yes? >> i've dealt with many fund- raising phone calls where they have been very pushy and do not take no for an answer, you know, asking for money. how far can you push it? how far can you ask for money? when is the time that you stop and say, well, will try again some other time? >> my advise is probably not typical because i think that you should ask more than once. it is not rude to ask more than once, but there is a point in time specifically working with major donors were you need to respect their time and respect their answer. here's the thing, a note today is not necessarily a note tomorrow. -- a no today is not todaya no it is, i don't know if this is helpful or not, a lot

of it will be a gut thing. are you feeling over the phone -- have you ever had a conversation and you guys are having an argument and you know that there's about point where things just went awry and you feel that? is it going to go well? trust your gut. going back to what i said earlier, you called someone and they said no and they are agitated and they're having a bad day. respect that. so very good question. yes? >> going back to one of the earlier questions i was asked. you said having a salon or houseparty type of thing to get the name out there. is seems like you need some money to get your name id but you also need name id to get someone in the first place. so i guess, is that the answer to getting that kind of seed money to get the camping off the ground? ground? how did ashley make that happen when you need one to have the other? >> sure. a lot of it is going to be leaning on people and asking, leaning on people and asking for

their help. in particular, people that you know for a long time in saying we've got a fabulous house. i would love it if you open it up for an hour and a half. i will get the people there. you know, we will do some wine and cheese, whatever. at having someone alone donate their space. i mean, that's huge, rydquist especially if it is somewhat respected in the community or other donors know. so it's true that they are tied together, but the interest is, if someone is running for office, especially if they're running for a house seat or a senate seat, if they don't have any name id, they shouldn't be running for that seat. that's the first thing. they may have 5% name id or 10%, but they got there for a reason, right? so whoever knows them whoever trusts him, respected or is talking to other people, even if it's a small, small, small group of people, utilize those people. if it's someone who has actually

no name id, there's probably a bigger issue. yes? [inaudible] and try to get people to give even though they might be value? . . they may hold you accountable for that and they may not write you a check because of it. there is not a lot you can actually do about that. if someone wakes up and says one day, no longer giving to anyone who identifies as a republican or democrat or whatever, there is not a lot you can do about that. but their frustrations over the phone or in a meeting and there's a lot you can do to bring it back. but what you have to do, i would

say, is recognize those frustrations. do not fight them. to argue -- i think everyone knows this, but do not argue with a donor. donor. let them say what they need to say and and and it in the sense that that is where they're comi from. let them say what they want to say and bring it back to you. there is no fix for someone who is universally upset or disenfranchised with a party and you are affiliated with that party and they want to be involved. we have a lot of great questions and this is awesome. i will move onto a few if that is cool and we will take more questions. we are doing good? let's do a few more questions. [inaudible] >> what percentage could be

dedicated not only to resources but the budget should be dedicated to fund-raising? what amount of money should you be pulling from that? weather that the e-maibe e-mail a website? >> i was trying to think of how to say this. i could give an answer that is not the most educated answer. it is good to have a session on that. >> what would be great is if you could show them the calculation for call signs. how many hours and how much money you raise per hour and how you start to get to your total. these guys a looking at potentially having to raise

$20 million. how do you begin to build call time? >> that is something we should talk about. working with major donors a lot of times, it is really your candidate making the call. you will be part of the call sign as well. you will want to have a column of all the people you are calling. you need to have a certain amount you are asking them for. in this case $2,400. you ask them for $2,400 and what do they give? it will be very easy in an excel spreadsheet at the end of the data to find out what you did that day but you need to be careful about making sure when you work out an equation of what did we do that day and what is the average make sure you are judging from the same list.

