> november 10 of 200 9 with first degree kidnapping. unlawfully kidnapping shaniya davis, a person under the age of 16. >> reporter: investigators have not been able to find her.

they are interviewing residents at the park. he was initially charged with first degree kidnapping. >> we are dropping the charges, that is correct. >> they got a line after releasing these pictures from a hotel that show mcneill with little shaniya. police say mcneill initially took shaniya. after police contacted his family, he turned himself in. >> i'm pat lalama in for nancy grace. extraordinary news. you saw the pictures that give us some hope. she was alive tuesday and is alive today. gurnal scott, we need to talk about the tile line. there are questions being brought up. mom says she put the child on the sofa at 5:30 a.m. take it from there. >> reporter: that is the case.

it's also said that the last time she saw her was at 5:30, then she made the call to police at close to 7:00 in the morning. you have to add into that, the neighbor who said around 3:00 in the morning, she heard a ruckus around her trailer. between that and the last time they saw the child. there's a little bit of time in there police are trying to hammer down and find out exactly if all the -- if there is a lot of truth in what's being said. >> defense attorney, doug burns, if the child is put down at 5:30 and the surveillance tape says 6:11, it doesn't give much time. >> i agree with bradley, actually. the time chronology is a little odd. i also find it odd, working off your point, that a confession

would go hand in hand with information about the where abouts of the child. for the report to say he's confessed to kidnapping, confessed to taking her, but we don't know where the girl is, is puzzling. >> any clue of a motive? we have two sisters living together. one boyfriend no longer a suspect. was charged, but no longer a suspect. now, another confesses. it seems everybody is interconnected. >> as far as a motive, somebody has to admit to what's going on here. he confessed he kidnapped her. we have this video. at the same time, we don't have information from the mother. we have no information because the father doesn't know anything. we certainly aren't hearing about the other adults in the home. no one is giving up the

information. it's hard to determine why it happened. >> i want to take calls from our viewers, regina from tennessee good evening. what's your question? >> caller: thank you for taking my call. because of the time line, i am very worried and i'm wondering if the mother or any other of the adults in this have taken a polygraph? >> cheryl, prime analyst, what is the scenario there? do you drag them in and take a test? >> everybody there should be. no question. >> it doesn't seem anyone has. tina, in illinois, your question. >> caller: why doesn't the mom step up and ask, where is my child and all this? you haven't heard nothing from her. >> lillian glass, is the mother thinking it's best to stay out of the limelight now or would we expect for the mother to expect the safe return of her daughter. >> you would expect any mother

to be frantic and plea for their daughter to come back. this is a very beautiful little girl. the mother's silence speaks volum volumes. a suspect comes in and says i kidnapped her, but i don't know where she is. what are your thoughts? >> it's very bizarre. i might add, pat, too, it's interesting the mother has not come forward. why? ordinarily, law enforcement would want her to come forward. is she afraid she might say something to implicate herself, even if she's innocent? i don't know. we have to wait and see. >> we were finding out that dss was no stranger to this household. there are issues they have dealt with from time to time. at some point, there were drugs

in the house. they are not saying this is involved in this case, per se. if you are a police officer and doing the investigation, you have to keep that in mind.

we're receiving new leads all the time. again, since the footage was aired last night, we received a lot of phone calls. every single phone call has to be followed up on. we continue to follow up on the leads and tips we have. >> extraordinary breaking news. you saw the images of little shaniya davis being held by a man who had mitts he kidnapped

her, but won't talk about where she might be or who she might be with. you know, i do have to talk about clarence coe. he's the mother's boyfriend that has been completely cleared. doug burns is not a happy man tonight. we spoke to him. he feels he's been treated unfairly. i'm sure, as a defense attorney, you feel the same way. >> no. anybody that's arrested then freed is going to be extremely upset. as gloria has been saying, this is a bizarre family circle here of interrelated actors. it's very, very hard, it was very hard to determine who is doing what. of course, he's upset. we'll see what happens in terms of a claim he might make. >> lillian dplasz, did i hear you say maybe he could use it as a defense that he was try ingin protect the child and take her

out of a horrific existence? >> that's possible. her hair is pulled back, looks very, very well taken care of. was the mother taking care of her? were the family members taking care of her. >> gloria, are you inclined to believe this man is trying to help her out? >> n-o. if she was in an abusive situation, and we don't have information to support that theory, if she were, the right thing to do is call child protective services, not engage in an act of self-help, take her away and not provide information to any of her relatives about where she was. >> cheryl mcclellum, what's the

advantage of taking a child to a hotel for an hour or two, then lord knows what next. >> there's motives for getting a child, ransom, assault or turning her loose. we're down to two here. dss was no stronger to this household. there are custody issues they have dealt with in this house from time to time. at some point, there were drugs found in the house.

a north carolina man admits to kidnapping 5-year-old shaniya davis. why is the little girl still missing. >> we have made another arrest in the davis kidnapping case. we have arrested mario andrette mcneill. >> he admits to kidnapping the little girl. there's shocking new footage. police say that's mcneill carrying shaniya to a hotel

room. >> she looks relaxed like she's wait i waiting for the elevator to come. she's not fighting him or anything of that nature. >> the key piece of evidence or clue may come from that girl in the video. i am wondering who is in the elevator. if you get footage of that, it may give you something to look at. >> they are looking at the stories to make it fit together and find out what happened to the little girl. >> kidnapping charges were dropped against the man police arrested on wednesday. her father says he wants his little girl home safe. >> i miss you so much and i'm waiting for you. i'm not going to give up and you don't give up, either, honey. >> i'm pat lalama in for nancy grace. extraordinary surveillance footage we are looking at tonight. this girl, at least, as of tuesday was alive.

gurnal scott, reporter of wptf radio, he's got a criminal histo history, but nothing related to children or sex crimes. >> reporter: he's been arrested for fleeing police, assault on a female, many drug arrests. as far as any kind of harm to children, that we have not seen in his record and we are given no indication he has a history of that. >> was he recent lid released from prison? >>reporter: no. that was mr. coe who ruz released in august after a charge he was in jail on. as far as mr. mcneill not as far as we know of. >> what's next for this person? arraignment and he's going to plead not guilty. >> he was arraigned today. he put in a plea of not guilty.

he's being held right now on $100,000 bond. the same, exact situation that clarence coe was facing yesterday. >> if he's saying he admitted to kidnapping, but he's going to plead not guilty, are you going to argue or would you argue about the alleged confession? >> of course. i would always argue about a confession. >> dumb question, huh? >> when the confession was made, if they read him his mir ran da rights. number two, you don't know the circumstances surrounding the kidnapping. i'm a bloodhound. i'm going to go out after it and smell out what's going on. they need to get the mom in and question her. she's nowhere to be found. it's suspicious. it's a smart thing to plead not guilty at this point. let's see where the chips fall.

>> gloria, i'm curious about the argument, banging noise that the neighbor heard at 3:00 in the morning. do you think there's a corelation? >> it may be. but, also, one wonders why was the little girl on the couch and was the door an the trailer opened, locked or unlocked. why is the mother not saying anything, by the way? maybe she's so emotionally upset that she can't. if there have been drugs in the past, is this little girl being taken and held hostage to pay off a drug debt. we don't know. >> good point. good point. we want to take calls, but i want to ask this one question of gurnal. do we know who was in the house in the hours leading up to the kidnapping? were the boyfriends around? who was there?

>> from what we understand, the mother and sister was there. mr. coe, the boyfriend, was there and there were either two or three other small children in the house including young shaniya. about six people were in the trailer at the time this happened. >> interesting. marlina you want to add something? >> it was actually the sister's boyfriend in the house. mr. coe was at home at his stepmom's house. >> so, in other words, the suspect, now, was in the house, but not mr. coe? >> no, i'm sorry. the suspect now is the exboyfriend of the sister. her current boyfriend was allegedly in the home and the man falsely arrested, mr. coe was not in the house at all. >> casey, you have been waiting a long time from florida. are you with me? >> caller: yes, ma'am. >> question.

>> they have surveillance of her going into the hotel, is there surveillance of her coming out with him or somebody? >> good question. i understand he was there for an hour, so somebody must have understanding of when and how he left. >> reporter: you would think they would. the only surveillance video and pictures we have seen and privy to are the ones when they were checking into the hotel. if there was surveillance, police are keeping it close to the vest. >> claire from indiana. your question, claire? >> caller: oh, yes. i'm wondering does anybody notice his body language as he's carrying the child into the elevator. he seems, he remind ed me of a cat. >> interesting. let's ask lillian glass. we asked about the child, but not him. >> he looks very confident.