if you are asking for $450 it will not average out to the $2,400 act that your candidate is making. where we spend the first few weeks or months depending on what kind of campaign it is and working that out and setting goals. let's say you walk away from four hours with your candidate and the contribution is $1,000. you want the average contribution to look like $1,500 and judging yourself that way. you will only be able to do this by doing it. that is the only way to figure out what this equation looks like. if the equation is looking like you are getting ten people on the phone over a two our period and you are not raising much money you probably need to be calling five hours instead of two hours. what are other things to think

about? are we calling the right people? are we calling at the right time? you need to dig into this and figure out what works and what doesn't. having some sort of equations worked out to where you realize if i do four hours of called time with my candidate on average walking out of here with $58,000, it took four hours to do that and took 62 people to do that, do that for the first week and he will walk out of there with some measurements. >> you wanted to spend 70% of your time on fund-raising but is that the entire election or just the beginning? >> the whole time. there are going to be different bumps when you need to pay for

things, working with trainees, there is going to be -- there are going to be dips and peaks. what is really important are the filings, the political ramifications of the filings are incredible. the hotly contested republican primary, three opponents, you will show four million dollars on hand and they will show a million, you want to look at it that way. the last few weeks of the campaign i make a minor adjustment. the last few weeks of the campaign look lot different in fund-raising because your plan that you have been working on that you are putting in place should long have been paid for. you are not paying for this two days before. it should be paid for and put into action. that is the only difference. you shouldn't have to be raising

as much money as you would be for. >> how many people should you reserve as an emergency fund or something? you don't want to tap someone immediately. if you are an attorney, you don't want to tap the local bar association immediately because you might need the money later on. >> everyone immediately. if they could write you a check of $50 or $500 they are getting asked right away. you will be in a true emergency if you hold off. just ask people. >> you have 60 people doing fund-raising and you have a goal for all the people, each individual person has a quota, would you stake? >> it is a very good question.

you will have a diverse group of people in your house party. you might have someone who shows up who is part of the local committee for that particular party and you want them there -- the goal is for that person not to leave until they max out. i would create an overall goal. that is very important. if you are doing a house party and you are doing 50 people and they are all maxed out, you are going to do a house party, 50 x 2400 is your goal. if they have done that, they have done that by the time they leave. overall, people are at events

for different reasons and it is okay to have a diverse group of people. it is also ok to have 15 people and they could each max out. [inaudible] >> you might get a different answer from someone else. i don't believe there is a bad time to call people. one bad time might be 9:00 a.m. on monday morning. mondays in general, i don't know about you but i can't wait to get to work and all that kind of stuff. you might be respectful of people's time in the morning. calling people on friday sometimes can be a really good thing for a few different reasons. they are looking forward to the weekend, they may not be in a

better place to talk or be as busy and that is a good time to call but i found out you will reach people at different times. especially in the fast-paced world of the candidate you will have cellphone of a lot of people and talking during the day will be terrible for them. calling at 7:00 at night -- that might be easier. i would avoid those monday mornings. >> maxing out to individual, the candidate pack. can individuals--both the primary and general because there are 3-peats. >> individual who gave 2400 in

the general. [inaudible] >> you can exit $2,400 and an additional $2,400 in the general. the reason i wrote two checks is the first twenty-four hundred dollars has to be spent by the primary and the second twenty-four hundred cannot be spent until after the primary but might as well hid them on the same day. it means your finance department has to have its accounting act together particularly if you are going to do that. they are 5,000 general. they went to checks like that. they give during the general. you have to keep the money

separate. >> we are going to do some role-playing. a little less conversation is -- a few things quickly, you got about 15 seconds to do a few things, really. who are you, why are you calling, and what do you want? the second bullet, you have a last name. use it. have you ever run a call from a telemarketer and they have told you there last name ever? so, if you call and you say my name is jason mida, you're automatically in a different category because your a real person they're talking to. you have a first name and last name and they want to have a conversation. i know it feels like a tiny thing, but it automatically feels like a different conversation. not you are on my list of 7000 people the popped up on my

computer and i am calling you. again, what do you want? what are you calling? so, you are calling someone and -- all right, jason, that is cool. i like your candidate. i do not have a lot of time. what do you want? well, i'm calling the evil " -- i'm hoping that you will max out at a $2,400 donation to this campaign. and the reason it is quiet is because that is the most important thing you can do in a conversation when asking for money is to just shut up. because if you do not, they cannot give you an answer. and number two, what you are doing is allowing them to process the question. to process the question. what you will find -- this will happen -- you will find you talk nonstop and what happens is you don't get around to asking what you called them to ask for and