he has a purpose and knows what he's doing. that's an excellent observation. you really do see that. but, the thing that concerns me is the fact of how her legs are positioned. that bothers me. >> dr. deutsche, does anything strike you in looking at the child? >> it hasn't been a long time, so severe dehydration or mall nourishment doesn't bother me. getting to the bottom of what happened to her is very, very important for the medical field. >> absolutely. >> caller: to confirm the mother's story, is in the picture, the surveillance video, is she wearing the same clothes the mother said she was wearing when the mother last saw her. >> marlina, the clothing in the surveillance tape, her mother said she has a blue t-shirt on

and pink panties. >> yeah, that's all she was wearing when the mother last saw her. again, you have to remember we are not clear on the details about what the mother is saying. >> we don't know for sure, that's what she had on. >> that's what i'm saying. >> as a crime analyst and investigator, what do you do next? >> they are going to look at his cell phone. see if there were pings in the direction he was going and try to determine the location of this child. hopefully, if he has dropped her with anyone else, drop her in a safe place. drop her off. hospital, police department, somewhere. >> that's a very good point. gloria, as a child activist, what would you implore anyone who knows anything to do tonight for this child? >> well absolutely to even call

anonymously to law enforcement, if they are afraid of being implicated and disclose the where abouts of this child. if you have a suspicion but are not sure, think they may have seen a child that resembles this child, call law enforcement. i have every reason to believe the law enforcement will follow up on each and every tip. >> brad, if you were defending this person, what would you be doing with him tonight? >> keep his mouth shut. look at the sloppy police work -- >> why is it sloppy? >> they arrested aman too early, that's why. they should have investigated the case. get more witness statements. the mom is nowhere to be found. the sister is nowhere to be found. >> isn't time of the essence? >> absolutely. you need statements from people who know what happened. >> what did you hear around 3:00

a.m.? >> it didn't sound like they were trying to get in my house. i heard nous outside the house. >> what kind of noise? >> it sounded like a struggle, but i know it wasn't anybody fighting, but it sounded like bang i banging on my side of the house.

breaking news. police say they found a grave contained to have the remains of jayme sue austin. her own brother-in-law has been arrested and charged with her murder. >> new details emerge about the bathroom where she last took a showerer. it was soaking wet and someone vacuumed. >> someone took a shower. the carpet was wet on the other side of the room. it was quite wet, yes. >> her prized necklace not on the counter, but broken inside

the vacuum. >> officers seal off the scene. >> i'm pat lalama in for nancy grace. another breaking news story tonight in a very, very strange case. this guy, the brother-in-law leads cops to her body? >> yes. what i'm told from the d.a. is on monday, apparently he went along with search crews looking for wherever she might have disappeared to. monday night, they questioned him. he appeared to be acting strangely. they questioned him, again, on tuesday night and further thought he was acting stranger. they further questioned him yesterday and he led them to the grave. >> he confessed to killing her? >> they are not saying he

confessed. there are reasons for that. the d.a. says it's against the bar rules for him to say that, but it sure seems like that. >> one of our great producers here, we have to set the scene here. this is an interesting scenario. we have three houses. we have the victim. we have her sister and husband who live in the middle and her mother on the other side, correct? >> yes, pat. >> remind the viewers what happened. she took a thousander at her mother's house. he brother-in-law is home in the middle. take it from there. >> it started at 9:00 a.m. she department have water. she called her mom and said i need to shower at your house. mom says no problem. jayme goes to her mom's house at 9:30. car in the drive way.

jayme never shows up at work. she calls them to say i'm going to be late. i don't have water in my house. low and behold, jayme is gone, car in the drive way, shower soaking wet and her prized necklace that she treasured and took care of was inside the vacuum. >> okay. obviously, we need to look for a motive. what is this, the case of an obsessive brother-in-law with the hots for his sister-in-law? >> obviously. he's living next door to her, absolutely, no question. >> do we have a reason to believe she could have been having a relationship with him? what do we know? >> we don't know. the sheriff is hush-hush about a motive. i guess they are trying to seal the case up for, you know, he will be arraigned on monday. maybe we will hear more on the weekend. there's going to be an autopsy

tomorrow. we don't know how she was killed. >> i'm going to take a caller. what's your question? >> caller: my question is, it's really odd to have one house in the middle of a block without water. could somebody have turned her water off? this brother-in-law, like? >> well, i guess that's always a possibility, gloria. i'll throe that one at you. if he's obsessed, we don't know that, but could he have turned her water off? >> it's also possible the bill wasn't paid. that's why it was turned off. there are many reasons why it may not have been working. the fact that that necklace appears broken and that was a prized necklace of her, there was an act of violence against her and she probably didn't leave with any kind of consent that she gave. it was against her will.

>> we'll go with doug. we have another seemingly confession here, we don't know for sure. he led police to the body. doesn't look good if you are the lawyer. >> i don't mean to be cute, he could have known what happened and led them to the body. the police are playing it very, very close to the vest, as they should. you're right, if you lead somebody to a body, it's not a good sign. >> i agree with doug. again, if the confession wasn't valid and it gets thrown out, any fruits of that get thrown out. now, where the body was or if there's semen or fluid on the body. when was he read miranda is the question. >> lillian glass, what does it smell like to you?

obsessed brother-in-law? >> yes. >> by the way, he's still married to the sister. she had been cell phone stalked. is it likely he is the one that was hacking into her cell phone? >> it's a good possible. the behavioral changes noted. he has a strang behavior. perhaps the guilt consumed him and he had to let it out once and forall. >> doctor, what are they looking for on the body. >> dna evidence, blood, tissue, fiber that is may lead to the person who killed her. cause of death. how was she killed. >> a mother of two, ladies and gentlemen. now, tonight's cnn heroes. i'm jewel. two years ago, i had the honor

of serve iing on the blue ribbo panel that selected the top ten heroes of 2007. clean water works to improve the lives of people around the world. i'm thrilled to cnn introduce one of this year's top ten honorees. >> i live on the street. >> when you're hungry, you're hungry. that's it. four years ago, i see those guys standing there like they're desperate. they need to eat. my name is jorge murill. every night i bring food to the hungry in queens, new york. i'm born in columbia. i'm a school bus driver. 5:15, my second job started. it's a family project seven days a week. every night around 9:30 they're waiting for me.

i help anyone who needs to eat. just line up. the best part is when you see their smile. i want them to eat every night. for me it's easy. >> very good. tired, but good.

and now a look back at the stories making headlines this week. >> where is little shaniya davis? police in fayetteville, north carolina, say the 5-year-old girl reported misses is in extreme danger. mom said she put little shaniya on the couch and noticed her missing an hour later. >> she reported her later, an hour after she said shaniya was gone. >> three people were in the home, shaniya's brother, mother

and a person they identify as a boyfriend. jam she called her mom a la asking to use her mom's shower. >> cindy is with us tonight, the mother of jayme sue. was there anything out of place in that bathroom? was everything in place in your home? >> everything was in place in my home but not in the bathroom, and, you know, the sheriff's office has asked me not to disclose any of the information about it, but because of what the bathroom looked like, they've listed it as suspicious, you know, as a crime. >> 911, what's your emergency? >> my name is quinn gray and i was kidnapped and i'm not sure where i am right now. >> standing by his wife. he believes she was kidnapped and because of her mental disorder, bipolar disorder that she bonded with the suspect and

began to participate in this plot to extort $50,000 from reid gray. >> with you trying to get money from your husband? >> of course not. if i wanted $50,000, all i would do is take it out of the bank account. >> at some point either at get-go or somewhere between the begins and end, the boy toy 25-year-old lover starts taping mommy. 37-year-old quinn gray. during their sex sessions, while they are discussing the fake kidnap plot. discussing blowing the head off of her husband, the father of her two little children. cody stanley, 21, texas. on a second tour of duty, he also served in afghanistan. awarded the purple heart, combat action ribbon and national defense service medal. loved growing up on the family

ranch, hunting fishing and four wheeling. leaves behind parents, brother and best friend, kad. cody stanley, an american hero. thank you to all of our guests for joining us. thank you, nancy, for letting me sit in for you. see you 8:00 sharp eastern, until then, good night, everybody. coming up on the joy behar show, the lege dare dolly parton tells us why she said no to elvis presley. that's a first. then we'll go from the queen of country music to the daughter of hollywood royalty. carrie fisher tells us why she didn't say no to anything. "good morning america"

co-host robin roberts won't say yes or no about who's replacing diane sawyer. all that and more next.

tonight, it's a wild tale of booze, pills, and shock therapy. enough about me. it's actress and author carrie fisher who joins me to reveal how she turned personal pain into career game. gma's robin roberts talks about who will replace diane sawyer. maybe she'll tell me what scuttlebutt means. i'll talk to dolly parton about why she's known as the iron butterfly. all that coming up now.

i'm excited today. this woman has had an extraordinary career. seven grammys, two oscar nominations, ten country music association awards and sales of more than 100 million records. the list goes on and on. it's hardly over. her latest a dvd and cd come moe platter called dolly live from london. it's a pleasure to have you here today. >> thank you. i'm so excited. i love your show. you're doing a great job. >> thank you. we always get along with you on the view. we love you at the view. you're here and i have you all to myself without anybody interrupting me. >> let's just do it all by ourselves. we like that. >> let me start with the country music awards last night. we'll get to your cd and dvd. don't forget. we'll get there.

but taylor swift -- taylor swift just made history as the youngest winner of the country music association awards, and as entertainer of the year. you won that award. right? what do you think -- >> i did. i did. long time ago. >> you've won every award except the nobel peace prize. i think i'm going to nominate you for that. i'm nominating you. >> thank you. i was really so very proud of taylor. she's very young and very talented. she deserved every bit of it. she has had an unbelievable last several months, year, year and a half. she's just killed them. so i wasn't a bit surprised that she won that last night and all the other things she won. we all love her and we think she's really representing herself as well as nashville and country music very well. we were excited for her. >> she's adorable. what did you think of the incident with kanye west? >> oh, i think that's always silly when people show their

butts like that. i feel like he probably was embarrassed about it later. anyway, i thought she handled it really well and i think everybody just wanted to smack a knot on his head. i think it was all -- you know, what can you say? it was what it was. you know? >> you know, you've had so much success in your career. do you ever just -- you made a lot of money at this point. let's tell the truth here. did you ever think of maybe giving it up and just rolling around in your money? >> no. i never just wanted to roll around in my money. i always said i'd count my blessings more than i, you know, count my money, but i have had a great career. i really like what i do. like you. i really enjoy the people, i enjoy the performing. i love making things happen and seeing things happen. i've been at it since i was a little bitty kid. i hope to be doing this from now on. i have enough money to do what i need and want to do but i still

love to work. >> what was the first thing you bought when you made money in the beginning? because you didn't start out with a lot of success. what did you do when you first got that big check? i always like that question. >> well, actually, i bought a cadillac. i think every country music star back in those days, back web when i started out, i thought if i didn't have a cadillac i definitely was not a star. that was the first thing i bought. for myself. when my little "coat of many colors" song became a hit, the first money i got from that, i bought my mother a mink coat back when it was still okay to wear it. my mother didn't know what to do with it. i think she probably resold it and used the money on something else. >> uh-huh. it's always interesting to read that in the beginning people were telling you to change your look which you never did. you were so original in the way you looked and act and it certainly is, you know, something, we always know what zolly parton is going to look

like and how beautiful you have been all these years. what did you say to them when they said, dolly, change your hair, you look a little bit too, you know, whatever. i don't know what they said to you. >> cheap. cheap would be a good word. actually i really did kind of pattern my look after the town tramp and was always overexaggerated. i think the way i looked felt the way i felt inside. i didn't want to be plain and ordinary. i wanted a little more pizzazz. the way i started out looking was a country girl's idea of glamour. that's what i still do. i feel more like myself. i just feel happier when i'm overdone. >> see, we have in common that i admire the neighborhood tramp also for some reason. i don't know why. i just didn't model myself after her because she was homely. the one in my neighborhood. yeah. she was tramping around, believe me. >> yeah, well this lady, she

wore her clothes, you know, her skirts all short and showed her legs and wore high heel shoes, red nails, red lipstick and piled her per rocksided hair on top of her head. everybody said she's just trash. i always told the story, i thought when i was little i thought i was going to grow up to be trash. that's how you and me both look. >> you know, the wonderful song that you wrote "i will always love you" that whitney houston has recorded and was a big hit for her, i understand that you -- i understand that elvis wanted to record that. i mean, you said no to elvis. why? >> well, i didn't say no to elvis. i loved elvis presley. he loved my song and had intended to sing it. he had been working it up. i had been invited to the session because felton jarvis, a guy that was a friend of mine and he was a great producer in

nashville at the time. elvis loved it and had planned to do it and it was the day of or the day before that colonel tom parker, a brilliant man, i don't blame him for doing it. he called and said, you know, we don't record any songs that elvis and i don't have the publishing on. i thought, well, that's already been a hit by me. it's one of my most important copy rights. so i just didn't -- i just didn't let them have it and it broke my heart because i still think about what it would have been like to hear elvis sing the song. there's no work tapes of it anywhere that i'm aware of, but it was just a decision i had to make. one of my first big business decisions i guess and it was only after that whitney recorded it and it did so well i was really happy i had made that. >> uh-huh. no wonder they call you the iron butterfly. as a businesswoman you're really very good at that, aren't you? people don't know that about you, i don't think. >> well, i love the business end of the business. i had to learn that early on. when they say you're in the

music business you have to think about those things, about your contracts, about the money you have to make to keep the band on the road and the expenses and to have a bus or ways to travel. you have to kind of start thinking early on that yourself until you can afford to hire people that will help you out with that. i enjoy that part of it as well. >> uh-huh. you know, during your live shows you banter with the fans quite a bit, don't you? >> yeah. i love the fans. it feels more like a reonnon to me, like a family reunion. they're out there, i know they've paid money to come see me. i appreciate that because they're the ones that keeps me in, you know, cheap clothes and hair. but seriously, i do have a wonderful, warm relationship and i see in their faces. i sense how people are. i can look out in that audience and see all the different faces and i feel like i can perceive what their moods are. i'm out to kind of work with that and cater to that person.

it's a love fest, if you're a true entertainer and really like the audience. i'm not afraid of the stage. if i mess up i mess up and try to make that part of my show. >> when you were a kid, i'm just wondering, were you -- you grew up with 12 other kids, right? you were 1 of 12? >> yes. six girls and six boys. >> wow. how did you get attention for yourself? >> well, i actually learned early on that there was not a lot of attention in that family of that many kids, and to have a special attention unless you were in trouble or sick or something. i learned early on by playing my guitar and writing songs it was fascinating to my mother and a lot of my relatives, although we were all very musical. all my mother's people played and sang. so -- but i realized early on i was getting a lot of attention so i thought that was something i wanted to do because i needed a lot of attention. and i still do so it served me well in my lifetime.

>> do you think the kind of talent you have is genetic? >> yes. i know that -- all of my mother's people are very, very musical. some of my big musical heroes, uncles or aunts, even my mother f a great singer. a lot of them sang in church or sat around and enjoyed the musz ix. i definitely inherited the music from my mother's side. i like to think i get my business sense from my daddy. even though he wasn't an educated man, he was a brilliant, intuitive, wonderful person. i have his work ethic. most creative people will sleep all day and get up and write songs when they feel like it and sing when they want to. me, i'm up early, early just like i'm going to work. i never think of myself as a star. i'm still just a working girl in my own mind. >> you're a working girl to us, too, but a good one. don't move. we're going to come back with more with dolly parton.

♪ stumble in the kitchen, pour myself a cup of ambition ♪ ♪ jump in the shower and the blood starts pumping ♪ ♪ folks like me on the job from

9:00 to 5:00 ♪ ♪ working 9:00 to 5:00, what a way to make a living ♪ ♪ barely getting by it's all taking and no giving ♪ >> i'm back with the legendary dolly parton. you've got me moving over here, dolly. >> i know. are you singing along? ♪ 9:00 to 5:00 i can see you now. >> your music is humble. you don't walk afrom your shows not hummi inming your tunes. >> it's always a big thrill for me to be on stage. i used to think when i used to work with other people that we're stars and have hit songs and have the whole audience singing along. i thought that must be the neatnea neatest thing it in the world to have the crowd singing your songs. when we do songs like "9:00 to 5:00" it's a ma jor, major thrill. >> i was reading your grandfather was a pentecostal

preacher and said to you at some point in your life you were going to hell in a hand basket. what is a hand basket? >> oh, that's just an old expression. it just means you're going to hell. it just means you're going to get there quicker, like satan's going to carry you there, i guess, in a basket. i don't know. but my grandfather was, like you say, a holy roller preacher. it was a very strict religion. it was not in the rules to be wearing makeup and tight clothes and all that, but my grandfather was very, very proud of me. he lived to see me become a big star and see people really did care about me and i wasn't as bad as i looked. i looked like jezebel but he got over that after he saw that -- after i wrote a song about him called "daddy was an old time preacher man." he was really proud of that. that smoothed it over for me. >> the other thing, you have a very big gay following, dolly. why do you think that is? what do they like about you so

much? >> i think it's because they know i'm different, too, and it took me a long time to be accepted and i think that they just kind of relate to that and plus a lot of my gay guy friends, you know, they love to dress up or they're very sensitive and very creative. i think they relate to that side of me as well. i think they just appreciate the fact i just love everybody for who they are. we're not supposed to try to change people. we should allow people to be who they are and love them as they are. >> so then would you say you are pro-gay marriage? i'm curious. your background would say otherwise. >> oh, i know that true. i always say, sure, why can't they get married? they should suffer like the rest of us do. >> that's good to know. what would we do without our gay audience? no back lighting. it would be terrible. we need them. >> that's true. >> here's a twitter question for you. dolly has a huge gay following.

what are your views on joel osteen's view on gays? he says gays are not god's best work. that was his quote. >> i don't get into really talking this issue to those degrees but i don't want to talk about him, i don't want to talk about them. i think god made us who we are and who we are. i don't think if he was a religious person he would be judging people. >> that's nice. that's good to say. you just released your double disk cd dvd live from london. are british fans different from your fans here in the united states? >> oh, we have wonderful fans in the united states. we do have great, great fans in europe when we get a chance to go there, especially london we love to play. we had actually been on a five-week tour and just -- we were winding up our tour in london at the 02s is arena and thought we're going to film this because this has been a

wonderful trip. we had such a great time, such a wonderful audience. all the songs, of course, that they love and all the popular songs. then we do a lot of variety of other things. we do interview, talk to the band, show the rehearsal, show the town. this dvd is a wonderful thing to watch. it's colorful and entertaining, but you can see for yourself on the dvd how involved the audience really gets. they knew all the words and they were swinging their arms back and forth on all the songs, singing along. it made for a wonderful experience for all of us and i'm very proud of the dvd and cd. it's all in one package. i have it right here. i call it my double ds. it's like double disks here. on one side you've got the dvd and the cd -- it makes a nice little stocking stuffer, too. >> you don't get tired of those boob jokes, do you? you love those boob jokes, don't you? >> i might as well learn to love

them. if i ain't telling them, somebody's telling them about me. it's not like i'm trying to hide them or anything. >> a lot of people pay a lot of money for those boobs. >> i did. >> that was a good one. okay. now, one more question about the record. you now have your own label. the dolly records, right? >> yes. >> why did you do that? why do you need your own label? >> well, because -- well, the music business in general has totally changed since the early days with us and a lot of the major labels are not doing that well, so a lot of the artists are really starting their own labels and, of course, everything has changed since then. we start thought it would be a smart move to make. i've been putting my own records out for a while now. i always say i will always do that even if i have to sell them out of the trunk of my car. we've had actually three records on dolly records. we had the cast album from the "9:00 to 5:00 musical" and the

"back woods barbie" one of the songs from the "9:00 to 5:00" but also a cd of mine, the first one. we're doing good with our label. >> we'll be back more with more dolly parton. stay right there.

thank you. any how, thank you for remembering jolene. that show is kind of loosely based on a little truce that happened years ago when i first got married. this old redheaded gal who was working at the bank decided she was going to steal my husband. well, she didn't get him. >> i'm back with the beautiful and talented dolly parton. dolly, i want to read you twitter questions because your fans are out there and want to know certain things. is that okay with you?