you will spend too much time and annoyed the person. what do you want? i need you to max out with a $2,400 contribution. silence from your end. what will happen is you will get an answer. it may not be the one you want but you will get an answer and you will get clarity from them which enables you to carry the conversation further. i can't stress enough when i started fund-raising and the person who taught me how to do fund raising over the phone said this and it only took two days to realize what they were talking about and it changed my time too. >> here is a rule of thumb. first person to talk loses.

that is would you tell candidates when you are training them on call time. no one will be shocked when i say i think of this. it is really hard to do but if you get good at it you ask and you just sit there. it is the most unbelievable uncomfortable silence but if you are disciplined they will give in first. the first person to talk loses. >> very true and very important. focus your message to, very simple but you will have a sense of urgency especially in a campaign. i understand you need money. why do you need it now? why can't i do it two months from now? you may go back to this conversation, i got to get on the air and do it quick. i need to do five pieces of mail. 5 don't show i have so much

money on hand i will not be a credible candidate. you will find yourself even with people who support your campaign reiterating the urgency. this is urgent stuff. bring it back to urgency, shut up and close it. that is what it is and it is not that easy a process, but getting the sense of urgency in their mind and being briefed and giving them a chance to respond whether it is yes or no. know your audience. a lot of this will be redundant but looking into -- does this person like me or dislike me? is there a reason they are predisposed to wanting to be part of my campaign? do they care about education? is it my major issue? it is something to talk about and frames the conversation. what drives this donor? you will not always have the answer to that question when you

do urgent fund-raising? when you are building relationships with people you have more of an opportunity to figure out what this person really cares about or what makes them want to be part of this organization. you are going to want to listen to this person. they may have something you are upset about or something they are happy about. listen to what they are saying. don't just talk. if all you do is talk, you are not walking away with a contribution. you need to listen to people. are you talking to someone who has the capacity to give who has never given? are you talking to a multimillionaire who has never written a check to a candidate before? we started talking about that. we are not trained as individuals to give money to political candidates. if you have ever done that and you are working with someone who has never done that, that can be a nervous thing for people. i give money to charity and i am

involved in my community but you want me to write a check for this candidate? i don't even know this person. why would i write this check? what do you do? you make it about them and their investment. i understand you have never met my candidate and you are not a political giver but i know you care about this community and you care about the quality of education. you want teachers to be paid more and that is why you should be part of this campaign. you have to do that in a pretty quick way. i covered the last point previously. just remember it is about them and not about you. what is different between a conversation over the phone and a conversation in person? some things are different and there are a lot of similarities. you have to be direct in the conversation just like you have to be over the phone. it goes back to the following.

this is just basic good manners. you asked this person to lunch or coffee. you need to drive the conversation. doesn't mean you need to talk a lot but you need to drive the conversation. you leave someone to sit down with you, the least you can do is be direct, be brief and tell them what you want. sid and down for an hour and talk about how excited you are to be working on the campaign and they walk away and you have to call them back two hours later and ask, that is awkward. it is not awkward to ask somebody face-to-face for something especially if they have agreed to meet you. if you our fund raising in your professional fund-raiser and people say they will meet with you doesn't mean they will contribute but they are open to the idea of contributing. the same thing as saying ask to

have a conversation. ask and shut up. given more than one opportunity, they have a question about this. making sure they are with the campaign, is there more than one opportunity to be involved, if you are going to be with someone and they contribute $2,400 on the spot, i need to say that is wonderful, we appreciate it. could you also do this? not only is that a smart thing to do but what you are doing is giving them a chance to be not just a donor but a true part of the campaign and that is important. tracking your conversation. this is really important. there are going to be different mechanisms that we will cover over the course of this class. you need to track the conversation to be fair to yourself and your candidate and your colleagues. here is the deal.

if you are focusing on a major donor, there is no way no one else on your campaign isn't calling that person. it may not be for money but they are calling for something else. it needs to be clearly noted this person gets $2,400 or this person said no or this person wants to have a house party or this person got in a fight. it needs to be tracked and that institutional knowledge is key. what if you have someone working on a campaign and they have been in charge in tracking and two months later they leave the campaign? you need to have this knowledge and you need to have it somewhere that it is easily accessible. it will help avoid a crisis. is a living breathing document. you are doing your own call time, constantly, you make a phone call and you're making hundreds of phone calls a day, you may think you have a good memory and you probably do but you don't have that good a memory and you need to make sure

you are writing this stuff down. this person lives and breathes because of his feelers. this person hates this particular food and they came to our reception and hated it. put it down. it could be important. it might not be but if you think it is important it probably is. i will spend a few more minutes on the slides and go to go role-playing. working with an adviser, this is something that is very common particularly working with donors who give a lot of political money. you will work with people who spend time with that particular donor and do this for a number of people and advise them on how they should do at and what they shouldn't give money to. something you will encounter when working with major donors from time to time, when talking

to the adviser you are talking to the donor. this is the person who is ultimately going to make recommendation. you should give to this organization or give to the candidate or shouldn't do it. they are in front of you and you need to remember that. there's a reason they have their job and their adviser -- their job is to advise the donor. make it easy for them. it is not so much about working on a potential senate race but more in general you are working for an organization and fund-raising and talking to different advisers about their donor giving $50,000, make it easy for them. type a memo. some people will require two to three paragraphs, great talking to you today, wanted to get back

to you with some salient points, here is how much cash we have and how many metal pieces we are going to do, could be some hangups on the campaign, let me know if you need anything else, have a great day. make it easy for them. what you will find is when people are making recommendations to donors--particularly of certain capacity, it is not that they don't care about their campaign but they are asking these donors to make smart decisions and it is their job to recommend that. don't be surprised if the first question you get asked is how much money do you have on hand? that happens all the time. sounds like a great candidate. tommy more about the raids. what does the last tracking polls say? does someone have this

endorsement? if all you know is the money or the event you are not doing any favors. you need to know the issues you're candidate cares about. you need to know everything as possible. it will make you a better fund-raiser. maintaining that relationship is very important and it can't always be about asking for money. so let's roll play. another 20 minutes? okay. what i have done is i have created a few scenarios here. the first one is what we are going to call the blue dog. i will need a volunteer in a second. you have defeated the republican incumbent with a message about

fiscal responsibility and small-town values. you have been in office ever since. you are facing a tough general election not that any democrats will face such a tough picture. you are facing a tough general election. president obama won 39% of the vote in your district in 2008 and polls say you are trailing the republican by 11%. your constituents are confused about health care and unemployment is over 10%. two things that can never happen. you are asking a previous donor who maxed out in the primary to max out again with another contribution. >> are you they giving you money again? >> exactly. they believe in you. you probably didn't have any challengers in the primary that is important to note that you have a challenge in the general. take any notes you have or need

to have. take a few notes about that and one of you is going to have to be the blue dog. and by that, one of you is going to be the kennedy, you are going to be asking for the money. i need a brave volunteer who want to ask for the money. i cannot believe not everyone of you wants to do it. [laughter] will i have to pick someone? thank you, brian. if it is logistically possible, can you come over here with your chair? here we go. >> do you need another one? >> yes, we will need two. now, i know this is a really hard ask. i need someone who has the money, who wants to give it away

or does not want to give it away. anybody want to do that? ok, thank you. let me give you some money. these are some things you want to focus on. you're going to wonder whether they can pull this off, right? you are upset with obama and lee the liberal leadership in the party. [inaudible] >> the blue dog is supporting health-care or not? >> my guess is they are probably not enthusiastically supporting it.