>> awe, sure. >> here's one. i know you've been married for 43 years. this person wants to know, how has dolly kept her marriage together for so many years when most celebrities don't last? >> well, i stay gone. >> stays what? i didn't hear you. i'm sorry. >> i stay gone from home. i stay gone a lot. so he doesn't get tired of me. >> you stay gone. i got along with that. i have a friend who says she and her boyfriend or her husband, whatever he is at this point, they have quality time apart. i like that. >> yeah. that is good. we have quality time together and quality time apart. >> all right. >> we get along real good. >> that's good. okay. dolly has a lot of dead people in her songs, it says. does she have a morbid streak? >> well, i think -- i think all country people have a morbid streak. i think that's sort of like country music in general because i know i have this one song that i wrote called "me and little

andy" and it's about a little girl with her dog and the little girl dies and the little dog dies, too, and somebody said i'm used to kids and people dying in these country songs but did you have to kill the damn dog? so -- >> there's a theme for a song. >> yeah. >> are you writing anything about a dead cat we can look forward to? >> no, i'm not. i'm not. i am still writing, though. anyway, to get back to -- in all sincerity, i think that's -- a lot of people you just write about things that happen. yeah, we have a morbid side but i have a happy side too. >> it's funny you say that, because, you know, i'm italian and the italians love opera and it's also very sad and from the guts and morbid in many ways. and the grand ole opry. i just realized it. >> oh, yeah, it is similar. >> here's one more question before i have to go. what's the biggest misconception

folks have about you? >> well, lord, i can't even imagine. i've been so out there. i think people know just about everything there is to know about me. i always just say i want people to not just see the big hair, i want them to know that there's a brain under there. and not just to see the big boobs, that there's also a heart under there. maybe it's just to see me and just think that's all there is. hopefully there's a little more than that. >> i think everybody knows that you're as smart as you are beautiful. everybody knows that at this point. don't worry about it. >> thank you. again, i wanted to tell you, i watch your show because i'm usually up that time of night and getting ready to do my things. you're doing a great job and i love your hair. >> thank you, darling. it was great to see you. come back again whenever you can, okay? >> okay. >> all right. the cd and dvd, dolly live from london is available now. dolly parton, thank you for joining us.

all right. welcome, class, to hollywood 101. thank you so much for enrolling. all right, so over here we have debby and eddie. in the '50s they were known as america's sweethearts. those of you that are younger, all three of you, and you can't, you know, you can't relate to any of this, try to think of it this way. think of eddie as brad pitt, debby as jennifer aniston, and elizabeth as angelina jolie. does that help? >> that's the very funny carrie fisher in a scene from her hit

broadway show. "wishful drinking." this week i talked to the former princess leia about her life and loves and took time out for a call from a special guest. >> hello, there. >> hi, mom. >> hello, darling daughter. >> so, debbie, you've seen the play, right? >> i've seen it about seven times. it's great. >> so is there anything in there you can relate to or that you would say -- >> i would just say that she should have put everything in then it would have really been an overnight sensation. >> what did she leave out? what did you leave out? >> mom? oh, yeah, there's stuff -- >> why are you looking up? do you think she's god? >> because she's god. >> debbie is god. >> i hear the voice from up there. >> you're close to her now. >> we live next door to each other. >> in california. how is that working out? >> good. >> i adore my daughter.

she's my daughter. she's my child. very talented. >> she certainly is. so are you. >> if i did not have you as a role model there would be no way i would still be working. when she stopped working out, she went to nightclubs, plays. she reinvents herself. i do that also. >> she's a great role model for that. >> i finally did turn into her, right, mom? >> you are a wonderful talent and i want to thank joy for coming over to the carlisle hotel to see your mother. that was very nice of you, joy. >> deb birks e, i was looking for you after the show. you disappeared. you must have wanted to get away from everything. >> there was no dressing room there. i had to change -- naked in the lobby, i didn't think the carlisle was up to it. >> anyway, debbie, you were great and thanks for calling in. you and your daughter can bond later. >> we're going to do a gray gardens thing i think. >> it's the greatest. i love you, carrie.

>> love you, mama. talk to you later. >> good-bye, hon. you know, debbie, she's an incredible icon in american -- >> my mother is awesome. >> she's awesome. she really is. as a mother there's a few things that i have to question. does your mother really suggest you get pregnant by an ex-husband? tell me about that. >> yes, she did, but she wanted me also -- it would make the show too long. she thought, though, she couldn't have children. richard didn't -- ended up being an awful husband. awful. >> one of your husbands. >> one of my mother's husbands. >> your mother's husbands that's not the one that drove her into the poor house? >> richard ham het. >> is he alive? >> oh, yeah, i wonder who he's taking advantage of now. anyway, my mother thought, though, you could get pregnant -- this was explainedf,

really? she thought you could get an injection. like a sperm in the arm injection and the sperm would go down here. >> this is what happens when you're raised catholic. >> my mother is excentric. she's not catholic. she's raised by a very strange group of people from texas. >> so she figured that that would be the way to do it, huh? >> yes, that's one of her ideas. >> let's talk about elizabeth taylor for a second. what was she like? >> i didn't get to know her until much later, but i think she's terrific. >> everyone loves elizabeth taylor. >> she's lovely. >> she did steal your father away from your mother. >> i once gave her an award and thanked her for getting daddy out of the house. the thing is, i did say to her once, did you love my father? and she said, we kept mike todd alive. >> oh, it was really on the heels of his death. >> he was best friends with mike

todd. i said -- mike todd was fantastic. >> he was like sort of a surrogate mike todd. that was weird. your father, was he in love with her? >> i'm sure he was. look at the woman. she's fun. she's a lot of fun. >> she's a lot of fun. so is your mother. they're both fun broad. >> they did very well. >> in a certain way you had a great, great time didn't you? >> yes, absolutely. then i have other stuff to make sure i know that time was great. that's what's good about bad times. you appreciate the other stuff. >> how about your father? >> he was not -- my father is adorable. he's lovely, he's charming, you can see why he got all that [ bleep ], but -- >> i can say it. >> oh, come on. >> my girlfriend -- >> he loves women. >> he loves women. >> and we have a very large relationship now so it's like now i'm sort of, you know -- but

he -- no, my father was a boyfriend. my father's a boyfriend. his children are a by-product of sex. he was not a bad father at all. when you saw him you loved him. i wanted -- that was the tragedy of it if there was. you know, there was so little of him available at that time. >> nowadays when you hear about these horrible fathers and sexually abusing their children, you look back on our fathers who were negligent and say thank you. >> he had elizabeth. >> meryl streep, i want to go here. do we have time for this? she played a character loosely based on you in "postcards from the edge." can we see some of that? >> will you please tell me what is this awful thing i did to you when you were a child? >> you want to know? >> i want to know. tell me. >> okay. fine. from the time i was 9 years old you gave me sleeping pills. >> that was over the counter medication and i gave it to you because you couldn't sleep. >> you don't give children

sleeping pills. >> they're not sleeping pills. it was store bought and it was perfectly safe. >> that was one of my favorite movies. i love the way shirley mcclain -- >> is she like debby in the movie? >> yeah. >> sort of self-absorbed? >> you know, my mom -- i don't know that that's what -- i wouldn't call my mother self-absorbed. i mean -- >> all actresses are self-absorbed. >> we are. this isn't narcissistic. you're probably that. >> narcissistic is a disorder. self-centered -- >> a good form of narcissism. >> you think so? let's do a little bit on your men before we run out of time. you were married to paul simon. >> you're kidding. >> i went to college with paul simon. >> how was that for you? >> we used to hear him playing his guitar on the library steps. >> he said bar mitzvah was standing room only. >> i mean -- that lasted a little while. i remember when you were married

to him. >> paul was great. >> are you friends with him now? >> that's complicated. we've moved on. >> yeah. has he come to see the show? >> no. >> no? >> i mean, there's nothing in it that, you know, would be bad. i'm very -- i mean, i admire paul. i'm, you know, i had a really -- some of our relationship was fantastic. >> yeah. she's had such a fascinating life. we could have talked for hours. "good morning america's" robin roberts on a search for a new gma co-host.