they might be supporting the senate version. i don't know. i would say they are not enthusiastically supporting it but they are not against it and they're trying to make up their mind because they are. this is not a phone call. this is a meeting. why don't you look at each other? okay. you are welcome to introduce yourself. >> we met before i guess. how are you doing? >> doing good. i am a little worried. >> so am i. that is why i wanted to ask for your help and to max out for the general election. >> you have a primary a couple months ago, i thought you might pull this off. the town hall in august, you are

getting your butts kicked. nancy pelosi and the democratic leadership are not doing you any favors, you have fumbled health care and cap and trade. looks like you might lose. why should i give money to your campaign? >> currently we are down in the polls but with your support we can put out direct mail that could explain health care better to my constituents. i think a lot of what is going on in the fall care debate has been handled very poorly. you are right with that. i believe in the values that are behind the health care legislation making sure people are covered by their insurance company, making sure they have choice with their doctors. am i in support of the entire legislation? absolutely not.

there are many issues with it but this is a long process. what the republicans want to do is repeal this whole thing. that is not what i want to do. i want to make it better which is why i am asking for your support today. >> the senate just passed the health care bill. what message are you focusing on on health care as part of your platform? >> it is important to explain it to everybody to make sure they know what the democrats stand for but the same time they're talking about jobs and employment is really high here and i will be very committed to making sure those green jobs back to our district and making sure we get the money that we are extending to washington back to invest in jobs and other opportunities. >> that sounds good but as a small-business owner i am

wondering when democrats are going to be able to pay that back to the economy. i am not able to hire more workers if i need to end all this talk about employer mandates and the health care bill, i don't see this health-care bill helping me. ..

if people are not able to make sure they understand what the democrats stand for early on, we may not be able to influence their decisions and changed their minds later on. it is important to take care of

this now, as soon as possible and then continue to work with people they know and the community in general to go forward in this race. but the importance of donating early is that we will be able to move forward very strongly and get our numbers up in the polls early on. know, i'm feeling -- i'm leaning towards donating. but i'm just wondering is what is your message going to be. when your opponent says ryan corn votes with the president's radical, liberal agenda 95% of the time, how are you going to calendar that? >> well, look, i'm my own person. and i support the president when i believe that what he's doing and what his policy are beneficial to the district. and i think that if we tied policies that i have sported because i believe they are important to the district to

actual tangible benefits that we'll be able to do very well in this election. >> okay. you know, i want to give to your campaign. i'm not sure if i can give the max amount. how much money do you need now? can i give you say $1,000? >> i $1,000 would be perfect. would you mind if i would be able to follow up with your later on and be able to check in and tell you how the rest of the campaign is going? >> absolutely. if my business is going strong, we get the health care bill. absolutely please hit me up for at $1,000. >> great. i will do that. thank you so much. >> thank you, guys. thank you very much. that was great. let's talk beliefly. what are some things that ryan did well? yes? >> he was really upfront in the beginning. said exactly what he wanted. >> exactly.

you did a great job saying here's why i here. this is what i want you to do. there's one thing he didn't say in the first sentence. what was it? when he was making the ask, what was the one thing he left out? the amount. the number. now you did say max. which is good. because you were thinking $2400, just remember say $2400. right? i thought you did a great job too at the end. hit me up again for $1,000. absolutely, i will. that was great. it was really good. what are some things, other good things, things that could be improved from that conversation? >> he answered all of small business owners questions. he answered all of his questions honestly. and forwardly. >> yeah. and he had a tough customer

too. that was good. >> he was very personallable. he asked what he did. >> yeah, i thought you were very considerate of your questions and what do you do and learning more about that person is very, very good. and the other only thing remember to concentrate on is just the whole silence part. letting their be silence. you let that happen at the beginning. which is good. let it happen again in the conversation. you got to say both did a good job. thanks very much. we have time for one more? is that okay? okay. all right. so we have the moderate. you live in a swing district. you want to close republican primary defeating more socially conservative pro-life candidate. you now face the democratic incumbent who is vulnerable but extremely well funded. to stay competitive you need to go on tv and increase the number

of mail pieces that you are sending. out again, this is 2010, we're assuming you already won the primary. you're asking the former -- this is important. you're asking the former chairman of the local party to max out in general with $2400 contribution. this person maxed out to your opponent in primary that almost took you out. now this guy -- this party chairman. this person is conservative. they just got down with the palin book signing. they don't like you. and they didn't like your campaign. but at the end of the day, they also identify as a republican and you're facing a vulnerable democrat who is fell funded but they are vulnerable. so i need a moderate and i need a conservative chairman of the local party. >> we have republicans in the room. step up. >> can i take the chairman's spot?

>> sure. i admire that. you can go ahead and come up. brooks if you will come here i'll give you something. we still need a member of the house please. we need a moderate. >> go ahead. >> all right. thanks. so i was just going to give you this. [inaudible conversations] >> all right. you can keep that. why don't you keep that? it's actually help you. all right. >> how are you doing today, greg? >> nice to meet you, my name is brooks by the way. >> new to the district.

[laughter] >> oh. new to the district, huh? >> you see i just moved here. and right now, i'm facing the tough real -- tough election here. obama is trying to push some terrible bill's down congress throat. we need some good republicans in congress. i need your support. can i ask you to max out to $2400? >> no. let me explain my position to you real quick. you're right. we do need some tough republican leadership out there in washington. however, your stance is more moderate than the fella that i gave money to the primary. i'm worried in the political environment, we have the tea parties. i don't know how realistic your stance is. >> i personally think we have a good shot here. looking at the polls right now, the democrat is vulnerable. if we don't take him out in this chance, we don't know what's going to happen two years. for all we know, obama could get

momentum back. when they pass health care, who knows what will happen. we need to have a republican in congress this november winning this election. >> you say we need a republican. are you going to be able to make the tough stances on pro-life conservative issues? >> i believe i absolutely will be able to take the stances. i want you to look at what this democrat is going to do. they are going to put more justices on the bench like sotomayor. they are going to make sure that they pass the most liberal anti-life aprils possible. and i'll tell you this much, sir, i'm going to do everything in my power to make sure we protect life without endangering the life of the mother. because we're pro-life in all stages when we're alive and the unborn. >> all right. well, let me ask you this. how competitive do you feel you are going to be? how much cash do you have?

what are the polls says? >> polls are saying we're down by 4 points. and the incumbent is still under 50%. cash on hand, we're a little bit behind. i'm willing to admit that. that's why i need your support. i need you to max out to the $2400. >> all right. i'll tell you what, i'll think -- i tell you what, of think about it, but i'm going to see a bit more conservative stance down the line. can i count on you for that? >> you can count on me to represent a republican values. as ronald reagan said, our great champion, if you agree with me 80% of the time, you are not my enemy. >> fair enough. >> awesome, wow. \ [applause] i'm thinking like, and the nominations here, that was good. chase, you did a great job.

brooks, you are very tough. a few things i will say very quickly and then feel free to chime in. chase said something several times throughout the conversation that i thought was so great and important. he said, i need you. right? like not give me $2400. i really can't do this without you. and this is what i need you for. and acknowledge brooke's concerns that he wasn't conservative enough. did you notice how he answered the questions? he didn't agree with brooks necessarily. but he basically said, okay. fine. i understand where you are coming from. these guys are terrible. that's not always going to be like what you are saying over the phone. i hope not. he acknowledged what he had to say, he respected it, and he still stayed on message. what else did he do that was great in terms of the ask? >> he always mentioned the number? >> uh-huh. always drove it back.

always drove it back to the number. so that throughout the conversation, there was never a -- you know, and you notice what he did was great. and, you know, you can fall into this trap. he asked for $12400. and brooks like that said not doing it. you know what he didn't do, can you give $100 or $250. he kept going back to the $2400. as a result, he walked away with $500 and the opportunity to come back for $2400 or to make up the difference. you guys did great the. >> i think brooks was treated as a peer. he was willing to share knowledge with him. that people might be ashamed of normally. >> i think -- there was a lot of mutual respect there. especially comes from the candidate. there's -- you know, how we talked about earlier, it's not like about agreeing with whatever the donor or the person says. brooks was being tough. we wanted him to be tough. it was good.