i am not my -- i am a soul that lies within, and that's it. no more wig. not going to do it. >> how did you decide to do it? was there a particular reason? >> i was finally strong enough. fear keeps us from doing the things we all want to do. i realized there was a part of me that was holding on desperately to the old robin, holding on desperately to how i look. >> do you believe us when we all say you're beautiful? because you are. >> you really are. >> my mom says i look like a little greek boy. so i don't -- >> i had a chance to sit down with "good morning america" co-host robin roberts earlier

and began by asking her who's going to take diane sawyer's seat on the couch. >> i really don't know. >> how about levi johnston? he's cute. that's what we love. >> give me other names. >> george stephanopoulos. he'll have to sit on your lap. but still -- >> come on, joy. you were doing so well there with levi and then you do that. >> i love george. >> he is phenomenal. >> he would be great. looking for a man or woman? >> we're looking for the best available person. i mean -- >> the best available person? could be the security guard down the hall. >> i feel like an athlete. you know, the best available in a draft. draft by position. the best available athlete. let me just say this in all sincerity. i have had -- >> don't get too sincere. >> i've had the time of my life sitting next to diane and have learned from her. i am so grateful for that. so it's going to be difficult for anyone to -- there's no one that's going to be able to replace her and so we'll find out how we're going to move ahead. it's about "good morning

america." it is. it always has been, always will be, no matter who sits there. >> that was pretty. very sincere. >> it was sincere. >> are you part of the discussions? are you like jay leno hiding being the closet listening to the negotiations? >> we have a very open door policy there. we have discussions. i think that we all have a say. i don't know who will have an ultimate vote. they listen to us and we listen to our audience to see what they want from us. >> what have you heard from the audience? >> not much, actually. let us know -- go to our shout-out board. the audience are like family. people don't like change in the morning. you have your routine in the morning. i have my routine in the morning. >> it's always been painful when we changed the cast cough "the view." you go through growing pains. >> how have you been able to do it? you have mad made a lot of changes there. you have yet, been able to maintain what it is about "the

view." how have you done it? >> barbara and i are still there. the pillars, the twin towers are still there. that's why maybe. i mean, maybe if they took everybody off at once and changed it all at once it wouldn't work, but because it's gradual it's not so bad. don't you feel you have to have chemistry when you're sitting there with those people? >> there's something intimate about morning television. people are there in their pjs, watching you between their feet and want to feel comfortable. chemistry is important. making the audience feel comfortable. at the end of the day the audience wants to be -- it's a different world now. they want to leave the door and know what's going on. that's our main objective, making sure we give them the information they need. >> but not too much. not so much it's going to wake them up. >> that they're going to put the covers over their head and say i'm not going to get up this morning. >> you were talking about your looks. i thought that was an interesting thing about how, you know, they had to shave your head. you really had to go look in the

mirror and say, who is this woman? right? how tough was that? >> it was very difficult, joy. it really was. many women will say they'd rather lose a breast than lose their hair when it comes to fighting breast cancer. >> really? >> you can hide that. you can't hide the fact -- that was the first time throughout my battle when i lost my hair -- that's when i really felt i looked like someone facing cancer. up until that point i just, you know, i wasn't feeling well and people knew i was going through something -- >> you didn't wear a wig. >> only on the air because i didn't want to distract. i didn't want people looking like this. it was an election year during that time. it was very important. around the streets of new york city i was like, hey, how are you doing? >> what kind of reaction did you get from people? >> it was great. people were wonderful. people embraced me. they told me their stories. >> i think people are in awe of that in a way that you could do that. >> because it really is something you're saying to the world, like, you know what? i'm so grateful i'm here. i don't care if i hair or not.

>> you've been through the health care system now. how do you think it faired for you? >> i was very blessed, very fortunate. >> you have good insurance. >> i'm very grateful. that's why i decided to make my mess my message. my mother said to me she knew i had a good job, i had health insurance. that's not the way it was for everyone. i could not imagine facing cancer as i did if i had to worry about how i was going to pay for it and worry about the care was receiving. >> many people do. >> that's why i was speaking out and letting people -- and not getting into the whole debate about universal coverage of anything like that. just saying if you are going through something like this that i cannot imagine going through it and having those concerns as well. >> in your job, though, would you actually come out and say i'm for or against the public option? you don't do that? >> my job is to -- that segment you just did was great. you bring people out to talk about the subject.

you let your viewers get the information. they're supposed to make their informed decision. they don't want to hear my opinion. my opinion doesn't really matter. >> mine does. so -- >> that's why it's the "joy behar show." >> exactly. >> if i have my name on my show, i can have an opinion, too. you're good. >> okay. let's see. what do you think -- >> what else you got there? i'm a little nervous. >> let's talk about your upcoming interview with janet jackson a little bit. >> i talked to her saturday. >> when is it airing? >> it airs on the 18th. i was at her home in malibu on saturday, talked about -- she has a new number one hits album coming out. she's working on a book. she's working on a lot of things. also, oh, by the way, of course talking to her about michael. she has not been on the record -- >> she seems to have separated from the crazy family more than others. >> i asked her about that. i flat-out asked her, your father, does he -- come on, does

he make you cringe sometimes? she loves her family, but when asking about her father, in particular, who's made some statements that, you know -- >> are cringe worthy. >> cringe worthy. she says i love my father but she did talk about, like a lot of us, when she first heard about michael, how we were all like, no, this is -- she's used to things about her family. that's the first thing she said. it's my family. people are always saying something. she didn't believe it at first when he was brought to the hospital. to hear her talk about -- >> did she think he was murdered? >> i did ask her. >> la toya says that. >> i asked her about dr. conrad murray in particular. i asked her about the conspiracy theory, if there is one, what the family feels. i asked her all those things. >> what did she say? >> i'm not going to tell you. nice try. >> come on. give me a little something here. >> you, you, you -- >> a little taste. what about the -- the film, "this is it." how does she feel?

>> hasn't watched it. >> did you see it? >> nope. >> you haven't? >> i would like to. she does not want to see it. she said maybe at some point. she hasn't seen it now because like her brothers -- her brother was a perfectionist. that wasn't meant to be seen. that would be the outtakes of what we're doing here and throw it up on the big screen. >> when he's not -- when he thinks he's at the top of the game he's better than 99.9 -- >> if you're a perfectionist, those kind of things you wouldn't want. absolutely to the average person watching. >> are you a perfectionist? >> no, not really. as you can tell, no, not really. i'm kind of hanging out. no, you know, i'm demanding of myself but i cut myself a lot of slack, especially post-cancer. i mean, i really -- >> there's nothing like a near-death experience to snap you out of any stupid stuff you're into. >> it really is. >> great lady. we'll be back in a minute.

remember the disgraced new york governor eliot spitzer? remember him? guess what he's doing? he's giving a lecture at harvard university's ethics center. hello? ethics is the key word here. with me to discuss this is kristin davis, not the kristin davis from "sex and the city," although she could be if that city was albany. she's not. she's the madame that provided spitzer with his escorts and joins me for an exclusive interview. >> the guy goes to harvard and gives a lecture on ethics up

there. the professor up there says it's not -- he's not talking about ethics. he's talking about constitutional corruption. you wrote a letter objecting to all of this. tell me about it. >> initially i wrote a letter just addressing some very basic questions. i can't attend the conference because i'm on probation. i can't leave the city of new york. >> you were going to go there? >> i would have loved to. >> just to hear it? >> maybe ask questions. same questions i asked in the letter. no one replied to my letters. i posted it on my blog. >> i see. why is he doing this? is he trying to meet women or what? >> big money in the public speaking circuit, you know? sad he has influence over the future ethics of any harvard student. of any student in general. i mean, event sold out. it's obviously an economic decision by harvard to increase their bottom line. he sold a lot of tickets. obviously this press has also

helped. >> you think he should not be talking about ethics. is that your point? >> i see some merit. in his lecture. however, if we're going to listen to this man, why don't we talk about the real issues? >> which are? >> corruption by public official. how, you know, i mean, obviously we can learn something from a public official who committed and covered up his crimes, who lied to the public he promised to protect. >> that's true. attorney general, he went around making examples out of the same ex-court agencies he was frequenting. hypocrisy is his middle name. >> obviously we can learn something from him if we talk about the real issues. how we as american public can question our public officials and let's talk about, okay, he made mistakes and how he can rectify them and how we can question the people in power. let's not talk about wall street. why does he want to talk about wall street? the biggest ponzi scheme in the history of the world happened

under his nose. >> he's a dog but a smart dog. the guy is not stupid. >> no, no, of course. i'm sure he's getting paid rather well. >> he doesn't need the money, obviously. he had a big bill at your agen y agency. >> sure, sure, his father's a billionaire. >> how often did he use the services you provided? >> weekly. >> weekly? >> weekly. >> was he a big tipper? >> he was a good tipper. if the girls were nice to them and had a good time, he tipped them well. >> why do jons never get into trouble? >> jons never get into trouble because in this country we promote unequalty. the women get in trouble and go to jail and the men, you know, we've historically never prosecuted a jon. >> what do you say to people saying it's the pot calling the kettle black in your case? >> i served my time. >> are you still a madame? >> no. >> what do you do now? >> i'm working on non-profits to promote, you know, legalization

of prostitutoin and that sort of thing. >> good night, everybody. good night, eliot. ninininininini

breaking news tonight in the case of 5-year-old north carolina girl shaniya davis. little shaniya reported missing from the sofa of her own home. major developments tonight. is there a break in the case? little shaniya spotted on surveillance video in the arms of a man at a hotel 40 miles away. 8 the sighting at 6:11 a.m., 40 minutes before mommy reports shanaya missing. investigators make a new arrest after a tipster sees mommy's boyfriend driving away with the

little girl. charges are dropped with the boyfriend. cops say 29-year-old mario mcneill confesses. there's still no sign of shaniya tonight. where is she? >> police in north carolina say a man has admitted to kidnapping a 58-year-old girl, but we still do not know where shaniya davis is. >> the 58-year-old vanished from her home in fayetteville, north carolina. 8 someone was arrested yesterday but that guy is out of jail. charges dropped. an ex-con is behind bars. there he is. >> we were table to gain information from tips and interviews we conducted overnight. we picked mr. mcneill up at a location that was disclosed to us. we found him there. we brought him in. he was questioned continuously through the night. he was arrested and charged with first degree kidnapping for shaniya davis.