notice how chase acknowledged that but he stayed strong. he was like agree, but you need me there to do this. what if this happens? what about obama grains momentum? going back to the supreme court. i'm showing my time is up here. until we have time for a few questions? >> we have time if you have time. >> absolutely have time. yeah, of course. >> let's go back to the some of the -- if you run into this sort of situation where we have a donor where it's not their number one choice candidate to give to. we have that back and forth, would it be more beneficial to candidate to ask brooks, hey, i might not agree with you on this issue, what else is important to you. and sort of go into that. and maybe see. >> absolutely. that's actually a great tool to use. because what you're doing is you're finding out what's important to brooks. that is incredibly coronet to brooks being conservative and pro life.

there could be other things. finding out more information in general is a good thing. especially if there's back and forth and taking a step back. what are some other things you care about? brooks may turn around and say i don't care about anything else. you have to do what chase said. i get what you are saying. what you thought about this? he got him thinking about things that probably, things that weren't on his right arm. it changed the conversation. yes? >> is there another way kind of at the end he backed him into a corner. he said are you going to work harder on this stance. if you are ever caught in a situation where somebody is asking you are you going to stand for something that you obviously don't? how do you, you know, act in that situation. where with you are dealing with the somewhat belligerent donor. >> very answer. just being honest. somebody gives you $1,000 and saying i'm expecting, if you are

not or you can't, be honest about it. it doesn't mean the conversation has to go in a bad place. you could just be like i really appreciate you sharing that with me, i appreciate your candor. thank people for being candor. that's one of the things we don't have enough of. thank people. don't make promotions you can't keep. don't do things that are or say things that are disinagain wows. they will know that. >> is it easier to keep them in the background not in the forefront of giving? >> my answer to that is if the candidate has a lot of controversy around them, particularly bad controversy, the fund raising is going to hurt no matter what. but to your overall question is it okay to use someone else? you might have a situation where they are someone on your campaign like your finance chair

or a volunteer who works in the office. and they've known this person for 20 years. and your candidate has only known them for a few months. you're going to want to go with the stronger relationships. in general, your candidate needs to be front and center of the fund raising. yes? >> we're going specter. he's kind of unique. he's an incumbent. calling people that have donated before. would you call his old donors. you know what i mean? they are hardcord republicans. are they worth the call? or are you going to make people upset? >> oh, wow. what comes to the top of my head, and in general, is that if they've given him money and his name hasn't changed, they should probably get a call. yup. anybody else, yes, sir? >> what do you feel about kind

of gimmicky fund raising like if you donate, have a chance to win a dinner or those internet ads. what do you feel about those fund raising gimmicks, are they successful? are they worth the time? >> this kind of goes back to michael questions. there are different things that are going to make people get excited. i've always wanted to go there. if i give, then i have a chance to win a raffle ticket. that would work. in general with major donors, first of all, you don't need. because they are serious political donors. they get what you do. so i would say on the major donor piece of it, i would stay away from that. but that said, you're not just going to be talking to major donors. your $5 and $10. if it's something that you can do that doesn't cost you any money. one the biggest lessons in fund raising for me is you don't know until you try. you're going to try and fail. and you are going to try and

they are going to work. in a situation like that, if it's minimal risk and cost, give it a try. see if it works. yes? >> you mentioned that it's important to keep track of who all you talk to and what you talk about and so forth. what is the most efficient way of keeping track of that? do campaigns invest in computer programs? >> yes. definitely. i don't want to like advocate for a particular software program. but, yes, there are lots to choose from. definitely big names. you know, out there. and places that you can do everything from look at their donor history to while your calling them, pull up a notes tab and be typing in the notes. the good thing to answer in your question is yes. there are a vast array of resources out there. yes. yes, bill? >> what's the minimum amount of time that you would spend in reasking? so like $1,000. how long before you are able to