>> november the 10th of 2009 with first degree kidnapping, unlawfully. shaniya davis, a person under the age of 16. >> shaniya was spotted an hour after she disappeared back on tuesday. she was seen with him in a hotel about 40 miles away from her home. police used surveillance video from hotel to confirm their identities. >> what we know from investigators is they were only at that hotel for about an hour, around 6:11 a.m. just this past tuesday morning. >> police are going to have to see if there's a relationship between cole and the mom. what had happened prior to this? why was the child targeted? >> what exactly are the conflicting stories of the mother's? none of this stuff makes sense. >> i ask that they let her go and bring her home safe. we miss her and love her very much. breaking news tonight out of

oregon in the disappearance of a young satellite tv sales woman, jayme sue austin, the mother of two, apparently vanishing from the shower. signs in the bathroom of a struggle. breaking tonight. the search for 31-year-old jayme comes to a tragic end. her body found buried in a grave site in the last hours. the murder suspect, jayme's own brother-in-law. >> shocking developments in the search for missing mother of two jayme sue austin. police believe they've located jayme's body buried in a grave and arrested her own brother-in-law in connection with her murder. >> someone had been in my bathroom. the sheriff's office, because of what the bathroom looked like, they've listed it as suspicious, you know, as a crime.

>> jayme's mom reveals potential clues left behind in her bathroom including a wet rug. the throw unfolded on the counter. the most disturbing, a necklace jayme liked in the bathroom. >> quhovr whoever vacuumed up that sopping wet carpet in the bathroom felt there was no rush. >> someone who knew her mother's habits. >> police charging 35-year-old patrick lee late last night. days of intense search by air, land, sea and tracker dogs culminate with bad news. >> good evening. i'm pat lalama in for nancy grace. breaking news. is there a break in the case of missing 5-year-old north carolina girl shaniya davis? little shaniya spotted on surveillance video in the arms of a man at a hotel just 40 miles away. >> we have made another arrest in the davis kidnapping case.

we have arrested mario andrette mcneill. we have apprehended him now. we've been able to charge him with first degree kidnapping. he admitted he did take miss davis. >> new arrest in the kidnapping of 5-year-old shaniya davis. a convicted felon admits he took the girl from her home. he's behind bars. there's no sign of little shaniya. >> she was spotted with this man an hour after she disappeared tuesday. shaniya was seen with him in a hotel 40 miles from home. police used surveillance video from the hotel to confirm their identities. >> mcneil checked into the hotel in sanford with little shaniya after 6:11 a.m. tuesday. a tip led them to the hotel. by the time police arrived mcneil and the little girl was gone. >> with mcneil's arrest, kidnapping charges have been dropped against the man police arrested wednesday. police are looking for shaniya. her father just wants his little

girl home safe. >> i miss you today. i miss you so much, honey. i'm waiting for you. i'm not going to give up. you don't give up, either, honey. >> astonishing images of this little girl in that man's arms. perhaps a little bit of hope that she is alive. it gives us something to believe in. gurnal scott, reporter from wptf radio. what is this man telling cops? >> right now, absolutely nothing. they have him in custody. they have been questioning him as you heard. when they took him in custody, they questioned him all night. he has not given up the location of little shaniya. police are frantically trying to search to find this little girl who looked in the pictures as we've all seen them, that she was in reasonably good health and was being taken care of. now they don't know where she is. she has apparently been handed

off again. >> so -- okay. that's a very good point. is she handed off? did he indicate he gave her to someone else? do we have any knowledge that that, in fact, happened? >> if that has been told to police, they are not sharing that with us in the media, that maybe to protect their investigation, but what we know at this point, we have no idea where the whereabouts of this little child is, if she has been handed off to someone else who may be involved. that is the big question here right now. >> it's just extraordinary to look into the eyes of that child, grainy as it may be, and just ask yourself what is going through her pretty little head? marlaina schiavo, nancy grace producer. motive? we have to look at the scenario. we believe this man to be the ex-boyfriend of the mother's sister. do i have that right? >> that's right. we're only getting that from -- we're getting that from two

sources because we spoke to shanaya's half brother today and he said that's the relationship. we also spoke to clarence, the man falsely arrested yesterday and said that is the ex-boyfriend of the mother's sister. the sister that they were living with in that trailer. >> so we have the mother, the sister, and shanaya. are there any other children in this scenario? >> reports originally came out, we heard that there was a 7-year-old also in the home and then there was one report that said there was an infant. police will not talk about the children in the home. they've been very tight lipped about a lot of the details of this investigation and much of which, you know, was the people who were actually in the home. >> okay. sheryl mccollum, crime analyst, director of cold case squad, pinelake pd. we have the trailer, we have the hotel. what are police going to be focused on? >> they're going to focus on the direction he was traveling. if he did drop that child off

with somebody else, it's passed that hotel. he drove 40 miles with her, pat, he went in the same direction to drop her off. >> it's absolutely frightening to imagine, gloria all red, family law attorney and victim's right advocate. the person in question -- he has a criminal history but nothing sex-crime related. nothing child related. what concerns you tonight? >> it concerns me he had this sweet little girl and there doesn't appear to be an allegation he had her with consent. what did he do with her? is she okay? in whose hands or arms is he right now? what is he telling law enforcement, if anything? >> are you concerned about the other children? child or children who may be in that environment? >> i am. it may also be that this little girl knew him, if, in fact, he was the ex-boyfriend of the mother's sister, and maybe -- who knows what he even told her.

i am concerned about the others, although the other little children appear to be safe at this time. >> all right. now, i want to go to lillian glass, psychologist and body language expert, author of "i know what you're thinking." you know, when you look at those images, i'd like to believe she's not scared out of her mind. okay? tell me what you're thinking when you look at those images. >> it's very interesting because she does look like she knows him. she does look comfortable. there something that is a giveaway that doesn't look comfortable. you can see later on in the pictures she does krot her legs. her knees are together. is she sexually molested? what has happened to her? what is being done with this girl or what has been done with her? >> dr. jake deutsche, doctor of emergency medicine, the question, we're all hoping and praying there has been no harm. i mean, kidnapping bad enough. putting the fear of god into this child. but, you know, any physical harm. if and when she's found, what will we look for so we know?

>> the doctors are going to have to do an overall assessment to look at her medical condition, look for signs of trauma, bruising, head injury, general well being. in order to determine if there's any rape crime they're going to have to do a rape kit. that's an investigation where they're going to collect evidence, secretions, body fluids, hair samples in order to seal the case and understand what the extent of the trauma was. >> doug burns and brad forcowen, defense attorneys, this man apparently has confessed to kidnapping. you know, if he wants to make a good deal for himself he better tell where that child is, correct? >> yeah. i'm sorry, brad. >> that's one thing. it could happen. i mean, what's unusual here is the timeline and that she saw the baby at 5:30. he gets to the hotel at 6:11. i'm concerned with what the mom knows in terms of how this all occurred. how he got into the trailer, how he grabbed the child. i mean, there's a lot of things

they're going to have to look at here. >> we're still conducting interviews and following up on leads this morning. >> is she alive? >> i can't speak to if she's alive or not. again, we're hoping we find her alive. >> you haven't found her yet? >> no.

investigators say mcneil's time on the run with 5-year-old shanayi davis ended in this courtroom. investigators say the little girl was not with him when he was taken into custody but he admitted to kidnapping her. judge david hasty laid out the trouble mcneil faces. >> you are charged on november the 10th of 2009 with first degree kidnapping. unlawfully, willfully and kidnapped a person under the age of 16. >> investigators have not been able to locate the 5-year-old who was kidnapped from her home tuesday morning. investigators are reinterviewing residents at that mobile home

park. mcneil's arrest cleared the way -- mcneil was originally charged with first degree kidnapping. >> as for mcneil investigators got a loin on him after releasing pictures of surveillance video from a hotel that shows mcneil with little shaniya. this is the comfort sweets where mcneil took shaniya. after police contacted mcneil's family, he turned himself in. >> i'm pat lalama in for nancy grace. extraordinary, breaking news. you saw those images and it gives us some hope she was alive on tuesday, she's alive today. gurnal scott, reporter wptf radio. we need to talk about this timeline. there are questions being brought up. mom says she put the child on the sofa at 5:30 a.m. take it from there. >> that is the case, and it's also said that the last time she

saw her was at 5:30. then she made the call to police at close to 7:00 in the morning. now, you have to add into that the neighbor who said around 3:00 in the morning she heard a ruckus around her trailer, so between that and the last time she saw the child and the time that the police were called to report the child missing, there's a little bit of time in there that police are trying to hammer down and find out exactly if all the -- if there is a lot of truth in what's said here. >> defense attorney doug burns. if the child is put down at 5:30 and the surveillance tape shows 6:11, that doesn't give him a lot of time to get to tfrom the trailer to the hotel? >> the time chronology is a little bit odd. i find it very odd, pat, working off your original point that a confession would usually go hand

in hand with information about the whereabouts of the child. for the report to come in, okay, he's confessed to kidnapping, confessed to taking her, but we don't know where the girl is strikes me as puzs. >> marlaina schiavo, any clue of a motive? we have two sisters living together, one boyfriend who is no longer considered a suspect, was charged and was a suspect and another boyfriend who confesses to kidnapping. it seems everybody is a little interconnected. >> they are interconnected. as far as a motive goes, we would have to have somebody admit to what is going on here. so he says he confessed that he kidnapped her and obviously we have this video, but by the same time, i mean, we don't have any information from the mother. we have no information because the father doesn't know anything and we certainly aren't hearing about other adults in the home. no one is actually giving up the information. it's hard to determine why this happened. >> i want to take some calls from our viewers.

regina from tennessee. good evening, what's your question? >> caller: hi, question. thank you for taking my call. because of the timeline, i am very worried and i'm wondering if the mother or any other of the adults in this have taken a polygraph? >> sheryl mccollum, crime analyst, what would be the scenario there? drag them in, ask them to take a test in. >> definitely. everybody in that trailer should be taking a polygraph. >> it doesn't seem at this point we have indication they have. tina in illinois. your question? >> caller: yes. why hasn't the mom stepped and and ask, where's my child in all of this? you haven't heard anything from her. >> lillian glass, psychologist, is the mother thinking it's best if i stay out of the limelight? would we expect her as a mother to plead for the safe return of her daughter? >> you would expect any mother to be frantic and plea for her daughter to come back.

this is off is beautiful little girl. it's very disconcerning what's going on. just the mother's silence speaks volu volumes. >> gloria allred, a suspect comes in says, yeah, i kidnapped her, but i don't know where she is. what are your thoughts. >> well, it's very bizarre. i might add, pat, too, that yes, it's interesting that the mother has not come forward. one has to ask, why is she not coming forward? ordinarily law enforcement would want her to come forward. is she afraid, herself, she might say something that might implicate herself even if she's innocent? i don't know. we'll have to wait and see. >> we were finding out that dss was no stranger to this household. there have been custody issues that they have dealt with in this household from time to time. there at some point had been drugs found in this house. they're not saying this is involved in this case, per se, but if you're a police officer

and you're doing this investigation, you have to keep that in mind.

we're receiving new leads all the time. again, since that footage that was aired last night, we've seened a lot of phone calls. every single phone call has to be followed up on. with on the to follow-up on leads and tips we have. >> extraordinary breaking news. you saw the images of shaniya davis by a man who admits he kidnapped her but won't talk about who she might be or or

what fate she's dealing with at this point. i have to talk about clarence co, the mother's boyfriend who has been cleared. he's not a happy man tonight. he feels he's been treated unfairly. i'm sure you as a defense attorney feel the same way. >> anybody who is arrested and immediately freed, of course, is going to be extremely upset. you know, as gloria allred's been saying, this is a bizarre family circle here of all kinds of interrelated actors. and, you know, it's very, very hard -- it was very, very hard to determine who's doing what. of course he's upset. we'll see what happens, you know, in terms of any claim he might make. >> lillian glass, did i hear you say or tell someone earlier it's possible maybe he could use this as a defense, he was trying to protect the child? take the child out of a horrific existence? >> that's a possibility, too. when you look at the pictures, initially, you see her hair is

pulled back. she looks very, very well kept. you see in this picture the hair is dishevelled, it's very wild. you wonder, you know, was the mother tending to her? were the family members taking care of her? that speaks volumes, especially when you look at how well kept she was ahead of time. >> gloria allred, are you inclined to believe this man was trying to help her out? >> n-o. i have no belief in that because, look, if she was in some sort of abusive situation and we don't have any information that would support that theory, but if she were, then the right thing to do would have been to call child protective services. not to engage in some sort of act of self-help, taking her away and not providing any information to any of her relatives about where she was. >> sheryl mccollum, crime analyst, we were hashing this out today in the newsroom. i mean, what's the motive of taking a child for an hour or two to a hotel and then lord

knows what next? >> pat, there's three motives for kidnapping a child. one is for ransom, one is to harm her and one is to assault her and turn her loose. that would be like revenge. we're down to two here. >> dss was no stranger to this household. there have been custody issues that they have dealt with in this household from time to time. there had at some point been drugs found in this house.

a north carolina man admits to kidnapping 5-year-old shaniya davis, why is the little girl still missing? >> we have made another arrest in the davis kidnapping case. we have arrested mario mcneil. >> cops say mcneil admits kidnapping the little girl and there is shocking new surveillance footage. police say that's mcneil carrying little shaniya into a hotel room. he's in jail. but shaniya is still missing.

>> she looks relaxed like she's waiting for elevator to come. she's in his arms. not like she's fighting him. >> the key piece of evidence or the key clue in this may have come right from that girl in that video. i'm wondering, myself, who was in the elevator? if they could get footage as to who was in the elevator, that might give us something to look at. >> they're looking at the stories and trying to make it fit together to find out what happened to this little girl. >> kidnapping charges have been dropped against the man had arrested on wednesday. please take a good look at shaniya here. her father says he wants liz little girl back home. >> i misyou so much. i'm not going to give up. >> i'm pat lalama in for nancy grace. extraordinary surveillance footage we're looking at tonight. this girl, at least, as of tuesday, was alive and with any luck and hope she still is.

gurnal scott, reporter wptf radio. tell me about the suspect. i know he has a criminal history but nothing related to children or sex crimes i know of. >> from what we understand, no. he has been arrested for fleeing police, assault on a female, many drug arrests that we understand, but as far as any kind of harm to children, that we have not seen in his record. we're giving it no indication he has a history of that. >> was he recently released from prison? i know he spent a few years in prison. am i wrong in. >> that was mr. ceo who was recently released from this i think as recently as august. in his case after a charge he was in jail on. >> marlaina schiavo, what's next for this person? arraignme arraignment? i understand he's going to plead not guilty? >> yes.

he put in a plea of not guilty and he's being held right now on $100,000 bond. the same exact situation that clarence ceo was facing yesterday. >> bradford cowen, if he's saying, admitted to kidnapping but he's going to plead not guilty, are you going to argue or would you argue about this alleged confession? >> of course. i would always argue about a confession. >> dumb question, huh? >> see if it's voluntary, how the confession was made, when the confession was made, if they read him his miranda rights. there are so many issues surrounding a confession, first of all, that's number one. number two is you don't know the circumstances surrounding these kidnapping. i'm a bloodhound. i'm going to go after this and smell out what's going on. these cops need to get the mom in. they need to start questioning her. she's nowhere to be found. that's very suspicious what's going on. i think it's a smart thing for him to plead not guilty at this point. let's see where the chips fall. >> gloria allred, i'm curious

about this -- i don't know, arg argue, banging, noise the neighbor heard at 3:00 in the morning. are you thinking there might be some sort of correlation? >> it may be. also -- one wonders why was that little girl on the couch? was the door to the trailer, was it open? >> right. >> was it locked or was it unlocked? why is the mother not saying anything? by the way, maybe she's so emotionally upset she can't say anything. another issue that hasn't been addressed is if there's been drugs in the past, is this little girl being taken and held hostage in order to pay off a drug debt? you know, suggesting that, perhaps, until that debt is paid she doesn't come back. >> good point. i have to ask this one question after gurnal. do we know who was in the house, for instance, in the hours leading up to this kidnaps? were the boyfriends hanging around? was it just the sisters? who was there that night? the night leading up to the

kidnapping. >> from what we understand the mother was there, the sister was there, the mr. ceo, the boyfriend was there. there were either two or three small children in the house including young shaniya. so there were, i believe, as many as six people, i understand, in the trailer at the time this all happened. >> interesting. all right. marlaina, you want to add something? >> actually just one thing. it was actually the sister's boyfriend that was in the house. mr. ceo was at home at his step mom's house. that night. >> okay. so in other words the suspect now was in the house but not mr. c orkeo ceo. >> no. i'm sorry. the suspect is the ex-boyfriend of the sister. the sister's current boyfriend was allegedly in the home and, of course, the main that was falsely arrested, mr. ceo, was not in the house at all that day. >> casey, you've been waiting a long time from florida. are you with me? >> caller: yes, ma'am. >> question. >> caller: okay.

they have surveillance of her going into the hotel. is there any of her coming out of it with somebody else or with him possibly? >> very good question. gurnal, any other surveillance video? i understand he was only there for an hour. so somebody must have some understanding of when he left and how he left. >> you would think they would. the only surveillance video and pictures that we have seen and we have been privy to are the ones when they were checking into the hotel. if there was surveillance of them coming out, police are keeping that close to the vest and we have not seen that yet. >> i want to take claire from indiana. your question, claire? >> caller: oh, yes. i'm wondering, well, has anybody noticed somehow, i don't know, his body language or whatever, as he's carrying that child into the elevator and all that. he just seems -- he reminded me of a cheshire cat. >> interesting. let's ask lillian glass. we asked about the child. we didn't ask about him.