ask them again comfortably? >> that's a good question. i mean if someone gave you $1,000 in october. you don't really have a choice. you are going to have to go back a few weeks later. that's probably not the ideal. but it is what it is. if someone gave you $1,000 in the first. sorry, you got $1,000 right and particularly going back. you know, i think if you are 10 months out, probably want to it wait a few months. but you'd probably want to do it around something that you can message it on. hey, that $1,000 really helped get the campaign running. make sure and thank them for that. but thank them in the way that they understand what the $1,000 did for your campaign. i don't know if you know this or not, we have another following coming up. hoping we can go ahead and do that other $1,000 thank you. you are thanking them and it's centered around something tangible. >> oh, yes?

no. >> what do you do if like, say i got that $1,000 from barack. and two months later you are further behind in the polls. is this the kind the thing that the campaign is going to shed donors because you are not doing well? >> you hope not. you are hope that you are able to explain to donors what's going on. you're going to have some explaining to do. with this contribution, we're going to be up in the polls. we're going to have to message that. but the way to message that is to be honest about the concerns that you are having. and the difficulty that you are having as a candidate and campaign. but going back to it's why i need you. right? i needed you before. we're in a rough spot again. i know it's a difficult situation. but i need you to get through this. but you're going to have to have a very. that's a hard ask to make. especially when you're already told someone with this check i'm going to be up. you're going to need to rack no, ma'am in the conversation before

you get to it, hey, calling and not great news. but this is why i'm calling. because i need you. and i'm confident with your help that we can pull this off. you know? and that's essentially what you did the first time. it's just having that conversation again. maybe a little bit more difficult, but having it again. yes? >> i have a really -- do you leave messages on voicemails? >> that's a great question. yes. you do. absolutely do. there's no reason not to. cell phone, home, et cetera, et cetera, make sure though when you leave a voice message, quick and let them now how to get in touch with you. let them know, the caller making the donors, you're leaveing your work phone and your leaveing your cell phone too. you may not get home until 8:00, no problem, here's my cell. yup. >> have you found from your experience that's it's more difficult to raise money for a

political action committee, particularly one that donates a funds that they get to a lot of different candidates versus a singular campaign for a single tangible candidates? >> no, i don't think it's difficult. i think it's explaining to people what their contribution will do. whether it's for a candidate or campaign. with me, when i'm asking people for victory fund, i'm asking them to support the idea that having ldtp is an important thing and our ultimate path to achieving true equality. if i'm raising money for a particular candidate, and i was raising money for a candidate outside of a become, it's not different. you are still telling a story. you are still talking about why the race is important. if you are only calling and saying we need money. we don't have any money. who's compelled by that. if you are calling and saying i believe in this candidate. hopefully you do believe in the candidate by the way. that makes you a much better

fund razer. not to get off topic. i encourage all of you, no matter what you do, fund raising or anything else. do something that you are passionate about. it will relate and go over to your work. you will be better at something that you are passionate about. always. yes? >> how much information and persuasion should you put into a fund raise we are, if, for example, you are caucusing and you need them to donate to you against your neighboring. how much do you put in for persuasion? >> i would stay focused on you. >> they bring it up, how much time? >> however much time they want to. if they absolutely love, you know, the candidate who's neck to neck with you in the polls. and they sort of like you too and they are considering it, you are probably going to have a lengthy conversation on why they should take a chance you. if it's a random thing that i heard so and so is doing that.

let me talk to you about my campaign. bring it back home. you know? anybody else? yes? >> do you worry about turning off undecided for money? you worry about turning them off as opposed to getting money to end their support? >> no. because first of all, if you are calling people who are undecided. it's not that you are not going to call them and ask them for money. you are. they are certainly not going to be at the top of your calling list. calling them for people who have given candidates and have an interest in the campaign. you don't have -- yeah. you know don't have the luxury of that. you don't have the luxury of worrying about whether you are going to turn somebody off. >> here's a general with some fund raising. if you are not asking the candidate or person for money, somebody is. they either have or the minute that you hang up the phone you are getting the phone call from your opponent.