>> he does. he looks very confident like he knows he has a purpose and knows what he's doing. that's an excellent observation because you really -- you really do see that. the thing that concerns me is just the fact of how her legs are positioned. that really bothers me. >> dr. jake deutsche, as a doctor of emergency medicine, does anything strike you in looking at this child? >> it hasn't been a long time, so severe dehydration or malnourishment doesn't concern me. i agree the well being of this child is the utmost importance and getting to the bot toll of what happened to her is important for the medical field. >> absolutely. sue in minnesota. let me take a question from you. >> caller: to confirm the mother's story, is in the picture, in the surveillance video, is she wearing the same clothes that the mother said she was wearing when the mother last saw her? >> marlaina, tell me about that. the clothing in the surveillance tape, i believe the mother said she had a blue t-shirt on and

pink panties? >> yes. that's correct. that's all she was wearing when the mother said she last saw her. but, again, pat, you have to remember that we're not completely clear on the details about what the mother's saying. >> in other words we don't know for sure that's exactly what she had on? >> that's what i'm saying. >> sheryl mccollum, as a crime analyst, as an investigator, what next? do y do. >> they're going to look at his cell phone, see if there were pings in the directions he was moving and how long he was in certain places to determine the location of this child. hopefully if he has dropped her with anyone else, the best thing they can do is drop her in a safe place. drop her off. hospital, police department, somewhere. >> you know, that's a very good point. gloer ya allred, as a child advocate and activist, what would you implore anyone who knows anything tonight for this child? >> absolutely to even call

anonymously to law enforcement. if they are afraid, themselves of being implicated. and disclose the whereabouts of this child or even if anyone has a suspicion but is not sure and thinks they may have seen the child the that resembles this child to call law enforcement and give that tip. i have every reason to believe law enforcement will follow-up on each and every tip. >> brad cowen, if you were defending this person, what would you be doing with them tonight? >> obviously telling him to keep his mouth shut. besides that, looking at the sloppy police work going on. >> why is it sloppy? >> because they arrested -- i'll tell you why. they arrested a man too early. that's why. they should have investigated their case. they should have built their case. they should have gotten more witness statements. the mom's nowhere to be found. the sister's nowhere to be found. >> wouldn't time be of the essence with a mising child? >> absolutely. you need to start taking statements of the people that know what happened. >> what did you hear around 3:00

a.m.? >> it didn't sound like anyone was trying to literally get into my house, but i heard noise outside of the house. >> what kind of noise? >> sounded like a struggle but i know it wasn't anybody, per se, fighting, but it sounded like banging on my side of the house.

breaking news. police say they found a grave believed to contain the remains of missing mother of two jayme sue austin. jayme's own brother-in-law has been arrested and charged with her murder. >> new details emerge about the bathroom where jayme is believed to have taken a shower. her mom tells "the orgonian" that bathroom was soaking wet and someone vacuumed. >> someone had taken a shower. the carpet was wet. the carpet out to the counter on the other side of the room was quite wet. yes. >> jayme's prize pucca shell

necklace not on the counter but broken inside the vacuum. >> officers seal off the scene. and continue to process the area for >> i'm pat lalama in for nancy grace. another breaking news story evidence. tonight in a very, very strange case. leslie lauder, reporter for "bicoastal media." this guy, the brother-in-law leads cops to her body? >> yes. what i'm told from the d.a. is on monday, apparently he went along with search crews looking for wherever, you know, ms. austin might have disappeared to. on monday night they questioned him and he appeared to be acting strangely, so they questioned him again on tuesday night and then they further thought that he was acting stranger, so they questioned him yesterday and he led them to the grave. >> so i can assume he confessed to killing her? >> they are not saying he confessed. i guess there are ethical

reasons for that. the d.a. says that it's, you know, against the bar rules for him to say that, but it sure seems like that. >> all right, clark goldband from answer snancy grace, one o great producers here. we have to set the scene here. this is an interesting scenario. we have three houses. we have the victim. we have her sister and husband who live in the middle and her mother on the other side, correct? >> yes, pat. >> remind the viewers what happened. she had to go take a shower at her mother's house. meanwhile, her brother-in-law is home that day in the middle. take it from there. >> it started at 9:00 a.m. this week on monday morning when the victim's shower wasn't working. she didn't have water. she called her mom and said i need to shower at your house. mom says no problem. what happens is jayme goes over to the mom's house about 9:30. car found in the driveway. jame never shows up to her job.

she called her job that morning to tell them i'm going to be a few minutes late, i don't have water in my house. mom gets worried. checked on jayme. lo and behold, jayme's gone. car in the driveway, shower soaking wet, and her prized pucca shell necklace that she treasured and took care of was inside the vacuum. >> okay. obviously, we need to look for a motive. what is this, the case of an obsessive brother-in-law with the hots for his sister-in-law? >> absolutely. he's a stalker. he's stalking her. he's in love with her. he's living next door to her, absolutely, no question. >> do we have a reason to believe she could have been having any kind of relationship with him? what do we know? >> we don't know. we haven't been told anything. the sheriff is pretty hush-hush about any type of motive. i guess they are trying to seal the case up for, you know, he will be arraigned on monday. maybe we'll hear some more over the weekend. there's going to be an autopsy tomorrow.

we don't even know at this point how she was killed. >> i'm going to take a caller. hi, sheeba, what's your question? >> caller: hi, darling. my question is, it's really odd to have one house in the middle of a block without water. could somebody have turned her water off? this brother-in-law, like? >> well, i guess that's always a possibility, gloria. i'll throw that one at you. if he's obsessed, we don't know that, but if he is could he have turned her water off? >> i guess that's possible. it's also possible the bill wasn't paid and that was why the water was turned off. i'm not saying it was not paid, but there are many reasons why the water may not have been working. the fact that that necklace appears broken and that was a prized necklace of her, there was an act of violence against her and she probably didn't leave with any kind of consent that she may have given. it was against her will.

>> doug burns and bradford cowen, we'll go with brad first. we have another seemingly confession here. we don't know for sure. he led police to the body. doesn't look good if you are the lawyer. right? >> i'm not trying to be cute. conceivably he could know what happened to her and led them to the body. that's probably very unlikely, pat. again, the police, as has been said before me, are playing it very, very close to the vest as they should. of course, you're right. if you lead somebody to the body, that's not a good sign. >> i agree with doug. it's not a good sign. again, if that confession was not valid and that confession gets thrown out, any fruits of that confession also get thrown out. now, where the body was or if there's semen or fluid on the body, that would also get thrown out. you need to take a look at that confession. it was done over a three-day period. when was he read miranda, when he wasn't read miranda? that's going to be the question. >> lillian glass, what does it smell like to you? obsessed brother-in-law?

>> yes, it does, very much so. >> by the way, he's still married to the sister. she had been cell phone stalkered. i know that's not a word. is it likely he was the one that was hacking into her cell phone? >> it's a good possibility. the fact that the behavioral changes were noticed. the people noticed he did have a strange behavior. perhaps the guilt consumed him and perhaps he just had to let it out once and for all. >> very quickly, dr. deutsche, what are they going to look for on that body? >> the smoking gun. any dna evidence, blood, tissue, fibers that may lead to the person who killed her. also cause of death. how was she killed? what was the circumstances of her death? >> a mother of two, ladies and gentlemen, another horrid story. now tonight's "cnn heroes." i'm jewel. two years ago, i had the honor

of serving on the blue-ribbon panel that helped select the top ten cnn heroes of 2007. as founder of project clean water which works to improve the quality of life for millions of people by helping provide clean water around the world, i'm of honorees. now more than ever, the world needs heroes. >> it's hard to find a job. >> i live on the street. >> when you are hungry, you are hungry. >> the guys are desperate. they need to eat. my name is jorge and i bring food to the hungry. i am born in columbia and i'm a school bus driver. when i come back around 5:15, it's like a family project seven days a week. every night around 9:30, they are waiting for me. i will help anyone who needs to

eat. just lineup. >> the best part is when you see their smile. i want them to eat every night. for me it's easy. compare with them, i'm rich.

now a look back at the stories making headline this is week. . >> where is little shaniya davis? the 5-year-old reported missing is in extreme danger. her mom put her on the couch and noticed her missing about an hour or so later. >> she reported her missing about an hour after she found her gone. >> they were in the home at the time. her 7-year-old brother, the mother, and a person whom they have only identified possibly as a boyfriend. >> 31-year-old mother of two

jamie sue austin was running late for work after her water stopped working. she called her mom around 8:30 asking to use her shower, a few houses down. she never heard from again. >> with us tonight, the mother of jamie sue. was there anything oust place? was everything in place in your home? >> everything was in place in my home, but not in the bathroom. they asked me not to disclose the information about it, but because of what the bathroom looked like, they listed it as suspicious as a crime. >> he's standing by his wife and believes she was kidnapped. because of her bipolar disorder she bonded with the suspect and

began to participate in the plot to extort $50,000. >> did you take money from your husband? >> if i wanted $50,000, all i had to do was take it out of the bank account. >> somewhere between the beginning or the end, the boy toy lover starts taping mommy, 37-year-old quinn gray during their sex sessions, while they are discussing the fake kidnap plot and discussing blowing the head off of her husband, the father of her two little children. >> cody stanley, 21, was on a second tour of duty and served in afghanistan. awarded the purple heart and national defense service medal. he loved growing up on the family ranch, hunting, fishing

and four wheeling. he leaves his parent, brother, and best friend. an american hero. thank you to all of our guests and you at home for being with us. thank you, nancy for letting me sit in. 8:00 sharp eastern and until then, good night, everybody. i'm brooke anderson and this is the "showbiz tonight" news break. here's what's coming up at the top of the hour. the supermodel extortion shocker. cindy crawford plaque mailed over her daughter bound and gagged. brand-new bombshells from sarah palin's book and her sit down

with oprah winfrey and what levi johnston is saying today. tv's most provocative news show starts at the top of the hour.